From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V3 #473 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Thursday, November 12 1998 Volume 03 : Number 473 The Joni Tour Pages: http://www.jonimitchell.com/Tour98.html http://www.jmdl.com/articles/tour98.htm ------- JoniFest 1999 is coming! Reserve your spot with a $25 fee. Send a blank message to info-jonifest1999@jmdl.com for more info. ------- The Official 1998 Joni Mitchell Internet Community Shirts are available now. Go to http://www.jmdl.com/ for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Re: Atlanta Review [Bmcd@aol.com] Denver party for Joni [Bernadette Gallagher ] So much for the Chinese Cafe NJC [Bernadette Gallagher ] Re: Joni LPs [Dreamzvill@aol.com] Re: Celebration At Big Sur [Dreamzvill@aol.com] Re: Joni online ["Juerg Loeffler" ] Re: No NY, LA or other initials ["Deb Messling" ] Re: Request for Joni stories ["John M. Lind" ] Re: Request for Joni stories [IVPAUL42@aol.com] So Long/Farewell [mann@chicagonet.net] Happy Birthday Julie [Bill Dollinger ] Re: Meeting Joni ["Marsha" ] Re: Joni online ["Marsha" ] Clarifying Sour Grapes (a new recipe?) ["Kay Ashley" ] Joni's "break" [Mary Pitassi ] Re: So Long/Farewell [Ashara@aol.com] RE: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe [Michael Yarbrough ] Audio Tapetree request ["Leong, Dennis" ] To Meet or Not to Meet? ["Don Rowe" ] Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe (NJC) ["Marsha" ] Today in Joni History - November 12 [Today in Joni History ] A Joni for All Seasons ... ["Don Rowe" ] Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe ["Kakki" ] Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe ["Don Rowe" ] Re: .Joni's knitting story [Drewdix@aol.com] Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe -Reply [Mary Grace Valentinsson ] NJC:JMDL To The Rescue [catman ] PPV and 17mins of Videos [Chrishiun@aol.com] Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe [Mark Domyancich ] UPDATE ON THE EXAMINER MAGAZINE [MDESTE1@aol.com] RE: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni ["wallykai" ] RE: So Long/Farewell ["wallykai" ] RE: Request for Joni stories ["wallykai" ] Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni [IVPAUL42@aol.com] HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE [BMFD78C@prodigy.com (MRS MARILYN A BILLONE] Re: Joni online ["Juerg Loeffler" ] "Shadows and Light" video ["Chris A. Leavitt" ] Breaking the silence... [Bounced Message ] Re: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE ["Juerg Loeffler" ] Re: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE [IVPAUL42@aol.com] Both Sides Now ["Kakki" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 03:00:03 EST From: Bmcd@aol.com Subject: Re: Atlanta Review In a message dated 98-11-09 13:25:56 EST, you write: << She had more than one opportunity to shrug us off and leave, but she insisted on staying and chatting. She is so sensitive at how her audience responds to her during her concerts, I'd think she'd be thrilled to know that she is, indeed, adored. Terry >> Given the accounts from Detroit and Atlanta, I''m sure you're right. Let's throw her a party! How about Denver (it's halfway). Karen Mc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 01:01:41 -0800 (PST) From: Bernadette Gallagher Subject: Denver party for Joni Given the accounts from Detroit and Atlanta, I''m sure you're right. Let's throw her a party! How about Denver (it's halfway). Karen Mc I'm so there: Please make it in April/May ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 01:19:12 -0800 (PST) From: Bernadette Gallagher Subject: So much for the Chinese Cafe NJC Rippin' off the Indian land again. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 01:23:17 -0800 (PST) From: Bernadette Gallagher Subject: My previous post I just sent a really long html doc here and I'd like to apologize in advance. I realized as soon as I hit send that this is rude and outside protocol for NJC. My only defense is that I got carried away. I will try really hard never to do this again. My apologies. bern - There's a wide wide world of noble causes to discover. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:41:19 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni LPs J in Switzerland - We have a bunch of extra Joni on vinyl....I believe two copies of Court & Spark; one is a digital master recording. Will have to double check on other availabilities.... Reading mail in the middle of the night 'cause I can't sleep, Susan C. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:47:36 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: Re: Celebration At Big Sur Hello lovely people... I saw this movie when I was a kid - always remembering Joni's great performance. Haven't heard much mention of it...does anyone own a copy? Love, Susan C. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:48:49 +0100 From: "Juerg Loeffler" Subject: Re: Joni online Hi Marsha, >I just told Joni about our list and she wants my old computer >and those personal introductory lessons I offered on it's use last year. Wow, this is what i call exciting news!!! I just imagine Joni getting in touch with all the love and admiration that shines through the postings here. Not to speak from possible contributions she might make every once in a while ... - - Juerg - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 07:45:47 +0000 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: Re: No NY, LA or other initials > In a message dated 98-11-10 02:41:33 EST, Wally B wrote: > << Joni has canceled her upcoming > press and promotional appearances I'm hoping she will do another promo round when the memoirs come out. It would make sense to do the talk shows to promote a book. I love cats. They give the home a heartbeat. -- Joni Mitchell ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 08:14:21 -0500 From: "John M. Lind" Subject: Re: Request for Joni stories You wrote: >Could someone please relate the knitting story, and the story about her childhood friend Sharon Bell? Well, the knitting story is long, so I'll leave it to someone else or until I've watched the PPV again a few times to get it all down. This, however, is as much as I can remember about the the "Sharon" story. This is all from memory of course and not word acurate: "When I was growing up my best friend was a girl named Sharon Bell. My dream goal in life was to grow up and marry a farmer and Sharon wanted to be a singer. Then we got older and I went off to art school and Sharon stayed at home. I became a singer and Sharon got to marry the farmer!" There may have been a few more details. I can't recall them all. I'm overloaded with three memories from Saturday night. 