From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #135 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Wednesday, March 31 1999 Volume 04 : Number 135 Joni the Joni Mitchell Internet Community Glossary project. Send a blank message to for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://www.jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Glossary project (NJC) ["Helen M. Adcock" ] Re: Back to the Bars [M.Russell@iaea.org] Re: Glossary project ["Eric Taylor" ] That extra chord or two... ["Phil Klein" ] Re: Tape trees [Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com] A Trip Through Hejira (long/strange) ["Don Rowe" ] Stormy cd [Jerry Notaro ] Re: Stormy cd [Randy Remote ] Re: Stormy cd ["Gerald Notaro (LIB)" ] stormy weather CD ["Jeffery W. Osborne" ] Re: stormy weather CD ["Don Rowe" ] A Happy Day Indeed [Michael Paz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 20:02:08 +1200 From: "Helen M. Adcock" Subject: Re: Glossary project (NJC) Les wrote: >"Who cares what I meant!? What does it mean to you?" - Joni Mitchell, when >asked about the meaning of a certain lyric. Just thought I'd add what Seal wrote about the inclusion (or lack thereof) of lyrics on his album liner: "One of the most popular questions people seem to ask is 'Why don't you print your lyrics on the album?' Well, the answer to that is that quite often, my songs mean one thing to me and another to the listener. But that's OK because I think it's the general vibe of what I'm saying that is important and not the exact literal translation. How many times have you fallen in love with a lyric that you thought went, 'Show me a day with Hilda Ogden and I'll despair', only to find that it went 'Show me a way to solve your problems and I'll be there'. I guess what I'm saying is that the song is always larger in the listeners mind because with it they attach imagery which is relative to their own personal experience. So it is your perception of what I'm saying rather than what I actually say that is the key." Quite elegantly put, I've always thought. Not that I'm against knowing the true lyrics to a song - far from it, I'm far too tidy-minded for that! But I thought it might give some relief to all those people feeling guilty for getting Joni's lyrics wrong - or not wrong, depending on how you interpret things! Have a happy day! Helen - happy now she's finally got a copy of "Painting With Words & Music"! See the Antipodes aren't quite so behind the times! P.S. All UK listers should get the Hilda Ogden reference immediately - others may require an explanation! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:08:15 +0200 From: M.Russell@iaea.org Subject: Re: Back to the Bars Michael Paz wrote: * I am also looking actively for some players to * duo or trio with me. Yippee, hey Marian, watch * out I am headed to Vienna to open a show for ya! Just say when, Michael! But we should definitely be a duo, don't you think? Marian (dreaming that this is a real possibility!) Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:23:38 -0500 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: Glossary project Les concluded his message: <<"Who cares what I meant!? What does it mean to you?" - Joni Mitchell, when asked about the meaning of a certain lyric.>> This is what I love about Joni! And what I love about her music. It's so open to interpretation.... E.T. NP: S&L ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:11:32 GMT From: "Phil Klein" Subject: That extra chord or two... Howard wrote: >I've heard the audio from the "Painting" session, and I didn't >notice any extra chords here - but I'll have another listen to be >sure. Get the video! It's been out over here for the past month! >It may be that Joni just emphasises some of the top open strings >more than she does on the original, so this could come across as an >extra chord? Maybe she strums all the open strings before playing >the bar chord at the 5th fret? On the original, she tends to play >just the top few open strings here. No, I think its definitely an extra chord change. I had another look/listen last night, and there's definitely a shift in her hands up the fretboard before the 5th bar chord, but the camera always tends to pan out at this point. I had a play around on the guitar, and suggest these shapes: 000000 02h01h00 040300 555555 575655 So the extra chord is 040300 >I noticed that Joni sometimes changes chords to her songs - and >she's done this with Amelia in fact, for the lines "I dreamed of >747s over geometric farms". I think the "painting" version is >different to the original. She also revamped parts of BYT recently, >adding some new chords. >Howard Yes, I noticed this too on BYT - in the chorus on the phrase "seem to go" there's a shift from 12th to 10th fret. And then, Jim said: >I've also noticed this "extra" chord in recent live versions of >Amelia. According to my study of the song, the first three chords of >the intro are: >222100 444300 555555 Hmm, interesting. That may be true for the other live versions, but I don't see her fretting that bottom string in Painting, but as I say, it's hard to make out visually, and my ear isn't that good! Phil ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:36:53 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: vali and recording Why shouldn't it be a jazz discussion group? Joni Mitchell has connected herself to jazz in (too) many ways (to get into right now). As for Miles: his apprentice years are documented on sessions led by Charlie Parker, originally issued by the Dial and Savoy labels. I think he plays better on the less numerous Dials. The early fifties can be traced on Prestige (BLUE HAZE and especially BAGS' GROOVE). Then in '55 he formed his own band with the illustrious sidemen John Coltrane, Red Garland, Paul Chambers and Philly Joe Jones. In what was reported as one marathon sesson for Prestige, they cut the material that resulted in 4 lps (COOKIN', RELAXIN' -my favorite-WORKIN' and