From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #538 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Tuesday, November 30 1999 Volume 04 : Number 538 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Latin Music NJC ["Eric Taylor" ] favorite Christmas songs (NJC) [Robert Holliston ] RE: favorite Christmas music (NJC) [David Wright ] RE: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) [Deb Messling ] Joni's Sign o' the times [Jamie Zubairi ] Re: Cry Cry Cry (NJC) ["Chuck EIsenhardt" ] Joni & Faye [Roman ] Re: Fwd: Message from JMDL main page [catman ] Re: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) [Siresorrow@aol.com] Joni in City Island, NY [Emily Kirk Gray ] Re: Latin Music NJC [Siresorrow@aol.com] stereophile ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] NJC Christmas [Steve Dulson ] Today in Joni History - November 29 [Today in Joni History ] Today in Joni History - November 30 [Today in Joni History ] Today in Joni History - November 27 [Today in Joni History ] Re: favourite Christmas songs (NJC) [Jason Maloney ] Grace Of My Heart (SJC) [Jason Maloney ] Grace Of My Heart (SJC) [Jason Maloney ] RE: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG [Martin Giles ] Joni Mitchell Contest ["Ken (Slarty)" ] Re: favourite Christmas songs (NJC) [David Wright ] Re: Top Canadians of the millenium ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - (now njc) ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: songbooks ["Catherine McKay" ] Miles Of Aisles HDCD ["Tony Wyer" ] "Grinch/Scrooge-like" ["John Low" ] Favorite Christmas song ever (NJC) [Vince Lavieri ] Favourite Christmas songs 2.0 (NJC) [Vince Lavieri Subject: Latin Music NJC I've really enjoyed this debate on Latin music & can't wait to hear some of the recommended music. Thinking about this all day I'd just like to add a few points. Recently pop star Mark Anthony stated his displeasure at being classified as Latin music. While I can certainly relate to his desire to not be stereotyped, what does he expect singing in Spanish? Ricky Martin's *Vuelve* is likewise sung entirely in Spanish. This is the reason I consider it Latino. Please don't tell me that this is somehow politically incorrect! I keep thinking about the Mexican-American who plays Chekote on Star Trek Voyager (my favorite show). He was given a lot of shit for not being a Native American (the role that he plays). He responded that, as a Mexican, he is at least half Native American. This fact silenced the protesters. What I love about America is the blending of races - the entire point of the Medicine Wheel.... E.T. NP: Urubamba ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 00:32:37 -0800 From: Robert Holliston Subject: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) Hey friends, I really love the Christmas season, and in that spirit am ignoring the ubiquitous lights and Christmas trees that have been displayed here since Hallowe'en. Mid-December seems early enough for me! Here are some of my favorite things to listen to while I'm decorating the tree: 1. Leontyne Price (with Herbert von Karajan) singing all sorts and styles of Sacred Christmas music. She has the most beautiful voice!! 2. A local choir here put out a lovely fundraising CD: my favorite song is "In the Bleak Midwinter" 3. J.S. Bach: Christmas Oratorio (all of Part 1) 4. Handel: Messiah (my favorite parts, which may include Easter's "I Know That My Redeemer Liveth," because the sentiment expressed needn't be limited to Christmas) 5. Judy Garland singing "Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas" and Mel Torme singing "Chestnuts Roasting on an Open Fire," both of which are about connecting with your loved ones during a very special time of the year 6. Any children's choir singing "Silent Night" or "Away in a Manger" will reduce me to tears... And that's my contribution :-) Best wishes and love to everyone, Roberto ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 04:19:29 -0500 (EST) From: David Wright Subject: RE: favorite Christmas music (NJC) On Mon, 29 Nov 1999, Louis Lynch wrote: > I thought I'd add my favorite Christmas carol list for this year: [snip] Some of my long-time favorites to sing: O Holy Night I Wonder as I Wander O Come, O Come, Emmanuel We Three Kings (with all 6-7 verses! especially the one about myrrh!) God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen Down in Yon Forest (sung by Joan Baez on "Noel") The Friendly Beasts O Come All Ye Faithful (Adeste Fideles) ....At home we listened to Joan Baez's Christmas album, Nat King Cole's (classic!), Raffi's, The Mormon Tabernacle Choir, etc... My parents also had this 3-record set called "College Choirs at Christmas" which I think they got from Time-Life or something. It had all these wonderful, wonderful eclectic pieces (contributed by various college choirs) I've never heard anywhere else -- a French carol called "Joseph est bien marie," Vaughan Williams' arrangement of "God Rest Ye..." Philip Warlock's "Balulalow," Sydney Carter's "Every Star Shall Sing a Carol" (a very heavy, beautiful, almost mystical contemporary song), a beautiful Baroque Magnificat by Nicolas Porpora (?!); and an odd, very fun contemporary composition by someone named Vaclav Nelhybel, "Estampie Natalis," an energetic mock-medieval dance with all these changing meters. Take care, - --David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 06:39:49 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) my xmas favorites: my all-time favorite: in the bleak midwinter [by either tenor ian bostridge or treble john bowen. not jessye norman's version: it sounds like a yuletide elektra.] once in david's royal city by treble robin barter oh little town of bethlehem the two carpenters' xmas albums [seriously: they're