From: les@jmdl.com (JMDL Digest) To: joni-digest@smoe.org Subject: JMDL Digest V3 #455 Reply-To: joni@smoe.org Sender: les@jmdl.com Errors-To: les@jmdl.com Precedence: bulk JMDL Digest Monday, November 2 1998 Volume 03 : Number 455 The Joni Tour Pages: http://www.jonimitchell.com/Tour98.html http://www.jmdl.com/articles/tour98.htm ------- Join the concert meet and greet lists by sending a message to any of these addresses: -Syracuse@jmdl.com Rochester@jmdl.com CollegePark@jmdl.com -NewYork@jmdl.com Kanata@jmdl.com Atlanta@jmdl.com ------- JoniFest 1999 is coming! Reserve your spot with a $25 fee. Send a blank message to info-jonifest1999@jmdl.com for more info. ------- The Official 1998 Joni Mitchell Internet Community Shirts are available now. Go to http://www.jmdl.com/ for all the details. ------- The Official Joni Mitchell Homepage is maintained by Wally Breese at http://www.jonimitchell.com and contains the latest news, a detailed bio, original interviews and essays, lyrics, and much more. ------- The JMDL website can be found at and contains interviews, articles, the member gallery, archives, and much more. ========== TOPICS and authors in this Digest: -------- all souls/el dia de los muertos [some millers ] (NJC) WANTED: [Susan Chaloner ] Madison Square Garden Rocked [Green51976@aol.com] some me too's (NJC) [stevephoto@mindspring.com] JONI in NYC (long) [DSK11 ] Re: Joni's remarks on Socrates being fascist ["Winfried Hühn" ] NJC this is my last week [Jamie Zubairi ] smoking on stage [Denisongs@aol.com] Re: (NJC) WANTED: [catman ] Re: Joni's early songs [IVPAUL42@aol.com] random NYC comments ["Deb Messling" ] Re: Kipling? (perplexed - SJC) [IVPAUL42@aol.com] DIRECTIONS FOR MARYLAND PARTY [Bill Dollinger ] Re: Dave Edmunds (NJC) [Dreamzvill@aol.com] Re: Swansea (NJC) [Dreamzvill@aol.com] Re: Joni's remarks on Socrates being fascist [PMcfad@aol.com] Some Vehicle [Bounced Message ] leaving to digest for awhile...:) [Dreamzvill@aol.com] Re: leaving to digest for awhile...:) [Jerry Notaro ] Today in Joni History - November 2 [Today in Joni History ] Joni in person ["Phil Klein" ] Re: Stuff [Phyliss Ward ] Thank You JMDL! ["Don Rowe" ] Wally's health(NJC) ["John M. Lind" ] Re: Some Vehicle [IVPAUL42@aol.com] A BIG THANK YOU [Tortorici@exchange.conference-board.org] Re: Kipling? (perplexed - SJC) [Susan Chaloner ] Re: JMDL Digest V3 #453 [FredNow@aol.com] Willy The Shake (NJC) [Steve Dulson ] T-shirt request (NJC, kinda, sorta) [Mary Pitassi ] Chicago Concert - Joni [FredNow@aol.com] Gershwin's World [FredNow@aol.com] Joni in SF Examiner [Mary Grace Valentinsson ] Re: Gershwin's World [TerryM2442@aol.com] re: smoking on stage [Mary Grace Valentinsson ] NJC:CC [catman ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 03:19:49 -0500 (EST) From: some millers Subject: all souls/el dia de los muertos howdy- tonight we're off to rendezvous with jm at the war memorial in syracuse, the salt city. wondering how things went in that tax free building in the big apple, but probably won't find out for a while as we'll be on the road for many hours. today we took a boat down the hudson river for five hours and returned by rail. absolutely magic. saw many flocks of swans flying and swimming, while the weather was "borderline" all day. won't be long before we take wing for the burning desert either. life is good. imho, it's important to honor our dead today -- all souls/el dia de los muertos -- and so it's fitting we'll be with jm in "the war memorial" tonight. before we leave home, we'll be transplanting some marigolds from the perimeter of our vegetable garden to our daughter's fresh-filled grave. here's to you amelia grace psomas miller. may you never ever fade from our memories. hasta luego- pablo s.bethlehem, ny p.s. psomas is greek for breadmaker, it's my wife niki's maiden name. guess we were destined for each other. also recently learned that bethlehem = house of bread. food for thought, especially vis-a-vis the location of jc's manger. with no intention of ruffling any feathers, me thinks he truly is (not was) the bread of life. np (in my headphones) five discs random fire: concrete blonde "mexican moon"; terry allen & the mystery panhandle band "bloodlines"; the iguanas "nuevo boogaloo"; texas tornados (reprise 9 26251-2); and jonathon richman "!jonathon, te vas a emocionar!" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 00:33:23 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: (NJC) WANTED: GOOD MAN 90 years old Rich One foot in the grave One foot on a banana peel Straddling askew creek Gee, I wonder if I could age Klein 50 years overnight };~D Susan L.A. "...I hear you in the water..."-JoniM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 03:54:09 EST From: Green51976@aol.com Subject: Madison Square Garden Rocked hello everyone! wow! what a dynamite show! she looked beautiful. and i never dreamed she would play so much of her older stuff- hejira, amelia, free man in paris, harry's house, and more... she looked really beautiful too. and i couldnt believe she smoked a cigarette on stage while she was singing... she looked so cool and sexy and... WOW! everyone went nuts and she got a standing ovation and came out and played woodstock for an encore... WONDERFUL! so did anyone write down all of the songs she sang? if so, will someone send it to the list...? that would be very kind. andy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 04:25:54 -0800 From: stevephoto@mindspring.com Subject: some me too's (NJC) There is no question that this is one of those moments on the list where "Me Too's" are the proper "netiquette". All of us who were over at Duane's are going to share some memories of the afternoon. The food... the conversation...the music...the vibe, I had a great time. Thank you for inviting us into your home so that we all could meet! I could tell that you had fun putting the whole thing together and you should be pleased with the outcome. What a fine chef and a warm host you are! Steve Julty stevephoto@mindspring.