From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #533 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Saturday, November 27 1999 Volume 04 : Number 533 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG ["Raffaele Malanga" ] Today in Joni History - November 25 [Today in Joni History ] Re: NJC: more STUFFing pahleeze [Julie Webb ] Re Thank You JMDL [Julian51469@aol.com] lhasa njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: NJC Violence against Women (and kids) ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: NJC: more STUFFing pahleeze ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: Jarrett and other suggetsions - now Lhasa (not the Apso) - NJC ["Raff] Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: jonifest box set njc ["Kakki" ] Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC [CaTGirl627@aol.com] Joni on the cover of RStone [Randy Remote ] Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC [Ginamu@aol.com] and another [Randy Remote ] Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC ["Kakki" ] Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC [CaTGirl627@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 02:05:42 PST From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG Catherine, thank you very much for transcribing the Vivid story! I love the way Joni tells it, so much that now "Dull, dull, dull dear" (with *that* accent) has become my joke. As English is not my first language, there were parts that I really couldn't understand, but now thanks to you everything's clear! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 07:28:30 EST From: Gertus@aol.com Subject: Re: Cher (NJC) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 01:04:07 -0800 From: Robert Holliston Subject: re: Cher (NJC) Roberto wrote:- >>> So, I love Cher's acting. As I do Dame Judi's - so I will take Julie Z. Webb's advice and see Tea With Mussolini as soon as possible.<<< Roberto, that is one of the best films I've seen for a long time. I'm no fan of Cher's and know very little about her music, but that film starred 3 of Britain's best actresses in Judy Dench, Maggie Smith and Joan Plowright but I have to say that Cher outshone them all. I was very impressed! Enjoy it! Jacky ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 05:15:01 PST From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Jarrett and other suggetsions Dear all, yesterday I was browsing in a second-hand record shop when I spotted a tape by Keith Jarrett. It was "My song" and I remembered having read something on this recording on the list. I bought it and I must say that it's great. Thank you for the advice, whoever and wherever you are. I though that I might give something in turn. If you got the chance, listen to a CD by Lhasa called "La llorona". It's the only CD she's done so far, and all my friends love it after I played some of the songs. As far as I know, Lhasa is a Canadian/Mexican singer (you might have heard of her through the Lilith Fair gigs), her voice is astonishing and full of passion, she sings in Spanish (with a very weird and nice accent) traditional songs as well as her compositions. Musically, the album is made of just acoustic guitars, percussions, voice and odd sounds (rain, etc.); the songs are sad, almost desperate at times, but they convey a good load of emotions. When I got the CD (more than a year ago) I just couldn't stop playing it and I still enjoy it a lot. Warning: It's contagious! Raffaele (in London) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 12:14:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 25 1970: The Alberta Herald publishes a review of Joni recent concert at Royal Festival Hall, saying "Joni, 26, uses a guitar, piano and dulcimer, an ancient instrument, as accompaniments for her original songs which, The Financial Times says, express "the rather tarnished hippie dream in conventional words and music." Read the full article at http://www.jonimitchell.com/Herald69.html 1976: Joni joins The Band's "Last Waltz" at the Winterland Ballroom in San Francisco. She sings backup to Neil Young on "Helpless" and with The Band on "Acadian Driftwood", performs "Coyote", "Shadows And Light", and "Furry Sings The Blues", and joins Bob Dylan, Van Morrison, Neil Diamond, Dr John, and others for the grand finale "I Shall Be Released." Photos and more information: http://www.jonimitchell.com/LastWaltz.html 1982: Rolling Stone publishes an article today in which Joni is quoted as saying "...when we started in this business, we were the ones who said you can't trust people over thirty. It was inevitable that we would eat a lot of what we said, because you have to turn thirty unless you wanna James Dean out. Now I'm finally hearing some good things about middle age. We need that. If all the war babies turn forty and get depressed at the same time, the world will not be pleasant." Read the rest at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/rs821125.htm 