From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #296 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Wednesday, July 7 1999 Volume 04 : Number 296 The Laborday JoniFest is happening this fall! For information: send a message to Join the mailing list at: ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- RE: jonifest 2000? njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: Song to a Seagull ["Wally Kairuz" ] RE: NJC:PHEW!!! ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: (NJC)Canadian Jonifest 2000? [Heather Galli ] vh1 Vote [Johnwe2@aol.com] Re: NJC:PHEW!!! [MDESTE1@aol.com] Re: NJC:PHEW!!! [catman ] baked big apple njc ["Wally Kairuz" ] setlists ["Jean-Pierre Pellerin" ] NJC Passion [evian ] RE: NJC:PHEW!!! ["Wally Kairuz" ] armageddon: this just in NJC ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Tim Curry & "Cold Blue Steel and Sweet Fire" [FMYFL@aol.com] re: STAS ["Takats, Angela" ] Re: Song to a Seagull ["Kakki" ] Re: Song to a Seagull ["Mark or Travis" ] Re: Joni Songbooks ["Kakki" ] Re: baked big apple njc [Dflahm@aol.com] STAS - vinyl variations [MP123A321@aol.com] Re: JMDL's shared joy NJC [luvart@snet.net] Re: setlists [RMuRocks@aol.com] Smoe news [Les Irvin ] Furry Sings the Blues (long) [Bolvangar@aol.com] Re: STAS - vinyl variations ["Kakki" ] NJC What is SMOE ? ["Gene Mock" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:18:47 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: jonifest 2000? njc all right but only if i get to play mother abbess. i can picture myself standing by the window, in the twilight, singing climb ev'ry mountain while susan la, ready to take her vows, looks on in awe. wallyk evian suggested >Well, lets all go to the Mendel in Saskatoon, then trek on down to >Calgary and go singing Joni tunes through the Rockies like the Von >Trappe family, ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:27:09 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: Song to a Seagull how "spanish" joni was on stas. many of the melodies sound so castillian! wallyK ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:25:53 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: NJC:PHEW!!! oh but didn't you read paco rabanne's [sp?] predictions? according to his interpretations of nostradamus the mir station will precipitate to earth and destroy paris on july 17. wallyk - -----Original Message----- De: catman Para: joni@smoe.org Fecha: Martes 6 de Julio de 1999 14:38 Asunto: NJC:PHEW!!! >According to the predictions of Nostrodamus, Amrageddon, the END, should >have taken place the day before yesterday. >Glad to be able to breathe again! > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 17:21:07 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: (NJC)Canadian Jonifest 2000? Madam L.A. writes: >Sounds great to me luv! Those who want to can "...go, go, go..." and >those who want to knit can just "...knit, knit, knit..." as long as we >can keep the go, go, goers out of the knitting rooms ;~D > Depends on what they are knitting ;-) >> Heather ( who's still in granny shock ;-) > >How're your knitting needles holding up? > Knit one .. pearl two .... (oh dear!) Heather NP: The Go Go's - My Lips are Sealed ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 20:52:27 EDT From: Johnwe2@aol.com Subject: vh1 Vote Be sure to vote for JM at VH1.com, 100 greatest women of rock. they also have some info on Joni ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 20:28:46 EDT From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC:PHEW!!! I hope it doesnt hit our hotel. marcel ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1999 00:01:06 +0100 From: catman Subject: Re: NJC:PHEW!!! I though Paco was into aftershave? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 20:14:41 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: baked big apple njc is it true that today's temperature in ny was 110?!?!? wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 19:00:46 -0400 From: "Jean-Pierre Pellerin" Subject: setlists Hi, I'm new to this list and I need help.I have several Joni's shows on tape and I'm looking for the setlists.Where can I find such information. Thanks, Jean-Pierre Pellerin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 16:40:24 -0600 From: evian Subject: NJC Passion Colin wrote: > Anyhow, to get to your point the song was Carly's TOUCHED BY THE SUN. > This song is like a prayer to me and one I identify with. > I just have to add a "me too".... Touched by the Sun is simply one of the best songs ever recorded, and it has almost become a mantra for me. Good choice, Colin! Evian np: Bruce Hornsby -- "Every Little Kiss" (any other Hornsby fans out there???) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 20:15:52 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: NJC:PHEW!!! well, now it seems he's into afterlife wallyk - -----Original Message----- De: catman Para: Wally Kairuz CC: joni@smoe.org Fecha: Martes 6 de Julio de 1999 17:11 Asunto: Re: NJC:PHEW!!! >I though Paco was into aftershave? > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 19:37:02 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: armageddon: this just in NJC actually, on reviewing mr. rabanne's predictions, i've learned that paris will be destroyed on august 11, not july 17 as i wrote before. the latter is the date for the last fashion show rabanne will do before he retires [probably to flee from paris before the city succumbs under the pieces of the mir station]. wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:14:00 EDT From: RMuRocks@aol.com Subject: Re: Song to a Seagull In a message dated 7/6/99 4:39:24 PM Central Daylight Time, kakkib@att.net writes: << so I threw the Clouds CD in my purse at the last minute. We did get to meet her after the show and I was almost embarrassed to present it to her, worried that she'd think I had not evolved too far. She even kind of smirked a little at it. O.K. so it wasn't Hejira ;-) but those early songs are so in my blood, I could not leave them behind if I wanted to. >> I'll bet she's signed her fair share of those first 3 over the years...The next time I meet Joni (wishful thinking here) I'm gonna get her to autograph Mingus for me while telling her how much it's meant to me...she'll probably faint from surprise! :~D Bob, who's actually quite satisfied with his autographed concert ticket stub NP: "Born To Take the Highway" from the Trees ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1999 10:31:29 +1000 From: "Takats, Angela" Subject: re: joni dress-ups Catgirl wrote (about Ange dressing up as joni for a party): <> Thanks Catgirl and others who've responded to my dress-up post! Got the cruddy old nylon string guitar to take....think I can do the clothes thing...as for the hair...mine being long and dark, dark brown...think the wig is a MUST. I was thinking about joni's hair, looking at some pics of her, she never really did the dye thing did she?? she's always been beautifully blonde (moi so jealous ;) Anyway...I'll let you know how I go. Ange Sydney ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 19:40:59 EDT From: FMYFL@aol.com Subject: Re: Tim Curry & "Cold Blue Steel and Sweet Fire" Bob M wrote: After seeing "Rocky Horror Picture Show" for the zillionth time back in college, I had purchased Tim Curry's "Read My Lips", "Fearless", and "Simplicity" albums. At the time I only had Joni's C&S & DJRD LPs. I loved the song "Cold Blue Steel.....", and when I looked closely to the credits and saw it was a Joni song, I had to go buy "FTR". It's so strange when you listen to a song performed by someone and later discover that it was written and originally done by another artist, especially when the artist is someone you love, like Joni. They both sing the song so differently, yet to this day I still associate "Cold Blue Steel...." with Tim Curry. I stupidly got rid of all my LPs, and never could find any Tim Curry on CD until last year at a used CD store I found "The Best of Tim Curry" which to my delight has "Cold Blue Steel...." on it. It's been out of print for a while now, so if you can get your hands on one BUY IT! Jimmy np: Tim Curry "I do the Rock" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1999 10:46:42 +1000 From: "Takats, Angela" Subject: re: STAS Mark wrote: <> Sometimes when I listen to this album after hearing ones like THOSL, SAL, and even CAS....I think it almost sounds empty, rather bare...but that's what makes it so special and "haunting" (as Mark says). It's just so raw...complex in a simple kind of way, if u know what i mean. A few digests back some listers were talking about colour and light within albums...I really see/feel alot of sun and warmth in this album, yet there are moments when the clouds appear and darken things...anyone relate? Marcie is so free and easy and warm....and then you hit the Pirate song and things get dark and sinister. Then STAS, I can see Joni rocking on a boat alone, with the sun passing thru deep masses of grey clouds above. I think my favs on this album would have to be "Nathan..."(moi forgets the spelling to the rest of his name...sowy) and "Cactus Tree".....I agree Mark, this one's a beauty - but aren't they all ;) Ange Sydney ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:25:00 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Song to a Seagull Heather wrote: > >I wonder if she got giddier or something moving to L.A. in the 60s? ;-) > > > You think smokin' a little hooch might make ones voice higher? Naw, maybe Annie's brownies > I love STAS too. Maybe ... just maybe she was targeting the top 40 at that > time with Clouds and LOTC. Then after these albums (and Blue) comes FTR. > A somewhat radical difference, don't you think? Or do you think Blue is a > transitional work? I don't think she was targeting the top 40 because at that