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 04:33:40 -0400 From: DSK11 Subject: JONI in NYC (long) DAMN! She's GOOD! What a strong performing presence she has. It's like she holds herself in, even when she's rocking, and she's so focused, energy comes right out of her center. I can't see auras (don't even know if they exist), but surely hers would be golden with rays touching everyone. She got a GREAT reception here in New York. From where I was sitting, it looked like 99% of the audience was there to see her. People stood, clapped wildly, whistled when she was introduced. And, as in earlier concerts, she sang the first two songs solo. There's something so vulnerable about that, no big noise to hide behind. No one to communicate with but the audience. Very smart to sing BYT first, with her Bob imitation at one point. People laughed and cheered. It's like she was saying, "yes I know you Bob fans are here and I respect that; I like Bob too." Each band member got a big hand, especially Brian Blade and Larry Klein. Joni said it was a union hall, so there wouldn't be time for her to do much talking, and she didn't. It was a quickly played set, one song right after the other, and at one point during Free Man in Paris, I thought, wow, what a rocker she is. This is not my old friend Miss Melancholy. Even Amelia, well, it didn't exactly become a dance tune, but the backup sounds were so forceful, hearing "maybe I've never really loved . . ." didn't put me in tears the way it usually does. It made me think and want to pay lots of attention to all the sounds I was hearing. Different. So now the comments and reviews about Joni reinventing herself are making sense. I expected to be awash in memories and emotion, bringing to the concert decades of experiencing her music and connecting it to certain events. It didn't happen (that is, I didn't cry the whole time, overwhelmed, as I really thought I would). It's like I was hearing this music for the first time, which really impressed me, thinking that these songs written 20-30 years ago sound brand new and so alive. In fact the only time I got teary was when the concert ended and everyone stood, and the applause was so loud! I felt very happy that Joni was getting such positive feedback and proud that these thousands of New Yorkers, who are often outspoken to the point of being really rude, treated her so well. (Since I live here, I feel weirdly responsible somehow.) There had been no heckling, and Joni seemed happy as she left, walking with a bounce around the stage and waving to the audience. The people in seats behind her really appreciated that (she had turned to face them occasionally during the concert). My favorites were Crazy Cries and DJRD, which they didn't restart, but it was a long while of strumming, swaying and getting in the groove before it finally took off. It was great hearing her sing that. And Sex Kills sounded great. When she plays it solo, I hear it as a strident scolding; with her band it's passionate and powerful. Oh, and Magdalene Laundries was so moving, as though Joni herself was one of those Irish girls. It was a fantastic concert; felt like I was meeting Joni for the first time. Oh, and her jazz singing at the end! Phew, hot! Smoking, both literally and figuratively, with no guitar and her arms held out from her sides, and lots of hand movements as she was singing, she looked big, broad and sultry. I stayed for all of Bob Dylan's set, even through the encore, since I'd never seen him perform live, and so many of his songs are part of our culture, I was just plain curious. I'd expected hearing Joni would be a nostalgia trip, turned out Dylan was. The only Dylan album I have is the blue double-album Greatest Hits, which must be 25 years old by now, but still I recognized most songs; probably some of them from the Joan Baez albums I used to buy. He ended his encore with "Blowin in the Wind," which people clapped along with. That song was on the Peter, Paul & Mary album my parents gave me when I was five (my very first album). That was a very long time ago -- talk about memories! I gotta say, though, I was impressed with his performance. It's nothing at all like Joni's, can't even compare them. He's like a music making machine, jamming with the guys, very loud, strong steady beat, energetic. Everyone with seats on the floor, and even some people in the raised sections, were standing and dancing during his whole performance. And, he does have a poetic way with words; some of them I could make out as he sang, most I remembered from somewhere. He seemed really happy too, dancing around, smiling when people started clapping to Blowin in the Wind. I was looking at him through my binoculars then and realized I'd never seen him smile before. Figured he was extraordinarily happy. He also did a lot of talking, most of which I couldn't understand, although it does sound like he has a southern accent. What's that about? Isn't he from Minnesota? His energy is so different from Joni's. I imagine his aura as bright red with tentacles whipping out toward people but quickly curling back toward himself. So, it feels like I've been to two completely separate concerts tonight that just happened to be in the same place. Both of them were great! Both of them were a big surprise. Meeting other Joniphiles also made this a special evening. It was so comfortable talking about Joni's music with Kai Wong, who sat next to me during the concert. (We talked all through Dave Alvin's set without even thinking about whether it was disturbing any Alvin fans -- lots of seats were empty at that point and no one shushed us, so we talked then and while they set up for Joni and then for Dylan. That is so much fun, talking face-to-face with someone who knows all about Joni, a first for me.) And, meeting JMDLers at the Irish bar before the concert was confusing at first, but also a very good experience. I got a friendly, Hi Deb, and soon after that a big hug, and by now I'm thinking this is an unusual amount of positive energy considering I rarely post and have most recently shown myself to be a crabby art snob. Oddly friendly group, is what I'm thinking. Turns out people thought I was friendly Deb Messling, who finally arrived and who is indeed pleasantly friendly. So, it turned out OK (and I can remain crabby, thank god!). All in all, and in every way, a very good evening! Goodnight everyone, even this night-owl has to call it a day sometime. Debra Shea P.S. One beautiful sight was seeing JONI MITCHELL on the brightly lit, flickering marquee outside Madison Square Garden, greens and whites, big and bright. Ahhhh!! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 10:49:19 +0100 From: "Winfried Hühn" Subject: Re: Joni's remarks on Socrates being fascist John Villanasa wrote: > Thanks to Winfried for the little lesson on Western thought. Very interesting. > > I guess Joni was just talking out of her asshole again. I love it! As an amatuer philosopher > I have been taken to task for the same :-). > > Thanks for setting the record straight Winfried. > Thanks for the compliments! Please don't take anything I write as 100 % true, though. It's just my personal, opinionated point of view, and others may think/judge differently with exactly the same or even higher validity. I might just be wrong and prejudiced. (Strong Socrates influence here!) As for Joni's remarks on Socrates being fascist, I think Michael Y. correctly explained she just may have used Plato/Socrates as synonyms. I think this is incorrect, but actually not totally ill-founded. Plato was the author, but it is Socrates who's doing the talking in his books. I was educated to separate Socrates from Plato (Socrates being the "good guy" and Plato being the "bad guy"), but there are others who think it's impossible to make these distinctions. If Joni had substituted "Socrates" with "Plato", I would have agreed 95 %, and I agree 100% with what Michael wrote. My opinion follows the viewpoint of Sir Karl Popper's book "The Open Society and its Enemies", Volume I. For anyone interested in politics, this is a highly recommendable book, as it contains a marvelous theoretical back-up of Western democracy. It's also fairly easy to read, even if one does not know the original works of Plato or anyone else mentioned therein. Winfried Goettingen, Germany ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 02:24:11 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Holliston Subject: Kipling? (perplexed - SJC) Hey, y'all, What *is* this revelation that Joni respects Kipling all about? Wasn't he the "Bard of the Empire" - i.e., he totally supported the British occupation of India? Wasn't he the misogynist who wrote: A woman is just a woman But a good cigar is a smoke! If you object to the British occupation of India (and I sincerely hope you do) you must ipso facto object to everything Kipling stood for. Rules? What is Joni thinking of??? Roberto, needing to JUST listen to the music.... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 10:21:52 -0000 From: Jamie Zubairi Subject: NJC this is my last week Dear Joniheads THis is my last week before I un.sub from JMDL. I won't be able to get to a computer until the 23rd of January so I will not be posting until then. I will still occassionally pick up my mail from this address but I won't be posting. I hope that everyone has a nice Thanksgiving/Christmas/Channukah(sp?)/Eid Much Joni JamieJake ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 06:37:15 EST From: Denisongs@aol.com Subject: smoking on stage In a message dated 98-11-02 03:57:14 EST, you write: << i couldnt believe she smoked a cigarette on stage while she was singing... she looked so cool and sexy >> She has always done this, and I will never understand people's reaction to it. The woman is hurting herself and disrespecting other's rights to smoke free breathing. She is an extraordinary person with tremendous gifts, but this is a shortcoming and I don't understand why it impresses people. Just my two cents......Denise ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:25:04 +0000 From: catman Subject: Re: (NJC) WANTED: Susan Chaloner wrote: > GOOD MAN > 90 years old > Rich > One foot in the grave > One foot on a banana peel > Straddling askew creek > > Gee, I wonder if I could age Klein 50 years overnight };~D I am sure you could! > > > Susan L.A. > "...I hear you in the water..."-JoniM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 07:26:17 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's early songs In a message dated 11/2/98 2:39:40 AM Eastern Standard Time, Cholas@aloha.net writes: << Is anyone in this group interested in Jonis' old music?? How bout those first five albums? Superb IMHO. >> I think it is safe to say that many of us are more interested in those songs than Joni is! Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 07:42:59 +0000 From: "Deb Messling" Subject: random NYC comments Well, at a party on Saturday night, I mentioned Joni Mitchell, and someone said, "her voice is shot." It isn't. My god, she sounded beautiful, as did her band. I like that Chris Botti fellow. My personal high point was "Amelia." She sang it with such feeling, and her voice rang like a bell. I like the way she has re-arranged the verses, too. It increases the poignancy of the lyric. Fellow NYCers (so good to meet all of you, and wish it could have been longer), did she omit the last verse of DJRD, or did I drift off for a moment? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 07:45:05 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Kipling? (perplexed - SJC) In a message dated 11/2/98 5:26:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, rhollis@islandnet.com writes: << If you object to the British occupation of India (and I sincerely hope you do) you must ipso facto object to everything Kipling stood for. >> It seems to me that at this point it is like objecting to the British occupation of America. Kipling may seem to you to be an icon for his generation, but he is merely a product of it. I won't get into a discussion of how much of Britain's relationship with India and other elements of its empire was oppression and how much was symbiosis, but certainly there was some of both. Similarly, you cannot negate everything that Thomas Jefferson accomplished and stood for because he owned slaves. You cannot go back in time and critically apply today's values on people who were merely acting upon and believing in the socially accepted mores of their time. You can, however, give greater respect to those who attempted to break through the molds and