1994: Joni makes the cover of this week's LA Weekly. Joni is quoted "My music is not designed to grab instantly. It's designed to wear for a lifetime, to hold up like a fine cloth. If you're in the right place, these records are waiting to go off in your life, you know. But if you're in the wrong space, which, luck of the draw, for the last 20 years I seem to have had reviewers in the wrong space...and I've been trashed for too long. The final insult is to watch my imitators elevated while I'm still being trashed. So if I don't get my just dues soon, I'm going into hermitdom. Fuck you all. (Laughing.) I'm going to take up my brushes. I don't care." How can you not read the rest? http://www.jmdl.com/articles/law941125.htm - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 01:38:27 -0500 From: Julie Webb Subject: Re: NJC: more STUFFing pahleeze > > I do want to see this one though. Do you > think it would be safe to take my 12-yr old daughter? She wants to see it, > but I've noticed the ads say it's not recommended for people under 14. Well there is quite a bit of head decapitation in the movie, but somehow it is only gruesome in a Halloween-make-believe sense----as opposed to real life violence. I would explain to your daughter what to expect and she'll be able to handle it. ("Trudy, you will see dead people who are really mannequins with chopped off heads just like the time your brother pulled off your Barbie doll's head so that he could watch it flush down the toilet.") -JulieZWebb, not likely to ever get work writing for a parenting magazine ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 11:38:40 EST From: Julian51469@aol.com Subject: Re Thank You JMDL In a message dated 11/26/99 3:03:04 AM Eastern Standard Time Vince writes: << all the JMDLers who have become my cyber family and my second home, a place that I go to daily for something worthwhile and meaningful....one turn of the kaleidoscope will happen when suddenly you see the pattern that has been hidden! And then you say, I see it, this is what we share, this is where we connect! >> Thank you for saying this so perfectly. Thank you for all of the wonderful words and priceless recordings that I receive from this family of mine. Thanks for being a home within a home, my brothers and sisters. Julian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:27:39 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: lhasa njc ciao raffaele, this artist you mention sounds so interesting. now, i don't like la macarena-type of music. does her music sound very traditionally mexican or hispanic or is there a twist to it? wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:05:23 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG Mark says: >I'm guessing there may have been a flood in North Dakota, but I don't know >of any rivers that flow through it. Sandbags are used as an embankment to >stop flood waters. And there may have been the war (as in the Civil War), >so >this woman would to have been at least 100. About the 'negroes': maybe they >were trying to destroy the embankment or something??? My first thought was sandbags - flood. Then I thought it was possibly a Civil War reenactment of some kind? (Was ND involved in the Civil War? Did it exist as a state at the time? Maybe it was a 4th of July kind of thing and the woman thought it was for real?) I think the woman was older, but not that old (like over 100). On the other hand, maybe she was just nutty! All other evidence seems to suggest that she was a bit, uh, different. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:08:34 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: VIVID - Minot, North Dakota Brett says: >I think the town in N.D. is Minot. I was there once as a boy. An >old >classmate of my father lived there. You're probably right. The way Joni pronounced it, it sound like Mi-NOOT. Like minute with the acCENT on the wrong sylLABble. >It was fun - ended up joining in a big neighbourhood crab apple >fight. Don't ask me why, but the kids there loved to have crab >apple >fights in the fall. They do it here too - they do it because the crabapples are *there*. If there are no crabapples, then any old berry will do. It used to drive my mother nuts when neighbourhood kids threw mountain ash berries all over the place. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:18:09 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC Violence against Women (and kids) Colin said: >I am glad to read this Gina. Children are the most oppressed group of >people on >the planet and the most powerless. It isn't just that they are abused >emotinally >and physicallyand used as sexual objects by adult women and men, but are >neglected and left to die by governments and politicians. They're also abused or neglected in much subtler ways than that. They are often treated as if they either don't exist at all or aren't worthy of attention. How many times have you been out at a store or a fast-food restaurant and there's a child there in the lineup wanting to pay for some candy or their ice-cream or whatever, and if there's an adult there, either the adult barges ahead of them, or the server doesn't even seem to notice they're there? Maybe it's because they're small and the server doesn't notice, or maybe the other customer thinks they kid is with an adult, but, if I ever find a server trying to serve me ahead of the child, I'll say, "Oh this young lady/gentleman was ahead of me." Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:28:31 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Eating at MacDonalds - was Cher, good?? NJC CaTGirl says: >I must say (and I am not a SNOB) that I have not eaten at a McDonalds in >over >10 years. Being a veg if I want fast food I usually go to Taco Bell and >get >a 7 layer burrito....no meat just beans! When my kids are a few years older, you won't catch me near a MacD's! For the record, they now have a few supposedly *vegetarian* dishes, but you still have to smell the lard and meat cooking when you go near it. I imagine, as a vegetarian, that would probably make you feel sick. (It does me, even though I'm not a vegetarian - although if I could figure out how to prepare veg meals properly, I would like to be. I don't much care for the taste of meat anyway, and I don't like the thought of eating animals.) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:23:48 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: Re: Eating at MacDonalds - was Cher, good?? NJC Catherine said: >I have heard some people *claim* they would *never* eat at McDonald's >but, IMO, they're either lying, they don't have kids, or they're >snobs. And I replied: >Well you probably expected SOMEONE to come back on that Catherine! Catherine said: > Yes, Martin, I did, but I didn't necessarily expect it to be YOU of all > people! ;) Wos matter? Do I come across as a bit of a flesh and blood eater then? Catherine again: > I always feel as if I've been stuffed > with used wallpaper, and the paste that goes with it. Terrible stuff. I'd > rather have falafel. LOL - perfect descrition! I've never had a falafel, though the word is dripping with flavour! atb, Martin. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:33:41 +0000 From: Martin Giles Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG When the visitor refered to 'Minute' North Dakota, was she having a Canadian/American dig? Was she saying North Dakota is tiny compared to Sakatchewan or Manitoba or something? Also, I assumed that she was indeed refering to a war, with the sandbags and the bayonets - the second world war. Did they have 'all black' battalions close-combat training before shipping out to Europe? atb, Martin. Catherine transcribed from PWWAM: > ......“Well, we went to the States once. We went to Minute [sp? Minoot? > Maynooth?] North Dakota. Oh, it was terrible, dear – it was terrible! You > know, the bayonets were out. You could see all the Negroes were huddled > together and the sandbags were all piled in one corner. And they were > sticking bayonets into the bales of sand. Well, YOU KNOW why they were > doing that… Oh, we got out of there in a hell of a hurry, eh?"...... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:49:31 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG Raffaele says: >I love the way Joni >tells it, so much that now "Dull, dull, dull dear" (with *that* accent) has >become my joke. Part of me thinks the lady with orange hair is actually my mother. Except my mother really did have orange (auburn) hair, no black roots. And she didn't have "English" teeth. Nor did she ever go to Vancouver. And she didn't walk around with a glass of gin in her hand (scotch maybe). But she did make a similar complaint about the "dullness" of the colours we wore as teenagers (if we weren't wearing our school uniforms, it was blue jeans and T-shirts). She'd tell us to get clothes with bright colours, her logic being that you can't wear those kinds of colours when you get older (I have no idea why not, but that's the way many in her generation seemed to think.) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:56:27 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Jarrett and other suggetsions - now Lhasa (not the Apso) - NJC Raffaele says: >If you got the chance, listen >to a CD by Lhasa called "La llorona". It's the only CD she's done so far, >and all my friends love it after I played some of the songs. As far as I >know, Lhasa is a Canadian/Mexican singer (you might have heard of her >through the Lilith Fair gigs), her voice is astonishing and full of >passion, >she sings in Spanish (with a very weird and nice accent) traditional songs >as well as her compositions. Is this song a traditional one or one of Lhasa's own songs? I've heard a song called "Llorona" sung by Joan Baez. The album is one where she sings all in Spanish, mostly Mexican, but other Central and South American, and possibly one or two from Spain as well. There's a song called "Llorona" on it that starts off something like: Todos me dicen la negra, Llorona and then I don't remember what comes next - anyway, just wondering if it's the same song. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:39:24 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: NJC Violence against Women (and kids) Catherine McKay wrote: > Colin said: > >I am glad to read this Gina. Children are the most oppressed group of > >people on > >the planet and the most powerless. It isn't just that they are abused > >emotinally > >and physicallyand used as sexual objects by adult women and men, but are > >neglected and left to die by governments and politicians. > > They're also abused or neglected in much subtler ways than that. Good for you! This is exactly what I meant by emotional abuse. So much is made of sexual abuse, and rightly so, that it seems to me that people forget about the other forms. Speaking for myself, the emotional shit was the most damaging and most memorable. The sexual stuff can be explained easily as being bad etc but not so the constant 'you are bad' messages. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:40:25 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Eating at MacDonalds - was Cher, good?? NJC > > > LOL - perfect descrition! I've never had a falafel, though the word is > dripping with flavour! try it. it tastes good. > > > atb, > Martin. - -- "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 12:57:17 PST From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Re: lhasa njc "Wally Kairuz" >ciao raffaele, >this artist you mention sounds so interesting. now, i don't like la >macarena-type of music. does her music sound very traditionally mexican or >hispanic or is there a twist to it? >wallyk > Wally, I get shivers when I hear something on the line like La Macarena! Lhasa's music is something *different*. You have to listen to it to understand. It's really frustrating trying to describe music (and it's more frustrating when you're doing it in a language which is not yours!). I would suggest to try CDnow and, if they have the CD, listen to some samples. Let me know. Raffaele ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:58:43 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC: more STUFFing pahleeze > Well there is quite a bit of head decapitation in the movie, but >somehow it >is only gruesome in a Halloween-make-believe sense----as opposed to real >life >violence. I would explain to your daughter what to expect and she'll be >able >to handle it. ("Trudy, you will see dead people who are really mannequins >with >chopped off heads just like the time your brother pulled off your Barbie >doll's >head so that he could watch it flush down the toilet.") -JulieZWebb, >not >likely to ever get work writing for a parenting magazine ROTFL! I get your point - based on what you're saying, I think it's safe to take her. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 13:03:46 PST From: "Raffaele Malanga" Subject: Re: Jarrett and other suggetsions - now Lhasa (not the Apso) - NJC "Catherine McKay > >Is this song a traditional one or one of Lhasa's own songs? I've heard a >song called "Llorona" sung by Joan Baez. The album is one where she sings >all in Spanish, mostly Mexican, but other Central and South American, and >possibly one or two from Spain as well. There's a song called "Llorona" on >it that starts off something like: >Todos me dicen la negra, Llorona >and then I don't remember what comes next - anyway, just wondering if it's >the same song. > La llorona is just the title of the album. There isn't a song with that name on Lhasa's CD. Hey, there is some interest here! btw: If any of you JMDLers will ever get the CD I hope you'll like it, otherwise I'll feel sooo guilty! But I shouldn't, really. It's such a wonderful album ...and it's friends proven! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 21:04:40 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC Martin says: >I've never had a falafel, though the word is >dripping with flavour! > Have a falafel. It's not awful. (P.S. it's middle-Eastern, it looks kind of like meatballs, but it's meatless. It's made from groundup chickpeas (sounds weird, tastes good). It's often served in a pita bread with a salad - tomato, lettuce or cabbage, maybe some onions, yummy! and with tahini sauce, which is pureed sesame seeds mixed with something - yogurt, maybe? - and varying degrees of hotsauce, depending on how hot you like it. Sloppy eating, but delicious.) Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 21:11:08 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG Martin asks: >When the visitor refered to 'Minute' North Dakota, was she having a >Canadian/American dig? Was she saying North Dakota is tiny compared >to >Sakatchewan or Manitoba or something? It is a Canadian/American dig, but not for the reason you say. I've since found out there's a town named Minot in North Dakota (the way Joni says it, it sounds like MinOOT). It's pretty typical of Canadians to make those kind of remarks, especially the one about Niagara Falls - we've got the GOOD falls, they get the crappy side with the rocks all falling down. Actually, I took my kids there in the summer and they made the same comment - "HaHa. The good falls are in Canada, the Americans get the lousy ones". I told them to watch what they say - actually the American side is pretty too in its own way, even though it is smaller and yes, it's falling down, but that's beautiful too. If you ever go there, take the "Maid of the Mist" boat tour that takes you right up close to the falls. You'll get soaking wet and the roar of the water is deafening - you can shriek like an idiot and no one hears you. > >Also, I assumed that she was indeed refering to a war, with the sandbags >and the bayonets - the second world war. Did they have 'all black' >battalions close-combat training before shipping out to Europe? > You may have a point there. They may indeed have had army training going on there. The woman doesn't talk about when they went to ND, so maybe there was some training going on there either for WWII, Korea or even VietNam. If she's typical of Canadians of that generation at that time, and especially in that part of Canada, she probably wouldn't have seen many black people, so she may have just thought they were *all* black. Catherine (in Toronto) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 00:25:43 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG I drove to Niagra Falls in 97. My first thought was how small it was! I expected something much bigger. I had got it confused with victoria Falls in Africa. Niagra sounds African to me. Anyway, the Candaian falls were stunning in their power. I stood mesmerised by it and said the the woman next to me, an american lawyer, 'it makes you want to go with it doesn't it?' To which she repplied'thank God you said that-I thought there was something wrong with me!' I knew just what she meant. niether of us wanted to die but both of us wanted to jump into the water and go over the falls. It was winter and there was still huge lumps of ice beneath the falls. I got loads of wonderful photos. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 00:25:53 +0000 From: catman Subject: NJCRe: Joni's VIVID story from PWWAM - VERY LOOOONG I drove to Niagra Falls in 97. My first thought was how small it was! I expected something much bigger. I had got it confused with victoria Falls in Africa. Niagra sounds African to me. Anyway, the Candaian falls were stunning in their power. I stood mesmerised by it and said the the woman next to me, an american lawyer, 'it makes you want to go with it doesn't it?' To which she repplied'thank God you said that-I thought there was something wrong with me!' I knew just what she meant. niether of us wanted to die but both of us wanted to jump into the water and go over the falls. It was winter and there was still huge lumps of ice beneath the falls. I got loads of wonderful photos. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:36:16 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC In a message dated 11/26/1999 4:07:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, cateri@hotmail.com writes: << Martin says: >I've never had a falafel, though the word is >dripping with flavour! > Have a falafel. It's not awful. >> Hee...this is really cute and funny! I haven't eaten falafel in soooo long! There used to be (could still be) this friendly hippy guy in Brattleboro, Vermont (southern VT) who sold falafel out of a little cart similar to that of a hot dog vendor's. Stuffed into pitta bread with lettuce and tomato, it sure is tasty! He and and his falabel cart were one of the things that made that town really cool. Brattleboro is one of those towns that has retained it's hippy vibe and hasn't turned real slick but still has a lot to offer in the way of several good bookstores, a few boutiques and Hammelman's, a great Jewish bakery. Anyway, sorry but all this talk of falafel made me think about one of my favorite spots in New England. : } Take care one and all, Gina NP: On The Inside - Rosanne Cash ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:12:17 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Voilence against Women (now child abuse) In a message dated 11/25/1999 8:36:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, catman@ethericcats.demon.co.uk writes: << I sometimes feel when i see yet another program or article about battered women or battered men or how some group or other is treated badly that people are so obsessed with their own stuff they forget about the children >> It's interesting you say this because the battered women's movement in this country has been severely criticized precisely for this reason and rightfully so, in my opinion. I was just having a conversation with a coworker who for many years worked as a