STEAMIN'). The hottest I've ever heard from this group is one half of an lp called MILES & MONK AT NEWPORT, from '58. (The second side is Thelonious Monk's Quartet with old-time clarinettist Peewee Russell as guest- disappointing IMO). Then in the mid-sixties came the band with Wayne Shorter, Herbie Hancock, Ron Carter and Tony Williams. I think there's good stuff on ESP & MILES SMILES. The electronic period that came after that holds little interest for me, but many, many people feel differently. Beautiful music, mostly by virtue of the arrangements rather than Miles' own contributions, exists on BIRTH OF THE COOL and MILES AHEAD (originally on Capitol and Columbia, respectively). It was one of the great careers and definers of mid- century modernism to be found in any creative art. Ciao for now DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 08:59:34 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: (NJC) WIN a FREE TRIP to HAWAII - REALLY! Phyliss wrote: <> Don't take it personal Phyliss, I know you're a nice person but a part of me really resents seeing the list used for something like this...it's one thing when I see promos for music which has some Joni connection, but this is kinda exploitative and although I know you feel like you're doing us a favor, it's ultimately more Spam. Maybe I'm in the minority, but as much as I hate hearing from telemarketers at home I certainly don't desire to take it on myself to call *them*. Just my opinion... Bob NP: Counting Crows, "Catapult" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:48:15 +0200 From: FL Subject: David Crosby and CPR: Through The Music. has anybody taped this from TV recently? David Crosby and CPR: Through The Music i really would appreciate to get a copy please, please, please, email me (i have many exc tapes for trade) thanks, francesco ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 09:03:39 -0500 From: Bob.Muller@fluordaniel.com Subject: Re: Tape trees Ashara shared: <JMDL Tape Trading Information for all the information you will ever want to know about tape trees. I am the resident video dubber, (or maybe that's just the resident "dubba"). Anyway, anyone who does not already have the Video Tape Trees Volumes 1 & 2, that wants them, e-mail me privately. I still have several copies of PAL versions as well.>> So if I make copies of the tape trees in SC, does that make me a "Bubba dubba"? Can I refer to your Nathan as "Son of Dubber"? Can someone else refer to the two of us as "Dumb & Dubber" (with me being the former of course)... Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:47:13 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: A Trip Through Hejira (long/strange) This is the story of my adventures up, over, through, around and under "Hejira" on my initial mescaline trip. This had all been suggested by my oldest and dearest friend, who figures prominently throughout this tale ... and since I was, in fact, bulletproof and immortal at the time, I figured anything was worth trying once. So over the weekend, at our lakehouse on beautiful Lake Bridgeport, TX, a resort called, at the time "Runaway Bay" -- I'm not kidding -- we ventured out of this world for the weekend together. A couple of general things. Some of you may not know that "Hejira" takes several spiritual re-incarnations to truly appreciate. We begin on the animal plane with "Coyote". We become one with the coyote as hearing, vision and sense of smell start to dramatically improve. As the last pulses of the coyote's racing heart (which is what Joni's guitar is really playing, don't you know!) fade from the track, we begin to realize we're not in beautiful Lake Bridgeport anymore. Stretching out as "Amelia" begins to fill the room, my friend remarks, "Have you ever seen how long your body really is? Man you can't walk that far!" It is, of course, true. And "Amelia's" dark sonic coloring, in combination with the shadows filtering in through the windows as the sun sets, isn't helping matters. By the end, we're completely out of our long bodies, and I at least, no longer feel anything like a coyote ... I just wish I could lose the stupid grin and stop gritting my teeth. As anyone who's ascended on beautiful, foolish arms can tell you, if you get too close to the sun, you fall. It's a long, long way down to Old Beale Street -- where we find ourselves as Furry starts to sing the blues. Motion becomes possible for the first time in centuries during this song, and by the end, we are both "dancing it up and making deals" - -- all a sort of inept Twyla Tharp in reality I'm certain, but at the time it felt more like Baryshnikov. But Furry doesn't like us and we're hurt, even though we know it's the old man's standard joke -- so we have to leave Memphis. "Wow, it's good to be the human again." With this cryptic decree, as if now a re-embodied ghost of darktown society -- it's time to hop on the imaginary skateboard and weave a course of grace and havoc. The carpeting is beginning to undulate nicely now, so we've got a lot of gently rolling hills to keep the board going. In fact, by standing still, it's possible to cruise over the shag from one side of the room to the other and back again. BTW, "A Strange Boy" is one of the warmest songs on 'Hejira' ... I know this because we're burning up, even though the air conditioning must be turned down to around 50. Fortunately, relief is on it's way. More quickly than either of us realize. "Hejira" is playing now ... where or when it started neither of us can say for sure. We just looked at each other, and suddenly it was there. Yes we are travelling now, and have been for some time, but not in some vehicle. The effect of this haunting song is to fill the room with a refreshing cool breeze (at first) ... then a slightly bracing chill ... ending up with a body-numbing cold. Dancing on Beale Street is now completely out of the question, as is any sort of movement. I'm surprised we're not frost-bitten. "Dude, it's like 55 degrees