change the way things were. But to criticize Kipling for participating in misogyny and the oppression of India is really reaching, IMHO. Get over it. Paul I ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 10:39:38 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Dollinger Subject: DIRECTIONS FOR MARYLAND PARTY Here are the directions for the party on thursday before the show. byob, and please feel free to arrive any time after 4:00, but not too late since we will be heading out early enough to pick up will call tickets and press passes and stuff. the venue is about 2 or 3 miles down the road. i will be out of the office after 12 noon today, but can be reached at the number listed below for Roy, who has graciously loaned his house for this get together. feel free to email or call roy with any other questions, his contact info is listed below. bill Directions to 4101 Stoconga Drive, Beltsville, Maryland: >From Inner loop of Capitol Beltway (95): Go to Exit 25A which will say North Route 1 towards Laurel, MD. Do not get off at first ramp which is Rte.1 south towards College Park. Exit lane is quite long before you go under Rte.1 and loop around and up onto northbound lanes. Carefully count five(5) traffic lights. At fifth light turn left onto Montgomery Road. You'll know you are at the right street if there is a 7-11 there on the left. Go up Montgomery Road to top of hill where there is a flashing Red light. After Stopping, Procede through flashing light. Stoconga Drive is first street on left. Turn Left onto Stoconga Drive. 4101 is the fifth house on the left side of the street. It is an all brick house with white trim and a porch across the front. Park anywhere on either side of the street. >From Outer loop of Capitol Beltway (95): Go to Exit 25A which will say North Route 1 towards Laurel, MD. At light at top of exit ramp turn Right. Including that light, carefully count five(5) traffic lights. At fifth light turn left onto Montgomery Road. You'll know you are at the right street if there is a 7-11 there on the left. Go up Montgomery Road to top of hill where there is a flashing Red light. After Stopping, Procede through flashing light. Stoconga Drive is first street on left. Turn Left onto Stoconga Drive. 4101 is the fifth house on the left side of the street. It is an all brick house with white trim and a porch across the front. Park anywhere on either side of the street. If you have any questions between now and thursday you can call Roy Peterson at his work during the day at 202-234-4589 or you can email him at roypeterson@projection.com. In the evenings, or if you get lost on Thurs. call the house at 301-937-7550. Billy McNeel, Roy Peterson or Bill Dollinger will be able to help you. JONI RULES! ______________________________________ Roy Peterson Sales Manager Projection Presentation Technology 1919 Connecticut Ave. NW Washington, DC 20009 Ph# 202-234-4589 Fax# 202-234-0951 Email roypeterson@projection.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 10:55:14 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: Re: Dave Edmunds (NJC) Howdy Vicki! No problem! That tune WAS "Sweet Little Lisa" - and tho' Dave can wrench some mighty riffs from his beloved hollow-body Gibson, it was actually Albert Lee of the screamin' guitar who guested on that number! Sometimes he'd show up and do the same at the live shows. The album is a DE classic - Repeat When Necessary (1979) - highly recommended! Also on the LP - a version of "Queen Of Hearts" that came out pre-Juice Newton, and puts her version to shame! I had the honor of interviewing Dave in '78 - a great experience! Cheers, Susan C. (*La Susana*) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:10:43 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: Re: Swansea (NJC) David- Thanks for the Swansea bits...can't wait to visit! Haven't heard C. Hughes yet, but I'll keep my ears open for her. I always remember the way Dave Edmunds said Hollywood ("Holy-woooood") I love accents and trying to place 'em....:) Luv, Susan C. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:12:59 EST From: PMcfad@aol.com Subject: Re: Joni's remarks on Socrates being fascist i dont see any of the arguments you have made over this issue, including your original post on the interview article. before i go any further, please understand my education in philosophy came from an american university and i think much of our differences will be explained with that fact. 1. On Socrates and Plato. Although 'fascist' is a strong statement, i can see joni's dislike for Socrates. Socrates was undefined, instigative, one who asked questions without giving answeres, ...a trouble maker, and, he drank the hemlock. joni is much more defined in her thinking and consistantly anti suicide, vis a vie her comments toward kurt cobain and van gogh. I agree with you that Plato was the fulfilment of Socratic thought, however Plato was much more definitive in his philosophy and to that end much more delivering of both questions and answers. ....'where are the forms? the forms are in the mind'... I think joni knew exactly who she was talking about in the name Socrates and I can see why his ways are uncomfortable for her. 2. On Nietzsche and the ubermensch. I was taught that the best english translation for the word uber in this context was ..'over', versus your choice of 'super'. To that regard, the ubermensch was the 'overman'. One who overcomes. One who gets beyond. One who can take anything. A survivor who comes out of struggle stronger than he/she went in. American philosophy teachers favor Nietzsche and preach his positives, not his negatives. I can see joni liking Nietzsche and not Socrates. That makes sense to me as an American. However, I found your comment on the negative elements seen in the ubermensch and the rise of the Nazi party to be extremely interesting and that too makes sense to me, although it is not something I have ever considered. 