From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V3 #457 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Tuesday, November 3 1998 Volume 03 : Number 457 The Joni Tour Pages: http://www.jonimitchell.com/Tour98.html http://www.jmdl.com/articles/tour98.htm ------- Join the concert meet and greet lists by sending a message to any of these addresses: -Syracuse@jmdl.com Rochester@jmdl.com CollegePark@jmdl.com -NewYork@jmdl.com Kanata@jmdl.com Atlanta@jmdl.com ------- JoniFest 1999 is coming! Reserve your spot with a $25 fee. Send a blank message to info-jonifest1999@jmdl.com for more info. ------- The Official 1998 Joni Mitchell Internet Community Shirts are available now. Go to http://www.jmdl.com/ for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- Detroit concert [Num1JwlFan@aol.com] finding a jmdl'er in an unexpected place NJC [Howard Motyl ] Joni in concert(s) [Howard Motyl ] Power and Sex ["John Villasana" ] Re: Walter Raleigh and Chris columbus ["John Villasana" ] Great review in NY Times! [DSK11 ] Re: smoking on stage (JC) [Scott and Jody ] Re: smoking on stage ["Eric Taylor" ] Tribute [Mark-Leon Thorne ] Re: Chicago Concert - Joni [Susan Chaloner ] Re: Review Of Gershwin's World (SJC) [Susan Chaloner ] Re: Great review in NY Times! [Susan Chaloner ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 21:37:02 EST From: Num1JwlFan@aol.com Subject: Detroit concert Hi, my name is Jenny and my friend attended the Mitchell/Dylan concert in Detroit, but she only got to hear the first two song's by Joni and none by Bob Dylan b/c she got sick and had to go home. For Christmas, if possible, I would like to get her a bootleg on CD or tape of that concert, or if not that specific one, any on the tour. If anyone could help me out, that would be great. Thank you so much! - -Jenny ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 20:37:13 -0600 From: Howard Motyl Subject: finding a jmdl'er in an unexpected place NJC A colleague handed me a photocopy of a page from Library Journal of video reviews. A tape I had made (Image of an Assassination) was reviewed. I was looking at the other reviews and one was written by a Gerald A. Nataro, and I paused as I read it. Then, I read it again, and again. And I said to myself, hey, that is Jerry. Nice company, I thought, on this page in Library Journal. And we are everywhere, I thought. Howard M "Anytime you have the opportunity to accomplish something and you don't, you are wasting your time on this earth." Roberto Clemente ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 20:43:20 -0600 From: Howard Motyl Subject: RE: Smoking on Stage From: catman Subject: Re: smoking on stage I agree smooking is a disgusting addiction. And I am hooked. But imagine: A tanned burnt blonde hunky farmer leaning against a fence smoking his fag in the hot sun, sweat pouring down his chest and forhead. Sorry i think that is sexy. No, honey! That's sexxy! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 20:55:08 -0600 From: Howard Motyl Subject: Joni in concert(s) I was reading yet another review of a JM show--and I should say another rave review--and it struck me that we who have seen her perform live are all agreeing. We thought her performance was amazing. No one is complaining about a thing she did. Everything she did/sang/played was great. We have been arguing/debating/fighting over TTT becuz some people like it, others hate it, still others adore it. WE even bicker about other albums or songs. But on these, her recent performances, especially on this latest tour, we all agree--she gave a fucking amazing performance. She transcended and gave all of us--especially those who have been waiting to see her live since we started listening to her--the concert time of our lives. May she give us many more. Howard M ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 21:16:04 -0600 From: "John Villasana" Subject: Power and Sex Mary Grace said: Since harassment has more to do with power than sex. I've never quite understood this arguement. I've allways understood power and sex to be pretty much inseparable. I can attest to this. It is indeed stimulating, and distracting to work with a beautiful woman who is dressed very sensually. The power is all hers however. John Villasana San Antonio TX ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 21:20:25 -0600 From: "John Villasana" Subject: Re: Walter Raleigh and Chris columbus David Said: In HOSL and DJRD, Joni touches on some of the whole ideologies underlying our society -- in her more recent songs, she often stays on the surface. This is a great point. I sometimes wonder if Joni was scared away from her deeper leanings, as this is when she has reported feeling that she lost her radio support. John Villasana San Antonio TX ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 22:21:29 EST From: DKasc13293@aol.com