1- The way she sounded when she realised she was being heckled, it was like something from a movie. She sounded child-like as if the taunting hit on a very strong childhood memory like being ridaculed in front of all the other kids. I could picture this little kid rising up inside and standing up for her. A little timid at first, the softer "I'm just as good as Bob" and then the stronger "...and your'e an idiot!" 2- Recognising the chords to "BSN" just before she stated to sing the first line.(major goosebumps) 3- The way she looked at me and shook my hand. John~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 08:41:18 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Request for Joni stories In a message dated 11/11/98 8:21:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, jml@amweaver.com writes: << "When I was growing up my best friend was a girl named Sharon Bell. (actually, I think she named two best friends, but I don't remember the other name) My dream goal in life was to marry a farmer and Sharon wanted to be a singer. In high school she would enter these singing competitions, and as her best friend I would dutifully accompany her. Sharon would always win the competitions. So the irony is that years later I became a singer and Sharon got to marry the farmer!" >> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 07:46:16 -0600 From: mann@chicagonet.net Subject: So Long/Farewell Julie, I'm going to miss reading your posts.......but as Kenny said I too know how much time consuming this can be....especially when one has small children...you don't want them to recognize the back of you quicker than they do your face!! Feel free to ICQ me anytime! Laura ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 08:46:59 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Dollinger Subject: Happy Birthday Julie I have to say one of the best parts of being on this list is meeting wonderful and interesting people such as Julie Webb. I certainly understand how one could need a break (but I strongly feel she will be back in good time). Meanwhile I will miss her wit, heart and insight. I had the good fortune to accompany Jules in the front row center seats we briefly occupied during the maryland show, and she and her husband Jon were gracious enough to loan me their camera so I could shoot some photos. Julie, best wishes for a happy birthday ("play that weird minor chord...") I know we will continue to "stay in touch" - after all, how else will I know what movies suck? later, bill ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:02:38 -0500 From: "Marsha" Subject: Re: Meeting Joni - -----Original Message----- From: Bmcd@aol.com To: docnurse@voy.net Date: Wednesday, November 11, 1998 2:57 AM Subject: Re: Meeting Joni >In a message dated 98-11-09 11:13:20 EST, Marsha wrote: > ><< So when all the negativistic and "I am so jealous" remarks trickle down >like >lead ballons on our little list here, >> > >I know I've been "guilty" of the I'm so envious feelings and comments. Try to >understand that's just a reaction and I think perfectly healthy to feel that >way. I'd rather just admit I feel envious, because I do!, than react in some >other way ( which I did recently) because I didn't feel I could say how >envious I felt. Karen, Most probably don't read every post that comes down the pike, especially when the thread goes on forever. But those of us who do and see repeated over and over again negativistic expressions of the kind that seem to be from individuals whose self-involvement interferes with their ability to empathize (and that means actually feeling good about someone's fortune, as well as feel badly about others' misforturnes), and I am not referrring to you or every person who writes they are jealous, but the the posts do add up and take on a wave of much more sad and depressive proportions than what is probably reality. Since I can balance the positive private posts that is fine for me, but as on a lot of discussion lists the negative comments made publicly over good fortune, a lot of times far out-number the positive "way to go" public mails. I like responding to the waves of negativistic sour grapes like I did, because after 18 months of sniffing those types of farts, a reminder that air freshener needs to be sprayed is another healthy response. Marsha now playing: For the Roses (air freshener) As great and so wonderful it is for any of us to meet joni in >such synchronistic ways, please understand that it's a genuine and longing >feeling to not be able to be part of this. I want so much to just meet joni >(have for so many years), however briefly, to actually say hello and shake her >hand (let alone have her put her hand on mine or around my shoulder), to tell >her briefly how much I admire her. I would tell her that for me, at 41, I see >her as a fabulous role model, and frankly I like seeing an "older" (how >ridiculous) woman so successful, so full of life and creativity. If I had the >resources and the time, believe me I would try and make it happen. I do >appreciate everyone's sharing their joni moments because at least I can live >it vicariously and I feel your happiness coming through. But I still want to >experience it myself. For now, I'll just have to crop a joni photo and a me >photo together ;~) > In short (now that I've said all this), please don't judge anyone for >feeling envious. Again, it's not an unhealthy emotion at all, especially if >allowed to express it without concern for backlash. > >P.S. A quick story to tell all of a mini jonifest WombQueen and I had before >she left Colorado. I was so giddy at seeing the CMIARS and NRH videos for the >first time ever. She just rocks out in that kitchen with her broom and her cat >;~D. I'd never seen any of them, except the excerpts on the VH-1 special. >Anyone out there know if copies are available and where? I've checked Twist >and Shout and Tower. I'm