From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #256 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Saturday, June 12 1999 Volume 04 : Number 256 The Laborday JoniFest is happening this fall! For information: send a message to Join the mailing list at: ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- more Saskatoon whining [evian ] Re: the siquomb tour [dsk ] Re: more Saskatoon whining & the siquomb tour ["Helen M. Adcock" ] RE: translating names (NJC) ["Wally Kairuz" ] Re: Joni's New Album? ["Juerg Loeffler" ] Re: translating names (NJC) [=?iso-8859-1?Q?Winfried_H=FChn?= ] Re: whats in a name? (NJC) [M.Russell@iaea.org] NJC - don't post much, but... [Robert Holliston ] Re: What does MRI mean? NJC [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: What's in a name? [TheHotelNH@aol.com] Re: NJC: why people don't post [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] Re: What's in a name? [TheHotelNH@aol.com] River ["Ken (Slarty)" ] RE: What's in a name (NJC) [Louis Lynch ] NJC: What's in a name [catman ] RE: re: Art exhibition [Mary Pitassi ] Joni entry in "Folk, The Essential Album Guide" [Ginamu@aol.com] Re: why people don't post [Heather Galli ] Re: Art exhibition [Ginamu@aol.com] Long song titles (NJC) [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: What's in a Name? Take 2NJC [AzeemAK@aol.com] THANKS--Tape Tree #8 [SMEBD@aol.com] Re: Joni's New Album? [Gellerray@aol.com] Motherhood/creative fires (long; tangential JC) [Mary Pitassi ] Re: The Boho Dance [Bob.Muller/GV/FD/FluorCorp@fluordaniel.com] Re: What's in a Doctor's Name (NJC) [jan gyn ] Today in Joni History - June 12 [Today in Joni History ] Spam (njc) [michael paz ] Butch Solutions to Joni [michael paz ] Webcams NJC ["Winfried Hühn" ] Re: Joni Mitchell at 30th Anniversary ADITG? [LRFye@aol.com] Saskatoon [michael paz ] Re: message to joni, larry, or anyone with sway [Dflahm@aol.com] Re:What's in a name? NJC [Brian Gross ] Lyric Game [Michael Paz ] Nice Kitty Kitty (NJC) [Michael Paz ] Joni From Hell [Michael Paz ] Searching for Drummers and other Musician Types! [Michael Paz ] Joni's new project : ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] Re: What's in a name(NJC) ["Jim L'Hommedieu" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 01:19:58 -0600 From: evian Subject: more Saskatoon whining Hi Kids, Well, since I am going to whine until I get someone to come on up for the exhibit, check out www.city.saskatoon.sk.ca/tourism/index/htm for a little guide to S'toon. There is also a link to the mendel on there. > I'd want to see > that view of the river that Joni painted, you know the one... that > painting in TTT of that big expanse of glassy water with Oz in the > distance. > > In that case, rooms at the Delta Bessborough are basically ON the river... and you can see in in the cover of CLOUDS ;), and you will be in walking distance to the Broadway Bridge.... C'mon peoples, I'd sure like so see you sometime..... Evian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:27:44 -0400 From: dsk Subject: Re: the siquomb tour Nicholas Bates wrote: > > The Joni Mitchell World Tour (or at least North America). > > No, no, not a tour byJM but a tour of JM sites of importance (or not such importance) by JM fans. What a wonderful fantasy! And in New York, there's not only the PanAm (now MetLife) building, but also a walk along West 16th Street where she lived for a year and 1/2 long ago (what is the building number? and what is the apartment number? and who lives there now? do you think they KNOW?), and didn't she have a loft in Soho for a while? There's the Regency Hotel where she worked on Mingus (what suite #?). And every time I look at the photos on STAS I wonder where she was; it looks a little beat up for Chelsea. Tribeca maybe? And Nathan La Franeer or his descendants will be easy to find. Then there's night in the city.... > And singing in "our best out of tune" voices all the way. Yes, singing our hearts out 'til we're hoarse! :-) Debra Shea ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 19:51:59 +1200 From: "Helen M. Adcock" Subject: Re: more Saskatoon whining & the siquomb tour OK, I'd like everyone to STOP suggesting all these wonderful tours until I win the lottery, or some long-lost great aunt dies, and leaves me her millions! It's too depressing hearing all these great ideas, knowing I can't be a part of them. In the words of my five-year-old niece (lying face-down on the floor, and beating my arms and legs) - "Waaaaahhhh.........I wanna go too!" But the SIQUOMB tour sounds like a WONDERFUL idea! If only I had the time and money...... Helen - pining away in the Pacific back-waters NP - Jonatha Brooke - 10c Wings ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:59:03 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: What's in a Name? Take 2NJC and how about Mike Unt and Hugh G. Rection. Those two are legend already! - -----Original Message----- De: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Para: catman CC: joni@smoe.org Fecha: Jueves 10 de Junio de 1999 14:55 Asunto: Re: What's in a Name? Take 2NJC > > >In my graduating high school class there was a guy named Rusty Nail & a >girl named Cherry Bush. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 00:58:27 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: more Saskatoon whining > In that case, rooms at the Delta Bessborough are basically ON the > river... and you can see in in the cover of CLOUDS ;), and you will be > in walking distance to the Broadway Bridge.... > C'mon peoples, I'd sure like so see you sometime..... We're there, Evian!!!! This is too fantastic! "On a plane flying off to S'toon From L.A. and the tropic sands Each of us from foreign flags jetting off to the Joni Land They'll be coming from New York City Six feet deep out on Myrtle's lawn As we party on the Brooklyn Bridge With Dreamland coming on Dreamland, dreamland Dreamland, dreamland" Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 05:15:30 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RE: translating names (NJC) this may sound REALLY stupid to you native speakers, but my friends and i have ball translating american names literally into spanish; names such as elizabeth taylor, roger plant, josephine baker, brooke shields, jon vickers [the latter two, phonetically rather than literally] and the funniest one of all: lucille ball. it's one of those things that's funny in some languages and silly in others. i wonder if winfried finds it funny in german. wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 10:33:09 +0200 From: "Juerg Loeffler" Subject: Re: Joni's New Album? Hi Eric, > One song I would highly recommend is Come Rain Or Come Shine. No one > has done justice to this classic since Judy belted it out at Carnegie > Hall in 1961 Have you listened to Frank's recording of it on: "Sinatra & Strings" (1962)? Just marvellous. Speaking of Sinatra.... > right now. I'm just going to come in to the studio and sing the songs > like Frank." I think what Joni meant by this was, for once she can just walk in to the studio, get in front of the mike, sing the tunes once or twice (preferably once) and walk out again. No hassle with song/lyrics-writing, musical arrangings, search for suitable musicians etc. Just doing the singing bit, the rest is done by others. Juerg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:08:47 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Winfried_H=FChn?= Subject: Re: translating names (NJC) Wally wrote: > this may sound REALLY stupid to you native speakers, but my friends and i > have ball translating american names literally into spanish; names such as > elizabeth taylor, roger plant, josephine baker, brooke shields, jon vickers > [the latter two, phonetically rather than literally] and the funniest one of > all: lucille ball. it's one of those things that's funny in some languages > and silly in others. i wonder if winfried finds it funny in german. > wallyk Ask me again after my exam June 22nd -- right now I'm so anxious I wouldn't even find Monthy Python's funny... (serious case I'm telling you). Generally speaking though, Germans have more fun translating literally from German into English, playing around with the numerous "false friends". It's an own literary genre, called "Filserbrief". "False friends" are English words that look familiar to German ones, but have a different meaning. Example: Guest: "When can I become a steak?" Waitress: "I hope never" -- (German bekommen = to get) Winfried ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:05 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:45 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:47 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:53 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:49 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 03:02:51 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: Re: that weird minor chord in joni's music I don't know if this relates but check out: http://www.experience.org/Jimi/purplehaze/ pat Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:11:25 -0700 From: pmeyer Subject: Re: What's in a Doctor's Name (NJC) I once worked with a pediatric resident named Dr. Seuss! I know of an orthopod named Dr. Payne. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 13:21:46 +0200 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: whats in a name? (NJC) Don Rowe wrote: > Many moons ago, my dad was just starting his legal > career, and so he got all the firm's grunt work. This > included name changes ... and one story he told was of > a woman named Verla, who had married a Czech man whose > last name was Vrla ... so she became "Mrs. Verla > Vrla." My first dentist was called Dr. Slaughter. As if going to the dentist wasn't scary enough! Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 04:46:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Holliston Subject: NJC - don't post much, but... Hey, fellow Joni fans! I just got back from a wonderful visit to Sitka, Alaska. I played chamber music with great colleagues and enjoyed being surrounded by mountains, ocean, and forests. How I wish I'd posted earlier, asking if there were any Alaska based JMDLers (it's a big state, though ;-) Haven't been posting much lately, but to introduce some Joni content: I met a fellow who hosts a radio programme in Sitka, and he's a Joni fan. Since they didn't have a copy of Taming The Tiger, I donated mine to the cause. So Harlem in Havana may well be saturating the Alaskan airwaves as we speak.... Looking very forward to Ashara's bash and hoping to meet many fellow JMDLers there (to say nothing of reunions with my pals from the list...) And hey, Wally K. - I have no intention of flying immediately back to work (ugh!), so will be on the east coast for at least a couple of extra days. New York beckons, though - I'm longing to see the next installment of the Whitney's 20th century exhibit.... Cheers and big hugs to all, Roberto ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 07:51:02 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: What does MRI mean? NJC <> You were very close, Win. It stands for Magnetic Resonance Imaging, it uses magnetic waves to get different internal pictures of what's going on. If I'm not mistaken, the Rolling Stone's "Emotional Rescue" used MRI technology to make the cover. American Doctors have gone a little overboard with MRI technology in my opinion - there are more MRI machines in Greenville County, South Carolina than in all of Canada! (factiod given to me by a doctor pal) Bob ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 08:23:29 EDT From: TheHotelNH@aol.com Subject: Re: What's in a name? In the small town in Alabama, where I grew up, I went to school with a girl named Angel Heaven. My friend, India Hale, lived across the street from her, so we had the Heavens on one side, and the Hales on the other. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 08:24:49 -0400 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: NJC: why people don't post Deborah says: <> Deborah, this was a great "Erma-Bombeck-ish" post - you are very talented! And all these posts definitely help me understand why I only hear from some folks intermittently. But I DO wish people wouldn't give fathers such short shrift. In my house, I do all the laundry, all the housework, pay the bills, and do the cooking (when I'm there; My current schedule makes it even tougher as I'm in NJ during the week and home only on weekends.) When I do get home, my son is quick to give me a long hug and then tell me that he is out of underwear! Thankfully he has consented to keep up with cleaning dishes in my absence (for a raise in his allowance, of course! :~). So saturdays are for doing all the laundry, washing sheets, vacuuming, gathering up old mail and newspapers, yardwork, etc. In between, I try to work in time with my wife & son, exercise, and keeping up with the list. (It's not as crazy as it sounds, btw). I try to knock it all out on Saturday so I can take Sunday off...plus it keeps me home so I can keep up with all my tape-making! And that's why I post so much from work instead of from home; it doesn't interfere with time I could spend with them, and - I get paid for it!! :~D I realize that I'm the exception rather than the rule, but still, it would be nice to see the phrase "parenthood" used every once in a while instead of always "motherhood". But I do understand the bond that mothers, especially single mothers, have with each other. Like Tevye said, we're all just Fiddlers on the Roof, trying to scratch out a simple tune without breaking our necks! Bob NPIMH: "Tradition" from Fiddler... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 08:30:15 EDT From: TheHotelNH@aol.com Subject: Re: What's in a name? In the small town in Alabama, where I grew up, I went to school with a girl named Angel Heaven. My friend, India Hale, lived across the street from her, so we had the Heavens on one side, and the Hales on the other. Chris NP: Paprika Plains ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 09:17:07 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: River Yet another cover of JM. This time by Dianne Reeves on a CD called Bridges. You can hear a little slice of it at CDNOW. Since the site address includes my own code I can't put a link but you all know where to find it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 06:26:44 -0700 From: Louis Lynch Subject: RE: What's in a name (NJC) Hi all! Love the thread. I went to school with a girl named Sandy Beech. But, my grandfather had me beat. He once dated a girl named Anita Cochenour. He said she was desperate to get married as soon as possible! Regards, Harper Lou ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 14:56:51 +0100 From: catman Subject: NJC: What's in a name Uk words: Pavement = sidewalk Fag = cigarette Faggot = meatball(large) Braces = suspenders(here they are used by women for stockings) Petrol = gas Gas is gas. Tarmac = pavement Lift=elevator Peter=a man's name Mary=a womans name and also a vagina Todger = penis Wanker = idiot Plonker = penis or idiot Wally = idiot Bollocks-testes fuck - we don't know ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 10:05:57 -0500 From: Mary Pitassi Subject: RE: re: Art exhibition To Evian and all those on board already for a JMDL get-together/tour of Saskatoon on the occasion of Joni's art exhibit there in 2000: COUNT ME IN!!! (Sorry for the shouting; couldn't restrain myself!) Mary P. P.S. I thought the idea of a tour of significant "Joni places" across North America was fascinating, and would love to see this developed further, but am afraid I can only commit to something a little more discrete and smaller in scope for the moment. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:22:52 EDT From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Joni entry in "Folk, The Essential Album Guide" Hi, everyone! I recently picked up a book called Music Hound Folk, The Essential Album Guide, edited by Neil Waters and Brian Mansfield, with a foreword by Mark D. Moss of Sing Out! magazine, published in 1998. I don't know if anyone's posted about this to the list, so before I take the time to transcribe their piece on Joni Mitchell, I'd like some feedback from people about whether I should take the time to. I haven't had time to really check it out completely, but it seems thorough enough, in terms of inclusion of artists, anyway. Every artist in the genre, including crossover people, that have come to mind and I've looked up, are covered. There are quite a lot of recent photos but, of course, none of Joni. They have an album rating system and Joni's are at times predictable and then there are some ratings that surprised me. Take care, Gina - marveling at how groovy the strawberries are this year in my neck of the woods...yummmm NP: Nick Lowe, Impossible Bird ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:29:16 -0500 From: Heather Galli Subject: Re: why people don't post <> >i ran into my college creative writing teacher last week, when i was at the >local farmer's market with my kids. and she said "are you still writing, >amy?" and i said "i haven't written a story in eight years." and she just >shook her head and said," come back to it someday. it's still there." Amy- Your teacher is right. Someday, when the kids are grown, you will come back to your writing. It has been like that for me and my artwork. It's a slow go of it but it hasn't left me! I did dabble some over the years. When we have children we make sacrifices. We can only hope the kids appreciate it later in life :-) Heather - who raised her daughter alone for 17 years and doesn't regret a day of it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:23:43 EDT From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Re: Art exhibition In a message dated 6/11/99 11:07:44 AM Eastern Daylight Time, PitassiM@WEAC.org writes: > To Evian and all those on board already for a JMDL get-together/tour of > Saskatoon on the occasion of Joni's art exhibit there in 2000: > > COUNT ME IN!!! > > (Sorry for the shouting; couldn't restrain myself!) > > Mary P. I too would love to be counted in. I only wish that into the new millinium, my life felt a little more certain...oh, well. Take care, Gina NP: Nick Lowe, Impossible Bird ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:39:41 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Long song titles (NJC) In a message dated 10/06/99 12:39:44, Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com writes: << the Hoagy Carmichael song I was referring to is entitled "I'm a cranky old yank in a clanky old tank, and I come from Yokohama with my Filipino mama doing the neat-o, beat-o, flat on my feet-o, Hirohito blues" >> And Paul trumps it with a Fairport Convention B Side: "Sir B. Mackenzie's Daughter's Lament for the 77th Mounted Lancers' Retreat from the Straits of Loch Knombe on the Occasion of the Announcement of her Marriage to the Laird of Kinleakie." What interests me is that I found the Hoagy song title mildly amusing, while the Fairport one has me in stitches, even though it's not obviously funny or wacky and I've heard of it before. Strange, that. Azeem ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:39:40 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: What's in a Name? Take 2NJC In a message dated 11/06/99 08:01:12, wallykai@interserver.com.ar writes: << and how about Mike Unt and Hugh G. Rection. Those two are legend already! >> You may jest, Wally, but I know of at least one person called Mike Hunt! I also used to know someone called Jon Thomas - a fairly innocuous name, one might think, except that in England it is one of many slang names for, you've guessed it, willy, dick, etc etc. The best names I can remember are a boy at my school called Lewis Lewis (what were his parents thinking of??), an English lecturer whose surname was Gifford-Gifford, and, best of all, a doctor whose parking space I spotted when I was living in Germany: Dr Grausam. Grausam, as Winfried will be able to confirm, means "cruel" or "brutal"!! Azeem in London ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:42:25 EDT From: SMEBD@aol.com Subject: THANKS--Tape Tree #8 I joined the JMDL several months ago--I'm mostly a reader, but have posted a few times--and signed up for Tape Tree #8. I received my tapes yesterday and wanted to say thank you to Simon, Les, Steve Springer (my branch), and everyone else involved. The sound quality on the tapes is very impressive. A great deal of work obviously goes into putting the trees together. I, for one, very much appreciate all of the time and effort that people give in order to share these very special recordings. I was lucky enough to have gone to "A Day in the Garden" last year, and was simply blown away by Joni's rendition of "Summertime" (which is different from the one on the Herbie Hancock CD--they are both wonderful, but different) and I'm thrilled to have it on tape. I'd also like to thank Ashara and everyone involved in the Video Tree--I couldn't believe all of the wonderful stuff that was on the 2 tapes. My question now is, how do I get copies of the 7 previous audio tape trees? THANKS AGAIN to everyone involved in the trees. Stephen--guess what I'll be listening to this weekend? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:52:28 EDT From: Gellerray@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's New Album? In a message dated 99-06-11 01:12:42 EDT, you write: << One song I would highly recommend is Come Rain Or Come Shine. No one has done justice to this classic since Judy belted it out at Carnegie Hall in 1961. Babs tried on Wet & it was SO boring.... >> Dear Eric, If you read my own post, sent in not long before yours quoted above (mine called joni, larry, or anyone with sway) you see I put out a plea for joni to sing "If Love Were All" by Noel Coward. Well, I just want you to know that i first heard that song on JG's Carnegie Hall album, and boy it has it stayed with me. Brilliant song, brilliant interpretation, all of which naturally enough lead me to think it would be brilliant for joni (being brilliant) to cover such a sparkling--and rather overlooked--gem. Question is: HOW DO YOU GET HER TO EVEN CONSIDER IT? I do remember her praising Noel Coward somewhere when she was talking about the overall (decline in) songwriting standards. But still, I am sure her list is set and she don't want to hear about it from guys like me--dadgumit. (dadgumit?). Ah, well, just dreaming. & by the way, you may hate me for this, but i don't hear joni as easily doing justice to "Come Rain or Come Shine." Maybe because the Carnegie Hall version is so perfectly burned into my brain what with those fantastic congas and that brisk brisk tempo. I have a feeling joni is in a smokier (ha) mood, though of course it's true, joni never does just one thing through any album--she knows the need for variation as the insertion of black crow will forever prove! actually, now that i am waking up and considering the idea more and more, I am beginning to be able to hear joni singing those strains--I'm gonna love you/like nobody's loved you/Come/Rain/or come shine (that is the jude's reading of course). Anyway so long for now--& best regards, raymond ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:19:12 -0500 From: Mary Pitassi Subject: Motherhood/creative fires (long; tangential JC) Amy wrote in part, in a beautiful, heartfelt post: " i don't know if other moms on the list have experienced this, but raising my children really takes so much energy, physical and emotional. and i guess it surprised me to realize that being a mom is a creative outlet, as well. i realized a few years ago, right before my marriage hit the rocks, that so many of the women i admire most are single, or have had several marriages, or don't have children. i started to wonder if being married with kids was stifling to a woman's creative fires...or maybe it satisfies the creative urges? i don't know. sometimes i feel so torn between wanting my family to be my life's work, or wanting my life's work to be something that will satisfy my personal, intellectual self. " Amy, your post really touched a nerve with me. It occurred to me that I've posed many of the same questions you expressed, although, in many ways, as your mirror opposite. I'm 40 years old, have never had children, and have recently had to face the very real possibility that I never will (definitely not a given, but, at this point in my life, perhaps more likely than not). On certain days, I can envision my life having turned out to be much more like yours, but, due to a combination of choices and "simple twists of fate," it is what it is: I'm a professional with a partner and a cat who's often frightfully busy and dabbles in music when there's time. When Carly Simon sang, years ago, about never getting to be "me first, by myself" before marriage and motherhood, she was singing to sharp-eared teenaged girls like me--and we listened. We went out and developed "ourselves," sometimes by investing in expensive educational programs that have taken years and years to pay off. We made sure that nothing subsumed our "creativity," which we defined, I suppose, as resulting in some finished product which reflected our own talent or world vision. We put in the long hours, and paid our dues. And we've often succeeded in what we've attempted, a success in which we've taken great pride. And yet, for me, at least, I find that a certain *kind* of creativity has passed me by. I don't want at all to minimize the real expenditures of time, energy, and money that raising a child well entails, or the fact, in dealing mainly with young children all day, a mother (or father) may not have the opportunity to "stretch" a certain portion of his/her creativity and intellect. And I also don't want to minimize the fact that, at the end of a long day at home, the last thing you may feel capable of being is "creative." But I firmly believe, a thousand times over, that