Subject: Fwd: MSG.NYC.11.1.98 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --part0_910063290_boundary Content-ID: <0_910063290@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 98-11-02 19:15:29 EST, DKasc13293 writes: << Wally, I need time, so busy here. The official setlist report: Big Yellow Taxi Just Like This Train Night Ride Home Crazy Cries of Love Harry's House Black Crow Amelia Hejira Don Juan's Reckless Daughter Face lift Sex Kills The Magdalene Laundries Trouble Man Coves Love Woodstock >> - --part0_910063290_boundary Content-ID: <0_910063290@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline From: DKasc13293@aol.com Return-path: To: wallyb@pacbell.net Subject: Re: MSG.NYC.11.1.98 Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 19:15:29 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Wally, I need time, so busy here. The official setlist report: Big Yellow Taxi Just Like This Train Night Ride Home Crazy Cries of Love Harry's House Black Crow Amelia Hejira Don Juan's Reckless Daughter Face lift Sex Kills The Magdalene Laundries Trouble Man Coves Love Woodstock - --part0_910063290_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 22:22:15 EST From: DKasc13293@aol.com Subject: Re: MSG.NYC.11.1.98 The most distinctive difference from this performance to the shows on the west coast was the excellect form of Joni's voice. It was the voice on Miles of Aisles. It was brilliant, feminine and strong. Her attire, Issey M. deep red velvet pants suit with bamboo geaufrasch, silver strapped shoes, Curl and teased up kind of hair, reminiscent of the insert photo from Miles of Aisles. She was more "dressed up" than LA. The set list, consistent with all previous shows, included the grooved rendition of DRJD. This seemed to have all the Joniphiles in the audience, and there were many, swaying as a community. Madison Square Garden doing a Joni "wave" as it were. By this time, midway into the set, everyone was singing the words aloud! I guess, what I feel is most successful and memorable about this particular show, was the opportunity afforded me by Wally Breese to personally thank Joni Mitchell. I was given the standard indoctrination of, "don't get star struck, and forget you're there in a professional capacity." I didn't forget that, but since I was able to stand there grinning like a fool, Joni spotted my wide eye open stare. I knew that she was aware of me. Behaving, I did not want to distract her. I shot mostly Chris Botti and Larry Klein, difficult as it was given their position on stage and the poor light source. Continued to shoot and shoot, moving back and forth, aware of the compositions I was creating within my rectangular frame. I let her play, then beamed appreciation after each song. Typical ardent admiration. At the conclusion of NRH it was time to leave the "pit". I stopped dead center of the mic and said, "Thank you, thank you soooooooo very much". She leaned and began to walk toward me smiling. Klein had overheard me and was smiling too. Checking herself, she said "This is a union stadium, so I'd just better play." I thought, well that's more than fine by me. Now that I recall, the only real talking during the whole set, was the introduction to the Magdelene Laundries. So with that sentiment and knowledge that there were some very appreciative fans present, Joni gave a performance so moving and giving. The energy level was very high. The band, tighter than LA. The sound system more than adequate. Thank you Wally, Duane The NYC crowd was also extremely responsive and receptive. No one at all out of line. Major applause for each and every song. >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 04:49:35 +0100 From: "Juerg Loeffler" Subject: Re: Nietzsche perspectives (SJC) Salut Winfried, >Nietzsche, a big fan of Richard Wagner's operas, And in his late years also the biggest enemy ("Nietzsche kontra Wagner"). >also said "Without music, live would be a mistake". Maybe that's what Joni >likes about him! I think you got the point here with Joni. Why does someone get stuck with an author? You cannot tell. It's beyond the content of the writings. Those just serve as a trigger to get "in touch". Nietzsche has a musical soul with this extraordinary gift (or punishment) of deep psychological insights and the power of putting them into vivid words. I feel similarities here. Both, Nietzsche and Joni are dionysan types, they dance and sing, and they are dedicated to life itself, not any substitutes of it, willing to suffer in order to stay sensitive. >Winfried, who BTW also gets stomach cramps from listening to Wagner music To loosen the cramps try the homeopathic way: listen to Wagners "Siegfried Idyll". The most peaceful music i know. There's this wonderful recording with members of the Toronto Symphony Orchestra directed by Glenn Gould. It's his last