3. On Plato's Republic and the Roman Church, you write: < Subject: Some Vehicle From: "Eric Jaimes" Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 10:33:35 -0500 I have been away, not on some vacation but rather banished by my ISP who has deemed mail from this list as SPAM, and does not let me receive it. Let me begin with a warm hello to everyone here, Roberto, Wally, Patrick, Carol, Lisa, and everyone else whose name escapes me at the moment. My thoughts were with you last night as I watched Joni at Madison Square Garden, from my seat in Section 204. I was blown away to hear so many songs from my favorite album, Don Juan's Reckless Daughter. Through the tastefully sparse arrangements, I was mesmerized by the realization I was finally seeing Joni live, and in such good form. Her voice was so ON, SO on as it rose from this noble, genie-like figure in the flowing red dress and filled the Garden like opium. Although I respect Bob Dylan, it is sometimes hard to remember why, especially in such a juxtaposition as last night. I sat through his set hoping he would return with Joni for just one duet so I might hear her voice one more time. It didn't happen. When Bob broke into "Everybody Must Get Stoned" and the Garden hopped to its feet, I sat back and stared at the circular scoreboard box hanging from the center of the ceiling. There was a crack between the panes which barely revealed a room behind the score boards, a secret clubhouse of sorts, accessible only to a privileged few. I imagined for a moment that I saw a figure in that secret room beckoning to me, secretly, quietly composed in contrast to the Romper Room antics on display below. I saw her red dress and caught a glimpse of her face - I don't have to tell you who it was - and I was able to rise like a ghost and meet her there in some whirlwind of spirit. It's just in dreams we fly; in my dreams, we fly..... Cheers, Eric ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 11:52:28 EST From: Dreamzvill@aol.com Subject: leaving to digest for awhile...:) Hello all you fine people... I am afraid I've become so overwhelmed with the volume of the JMDL (it does take a chunk out of one's day just to READ it all! Albeit a highly enjoyable chunk...:) so must switch to digest for awhile. I have a book or two that needs to be written! A child or two that needs to be homeschooled! Switching to digest usually means (to paraphrase a fellow lister) I let them pile up, and then, like pulling off a bandage - delete them! Sob! I'll try not to think about it now. I'll think about it tomorrow - after all, tomorrow is another day! (what famous character did I just quote? C'mon!) Love and smiles, Susan C. in Morro Bay ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 11:59:55 -0400 From: Jerry Notaro Subject: Re: leaving to digest for awhile...:) Dreamzvill@aol.com wrote: > I have a book or two that > needs to be written! A child or two that needs to be homeschooled! Well you know the perfect solution: a book on the JMDL! Jerry np: Rufus Wainright (a temporary diversion from my Joni madness) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 09:07:40 -0800 (PST) From: Medric Faulkner Subject: Atlanta Bob Dylan Ticket Sales came through for me and I've been a little out of touch lately. Are there any get togethers scheduled for Atlanta? Medric Faulkner megg56@yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 01:56:00 +0000 From: Today in Joni History Subject: Today in Joni History - November 2 1980: The Los Angeles Times publishes a review of the "Shadows and Light" album today, saying "Her version of Lymon's "Why Do Fools Fall in Love?" is spirited but ragged in a way that suggests you had to be there to fully appreciate it. That pretty much sums up the album as a whole: The music is pleasant enough while the record is playing, but it just drifts away when the needle rises from the turntable." Read on at: http://www.jmdl.com/articles/latimes801102.htm - -------- Know a date or month specific Joni tidbit? Send it off to JoniFact@jmdl.com and we'll add it to the list. - -------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 17:21:08 GMT From: "Phil Klein" Subject: Joni in person Just finished catching up on the last 10 or so digests, and have been glued to the screen reading about the close encounters of the SIQUOMB kind. Envious is a severe understatement. If anybody else from the JMDL is fortunate enough to meet the lady in question, please, please, please tell her she's got barrel loads of fans in the UK and Europe, and can she tour over here, please? It almost breaks my heart (actually, no almost, it does) to think she will probably never tour in the UK again, and meanwhile there are a few complete fuck-witted Dylan fans (I know they're the minority, and nothing against Bob), who couldn't give a monkey's that Joni is performing for them, whilst I would crawl on my hands and knees over broken glass for 10 miles, just to see her sleeping shadow. I'm really pleased for those of you who got to meet Joni - it sounds like you did the JMDL credit! The only time I've met musical heros was when I talked with Jimmy Carl Black, Bunk Gardner and Don Preston after a Grandmothers of Invention gig in a pub in Leeds. So, if I magnify that euphoria by 100, it may be close to the feeling one gets after meeting Joni. Ah, well, dream on..... Phil (who has surname in common with Larry, and its spelt KLEIN, right, not Klien, Kline, or any other variant!!). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 09:26:50 -0800 From: Phyliss Ward Subject: Re: Stuff Wally Breese wrote: > The good news is that as of my last scan a few weeks ago, the tumour > appears > to have shrunk from 8 centimeters to less than 2; It may even be gone by > now. This is wonderful news! All your postive energy is paying off. I can't help think that all this wonderful Joni activity - concerts, meetings, etc. has an affect. Just knowing you are the catalyst for it all must be incredible. Thank you and continue to get well! > I GET QUESTIONS- Phyllis Ward asked a question about whether traffic > to the Website had increased during the past month. (snip) Joni's high > profile has pushed the hits to the site from 49,828 in September to 64,744 > for October. So the answer to the question is a > definite yes! Way cool! > I've now watched "Joni Mitchell:Painting With Words And Music" five times. > Needless to say, it's a wonderful show. (snip) "I see > Leslie & Steve Mixon, I see Jill Tamada, I