child advocate at a local battered woman's shelter and she discussed how it's only been in the last couple of years that attention has been paid by the women's shelter/feminist movements to the issues of how violence affects children even if they are not the ones being beaten. Child advocates have been fighting to keep children's issues on par with women's in situations of battering, as they really do not have a voice or the political support that women have been able to garner in this area. In Massachusetts, there have been large grants awarded to battered women's shelters and for community education on this issue and I certainly support those efforts but where are the monies for high quality services to protect children? With its philosophy of "family reunification", Massachusetts Dept. of Social Services (and others across the U.S.) often sends children back to the homes where they have been beaten and/or neglected. We don't ask women to go back to live with a batterer but we expect children to go back to homes where *they've* been treated abusively because the parents have completed some inadequate parenting course? The rights of biological parents are much too strong in this country. Just an interesting tidbit I learned at a New England wide conference on child abuse I attended for work: some child welfare agencies in some states actually coordinate with humane societies to investigate potential child abuse in homes where animal abuse has been reported because statistics prove that often where there is animal abuse and there are children, there is also child abuse. I guess it should seem obvious, but it's not something that I ever thought about as being that closely linked. Gina, quite content and cozy at home with my kids, despite the heavy subject matter! : } ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:21:13 -0500 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Toshi Reagon and Joni In the 15 November 1999 New Yorker there is a photo of singer Toshi Reagon (daughter of Bernice Johnson Reagon of Sweet Honey in the Rock) who just released a album, 'The Righteous Ones." Asked to name three artists whose music she'd want if stranded on a desert island, she replied, her mother's, and Bob Marley, and Joni Mitchell. Check out pages 76-77. I am not sure how I missed this earlier (cathcing up on my reading today) and if this has already been posted, I apologise for the repititon. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 17:51:51 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: jonifest box set njc Wally K asked: > i'm listening to the jonifest box set. WHO is the man with the voice like > the herman's hermits that comes at the end of disc 3?!?!?!? i love his > voice. i have to meet him at once. he's almost like peter gabriel at times. > he's put us all to shame. That's our very own Marcel. (He's credited on my box set - not on yours, Wally?) Marcel couldn't make it to Ashara's but felt inspired to record a few songs for the Fest. He made tape copies for me, Paz, and, I think, Ashara, which we listened to that weekend and were blown away. Paz and I felt that his contribution deserved to be included in the box set. I think he sounds very much like a young Stephen Stills on the songs (Cactus Tree, For Free and Both Sides Nows) and his guitar and mandolin playing is amazing, too. Kakki NP: (Just coincidently recieved today from Marcel) Gram Parson/Emmy Lou Harris compilation ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 20:58:45 EST From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC In a message dated 11/26/1999 4:07:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, cateri@hotmail.com writes: << which is pureed sesame seeds mixed with something - yogurt, maybe? - >> nope tahina paste which is ground up sesame seeds. I love humus too which is chick peas and garic and tahina paste and a little lemon. I love greek and meditarainian food. Just don't know how to spell the word. catgirl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 18:47:11 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Joni on the cover of RStone The new Rolling Stone 12-16-99 is a special issue dedicated to photographs. On the cover are a bunch of color slides, prominently our Joan. Inside is the same Norman Seeff photo circa HOSL with her popping up out of the water in her knit bikini, alongside a short commentary by JM herself on the shoot, and a couple lines from Seeff. Am I the only one to notice that you can see part of her nipple in this series of shots-especially the ones in the HOSL songbook? Here is the text accompanying the photo: "Norman always wanted to get me wet," Joni Mitchell says of this Norman Seeff shoot, outtakes of which accompanied a harsh "Rolling Stone" review of "The Hissing of Summer Lawns." "It was in that wet-T-shirt kind of time, I believe, so I thought, 'OK.' There were a lot of swimming pool images on the album, but I know the pool photos were offensive to