recording (July 1982), and the first one as a conductor. Not from this world. Ciao Winfried - - Juerg - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 23:02:09 EST From: Denisongs@aol.com Subject: Re: smoking on stage (NJC) In a message dated 98-11-02 17:46:03 EST, you write: << Just for the sake of discussion, if cigarettes were NOT a "nicotine delivery system" and were NOT addictive or harmful in any way, would you or would you not find the act of smoking sexy? >> It is hard for me to separate this out. It is also hard for me to forget how unsexy it is to kiss a smoker or to smell it in your hair and on your skin. To me, it is a turn off. I think the idea of it can be sexy, but not the reality. It is empty and powerful advertising............Denise ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 00:15:07 EST From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Review Of Gershwin's World (SJC) Jazzman's Gershwin tribute is full of silliness and genius November 1, 1998 BY MARK STRYKER Free Press Music Critic In the liner notes accompanying Herbie Hancock's tribute to George Gershwin, Hancock says he's less interested these days in making records than "making events." "Gershwin's World" certainly qualifies. 'Gershwin's World' out of 4 stars Herbie Hancock (Verve) With guests ranging from Joni Mitchell and Stevie Wonder to Kathleen Battle and the Orpheus Chamber Orchestra, Hancock celebrates the 100th anniversary of Gershwin's birth with an ambitious exploration of his legacy. Not only, for example, does Hancock dress up "Here Comes De Honey Man" in zephyr-like textures and African rhythms but the pianist also reinvents music that spins on an axis parallel to Gershwin: the jazz-tinged second movement of Ravel's G Major Piano Concerto, the spunky Harlem stride of James P. Johnson's "Blueberry Rhyme." So who could ask for anything more? Well, anyone who thinks, as I do, that Hancock remains potentially our greatest living jazz pianist. Hancock aims for the Big Statement here, but he's betrayed by unsatisfying contributions from his guest stars and several ideas that look intriguing on paper but never deliver the goods. The tyranny of the overproduced jazz record strikes again. **Mitchell simply sounds silly aping late-period Billie Holiday on "The Man I Love," with her wobbly vibrato, piercing vowels and hiccup accents. Hancock, on organ and piano, disappears into pop-soul oblivion on W.C. Handy's "St. Louis Blues" behind Wonder's harmonica and vocal. There are, to be sure, several delights. The offhanded genius of Wayne Shorter's tenor obbligato, solo and delicate interplay with Hancock redeems "The Man I Love." Hancock and Chick Corea spar rambunctiously on "Blueberry Rhyme." Yet Hancock and producer Robert Sadin seem so committed to a revolving cast and a self-conscious effort to twist Gershwin's legacy into a postmodern pretzel that they've forgotten that Hancock's greatest gifts are his sophisticated improvising and innovative compositional voice. What do I want? Just Hancock surrounded by a group of musical peers playing their own music and perhaps a standard or two for contrast. Hancock may not think so, but that would be an event. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 21:07:17 -0800 From: "Kakki" Subject: Re: MSG.NYC.11.1.98 Duane wrote: > The most distinctive difference from this performance to the shows on the >west coast was the excellect form of Joni's voice >She was more "dressed up" than LA. >The band, tighter than LA. Oh Duane ;-( ...you are wounding some of us out here with such "regionalism." Remember, we got the end-of-West Coast-tour, sick, sneezing, coughing, allergic, tired, beset with mean reviews Joni in LA and she was still pretty amazing in spite of all that! Kakki ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 00:49:12 -0400 From: DSK11 Subject: Great review in NY Times! November 3, 1998 Pop Review: Mitchell and Dylan Among Friends By BEN RATLIFF NEW YORK -- Bob Dylan is at that stage of cuddly sainthood that Jerry Garcia reached in the 1980s: When he's having fun, the audience is having fun. Dylan looked modestly happy as he surveyed the Madison Square Garden audience through his deeply sunken eyes on Sunday night, and he talked to the crowd a little more than usual. He dug extensively into his lead-guitar playing, his recent ploy to change his group sound, and he danced gingerly, with self-conscious awkwardness, like an eccentric grandfather doing his impression of Chuck Berry to entertain children. It was a well-received performance, but uninspired. Dylan's greatest-hits set, part of a short double-feature tour that pairs him with Joni Mitchell, too often had the innocuous groove of a Grateful Dead sound-alike band. You know you're in a pretty bland zone when the mentioning of New York City in a lyric (as Dylan did in "Just Like Tom