From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #207 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Sunday, May 9 1999 Volume 04 : Number 207 TapeTree #8 is ready to roll. To sign up go to: http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- Join the Joni Mitchell Internet Community Glossary project. Send a blank message to for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- tunes.com ["P. Henry" ] Re: the Problem with Hejira [TreyCozy@aol.com] Latest Developments in Serbia NJC ["Winfried Hühn" ] Some more Joni content books [Deb Messling ] Re: Joni's Jazz in Central Park [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Dancin' Clown [RMuRocks@aol.com] Re: NJC: AbFab [TerryM2442@aol.com] Re: the Problem with Hejira [TerryM2442@aol.com] Re: Before the Gold Rush book ["Ken (Slarty)" ] RV: Help needed with song project [JC] ["Wally Kairuz" ] Before The Gold Rush#2 ["Ken (Slarty)" ] Before The Gold Rush#3 ["Ken (Slarty)" ] Re: NJC --How NATO is perceived by Serb students -- NJC ["Eric Taylor" ] Joni sings Doobies [Vince Lavieri ] Les Deux Cafes (NJC) ["Kakki" ] places in the heart (NJC) [Clancyhart@aol.com] Re: Les Deux Cafes (NJC) ["Gene Mock" ] H.elp needed with song project [JC] [Bounced Message ] (NJC)Transgressions, was WIN FREE TRIP [Bounced Message ] Influential Artists (NJC) ["John Low" ] Before The Gold Rush#4 ["Ken (Slarty)" ] Before The Gold Rush#5 ["Ken (Slarty)" ] Re: (NJC)Transgressions, was WIN FREE TRIP ["Kakki" ] Joni's recording trivia ["Helen M. Adcock" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:52:59 -0700 From: "P. Henry" Subject: tunes.com don't know if anyone's ever posted this before but I came across a site that has soundbyte song samples similar to cdnow and the others but the difference is they have them for every song on the album. the site is: http://www.tunes.com and I they're affiliated with rolling stone... anyway, just thought that might interest some who don't have all of Joni's catalog and would like to hear at lest a sample of each song. pat NP: Black Crow http://members.wbs.net/homepages/b/a/d/badwolff/badwolff.html Angelfire for your free web-based e-mail. http://www.angelfire.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 04:12:24 EDT From: TreyCozy@aol.com Subject: Re: the Problem with Hejira Hey folks... Hejira is an extremely unique album, in my humble opinion. On the first few listens, I don't think I was sure what to think. Especially since I experienced Joni almost completely chronologically. (I heard Court & Spark first and then started with Seagull..) But I remember one day - it just CLICKED!! I don't know how to explain it? "Coyote" started and the next thing I knew "Refuge.." was coming to close and I hadn't moved. I was transfixed. At first I thought "Black Crow" was some kind of sick joke!! Now I can't get enough. I guess it's sort of like pate (that's "pa-tay")? My biggest problem with it is "Refuge..". I just can't LIKE that song? It drives me crazy. I just do not like it. I even like "Jungle Line" but "Refuge.." is just lost on me. For the Roses is still my favorite. You just can't beat that record!! Not to start this whole discussion again (even though I only experienced the tail end of it).... Always.. Trey np - "Barangrill" Ridiculous!! AMAZING!! Any of you tuning freaks out there play this on the guitar?? It is JUST TOO MUCH FUN!!! She's brilliant.. simple as that. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 12:16:27 +0200 From: "Winfried Hühn" Subject: Latest Developments in Serbia NJC In Germany, there are now 10,000 recent Kosovar refugees, in addition to the 300,000 Kosovars which were driven out by the Serbs already before the bombing campaign started. There are also still 200,000 Bosnian refugees here which had fled from the Serb atrocities in Bosnia. Many of the recent refugees have seen so horrible things that they are totally traumatized. Our community church collected toys and other stuff for refugee kids, but these still are so scared that they won't take anything from people they don't know. Opening the door is enough to make them freak out, even now that they are here, in safety and peace. This is what it is all about, and it is important to keep it in mind. Obviously, bombing the Chinese embassy was a bad mistake which will further complicate finding a solution to the crisis. It should be kept in mind however, that China has strongly supported Yugoslavia throughout the entire crisis, because it has been subjugating its own political (Tiannamen) and ethnic (Tibet) minorities and therefore attempts to destroy all humanitarian efforts conducted by Western countries. I think it's also obvious that the bombing campaign is approaching its limits. The number of killed civilians is becoming unacceptably high, each one contradicting the humanitarian cause of the intervention. If NATO wants to further increase its pressure, it must somewhat limit the air attacks and either start sufficiently equipping the KLA, or prepare for ground warfare with