From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #348 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Wednesday, August 11 1999 Volume 04 : Number 348 The Laborday JoniFest is happening this fall! For information: send a message to Join the mailing list at: ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Resist The Eclipse Hype! (NJC) [=?iso-8859-1?Q?Winfried_H=FChn?= ] Who knows.../ (NJC) ["Catherine McKay" ] Larry the Riveter (some JC) ["Catherine McKay" ] The Art of Joni Mitchell ["Catherine McKay" ] Re: Larry the Riveter (some JC) [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) [WirlyPearl@aol.com] Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) [Jerry Notaro ] Urge For Going by Tony Rice? [Steve Dulson ] Al Kooper on Joni ["Chuck EIsenhardt" ] Re: Al Kooper on Joni [Don Rowe ] Joni's lines and images ["Brett Code" ] Re: One-liners [Heather Galli ] Re: One-liners ["Reuben Bell3" ] Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) [CaTGirl627@aol.com] Re: Al Kooper on Joni [CaTGirl627@aol.com] Re: Sandy Denny's death (NJC) [Brian Gross ] Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) [WirlyPearl@aol.com] Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II [Randy Remote ] Joni in print..... [CaTGirl627@aol.com] Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II [Scott and Jody ] VG-8 link on the Guitar Page [Susan McNamara ] Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) ["Lisa Peakes" ] For JMDL guitarists [Marian Russell ] RE: Larry the Riveter ["Brett Code" ] RE: Cactus Trees and Galleries... [Scott Price ] NJCRe: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II [catman ] Re: Larry the Riveter (some JC) [Brian Gross ] Re: One-liners ["Mark or Travis" ] RE: Cactus Trees and Galleries... ["P. Henry" ] NJC Life assurance question [catman ] Photo Auction [Leslie Mixon ] Re: One-liners ["Mark Domyancich" ] Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II [MDESTE1@aol.com] Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Enough with the Basher Bashing! (NJC) [luvart@snet.net] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:52:51 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Winfried_H=FChn?= Subject: Resist The Eclipse Hype! (NJC) Folks, I've always suspected it, but now I know for sure -- I live in a country full of pagans and benighted fools! "Benighted" is to be taken literally, as this current outbreak of mass stupidity has been triggered by the solar eclipse which will occur today over large parts of Germany. Here in Goettingen, we're about 200 miles away from the totality zone, but there are no "eclipse sunglasses" (made in China -- guaranteed to protect, hehehe!) available in all of Goettingen county. In Ludwigshafen, Southern Germany, an angry mob of 400 people demolished an optician store after learning that sunglasses were sold out, like everywhere in the country. I wanted to schedule a couple of urgent seminar preparation meetings today, but nobody is here! Everybody seems to have traveled into the totality zone in Southern Germany. Not to mention several dozens of other embarassing phenomena. The sky is completely overcast so nobody will see anything except for a few minutes of dimmed daylight, but never mind. In Ambrose Bierce's "Devils Dictionary" it says under "Comet" -- "An excuse for staying out late at night and going home drunk in the morning" Too bad he didn't witness an eclipse. And now, my friends, will you please excuse me, I have to go to my basement in order to look for a pair of dark sunglasses.... Winfried, angry and alone in Goettingen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:43:15 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Winfried_H=FChn?= Subject: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II Folks, you don't believe the words from my previous post? Well, here are all the ads from today's newspaper's main section: Page 5 The Sun Is Coming Out again! "12.37 -- 13.15 -- 14.00 -- it's convertible time! BMW Munich Page 6 (half page) The Sun is disappearing for a few minutes today -- Your money often disappears for years in unfair savings plans! AWD Financial Services (very curious -- AWD has been subject to many consumer lawsuits and some of its employees are jailed due to fraud...) Page 7 (full page) "This incredibly realistic solar eclipse was printed with Hewlett Packards revolutionary PhotoREt Precision Technology." Page 9 (Corona-Style picture of Volvo "Coffin" Station Wagon) "This won't happen again for a very long time -- Volvo Black Edition" Page 13 (full page picture of eclipse) "Sun, Moon & Yello Electricity. Yellow. Good. Cheap." Oh well...it'll soon be over! Winfried ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:05:20 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: NJC Re: Joni's one (or two or three) -liners Helen humbly harkens about "Helplessly Hoping": <> How about the Monkees' "Peter Percival's Pet Pig Porky"? Not much of a song, really, but great alliteration! Bob NP: Elvin Bishop, "Once In A Lifetime" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:18:55 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: One-liners Sue said: <> Sue, this may the best way of putting it...so succinct, and SO true! When we met and talked to Joni in Atlanta, Marsha asked her to sign her copy of Hejira. Joni just kind of held it for a minute, looking at it. Seeing her looking at it and holding it is a vision I will always retain - you could tell that project holds a very special place in her heart...and as I looked at her I thought "here is the person who conceived and created this masterpiece" and I was filled with awe. Okay, it sounds silly but I hope you guys understand...there's certainly no one else I could tell that could appreciate it! What if the "powers that be" at Asylum had decided the record wasn't "commercial" enough and refused to release it! It gives me shudders to even think such stuff... Bob NP: The Monkees, "She" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:30:34 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Enough with the Basher Bashing! (NJC) Azeem halts the Aaron-bashing: << Aaron Neville may have made a few bad choices of song and producer, but the man has the voice of an angel, and not just when he's doing that fluttery falsetto>> I can take that falsetto for about 2 minutes; I much prefer his voice mixed in with the rest of the Neville's. "Live on Planet Earth" is one of my favorite live albums ever! << And let's not forget that Aaron is built like a brick shithouse and looks as if he could have Mike Tyson in a fist fight!!