From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V4 #133 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Monday, March 29 1999 Volume 04 : Number 133 The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at http://jmdl.com and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Audiophile Question [Lisa Kowalski ] Re: questions about Painting With ... [Howard Wright ] Re: Miles [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Gossip (JMDL content) (NJC) [Ginamu@aol.com] Catching up: communism; cookbook (NJC) [Alan ] real virus (njc) [KerriLynn@aol.com] Re: Joni 8 TRACKS [Janet Hess ] Was Ezra Pound Jewish???? [Dflahm@aol.com] Re: Was Ezra Pound Jewish???? [MGVal@aol.com] Wild Things Run Fast [Marian Russell ] joni songbook ["paul tyrer" ] collecting 8-track tapes ["S. Iverson" ] Re: Joni Mitchell on Vali [Gellerray@aol.com] Re: I Saw You First (NJC) [RMuRocks@aol.com] Down Songs and Joan Armatrading (NJC) [Ginamu@aol.com] Re: Down Songs and Joan Armatrading (NJC) [LRFye@aol.com] Re: Joni Mitchell on Vali ["Deb Messling" ] Re: joni songbook ["Deb Messling" ] Re: joni songbook (NJC by now) [MGVal@aol.com] Stuff [Wally Breese ] Re: Audiophile Question [Randy Remote ] Joan Armatrading (NJC) [Joseph Palis ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 09:52:07 From: Lisa Kowalski Subject: Audiophile Question Hey all you audiophile/engineer types! I have a question.I recently bought a Miles Davis CD "Kind of Blue" and on the front of the CD it says..The finest sound ever-newly mixed and 20-bit Remastered.What does 20-bit Remastered mean? Can anyone out there in Audiophile Land explain this to me(in laymans terms please as I am Audiophile challenged) Thanks! Lisa ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:56:49 +0100 (BST) From: Howard Wright Subject: Re: questions about Painting With ... Phil Klein wrote: >3. Is there an "added chord" in Amelia? I'm talking about right at >the start, whcih is also the bit that is repeated twice after every >verse. I've heard the audio from the "Painting" session, and I didn't notice any extra chords here - but I'll have another listen to be sure. It may be that Joni just emphasises some of the top open strings more than she does on the original, so this could come across as an extra chord? Maybe she strums all the open strings before playing the bar chord at the 5th fret? On the original, she tends to play just the top few open strings here. I noticed that Joni sometimes changes chords to her songs - and she's done this with Amelia in fact, for the lines "I dreamed of 747s over geometric farms". I think the "painting" version is different to the original. She also revamped parts of BYT recently, adding some new chords. Howard ******************************************************* Howard.Wright@ed.ac.uk ...and they don't go for what's in the book and that makes 'em bad. So verily we must choppeth them up and stompeth them down Frank Zappa ******************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 10:51:27 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Re: Miles Lisa, I don't know if this is your first hearing of KIND OF BLUE but I hope you have as much enjoyment and inspiration from it as I did when I first listened in on a hot August afternoon in Lenox, Massachusetts --1959. Jazz musicians are still playing those songs and you've reminded me to take a shot with "Freddie Freeeloader" on my job this afternoon. Thanks, DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:38:24 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Re: Gossip (JMDL content) (NJC) In a message dated 3/26/99 10:34:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, Zapuppy@webtv.net writes: > Well, Gina, I did. Are your steady references to ood"les", nood"les", > dood"les" and now gurg"les" Freudian slips or your secret way to send > sweet little "I'm thinking of you's" to Les? The mind works in strange ways, Penny...who knows what's going on...I'm about to celebrate my 14th anniversary soon...and...well...that could mean I have double the itch...and well...as far as Freud goes, have you read his wonderful book on the oodle, the noodle and and superdoodle? It's a must-read. "My analyst told me that I was right out of my head..." Gina ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:01:51 -0600 From: Alan Subject: Catching up: communism; cookbook (NJC) Just catching up after a very busy week out of town; had to comment on two threads: Communism: As both Lori and Marcel correctly alluded to, on