Thumb's Blues") supplies the set's greatest crowd thrill. With the exception of three clearly enunciated songs -- his new "Love Sick"; a Charles Aznavour ballad, "The Times We Have Known," and a truly rehydrated version of "Blowin' in the Wind" that marked the set's best moment -- Dylan's delivery was characteristically bizarre. He ran together several lines in single breath, came close to rapping at times, and generally sounded as if he could be singing in any language. "I usually play these songs all by myself," he said, as he introduced the Aznavour. "But I feel all by myself now." If only he could have better projected that feeling. His latest album, "Time Out of Mind" (Columbia), uses a band that hangs several sizes too loose on him; the album portrays him effectively as a solitary, grief-wasted figure. Here, still with his castaway's croak and wheeze, he played the gregarious rocker, and it undermined his peculiar eminence. Besides providing a clunky, punky counterweight to the second guitarist Larry Campbell's session-musician proficiency, Dylan's amateur lead-guitar playing just tried one's patience. Ms. Mitchell satisfied the full range of her audience, playing what was mostly a fan's set with tremendous communicative clarity. She began with "Big Yellow Taxi," which Janet Jackson bowdlerized last year for her own hit. Ms. Mitchell's encore was a revamped "Woodstock." But between those warhorses, she performed some of her loveliest lesser-known work: "Hejira," "Amelia," "Harry's House," "Don Juan's Reckless Daughter," "The Magdalene Laundries." The songs emphasized Ms. Mitchell's brilliance with harmony. What one remembers most in her performances is the total arrangement, with her voice as the most important instrument. She was pushed by her rhythm section -- drummer Brian Blade, whose fills gave minute attention to the curves of the work, and bassist Larry Klein - -- as well a steel-guitar player and a trumpeter who mostly got out of the way of her harmony and lent the music lush surfaces. In the middle was Ms. Mitchell with her guitar, which she sometimes just strummed but more often played orchestrally, letting bass notes ring over her teasing of idiosyncratically tuned strings. Most of the performance lit up familiar strengths, but what audiences have learned recently is how good a jazz singer Ms. Mitchell can be. Putting down her guitar and lighting a cigarette, she turned to a plainer style to sing "Comes Love," made famous by Billie Holiday. Without the sudden rushes of phrasing and Ms. Mitchell's signature chords wrapped around it, the song made the most of her natural voice, its bright, cutting vowels and its new depths, a gift of age. It took her into a completely new context. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 23:47:51 -0600 From: Scott and Jody Subject: Re: smoking on stage (JC) Denisongs@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-11-02 17:46:03 EST, you write: > > << Just for the sake of discussion, if cigarettes were NOT a "nicotine > delivery > system" and were NOT addictive or harmful in any way, would you or would you > not find the act of smoking sexy? I think the act of smoking was sexy during the 30's and 40's. We didn't have the knowledge of it's harmful effects as we do now. I used to think it was sexy when Fred Astaire lit up. As far as Joni goes, I can only speak for her Chicago tour. During her intro to Magdalene Laundries, when the heckler shouted out and she said," I have the floor now!", I suddenly wanted to have a cigarette for her. I still believe she stopped "moon at the window" so she could smoke. At that point, I thought she was feeling, enough..... I noticed that she smoked through "Trouble Man" and "Comes Love". Joni would have been just as sexy and saultry without cig in hand, but also being a smoker I understand her reasons for wanting to smoke at that time. jody ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 01:04:40 -0500 From: "Eric Taylor" Subject: Re: smoking on stage Denise wrote: >The woman is hurting herself and disrespecting other's rights >to smoke free breathing. She is an extraordinary person with >tremendous gifts, but this is a shortcoming and I don't understand >why it impresses people. Perhaps what impresses us is that Joni can chain smoke for 40 years and still sound and look better every day! She should be the postergirl for Natural American Cigarettes (stronger than Camels but without all those harmful chemical additives ;~)... Native Americans revered tobacco as the Breath of the Great Spirit. It was smoked in the Peace Pipe and always burned at the four corners of camp to purify the air. As a smoker I must say that I am SO sick of non-smokers informing me that I am killing myself and everyone around me that I could puke! I don't smoke in non-smoking homes or sections and still people complain bitterly. And I don't mean to jump all over your case, Denise. I'm just having a nicotine fit! E.T. P.S. How do we know she was really smoking tobacco anyway? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Nov 1998 17:53:58 +1000 From: Mark-Leon Thorne Subject: Tribute Hi All! I've just joined the list from Canberra, Australia and was wondering if there are any other Aussies on the list. I am a 34 year old undergraduate neuroscience student originally from Sydney. I've been a Joni fan since I was 16 and have every recording to date. I even picked up Song To The Seagull on vinyl when I was in Vancouver, Canada when I was 18. I am a self-confessed Canadaphile (or is that Cannuckphile?). I am trying to find out about a tribute album that I heard about. I read an article about k.d. lang in a local lesbian magazine here which said she would be recording, "Free Man In Paris" for the tribute album which also included the Rolling Stones amongst others. Has anyone heard any more news than that? I also have a lot of covers of Joni songs like, Woman of Heart and Mind by Minnie Ripperton, A Case of You by Tori Amos and another version by Caroline Lavelle and Be Cool by Cathy Sullivan. I also heard that there was a tribute album to Joni recorded in Canada a few years ago. Does anyone know where I could lay my hands on a copy? I think it's called, Back To The Garden. Mark (Canberra) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 23:02:22 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: Re: Chicago Concert - Joni FredNow@aol.com wrote: > and Klein's deep bottom bed Ooooooh...Aaaaaaaaaah...Superb piece of writing Fred! I want one of those deep bottom beds! ;~D Susan L.A. "...Is it too much to ask? I want a comfortable bed that won't hurt my back..."-Mary Chapin Carpenter ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 23:02:37 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: Re: Review Of Gershwin's World (SJC) Hey Terry! > **Mitchell simply sounds silly aping late-period Billie Holiday on "The Man I > Love," with her wobbly vibrato, piercing vowels and hiccup accents. Who the f---k does this Mark Stryker think he is writing shit like this for Free Press?! Yeah, right! That's an oxymoron in the extreme...There has never been a f--kin FREE PRESS and there probably never will be...I'd like to lay 'THIS SNAKE I DON'T LOVE' out to whale shit...Joni gets more repect from rank strangers in the streets...And deep bottom bed players ;~) Joni: "...Darlin', you can't slay these beasts of prey..." Susan L.A: How much Ya wanna bet? I feel lucky "...Auntie Ruthie would have died if she knew we were on the inside..." };~) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Nov 98 07:39:34 GMT From: kg@ibm.net (Kenny Grant) Subject: 2-for-1 Sale at CDNOW thru 11/9/98 (NJC) Here's a URL for a "buy one -- get one free" deal available at CDNOW, for my fellow bargain-lovers on the list! http://www.cdnow.com/cgi-bin/mserver/SID=722122508/rl=/RP/BXGY/classics_bogo_pp. html -Kenny ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 23:48:01 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: Re: smoking on stage Hey E.T! > Native Americans revered tobacco as the Breath of the Great Spirit. Heyoka! > As a smoker I must say that I am SO sick of non-smokers informing me > that I am killing myself and everyone around me that I could puke! Hey-hey-heyoka! It's a good day to die...Pass the pipe darlin' ;~) > P.S. How do we know she was really smoking tobacco anyway? Was she out of balance? Was she out of hand? Was she pain-free? If the answers are negative to the first two and affirmative to the last, Joni might have been smokin' Herbie :~D Susan L.A. "...These leaves are crazy..."-JoniM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 23:47:36 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: Re: Great review in NY Times! DSK11 wrote: > > November 3, 1998 > > Pop Review: Mitchell and Dylan Among Friends > > By BEN RATLIFF > Most of the performance lit up familiar strengths, but what audiences > have learned recently is how good a jazz singer Ms. Mitchell can be. > Putting down her guitar and lighting a cigarette, she turned to a > plainer style to sing "Comes Love," made famous by Billie Holiday. > Without the sudden rushes of phrasing and Ms. Mitchell's signature > chords wrapped around it, the song made the most of her natural voice, > its bright, cutting vowels and its new depths, a gift of age. It took > her into a completely new context. Light a penny candle! I like this Ben Ratliff dude! Yes I do! He plays real good even though it can't possibly be for free :~) Meggissimo Hugs Benny Baby! Susan L.A. "...During times like these The wise are influential..."-JoniM ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V3 #457 ************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?