>> True, but he would never fight Tyson because he'd be too afraid that Iron Mike would try and bite that birthmark-thingy off of his head! :~D Bob NP: The Monkees, "I'm Not Your Stepping Stone" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 05:59:42 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: RE: Cactus Trees and Galleries... (my apologies for the delay in posting on this) Seth Garrison wrote: to which WallyK responded: I posted on this back in february at which time there were other, apparently more vital issues being discussed and it did not seem to foster much interest at that time... but now that the subject has come up, since I have some personal experiential knowledge of events which may have at least partially inspired the writing of this song... I re-submit: (in response to a question regarding my relationship with Joni, '66-'68 as well as a question on who 'Cactus Tree" might have been referring to) "ummmm... how do I say this... well, I certainly would have *liked* to have had 'more than a friendship' with her... (me and a thousand other guys!) but when I first met her she was still married and it never really crossed my mind... (ok, so maybe it crossed my mind a few times, but I always stifled myself! LoL!!!) also, there was the difference in our ages... she, about 21/22 and myself a mere 17... I think, had I been her age, I would have actually tried to get next to her after she split with Chuck... she gave one the feeling that a little romance would be ok with her... (the words "...try to keep myself open up to you" come to mind...) but me? I was a virgin... (in fact I lost my virginity during that time I knew her to a sweet young farm girl with a lot of the same qualities I saw in Joni and lived with her for the next two years...) Joni had such an intense effect on me! and I mean more than my teenage crush on her... we were friends and we spent many hours just hanging together. I've written before trying to describe this and it's not all that easy... Joni was very... well, open... even flirty. although she gets along with other women just fine, she is one of those kind of women who is very comfortable hanging out with guys... when she talked to you she talked about you... not herself, unless you asked... and she was a joker and knew how to make a guy smile and feel like a million and very much at ease... she didn't play games but looked you right in the eye when she was with you and I never heard her put anyone down... (well, at least not to boost herself up) and she was extremely honest... even blunt... and, as far as I know, still is. as to the 'cactus tree'... you ask "Did/Do you know who she's singing about?" well, I wrote on that before also... this is how it was... there were men... *lots* of men... men who, for example, caught her performance in philly, perhaps got a chance to speak with her for a minute or two, and then took off from work or school, jumped on a plane or a bus and *followed* her to her next gig... and her next... and her next... etc. the reason I am so acutely aware of this is because it was usually I who was the go-between if someone wanted to talk to the performer for some reason and these guys were obsessed! ...persistent and obsessed... and they tried everything, even to the point that sometimes we had to threaten to ask them to leave, which, btw, would always calm them right down. sometimes Joni would say yes and talk with one of them for a few minutes out of interest or sympathy, but mostly she would refuse because she knew where it would go... (and didn't want to encourage them) so, when you ask me if I know who... that's who I think about on the cactus tree... guys like that... and guys like me. *G* I probably didn't, at 17, have the wherewithal to understand it= then, but, in hindsight, I think Joni was a very sensual and romantic young lady... and not all that hindered by convention... she'd met Chuck at the riverboat coffeehouse in toronto (where they had two clubs, one upstairs and one down, one for american performers and one for canadian... I can only remember that one was called the riverboat... can't recall the name of the other or which was which... used to know, damn it) and married him, as we all know, for practical purposes mostly... a far cry from what seems to be the carefree art school romance that produced Kilauren, and, to be honest, that's just the way it seemed between them... practical... I think that, by the time I met them in '66, the adoption had already taken place and they seemed to be more a singing duet than husband and wife... I mean, social... nice... but with little interaction between them. (Joni didn't talk about it much but she did relate to me that Chuck took it hard when she became more in demand than he and bookers didn't want the two of them but only her, forcing Chuck to book himself individually too... I think this was when they started to talk about divorce...) at any rate, after they were split I think Joni had had it