From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #406 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Tuesday, September 14 1999 Volume 04 : Number 406 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: The SSSSSSSSSSNAKE room!NJC [M.Russell@iaea.org] RE: The geezers of jmdl ["Wally Kairuz" ] aging NJC ["Wally Kairuz" ] Old Age [Thunderthumbs ] Re: The geezers of jmdl [catman ] Re: Old Age [catman ] Re: NJC Old age [MGVal@aol.com] Re: Old Age [MGVal@aol.com] Re: Old Age - forgot the NJC - sorry [MGVal@aol.com] Re: Old Age -Reply [LOREN CARTER ] ROTR [Martin Giles ] Re: soundtracks (NJC) [Heather Galli ] Re: Atty May Setlist Info [Heather Galli ] Instrument Bash ["Paul Castle" ] Re: NJC Old age [Heather Galli ] Re: Old Age -Reply ["Julie Z. Webb" ] Re: Converting the young ["Catherine McKay" ] NJC aging and Einstein [Linda Worster ] Re: Graham Nash in Accident (NJC)/Eurhythmics reunite ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: check out this soundtrack. [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Old Age [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: NJC Old age ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: NJC Old age [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Graham Nash in Accident(NJC) [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: Old Age (NJC) ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: Old Age [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Joni & Michael Hedges (tunings) [Howard Wright ] Re: JoniFest Photo'sNJC and aging [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: NJC aging and Einstein ["Catherine McKay" ] Graham Nash [Leslie Mixon ] Re: Atty May Setlist Info [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] ani on the joni interview [Bounced Message ] Re: ROTR [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] NJC Re: Instrument Bash [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: NJC Old age ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: Joni & Michael Hedges (tunings) [Mark Domyancich wrote: > But I have no fear of any animal whatsoever - except > maybe sharks, after an encounter with a 15-foot long > hammerhead when I was 12 - which swam under > the boat I'd been swimming around, about 2 minutes > after I got out of the water! Scary! > I've never seen a snake, much less held one, but I doubt > I'd have a problem. So can we assume from this statement that you're planning a trip to Boston next September? Hopefully, Marian Vienna Helen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:18:56 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: The geezers of jmdl that's cool, colin! honestly, i always have a hard time remembering that you're actually a year older than i. i don't mean you sound stupid or immature, but to me you always come on as a teenager or someone in his early 20's at most! somebody at the jonifest told me they thought i was in my fifties by the way i write. wallyK - -----Original Message----- De: catman Para: joni@smoe.org Fecha: Lunes 13 de Septiembre de 1999 07:58 Asunto: Re: The geezers of jmdl >You're older than me then!!! I'd be lucky if I was 14. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:25:20 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: aging NJC bob, this is such a fascinating perspective! as i approach my 39th birthday, i'm beginning to feel the acceleration of time. manuel puig, a marvelous argentine writer, author of the kiss of the spider woman, once said that you realize that you're getting older when people stop *paying* -- literally or figuratively -- for your company and you begin to pay. wallyK - -----Original Message----- De: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Para: w evans CC: joni@smoe.org Fecha: Lunes 13 de Septiembre de 1999 08:37 Asunto: Re: JoniFest Photo'sNJC and aging >I think it has to do somewhat with >Einstein's theories of the relativity of time. >Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 05:35:20 -0400 From: Thunderthumbs Subject: Old Age With all this talk of age, and age-related things... Here's some of my thoughts about "old" age, and age related issues that may be of an interest. I graduated college in 1997 and I'm twenty-five. Twenty-six next month. All of my life up until two years ago has been comprised of peer groups and interacting with people my age. When I graduated and went into the workforce, I started out in the new home construction field. I'm in the legal profession now, but... in these past two+ years (and even now) I've met one or two women my age- none of which worked in my business of construction which seemed to be dominated largely by white heterosexual males between the ages of 30-55. Maybe that's an over generalization, but... There were no women my age in that business, and seeing how I spent much time at my job, I basically never met or had any chance to interact with them. This is still a very much current problem in the legal field for me now. I know 25 (or so) year old women exist, but where, I don't know... In that/this time, the only women I've had any interaction with are older than I am- somewhere in the 30+ range. I think that since I've not been able to interact with girls my age, that in that vaccum, I've begun to find the "older women" attractive. I even find a few that are pushing 50 are attractive. Not in the sense that "oh you look nice today" but "wow, she really looks nice" kind of a thing. I am not sure if this is right or good, but it seems to happen. Two+ years ago in college, I had a very serious girlfriend who was 20 at the time. She broke up with me two+ years ago for reasons I still don't know and I haven't gone on a date since. Not that I wouldn't like to date, but I can't seem to find anyone. Anyways... at that time, I couldn't conceive of finding an "older woman" attractive as I do now. It's a ridiculous thing. I have no interation with girls my age, and I suppose to fill the gaps I find the 30+ (most between 35-45) attractive. This can go nowhere. Personally, if I had a choice, I wouldn't date anyone younger than 21, and