wonderful!], best tracks: sleigh ride, the first snowfall, the christmas song, white xmas. [you MUST listen to karen sing this one. she remains unequalled.] adeste fideles i saw momma kissing santa claus the whole on yoolis night album by anonymous 4 but most of all in the bleak midwinter. i play it when i finish putting up the tree and cry and cry and cry. my birthday falls on the 27, right in between xmas and new year's. i feel particularly sensitive during the whole week. wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:49:43 -0000 From: Jamie Zubairi Subject: Lesley's Weekend Dear Gang I have been away from the list for 2 weeks. Have I missed the post Lesley sent regarding the weekend with WallyB? Could someone send it to me if I have? Most appreciated. Thank you. Jamie Z ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 06:29:25 -0500 From: Deb Messling Subject: RE: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) Some of my favorites: Anybody: A Virgin Most Pure Angels from the Realms of Glory Once in Royal David's City Tomorrow Shall Be My Dancing Day Good King Wenceslas All the traditional wassail songs, esp. The Somerset Wassail ("and it's joy be to you anda jolly wassail") Bruce Cockburn: Mary Had a Baby Loreena McKennitt: In Praise of Christmas Maddy Prior: See Amid the Winter Snow; the Boar's Head Carol The Christmas Revels: Just about anything. Baltimore Consort: entire album "Bright Day Star" Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ ~there are only three kinds of people: those who can count, and those who can't. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 11:10:50 -0000 From: Jamie Zubairi Subject: Joni's Sign o' the times Dear Michael Goldstein Les Irwin from the JMDL website sent us your message which I thought I would reply to. I'm not entirely sure of what you mean by 'reflective of the times' but I assume it's about the issues of the day that artists feel strongly about enough to write. You may mean relfective of the spirit of the times (i.e. the sixties, the nineties etc.) Obvious 'issue' ones are: Sex Kills (Turbulent Indigo) Not To Blame ditto Borderline ditto Dog Eat Dog (the whole album) Lakota (Chalk Mark In A Rain Storm) No Apologies (Taming The Tiger) The Fiddle and The Drum (Clouds) Obvious 'spirit' ones are: Songs To Aging Children Come (Clouds) People's Parties (Court And Spark) The Reoccurring Dream (Chalk Mark...) The Hissing Of Summer Lawns (same name) Hope this is a good start for your paper. There are more but not ones that I can think of at the moment. Regards Jamie Zubairi ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:53:21 -0500 From: "Chuck EIsenhardt" Subject: Re: Cry Cry Cry (NJC) It turns out I have a live version of the Ballad of MM with Dar singing lead and Richard singing harmony, from a WUMB fundraiser premium. Also on this disk is Chris Smither twice, Peter Mulvey, and another Richard Shindell callled 'Money for Floods'. I'd be happy to dupe this for U guys perhaps along with this year's number of the bonus CD, all otherwise unavailable stuff. Send an address if interested. Chuck - ---------- >From: "Paul Castle" >To: "jmdl" >Cc: "Steve Dulson" , >Subject: Cry Cry Cry (NJC) >Date: Tue, Nov 23, 1999, 01:11 PM > >Chuck E wrote: > >>I think of all the worthies mentioned here my next essential purchase is >>'Cry, Cry, Cry', a collaboration of Dar Williams, Lucy Kaplansky and >>Richard Shindell > >and Steve wrote: > >>I recommend it without reservation. Wonderful CD. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:21:29 +0100 From: Roman Subject: Joni & Faye Faye Dunaway only started to look like Joni after she had her facelift. It help keep her looking beautiful but sadly she didn't look like the Faye Dunaway that melted a million hearts in Bonnie and Clyde, The Thomas Crown Affair, The Arrangement and Network anymore. It radically changed her entire face, for the worse. I hardly recognised her in Supergirl. Dunaway was HUGE in Hollywood in the late sixties, early seventies, really the only viable successor to Monroe - There was a vaccuum of star-quality actresses around her five years before and after she peaked. Sadly, all reports show her to be too much the prima donna and she burned out in a blaze of self regarding glory not long after Network and ChinaTown. These days Joni is by far the more natural beauty, ageing with grace and charm, and I'd bet my next paycheck that she's a lot more beautiful than Dunaway ever was on the inside. Tube ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:18:23 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Fwd: Message from JMDL main page Sex Kills off TI. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:20:07 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: How about a WORST Christmas Carol list? (NJC) Did I ? I have forgotten if I did! Wally Kairuz wrote: > oh but colin had a wonderful joke about this song. colin, how did it > go?!?!?!?! > wallyk > > ----- Mensaje original ----- > De: Anne Sandstrom > Para: 'Louis Lynch' ; Anne Sandstrom > ; > Enviado: Lunes 29 de Noviembre de 1999 17:47 > Asunto: RE: How about a WORST Christmas Carol list? (NJC) > > > ok, I'll add The Twelve Days of Christmas sung by any number of > prepubescent > > individuals in the back seat of any vehicle (or by anyone anywhere, > > actually) > > > > Anne > > - -- "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:21:15 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) Well, shoot me, but I lioke Mary's Boy Child by Boney M and the one by Slade. Robert Holliston wrote: > Hey friends, > I really love the Christmas season, and in that spirit am ignoring the > ubiquitous lights and Christmas trees that have been displayed here > since Hallowe'en. Mid-December seems early enough for me! > > Here are some