time her music did not remotely resemble the typical top 40 fare. Her early work then was considered very unique. She got played on the AM stations in L.A. but mainly because of disc jockeys, B. Mitchell Reed in particular, who'd met her and were championing her, plus it was a totally wide open format back on AM then and FM was just starting to evolve. I think Blue was a departure more in terms of sparseness and being more plaintive and less ornate. Definitely the first of many transistions. > I would have bought the LP, Kakki. And then again, I would have had > trouble choosing between STAS or FTR. After a week with no sleep and armies of JMDL houseguests, the mental acuity was less than sharp ;-) > I'm a little surprised she smirked at it. She clearly did but tried to recover with an indulgent smile and of course I felt like a dork (but a happy dork). Next time I'll plan ahead better ;-D > I remember giving Laura Nyro my "Christmas and the Beads of Sweat" > LP to sign ... she exclaimed "oh my!" I felt a little smallish. You're very fortunate to have met Laura, you lucky! But why would you feel smallish? I thought "Christmas" was considered her "Hejira"? Kakki NP: Heather Nova - Walking Higher ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 18:54:40 -0700 From: "Mark or Travis" Subject: Re: Song to a Seagull Heather casually lets this one drop: I remember giving Laura Nyro my "Christmas and the Beads of Sweat" > LP to sign ... she exclaimed "oh my!" I felt a little smallish. Oh my! Am I ever envious of this! I think "Christmas and the Beads of Sweat" is an incredible record and should be hailed as the true classic it really is. I listened to STAS again on my commute today and was amazed at how Joni can make a guitar sound like a whole group of instruments. The guitar in 'I Had a King' nearly makes me cry it is so achingly beautiful and such a perfect compliment to the words and melody. In recent years I have marveled at her every time she's played 'Just Like This Train'. You can practically hear every instrumental part that was on the Court & Spark studio version coming from just that single guitar. Amazing! I don't think her guitar playing has become simplified or lazy at all. It has evolved into a style that is completely her own. Not being a musician I don't quite know how to describe it but it isn't simple and certainly not lazy, imo. Mark in Seattle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 19:11:16 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Joni Songbooks Catherine wrote: >It may have been called something as highly imaginative as "The Joni Michell > Songbook" (Imagine that!) It had on the front cover the picture from > "Clouds" and inside it had songs and music from both "Clouds" and "Song to a > Seagull" as well as a number of unpublished songs such as "Carnival in > Kenora" and "A melody in your name". It's "The Music of Joni Mitchell" and has been frequently available at a low price on eBay.com lately. I have a well-worn copy that I treasure. > "Can you still remember how it all began > with clipper ships and pink electric trees? > Dawnlight on a rooftop, bridges span, > Streetlight on a [something] melody. > Then it was me, and spring came, > Breathing a song of spring rain. > A melody in your name." This is my very favorite of the unrecorded songs. My dream is to find a recording of it one day. > As usual, this book used the standard guitar tunings, so none of it really > sounded like Joni's version, but it was a good start. It seems to me the > piano arrangements weren't bad. Your memory is perfect - the piano arrangements are very true to the original. > Surely to goodness, there are enough of us out there/out here? who want such > a thing as a REALLY DECENT Joni songbook that has ALL of her stuff in it - > and with proper guitar stuff in it. The ideal book would have both standard > tunings (for those who are confused by the open tunings) and the proper open > tunings (for those of us who love that sound, when we can work ourselves > around to constantly retuning the guitar.) Wouldn't that be something? Do > you suppose there's some publishing company whose back we could get on about > this? That would be a dream to have it all in one songbook. Check out the guitar pages on the JMDL website - Marian, SueMc, Howard, Mark and Jim have all worked on providing the open tunings. Unfortunately, I must stay retro with modified standard tunings since my barr finger met with a gory mishap in my youth ;-( Kakki NP: Heather Nova - Throwing Fire at the Sun ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 22:33:17 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: baked big apple njc I'm sure there were some locations where it was 110 but the official high will surely be reported as more like 102. I must have some reptile genes; I kind of like this weather, 'though I cautiously refrained from my Central Park bike