nobody older than 29. When you start looking at the older women, they're looking for things in a mate that at 25 going on 26 that I can't possibly be or provide. Not that I'm not responsible and mature etc..., but I simply don't have the level of career, achieved proffesional/job status and financial stability and intangeable "other" that becomes increasingly important to women when they get older. I'm kind of stuck between worlds. It's rather interesting and maybe even slightly uncomfortable to see a soccer mom in the Caravan or the 35 year old business professional, and think of her in anything approaching romantic terms. I have nothing to offer them. I've seen it all too often to deny that women tend to date older guys, not much younger ones. The girls that would find me to be the "older guy" they'd like to date (if that even) are those still "away at school". In an age where there is such a value placed on, and an of envy of youth (and I'm still within spitting distance of that coveted age that many people wish they were), how ironic it is that I am wishing I was older to get what I feel is missing from my life simply because I have little interaction with those women my age. It's like you get to a point and say "Is this as good as it gets?" Just like the movie says... Clearly if being twentysomething out of college is a great thing (and I've heard that from MANY older people who wish they were- like I should be "living it up- " Yeah right), I'm really missing the boat on all accounts. The flipside of their comments would be that being thirtysomething, or fourty something would not be as good or desirable? If this is true, and I'm not having a good time in my twenties, makes me wonder what will happen in my thirties and fourties? If now is good, I'm not sure I want to be around for the less than good. Age is an interesting topic indeed... I've never seen The Graduate, but damn if I'm not tempted to watch it. -Brad ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:54:10 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: The geezers of jmdl Wally Kairuz wrote: > that's cool, colin! honestly, i always have a hard time remembering that > you're actually a year older than i. actually it seems I am 2 years older than you! > i don't mean you sound stupid or > immature, but to me you always come on I didn't know I came on at all! I didn't mean to flirt > as a teenager or someone in his early > 20's at most! arrested development I guess! Only wish my body followed suit. > somebody at the jonifest told me they thought i was in my > fifties by the way i write. who was that? I'll beat them for you if you wish. How rude! Still I am sure seeing you put them in the right decade. A child of the 40's right? > wallyK > -----Original Message----- > De: catman > Para: joni@smoe.org > Fecha: Lunes 13 de Septiembre de 1999 07:58 > Asunto: Re: The geezers of jmdl > > >You're older than me then!!! I'd be lucky if I was 14. > > - -- "It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not." TANTRA’S/ETHERIC PERSIANS AND HIMALAYANS http://www.ethericcats.demon.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:57:33 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: Old Age Brad wrote: I even find a few that are pushing 50 are attractive. Quick, get the dcotor. Women pushing 50? You need help. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 07:02:50 EDT From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC Old age In a message dated 9/14/99 3:12:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time, revrvl@pathwaynet.com writes: << f you are old enough to remember records (as I am) you are old. >> My kids like to play a game called "tell me about the olden days, Mom." Hell's bell's, I'm only 40, but yes I grew up in the magical, olden time when: 1. we did not have microwaves 2. only had black and white TV with 3 channels 3. only had 45's and 78's 4. my paper route delivery identity had to be clandestine because girls were not allowed to deliver the Star Ledgar 5. Nintendo did not exist ...and on and on and on.... This game can make my head reel, but my kids grow silent and pensive of all the obstacles I've had to overcome in those dank and dark ages. MG - nowdays just trying to look younger than my photo.....(:-D ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 07:43:02 EDT From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: Old Age In a message dated 9/14/99 4:24:16 AM Pacific Daylight Time, ddietz@erols.com writes: << When you start looking at the older women, they're looking for things in a mate that at 25 going on 26 that I can't possibly be or provide. Not that I'm not responsible and mature etc..., but I simply don't have the level of career, achieved proffesional/job status and financial stability and intangeable "other" that becomes increasingly important to women when they get older. >> Ahem...speaking up as an "older" woman, (my god, when did THAT happen!), I think that you are a bit right, but a bit on the wrong track, logic-wise. I've been single for 5 years and things like "career, achieved professional/job status and financial stability" are less and less important to me, the older I get. I know for myself what attracts me more than anything else are the intangibles: a sense of humor, intelligence, kindness and a good soul. These are qualities that mean more to me than a man's job status or bank account. As a matter of fact, those things are very, very secondary. An openness to personal growth and a comfort with sexuality are also big top tens on my list. More than anything else, I look to grow as two people together rather than two combined bank accounts. (although thoughtful gifts are always welcomed!). To me, it sounds as though you are isolated in the workday world. I know that it sounds very Ann Lander-ish, but the best way to expose yourself to a wide range of people, (woman included!), is to get yourself beyond that limited sphere and develop your outside interests, be they sports, (join a co-ed team, take lessons), altruistic, (volunteer your time), or religion, (church