up to here with being 'practical' and was very very hungry for love and passion as a woman and as an artist. it doesn't surprise me at all that she went on from there to search out rewarding relationships in these areas... and, in some cases, to find them..." well, all that kind of rambles but it's all true and somehow relevant... the only think I can add is: could David Crosby have been the one out sailing... sure! in fact, if it is him, since he appears at the top of the list it seems likely to me that, in fact, he may have served as the catalyst to her finally expressing something that had been on her mind for years... how virtually every guy that met her fell in love with her instantly! pat NP: Cactus Tree (what else?) http://members.wbs.net/homepages/b/a/d/badwolff.html Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:18:50 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Who knows.../ (NJC) Wasn't "Who knows where the time goes?" written by Sandy Dennie? Can anyone tell me how Sandy died? cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:31:52 GMT From: "Catherine McKay" Subject: Larry the Riveter (some JC) Bob you do have a way with words. Your Larry thing was brilliant. >Kakki, who brings out the Joni in everybody, surprises even herself: <> Or as Joni would sing... Subject: The Art of Joni Mitchell I think I've deleted the post, but a few days ago someone mentioned the art (the paintings, in this case) of Joni Mitchell. I'm sure I read somewhere about her possibly having a showing of her paintings, perhaps a tour of some kind. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find the reference anywhere. Can anyone help me out with this? cateri@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:01:40 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Larry the Riveter (some JC) Catherine asks: <> "The guy at the gaspumps" (Barangrill) Bob NP: Song for Sharon from 06/14/83 show ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:21:10 EDT From: WirlyPearl@aol.com Subject: Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) In a message dated 8/11/99 9:20:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, cateri@hotmail.com writes: > Wasn't "Who knows where the time goes?" written by Sandy Dennie? Can > anyone > tell me how Sandy died? Yes, Sandy Denny did write "Who Knows Where The Time Goes" and sings it beautifully, as does Judy Collins. It's just a beautiful song. Tragically, she died in a fall down the stairs. I think she was in her early 30's. Pearl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:30:11 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) This was the most requested song when I was singing at a lot of weddings. And around many campfires. Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:37:51 -0400 From: Anne Rickaby Subject: RE: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) The 'fall' was somewhat mysterious. Rumor had it at one point that she might have been pushed, if I recall correctly. Anne in Cambridge ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 08:25:13 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Urge For Going by Tony Rice? A bluegrass DJ on the FOLKDJ list played: 5 Urge For Going (5:48) by Tony Rice Tony Rice Native American Rounder- 0248 Is this a version of our Joni's song? ############################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" *NEW* website at: http://www.tinkersown.com "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ "The Living Tradition Concert Series" (Website soon!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:38:30 -0400 From: "Chuck EIsenhardt" Subject: Al Kooper on Joni Howdy y'all, I've been in deep lurk but keeping an eye on you guys. Gearing up for Asharastock. Hello to new and old friends here. I've been meaning to post this excerpt from Al Kooper's book 'Backstage Passes and Backstabbing Bastards' and now more than ever since it sheds some light on the Joni-Judy Collins relationship. In Al's words: 'One night I was sitting in my favorite bar in the Village, the Dugout. It was the best place to kill a summer's night, and I always ran into a few friends I would miss while I was on the road. I was living platonically at folk-singer Judy Collins' apartment on the Upper West Side in between my own apartments. Judy, the number two female folk singer behind Joan Baez, was a wonderful, generous woman. Her apartment was the folk-music salon of the mid-sixties. People like Dylan, Leonard Cohen, Phil Ochs, and others would make the pilgrimage to her digs and enjoy her hospitality and earth mothering. This particular night in the Village I was sitting with a new girl in town. She had a crush on Roy Blumenfeld, the drummer from the Blues Project [note: Al's Band] Unfortunately for her, Roy had a girlfriend who was on to her, and extremely jealous. So this gal is crying in my beer for about three hours, and I don't mind 'cause she's kinda easy on the eyes and nothing else is going on anyway. So they're closing the bar and throwing us out and I offer to walk her home. It was about a fifteen minute stroll, and it was a beautiful summer's night Since I was covered in the ashes of my failed marriage, this was a pleasant diversion. When we got to her door, she invited me in to hear some of her new songs. She was a folk singer. Canadian. Half of a duet with her recently divorced husband, they had achieved a mild popularity and a cult following in various American border cities. She, being real pretty, had me bounding up the stairs like a hound dog, figuring if the songs were lousy, maybe I could salvage the evening some other way. In a few minutes that became the furthest thing from my mind. Her songs were incredible and totally original, which was a surprise in those days, but