of my favorite things to listen to while I'm decorating > the tree: > > 1. Leontyne Price (with Herbert von Karajan) singing all sorts and > styles of Sacred Christmas music. She has the most beautiful voice!! > > 2. A local choir here put out a lovely fundraising CD: my favorite song > is "In the Bleak Midwinter" > > 3. J.S. Bach: Christmas Oratorio (all of Part 1) > > 4. Handel: Messiah (my favorite parts, which may include Easter's "I > Know That My Redeemer Liveth," because the sentiment expressed needn't > be limited to Christmas) > > 5. Judy Garland singing "Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas" and Mel > Torme singing "Chestnuts Roasting on an Open Fire," both of which are > about connecting with your loved ones during a very special time of the > year > > 6. Any children's choir singing "Silent Night" or "Away in a Manger" > will reduce me to tears... > > And that's my contribution :-) > > Best wishes and love to everyone, > Roberto - -- "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:42:08 -0600 From: Steve Polifka Subject: Speaking of Christmas songs... Does anyone out there remember (or have) jazz pianist Judy Knapp's version of 'River'? It came out early 80's and she was classified as jazz. It was so beautiful- I had heard it on the radio, but subsequently forgot about it until I couldn't find it...and just hate that when that happens. So if anyone can play Santa to my Christmas list, I would appreciate it! You can email me privately... Thanks! Steve ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:44:52 -0500 From: Anne Sandstrom Subject: RE: Christmas music - yet another list (SJC) No, that's not it, but it sounds like it's closer than The Coventry Carol. (Good guess to whoever suggested it - but the Coventry Carol is track #9 on the same CD.) I think it might be an original song, based strongly on some traditional lyrics and even melody. Anne ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:01:56 -0500 From: Anne Sandstrom Subject: more Christmas music How could I forget "Gaudete" by Steeleye Span? (ok, so does anyone have the lyrics to this? I can actually translate some of the Latin - not something I'm proud of.... but other lyrics I don't get) Also, "Have Yourself a Merry Little Christmas" by Shawn Colvin and a French carol, "Il est ne" (yes, there should be an accent aigu over the e in ne, but I don't feel like figuring out how to do it right now...) also, "I Saw Three Ships" (I have a great version w/Native American flute, and guitar) and "Un Flambeau Jeanette Isabella" sigh, music is wonderful... Anne ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:11:53 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: favorite Christmas songs (NJC) my favorite christmas songs are : oh come oh come emanuel - done acapella carol of the bells - george winstons arrangement on December the O Antiphons - sung from December 17 - 24 in high churches, usually in latin, but very very beautiful Ooooo ooooo ooooo oooo ooooo Root of Jesse then, totally out of character with the above, i like chrissy hines christmas song, which i can't remember right now. pat ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:22:33 -0500 (EST) From: Emily Kirk Gray Subject: Joni in City Island, NY no -- not in person, but her music... hi everyone, just thought i'd share this: when i was visiting my parents for thanksgiving, i spent about 3 days at their place in city island, which is a TINY shore town in the bronx, right on the water... a cute place. anyway, i was wandering with my mom through the small shops and we went into an art gallery called "the starving artist" (the name alone made me feel at home) and the first thing i heard (no, not a traffic song) was "my old man" over the store's speakers. i know this thread already passed, but it was the first time i think i've heard joni in public -- it was a strange, exhiliarating expericence! i said "nice music" to the owner and gave him a thumbs-up. then we started talking and he explained that it wasn't a CD playing, but this great radio station, WFUV, which is fordham university's public radio. they have this great program "city folk" and apparently play joni all the time. what's annoying is that i've tried to tune in many times (90.7 FM) but in brooklyn i just can't get it. anyway, they apparently were playing the "top 100 albums" of the century, and i happened to walk in on "blue"! i wish the store owner had remembered which number it was...and i'm sure C&S must have been up there. does anyone else know anything about this ranking? i think it's so cool to play entire albums on the radio! all in all, a lovely thanksgiving encounter -- and the store's art wasn't too bad, either! one tiny irritance, however: the store owner said the same old thing to me that i have to say i'm getting tired of hearing, "how did someone your age get into joni mitchell?" i'm 26 and frankly, i think that's kind of an inane question to ask...but i hear it all the time! i usually give my standard "she's such a great musician" answer but i think this question must stem from so many people thinking of JM only as a '60's folk singer...also, i was taught that it's kind of rude to mention ANYONE'S age to them in terms of making assumptions....oh well... - -- emily ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:28:01 EST From: Siresorrow@aol.com Subject: Re: Latin Music NJC one of the posts i wrote before but did not send to the list was in response to the cher / joni thread. actually, at that time, it was the madonna / joni thread. and i composed a list of about 10 comparisons that went like: madonna vs joni is like: Ricky Martin vs Carlos Santana then on Ricky's special, he had Santana and the other guy who i know but can't remember right now. i though ricky was