see my best bud, Jim Johanson, > I see Marianna, I see my photographer/friend Karl, I see Pearl, I see > Don, and I see so many more fans and friends. This will make it even better, if that's possible! I kept telling my friends that you wouldn't see my mug, but now, who knows! > Visit the JM.COM pages (there's even a complete set list) I did! Wow! Song for Sharon! I missed this as she only played it the first night when I was not there. I see Refuge of the Roads is absent. : - ( I loved the story she told before that one too! I just can't wait! One more invitation to any Central California JMDL'rs who want to join us for the event. Please Come! (contact me privately.) - -- Phyliss, cable box installed, blank tape in hand, guest list growing! pward@lightspeed.net http://www.bodywise.com/consultants/bpward ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 09:42:19 PST From: "Don Rowe" Subject: Thank You JMDL! I see that my defense of DED struck a chord. I'm sending this as a blanket "thank you" to all for your kind words and insightful comments. And I'm going to tag a big "thank you" on for the fascinating discussion of the interviews and philosophical interpretation threads. We've certainly raised the bar from the "petty wars" which have been raging these last few weeks. You know, I think the fact that so many of us are now seeing Joni on-stage and in-person has generally had a wonderful impact on all of us. So glad to see it -- keep those standards up! Don Rowe ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 13:23:00 -0500 From: "John M. Lind" Subject: Wally's health(NJC) From JoniMitchell.com, 11/2/98: >>snip<< "The good news is that as of my last scan a few weeks ago, the tumour appears to have shrunk from 8 centimeters to less than 2; It may even be gone by now." ALRIGHT!! I'm so glad to hear this. I lost my mom to breast cancer in 1991 and came to the conclusion that chemo was nothing but a mass scam devised by evil, crooked, greedy doctors, hospital administrators, and drug companies for the sole purpose of keeping terminal patients alive longer so they can bill them more. I guess you could say I came out of the experiance a little jaded. Anyway, our friend is beating the odds and getting better. Way to go! John ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 13:33:39 EST From: IVPAUL42@aol.com Subject: Re: Some Vehicle In a message dated 11/2/98 11:37:18 AM Eastern Standard Time, les@jmdl.com writes: << When Bob broke into "Everybody Must Get Stoned" and the Garden hopped to its feet, I sat back and stared at the circular scoreboard box hanging from the center of the ceiling. There was a crack between the panes which barely revealed a room behind the score boards, a secret clubhouse of sorts, accessible only to a privileged few. I imagined for a moment that I saw a figure in that secret room beckoning to me, secretly, quietly composed in contrast to the Romper Room antics on display below. I saw her red dress and caught a glimpse of her face - I don't have to tell you who it was - and I was able to rise like a ghost and meet her there in some whirlwind of spirit. >> Can you send me some of whatever you smoked before that concert in time for me to have it for the Saturday night concert in Atlanta? ;>) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 14:01:00 -0500 From: Tortorici@exchange.conference-board.org Subject: A BIG THANK YOU Hi JMDL Although I did not call all of you back (I got so many calls) I'd like to thank everyone who phoned about Joni's outburst in Indy. I was able to write a small item (scan) in last week's SonicNet/Addicted to Noise (www.sonicnet.com check out news then archives) about the show. Check out the site on Joni's bday (Nov 7) for my birthday column on her. Just got back from the Joni/Dylan show at Madison Square Garden in NYC. Although I am a big fan of both artists, Joni was in especially fine form. Her voice sounded GREAT, almost making me believe her claim that her voice now is better than it was when it was multi-octave. Her song selection was quite interesting (Don Juan, Harry's House, Amelia, etc.) She said she couldn't talk between songs much because of "union rules," so she was less chatty than usual. I think she meant the show had to end at a certain time and the 3 acts made it rather crowded. And conspicuous to me, she never thanked the crowd for its amazing response (almost but not quite as much applause as for the much rowdier Dylan - --by the way at his most nasal). All in all, a great Joni performance, but of course too short. I wish she'd play at least 1 1/2 hrs. Personal observation: Dylan changed around his songs much more than he's done in the last year, making some of them unrecognizable like he did in the 80s and early 90s. Joni did this to "Woodstock," which left many casual Joni listeners confused. I wish she'd do it the old way. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 11:20:57 -0800 From: Susan Chaloner Subject: Re: Kipling? (perplexed - SJC) Roberto said: > << If you object to the British occupation of India (and I sincerely hope you > do) you must ipso facto object to everything Kipling stood for. >> And IV Paul replied: > Kipling may seem to you to be an icon for his > generation, but he is merely a product of it. Blue Mountain Paul! This is so sensible! Yes, we are all products of our generations and I believe you are correct: one should view people and events in context ...but really Paul! Must you throw lead balloons? Get over it? Roberto is my pal, so of course he can do no wrong!!! It greives me to have to tell you to: KISS MY ASS :~* But these things must be done...Bummer, Susan L.A. "...Let light hearts remake us..."