being a parent *is* a creative endeavor, in and of itself!!! You have not, perhaps, expressed quite the same part of your creative spectrum that I have, but then, you've expressed a part of *your* creativity that is markedly unfamiliar to me. And you may sometimes feel that you haven't developed yourself or pursued your muse. . . but when I hear of the flexibility and patience you've developed from the tangible demands of being there for your family, day in and day out; see the intimacy and laughter between you and your children, and witness your very real pride in what they've become through your guidance, love, and (sometimes) tears, then I know that you've done both. Parenthood *is* "you, first"--or at least, it can be that, as much as what I'm doing is "me, first"! And maybe more so. It's too bad that each one of us can't do it all. And some of us are unquestionably better at balancing various forms of creativity than are others. But I guess, when all is said and done, that it's up to each of us to strike the balance that's right for ourselves, appreciating the creativity inherent in our own lives, as well as those of our counterparts on the other side of the mirror. Mary P. P.S. I've wondered many times since Joni publicized her search for Kilauren whether she could have maintained her career as we know it and raised a child at the same time. My guess is that she couldn't, and that perhaps, on the most elemental level, she knew that (although I realize that there were pressing issues of poverty for her as well). And if she had parented Kilauren instead during those long years? Undoubtedly, we would have been much the poorer, but Joni herself would have lost something, and gained something, in living every day. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 11:48:12 -0400 From: LOREN CARTER Subject: Why people don't post (NJC) All, I sent this yesterday, but I don't know if it made it out of the system here. If it did and this is a duplicate, I'll apologize in advance. - ----- After reading two recent posts from Amy and Catgirl, if I weren't at work, I'da stood up and given you two a polite round of applause, and if Tinky Winky weren't so non-PC these days (thanks Jerry!, but my son still likes them, so we'll watch), I'd give you two a "Big Hug" . Your two recent posts were chock full of feelings and emotions and written very well..... thanks. Amy, I worry about my wife all the time. She (before the birth of our little one) was an editor at a large newspaper, and wanted to be a full time mom. I worried that she would not get human, adult contact other than me (if I can assume that I am in both of those classes). She stays at home with Joshua, and I worry about her, so I share your concerns with family life and loss of a social life. Catgirl, I am constantly amazed at your level of intelligence, emotions, and ability to compose prose that leaves me knowing exactly what you are thinking. You "wear" your emotions in your postings, and I find myself doing a mental "yup...exactly....he hit that one on the head...I fell the same way...RIGHT!..." The reason I don't post very much is that I feel so inadequate about most of the discussions that happen here. I don't play the guitar, piano, don't know anything about tunings (pardon me while I stand up after ducking all the things flying over my head). All I know is that I have come to like and appreciate the music for which we all are assembled. I don't understand all of the finer points of her music, all the nuances, all the words and reading between the lines. All I know is that I like to listen to it. And I'm at work, so sitting down and writing responses to things that might be of interest to me, or that I have questions about, is a time thing. The folks here pay me to be their computer network geek, and that pays the bills and mortgage. Then when I read the e-mails, I see that someone has already offered up what I was thinking, so I would be reduced to a "me too" message, and I don't see any reason for that. - ----- I'll sit down and shut up now. humbly, Loren..... NP...What I Want...Derrick Strong ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 10:53:28 -0400 From: Bob.Muller/GV/FD/FluorCorp@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: The Boho Dance David's classic post also stated: <> When I hear "nylons" in terms of Joni lyrics, I'm always drawn to the image of "Momma's nylons underneath my cowgirl jeans" from "Song For Sharon". The concept that Joni wants to "run with the posse" (from Gene Autry show) but still retain her femininity. I don't see stockings in Joni's work as shield but rather as a feminist expression. But I do agree that her expressions of the joys and pleasures of dancing in her songs is a celebration of her victory over a crippling and scary disease. On another level, it reminds me of the scene in "It Happened One Night" (I think) when Clark Gable's car breaks down and he uses his legs walking for help while Claudette Colbert is able to use hers (by flashing them) to get a car to stop and pick her up. So legs can be used to delineate gender differences as well as nylon stockings. Anyway, I've really treasured all the great discussion about "Boho Dance" - every