fans. There was a prevailing attitude that I'd sold out, that I was showing off. The whole illustrative quality of what it was about was kind of missed." The mood at the session apparently wasn't as sunny as this photograph suggests. "It's at my house," Mitchell recalls. "I think that's the first session that we did out of Norman's studio. The best way to work with Norman was to have an idea, because if you didn't, he was very psychological-and most people never went to him twice, you know. He's got a whole film of every celebrity crying. The only way you could work with him was to have ideas up your sleeve and seduce him with play." Seeff explains that "Joni and I would kind of battle our way through it in a very positive way. There was always that very intense interaction with artists." As for this shoot, Seeff says, "I thought it was a very powerful cocreation between the two of us. It was a rather sensuous- not sensual, but a sensuous-shoot. To me they were just real beautiful images, rather than trying to go for the very in-depth personality type of stuff." For the record, Seeff passes along word that Mitchell was "a very good swimmer." "I haven't used the pool for a while." Mitchell says. "I guess when my daughter comes, we go in. It costs a lot to heat it." Joni's pic shares the page with a pre Rumours F Mac shot, and faces a shot of Bob Marley. RR ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 22:06:58 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC In a message dated 11/26/1999 9:01:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, CaTGirl627@aol.com writes: << nope tahina paste which is ground up sesame seeds. >> It's tahini, actually. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:09:33 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: and another four B&W head shots from 1969 to be exact, bangs and straight hair. The text: From both sides now, the subject's and the photographer's, recollections of these dramatic black-and-white portraits- one of which was used for a 1969 Joni Mitchell cover story- are vague. "That I don't remember." Mitchell says today. "I've seen it, and it's interesting, but I don't remember where it was. The eye has a bit of odd vulnerability. It is not quite haunted, but there's a bit of that poignancy there." "I feel the same way," says Baron Wolman. "I just remember it was up at her home in Laurel Canyon-I think. I did a color and black-and-white session. She was just very hospitable. Some people just want you out of there, you know. I remember we were sitting at a table, and I was using natural light. She had this really beautiful pink silk or silk-like blouse on. It was almost Edwardian-if it were a guy wearing it they would say it was Edwardian. She had a very expressive face and really nice long blond hair in those days." Today Mitchell says she was fairly oblivious to the fact that such images were making her an icon of the era, a folkie dream woman. "I think the only awareness that I had of it, perhaps, was from the ribbing," she says. "Like, David Crosby used to call me the Love Bandit, but that was it." Also on the page are pics of Bill Graham and Neil Young from the same year. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:51:29 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC Gee, this thread is making me hungry. I love Falafels and can devour them endlessly. I also love MacDonald's but have to stop after one small cheeseburger. I also like Baba Ghannouj, where eggplant is used in place of the Garbanzo beans. These dishes remind me of a very unique woman who worked with me long ago. She was the daughter of Armenian restauranteurs, born in Israel, who attended a French convent school in Lebanon growing up. For college she came to the U.S. and attended the University of Texas. She spoke six languages and had the most amazing accent - very raspy French-sounding with a strong Texas drawl. She was a real character and used to constantly invite half the office over for her endless repetoire of home-cooked specialties while laboriously trying to "eh-jeaux-cate" us about world cuisine. She would always staunchly maintain that that all these Middle Eastern and Greek dishes originated in Armenia. ;-) Great food and very healthy, too! Kakki, wishing for a Falafel home delivery right now. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 23:29:56 EST From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: Falafel - was Eating at MacDonalds - NJC In a message dated 11/26/1999 10:09:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, Ginamu@aol.com writes: << nope tahina paste which is ground up sesame seeds. >> It's tahini, actually. >> well.. for not running stairs and looking at the jar I think I spelled it not to shabbily...thanks for the grammer check! ;o) Catgirl ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #533 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! 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