quite refreshing. She would finish one, and I would say more, more. And she had enough to keep going for hours, most of them brilliant. One song especially killed me, and I thought it would be great for July Collins- that a nice way to pay her for her hospitality would be to turn her on to it. Being impulsive, I asked my host if I could use her phone, and I called Judy up. It was 5:30 a.m. by now and Judy was pretty pissed off. "I have to get up soon and drive all the way to the Newport Folk Festival, and I wanted to get some sleep for a change. I can hear this song when I get back from the festival. Al," she said diplomatically. Bang! A great idea hits me. "Judy, why don't you, room permitting, take this girl with you to the festival? She could play the song and others for you on the way up and make your trip that much more pleasant. Then, being that you're on the Board of Directors, you could see if maybe they could fit her in the schedule somewhere to play, huh?" Silence at the other end. "Judy?" "Kooper, you bastard. Yeah, I'll do it. Gimme her number. Bye." Just to make sure, I gave the woman Judy's number and told her to call Collins in a couple of hours. I split immediately 'cause I was exhausted and never made it to Judy's place, preferring to crash on a bench in Washington Square Park in the steamy, summer morning rather than get hell for waking her at 5:30 a.m. Well, as the saying goes, the rest is history. The girl (Joni Mitchell, of course) played the 1967 Festival, thanks to last-minute urgings of Judy Collins, and stole the whole show. Judy eventually recorded 'Michael from Mountains' ad also had a huge hit with 'Both Sides Now', another of Joni's songs. Joni never thanked me, but when I heard the album Ladies of the Canyon that was thanks enough. Maybe I should thank *her." So that's Kooper's story. I can *pretty much believe it all, as Al was a veritable musical Forrest Gump and seemed to be in on most every seminal moment of the era. The particular scenario with the drummer from Blue Project suggests to me that it may have even provided context for her tune 'Conversation'? The dates are about right... I enjoyed Kooper's book a great deal, (currently teaching at Berklee!) and would recommend it for a good light summer read. End of book report. See some of you at Ashara's! Chuck E ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 09:01:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Don Rowe Subject: Re: Al Kooper on Joni Hi Chuck, and welcome in from the cold ... > Al Kooper's book sheds some light on > the Joni-Judy Collins relationship. Judy's book "Singing Lessons" tells this same story almost word for word ... which if I remember my Journalism 101 ... equals a "confirmed source." So it must be true ... ;-) Don Rowe _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:10:11 -0600 From: "Brett Code" Subject: Joni's lines and images I've been through the lyrics now - what a thrill it is to read them all. Here's my list of the lines and images that jumped out at me over the last few days and that have been with me for years or decades. I love Joni's music - so amazing. In chronological order: 'Conversation' She removes him, like a ring To wash her hands She only brings him out to show her friends I want to free him 'All I Want' I am on a lonely road and I am travelling looking for the key to set me free Oh the jealousy, the greed is the unraveling It's the unraveling and it undoes all the joy that could be 'My Old Man' The bed's too big The frying pan's too wide 'A Case of You' "Love is touching souls" Well surely you touched mine 'The Last Time I Saw Richard' All good dreamers pass this way some day Hidin' behind bottles in dark cafes 'Lesson in Survival' I will always love you Hands alike Magnet and iron The souls 'Woman of Heart and Mind' After the rush when you come back down You're always disappointed Nothing seems to keep you high Drive your bargains Push your papers Win your medals Fuck your strangers Don't it leave you on the empty side 'Down To You' You go down to the pick up station Craving warmth and beauty You settle for less than fascination A few minutes later you're not so choosy When the closing lights strip off the shadows On this strange new flesh you've found Clutching the night to you like a fig leaf You hurry To the blackness And the blankets To lay down an impression And your loneliness 'The Boho Dance' Like a priest with a pornographic watch Looking and longing on the sly 'Shadows and Light' Critics of all expression Judges in black and white Saying it's wrong Saying it's right 'Amelia' Maybe I've never really loved I guess that is the truth I've spent my whole life in clouds at icy altitudes 'Hejira' In the church they light the candles And the wax rolls down like tears There is the hope and the hoelessness I've witnessed thirty years 'Song For Sharon' A woman just drowned herself The well was deep and muddy She was just shaking off futility Or punishing somebody 'Refuge of the Roads' Oh, radiant happiness It was all so light and easy Till I started analyzing And I brought on my old ways A thunderhead of judgment Was gathering in my gaze 'Talk to Me' Is your silence that golden? Are you comfortable in it? Is it the key to your freedom Or is it the bars on your prison? 'Chinese Cafe - Unchained Melody' And my child's a stranger I bore her But I could not raise her 'The Three Great Stimulants' I saw a little lawyer on the tube He said, "It's so easy now, anyone can sue" "Let me show you how your petty aggravations can profit you!" 'Passion Play' Magdalene is trembling Like a washing on a line Trembling and gleaming Never before was a man so kind Never so redeeming 'Magdalene Laundries One day I'm going to die here too, And they'll plant me in the dirt Like some lame bulb That never blooms come any spring Come any spring No, not any spring . . . 