group, etc. etc.). What makes your twenties so "live it up," is less excitement junkie times and more the freedom to examine yourself and try out different life experiments without the added responsibilities of mortgages, kids and spouses. Get out there! Best, MG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 07:44:13 EDT From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: Old Age - forgot the NJC - sorry Forgot the NJC on my last post. Blame it on old age. MG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 08:10:08 -0400 From: LOREN CARTER Subject: Re: Old Age -Reply I for one am now looking forward to the advancing years. When I was 31 I got my first (and so far only cavity!), my hair started to fall out, and there was an 18 year old woman who was smitten with me (and my wife just could not understand why....neither did I for the most part), but way back then I sure did feel old. Now that I'm 41 (42 in January) and recently diagnosed with MS, I am looking forward to the coming years. Let me explain....my neurologist explained to me that the data on MS is showing that the diesase "burns" itself out around 50-55 in most people. Since my case is not that severe, maybe my diagnosis at 41 means that I won't ever get into the really bad part of the disease (wheelchairs, walkers, stumbling, mumbling, etc.), so bring on the big 5-0. Right around that time I can start volunteering to coach my son's little league teams, and be done with MS. I may be death, dumb, and blind to it all, but this hope gives me the strength to carry on. Now about older women, I've always been attracted to "older" women. My wife is 5 years older than I, my first wife was 9 years older, and my first experience was the mom of one of my friends. You never forget your first time. Damm this has been waaaaay tooooo revealing, so I'll shut my yap and sit down. Loren....... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:03:43 +0100 From: Martin Giles Subject: ROTR Bob wrote > NP: "Refuge of The Roads" from Tokyo '83 (I LOVE this show!) Huh? Wossat?? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 08:36:59 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: soundtracks (NJC) >My favorite soundtrack, hands down, is Peter Gabriel's PASSION (from The >Last Temptation of Christ). It's amazing. I agree, Terri !! The dance troup MOMIX does a performance to this soundtrack. It is truly awesome .... a must see. Heather ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 08:41:33 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: Atty May Setlist Info Inquiring minds want to know...... when can we get this on tape? Will it be included in a Tape Tree? Heather - who is bummed that Marian's performance of All Along The Watchtower is incomplete :-( >For those of you who are interested, the following is a list of what was >recorded at Atty May's Sunday afternoon and evening. > >Marian All Along The Watchtower (incomplete) >Paz Song For Sharon >Marian Yvette In English >Chuck Rainy Night House >Chuck Wichita Lineman >Chuck These Four Walls >Paz Love Puts On A New Face >Paz Just Like This Train >Marian Moon At The Window >Marian Number One >Marian Offnight Backstreet >Marian A Strange Boy >Marian BaranGrill >Marian Coyote >Paz Don't Let Me Be Lonely Tonight (JT) >Paz Chinese Cafe >Chuck, Kakki, Paz Southern Man (CSN) >Chuck, Kakki, Paz Wooden Ships (CSN) >Chuck, Kakki, Pearl, Paz Big Yellow Taxi (the first time today) >Chuck, Kakki, Pearl, Paz Peoples Parties (incomplete my fault) >Chuck, Kakki, Pearl, Rainy Night House >Paz In The Air Tonight (Phil Collins) >Paz Say GoodBye (Dave Matthews) >Paz, Chuck Guajira (Santana) >Paz and Chuck Hejira >Paz and Chuck Cherokee Louise >Chuck, Pearl, Kakki I Think I Understand >Chuck, Pearl, Kakki, Paz Circle Game >Paz, Kakki Shades of Scarlett Conquering >Paz, Kakki Another Star (Stevie Wonder) >Paz Building A Mystery (Sarah McLachlan) >Ensemble Love The One Your With (Stills) >Ensemble Long Time Gone (CSN incomplete) >Ensemble If I Needed Someone (Beatles) >Ensemble Big Yellow Taxi (one mo time) >Chuck + Guest Singer > from Blue Heaven Band Under The Boardwalk > > >Best wishes to all, > >Michael > >NP-WallyK leading the gang at the close of Joni Fest-Circle Game > >P.S. Les's DAT player caught all of WallyK's set and Brian Thomas + a >couple ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:40:51 +0100 From: "Paul Castle" Subject: Instrument Bash >Jeez, I hate people that destroy musical instruments. That's so, like, > yesterday (yeah, yeah, it was yesterday.) Yes, but I hated them yesterday too! I used to say "Excuse me, have you finished with that?" (Not so much possessive as frightened I might be in the room when they actually did it!!). PaulC Talkin'boutmygggggeneration ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 08:55:05 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: NJC Old age LOL, MG!!!!! I remember telling my daughter about the dark ages ;-) She wanted to know what it was like to be a hippie! Now I'm a grandmother. I guess I'll have to explain that to my dear sweet little Hannah. BTW, folks, she loves Night In The City! There is hope! MG, you look very young! I think you make a cool Mom! Heather - who's remembering Pong ... the first TV computer game, I think. >In a message dated 9/14/99 3:12:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time, >revrvl@pathwaynet.com writes: > ><< f you are old enough to remember records (as I am) you are old. > >> > >My kids like to play a game called "tell me about the olden days, Mom." >Hell's bell's, I'm only 40, but yes I grew up in the magical, olden time when: > >1. we did not have microwaves >2. only had black and white TV with 3 channels >3. only had 45's and 78's >4. my paper route delivery identity had to be clandestine because girls were >not allowed to deliver the Star Ledgar >5. Nintendo did not exist > >...and on and on and on.... > >This game can make my head reel, but my kids grow silent and pensive of all >the obstacles I've had to overcome in those dank and dark ages. > >MG - nowdays just trying to look younger than my photo.....