its own troops. I fear there'll be more suffering to come, but I still think closing our eyes to these ethnic mass killings would have been even worse. Winfried ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 06:54:38 -0400 From: Deb Messling Subject: Before the Gold Rush book Does anyone know anything about the book Before the Gold Rush? Potentially interesting Joni content. (Please don't tell me this has been extensively discussed and I've forgotten!) >In the 1960s, Toronto's hippie hangout and rising music scene was the >neighbourhood of Yorkville. Before the Gold Rush: Peace, Love and the >Dawn of the Canadian Sound follows the story of the golden age of >Canadian music. Veteran Canadian journalist Nicholas Jennings features >more than 100 interviews with coffee house owners, managers and record >company execs. He also profiles such Canadian legends as Neil Young, >Joni Mitchell, Gordon Lightfoot, Robbie Robertson, Ian & Sylvia, Murray >MacLauchlan, Bruce Cockburn, Buffy Sainte-Marie, Blood, Sweat & Tears >and Ronnie Hawkins. Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ ~there are only three kinds of people: those who can count, and those who can't. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 07:08:03 -0400 From: Deb Messling Subject: Some more Joni content books Here are some other books with Joni content; can't vouch for how good or how much, but her picture is on the covers: MUSIC OF OUR TIMES by Marco Adria Eight Canadian singer songwriters Published by James Lorimer & Co. - 1990 ISBN 1-55028-317-0 (bound) ISBN 1-55028-315-4 (paperback) SOME DAY SOON by Douglas Fetherling Essays on Canadian songwriters Published by Quarry Press - 1991 ISBN 1-55082-000-1 And the lowdown on the Nichlas Jennings book is: Published by Penguin Books - 1997 ISBN 0-670-87381-0 Deb Messling messling@enter.net http://www.enter.net/~messling/ ~there are only three kinds of people: those who can count, and those who can't. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 07:40:50 EDT From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's Jazz in Central Park I want to try promoting my CD, JAZZ TAKES ON JONI MITCHELL, around/at this event. Does anyone have a clue who the promoter(s)/producer(s) is? This information will be very valuable, if I can get it. Thanks DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:21:03 EDT From: RMuRocks@aol.com Subject: Re: Dancin' Clown Helen Hungrily responded: << You've just said that Dancing Clown has no lyrical, musical, instrumental or vocal validity - something I find astounding, especially from someone who's also just said he LOVES it when Joni's having fun! There's seems to me, to be a huge contradiction in what you've just said. Again (and I stress again, this is only my opinion!) but that's why I love songs like this - Joni's having "fun" with a song. A song doesn't have to be serious to have validity! Sorry to harp on about this, but I just fail to see any logic in your reasoning! Enlighten me! >> Helen, let me see if I can make you understand it this way...Suppose Joni decides on a whim to "let loose and have fun" by playing a kazoo and overdubbing a yodel, dogs barking, jackhammers, etc. Now, she's had her fun, but the end result is crap! That's the way I feel about Dancin' Clown - the "validity" of the song has nothing to do with its (lack of) seriousness, rather its lack of song quality in terms of the characteristics I previously listed. "Lead Balloon" almost dips into the same category for me, but not quite, there's enough going on to let me enjoy it, and again she's got her hair down and is very playful with the song. "Harlem in Havana" isn't a "serious" song either, but man, it's a three-ring-circus of delight because of the vivid mind pictures she paints with her words, the swoops and sways of her vocal, Wayne Shorter's sax inserts, the melodic hooks that are planted in your brain. Compare DC to that and it comes up as extremely mundane I think. Enlightened now? I'm not expecting you to agree with me, only to understand my logic... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 10:37:08 EDT From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: NJC: AbFab In a message dated 5/8/99 1:45:58 AM Eastern Daylight Time, netgirl@ctos.com writes: << Comedy Central is running 16 back-to-back episodes of "AbFab" on Sunday afternoon in honor of Mother's Day. >> Good thing we don't get Comedy Central! I wouldn't see my kid all day! Terry ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 10:41:42 EDT From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: the Problem with Hejira In a message dated 5/8/99 4:14:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, TreyCozy@aol.com writes: << np - "Barangrill" Ridiculous!! AMAZING!! Any of you tuning freaks out there play this on the guitar?? It is JUST TOO MUCH FUN!!! She's brilliant.. simple as that. >> YES! One of my favs. The tuning on this one is truly beautful. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 14:17:31 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Re: Before the Gold Rush book I've got the book and will post the Joni bits. Deb Messling wrote: > Does anyone know anything about the book Before the Gold Rush? Potentially > interesting Joni content. (Please don't tell me this has been extensively > discussed and I've forgotten!) > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 15:57:52 -0300 From: "Wally Kairuz" Subject: RV: Help needed with song project [JC] I sent this one ysterday but it didn't post. Your help is needed. - -----Original Message----- De: Wally Kairuz Para: jmdl Fecha: Sábado 8 de Mayo de 1999 05:09 Asunto: Help needed with song project [JC] >I'm planning to have my students work with stories that deal with the "dark >half" this month. I'd like to play The Wolf that lives in Lindsay at some >point for them to transcribe the words and discuss the song's connotations. >However, I'm not sure whether we listers ever came to any conclusions as >to who/what/where this Lindsay might be. At least, I don't remember, though >I recall we once discussed the song on the list. Before I decide to use the >song, I'd like to make sure I understand it myself. So my question is: does >anyone remember what we said about it when we discussed it? What other Joni >Mitchell's or other musicians' songs would you recommend to use in this >context? Thanks in advance. >Wallyk > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 15:22:13 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Before The Gold Rush #1 In Montreal, Twenty-four-year-old Leonard Cohen didn't posses a fine singing voice. But he was a published poet and had begun reading his work, beat-style, with jazz accompaniment, at clubs like Dunn's Progressive Jazz Parlour on Ste. Catherine Street. One of his first accompanists was guitarist Lenny Breau, who later also backed Joni Mitchell when she passed through Breau's home town of Winnipeg. In 1958, Mitchell was still Joan Ander- son, a fifteen-year-old living in Saskatoon. That year, she purchased her first instru- ment, a $36 baritone ukulele, with money she earned from modelling. The ukulele was an alternative to a guitar, which her mother had strictly forbidden. But it enabled her to accompany herself, singing Kingston Trio songs and other folk material of the day. Coincidentally, Neil Young also received a ukulele from his parents around the same time, while living in Pickering, Ontario. The thirteen-year-old Young, who, like Mitchell, also suffered a childhood case of polio, had been inspired by seeing Elvis perform on Tv's "Ed Sullivan Show." ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 15:46:37 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Before The Gold Rush#2 As the only child born to William and Myrtle Anderson in Fort McLeod, Alberta, Roberta Joan had grown up in Saskatoon-not far from Sainte-Marie's own birthplace on the Cree Indian Piapot Reserve in the Qu'Appelle Valley. A self- described "good-time Charlie," Joni first wrecked her stockings dancing to the jukebox jive of Chuck Berry, Elvis Presley and The Coasters. But at a certain point, like many teenagers in the early '60s, she traded rock's "jungle rhythms" for the more cerebral qualities of folk music. "Rock 'n' roll went through a really dumb, vanilla period," she recalled. "And during that period, folk came in to fill the hole." At parties, Anderson began to lead singalongs, accompanying herself on baritone ukulele with chords she'd learned from a Pete Seeger instruction record. While performing at a local wiener roast in 1961, the eighteen-year- old caught the fancy of some people connected with Prince Albert's TV station, who promptly booked her as a one-time replacement for a late-night moose-hunting show. Two years later, while working as a waitress at Saskatoon's Louis Riel coffee house, Anderson ventured to the stage during one of the Riel's weekly "hoot nights." Sitting on a stool, the pigtailed performer screeched into the microphone and plunked away on her ukulele for some puzzled onlookers. Indeed, her developing taste for folk music left more than a few people bewildered. "My friends who knew me as a rock 'n' roll dancer found this change kind of hard to relate to," she admitted recendy. "The songs at that time [were] folk songs and English bal- lads, and English ballads are always [about] 'the cruel mother,' and there's a lot of sorrow in them. But they had beautiful melodies, that was the thing, and I always loved melody. Melody is generally melancholy and sad, and the text that accompanies it must be the same." In the fall of '63, Anderson enrolled at the Alberta College of Art in Calgary to pursue her interest in painting. But she continued to entertain thoughts of becoming a folk singer and was soon showing up at Calgary's Depression coffee house. Will Millar, then a budding folk singer and later the leader of The Irish Rovers, recalls: "Joni came with her uke and tor- mented us all with a shrill 'Sloop John B' and 'I With I Wath an Apple on a Twee."' But by the following year, Anderson had improved enough that the Depres- sion paid her $15 to entertain weekend audiences of mostly fellow art students. She even got hired to per- form at Edmonton's Yardbird Suite coffee house, which, along with the Depression and Vancouver's Bunkhouse, was a major stop on the folk circuit in Western Canada. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 16:28:05 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Before The Gold Rush#3 With a guitar now in hand, Joni Anderson pur- chased a one-way train ticket from Calgary to Toronto and set out to attend Mariposa in July '64. She'd quit art college and, whether she knew it yet or not, was a couple of months pregnant-the result of a love affair with fellow art student Brad MacMath. Somewhere between the Prairies and the Lakehead, she penned her first song, "Day by Day," a bluesy piece written to the rhythm of the train wheels that she later described as a "feeling-sorry-for-myself song. Joni arrived in Toronto and took a bus up to Orillia, only to find that Mariposa was in trouble. The previous year's festival had attracted such an unexpected flood of people that the town of Orillia had been overwhelmed. Although it was hardly a disaster of Woodstock proportions, there had been complaints of traffic jams, inadequate facilities and well-publicized acts of drunker debauchery. The local police chief had claimed that the festival had given Orillia "the worst forty-eight hours in its history." So even though Mariposa had been granted permission to use nearby farm land for the '64 festival, a nervous town council blocked the move at the last minute-and the courts upheld the decision just one day before the festival was scheduled to open. When Anderson and other early birds showed up, organizers were in complete chaos, faced with the monumental task of packing up and moving several tons of equipment and supplies back to Toronto, where the Maple Leaf baseball stadium had been lined up as a last-minute venue. According to the festival's Martin Onrot, Joni helped to load trucks along with other volunteers. Then, at the stadium by Lake Ontario, she and others braved the rain and cold tern- peratures to watch performances by blues legends Sonny Terry & Brownie McGhee, Mississippi John Hurt and others. In particular, Anderson studied the distinctive vibrato style of Sainte-Marie, who enjoyed no fewer than four standing ovations. After the festival, the new girl in town had to find a place to crash. She discovered a rooming house in the Annex neighbourhood of the city and, to make ends meet, landed herself a sales job in ladies' wear at the Simpson's department store. Although Anderson must have figured it out by then, her pregnancv was still not evident. Eventually, her weekly wage would enable her to pay the dues required to join the musicians union. In the meantime, she settled for playing several non union coffee houses in Yorkville. The first to hire her was the Penny Farthing, which featured novice folk singers in its basement. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 18:16:50 -0400 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: NJC --How NATO is perceived by Serb students -- NJC al_date@email.com wrote: <> I don't understand the question. If you are implying that NATO is wagging the dog for Clinton, you're NUTS! E.T. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 18:58:15 -0400 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Re: NJC --How NATO is perceived by Serb students -- NJC > al_date@email.com wrote: > > < BACK TO THE STONEAGE FOR SOMETHING THAT BILL CLINTON HAD DONE?>> > > I disagree that no one has answered the question. I disagree that the NATO campaign is bombing Belgrade or anywhere in Serbia "back to the stone age." NATO is not carpet bombing. NATO is strategically bombing, not carpet bombing, to the best limits of technology and human endeavor. And Winfreid has already responded to this by asking when will Serbians take collective responsibility (or individual responsibility!) for their acts in Kosovo, and Bosnia. And Al, for your Russian friends who you said made the analogy of NATO to Nazis, I would like their definitions and analogies for Stalin's purges, the Gulag Archipelago, and the Soviet crackdowns on Hungary in 1956, Czechoslovakia in 1968, and Poland in 1981, and the Soviet-Nazi (Ribbentrop and Molotov) Pact of, I believe, 1939. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:05:39 -0400 From: patrick leader Subject: RE: Joni Fest (NJC) and a note on RENT first of all, congratulations, treycosy! to be playing a lead in a show as current as rent is a great milestone. i saw rent about a year ago, with mixed feelings. the one song (seasons of love?) is pretty striking. still, i'm glad someone bought me the ticket. i had avoided the show partly because of the tragedy (and the promotion of that tragedy) of its beginning; jonathan larson dying before the off-broadway production even opened. and even more so because i knew and didn't like larson's work long before then. i have an acquaintanceship and history with jonathan larson. his last girlfriend, 'susan', and the one before that, 'myrtha', were good friends of mine, both talented modern dancers, and i'd heard a number of his scores for 'myrtha's pieces, and respected his musicianship. then i saw a one-man show of his in '90 or so, just after he'd broken up with m and started dating s and he used both of them in his piece, and completely trivialized both. i was so angry. my rtha and susan were his names for them, and 'myrtha' was particularly ill-chosen. myrtha is the name of the vindictive queen of the wilis (souls of betrayed girls) in the ballet giselle. nearly every dancer knows this. when jon renamed his ex-girlfriend 'myrtha', it was a nasty piece of work. i'd held a grudge. i'm interested in rent, though. there were other reasons why i didn't trust his work, that i've grown out of. i'm also kind of on a sondheim kick, and larson was a sondheim disciple. i may buy the cast album and try to rise above my personal reservations. broadway mostly sucks so bad; rent is certainly better than the helicopter, the mask, or the loaf of bread show. patrick np - sunday in the park with george ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 11:31:01 +1200 From: "Helen M. Adcock" Subject: Re: Dancin' Clown Bob wrote: >Helen, let me see if I can make you understand it this way...Suppose Joni >decides on a whim to "let loose and have fun" by playing a kazoo and >overdubbing a yodel, dogs barking, jackhammers, etc. Now, she's had her fun, >but the end result is crap! That's the way I feel about Dancin' Clown - the >"validity" of the song has nothing to do with its (lack of) seriousness, >rather its lack of song quality in terms of the characteristics I previously >listed. >brain. Compare DC to that and it comes up as extremely mundane I think. > >Enlightened now? I'm not expecting you to agree with me, only to understand >my logic... Point taken - sorry for harping on the subject, but you struck a nerve! Like I said in my last post, there seems to be an underlying contempt (probably too strong a word, but I can't think of a better one!) for songs that are not "serious" in the traditional Joni vein. I do understand we're you're coming from, and I do now understand your logic! Helen - now smoking a peace pipe, and feeling calm and serene! NP - Stevie Nicks - Street Angel ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 19:50:37 -0400 From: Vince Lavieri Subject: Joni sings Doobies I just found a news item from some paper in Dallas that says Joni is singing "Minute by Minute" on an upcoming Doobies tribute album. Not sure what to make of this. (the Rev) Vince ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 17:04:22 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Les Deux Cafes (NJC) They paved parking lot and put up a paradise may describe this little secret restaurant which has been noted as a Joni hang-out by Los Angeles magazine. Located on an obscure side street off Hollywood Boulevard it is virtually impossible to find unless someone gives you explicit directions or you stumble upon it by accident. I'd read and heard it was in a parking lot so we walked through three separate parking lots in the vicinity and found it on the third try. We walked through a giant parking lot which had an old two-story California bungalow-style house on its perimeter. The house was all dark (no lights on) covered in vines and surrounded by an industrial chicken-wire fence. It looks abandoned from the outside. Halfway through the parking lot we saw a tiny, portable sign that said "Les Deux Cafes" with an arrow pointing toward a vine-covered wall. Walking blind we came upon a little vine and trellis covered stone walkway that led to a teeny bar, all candlelit. To the left was a large outdoor stone patio with several tables all candlelit and filled with stylish people (looking all the more beautiful from the light of the candles). There is a tiny indoor section of the back of the house which holds a few more tables and the kitchen but 90% of the restaurant is outdoors with a ceiling of vine-covered trellises and a good supply of heat lamps. The ambiance is magical and there is a feeling of going down the rabbit hole and entering Wonderland. It's easy to see that Joni would like it with its' privacy and unique atmosphere. Because most of the restaurant is outdoors, there is also the ability to smoke cigarettes in a beautiful dining setting, which is almost impossible to do in California anymore with the no-smoking laws in all bars and restaurants. The concept here is not new - this restaurant is like a miniature version of predecessor Twin Palms in Pasadena, which also was built around an old house and where most of its dining area is outdoors on a patio under a tent-like ceiling of large sails. We did not have time to dine because we were running late for a concert but the menu looks fantastic and is moderately priced. I've heard they