paper, it is capitalism not communism that is designed to fail. The essential problem with capitalism is that economic profits almost always represent a transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich. The standard defense that the stock market allows the masses to share the wealth just doesn't fly, as the upper 20% own the vast majority of the stock. It really is too soon to tell how the capitalism experiment is going to turn out. Communism looks wonderful on paper, but it totally failed on the human level. For one thing, the faceless government bureaucracy, and quite literally everyone worked for the government, resulted in collective irresponsibility. But on a more human level, the collective mindset resulted in a kind of 'everyone gains or nobody gains' attitude. Quite the opposite of Adam Smith's "Enlightened self interest" (although I would still question how enlightened we are ;-) Years ago, before the wall fell, I read an article written by a reporter traveling through the Soviet Union. On a whim, he asked a peasant farmer, "If you could have one wish, anything at all, what would you wish for." The man thought about it, and said, "can I wish for something for everybody?" The reporter said, "No, just one thing." The man thought some more and said, "Can I wish for somebody else?" Reporter; "Sure, why not." "Then I wish my neighbor's mule would die." The reporter was shocked, "I said you could wish for anything, why would you wish for that?" The man replied, "If everyone can't have a mule, then he shouldn't be allowed to have one." I know this was just one person talking, but I thought it was a very telling metaphor; I've never forgotten it. Second subject: Cookbook: Marian, everyone had an individual chance to vote on content when they sent in their own input. You graciously volunteered to put it together and be the "editor in chief." I would suggest that you don't change a thing unless you think it needs to be changed. Alan NP: "Sunny Sunday" (how totally appropriate!) Joni: TI ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 11:59:03 EST From: KerriLynn@aol.com Subject: real virus (njc) HEY EVERYONE! i just read about this virus on the news.... it's real, and it looks pretty bad.... click the link below to get more info... DON'T DOWNLOAD ANYTHING FROM E-MAIL THAT YOU DONT KNOW WHAT IT IS!!!!!!!! http://www.msnbc.com/msn/253803.asp KERRI your fave lurker :) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:03:57 -0500 From: Janet Hess Subject: Re: Joni 8 TRACKS I began "collecting" 8 tracks by accident. A friend of mine picked up a working (and quite nice, actually) 8 track player at a yard sale. She said she knew it was intended for me. I think she paid fifty cents for it and a zillion tapes. Many of the tapes were fairly lame, I'm afraid, but once I had a fully functional 8 track player, tapes started arriving here at the palace (chortle). Haven't run across much Joni, but the same pal who came up with the player gave me S&L, which she plucked from another yard sale or thrift store for, I think, a quarter. Several times in the last few years I've picked up 8 track collections at eBay, generally at very low prices. I've had a couple tapes disintegrate in the tape player; for the most part, these things seem to have been squirreled away in an attic for about a generation. BTW, the 8 track of S&L contains the whole durn thing, unlike the CD. Is that a hoot? At 11:07 PM 3/27/1999 -0700, Kevin wrote: >I will let you know any others. Is it just me being sad >or does any one else collect 8 tracks >Kevin > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:07:55 EST From: Dflahm@aol.com Subject: Was Ezra Pound Jewish???? I am almost certain you are misinformed in referring to Pound as a "Jewish" poet. What is your source for this claim? Not that it is 100% definitive, but Pound was born in Hailey, Idaho. I looked up the Pound chapter in William H. Pritchard's LIVES OF THE MODERN POETS (reissued by the New England Univ. Press in Hanover, NH) and while Pritchard does mention Pound's pro-Nazi propaganda and his capture and imprisonment by the Americans in Italy at the end of WWII, he doesn't write that Pound was Jewish, as I would have expected him to had that been the case. The cited works on Pound are: John Reck, EZRA POUND: a close up-(McGraw-Hill, New York, 1969); Hugh Kenner, THE POETRY OF EZRA POUND-(New Directions, Norfolk, CT, 1951) & THE POUND ERA-(U of Calif. Press, Berkeley, 1971); Donald Davie, EZRA POUND: the poet as sculptor-(Oxford