(:-D ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 00:30:38 -0400 From: "Julie Z. Webb" Subject: Re: Old Age -Reply "Oh I am not old, I'm told, but I am not young and nothing can be done. Don't start my heart is a smoking gun. Oh and nothing can be done. Must I surrender with grace the things I loved when I was younger (Sweet embrace?) What do I do here with this hunger?" I'll be 42 in November and as far as I'm concerned these years of late have been my awakening. So I say in a good way: nothing can be done. - -Jules ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:04:11 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Converting the young Helen, you said, >in my pre-Joni days, it could have been a lot worse (since I >still >owned >the album "Tragedy" by the BeeGees)! Helen, I have a confession to make. I've got several BeeGees albums, (in vinyl) including the Saturday Night Fever soundtrack (as well as the Muppets' version, Sesame Street Fever). I think that is heading in the "classic" direction though, so it's almost respectable again. cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:02:28 -0400 From: Linda Worster Subject: NJC aging and Einstein >kenevans said: > ><issues, both time acceleration (the feeling that the past year was a few >months, where a year used to feel like a year)>> > and Bob added: >This is interesting to me also...I think it has to do somewhat with >Einstein's theories of the relativity of time. That is, when you're 5, a >year represents 20% of your life so it passes by RELATIVELY slowly, whereas >when you're 20, a year is only 5% of your lifetime so it advances much more >quickly, in your mind's eye anyway. By the time you're 50, a year is only >2% of your lifetime, so it's perceived as moving very rapidly...we've all >heard folks who have gotten older talk about how quickly the time flies - I >think this is why. Not that TIME itself changes in measure, but that the >perception of time changes... > This subject is fascinating to me too. I have a friend whose 90 year old grandmother, commenting on how her life was speeding up, said: "Every five minutes, I'm eating breakfast!" Linda ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:09:11 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Graham Nash in Accident (NJC)/Eurhythmics reunite Ooh yeah. Two broken legs. The poor man - I can only imagine what that must be like. I heard that this morning on the news as well - another thing I heard, totally unrelated, is that Eurhythmics is (are?) getting back together again. "Officially", whatever that means. >>I just read this on the CSN list. Poor Graham! Kakki cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:18:25 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: check out this soundtrack. mr_lovesaint@webtv.net wrote: > ok...perhaps i shouldn't admit it now-a-days, but i'm a robert > altman fan ( he did m.a.s.h. , the player, nashville among many other > great films). Shouldn't admit it? Why not? You have discriminating taste. He is one of our great director's. I always put Nashville on my top 5 list of best American films. Jerry np: The Weather Channel, what else?????????????? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:18:22 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Old Age Watch it, Catman. It may be a long, long way from Canada, but here's one woman almost pushing 50 who doesn't think it's too far to go to track you down and take - you - out! >Brad wrote: >I even find a few that are pushing >50 are attractive. > >Quick, get the dcotor. Women pushing 50? You need help. > > cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:24:59 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Old Age Colin said to Brad: <> Colin, this wasn't directed to me but I find it very offensive. Was it intended as a joke? It didn't come off like one. Why does he need help? Why can't women pushing 50 be attractive? I know it's common, especially in America, to believe that youth=beauty and vice versa, but it's certainly not a theory I subscribe to. I know many women in their 50's and up that are attractive AND also sexy as hell! There is a real beauty in a face that revels in the wrinkles of experience and the eyes of wisdom. Now women who are 50 and try to look and/or act 20 are embarrassing (same with men), but women who celebrate their years instead of trying to escape them? Very attractive indeed. One of the coolest things Joni said last year in Atlanta was in regards to turning 55...she commented that our President was the same age, and HE was still pretty frisky! (Or something to that effect). And believe me, plastic surgery or not or whatever, Joni is one attractive/beautiful/gorgeous lady!! She realizes and says that she's no longer an ingenue, sure doesn't mean she's not attractive... You should either apologize to Brad or explain what you meant by telling him that he needs help. Sounds to me like the only help he needs is hooking up with one of these "Sugar Mamas", after all, in the words of Benjamin Franklin, they don't tell, they don't swell, and they're grateful as hell! :~) Bob NP: Raised on Robbery ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:31:44 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC Old age MG, you said: >My kids like to play a game called "tell me about the olden days, Mom." >Hell's bell's, I'm only 40, but yes I grew up in the magical, olden time >when: > >1. we did not have microwaves >2. only had black and white TV with 3 channels I can top that! We only had ONE channel! This was when I was a kid living in Pembroke, Ontario. Because it's in a valley surrounded by hills, and they didn't have satellites and all that, TV signals had to be bounced across various towers on hilltops. So all we had was CHOV, Channel 5, the Voice of the Ottawa Valley. Jeez, I still remember my phone number from when we lived there, because you only had to dial the last 5 numbers! Later, when we moved to the Big City, we bought a colour TV just in time to watch the first lunar landing, which my nerdy brother tried to take photos of from the TV screen - no VCRs back then! >3. only had 45's and 78's >4. my paper route delivery identity had to be clandestine because girls >were >not allowed to deliver the Star Ledgar >5. Nintendo did not exist > >...and on and on and on.... > >This game can make my head reel, but my kids grow silent and pensive of all >the obstacles I've had to overcome in those dank and dark ages. > >MG - nowdays just trying to look younger than my photo.....