guessing if they ever were released they are now out >of distribution. (At least in America) >Yours in jonispirit, >Karen Mc > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:25:44 -0500 From: "Marsha" Subject: Re: Joni online - -----Original Message----- From: Juerg Loeffler To: Marsha ; joni@smoe.org Date: Wednesday, November 11, 1998 6:06 AM Subject: Re: Joni online >Hi Marsha, > >>I just told Joni about our list and she wants my old computer >>and those personal introductory lessons I offered on it's use last year. > >Wow, this is what i call exciting news!!! I just imagine Joni getting in >touch >with all the love and admiration that shines through the postings here. >Not to speak from possible contributions she might make every >once in a while ... I'm sorry, Juerg. I was only joking. Joni hasn't and probably won't ever grace our list. She is too smart to bombard her artistic senses with our kind of communication here. Marsha ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:18:48 -0500 From: "Kay Ashley" Subject: Clarifying Sour Grapes (a new recipe?) Regarding responses from Paul I, Terry and others to Chilihead's e-mail about To Meet Joni or Not To Meet Joni: please allow me to clarify. Chili and I were having a conversation at the Duane the Wonderful's apartment, and we were talking about, in light of all the recent Joni meetings, whether or not we'd want to meet her. I can't totally speak for Chili, but for me, I am not at all sure that I would want to meet her. This is not at all to denegrate the experiences of those who have met her. I think it's great! I mean, BRAVO and CONGRATULATIONS on all the efforts that paid off in a big way! All of you who've met her had a dream come true, and that is truly wonderful! And part of me IS envious. Yet most of me feels that FOR ME (and I think this is also what Chili feels, at least in part), perhaps it is not the healthiest thing to get that close to a hero who has held such a huge place in the parthenon of my subconscious. This is an especially poignant issue for me since I am a songwriter, pianist and guitarist, and Joni's music looms WAY too large in my creative mind; it is a constant struggle for me to find my own voice and not just crank out more Joni-esque songs. As an artist, it can be dangerous to admire someone else too much. So, I am not at all sure I would want to meet her. And I am not at all sure that she would want to meet me! ;-) (After all, she hates copy cats... even reluctant ones, I should think) Chili and I were just daydreaming, saying wouldn't it be great to be able to sit down and have a real, lengthy conversation -- not a brief encounter that is defined by the inherent inequality of a fan-star interaction. As I said, we were daydreaming -- we were fully cognizant of the high degree of unlikelyhood that this would ever occur. I think that the degree of nastiness which greeted Chili's post was way out of proportion to what he said. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I was detecting subtext from a couple of people implying that if you don't want to meet her, then you're not a real fan. And that's ridiculous. Everyone here has his/her own personal relationship with Joni and her music (totally unbeknownst to her, of course), and to judge degrees of "fandom" is just so asinine. In conclusion, were the opportunity to meet her dropped into my lap, I would certainly not pass it up. However, I don't see myself putting a tremendous effort into making it happen, such as the industrious Robbert and Marsha have. Absolutely no condescension or anything else negative implied here: they had a vision and they made it happen! This is what life is about! But it just isn't my vision, and it was upsetting to me to be marginally included in a diss-fest (Chili metioned his conversation with me in his post, so all the vitriol was directed at me, as well, I felt) just because I am not willing to hunt the woman down! OK, 'nuff said.... In the Great Ashara Tradition, Hugs, Kay ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:48:53 EST From: TheHotelNH@aol.com Subject: Rare Joni Recordings Hi everyone, I haven't seen this mentioned on the list. I'm kind of new, so I might have missed it. I was wondering if anyone has any rare Joni recordings, or concert recordings that they could trade for other things. I have a CD recorder, and some Tori Amos concert recordings. I don't know if trading is done over this list, but if anyone's interested, please e-mail me privately. Thanks, Chris Cochran (Birmingham, AL) "We'd dance and sing and be the only joy in town." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:57:23 -0500 (EST) From: John Rogalski Subject: NY Times 10 Nov 98 Health & Fitness Article Hello everyone, I'm a quiet new JMDLer -- a "digest" guy, actually. Being on digest I apologize if it turns out that this is old news when my next issue arrives....but there was an article in the NY Times Health and Fitness section 10 November 1998: "A First-Person Study of Polio's Painful Legacy" that mentions Joni. Referring to Dr. Nancy Frick, the article says "She had reported, too, with Dr. Bruno, that polio survivors -- Franklin D. Roosevelt, Itzhak Perlman, Joni Mitchell, Mia Farrow, Alan Alda and others -- were often, like her, hard-driving, Type-A personalities. "Of the 1,049 polio survivors Dr. Frick surveyed, 23 percent more were Type A on average than nondisabled control subjects. And the more driven the survivors were, the more post-polio symptoms they had. And from a third study, the two researchers concluded that these super-achieving survivors tended to be extremely sensitive to criticism, and fearful of failure." I want to thank Joni for giving so much of herself to us. I hope she rests up and I want to send good thoughts her way. Love, --John Paul. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 09:02:19 -0800 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Re: NY Times 10 Nov 98 Health & Fitness Article Thanks John. Very Interesting! Major Aaahaaaaa John Rogalski wrote: > there was an article in the NY Times Health and Fitness section 10 November > 1998: "A First-Person Study of Polio's Painful Legacy" that mentions Joni. (snip) > the two researchers concluded that these super-achieving survivors tended > to be extremely sensitive to criticism, and fearful of failure." -- Phyliss pward@lightspeed.net http://www.bodywise.com/consultants/bpward ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:05:49 EST From: Gellerray@aol.com Subject: Re: joni's sad song wait a minute--joni's "servant" painted her piano? what the hell is that? what color did she paint it? what is that? rg. whose favorite song on TI is also, most definetly, Sire of Sorrow. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:20:14 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni LPs Good morning Phyliss!!! Actually, my husband was head buyer for a chain of record stores here in the Central Coast area during the '80s. He got loads of comps and had a ton of fun, but the job didn't pay very well, so...he's trying to think of a way to get back into it in a more profitable way, and perhaps even link in what he's most experienced at now - graphics/printing/publishing. I did a series of fanzines in the late '70's through late '80's, did a lot of selling of music collectibles, and wrote articles and reviews on some of my favorite people. Sometimes I got free tickets to the shows this way, or got to meet the people who made the music! (Stevie Ray Vaughan, Chris Isaak, and Dave Edmunds, etc - great folks, all!) It was a great time! Great to hear about your PPVParty - wishin' I coulda been there....:) Love, Susan C. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:28:09 EST From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes (a new recipe?) Kay, Thank you for clarifying your points. However, I still have to say that the sour grapes I'm referring to can be seen in the piece below, from Chili's post: <> Everyone has his/her own idea of what Joni's work and personna means to them. I'm also a musician and artist, but meeting people I admire in those fields does nothing to change my perspective on my own work. I appreciate that it may for you. But what bothered me about the post was that there was no sharing of congrats to those who DID want and meet Joni. Instead there was the YUK comment. To me, that was sour grapy as hell. When people on this list have had good fortune, no matter what it is, I try to share my happiness with them. As Karen pointed out, a bit of envy is entirely normal and I totally accept that too. Heck, I'm envious that I couldn't meet Joni again in Atlanta! But I congratulated the lucky folks for their experience. Again, thank you for explaining your point of view. I'm sorry that your name got caught up in the whole thread. Terry ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:56:19 -0500 From: "Marsha" Subject: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe I am amused by the "meeting my idol might interfere with my muse and productivity as an artist" as a rationalization for not *wanting* to meet Joni Mitchell. That makes me wonder if her desire and pro-active behavior to meet Georgia O'Keeffe as she did years ago made Joni the lesser creator in her world of art....hmmm. Somehow I doubt it. Marsha, going for my first guitar lesson (a promise I made to myself as a reward for an epiphany happening, and yes, it is OK to wait to do it...all the more sweet as my finger tips throb and hurt) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 11:57:51 -0600 From: Mary Pitassi Subject: Joni's "break" I was also very glad to hear that Joni is planning to *take it easy* after putting so much into the recent tour--and really, the past eight months or so. I hope she enjoys the relaxing, restful, reinvigorating vacation she so richly deserves. Ironically, Wally's announcement came shortly after I read an article on post-polio syndrome in the New York Times yesterday. According to research done by a psychologist who is herself living with the syndrome, some polio survivors, including those diagnosed with PPS, tend to push themselves too hard, when rest and relaxation is really the key to maintaining one's energy and health. I'm happy that Joni appears to be putting her health first! Mary P. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 13:56:20 EST From: Ashara@aol.com Subject: Re: So Long/Farewell Julie, I bid you a sad farewell, as you have touched me with your stories, your entusiasm, and your energy. I have enjoyed the exchanges that you have so eloquently added on this wonderful list, and I will miss you. (Although, I *do* have your number!) You bravely stepped where no man or woman had gone before (Jonifest), and gave me the incentive to have a bunch of incredible strangers in my home, and for that, and much else, I thank you. I completely understand your need to have time for you and your family away from us, as I struggle with that on a daily basis. God bless us, but we *are* prolific on this list, and it takes *a lot* to even *try* to keep up! The very best to you, Julie, "may your dreams come true." Hugs, Ashara ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 14:29:00 -0500 From: Michael Yarbrough Subject: RE: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe <<>> It's not a rationalization, it's a reason. If you don't want people to make value judgments about your opinions on the issue, then don't make value judgments about their opinions on the issue either. I'm not an artist (unfortunately), but I don't particularly want to meet Joni either. If I had the good fortune to run into her in an elevator I would certainly thank her for sharing her work, and I've been more than forthcoming in my congratulations for those who have achieved something *they* *want*, but I don't feel at all strange for not wanting the same thing. Good luck with the guitar lessons... - --Michael NP: Sarah Vaughan, "My Funny Valentine" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 13:56:38 -0600 From: "Leong, Dennis" Subject: Audio Tapetree request Hello, I'm a newbie to JMDL and would like someone to make some audio tapes from the tapetree. In exchange, I would like to offer this list to choose from in exchange for time and trouble: VHS - Johnny Cash TV shows - Joni (circa 1967?) does two duets with Cash and solo numbers on piano,guitar,& dulcimer. I used to have an abysmal copy of this but now, I have a close to pristine copy. VHS - Wembley '83 concert via BBC VHS - "Good Friends" video from MTV VHS - Farm Aid 86/87 CAS - from Celebration at Big Sur soundtrack, 1969. Joni with CSNY doing Gino Vanelli's "Get Together" and Woodstock. CAS -Gerdes Folk Festival '67 CAS-U.of California/Berkeley '68,Greek Theatre with Odetta, Tom Paxton, & Herbie Hancock CAS-Hudson River Festival (lennie&Dom songs 73?) CAS-Troubador, Hollywood,CA '72 CAS-Finger Lakes,New York 1983 concert Part II with encore. This is the encore where Joni sings Marvin Gaye's "Heard it through the Grapevine". Just stunning. CAS - Tokyo '83 Joni concert,live radio broadcast I can supply audio on cassette, DAT, or CD-ROM. Best Wishes, Dennis dennis.leong@mcd.