very talented. i mean, he might not be as long lasting or as deep a thinker as say a joni or a santana, but i'd love to have his talent. that special went a long way to help make latin music more acceptable in the states. i'd love to know the statistics for latin ameriacans in the states now. at the same time, the latin culture has really not melted in the main stream. there are spanish speaking tv networks and there are spanish speaking radio stations. but i rarely see a mixture of the two. that is probably why i liked santana's supernatural so much because he did exactly that: mixed latin music with american rock and roll. pat ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 11:04:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: stereophile From John Atkinson's review of the new Yamaha@PET RP-U100 personal receiver (December 1999, p193): To give Yamaha credit, with the exception of the occasional effect on Sting's Soul Cage album, I have never been very sensitive to virtual surround techniques- even the much hyped QSound of a few years back failed to impress me. The shape of my ear pinnea must be too far from the norm, or at least from the models used by the auralization engineers. But as I write these words in the Stereophile office, I am listening to "Amelia," from Joni Mitchell's Painting With Words and Music DVD, the 5.1 Dolby Digital soundtrack fed to the Yamaha's optical input with AudioQuest's new TosLink cable and processed with the receiver set to Hall, the video fed with an S video connection to my Apple Studio Display. The experience of reproduced music has never approached this level of satisfaction before - at least at work! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:05:47 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: NJC Christmas If Brian or Les or Deb hasn't mentioned it yet, Stan Rogers' "First Christmas (Away From Home)" is a killer. ######################################################### Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" http://www.thelivingtradition.org/ (Website under construction!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 12:15:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 29 1975: Melody Maker today reviews Hissing, saying "...I confess it is difficult. Always a lyricist of exquisite subtlety, preferring to suggest rather than interpret meanings, she has devised a delightful torture." Read the rest at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/mm751129.htm - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 12:15:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 30 1981: Joni hosts a jam session at her New York apartmaent with Jaco Pastorius, Michael Brecker, Bobby Mintzer, Don Alias and Peter Erskine. It was the night before Jaco's 30th Birthday Concert and they were running through some of the music. Full story: http://www.jazzonln.com/LABELS/WBSPACE/jacoline.htm - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 12:14:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 27 1974: The album "Miles Of Aisles", still climbing the charts, is certified gold by the RIAA. 1976: Finally... a review worth reading. Today's Sounds magazine says of Hejira: Timeless and majestic, this is the music for the spirit. Intellectual and inspired, this is music for the mind. Rhythmic and subtle, this is music for the body. The music of tomorrow, this is the tip of the iceberg. Don't hear this album. Listen to it. Read the rest at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/sounds761127.htm Also today, Melody Maker reviews Hejira, saying "The qualification about this album's success stems indirectly, in fact, from the lyrics. "The Hissing Of Summer Lawns" was criticised in some quarters (thought not by me) for being purely a vehicle for her lyrics, a criticism, however, which has some application to "Hejira". This is the first Joni Mitchell record for which the song sheet is indispensable." Read the article at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/mm761127.htm 1982: Today's New Musical Express isn't so kind to Wild Things Run Fast, saying "Because she does not have the gift of writing great dumb pop music. That's the only thing that would carry a trifle like "Wild Things Run Fast" itself. There is a persistent suggestion that she's slumming in the cheapest throes of dime-novel romance, and it's ludicrous that the progenitor of the scorched skyline of the "Hejira" set should want to settle for something so facile. This is a simplification, not a paring away." Read it at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/nme821127.htm 1985: (From Wally's bio page): The video for the first single "Good Friends" premiered on MTV [today]. It was directed by Jim Blaschfield, who had found fame with his video for the Talking Heads "And She Was," by inserting color xerox images that move independently within the live action. The premiere of "Good Friends" was announced with some fanfare by MTV VJ Mark Goodman: "Joni Mitchell-at last!", but the video received only light airplay for the next 2 months. - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 17:43:24 +0000 From: Jason Maloney Subject: Re: favourite Christmas songs (NJC) My own experiences of growing up in Britain during the 70s has given me a certain viewpoint of Christmas music, especially as neither I nor my family have ever been church-goers. In fact, the compulsory school Christmas service was always something I dreaded. As such, I have a distinct aversion to carols and all that nativity stuff. I never cared for the presentation of such events, and never will. Just a personal preference of mine. Please don't take offence! Yet, there is something quite special about the better Christmas memories I have. No embarrassing, drunken family dramas for