(:-D Isn't it amazing that kids are surprised that we didn't have Nintendo, or CDs, or all the different flavours of gum and candy that they have now. On the other hand, when I tell them I could go to the corner store (and walk there with my sisters, not get driven or accompanied by an adult!) with 5 cents and come back with a bag of candy which you could buy 2 or 3 for a penny in some cases. They'll ask me how much such-and-such cost when I was a kid and half the time whatever-it-was didn't even exist back then. My Dad tells me that when he was a kid growing up in Montreal, in winter, everything was delivered by horse-pulled sleighs. Which is the more amazing thing - the horses and sleighs, or the fact that you could still get milk/bread/eggs and so on delivered to your home? Whenever I tell my kids about the olden days, the story starts like this: Long, long ago, when the earth's crust was still cooling, and dinosaurs roamed the earth... You have to say that in a particular low, slow voice, while looking around at them 'til their eyes get really big and their mouths start hanging open a bit before you go on. (Kinda like when you're telling them ghost stories.) cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:46:05 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: NJC Old age Enjoy: Do you remember . . . . . > > > 1. Blackjack chewing gum > > > 2. Wax Coke-shaped bottles with colored sugar water > > > 3. Candy cigarettes > > > 4. Soda pop machines that dispensed bottles > > > 5. Coffee shops with tableside jukeboxes > > > 6. Home milk delivery in glass bottles with cardboard > > > stoppers > > > 7. Party lines > > > 8. Newsreels before the movie > > > 9. P.F. Flyers > > > 10. Butch wax > > > 11. Telephone numbers with a word prefix (Olive - > > > 6933) > > > 12. Peashooters > > > 13. Howdy Doody > > > 14. 45 RPM records > > > 15. S&H Green Stamps > > > 16. Hi-fi's > > > 17. Metal ice trays with levers > > > 18. Mimeograph paper > > > 19. Blue flashbulbs > > > 20. Beanie and Cecil > > > 21. Roller skate keys > > > 22. Cork popguns > > > 23. Drive-ins > > > 24. Studebakers > > > 25. Wash tub wringers > > > > > > If you remembered 0-5: You're still young > > > If you remembered 6-10: You are getting older > > > If you remembered 11-15: Don't tell your age > > > If you remembered 16-25: You're older than dirt! Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:47:33 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Graham Nash in Accident(NJC) Kakki announced: < Graham Nash, of Crosby Stills Nash & Young, was injured in a freak boating > accident in Hawaii yesterday that caused him to break both of his legs, it > was announced by his manager Gerry Tolman.>> So Joni's a prophetess again! Didn't she say... "Woman she bounce back easy, but a man could break both his legs..." :~) I suppose he'll want to sue the boat manufacturer...but he won't have a leg to stand on!! Sorry all, in all seriousness I'm sorry for the accident and wish a speedy recovery for Graham... Bob NP: Sonic Youth, "Junkie's Promise" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 13:52:54 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: Old Age (NJC) ><< When you start looking at the older women, they're looking for things >in >a mate > that at 25 going on 26 that I can't possibly be or provide. Not that I'm > not responsible and mature etc..., but I simply don't have the level of > career, achieved proffesional/job status and financial stability and > intangeable "other" that becomes increasingly important to women when > they get older. >> > > >Ahem...speaking up as an "older" woman, (my god, when did THAT happen!), I >think that you are a bit right, but a bit on the wrong track, logic-wise. > >I've been single for 5 years and things like "career, achieved >professional/job status and financial stability" are less and less >important >to me, the older I get. I know for myself what attracts me more than >anything >else are the intangibles: a sense of humor, intelligence, kindness and a >good >soul. These are qualities that mean more to me than a man's job status or >bank account. I have to agree with this. I do know people (women) who are only interested in men if they've got the kind of financial stability you're talking about, but this tends to be of less importance as you get out of your 30s or so and into your 40s, and the people I DO know who are over 30 and still think this way are often people who have had difficulties in earlier relationships possibly because they DID think this way, if you catch my logic. Of course, some people will always be that way because they associate success with money and status, but think of all the people you may know who seem to have it all in terms of looks, money, status, the right job, a fancy car and all that, but aren't really happy. It's corny but true that money can't buy you happiness (but I will admit, it sure helps!) I actually feel kind of sorry for people in their 20s or so these days, because Brad, you're right - most of the "good" jobs seem to be taken by white males in their 30s to 50s, with the odd token woman (also white and in that age group) thrown in for good measure (and here and there in places where employment equity is taken seriously, like in gov't, where I work, people of colour and handicapped people as well, of either sex). It may seem hard to believe that you can get anywhere with all these people seemingly blocking the way, but the good news is - we're all gonna retire or die at around the same time, those of us who don't have nervous breakdowns and take disability leave. So, you may have to wait a bit longer, but in another 10 or 20 years, you are gonna RULE! cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:55:18 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Old Age In a message dated 9/14/99 7:22:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time, ddietz@erols.com writes: << I'm kind of stuck between worlds. It's rather interesting and maybe even slightly uncomfortable to see a soccer mom in the Caravan or the 35 year old business professional, and think of her in anything approaching romantic terms. I have nothing to offer them. I've seen it all too often to deny that women tend to date older guys, not much younger ones. >> I've no doubt there are plenty of women in their 30s who would be attracted to a guy your age, but if you "think" you've nothing to offer them, then you don't. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 14:58:20 +0100 (BST) From: Howard Wright Subject: Re: Joni & Michael Hedges (tunings) Anne Sandstrom wrote: >I recall reading that Michael Hedges was heavily influenced by Joni - no >surprise since he played in many different tunings. One of my favorite >Hedges tunings (he used it for Rickover's Dream) is CGDGBC. As far as I >know, Joni never used this tuning right? You're right. The closest Joni tuning to this is, I think, CGDGBD - i.e only the top string is different (D instead of C). Joni used this for quite a few songs (Trouble Child, Don't Interrupt the Sorrow, Cold Blue Steel, Sweet Bird). That Hedges tuning looks pretty interesting. Having a semitone (half-step) between the two top strings (B and C) must make for some juicy chords! I haven't got my notebook here to check, but I'm pretty sure that there are no Joni tunings that have two adjacent strings tuned a semitone apart like this. She's had strings a tone apart, or in unison, but never a semitone like this. I know hardly anything about Micheal Hedges, but his name has come up so many times on this list, and many of you seem to really love his music, so it's about time I checked him out I think! Howard ******************************************************* Howard.Wright@ed.ac.uk Every country has smart people in it. The trouble is : none of these smart people ever go into politics. - Frank Zappa ******************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 09:52:29 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: JoniFest Photo'sNJC and aging Catgirl said: <> Thanks, Catgirl, I think I look more like Johnny Winter or Ric Flair (championship wrestler) than Joni, though! :~D Bob ps: What's with your emoticon? looks like you got a bad unwanted facial hair there! LOL! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 14:04:27 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC aging and Einstein ROTFL! (I finally figured out what that meant!!!) You said: >I have a friend whose 90 year old grandmother, commenting on how her >life >was speeding up, said: "Every five minutes, I'm eating breakfast!" That sounds like one very cool old lady! cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 07:30:59 -0700 From: Leslie Mixon Subject: Graham Nash As the goddess says, "Woman she bounce back easy, but a man can break both his legs......" Leslie ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:00:40 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Atty May Setlist Info Michael rubs it in with: <> Wow, Michael, I don't know if I should say thanks or curse you for posting this wonderful set list that I DIDN'T HEAR!! Kinda makes me feel like a kid looking in the candy store window... Among everything else there, I can't wait to hear Marian's "Offnight Backstreet", "Strange Boy", oh heck, I can't wait to hear it all! AT least I've been able to start my mornings off with the wonderful European Coffee that Marian gave me! Starts my day with a taste of Jonifest '99... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 08:27:12 -0600 From: Bounced Message Subject: ani on the joni interview Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 05:30:56 -0400 From: BarBearUh hey folks. just got pointed to this intvw w/ani difranco in motherjones mag. what follows is the part that relates to the joni intvw a few months back. you can check out this URL for the article http://www.motherjones.com/interview/difranco.html MoJo Wire: You wrote a Los Angeles Times Magazine article on Joni Mitchell in which you noted that Mitchell was uppity, so the press painted her as a bitch, whereas Dylan, who was also uppity, was considered rebellious. Obviously, times have changed. So how do you think this uppity Ani DiFranco person has been portrayed? DiFranco: Well, I basically get stereotyped a lot in terms of being a girl and writing "chick" music for teenage girls or something. I think, if anything, the press kind of, because of my gender and my age, tends to kind of relegate my work to this sort of special-interest group. It's part of the cultural dynamic, I guess. MoJo Wire: Mitchell hated to be compared with other female musicians. Does that bother you too? DiFranco: Well no, actually. I don't hate being compared with female musicians. I don't mind that at all. I have no problem with seeing connections between women's work. On the other side of the coin, I hate it when people don't recognize the work of women as being universal, or having any import to the world at large, as opposed to men's work, which is generally tends to be seen as more universal -- men's writing about their own experience tends to be put in a broader context. MoJo Wire: In the LA Times piece you write, "Either you are a feminist or you are a sexist." DiFranco: Well, I just see a lot of people who are really terrified of the"f-word." A lot of women these days, a lot of young women don't want to call themselves feminists. You have this cheap, hideous "girl power" sort of fad, which I think is pretty benign at best, but at worst, I think it's a way of taking the politics out of feminism and making it some kind of fashion. I see a lot of young female performers -- and Joni is kind of an older guard -- who do not