Univ. Press, New York, 1965) and Noel Stock, READING THE CANTOS (Routledge, London, 1967). This last may or may not be the biography by Stock to which Pritchard refers in his chapter. Yes, I was an English major during my apprentice years as a jazzer. DAVID LAHM ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:24:33 EST From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: Was Ezra Pound Jewish???? Thanks D. I'm going to root through my old lit/history books to check this one out. He was an obsessive anti-Seminite who gave hundreds of propaganda broadcasts during the war supporting Hitler, the final solution and Mussolini's regime. I just did a quick glance through my deskside Benet's and I should have doublecheckd that first before posting. Although he came from a New England background, somewhere in the back of my not-to-be-totally-trusted memory, is a biography or critique that mentioned that he had Jewish blood. But, Jewish or not, his total acceptance of Facism and Hitler & Co. totally wipes out his value as a poet, IMHO. He was declared insane and his release from the hospital was secured by the efforts of major literary figures. Not a bad sentance for treason, all things considered. Shades of Norman Mailer's championing Jack Abbott's release back in the late 70's/early 80's. Promoting the value of art over the value of human decency leaves a sour taste in my mouth. MG ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 06:02:10 +0100 From: Marian Russell Subject: Wild Things Run Fast Just a quick note to the guitarists on the list: I added a transcription for WTRF (the song) to the JMDL Guitar Files today. Check it out! Marian Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:02:19 +0100 From: "paul tyrer" Subject: joni songbook Kakki wrote: The other songbook is also rare and Joni's first, titled "The Music of Joni Mitchell", published in the U.K. and copyright 1969. It includes many unreleased songs such as Winter Lady, Carnival in Kenora, Melody in Your Name, Strawflower Me, Moon in the Mirroe, Jeremy, Poor Sad Baby and Who Has Seen the Wind. P says: I saw this songbook in vancouver city library in 1997 and it was really frustrating because i wanted to borrow it and couldn't (not being a Canadian let alone a Vancouverian and only being there a couple of days before decamping to Seattle)!! I thought of nicking it but resisted. Has anyone ever heard these tunes? Some of the titles sound a bit dodgy but... Vancouver City Library has an excellent collection of Joni songbooks so if you can tear yourself away from the fantastic cityscape, pay it a visit. PX ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:23:49 -0500 From: "S. Iverson" Subject: collecting 8-track tapes >You are the only one collecting 8-tracks, I am sure. >But since the sound quality is SO poor, I wonder why you do. Actually, I collect 8-tracks, too, and so do many other people. They're cool, in a pop-culture-historical sort of way. You don't have to listen to them to enjoy collecting them. Steve I. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 13:56:28 EST From: Gellerray@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell on Vali Marksa973 wrote: I have a CD of a live recording of Joni's where she sings a song about someone named Vali. In the intro, she says she saw an underground movie about her. Joni describes her as a bohemian type who grew up in Australia, went to France, was asked to leave France for being too much of a bohemian (?) and once danced at a concert performance of Donavan's in England. wait a minute--i just read this post of yours (today, Sunday the 28th of March) and looking through my later (unopened) posts I do not see that you received a reply concerning this most interesting character and song. Is it true--no one wrote back to comment? When was the recording from and what song does Joni say is about "Vali?" I wonder. ray ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 14:04:02 EST From: RMuRocks@aol.com Subject: Re: I Saw You First (NJC) Marian, The "I saw you first" song you were referring to is from John Mellencamp's "Mr. Happy-Go-Lucky", I'll bet. The actual song title is "Key West Intermezzo (I saw You First). Bob NP: Joni talking about TTT ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 15:09:12 EST From: Ginamu@aol.com Subject: Down Songs and Joan Armatrading (NJC) In a message dated 3/26/99 9:45:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, AzeemAK@aol.com writes: > Good on you Gina - those are four cracking