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:19:42 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: To Meet or Not to Meet? Well I've been battling a second cousin of flu for a couple of days, and I must say this whole issue around meeting/not meeting Joni has gotten me to thinking. And I suppose I just don't know ... Yes there's that part of me that would definitely go out of my way to meet Joni if I knew the odds were good. I'd like to let her know that her music has been a wonderful part of my life, thank her and offer encouragement for the future. No regrets, coyote. But honestly, I've got plenty of opportunities to make a fool of myself in everyday life without running into one of my idols. I can just see it, elevator doors open, there SHE is, and something comes out of my mouth like, "Joni Mitchell! Gee I hope I end up writing half as many good songs as your good songs." DOH! Anyway, you get the picture ... so the creative angst thing has its resonance. Of course the "quiet dinner conversation over drinks and smokes" is something I've filed away with "invulnerability", "immortality" and "winning the lottery" -- pure, delicious fantasy. So, I think it safe to say that we can all be good acolytes and true, whether or not we get an audience with Our Lady of Duality ... and am I a little green about the recent meetings? -- you bet, I can only console myself with the fact that I didn't get a chance to look like a troglodyte. :-) Don Rowe (just as jealous that you Atlanta folks got to hear "Song for Sharon" and we Chicago plebes did not ...) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 15:23:51 -0500 From: "Marsha" Subject: Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe (NJC) - -----Original Message----- From: Michael Yarbrough To: 'Joni' Date: Wednesday, November 11, 1998 2:37 PM Subject: RE: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe ><<my muse and productivity as an artist" as a rationalization for not >*wanting* to meet Joni Mitchell.>>> >It's not a rationalization, it's a reason. If you don't want people >to make value judgments about your opinions on the issue, then >don't make value judgments about their opinions on the issue >either. Michael. When it is in the context of a post of direct judgements initially, then I WILL answer in kind. And yes, I see it as a rationalization of a type of denial of certain feelings. And I think you are mischaracterizing the value judgement thingy....anyone is free to fart what they will here. It is an unmoderated list. I am free to be amused by rationalizations wrapped in negativistic threads that weave an ugly fabric here. >I'm not an artist (unfortunately), but I don't particularly want to >meet Joni either. If I had the good fortune to run into her in an >elevator I would certainly thank her for sharing her work, and >I've been more than forthcoming in my congratulations for those >who have achieved something *they* *want*, but I don't feel >at all strange for not wanting the same thing. Glad to know that. Glad to know you don't have a need to hop in with how jealous and envious you feel either...or even with veiled "I wouldn't want that for me because (fill in the blank with negative whatever)"-isms either. >Good luck with the guitar lessons... Thanks, BTW, a question for our guitarists out here. Is 50.00 per month for 4 half hour sessions a reasonable fee for a beginner? Once they meet me and want to charge double, because of my Den Mother behaviors and resistance to cutting fingernails...I want to think I am getting a bargain.....HA! Marsha ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:51:00 +0000 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 12 1994: Turbulent Indigo debuts at its #47 peak on the US charts. - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:47:10 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: A Joni for All Seasons ... Yes, this will be fun, and there are a great many albums of Joni's that for me, fit a season -- or at least that get played more at certain changes of the seasons that they do otherwise. It runs for me like this - -- Spring Court and Spark Wild Things Run Fast Hejira Summer Night Ride Home Dog Eat Dog Hissing of Summer Lawns (big surpirse!) Don Juan's Reckless Daughter Ladies of the Canyon Hejira Fall Turbulent Indigo Chalk Mark in a Rainstorm Blue Mingus Hejira Winter Turbulent Indigo Taming the Tiger (at least I think it'll fit in here, what with "Facelift" and "My Best to You" ...) For the Roses Hejira Don Rowe ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:56:04 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe Finally reading the story of Joni's attempts at meeting her *own* idol, O'Keeffe, took away a large amount of my guilty embarrassment at wanting to meet Joni myself someday. I just love the story. For those who don't know it - basically Joni got a friend to go with her to Santa Fe, N.M. with the sole quest of meeting O'Keeffe. Joni brought several little gifts she wanted to give O'Keeffe and also bought a few more in Santa Fe. She and her friend drove up to O'Keeffe's house one night and actually lurked guiltily around the property. Joni could not get up her nerve to knock on the door and so just left her basket of gifts with a note. Then she and the friend walked around the side of the house and peered in a window! Suddenly they saw O'Keeffe staring back with an angry expression on her face. They were busted and hightailed it out of there. Joni was feeling mortified. But then a few weeks later she read an interview where O'Keeffe was asked what she would want to come back as, if reincarnation existed. O'Keeffe answered something to the effect of "I would want to come back as a beautiful woman with long