in here," my friend informs me, going over to check the thermostat (like he can read it at this point!). "Don't need no machine to tell me that!" I reply. So it's out to the deck to warm up, take in a view of the lake and "Song for Sharon." We seem to have developed the remarkable power to reshape clouds in the moonlight into whatever shapes Joni suggests ... the Manhattan Skyline, the Statten Island ferry, a drowned Ophelia and more ... each magnificent, vivid and ephemeral. Now totally relaxed, we are caught completely off guard by what I've since considered to the the "real" beat of black wings .. "Black Crow." Just as the coyote's earlier heartbeat, the guitar here is the flapping of wings, with Jaco's bass the warm current of air thermals that lifts us out of our comfy chairs, off the deck and into the night sky, still alive with cloud visitors. The black crow vanishes slowly into the distance, and we're both a little relieved to find that we haven't moved, at least in any physical sense. Still on the deck, huge sighs are breathed out as the lilt of "Blue Motel Room" wanders out to enfold us. From the starry skies, our attention is drawn down to the waters of the lake, and the deck seems a small fishing canoe. The whole world sways gently back and forth, and for as wide awake as we obviously are, there's a wonderful sense of relaxation that grows throughout this song. In the end, we're a couple of nylon-boned Gumbies paralyzed with comfort. The winter chill of the title track has abated inside, and though it's kind of hard to walk with nylon bones, we straggle back inside to seek "Refuge of the Roads." We take positions on a couple of barstools, which become amazingly taller as the song takes shape. The insistence of the guitar pushes us up and out ... I know the ceilings aren't really 20 feet tall, and the room doesn't really stretch out to an infinite vanishing point on the horizon, but it's as convincing a feeling as I can only poorly describe. Thank heavens it takes Jaco so long to wind down our marvelous journey and set us carefully back down on the floor. And so "Hejira" comes to an end. There are more adventures to be had that weekend, but none remain so vivid in my mind as these. Say what you will, but it's an experience I wouldn't trade for anything. To this day, I will smile softly and remember these times, fixed in my mind by the mesmerizing genius of Joni Mitchell. Don Rowe ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 14:30:37 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Stormy cd Got my Stormy Weather cd in the mail yesterday. It's really worth the effort to get one. Joni is terrific, but Sheryl Crow gives her a run for her money. Jerry np: Beautiful Thing soundtrack ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:07:48 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Stormy cd Jerry Notaro wrote: > Got my Stormy Weather cd in the mail yesterday. It's really worth the > effort to get one. Okay, how? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:35:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Gerald Notaro (LIB)" Subject: Re: Stormy cd I called ATT World \Net. The cd has the software on it to start up their internet service. Clever, but a little shifty. Smacks of Microsoft. But since they are given out free we can't gripe too much. I asked them to send it to me so I could try out their service, and they did. Jerry On Tue, 30 Mar 1999, Randy Remote wrote: > > > Jerry Notaro wrote: > > > Got my Stormy Weather cd in the mail yesterday. It's really worth the > > effort to get one. > > Okay, how? > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 15:28:58 -0600 From: "Jeffery W. Osborne" Subject: stormy weather CD Greetings, To get your Stormy Weather CD (and AT&T internet software) dial 800-967-5363, in the USA Q: If Mexicans took up arms in Texas, and wanted their own country there, and killed US soldiers, would China and the USSR send troops to stop us from killing them? Jeff Osborne Systems Engineer ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 13:35:07 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: Re: stormy weather CD >Q: If Mexicans took up arms in Texas, and wanted their own country there, >and killed US soldiers, >would China and the USSR send troops to stop us from killing them? > Wouldn't be necessary. The ranchers, wildcatters and other assorted "good ol' boys" would have the poor Mexicans so phenomenally out-gunned, they'd surrender without a fight before reinforcements from the National Guard could mobilize ... let alone the Russians or the Chinese. Don Rowe Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:47:12 -0600 From: Michael Paz Subject: A Happy Day Indeed Hello Gang of 500 or so- It has been a very happy day for me indeed. although I am at home sick (along with my two boys) today, I received as a gift from the family a DVD player as well as the worlds latestandgreatest DVD "Painting With Words and Music". What a wonderful present! It looks fab! All my friends look so much better in digital. It truly is unbelievable how much sharper this picture is and oh the stop frame function (I'll get all those little nuances yet). 98 minutes of sheer bliss. SO TO ALL THE SPOUSES AND SIGNIFICANT OTHERS OF THE JMDLERS: PLEASE CONSIDER GETTING THEM A ROLAND VG-8 (WITH THE PARKER GUITAR OF COURSE), A DVD PLAYER WITH THE NEW VIDEO, AND OF COURSE THE REMASTERED CD'S AND GOLD CD'S. I am getting ready to go pick up Chinese take out and spend a Rainy Night Home with the people I love the most and also think about the the people from coast to coast and beyond, I love almost as much. Love and peace to all. Michael ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #135 ************************** There is now a JMDL tape trading list. Interested traders can get more details at http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- The Song and Album Voting Booths are open again! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?