call themselves feminist, but would certainly believe in their own right to self-determination, and wouldn't want anybody to stop them from becoming themselves. They just refuse to recognize the relationship between their lives and those of other women, or feel any solidarity there. And that scares me, because I think if we can't use the word feminist, if it's some kind of taboo or dirty word, or means you're ugly, or you're angry, or you're not dateable [laughs], then you've just reduced the language by a whole concept. I just don't know any other word than "feminist" that describes a person who believes women are people. - -barbara np: me'shell ndegeocello, bitter (michael's right, it's fabulous) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:29:18 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: ROTR Martin awakens from his nap: <<> NP: "Refuge of The Roads" from Tokyo '83 (I LOVE this show!) Huh? Wossat??>> Martin, this is a recording that has been passed around here a little, the quality of the recording is superb, and personally I LOVE the song selection as she plays a lot of stuff from WTRF which I love and really rocks it up! Thanks again Patrick for sharing this with me! Additionally, the Japanese audience is VERY respectful, and while she is playing, they are practically silent. And it's taped from a radio broadcast as opposed to a tape player under someone's chair, so the sound is clear indeed! It's full of treasures and surprises...I'll be glad to make you a copy (tape), or you can wait for the next CD tree, I think it's going to be part of that. I'm equally excited to be getting a copy of Sydney '83 from yet another JMDL'er pal! Bob, self-professed Joni Junkie...needing a new fix :~) NP: Sonic Youth, "Skip Tracer" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:36:25 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: NJC Re: Instrument Bash Paul said to Pete T. and Jaco P.: <> It puts me in the mind of John Hiatt's tune "Perfectly Good Guitar" featuring the lines, "Oh, it breaks my heart, to see these stars, Smashing a perfectly good guitar..." And in interviews when that record was released, he would joke about bands that would find themselves in what he called a "Pearl Jam", where they would try to destroy their guitars but they were so well made they weren't easily broken... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 14:44:34 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Re: NJC Old age My, you do bring back some memories! >Do you remember . . . . . > > > > 1. Blackjack chewing gum Not at all, but maybe we didn't have this in Canada. I do remember Thrills - - it had fuschia-coloured coating and tasted like soap. You can still buy it in some bulk-food stores. I have no idea why we liked chewing this stuff. > > > > 2. Wax Coke-shaped bottles with colored sugar water Not quite - I do remember wax vampire-fangs - you can still buy these, and they do have coke- and other pop- (soda in the US)-flavoured thingies to this very day in our local variety store, but my kids hate 'em. > > > > 3. Candy cigarettes Yer darn right - I smoked a load of those in my day while pretending my glass of apple juice was wine, or water was a martini, and saying "B'duh, b'duh!" a lot - this was how my sister, Arne Saknussen, and I, thought ladies at cocktail parties spoke. The ciggies have crept quietly back, but sometimes they call them something other than cigarettes (like candy "sticks" for example) in order not to encourage kids to smoke, I guess, haha, as if that fools anyone. And they've removed the red bit that was supposed to be the lit part - probably found out the red dye was carcinogenic or something. Or maybe it's OK to "smoke" candy cigarettes as long as they're not "lit". > > > > 4. Soda pop machines that dispensed bottles Yeah, and the Coke bottles, those green ones, were always the best! > > > > 5. Coffee shops with tableside jukeboxes You could get one song for 10 cents or 3 for 25 cents. Maybe it was cheaper earlier on, but that's what I remember. > > > > 6. Home milk delivery in glass bottles with cardboard > > > > stoppers Yes! The milkman, when he was delivering the milk, would always call my sister and me "boys" just to piss us off, and we, taking him seriously, would always say "We're GIRLS!" and we used the cardboard stoppers (sometimes there were aluminum ones in different colours - these were really cool) as counters when learning Grade 1 arithmetic. Today you have to use those plastic thingies that are around the big bags of milk, which does NOT have the same effect at all. > > > > 7. Party lines There are STILL a few people in Canada who have these, and who will fight to the death to keep them because their phone bills are so cheap. A Canadian (at least the older ones, no matter how much money they may have) will NOT call long-distance because they hate paying the long-distance charges. > > > > 8. Newsreels before the movie That, I gotta say, no. > > > > 9. P.F. Flyers > > > > 10. Butch wax I don't have a clue about either 9 or 10! > > > > 11. Telephone numbers with a word prefix (Olive - > > > > 6933) Yup - my phone number when I was a kid was REgent 2-9482. > > > > 12. Peashooters When you've been hit by one, you never forget it. > > > > 13. Howdy Doody Yes, and we had a Canadian version of it too, but that's going back such a long way, that I don't remember it much. What I want to know - and it may be that only Brits and a few Canadians will remember this - does anyone remember Bill and Ben, the Flowerpot Men? I've only met 2 people (apart from Arne) who does remember them, and one of them is British. > > > > 14. 