ride. LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 23:42:53 EDT From: MP123A321@aol.com Subject: STAS - vinyl variations I recently missed out on buying a promo white label vinyl copy of Joni's - SongTo A Seagull that the seller states was a mono pressing. Does anyone own (or have seen) a mono version of this LP on the list? Stock (regular release) or Promo? Any other Mono Joni LPs? If so, I need a tape or at least some info, plenty to share in return. a shot in the dark... thanks, Maurice ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 23:47:37 -0400 From: luvart@snet.net Subject: Re: JMDL's shared joy NJC At 12:52 AM 7/4/99 -0400, Jim L'Hommedieu wrote: >The JMDL and JMHP are a community of Joni fans. If you think of JMDL as >an email *community* you'll be on the right track. When I first >attended a JMDL party I felt it to be more of a reunion with those >present than meeting them for the first time. > This is really true! Every time I meet up with JMDLies I feel a bond. It has to be 'cause Joni's music is so special :-) Heather ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1999 00:03:59 EDT From: RMuRocks@aol.com Subject: Re: setlists In a message dated 7/6/99 8:50:20 PM Central Daylight Time, jpelerin@aei.ca writes: << I'm new to this list and I need help.I have several Joni's shows on tape and I'm looking for the setlists.Where can I find such information. >> Hello Jean-Pierre and welcome to the list! If the shows were from Joni's 98 tour you can find the setlists on Wally's site. Otherwise, just listen to the tapes and write down what she's playing...sounds pretty foolproof to me! :~) I'd love to know which ones you have, maybe I've got 'em too and I can send you the setlists... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 1999 22:19:51 -0600 From: Les Irvin Subject: Smoe news Joniphiles - The following note is from Jeff Wasilko, the wonderful guy at Smoe that hosts this list for free. I'm passing it on for all those who might be interested in some of the behind-the-scenes news. Jeff writes: smoe.org's cable modem connection that normally handles the outgoing mail failed earlier today due to a fiber cut near my house. Mail was going out over our other connection (a 56K ISDN line), but it is much slower than the cable modem so mail was being delayed. Later today, an electrical storm disrupted our ISDN line (which handles web traffic and incoming email), but things were back to normal by 9pm tonite... In other news, I'm in the middle of changing jobs, and as part of that I will be relocating to Northern Virginia. As part of that relocation, smoe.org will take up residence in my new employer's data center. This means smoe.org will enjoy a much better network connection. smoe.org's move to Virgina will probably take two days. During that time, I'm planning on provide a 'read-only' copy of all web sites during the move. I'll send out more information when I have it... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1999 01:10:57 EDT From: Bolvangar@aol.com Subject: Furry Sings the Blues (long) Hi all, If I might jump in with an (almost) completely new topic here (though there *were* some posts about this song not long ago): Listening to _Hejira_ on Sunday night while driving down the highway, watching the fireworks in the distance over Denver, I got to pondering why I have never liked "Furry Sings the Blues" as much as the other songs on the album: why it doesn't completely work for me, even though there *is* much to admire in it, as with most Joni songs -- I like the "gold tooth caps" line especially (as others have said), and the harmonica, and Joni's singing, and sometimes I think I briefly understand what she was aiming for overall in this song and then I like it a lot. One reason for its incomplete success I think is that Joni does not entirely locate herself in relation to the song's story and framework. It seems that the descriptions and images are Joni's, but she states them in an oddly abstract third-person way -- not much of the song is in the first person -- there is an issue of "voice" in the song. It's (arguably) not exactly explained what she's doing there, or why she's there, or what her feelings about the destruction of old Beale Street are. I think there's a distance in "Furry" between us, and what she's describing and her feelings about what she's describing -- a distance rooted in Joni's own distance from what she is describing. Her location, her role in the story and in telling the story (two different issues), are (until the last verse) uncertain, maybe to her as well as us: I think the last verse -- the best, in my opinion -- addresses her uncertain relationship to Beale Street. "Why should I expect that old guy to give it to me true?"; "While our limo is shining on his shanty street/old Furry sings the blues..." -- these lines sum up her "outsider" status. On one level the theme of "voice" in telling the story (a theme perhaps