time I hear the words now all the comments that everyone's made are swirling around in my head... Bob NPIMH: ZZ Top, "Legs" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 10:59:05 -0700 From: jan gyn Subject: Re: What's in a Doctor's Name (NJC) I once noticed a Doctor whose first name was Lance. - -jan ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 12:50:00 -0600 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - June 12 1983: Joni performs in Concord, CA - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1904 06:48:55 +0000 From: michael paz Subject: Spam (njc) dayn-castello" wrote: " I want to give the site a few days, but the last time I did this, I was spammed to death and no one was ever really saying anything." First of welcome to the list. I am sure you will find alot here like the rest of us have. Some people may call it spam here, but it tastes like chicken. Best wishes, Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1904 06:49:37 +0000 From: michael paz Subject: Butch Solutions to Joni Trey wrote: " My question is: has anyone found a solution? Is it possible to buy certain strings that tune higher? I am not that educated when it comes to the engineering of the guitar. Are we males forever banished to singing Joni an octave down in boring bass tones? I want to be able to sing her stuff in that great place like she does -- y'know??" Trey- My solution was the VG-8 I frequently use alternate tunings to be able to sing the songs where I want to (relative to virtual, if you will, capo placement. Best, Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 23:17:57 +0200 From: "Winfried Hühn" Subject: Webcams NJC Just wondering... you guys also like webcams? I LOVE the touristic ones allowing you to check out scenic places without having to leave your apartment. One of my favorite ones: http://mimer.no/kamera (City of Aalesund, Norway) Or this site with various webcams around Bergen, Norway http://www.bergens-tidende.no/kamera/ulriken_l.html How about this one, in Tromsĝ, the world's northernmost university city http://www.cs.uit.no/cgi-bin/weather/ Or, in to stay in Scandinavia, the famous Electrolux ("nothing sucks like an Electrolux") fridge cam: http://www.electrolux.se/house/kitchen/fridge/real_fridge_cam/ Good night! Winfried Winfried ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 17:35:10 EDT From: LRFye@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell at 30th Anniversary ADITG? Hi Lisa, Thanks for responding to my query about whether Joni Mitchell might be performing at A Day In The Garden this year. I'm really surprised that the line up for the 30th Anniversary of Woodstock has not already been established and advertised. The weekend of August 13-16 is only two months from now. Last year I purchased tickets for ADITG in June, including travel tickets as I live in Texas. I know for certain that Joni fans traveled from as far away as Colorado and even Holland (yes, the Netherlands!) for last year's event, and I'm sure that folks who are considering traveling from distant locations this year would appreciate knowing the schedule and list of performers soon. I did check the ADITG website today and I see that there is an "Anniversary Show" planned for August 15, and I'm hoping that a line up and details will soon follow. (Please don't tell me that your group is going to let that rip-off in Saugerties get all the attention for the 30th Anniversary!) Thanks again. Peace, Lori Fye > Hi Lori, > Unfortunately, I can't tell you if Joni will be performing or not. The only > thing I can say is that there is going to be a season of events beginning > with Britney Spears on July 4 with fireworks following the show. > My best suggestion for you at this point is to keep checking the website. > As soon as new event and act information becomes available we will post it > to the site. > See you at Yasgur's Farm. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1904 07:39:37 +0000 From: michael paz Subject: Saskatoon kakki wrote: "doesn't just tip the scales for me to really plan a trip to Saskatoon (Oh Evian....Evian....darling....when will you begin taking reservations for Jonifest 2000??" Please sign me up now, Evian dawling. This sounds wonderful. I can see the bridges now.. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 19:17:11 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: message to joni, larry, or anyone with sway I music-directed a cabaret act in NYC a few years ago for a good singer and we worked out an arrangement of "If Love Were All" and (from SOUTH PACIFIC) "Happy Talk" that seemed to work very well. I think she wants to record it this year. The Twiggy show got a gentle, somewhat condescending review in the NYT. DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 19:39:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Gross Subject: Re:What's in a name? NJC Kate wrote: "Here we have an accountant named John Dollarhide!" And my brother's best friend is a veterinarian named Dr. Goldworm !! Brian np: Loreena McKenitt, "The Visit" === "No paper thin walls No folks above No one else can hear the crazy cries of love" over the din of WWIII at 902 :-) _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 22:47:28 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Lyric Game > >http://www.thehub.com.au/~bchudso/jmgame.htm Finally had a chance to play the lyric game and I thought it was fun. This could be a good one for the party. I got 7 out of 10, 8 out of 10, and 4 out of 10. I need to listen more to the words. I have sometimes just enjoyed the sound of her voice as opposed to trying figure out everything she meant by the lyrics. I find this true of my liking Robert Plant. Most of the stuff he sings I can't understand at all. When I got a Zep songbook I was reading one day and thought how funny it was to know what he was singing. Sometimes ignorance is bliss (in my case that would be redundant). Later! Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 22:57:05 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Nice Kitty Kitty (NJC) Hey CaTGirl- I think the dude should give you the book "for free". It's not nice to inform someone of that kind of noticeable of a problem with something one is selling. He should give you a sizeable discount anyways cause the book is "worth" less incomplete. He is taking advantage of your desire to "have it". I say burn him at the stake or least beat him to death with a wet noodle. Good luck, Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 23:02:24 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Joni From Hell Martin wrote: "I wonder what is the worst cover of a Joni song ever? My candidate has to be Nazareth's destruction of 'This Flight tonight'. If there are a lot of suggestions, perhaps tape tree 11 could be the tree from hell! :-) Is this a topic worthy of discussion? One of the problems of being a newcomer is I don't know if something has already been 'talked out' even in the recent past. If anyone feels the urge to castigate me for my ignorance I do a pretty dangerous version of 'The last Time I Saw Richard' in a broken, flat baritone. I could send you a .wav file!!" Hey Martin- Welcome to the list! I REALLY like this idea. Although I can't think of any I would submit YET. At least we would find out more about Joni Covers out there. And we must always remember, "one persons trash is another..." Rock on! Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 23:06:59 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Searching for Drummers and other Musician Types! Hello All (from steamy hot new orleans) I was wondering (yes again) how many musicians are planning on going to Ashara's? I know the ones that I met last year, but I am referring to newbies/people sitting on the fence/or anyone else who may have passed out drunk or stoned and not picked up on the plans for this little shindig. I was thinking it really would be fun to have a WHOLE band. A drummer with kit would be maahvolous. We had a few of us that were able to collaborate on some tunes, but I am dreaming of some ensembles to compliment performances. Special thanks to Heather for the comments about "family" at last years Joni fest. I felt that same feeling and it was a very comfortable place for me to just be. Michael (hoping for more people to join our family jam) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 23:12:31 -0500 From: Michael Paz Subject: Songlynx Kakki wrote: " Since this may be of interest to the musicians, performers and songwriters on the list, in possibly Joni-connected ways, I have not marked it NJC. You can check it out at http://www.songlynx.com/frameset.html Kakki" Kakki Thanks so much for posting this. I plan on spending some time checking this place out tomorrow. I can see how this could be an extremely valuable asset. Also, thanks to however posted about the MacTuner web radio thingy (that's a valid techy term). I have been enjoying that as well. Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend. We have Reggae Riddum's International Festival this weekend. Always something happening here. Love to all, Michael ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 01:34:07 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Joni's new project : Sure, she *says* that she'll just show up in front of a mic and sing them, then drive home..... Before you know it, she'll be *re* arranging, hiring different musicians, changing lyrics..... until it sounds like a "Joni Mitchell album". Worse things could happen- THAT'S FOR SURE! " Joni Mitchell is working on an album with standards with an orchestra. *I get hooked*, she says, *when I performed with The El Nino Orchestra at a 1998 benefit organized by Don Henley. An arranger is working on the material right now. I'm just going to come in to the studio and sing the songs like Frank.* - -- All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu ** Get well Wally! ** Tolerance, tolerance, tol... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Jun 1999 01:44:43 -0400 From: "Jim L'Hommedieu" Subject: Re: What's in a name(NJC) Here in Northern Kentucky, we have Grote Bakery and Grimme Cleaners - -- All the best, Jim L'Hommedieu ** Get well Wally! ** Tolerance, tolerance, tol... ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #256 ************************** The Song and Album Voting Booths are open! 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