'Happiness is the Best Facelift' This river has run through both our lives ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:24:42 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: One-liners >Sue said: > ><> > Bob wrote: >Sue, this may the best way of putting it...so succinct, and SO true! > >When we met and talked to Joni in Atlanta, Marsha asked her to sign her >copy of Hejira. Joni just kind of held it for a minute, looking at it. >Seeing her looking at it and holding it is a vision I will always retain - >you could tell that project holds a very special place in her heart...and >as I looked at her I thought "here is the person who conceived and created >this masterpiece" and I was filled with awe. Okay, it sounds silly but I >hope you guys understand...there's certainly no one else I could tell that >could appreciate it! > I wish I could have been there to see Joni's expression! Hejira helped me travel through a very uncertain time in my life. Kind of like a security blanket :-) Heather - making name tags for Jonifest ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:51:33 -0400 From: "Reuben Bell3" Subject: Re: One-liners >>> Heather Galli 08/11/99 01:24PM Joni just kind of held it for a minute, looking at it. Seeing her looking at it and holding it is a vision I will always retain>>> That is such a cool story, I would have loved to have been there! >>>...travel through a very uncertain time in my life. Kind of like a security blanket :-)>>> Me, too. Its funny how much that album means to me. I wonder, worldwide (or at least listwide) how many people have this connection to "Hejira". It is perfect when you are lost and lonely, but at the same time isn't "maudlin and full of self pity." It just goes. Reuben ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:35:46 EDT From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) In a message dated 8/11/1999 10:24:28 AM Eastern Daylight Time, WirlyPearl@aol.com writes: << In a message dated 8/11/99 9:20:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time, cateri@hotmail.com writes: > Wasn't "Who knows where the time goes?" written by Sandy Dennie? Can > anyone > tell me how Sandy died? Yes, Sandy Denny did write "Who Knows Where The Time Goes" and sings it beautifully, as does Judy Collins. It's just a beautiful song. Tragically, she died in a fall down the stairs. I think she was in her early 30's. Pearl >> NO she did not die from the fall down the stairs..it took a few months because she never went to the hospital after the fall and she started complaining of headaches. She had swelling on the brain and then died a few months later. She was an extremely talented woman a major loss to the music community. Catgirl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:42:32 EDT From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Re: Al Kooper on Joni In a message dated 8/11/1999 11:43:34 AM Eastern Daylight Time, chucke@tiac.net writes: << I enjoyed Kooper's book a great deal, (currently teaching at Berklee!) and would recommend it for a good light summer read. End of book report. See some of you at Ashara's! Chuck E >> WOW, What an amazing Joni story! What a time to be alive. Mid sixties, talent flying around like a swarm of bees and smack dab in the middle was Joni. Young, beautiful, extremely talented. What man wouldn't fall in love with such a girl? If I was that guy I wouldn't have left her side! Catgirl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:41:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: Sandy Denny's death (NJC) - ---Catherine McKay wrote: > > Wasn't "Who knows where the time goes?" written by Sandy Dennie? Can anyone > tell me how Sandy died? Sandy Denny fell down the steps at her Northamptonshire (Australia) cottage, and some days later, complained of acute headaches. She sought no medical attention until she collapsed into a coma and was rushed into hospital on April 16, 1978. She never regained consciousness and died late on Friday night April 21 in Atkinson Morley Hospital. She was 31. Death is believed to have been caused by a brain haemorrhage. The funeral was at Putney on April 27. She is sorely missed. Brian === "No paper thin walls No folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:51:05 EDT From: WirlyPearl@aol.com Subject: Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) In a message dated 8/11/99 1:35:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time, CaTGirl627 writes: > Tragically, she died in a fall down the stairs. > Pearl > >> > NO she did not die from the fall down the stairs..it took a few months > because she never went to the hospital after the fall and she started > complaining of headaches. She had swelling on the brain and then died a few > months later. CatGirl Thank you for the clarification CatGirl. I asked my husband about it and that's what he told me. I guess the fall caused the swelling on the brain. Pearl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 11:03:29 -0700 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II These were great posts, and gave us a flavor of the eclipse scene as well as reminding those of us on the other side of the sphere about it. If it was in America, a company would have patented the phrases "eclipse", "total eclipse", and all related combinations, and McDonalds would be the official sponsor of the 1999 solar eclipse, etc, etc, etc RR ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:11:00 EDT From: CaTGirl627@aol.com Subject: Joni in print..... Hello friends, My husband was readi9ng a book and Joni was mentioned several times so I figure I would share with all of you.. The book is called The Mansion on the Hill....Dylan, Young, Geffen, Springsteen, and