have live music on Thursday nights. Oh, and no, we didn't see Joni ;-) Kakki NP: Madonna - Sky Fits Heaven ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 20:34:06 EDT From: Clancyhart@aol.com Subject: places in the heart (NJC) here is a question unrelated to anything, but it is really bugging me. in the movie "places in the heart" with sally field, in the final scene all of the characters, dead and living, are sharing communion and singing a hymn. what is that hymn?? i have asked all of my friends, and have gotten answers ranging from "rock of ages" to "amazing grace". i think it might be "blessed assurance". if nobody here knows, i'm going to rent the movie tomorrow because it is driving me crazy! thanks....amy and thanks to the list as a whole for all of the kindness and concern extended to me recently. it has helped so much... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 18:28:46 -0700 From: "Gene Mock" Subject: Re: Les Deux Cafes (NJC) Thanks Kakki. Can you tell me the nearest intersection off Hollywood Blvd.? Take Care gene - ----- Original Message ----- From: Kakki To: Sent: Saturday, May 08, 1999 5:04 PM Subject: Les Deux Cafes (NJC) > They paved parking lot and put up a paradise may describe this little secret > restaurant which has been noted as a Joni hang-out by Los Angeles magazine. > Located on an obscure side street off Hollywood Boulevard it is virtually > impossible to find unless someone gives you explicit directions or you > stumble upon it by accident. I'd read and heard it was in a parking lot so > we walked through three separate parking lots in the vicinity and found it > on the third try. We walked through a giant parking lot which had an old > two-story California bungalow-style house on its perimeter. The house was > all dark (no lights on) covered in vines and surrounded by an industrial > chicken-wire fence. It looks abandoned from the outside. Halfway through > the parking lot we saw a tiny, portable sign that said "Les Deux Cafes" with > an arrow pointing toward a vine-covered wall. Walking blind we came upon a > little vine and trellis covered stone walkway that led to a teeny bar, all > candlelit. To the left was a large outdoor stone patio with several tables > all candlelit and filled with stylish people (looking all the more beautiful > from the light of the candles). There is a tiny indoor section of the back > of the house which holds a few more tables and the kitchen but 90% of the > restaurant is outdoors with a ceiling of vine-covered trellises and a good > supply of heat lamps. The ambiance is magical and there is a feeling of > going down the rabbit hole and entering Wonderland. It's easy to see that > Joni would like it with its' privacy and unique atmosphere. Because most of > the restaurant is outdoors, there is also the ability to smoke cigarettes in > a beautiful dining setting, which is almost impossible to do in California > anymore with the no-smoking laws in all bars and restaurants. The concept > here is not new - this restaurant is like a miniature version of predecessor > Twin Palms in Pasadena, which also was built around an old house and where > most of its dining area is outdoors on a patio under a tent-like ceiling of > large sails. > > We did not have time to dine because we were running late for a concert but > the menu looks fantastic and is moderately priced. I've heard they have > live music on Thursday nights. Oh, and no, we didn't see Joni ;-) > > Kakki > > NP: Madonna - Sky Fits Heaven > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 21:36:24 -0600 From: Bounced Message Subject: H.elp needed with song project [JC] From: "Wally Kairuz" Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:09:22 -0300 I'm planning to have my students work with stories that deal with the "dark half" this month. I'd like to play The Wolf that lives in Lindsay at some point for them to transcribe the words and discuss the song's connotations. However, I'm not sure whether we [listers] ever came to any conclusions as to who/what/where this Lindsay might be. At least, I don't remember, though I recall we once discussed the song on the list. Before I decide to use the song, I'd like to make sure I understand it myself. So my question is: does anyone remember what we said about it when we discussed it? What other Joni Mitchell's or other musicians' songs would you recommend to use in this context? Thanks in advance. Wallyk ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 21:37:23 -0600 From: Bounced Message Subject: (NJC)Transgressions, was WIN FREE TRIP From: "Don Rowe" Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 13:35:47 PST >If we look at this particular admonishment-to-transgression >ratio, and assume that all those admonishments are valid, do we then assume >that most of the "inappropriate" postings come from the females on the list? >Something to ponder here at the Oasis. I don't know about this. First of all, those who admonish others typically don't tend to discriminate on any