45 RPM records (Yup) > > > > 15. S&H Green Stamps (In Canada, we had Lucky Green Stamps - we >bought a record player with them, on which we listed to our 45's and even >the odd 78 - these belonged to my mother - that was back when record albums >were truly that - a bunch of 78s by someone like Bing Crosby in an "album", >not unlike a CD boxed set, but much bigger.) > > > > 16. Hi-fi's Oh my Lord, yes - my Dad bought one and the whole family crowded around to listen - he had demo-type records that were meant to use all the various sounds the Hi-Fi was capable of producing - one of these was called "Ping-pong Percussion". (Later, came the military marches, the Broadway musicals, and the Herb Alpert.) > > > > 17. Metal ice trays with levers Hey - I still have one of those! > > > > 18. Mimeograph paper YEah, that purple ink really smelled cool right after they were run off. > > > > 19. Blue flashbulbs (yup) > > > > 20. Beanie and Cecil (yup) > > > > 21. Roller skate keys (only in Melanie's song) > > > > 22. Cork popguns (nope, but pingpong ball ones, yes.) > > > > 23. Drive-ins (that was my family's version of "going out to >dinner" - down to the local A&W for a teen-burger and a rootbeer.) > > > > 24. Studebakers (just the name - we had a Ford Falcon >stationwagon) > > > > 25. Wash tub wringers (get serious! how 'bout a rock and a >mountain stream while you're at it!) > > > > cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 10:03:41 -0500 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Joni & Michael Hedges (tunings) Would Sire of Sorrow (DADF#GD) count? At 2:58 PM +0100 9/14/99, Howard Wright wrote: >That Hedges tuning looks pretty interesting. Having a semitone (half-step) >between the two top strings (B and C) must make for some juicy chords! I >haven't got my notebook here to check, but I'm pretty sure that there are >no Joni tunings that have two adjacent strings tuned a semitone apart like >this. She's had strings a tone apart, or in unison, but never a semitone >like this. ___________________________________ | Mark Domyancich | | Harpua@revealed.net | | http://home.revealed.net/Harpua | |_________________________________| ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 11:05:30 -0400 From: LOREN CARTER Subject: The five questions most feared by men -NJC Catgirl, I used to work at a place where a woman who worked for me (and had just returned to work after having a baby) asked me "Loren, do you think I'm fat?" I has just come up the ramp and into the computer room when she asked me that (in front of a bunch of others). Here's how I answered: Melissa, I'm not going to answer that question, and here's why: 1) There's no way for me to tap dance around and answer you. Simply by asking, you feel that you are, so if I say no, you'll think I'm lying to you, and I sure as hell ain't gonna say..."Yes, Melissa, I think you are fat!". So what I'm gonna do is moonwalk out the door I just came in and go around to another entrance. We all laughed, I left, and it is a memory from the past. Soon, I'll forget the names, places, and story, since I'm advancing in years. Loren..... NP....nothing but the sound of the water cooler and ringing phones behind me. >>> 09/14/99 12:36am >>> In a message dated 9/13/1999 2:30:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Mary_Jo_Bergbauer@RohmHaas.Com writes: << The five questions most feared by men are: 1. What are you thinking about? 2. Do you love me? 3. Do I look fat? 4. Do you think she is prettier than me? 5. What would you do if I died? What makes these questions so difficult is that every one is guaranteed to explode into a major argument if the man answers incorrectly (i.e., tells the truth). Therefore, as a public service, each question is analyzed below, along with possible responses. Question # 1: What are you thinking about? The proper answer to this, of course, is: "I'm sorry if I've been pensive, dear. I was just reflecting on what a warm, wonderful, thoughtful, caring, intelligent woman you are, and how lucky I am to have met you." This response obviously bears no resemblance to the true answer, which most likely is one of the following: a. Baseball. b. Football. c. How fat you are. d. How much prettier she is than you. e. How I would spend the insurance money if you died. Perhaps the best response to this question was offered by Al Bundy, who once told Peg, "If I wanted you to know what I was thinking, I would be talking to you!" Question # 2: Do you love me? The proper response is: "YES!" or, if you feel a more detailed answer is in order, "Yes, dear." Inappropriate responses include: a. Oh Yeah, shit-loads. b. Would it make you feel better if I said yes? c. That depends on what you mean by love. d. Does it matter? e. Who, me? Question # 3: Do I look fat? The correct answer is an emphatic: "Of course not!" Among the incorrect answers are: a. Compared to what? b. I wouldn't call you fat, but you're not exactly thin. c. A little extra weight looks good on you. d. I've seen fatter. e. Could you repeat the question? I was just thinking about how I would spend the insurance money if you died. Question # 4: Do you think she's prettier than me? Once again, the proper response is an emphatic: "Of course not!" Incorrect responses include: a. Yes, but you have a better personality b. Not prettier, but definitely thinner c. Not as pretty as you when you were her age d. Define pretty e. Could you repeat the question? I was just thinking about how I would spend the insurance money if you died. Question # 5: What would you do if I died? A definite no-win question.(The real answer, of course, is "Buy a Lexus and a Yacht"). No matter how you answer this, be prepared for at least an hour of follow-up questions, usually along the these lines: WOMAN: Would you get married again? MAN: Definitely not! WOMAN: Why not, don't you like being married? MAN: Of course I do. WOMAN: Then why wouldn't you remarry? MAN: Okay, I'd get married again. WOMAN: You would? (with a hurtful look on her face) MAN: ( makes audible groan ) WOMAN: Would you sleep with her in our bed? MAN: Where else would we sleep? WOMAN: Would you put away my pictures, and replace them with pictures of her? MAN: That would seem like the proper thing to do. WOMAN: And would you let her use my golf clubs? MAN: She can't use them; she's left-handed. WOMAN: - - - silence - - - MAN: Shit. >> ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #406 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! 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