the head-on collision of Rock and Commerce By Fred Goodman Here is one menioning says... ...Although Wickhan kept an office in Burbank, he was paid $200.00 a week, and given his own secretary, his real work was to be a part of the Laurel Canyon cognoscenti, keeping one hand on the pulse of the underground and pointing potential signings towards the label with the other. Among those Wickham had a role bringing to Warner/Reprise were Eric Anderson, Jethro Tull, and Van Morrison. During the first week at the company, Wikham urged Ostin to sign Joni Mitchell. Just twenty-three, the Canadian folk singer had come to Wickham's attention when Tom Rush and the duo Ian and Sylvia recorded her song "The Circle Game." After hearing a tape of a club performance and being told Mitchell looked like a blond Joan Beaz, Ostin quicky gave his approval. excerpt one...more to follow or just get the book..it is very interesting reports Eric. Catgirl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 14:01:15 -0500 From: Scott and Jody Subject: Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II Thanks for the posts Winfried! Next year this will be happening in South Africa, so unless you're planning to move there you'll be ok. Did you ever find your sunglasses in the basement? WAIT! You won't need them as the Perseus Showers are happening Tonight! Please keep us updated on that phenomenon :~) you wrote: > In Ambrose Bierce's "Devils Dictionary" it says under "Comet" -- "An excuse > for staying out late at night and going home drunk in the morning" Too bad > he didn't witness an eclipse. > Oh, on second thought I guess Perseus Showers aren't as eventful. We would go to a forest preserve where there was also a field, and lie down and just watch them fall from the sky. It was quite stunning actually! jody ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:03:19 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Larry the Riveter (some JC) <> Besides the aforementioned Barangrill reference, this was all I could find: Shadows & Light: "Pale miners in their lantern rays" Dry Cleaner from Des Moines: "I talked to a cat from DesMoines, he said he ran a cleaning plant" Joni certainly doesn't talk as much about blue-collar work as she uses the word "blue" in her work...now if you want to talk about Springsteen's references to blue-collar work, you could talk all day! Bob NP: The Eagles, "Hollywood Waltz" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:32:56 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Larry the Riveter Catherine wrote: > <> "Marcie's faucet needs a plumber" "Hula girls and Caterpillar tractors in the sand" "The janitors of Shadowland flick their brooms at me" Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 16:27:56 -0400 From: Susan McNamara Subject: VG-8 link on the Guitar Page Attention all VG-8 owners: I recently received an email from Esau Simmons who alerted me to the fact that he has a page at www.vg-8.com where people can download Joni Mitchell tuning patches!! He was very appreciative to Jim Leahy, and our compatriats at the JMDL Guitar Page (me, Marian, Howard and Mark) for giving him the info on the tunings. Alas, I don't own a VG-8 but I am willing (after I cleared it with Les, of course!) to set up a link to Esau's page so JMDL VG-8ites can download these said patches. I thought it would also be a good idea to link any other interesting VG-8 info for our collective enjoyment. If you are a VG-8 owner and have any ideas about what a VG-8 page should include, please contact me and I'll start setting it up as a part of the JMDL guitar site. For previews of Esau's patch page go to the VG-8 site: http://www.vg-8.com (Esau explained to me that this page is not affiliated with the Roland company) For all those newcomers who don't know what the hey I'm talking about: The VG-8 is a machine that hooks up to an electric guitar (in Joni's case a mahogany Parker Fly) and automatically sets the strings digitally to any tuning you program. This invention virtually saved our Hero's career and made something amazingly surprising like Harlem in Havana possible. Talk to me, Vg-8ites ... Sue NP: my favorite live album this week: David Live (I'm a dude, yeah!) ____________________ /____________________\ ||-------------------|| || Sue McNamara || || sem8@cornell.edu || ||___________________|| || O etch-a-sketch O || \___________________/ "It's all a dream she has awake" - Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:12:57 -0400 From: "Lisa Peakes" Subject: Re: Who knows.../ Sandy Denny(NJC) > The 'fall' was somewhat mysterious. Rumor had it at one point that she might > have been pushed, if I recall correctly. I heard another rumor that she was pregnant at the time. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:18:07 +0200 From: Marian Russell Subject: For JMDL guitarists Just a note to let you all know I've updated the list of tuning patterns at: http://www.jmdl.com/guitar/marian/jm_tunings.htm with a new tuning for Ladies' Man and Man To Man, so you might want to print out the new list. I've been worrying over the right tuning for those songs for some time now and I think I finally got it. Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:18:17 -0600 From: "Brett Code" Subject: RE: Larry the Riveter I'm not sure I know what blue collar means in this post-modern world. I guess from my point of view, namely, that of a "little lawyer", it has acquired a broad meaning in these times of "service" industry "jobs". 