blond hair who could sing like a bird." I bet Joni had great taste in picking out those gifts ;-) Oh, and they also later actually became friends. Kakki NP: Van live in San Jose (WOW) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 13:21:36 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe >From: "Kakki" > O'Keeffe was asked what she would want to come >back as, if reincarnation existed. O'Keeffe answered something to the >effect of "I would want to come back as a beautiful woman with long blond >hair who could sing like a bird." I bet Joni had great taste in picking out >those gifts ;-) Oh, and they also later actually became friends. > So I, at least, should look forward to Joni answer something like, "I would want to come back as some skinny brunette guy with modified goatee who sings like frog." Hmmm ... just doesn't quite have the same -- je ne sais quio ... ;-) Don Rowe ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 16:52:10 EST From: Drewdix@aol.com Subject: Re: .Joni's knitting story I thought this story was absolutely breathtaking--because she told it soooo well, and, (as the Orange Haired Lady described "paradise)", the telling of it was so VIVID--I imagined the village and the cottage and her mood, and what the room looked like, what Joni was wearing (and wasn't), the glass of gin, even the invisible husband to whom the OHL remarked about the stars. I mean, there's a real storyelling gift there folks (gee, wonder where that comes from?),--with her timing, pauses, rhythm..it was truly a poem: I think it centered around the generation gulf between Joni and the OHL; the Summer of Love breaking up , (what a profound time for her); their difference of opinion in re the colors of paradise. Joni declined to join the older woman, but it wasn't bitter or a stereotypically 60s "us against them" reaction-- and the OHL's remark about the stars was timeless and youthful and poetic; perhaps Joni's milepost of moving past the "don't trust anyone over 30" philosophy. A coming together, and a moving on. I loved it. One of my favorite Joni moments. She told it so damn well. - --DD ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 14:07:17 -0800 From: Mary Grace Valentinsson Subject: Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe -Reply >>> "Kakki" 11/11/98 12:56pm >>> ==snip, snip, snip the Meet O'Keefe storry===== Thanks for passing that on. I knew the first part and believe that Warren Beatty was her travelling companion. I did not know the last part which adds a nice touch. MG ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 17:17:42 EST From: MHart16164@aol.com Subject: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni I agree with you and obviously Chili to a large degree. I was one of the first people to say that I was jealous of those that got to meet Joni. I was thrilled for them because the accounts related made it obvious what an impact meeting JM had on them. I felt as though I had shared their joy. I have never tried to go out of my way to meet her. Most likely because I, like you, would want a conversation that went beyond fan/star. Also, I wouldn't want to say anything trite or stupid (I find myself thinking the same thing when I go to send an email to the list) for fear of making a complete fool of myself. But, whether you travel the breadth of extremity or stick to some straighter line... it's all good. we all love JM sour grapes and all because happiness is the best facelift!!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 18:06:42 EST From: Gellerray@aol.com Subject: query--joni & the metaphysicals i was just wondering if anyone ever read the piece i once did eons ago about joni where the writer--maybe it was ellen willis?--compared her to the metaphysical poets? it was, i believe, a review of blue and was published in the Village Voice I believe. And if so--if anyone knows or remembers--is it on wally's page? no, i think not. and i should just go to a library and look for it, the old fashioned way. right? but does anyone remember? i have a class you see and we are studying them and my teacher, whom i love because he is passionate about these thought to be musty old boys, saw me with two cds the other day and asked me whose they were. When I flashed them around, there was joni floating over a wintry highway, cigarette in hand. and he seemed interested. and i said yeah--i was going to mention her to you anyway the other day because i once read a review which compared her work the the meta...blah blah blah. Anything to spread the word. ray ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 15:27:27 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Rock'n'Roll Dulcimer (NJC) Hello All! I just heard through the dulcimer grapevine that the dulcimer on which Brian Jones played "Lady Jane" (there's a photo of him, and it, on the Tinker website under "Other Resources") is in the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame in Cleveland. Way cool! I think the Folk Alliance conference is in Cleveland in 2000, so I'll have a chance to visit. No Joni content, but I'm pretty excited about it, and had to share.... ############################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://members.aol.com/tinkersown/home.html "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 23:30:31 +0000 From: catman Subject: NJC:JMDL To The Rescue Wow! This JMDL thing really does surprise me all the time. Not just cos it helped me find myself. I asked a question the other day about gastritis and got the answers I needed. I believe this really helped me and may have saved me too. because of what i read i felt my gp hadn't been too good to me. No explanation, no diet advice or anything. So I was suffering pain and fear. Anyway, today whilst i was in the bank I had a huge chest pain. I went off to the nearest Causualty. There i found that my heart is OKAY! but I have an ulcer!!!! Phew! at least I know what is wrong and that my heart is fine. I would not have done this but for the info some kind hearted souls sent me. Who's have thought it? Not only is the JMDL the best shrink but a medic too! Thanks everyone. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 18:51:11 EST From: Chrishiun@aol.com Subject: PPV and 17mins of Videos Did anyone's Pay Per View Channel show the 17mins of videos, Good Friends, My Secret Place, How Do You Stop and Shiny Toys after the PPV special. I heard a rumour this was to be shown also? Just wondering if anyone got to see that. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 18:50:57 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni In a message dated 11/11/98 5:23:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, MHart16164@aol.com writes: << I was thrilled for them because the accounts related made it obvious what an impact meeting JM had on them. >> I'm not sure what affect (not "impact," by the way) meeting Joni has had on me. I was hoping that meeting me and others who tell her of the important affects she has had on our lives had a positive affect on Joni. While I doubt that anything I said would have buoyed her significantly, I think the sum total of the positive feedback she has received from myself and many others has helped her muddle through this past tour and maintain her positive outlook to the point that she told me she is planning another tour and looking forward to it. I did not seek to meet her for selfish reasons, to unburden myself or make a closer connection with my muse or anything like that. Maybe others did, but I think most of us who have wanted to meet her did so for reasons like mine -- so I could be one more person among many who would try to tell her how what she has accomplished, learned and shared in her life has helped me somewhere along the way. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 18:02:19 -0600 From: Mark Domyancich Subject: Re: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe Good luck learning some Joni tunes! There is an incredible feeling you get when you play Joni's songs! NP-DJRD, very suitable for this season (Those two baldheaded in November...). Too bad we've already had our first snow... At 12:56 PM -0500 11/11/98, Marsha wrote: >going for my first guitar lesson (a promise I made >to myself as a reward for an epiphany happening, and yes, >it is OK to wait to do it...all the more sweet as my finger tips >throb and hurt) ___________________________________ | Mark Domyancich | | Harpua@revealed.net | | http://home.revealed.net/Harpua | | http://www.jmdl.com/guitar/mark | |_________________________________| ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 20:32:00 EST From: MDESTE1@aol.com Subject: UPDATE ON THE EXAMINER MAGAZINE I was able to send out the copies of the examiner magazine (Joni issue) to all those who requested a copy, today. If you sent me your address and the address was correct you should be receiving your copy soon via snailmail. I did get a couple who asked me if I had any extra copies but they didnt give me their address when they asked me. If they got back to me right away, then theirs was one of those I sent out. As it turns out the Examiner sent me two extra copies so I have two remaining. marian, yours will take longer to get out because Im copying the Turbulent Indigo songbook to go with it. Some in your letters are asking me what I want or how much money they should send for reimbursement. My answer is nothing. Enjoy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 23:58:34 -0300 From: "wallykai" Subject: RE: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni - -----Original Message----- De: IVPAUL42@aol.com Para: MHart16164@aol.com ; joni@smoe.org CC: Kay_Ashley@ars.aon.com Fecha: miércoles 11 de noviembre de 1998 17:57 Asunto: Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni >In a message dated 11/11/98 5:23:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, >MHart16164@aol.com writes: > ><< I was > thrilled for them because the accounts related made it obvious what an impact > meeting JM had on them. >> > >I'm not sure what affect (not "impact," by the way) "effect" not "affect", by the way WallyK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:15:18 -0300 From: "wallykai" Subject: RE: Joni meets Georgia O'Keeffe njc >> >So I, at least, should look forward to Joni answer something like, "I >would want to come back as some skinny brunette guy with modified goatee >who sings like frog." > >Hmmm ... just doesn't quite have the same -- je ne sais quio ... ;-) > >Don Rowe Don, what's a modified goatee? WallyK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:19:28 -0300 From: "wallykai" Subject: Marsha's lessons njc - ->Thanks, BTW, a question for our guitarists >out here. Is 50.00 per month for 4 half hour >sessions a reasonable fee for a beginner? > >Marsha > Marsha! Be grateful! In Argentina you'd pay $60 for the half hour only! WallyK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:27:40 -0300 From: "wallykai" Subject: RE: So Long/Farewell Julie, I hope I'm not too late to say how much I've always admired your leadership and imagination. The list will certainly not be the same without you. But I know the need to move on myself and I wish you the best. I'll miss your all your Scorpionhood and your humor. Love, WallyK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:30:52 -0300 From: "wallykai" Subject: RE: Request for Joni stories What's all this knitting story about? We don't get PPV here. WallyK ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:40:47 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Clarifying Sour Grapes/Meeting Joni In a message dated 11/11/98 9:58:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, Wallykai@interserver.com.ar writes: << "effect" not "affect", by the way WallyK >> you are correct, sir. thank you. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 22:57:44, -0500 From: BMFD78C@prodigy.com (MRS MARILYN A BILLONE) Subject: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE It's now been 9 months since I became a member of the JMDL. I FINALLY have drawn up the courage to write on this thing. Call it a birth...an announcement: I have been identifying with all of you-- your thoughts and feelings on Joni--from Day 1. What made me "come out" today? I JUST finished watching her PPV event that I recorded last night. Need I say more? Well, maybe I will...Joni is one incredible woman, where words are weak to describe what we feel when we see, hear, and feel her creating her art. So I will not even attempt it; you all know what I'm talking about. I do have a few questions for all you JM experts: (1) Did Joni actually spend the time having the audience's furniture arranged on her incredible set? (2) How many of you were actually there? (3) Do you think this is Joni's "LAST" gig for the public? (4) When did Joni start smoking (cigarettes) again? (5) Finally, what color are Joni's eyes? Thanks for listening, and, hopefully, sharing. Hope to visit more often, now that I've broken through the ice! Marilyn (B.) CC: BMFD78C ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 05:15:54 +0100 From: "Juerg Loeffler" Subject: Re: Joni online Hi Marsha, >I was only joking. Joni hasn't and probably won't >ever grace our list. She is too smart to bombard her >artistic senses with our kind of communication here. It was a nice idea anyway ;-) Take care - - Juerg - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 20:29:21 -0800 From: "Chris A. Leavitt" Subject: "Shadows and Light" video Hello all, Does anyone know where I can obtain a copy of the "Shadows and Light" video in NTSC format? Thanks, Chris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:33:03 -0700 From: Bounced Message Subject: Breaking the silence... From: "Russ L." Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 23:22:58 -0500 Hey everyone... Inspired by Marilyn's "coming out"... I'll jump out as well. My name's Russ Lane/MythicalC for Instant Messaging folks, I'm 19 attending university at UNC-Chapel Hill in North Carolina. Joni has always been in my life (although as much as I like her I won't listen to Both Sides Now of Big Yellow taxi... bad memories of the family station wagon :-) ), but I didn't become I fan on my own until Turb. Indigo. Now I'm hooked. I've owned quite a bit of Joni over the 4(!) years I've been a fan, but my favs still have to be the apply named Hejira, TI, and of course Blue. "A Case of You" is my life in microcosm, but "Black Crow" was adopted into my philosophy...y'know, "in search of love and music/my whole life has been" The question I would like to pose is this... One of my favourite interviews form J came from Details, the one when she talked about "simpleminded Americans" not appreciating Jazz. I'm taking some Jazz classes now and I'm wondering what albums Joni has recommended, or albums you think deserving of a listen. I have most of the classics but it's hard to be a connoisseur in the genre when so much is out there. BTW, I hope you all have heard Cassandra Wilson's excellent reading of "Black Crow"... I'm not exaggerating when I say it is on par with the original. Anyway, I'm glad to be here with fellow Joni fans in what I hope proves to be a great experience! Take care, Russ Lane/MythicalC ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 05:36:26 +0100 From: "Juerg Loeffler" Subject: Re: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE Hi Marilyn, >(4) When did Joni start smoking (cigarettes) again? This is what Joni says (on Wally's Page "Childhood days 1943-64"): "I started smoking at the age of nine. I had polio, and when I got out of the hospital, I kind made of a pact with my Christmas tree, or maybe it was God, that if I could get my legs back... At that time I'd broken away from the church because I loved stories, and they had a lot of loopholes, and, if you asked the teacher about those loopholes, like, O.K., Adam und Eve meet, there the first man and woman, and they have two sons: Cain and Abel. Cain killed Abel, then Cain got married. Who did he marry? It did not go over well. So I refused to go to church in the town for awhile. But I had this debt to go back because I did stand up, unfurl, and walk. So I joined the church choir and one night after choir practice, in the middle of the winter, a girl had snitched a pack of Black Cat cork from her mother and we all sat in the wintery fish pond in the snow, and passed them around. And you know, some girls choked and some threw up, and I took one puff and felt really smart! I mean I just thought, "Woah!" My head cleared. I seemed to see better and think better. So I was a smoker from that day on. Secretly, covertly, and I'm still smoking." - - Juerg - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 20:33:14 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE Hi Marilyn B, Welcome in from Lurkland! You asked: >(1) Did Joni actually spend the time having the audience's furniture >arranged on her incredible set? Maybe a little. It was very well done. >(2) How many of you were actually there? JMDL'ers present were Wally, Don, Les, Mariana, Marsha, Phyliss/Bob, Jill, Steve, Ken, SteveJ, Leslie, SteveM, Catherine, Pearl, Mary Ann, Me, and also SkinDeep/Waltzenfree said he was there. Maybe 18 of us. I hope I'm not forgeting anyone. >(3) Do you think this is Joni's "LAST" gig for the public? I hope not! >(4) When did Joni start smoking (cigarettes) again? She never stopped. >(5) Finally, what color are Joni's eyes? The eyes I recall were a very twinkling sapphire blue. Kakki NP: CPR - Morrison ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:02:30 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: HELLO TO ALL--FIRST TIME HERE In a message dated 11/11/98 11:03:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, BMFD78C@prodigy.com writes: << (3) Do you think this is Joni's "LAST" gig for the public? After completing her recent tour, Joni had agreed to tape a Storytellers show for VH-1, but that was canceled (hopefully postponed) this week so she could rest. (4) When did Joni start smoking (cigarettes) again? When had she quit? Paul I >> ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 21:05:26 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Both Sides Now With all the avalanche of Joni concert and meeting information recently, it has taken a little time for some details to truly sink it amongst all the "wows!" Today at work it finally really hit me that she actually sang Both Sides Now as the last song of the tour in Atlanta. I tried to imagine being there hearing it. It really must have been just a mindblower to all who witnessed it. I'm dearly hoping a tape of this will emerge somehow, somewhere for a future tape tree. It just seems so priceless. Kakki ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V3 #473 ************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. 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