our lot, thankfully. It's always been a pretty low-key time for me. The accent has usually been on atmosphere and trying to recreate what it was about this time of year that seemed so magical as a child. So, musically-speaking, I'm no traditionalist. Every year my mum asks me why I can't have an album of carols in my collection. We do have one of those "Best Xmas Albums..Ever!" tapes from the 80s, with a mixture of contemporary stuff from White Christmas to Do They Know It's Christmas?, but I prefer my own selection of seasonal songs that don't make me want to squirm. Saint Etienne - I Was Born On Christmas Day The Pretenders - 2000 Miles ...for me, THE sound of Christmas. Never fails to get me in the mood :-) The Pogues & Kirsty MacColl - Fairytale of New York Wham! - Last Christmas Slade - Merry Xmas Everybody John Lennon - War Is Over (Happy Xmas)...both so firmly etched in my mind as a child, and virtually insperable from any associations I have with Christmas Eurythmics - Winter Wonderland Alexander O-Neal - Sleigh Ride Duran Duran - Winter Marches On ....not specifically about Christmas itself, but I love the ambience it conjures up. Great to see a mention for Jackson Browne's Rebel Jesus. That's one I hadn't thought of before. I'll add that one to my list as well :-) Season's greetings, Jason. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:21:26 EST From: SCJoniGuy@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni in City Island, NY Emily said: < were playing the "top 100 albums" of the century, and > i happened to walk in on "blue"! i wish the store owner > had remembered which number it was...and i'm sure C&S > must have been up there. does anyone else know anything > about this ranking? >> Emily, I bet they have a website, go see if they have the list and report back...(homework) < hearing, "how did someone your age get into joni mitchell?">> here are some possible retorts: 1. Can I help it if I'm smarter than my peers? 2. I don't know - how did someone YOUR age get so jerky? 3. Don't ask me, ask my mother, the Kid Rock fan! Of course, you're probably much too classy to use any of these, Em...but I can hear *me* saying them. Of course, no one would say that to me in the first place anyway with my gray hair! Bob NP: Sheryl Crow, "Can't Cry Anymore" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:23:08 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC Voilence against Women (now child abuse) Gina wrote: >With its philosophy of "family reunification", Massachusetts Dept. >of >Social Services (and others across the U.S.) often sends children >back to >the homes where they have been beaten and/or neglected. We >don't ask women >to go back to live with a batterer but we expect >children to go back to >homes where *they've* been treated abusively >because the parents have >completed some inadequate parenting course? >The rights of biological >parents are much too >strong in this country. You're quite right and I believe this is a world-wide issue. There have been numerous such cases in Toronto papers in the last few years where inquests have been held into the violent deaths of young children at the hands of abusive parents. One of the problems is that the caseworkers have such heavy caseloads that they can't always deal with a problem as it should be dealt with and often err on the side of allowing the child to go back to their parents. Then the social workers get blamed. Fortunately we now have legislation that says that, if a doctor finds or suspects child abuse, he or she is obligated to notify the Children's Aid Society. Failure to do so can result in criminal charges. This certainly isn't enough, of course, but you're right. Anyone can have a baby - you don't need a license or a diploma of any kind. But you need a license to catch fish (?) >Just an interesting tidbit I learned at a New England wide >conference on >child abuse I attended for work: some child welfare >agencies in some >states actually coordinate with humane societies to >investigate potential >child abuse in homes where animal abuse has >been reported because >statistics prove that often where there is >animal abuse and there are >children, there is also child abuse. You're quite right there. Most psychopaths who murder people start out by torturing and killing animals. Sadly, I've seen cases of neighbours calling regarding the welfare of someone in their community who may be suffering from Alzheimers or similar dementias. The neighbours call in the hope of getting this person some help and often because their homes are in an incredibly bad state of repair. The person has the right to refuse treatment, so you can't send someone, such as a public health nurse, to check on them unless the person agrees to let the nurse in. So, often you need to get the Human Society to obtain an order to get access to the home on the basis that there are animals being neglected or abused - since a lot of these older people keep many pets, mostly cats (Oh-oh, CatGirl - watch out!) The Humane can get an order to be allowed to go in to investigate animal abuse, but the health authorities can't do anything about getting into the home (unless it's one of those mental health type cases where there's evidence that the person is likely to harm him/herself or others, and that's often hard to show - does neglecting oneself fit that criterion? Unfortunately, usually it doesn't.) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:37:54 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC Catgirl says: >I love humus too which is >chick peas and garic and tahina paste and a little lemon I love that too. I have an Armenian brother-in-law. He was born in Palestine and much of the food they eat is the typical middle-Eastern stuff, like hummus, baba ganouj (sp?) and so on. Oh, the joys of a multicultural family! My husband is half-Italian, half-German, half-Catholic, half-Jewish; another brother-in-law is Mexican and another brother-in-law, Italian, so I've been introduced to a lot of really yummy foods in the last 20 years or so. When I was a kid, I wouldn't eat anything but peanut butter sandwiches. You'd never catch me near Italian or Chinese food - how things have changed (for the better!) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:37:53 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: 12 days of xmas joke (NJC) oh yes. it was a series of letters sent every one of the 12 days after the poor person receives the partridges and the pear tree and all the stuff. it was sooooo funny. please try to find it: my computer crashed many times since last xmas and i lost the joke. Mensaje original ----- De: catman Para: Wally Kairuz CC: Anne Sandstrom ; 'Louis Lynch' ; Enviado: Martes 30 de Noviembre de 1999 10:20 Asunto: Re: How about a WORST Christmas Carol list? (NJC) > Did I ? I have forgotten if I did! > > Wally Kairuz wrote: > > > oh but colin had a wonderful joke about this song. colin, how did it > > go?!?!?!?! > > wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:48:25 +0000 From: Jason Maloney Subject: Grace Of My Heart (SJC) There has been a degree of discussion on this film over the past year or so, as it's obviously JC, but I have only just seen it for the first time. Yes, at last! This is such a tough movie to find here in the UK. Indeed, it's never been given a retail release. I had to ask a US net-friend to get me a copy. Quite simply, I loved it. Though I cannot attest to its authenticity as regards how accurately it evokes and recaptures the times it portrays, it made for an often enthralling 2 hours. What really impressed me most was the music. All original material (pastiches, I suppose) specially written for the movie, or so I gather. Joni's Man From Mars, of course, was a highlight...and I liked the "alternate" arrangement it was given. In the comparitvely barren 90s (as far as the quality of mainstream bubblegeum pop is concerned), I rejoiced in the seemingly endless stream of marvellous songs featured. The film did a wonderful job of capturing the magic and energy that goes into creating a tune, any tune. Those were my favourite moments. The two songs that really had my jaw dropping to the floor were the first version of God Give Me Strength (with Illeana Douglas performing while Matt Dillon looked on), and the closing Grace Of My Heart. They are the most staggeringly beautiful and powerful songs I have heard in a long while. Can anyone who has the soundtrack tell me which songs featured in the movie are actually included? Though I am now compelled to search out the CD anyway, it would be helpful to know which ones made it onto the album. Jason. The Slipstream....A Guide To Life In The Slow Lane : http://freespace.virgin.net/jason.maloney/index1.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:47:14 +0000 From: Jason Maloney Subject: Grace Of My Heart (SJC) There has been a degree of discussion on this film over the past year or so, as it's obviously JC, but I have only just seen it for the first time. Yes, at last! This is such a tough movie to find here in the UK. Indeed, it's never been given a retail release. I had to ask a US net-friend to get me a copy. Quite simply, I loved it. Though I cannot attest to its authenticity as regards how accurately it evokes and recaptures the times it portrays, it made for an often enthralling 2 hours. What really impressed me most was the music. All original material (pastiches, I suppose) specially written for the movie, or so I gather. Joni's Man From Mars, of course, was a highlight...and I liked the "alternate" arrangement it was given. In the comparitvely barren 90s (as far as the quality of mainstream bubblegeum pop is concerned), I rejoiced in the seemingly endless stream of marvellous songs featured. The film did a wonderful job of capturing the magic and energy that goes into creating a tune, any tune. Those were my favourite moments. The two songs that really had my jaw dropping to the floor were the first version of God Give Me Strength (with Illeana Douglas performing while Matt Dillon looked on), and the closing Grace Of My Heart. They are the most staggeringly beautiful and powerful songs I have heard in a long while. Can anyone who has the soundtrack tell me which songs featured in the movie are actually included? Though I am now compelled to search out the CD anyway, it would be helpful to know which ones made it onto the album. Jason. The Slipstream....A Guide To Life In The Slow Lane : http://freespace.virgin.net/jason.maloney/index1.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:43:21 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: RE: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG Mariana from Argentina complains.. > Am I the only Lister who's never seen Joni live? I want to see her so badly! > No, there are two of us. Just you and me it seems ! Martin. In London. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:38:02 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: Re: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC For a long time now I have felt there has been something missing in my life. I now realise what it is. I haven't ever had the opportunity of walking into a restaurant and saying, "I would like some Baba Ghannouj, but hold the Garbanzo beans." "Can I have a cheese sandwich?" just doesn't cut it :-) atb, Martin. In London. England. Yawn. Kakki drooled... > Gee, this thread is making me hungry. I love Falafels and can devour them > endlessly. I also love MacDonald's but have to stop after one small > cheeseburger. I also like Baba Ghannouj, where eggplant is used in place of > the Garbanzo beans. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:50 -0500 From: Linda Worster Subject: Re: 12 days of xmas joke (NJC) I *just* received this yesterday from a friend and it is hysterical!! The language is....errrr..... a bit.... strong! I'd be happy to send it to anyone who wants it. Linda, still LOL At 03:37 PM 11/30/1999 -0300, Wally Kairuz wrote: >oh yes. it was a series of letters sent every one of the 12 days after the >poor person receives the partridges and the pear tree and all the stuff. it >was sooooo funny. please try to find it: my computer crashed many times >since last xmas and i lost the joke. > >> Wally Kairuz wrote: >> >> > oh but colin had a wonderful joke about this song. colin, how did it >> > go?!?!?!?! >> > wallyk > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:26:32 -0500 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Joni Mitchell Contest InkBlot Online Magizine is giving away Joni Mitchell's 1999 vinyl reissue of Blue. To register go here. http://www.inkblotmagazine.com/jonimitchell_registration3.htm The contest ends Dec. 24 Good Luck! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:37:34 -0500 (EST) From: David Wright Subject: Re: favourite Christmas songs (NJC) On Tue, 30 Nov 1999, Jason Maloney wrote: > The Pretenders - 2000 Miles ...for me, THE sound of Christmas. Never fails to > get me in the mood :-) YEAH!! ALso...the Cocteau Twins' "Frosty the Snowman." - --David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:23:01 -0800 From: jan gyn Subject: mcdonald's joke (NJC) As I remember there was a discussion of the pros and mostly cons of nourishing one's self at McDonald's. So I'm forwarding this joke... - -jan A German tourist walks into a McDonald's in New York City and orders a beer. (In Germany and many parts of Europe, McDonald's actually does serve beer.) The local guy in the line behind him immediately gives him the jab: "They don't serve BEER here, you MORON!" The German fellow felt pretty stupid, but suddenly turns to the New Yorker with a surprised look, and begins to chuckle. "And what's so funny?!?" the New Yorker demands. "Oh, nothing really, I just realized that you came here for the food." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 20:57:19 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Top Canadians of the millenium Deb wrote: > >If you care to, stuff the ballot for Joni at CBC's top-Canadian-musician of >the millenium poll: > >http://cbc.ca/millennium/castyourvote/index.html I just voted (a couple of times). As of right now, the results are: Ranking Musician % of Total Vote 1. Glenn Gould 18 % 2. Neil Young 13 % 3. Leonard Cohen 12 % 4. Joni Mitchell 9 % 5. Oscar Peterson 8 % Vote early - vote often. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 20:59:33 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Toshi Reagon and Joni The Rev. Vince wrote: >If it were only three, that would be tough: Joni, Janis Joplin, and the >Beatles >for me. > >If I got to pick for Bob Muller, it would be George Fredric Handel, Mrs. >George >Fredric Handel, and George Fredric Handel, Jr. Just so he'd get to learn >to >love the Messiah... > Mrs. George Friedrich Handel - that wouldn't be Joan Baez, would it? ;) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 21:14:04 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - (now njc) >Evian, who is SOOO mad at McDonald's for screwing up my order the other >night that I phoned and got a free meal... God help me, I am turning >into my father. > I'm a frequent writer of kvetch letters to various companies. I try to describe my horrific experience but to make it funny at the same time. As a result of writing this type of letter, here's what I've ended up with for free: - - a couple of baby products (full size) from Johnson and Johnson - in fact, all I did was phone them because when my son was a baby, he couldn't tolerate any sunscreen that I knew of without breaking out into red blotches. I called J&J and they had their dermatologist call me back. She recommended I try one of their baby sunscreens, sent me a free big bottle of it plus a bottle of baby bath stuff. She also called me a few weeks later to check to see if I had used the sunscreen on Matthew and how it worked out (he didn't react, so it became my sunscreen of choice for quite a while) - - a monthly Metropass for the Toronto Transit system. This was worth (at the time) about $60. This was a few years ago, and I think it's unlikely they would do this again, but I lucked in - I took the bus and subway EVERYWHERE for that entire month, whether I need to or not - - chocolate bars or coupons for free chocolate bars from M&Ms and Cadbury's - - a free lunch at a restaurant in town (which I didn't follow up on, because my complaint letter was about seeing mice running around while we were dining - you may know they're there, but if you don't see 'em, you can block it out. - - a $25 gift certificate from Shoppers' Drug Mart I'm not recommending that everyone suddenly become a prolific letter writer just to get free stuff, but if you have a complaint, you should let the company know. Most of them really DO value your input and if your complaint is logical and done in the form of constructive criticism, rather than just a "who-the-hell-do-you-people-think-you-are?" kind of rant, they actually use your input (and you get free stuff too!) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 21:29:03 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Ricky Martin NJC ET asks: >RM is from Puerto Rico (which is arguably too American but >none-the-less Latin). Why is the music of Gloria Estafan or Ricky >Martin >any >less Latin than those living south of the border? >:~* Gloria Estefan is Cuban originally. If you hear her sing in Spanish, (she has a CD called "Mi Tierra" where she sings entirely in Spanish in the Cuban style) you would get a completely different perspective on her singing. I don't care for her much in English, but she's completely different in Spanish. In a similar vein, if you hear Celine Dion singing in French, she's much better than in English - even if you can't stand her singing in English, you might like the French. (In this case, I said "might" - Celine's not one of my favourites, although there are one or two songs she has done that seem to suit her singing style well and that I can tolerate because she doesn't scream. Much.) I figure the reason is that French is her first language and she may emote too much in English because she's not totally confident in the language (or because her husband/producer told her to?) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 21:36:03 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: songbooks Joni Mitchel Songbook volume 1 (1966-1970)Joni Mitchel Songbook volume 2 Wally, the screaming Argentinian writes: >through wonderful LES, i have just contacted another argentine jonifan who >happens to have the following songbooks: >Joni Mitchel Songbook volume 1 (1966-1970) >Joni Mitchel Songbook volume 2 >JM Anthology >Hejira >Don Juan reckless daughter I've got the JM Songbooks vols 1 and 2, as well as For the Roses, Court and Spark, and Wild Things Run Fast. If anyone wants photocopies of all or part of any of these, let me know. (Send me an email privately.) As long as I can be reasonably assured that they're out of print (and I believe they are), I don't have any qualms about copying them. If the publishers wanted to make any more money of them, they could just reprint them, couldn't they? Actually, a fellow listed pointed me to this website a while back: http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/a/phrase.html?id=11890&phrase=Joni%20Mitchell where they have a number of Joni books for sale. At one time, I went in there, and they had Hejira and I was going to order it, but my credit card was maxed out at the time, and the last time I checked, they didn't seem to have it any more. Damn. I've ordered Turbulent Indigo, TTT and Hits & Misses (because of a few songs that I don't have elsewhere and after all, these are apparently in tab/open tunings version) but haven't rec'd them yet. I'll let you know once I do what kind of service I got from them (and if it's lousy, maybe a kvetch letter is in order - who knows what kind of freebies they might have? honestly, I wouldn't write a complaint letter frivolously just to get free stuff. Really. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:02:44 -0000 From: "Tony Wyer" Subject: Miles Of Aisles HDCD Finally received my MOA cd from the USof A to find that its a digitally remastered HDCD to replace my scratchy rock and roll vinyl copy. And there is only one word for it..... Wow! What a great job they've done, exceptional. Not a hint of tape hiss, and the impression that at times you are sitting right next to her on stage. Top marks for technical achievement go to 'Rainy Night House', with 'Love or Money' a close second ( any subsequent history to this song ????) However I can not play it at all on the computers cd drive, it just ends up skipping through the tracks. Oh well, can not have everything! regards Tony NP Ani Difranco's 'Untouchable Face' from Dilate Tony's Rough Guide to Skiing La Plagne http://www.wyer.force9.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:59:13 PST From: "John Low" Subject: "Grinch/Scrooge-like" Bob wrote: >So anyway, I'll try to be less "Grinch/Scrooge-like"...hopefully the >folks >that I've shared Joni music with would consider me a generous >person. Amen to that, Bob!! As a grateful recipient of music from your Joni treasure chest, "Grinch/Scrooge-like" would be the last term I'd use to describe the South Carolina Joni Guy. Your Aussie mate, John. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:14:22 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Favorite Christmas song ever (NJC) For whatever reason, my absolute favorite Christmas song is the barking dogs doing Jingle Bells. Cracks me up every time. I am sitting here smiling just thinking about it. Maybe I love it because it is the one song that I can get my dogs to sing along in, and many years at Christmas time my telephone machine message was the recorded version with all my dogs and I singing (barking) along. My friends are used to it and it serves the telemarketers right! My second favorite is Rudolph, the Red Nosed Reindeer, and perhaps because it, like I, were conceived in Chicago. What, you were expecting something religious? Then my third, God Rest Ye Merry Gentlefolk (my nonsexist version, such a great tune and such fun to sing I had to de-genderfy it to include all of the Merry Gentle People). I concur with those who would consign The Little Drummer Boy (the song, not the actual boy) to the lower depths of hell. And if you have had volunteers who sing flat sing "O Holy Night" at a Christmas Eve service, as I have had, you might join me in never wanting to hear that one again, either. I will not mention my favorite Christmas oratorio out of deference to a certain baroque-musically challenged Southerner. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 18:17:46 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Favourite Christmas songs 2.0 (NJC) How could I not include the Christmas song in a class all by itself, and it actually gets a tear in my eye every time: Merry XMas (War is Over) by John and Yoko. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #538 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. 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