-JoniM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 14:31:11 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Re: JMDL Digest V3 #453 In a message dated 11/2/98 2:04:46 AM, cholas Thought it worth mentioning that I live in Kilauea. > >Is anyone in this group interested in Jonis' old music?? How bout those first >five albums? Superb IMHO. Yes, superb. I am almost exclusively into Joni's early work, the first ten records, and especially the first five (although I'd have to skip ahead and add Hejira to those five) ... I'm a heretic here, and don't really dig much after Don Juan's Reckless Daughter. As I've said before, and as others are probably way tired of hearing, my problem is with the notes themselves ... the divine, inspired melodic/harmonic gift that Joni so profoundly displays in those first ten albums seems to have been lost or abandoned. But, as I always feel compelled to add, this is *entirely* my problem, and in no way diminishes my deep love for her early work ... and she should continue to do any damn thing she wants to ... I'll always listen. By the way, I'm also very interested in Kilauea, and Hawaii in general, having spent some time there three years ago, one week on Kauai -- snorkeling for the first time in my life (better than acid!), and hiking the Na Pali coast and Waimea Canyon -- and one week on Hawaii -- even better snorkeling in Kona, and hiking in the Volcano National Park, through the rainforest and across the moonscape of Little Iki Crater, hanging out with the nenes. I love it there ... they don't call it paradise for nothing. I'd go back in a minute if I could get a gig playing somewhere there. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 12:37:10 -0700 From: Steve Dulson Subject: Willy The Shake (NJC) Suze wrote: >Timing is everything in life. In these two incredible days, it was the >stuff that dreams are made of (Colin, that Carly lyric quote was for you!). Carly lyric quote? Hmm...wonder where Carly got THAT from???? :) And to the othe Sue, LA that is, WELCOME BACK! I missed you! ############################################################## Steve Dulson Costa Mesa CA steve@psitech.com "The Tinker's Own" http://members.aol.com/tinkersown/home.html "Southern California Dulcimer Heritage" http://members.aol.com/scdulcimer/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 13:42:14 -0600 From: Mary Pitassi Subject: T-shirt request (NJC, kinda, sorta) I have *very* few regrets about my recent sojourn to Detroit, but a minor one is that I didn't buy a TTT t-shirt while I had the chance--and am now kicking myself! (especially after seeing how very nice they looked as "modeled" by various members of our group). Would anyone attending one of the remaining concerts be willing to pick one up for me? If so, please e-mail me privately. Will pay for shirt and shipping by money order. Much thanks in advance-- Mary P. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 14:55:18 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Chicago Concert - Joni It was thrilling to hear Joni live for the first time in 15 years. She sounded great, looked and moved great, and, to my great delight, performed a surprising number of older tunes considering her repeated avowals not to do so - -- Big Yellow Taxi, Just Like This Train, Free Man In Paris, Harry's House, Black Crow, Amelia, Hejira, Woodstock -- in fact, the majority of her own songs in the set were 22 years old or older ... imagine that! In between the Alvin and Dylan sets, which were way too much for the cavernous acoustics of the United Center to handle, Joni's music was enhanced by the extra reverb of the hall, playing at half the volume of the others and actually attaining about as much intimacy as one could hope for in a place of that size. Joni and band played like jazz musicians, responding spontaneously to each other, playing with rhythms and phrasing and melodic variations ... very cool temperature-wise but never frigid. The VG8, trumpet, and pedal steel guitar, along with Brian Blade's exquisite drumming and Klein's deep bottom bed, coalesced into a unique whole, a sound unlike anything I've ever heard, fulfilling all the promise of Joni's experiments through the years with jazz. Joni's singing was superb: always on pitch, supple and graceful, dynamically and tonally varied and rhythmically vital. When she sang Woodstock (by far the best version I've ever heard), my eyes filled with tears. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 15:00:21 EST From: FredNow@aol.com Subject: Gershwin's World I've been really, really digging Herbie Hancock's new album Gershwin's World, which consists of varied arrangements of both Gershwin's music and music that influenced Gershwin. There are several tracks that each alone make the album worth having: Stevie Wonder singing and playing harmonica on an extremely funky version of W.C. Handy's "St. Louis Blues." Herbie plays only acoustic piano on the album (except on this cut he also plays organ), so this funk is not your Headhunters' funk, but more like Blue Note/Watermelon Man funk. Stevie is incredible. Joni sings The Man I Love and Summertime, and absolutely kills. Her smoky, lower voice is now the perfect jazz vehicle, and her pitch and phrasing right on. One doesn't even necessarily recognize Joni at first. And, what's more, Wayne Shorter plays elegant-as-always tenor and soprano sax. (Can't wait for a Joni-sings standards album.) The second movement of Ravel's G Major Piano Concerto is one of my personal all time favorites, and Herbie gets deep into it, using both written text and improvisation to illuminate one of the most beautiful pieces ever composed. This is a great work from Herbie, who is a genius if there ever was one, and as a genius, he surrounds himself with other geniuses: Gershwin, Ravel, Ellington, Joni, Stevie, Wayne, Chick ... a gorgeous record. - -Fred ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:08:55 -0800 From: Mary Grace Valentinsson Subject: Joni in SF Examiner The mag also included a small article on Joan Baez. It makes for interesting reading in conjunction w/ Mitchell's articles touching on how "HOSL" was dumped because of the worldbeat, only to see "Graceland" gather praise. There is an interesting and telling quote in the Baez article by the musical director of KLLC: "....It's nice that Joni Mitchell and Joan Baez and Stevie Nicks and Patti Smith and people like that have paved the way for women in rock. But I don't think it necessarily means they'll always have a place in today's contemporary-rock arena. There's a ton of very successful, wonderful, talented young women, who have benefited by their breaking ground. But it's their turn now, and that's who we play." It's