1) Nathan La Freneer - coach driver 2) Without meter maids and peace parades - 'Nathan L F' 3) There's a jouster and a jester and a man who owns a store ( a stretch, I know)- Cactus Tree 4) The merchants roll their awnings down/The milk truck make their morning rounds - Morning Morgantown 5)The station master's shuffling cards - Just Like This Train 6) Egles the Tailor . . . Pawn shops glitter - Furry Sings the Blues 7) The Dry Cleaner from Des Moines 8) Who're you gonna get to do the dirty work/When all the slaves are free? - Passion Play 9)We're trying to get things white as snow . . . Prostitutes and destitutes/And temptresses like me/Fallen women -/Sentenced into dreamless drudgery - The Magdalene Laundries 10) But now the janitors of Shadowland flick their brooms at me - The Sire of Sorrow 11) I see the diggers waiting, they're leaning on their spades - Sire of Sorrow Brett > <> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 15:41:15 -0700 From: Scott Price Subject: RE: Cactus Trees and Galleries... At 05:59 AM 8/11/99, P. Henry wrote: >virtually every guy that met her fell in love with her instantly! Intelligent, creative, beautiful, graceful...what's not to like? :-) She has been described as "instantly intimate." And by all accounts of JMDLers who have met her, she is indeed warm, genuine, kind, gracious. Some people have a certain magnetism which draws others toward them. Surely Joni is aware of this special quality that she has...the way she affects those around her...the way they respond to her. Some feel or even see a strong aura when in Joni's presence. Some are nearly speechless and gape in stunned silence when she passes. I find myself shaking my head in utter amazement sometimes when listening to her albums, even after all these years--such is my admiration for her genius. I can only imagine how it must have been in the early stages of her career, live and in person. Thanks Pat for your vivid recollections of those times. Yep, many of us have "fallen in love" with her in one way or another. She can cast a spell with a simple strum of her guitar or a softly-sung lyric. It's this emotional *power* that makes her so very special. "Cactus Tree" has always been one of my many favorites. Difficult as it is to only pick out a few "one-liners," here goes.... "He has kissed her with his freedom..." "He hopes her heart can hear three thousand miles..." "He can think her there beside him..." "He writes 'wish you were beside me'..." "And her heart is full and hollow..." "And you know there may be more..." This is one Joni song that men in particular can really identify with, IMO. It's not about "mama's nylons" or "kick pleat skirts." The actions she describes for this guy are believable and poignant. Even as early as STAS, Joni was examining themes of duality with a heart which at the same time is "full and hollow." But the overwhelming message, again IMO, is that she was looking back at the men in her life while struggling with the idea of "settling down" as opposed to retaining her freedom...a dilemma often faced by both men and women...which only shows that much of her work is truly androgynous. Scott ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:59:36 +0100 From: catman Subject: NJCRe: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II Well todays eclipse was a flop. i din't notice a thing. I have sen two before tho. one is Australia and I think the first i saw was in Singapore but can't remember. I don't really what the big deal is. they happen regulalry in different parts of the world. it is supposed to happen here again 2090. I think I'll probably be too busy answering email thru a medium by then. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 16:06:47 PDT From: "John Low" Subject: Tiny Tim (NJC) Late as usual reading my digests, but boy I've enjoyed the thread on Joni one-liners. This has been a perfect way of demonstrating her abilities as a poet/musician. However, that thread is not the subject of my present post. I felt I really must take issue with Don Rowe when I saw his list of "please feel free to bash-at-will" (Digest 345) and noticed the name of Tiny Tim thereon. How could you Don? Tiny Tim (now sadly deceased) was a 'living work of art'! How could anyone forget his 'Tulips' or his marriage to Miss Vicki - both artistic tour de forces! The fine Australian artist Martin Sharp (co-writer with Eric Clapton of 'Tales of Brave Ulysses' and designer of Cream's 'Disraeli Gears album cover) considered Tiny Tim a master of popular song and was a devoted fan and tireless promoter of Tiny, even featuring him as a subject for his own art. Richard Neville, in his memoir of the sixties 'Hippie Hippie Shake', tells the story of how Martin Sharp once presented the "astonished warbler" with a very large painting after a concert. There was, said Neville, "a long silence. Tiny shook his head. 'Oh, what a shame, Mr. Sharp, it doesn't fit into my shopping bag.'" I only saw Tiny Tim 'in the flesh' once, a couple of years before his death. He was in Australia and they wheeled him out on the back of a flat top truck at half-time during a rugby league match at North Sydney. How sad to see his artistic career come to this! Shame on you Don!! Long live Tiny Tim, a unique presence in the often bombastic world of rock 'n roll. John. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:41:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re: Larry the Riveter (some JC) > <> What about Nathan LaFraneer, our favorite taxi driver? Brian np: NPR, The World === "No paper thin walls No folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" yeah, right _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:46:39 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: One-liners > Me, too. Its funny how much that album means to me. I wonder, worldwide (or at least listwide) how many people have this connection to "Hejira". It is perfect when you are lost and lonely, but at the same time isn't "maudlin and full of self pity." It is "magnificent" though. Mark in Seattle who loves 'All About Eve' ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 17:57:04 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: RE: Cactus Trees and Galleries... Scott Price wrote: <...the overwhelming message, again IMO, is that she was looking back at the men in her life while struggling with the idea of "settling down" as opposed to retaining her freedom..