reinforced in the song by her vocal imitation of Furry) is fascinating to me, is very successful, and is really honest of Joni. But on another level that distance, despite Joni's awareness of it, creates a really basic problem for the song because it makes her unable to bring old Beale Street completely to life enough for us -- me, anyway -- to understand and share her feelings about it, which is (seemingly?) crucial. In this sense "Furry" may be an ambitious, perceptive study in limitations. I once read a review (I forget where) which said that the line about "history falls/to parking lots and shopping malls" sets up a dichotomy between "history" and "malls" -- that for Joni contemporary shopping malls are not part of "history" and (implicity) are inherently less valid or authentic or less "real" than old Beale Street. That has stuck with me as an interesting observation. Since Joni necessarily writes from a contemporary viewpoint, is this another problem of her location, that she identifies with neither the era she's describing nor the era she's writing in? On another note.....it's been observed that as her lyric-writing style became more conversational (starting around _Blue_), she began cramming more and more syllables into the lines of verse ("I don't want nobody coming over to my table/I got nothing to talk to anybody about" leaps to mind) -- which I think is a Good Thing, or at least something that she can make work brilliantly and with great originality (I love "The Last Time I Saw Richard"). But I think that "Furry" is one of her more extreme, and less successful, examples of this -- as in "Everybody laughs as if it's the old man's standard joke" or "And I'm not familiar with what you play/but I get such strong impressions of your heyday" (though I do love that repeated rhyme) -- it all makes the song very dense, and not in a good way. And I think that there's an odd tension or instability between the music, which is relatively down-tempo and loose and with a slow harmonic rhythm (i.e., less frequent chord changes), and this rapid-fire lyric overload, with its barrage of images, that for me doesn't work; it's like the lyrics and music are pulling in two different directions. I think the music (the chord changes) is dense, too, though in a different way from the lyrics - -- kind of murky. Some of the chord changes in the other songs, by contrast, each sound fresh and clear and give the song direction -- "Coyote," "Black Crow," "Hejira," "Refuge" -- and especially "Amelia," where every chord change has a kind of wonder for me that is just practically luminous. Maybe the other songs on the album show up these relatively minor weaknesses of "Furry" more than it really deserves. Thoughts? - --David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 22:01:47 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: STAS - vinyl variations Maurice wrote: > Does anyone own (or have seen) a mono version of this LP on the list? Stock > (regular release) or Promo? I just checked my two STAS vinyls and they are both stereo. However, long ago I posted about finding a mint condition one in a used record store that sounded incredibly better than usual (and the improvement seems to be attributable to more than it just being a mint copy). I recall the threads and David Crosby's comments about how the original engineer passed away and the master got wrecked and how there is distortion in the album that's not supposed to be there, etc. (I always thought it was supposed to sound that way until I read the story). I am curious if you or anyone else has any obscure information regarding the pressings. The one I originally bought in the 60s has the following exactly engraved in the run-out: (Side One) 30753RS629A - 1H and (Side Two) 30754RS6293B - 1G The mint one that sounds so incredible has the following: (Side One) RS6293 30754-4 and (Side Two) T BS6293(30753)-3 I know this is kind of nerdy but I would really appreciate any more information if anyone knows. Thanks, Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1999 22:20:18 -0700 From: "Gene Mock" Subject: NJC What is SMOE ? This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BEC7FD.BA6224C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FYI http://smoe.org/ - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BEC7FD.BA6224C0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="smoe.org.url" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smoe.org.url" [DEFAULT] BASEURL=http://smoe.org/ [InternetShortcut] URL=http://smoe.org/ Modified=6065463D38C8BE0107 - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BEC7FD.BA6224C0-- ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #296 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: Glossary project: Send a blank message to for all the details. FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? - -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?