an especially odd comment because that radio station plays just as much Clapton, Dylan and other "historical" figures. Why aren't these artists dropped for newer talents as well? Other nugget, (or "This is why ani wrote what she wrote" dept.): JM says: "....Power corrupts and there is too much wanking on secJM retaries' desks going on everywhere within the record companies and all the other high places.....It's gotten out of hand. I don't think that men are entirely to blame. It used to be that women had some consideration for men's sensitivity to visual stimulation. Just being practical about it. Women were covered up for a reason. Men are easily excited. (laughs). It was a kind of courtesy to them...." It's my fear that this was not entirely tongue in cheek. Anyone catch the reference to Sharon? That's it for today.... MG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Nov 1998 15:14:14 EST From: TerryM2442@aol.com Subject: Re: Gershwin's World In a message dated 11/2/98 3:02:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, FredNow@aol.com writes: << Joni sings The Man I Love and Summertime, and absolutely kills. Her smoky, lower voice is now the perfect jazz vehicle, and her pitch and phrasing right on. >> I've been enjoying this new CD as well and was appalled to read the Detroit Free Press' poor review of it, including the part where they describe Joni's singing as a Billie Holliday wannabe. Terry ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 12:17:56 -0800 From: Mary Grace Valentinsson Subject: re: smoking on stage from denise in response to the first sentence: << i couldnt believe she smoked a cigarette on stage while she was singing... she looked so cool and sexy >> She has always done this, and I will never understand people's reaction to it.The woman is hurting herself and disrespecting other's rights to smoke free breathing. She is an extraordinary person with tremendous gifts, but this isa shortcoming and I don't understand why it impresses people. == Denise, This has always been a pet peeve of mine and I can never understand why people are impressed by the smoking or find it sexy. There is nothing sexy about drug addiction. MG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 20:21:03 +0000 From: catman Subject: NJC:CC I thought this was amusing and I know some of you are fans so: The reworking of bits of Carly songs reminds me of a sister act I once saw > in > the Catskills. . . > > > Both: We Have No Secrets we tell each other everything! > Betty: Everything! > Belinda: Better Not Tell Her. . . > Betty: (Tell me what?) > Belinda: I Think I'm Going to Have a Baby! > Betty: Why? > Belinda: I got down with -- > Betty: My New Boyfriend? It's Just Not True! > Belinda: Betty, forgive me - I'm no virgin! > Betty: Belinda works on all the wild young men! > Belinda: I didn't tell you and you didn't see. > That's when jealousy got the dog up in me. > Betty: (Hey! Who's calling My New Boyfriend a dog?) > Belinda: We made love like dogs gone mad! He showed me the way it was in Spain! > Betty: I'll bet it's hot in the summer in Madrid! > Belinda: I've got my mind on your man again. Your man is on my > mind.... > Betty: Why My New Boyfriend? > Belinda: Cause Nobody Does It Better. > Betty: Why'd you tell me this? Were you looking for my reaction? > Belinda: I don't need to prove to you that I'm beautiful to > strangers! > Betty: (Well, that's the truth -- cause those are the only kind of > guys you > ever get!) > Belinda: (So, I go home with someone I don't know once in a blue > moon!) > Betty: It Happens Every Day. Good God, what she does in one day > you wouldn't believe! > Belinda: I was so easy then - never making any plans > I was so easy then - holdin' hands > Betty: (Well, it sounds like you did more than that!) > Belinda: (Guilty!) (BOTH LAUGH) > I had one eye on > Betty: My New Boyfriend! You were Waiting at the Gate! > Belinda: He said, "Hello little woman!" And I said: "Come Upstairs! > Don't > wrap it up cause I'll eat it here!" > Betty: I'm in Pain. I'm in Paaaaaaaaaaaaain! Paaaaaaaaaaain! > Belinda: Well, It Should Have Been Me! > Betty: That's Not Like Him! > Belinda: He's obviously fooling her, cause he doesn't ask permission > When he comes to see me. > Betty: Damn, You Get to Me! > Oh, Jesse! (How could you do this?) And with my Older Sister! > Oh, Jesse! I won't change the sheets for you. > I won't even brush my teeth for a week for you! > Belinda: (Yuck!) > Betty: I wondered why it wasn't me I guess it's just that > Belinda: Those are my initials in his Diary! > Betty: She's wicked to all the beaming dreamers who laid her > Belinda: And boast of an evening at my fiery side! > > Belinda: My father sits at night with > Betty: Two Hot Girls on a Hot Summer's Night > Belinda: My mother reads her > Betty: Vogue and Glamour Mademoiselle > Belinda: But, you know, she can B- > Betty: (Hey wait just a minute. That's my mother you're talking > about!) > > Both: The restaurant shuts; you catch your flight > Betty: If all our flights are grounded, Belinda we'll go to > Belinda: Houston, home of Exxon, Gulf and Shell > And dance > Betty: The Gavotte! > Belinda: (The Gavotte? What is that anyway?) > Betty: (Beats me. Just one of the few things that rhymes with > apricot!) (BOTH > LAUGH) > Betty: It used to be for a while that the river flowed right to my > door > Belinda: But the river doesn't seem to stop here anymore. > Betty: But I will wait for you forever! Like a river. > Both: Let the River Run! > Betty: I'm looking forward to it Coming Around Again > Belinda: Cause I Haven't Got Time for the Pain > Betty: Let's make > Both: Hotcakes! > Belinda: For old time's sake. Let's invite our hearts > Both: To Bake! Let's close now..... > ------------------------------ End of JMDL Digest V3 #455 ************************** Don't forget about these ongoing projects: FAQ Project: Help compile the JMDL FAQ. Do you have mailing list-related questions? -send them to Trivia Project: Send your Joni trivia questions and/or answers to Today in History Project: Know of a date-specific Joni fact? -send it to ------- Post messages to the list at Unsubscribe by sending "unsubscribe joni-digest" to ------- Siquomb, isn't she?