> scott, that was beautiful! having seen the phenomena of Joni's 'groupies' with their insistance and that glazed over look in their eyes first hand and having to personally 'fend them off', so to speak, I am more inclined to view these lyrics as a very sensitive and empathetic describing of what had been going on... but perhaps you are right. witness the words of another song: "...there are no strings to hold him I guess you could call him so free... yes he's free to be lonely and empty and lost... just like me" pat NP: Helpless - Neil and Joni (from TLW) Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 02:01:00 +0100 From: catman Subject: NJC Life assurance question we have been going about getting life assurance for john to protect me if he dies. It is also for critical illness in that if he has a heart attack or stroke or other things but doesn't die, the mortgage still gets paid off.(it stands at $60000 decreasing yearly of course) we were quoted $150 per motnh for this that is until they saw he was single and 52. So they asked if was gay and then said he had to have an hiv test. He has gone for that. Now we find out that regarless of the result the cost will be $200 per month just cos he is gay. And now that he has the test it is on his record and evry other compnay will weight the charge too. So we cannot afford $200 a month, simple. At least not wiothout major adjusments to other things. Plain life assurance which only pays if he dies, is much less. But it is risky. What if he gets sick? There is no way either of us want to end up back in London. of course i could make sure if he gets sick he dies but that wouldn't be very nice. i don't know what to do. Any advice would be welcome. - -- CARLY SIMON DISCUSSION LIST http://www.ethericcats.demon.co.uk/ethericcats/index.html TANTRA’S/ETHERIC PERSIANS AND HIMALAYANS http://www.ethericcats.demon.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 19:47:35 -0700 From: Leslie Mixon Subject: Photo Auction Hello: Ashara has done a great job of fundraising to help cover the costs of running JoniMitchell.com. and inspired me to follow her example. I recently met a woman who is not only a disc jockey, but also a professional photographer and darkroom technician (as well as a Joni fan). Clytia Fuller offered to print 9 poster-sized prints (3 each of 3 images) of my Joni photos (real good) for free. There are still two copies of the #3 photo left, which happens to be the print that Wally has requested to grace the wall of his living room. Wally and I visited this past weekend and we talked about different methods of framing this particular image of Joni. The auction ends on Friday (13th) at 8PM PST. You can read about it at: http://www.jonimitchell.com/MixonAuction799.html Thank you for your support! Leslie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 20:12:17 -0500 From: "Mark Domyancich" Subject: Re: One-liners There is no comparison! ___________________________________ | Mark Domyancich | | Harpua@revealed.net | | http://home.revealed.net/Harpua | |_________________________________| >> Me, too. Its funny how much that album means to me. I wonder, > worldwide (or at least listwide) how many people have this connection > to "Hejira". It is perfect when you are lost and lonely, but at the > same time isn't "maudlin and full of self pity." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:19:09 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II In a message dated 99-08-11 14:11:35 EDT, guitarzan@saber.net writes: I love this ... <<< and McDonalds would be the official sponsor of the 1999 solar eclipse, etc, etc, etc RR "Lawyers and Loan Sharks are made in America" Marcel Deste ----------------------- Headers -------------------------------- Return-Path: Received: from >> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:28:41 EDT From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Resist the Eclipse Hype Part II In a message dated 8/11/99 3:07:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time, johnsonjs@earthlink.net writes: << Oh, on second thought I guess Perseus Showers aren't as eventful. We would go to a forest preserve where there was also a field, and lie down and just watch them fall from the sky. It was quite stunning actually! jody >> You should try watching them from a mountaintop, as I did in the Colorado Rockies 25 years ago on the night Nixon resigned. It was as if the heavens were celebrating! From above the clouds at such icy altitudes (it's midsummer, so it wasn't so cold), you can see the thousands of different angles at which meteors hit the Earth's atmosphere -- from those that barely skim the highest layers and seem to bounce off to the ones that look like they are bearing right down on you before (hopefully!) flaming out. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 23:31:58 -0400 From: luvart@snet.net Subject: Re: Enough with the Basher Bashing! (NJC) At 08:30 AM 8/11/99 -0400, you wrote: ><< And let's not forget that Aaron is built like a brick shithouse and >looks as if he could have Mike Tyson in a fist fight!!>> > >True, but he would never fight Tyson because he'd be too afraid that Iron >Mike would try and bite that birthmark-thingy off of his head! :~D > It would be cheaper than surgery ;-) Heather ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #348 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. 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