basis, other than their own personal bias as to what they feel "should" vs. "should not" be a part of the list. I'm sure that I would have drawn the same fire as Phyliss - -- who I don't think Bob is trying to make an example of -- had I posted an ad to the jmdl. And those who have been siding with Bob's POV would, again, side with him about the issue. I think gender has far less to do with it than content. So I'll sit back now and wait for something to the effect of ... "you WOULD think that way! All you men are alike!" ;-) Don Rowe ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 20:53:53 PDT From: "John Low" Subject: Influential Artists (NJC) I'm not sure how well she is known in America but, can I drop into the discussion about influential artists the name of Sandy Denny (1947-1978)? Quintessentially English, her work infused with the folk and historical traditions of her native land, she was described by Greil Marcus in an obituary in 'Rolling Stone' as: "a singer who meant to defeat time .... She sang about serfs and noblemen with the naturalism of a woman describing everyday life, and she sang about everyday life as if from the perspective of a woman a thousand years gone." Her importance in British folk rock circles is indisputable and, though I speak here with limited familiarity, I have been told that her influence can also be heard in musicians like Kate Bush and Sinnaed O'Connor. John. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 00:06:07 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Before The Gold Rush#4 That same month, February '65, Joni Anderson gave birth to a daughter A month earlier, she had moved out of the Annex rooming house and into an apartment above the nearby Lickin' Chicken restau- rant with Vicky Taylor, another folk singer. Taylor remembers that Joni brought the baby girl home for a couple of weeks. But when she realized she could neither support the child financially nor get on with her singing career, she made the wrenching decision to place her daughter with foster parents. "That really tore her apart," recalls Taylor. "She knew that she couldn't be a single mum and do anything with her music. It was a really hard decision for her to make." The decision haunted Joni for many years. She left clues about the baby, whom she had named Kelly, in some of her songs, including "Little Green" from her Blue album. The lyrics, in part, go: "Call her green for the children that have made her... / Child with a child pretending... / You're sad and you're sorry, but you're not ashamed / Little green, have a happy ending." In a fairy-tale ending worthy of a Disney movie, Mitchell and her daughter, whose adoptive name is Kilauren Gibb, met each other again in March 1997 in an extraordinary, media-hyped reunion. Above the Lickin' Chicken, Joni began writing songs in earnest. Taylor remembers her getting up in the mid- dle of the night and working, some- times until dawn. "One morning," says Taylor, "she told me that she'd woken up with a tune going around in her head and couldn't go back to sleep until she worked it all out." That song turned out to be "Here Today and Gone Tomorrow," one of several that she later described as "lost-love pieces for a wan- dering Australian who really did me in. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 00:32:55 -0400 From: "Ken (Slarty)" Subject: Before The Gold Rush#5 By the spring of '65, Joni Anderson was back strug- gling to find work as a folk singer. She landed gigs at the Half Beat and the New Gate of Cleve where Mariposa's Estelle Klein saw her for the first time. "She wasn't doing all her own material," recalled Klein, "but she was a nice singer and had a very charming manner." Fiedler was not so quickly impressed, offering the folk singer a job in the kitchen when she first inquired about work at the Riverboat. She turned it down. (Fiedler has always denied this story, but she insists it's true.) Fiedler says he does remember saying to her, "So, Miss Anderson, I see you're going for the Baez sound," a comment that surely must have rankled her. Truth was, the more she wrote her own material, the less derivative she sounded. "Once I began to write," she admitted, "my vocal style changed. My Joan Baez I Judy Collins in- fluence disappeared. Almost immediately, when I had my own words to sing, my own voice appeared." You might say Joni Anderson was on the rebound from losing her daughter or maybe it was the wandering Australian. But when the older and wiser Chuck Mitchell blew into town that June, she was clearly vulner- able. He was the "star" folk singer from Detroit performing upstairs at the Penny Farthing, while she was the local girl on the basement stage. When he turned on the charm, the impressionable Joni found him hard to resist. "I was at an indecisive time in my life," she later admitted, "and he was a strong force. He decided he was gonna marry me. So he dragged me across the border; got me some work and we were quickly married." Quickly is right. Vicky Taylor remembers