songs! It's great to see Joan > Armatrading mentioned on the list, she's sadly overlooked these days. Her > self-titled third album, the one with "Down to Zero" and "Love and Affection" > , > is a very wonderful album indeed Azeem, I'm still a big fan of Joan's. I saw her perform a long, long time ago and she was most endearing as a performer. Her rapport with the audience was warm and fun-loving. She was very passionate when singing songs like Down To Zero (my favorite) and on other more rocking numbers, she had lots of fun, laughed, smiled and danced a lot. Plus she had a very good band and that intense voice just blows me away! I found her to be a warm and very uniquely beautiful woman on stage. The last album of Joan's I've listened to all the way through was Hearts And Flowers from sometime in the early 90's, if memory serves. I've lost track of anything since and it seems as if she's faded into the woodwork or perhaps it's just, as you said, that she's being overlooked. Take care, Gina NP: Judybats - Pain Makes You Beautiful ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 16:19:16 EST From: LRFye@aol.com Subject: Re: Down Songs and Joan Armatrading (NJC) Gina wrote of Joan A. > The last album of Joan's I've listened to all the way through > was Hearts And Flowers from sometime in the early 90's, if memory serves. I've > lost track of anything since and it seems as if she's faded into the > woodwork or perhaps it's just, as you said, that she's being overlooked. Run, do not walk, to your nearest record store or keyboard and purchase 1995's "What's Inside." A beautiful and brilliant album, imho. Lori, who has been lucky enough to shake Joan's hand backstage in Austin, 1996 San Antonio ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:19:59 +0000 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: Re: Joni Mitchell on Vali Joni never recorded the song. Her live performance, circa 1967, is available on one of the tape trees. She played it for laughs. It was pseudo psychedia, and from what I can hear and remember, the lyrics are: Down in the garden Under a leaf she was smoking her (something) And she was looking at stardom Everything's bright as she draws on the pipe And the bowl glows redder Things look better Mars is a ruby Saturn is sapphire It burns with a blue fire Colors run through me Loose in my thinking They're flashing and blinking And always changing Rearranging Ballerina Valerie now Move me through your crimson dances (something) red bandana Bring me down your silver trances Down in the garden Under an oak she was drinking her Coke And she was looking at stardom Everything's bright as she draws on the pipe And the bowl glows redder Things go better with Coca Cola. > I have a CD of a live recording of Joni's where she sings a song > about someone named Vali. > character and song. Is it true--no one wrote back to comment? When > was the recording from and what song does Joni say is about "Vali?" > I wonder. Deb Messling ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 18:26:34 +0000 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: Re: joni songbook > includes many unreleased songs such as Winter Lady, Carnival in > Kenora, Melody in Your Name, Strawflower Me, Moon in the Mirroe, > Jeremy, Poor Sad Baby and Who Has Seen the Wind. > Has anyone ever heard these tunes? Indeed, good question! I have the songbook, but not being musical, I have no idea what these songs sound like, even though I once tried to pick out the notes on my old flutophone from fourth grade. If we ever do a second JMDL tape, maybe some folks could tackle these songs. I know we don't have the real tunings, but at least we'd have an inkling of the melodies. Deb Messling ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 20:15:51 EST From: MGVal@aol.com Subject: Re: joni songbook (NJC by now) In a message dated 99-03-28 18:23:10 EST, messling@enter.net writes: >even though I once tried to >pick out the notes on my old flutophone from fourth grade. Wow! Does this bring back memories! In 4th grade, the Belleville, New Jersey had all of the 4th grades learn music via the flutophone. My family life was pretty much devoid of all music and violin and flutohpone lessons were my first foray into it. MG - tripping down memory lane..... ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 99 19:07:02 -0700 From: Wally Breese Subject: Stuff Hi everyone, The soundtrack to a new film, A Walk On The Moon, produced by Dustin Hoffman and directed by Tony Goldwyn, features a myriad of classic songs and newly recorded tracks from the period in which the film is based- 1969. Songs such as "Wishin' And Hopin'" by Dusty Springfield, "White Bird" by It's A Beautiful Day, "Crimson & Clover" by Elijah Blue Allman + Cher (a new recording), "Ripple" by The Grateful Dead, and "Cactus Tree" by Joni Mitchell are included on this very interesting soundtrack. Here's the complete line-up: A Walk On The Moon: Original Soundtrack 1. Summertime - Big Brother & The Holding Company 2. Town Without Pity - Mandy Barnett 3. Wishin' And Hopin' - Dusty Springfield 4. Sally Go Round The Roses - Damnations TX 5. Helplessly Hoping - Taxi 6. Sunlight - The Youngbloods 7. Today - Jefferson Airplane 8. Embryonic Journey - Jefferson Airplane 9. Crystal Blue Persuasion - Morcheeba 10. Cactus Tree - Joni Mitchell 11. Ripple - Grateful Dead 12. No Matter What You Do - Mojave 3 13. Who Knows Where The Time Goes - Judy Collins 14. White Bird - It's A Beautiful Day 15. Follow - Richie Havens 16. Crimson & Clover - Elijah Blue Allman + Cher See a photo of the album cover at this address: (http://www.jonimitchell.com/upcoming2.html) - --------------- Starting tomorrow (Monday morning), I have another five day session of chemotherapy. I haven't mentioned my previous session, which was about a month ago, but it was a difficult time. I was more sick than I've ever been, and the ill period lasted a longer time, in fact, for more than a week after the session ended. I don't know how my body will react this time, but I'm really hoping for an easier time. The mental image that I'm trying to concentrate on is one of the poisons (chemo) flowing directly to what remains of the original tumour and to the numerous implants (tiny tumours) that are now lining my pelvis. The goal is to kill off the cancer cells with the chemo, and then have my regular healthy cells recover quickly from the session. If anyone else feels the urge to want to help, try concentrating on the same image that I am. Thanks, folks. Later, Wally Breese The Joni Mitchell Homepage http://www.JoniMitchell.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 19:50:58 -0800 From: Randy Remote Subject: Re: Audiophile Question Lisa Kowalski wrote: > Hey all you audiophile/engineer types! I have a question.I recently > bought a Miles Davis CD "Kind of Blue" and on the front of the CD it > says..The finest sound ever-newly mixed and 20-bit Remastered.What does > 20-bit Remastered mean? Can anyone out there in Audiophile Land explain > this to me(in laymans terms please as I am Audiophile challenged) > > Thanks! Lisa > It means greater resolution. You know how magazine photos are made up of lots of tiny dots? The 20 bit mastering uses more dots. Then they put it on a 16 bit CD anyway! That part I cannot explain. Anyway, it's good that they remastered it-it's one of the classic albums of all time. A little "Kind of Blue" trivia: You would think it was recorded just as you hear it, but in fact, the songs were edited down, the best solos left in. Read it awhile back in Mix, don't recall the source except that it was from someone who was involved in the recording. Did you know a typical classical recording can have up to 100 edits? They do the recording in bits and pieces to get the beginning, end, and tricky parts right. Or someone coughs. RR ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:41:32 +0800 (PST) From: Joseph Palis Subject: Joan Armatrading (NJC) On Sun, 28 Mar 1999 LRFye@aol.com wrote: > > Run, do not walk, to your nearest record store or keyboard and purchase 1995's > "What's Inside." A beautiful and brilliant album, imho. I agree 100% Lori. This album reminds me of an Ella Fitzgerald album (ELLA IN BERLIN) where everything's perfect... the sequence of songs, the choice of songs, the melodies... I particularly like Armatrading's "Recommend My Love". By the way, I read one magazine article that said that if Tracy Chapman's voice is cool, Armatrading's "cold". Is this a bitchy comment or meant to emphasize's Armatrading's cooler-than-Tracy's-cool voice? Joseph np: Everything But The Girl "Time After Time" ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V4 #133 ************************** There is now a JMDL tape trading list. Interested traders can get more details at http://www.jmdl.com/trading ------- The Song and Album Voting Booths are open again! Cast your votes by clicking the links at http://www.jmdl.com/gallery username: jimdle password: siquomb ------- Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?