the courtship as lasting all of thirty-six hours. The two were married in Mitchell's parents' backyard in Rochester; Michigan. "I was totally shocked," says Taylor; "but I figured Joni knew what she was doing." She and Chuck moved into a cheap fifth-floor apartment on Detroit's Wayne University campus and Joni moved into her husband's world. Chuck was well known on the coffee-house circuit, and soon their apartment became a crash pad for visiting folkies, from Gordon Lighifoot and Buffy Sainte-Marie to Tom Rush and Eric Andersen. Andersen taught Joni some unusual open tunings on the gui- tar; which she quickly used to write new songs. Chuck and Joni began touring together, playing Detroit's Chessmate coffee house and New York's Gaslight Cafe'. Recalled Joni, "I wasn't very good, and I had a lot of trouble with the audience booing and hiss- ing and saying, 'Take your clothes off, sweetheart.' Things like that really shook me up because I didn't know how to counter or act. I thought I'd bombed." Larry Leblanc, writing in Rolling Stone in 1971, described the Chuck & Joni show as a vari- ety act, with him performing very theatrical, "Brechtian" shtick and Joni doing her own folky thing. When they did team up on duets, the songs they sang were often Lightfoot's. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 23:28:18 -0700 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: (NJC)Transgressions, was WIN FREE TRIP I don't know if this response to a post of mine from 6 weeks ago has been lost in Joniland all that time but since I've received it twice in the past 24 hours, I guess Don wants me to reply to it. > I don't know about this. First of all, those who admonish others > typically don't tend to discriminate on any basis, other than their own > personal bias as to what they feel "should" vs. "should not" be a part > of the list. I'm sure that I would have drawn the same fire as Phyliss > -- who I don't think Bob is trying to make an example of -- had I posted > an ad to the jmdl. And those who have been siding with Bob's POV would, > again, side with him about the issue. I think gender has far less to do > with it than content. Gender should have far less to do with it than content but some others and I were starting to see a bit of a gender-based trend. Lots of people post all kinds of stuff on (the now NJC) list that perhaps others don't want to read but no one usually takes exception to them. Many people also post "ads" of sorts for stuff that is close to them (which I have no problem with and enjoy). Phyliss' "ad" was not music -related but it was something close to her. It's not like she has been bombarding the list with this stuff, and in fact, she rarely posts. Bob took exception to it and that is his perogative. But there was a lecturing tone to it that I thought was unnecessary. Then two other guys piled on about Phyliss' "transgression". I think it was petty. What is ultimately more offensive - posting an innocuous personal "ad" or making a big public deal out of it on the list? There have been other posts along the way that have probably qualified as more offensive and they have gone by without comment. I don't mean to single Bob out on this one and I hate to sound like I am also lecturing, but there just seemed to me to be a double-standard developing over time as to list content and it was starting to bother me. Off my drone now and back to the future ;-) Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 18:42:26 +1200 From: "Helen M. Adcock" Subject: Joni's recording trivia Some Joni trivia you may, or may not be aware of. "Hits" and "Misses" were not the first compilation albums released by Joni - I rediscovered this fact while browsing a record-store today, although I had been previously aware of it! I'm not exactly sure when it was released (and the album cover didn't say) but there was a compilation album called "The World of Joni Mitchell" released on vinyl only in New Zealand (the land of compilations!), in (I would guess) the early-mid 70's. The track list is as follows. Side One: Big Yellow Taxi, Woodstock, All I Want, Both Sides Now, Chelsea Morning, I Had A King; Side Two: Carey, The Circle Game, California, Song To A Seagull, That Song About the Midway, Night in the City. I didn't buy it, since it was only in "average" condition, and I'm trying to cut down on buying vinyl (I also have all those songs on the original albums) but I was very tempted, if only to say I owned an official Joni release that probably no-one else has! Has anyone else heard of it, or does anyone own a copy? I may still go back and get it, just for the hell of it! Helen NP - Crosby, Stills & Nash (first album -digitally remastered) ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #207 ************************** There is now a JMDL tape trading list. Interested traders can get more details at http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- The Song and Album Voting Booths are open again! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?