From: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org (jewel-digest) To: jewel-digest@smoe.org Subject: jewel-digest V2 #525 Reply-To: jewel@smoe.org Sender: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk jewel-digest Thursday, July 3 1997 Volume 02 : Number 525 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: NJC U2 Concert Review.(Read If You Want) [gosiam@juno.com (Margaret E] Re: Read This And You'll Be Sorry........ [stratman7@juno.com (JAMES R BA] NJC: getting along [Bob B ] Re: SF BAY AREA Lilith concert ticket for sale July 8 [Gerrit Kruidhof ] Anti-popularity idiocies ["Adrian du Plessis" ] Bearsville '97, Angel Needs a Ride Take II [SM_KARTALOPO@ACAD.FANDM.EDU] Happy July 4 [Chaplain Dan ] Re: Backing up stanley(Jewel's popularity) [HDENANGEL@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 11:13:04 -0500 From: gosiam@juno.com (Margaret E Milsztajn) Subject: Re: NJC U2 Concert Review.(Read If You Want) On Thu, 3 Jul 1997 10:57:32 -0400 (EDT) "Timothy Paul Mccormick Jr" writes: >Wow, that sounds like a great concert. Did you know that >the Last Night on Earth Single came out on Tuesday, >and it includes a eight minute version of Pop Muzic. >Can't wait till October. > >motor city angel, >tim > When The Last Night On Earth Single came out here in Chicago I bought it yesterday it includes the following songs: Eight Minute Version Of Pop Muzik Single Version Of LNOE Remix Of Numb AND, a song by the Beatles re-done by U2, I forgot the title, because right after I bought it my brother came home and took it, so God knows when I'll get it back, hehe See Yah Around! Margaret *The*Hyper*Angel* ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 09:07:58 EDT From: stratman7@juno.com (JAMES R BAILEY) Subject: Re: Read This And You'll Be Sorry........ Hey Margaret, sounds like you need to stick w/ we fellow EDAs and say so long to people like her. It is amazing how some people can be isnt it? Sounds like your better off w/ out her. You know what they say, w/ friends like that, who needs enemys?!!! Have a good one. JULES " I'll get you my pretty..............and your little dog too." ~wicked witch of the west On Tue, 1 Jul 1997 19:02:57 -0500 gosiam@juno.com (Margaret E Milsztajn) writes: >Ok Angelz Here's One Hell Of A Nasty Story, >I was talking to one of my old friends that came from out of town and >we were just having a casual conversation and we got onto the subject >of music, so naturally i said that i LOVE the following bands or >solos, Jewel ( Duh!) No Doubt, Bush, U2, Depeche Mode,Alanis and so >on. I ask her if she likes any of them and she says all of them except >Jewel! I ask, WHY!?!? I mean why don't you like her at all?? Get this, >she says; Oh, she is such an Alanis Wannabie!! I was about to explode! >I mean Jewel is nothing like Alanis! Alanis is cool with her own style >and music and so is Jewel, but their not alike in what they sing >about.... Then we turn on the tube (TV) and coincidenty Jewel's YWMFM >Video came on and she said, " She is so horny in this video i think >i'm going to be sick if you don't change the channel!" I start >standing up for myself and Jewel so I say; Do you even have any idea >what she's singing about?? She started to talk back so did I and we >eneded up fighting, not just because of Jewel but because when by BF ( >boyfriend) walked into the room she said, Oh my GOD!! Your going out >with that idiot! NOW that really got to me and i pulled her hair so >hard there was still some in my hand! She started calling me a >backstabbing B*tch and i called her something that I don't want to >mention because i'll get kicked off the list! But anyway, I know it's >her opinion but she made Jewel look so bad that I couldn't take it! > >Margaret, *The*Pissed*Off*Angel* ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 12:50:10 -0600 From: Bob B Subject: NJC: getting along Must flames be posted instead of sent privately. I mean what are people = trying to accomplish by shooting down people's posts publicly. This is = not a battle zone. I suggest if someone posts something you don't like = flame then privately. If it is something that is not really a flame not = directly to the sender, just trying to give constructive criticism that = is O.K. But I know no one on this list to be a hateful person so just = lighten up O.K. Bob There's got to be some way out of here. Said the joker to the thief. Jimi Hendrix ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 09:05:05 -0700 From: Gerrit Kruidhof Subject: Re: SF BAY AREA Lilith concert ticket for sale July 8 I also have an extra *lawn seat* to this event. Therefore, if anyone is looking for TWO lawn seat tickets, you can get one from me and one from him. :) Same price. =) Gerrit Kruidhof http://www.endor.org/ amethyst@endor.org gerrit@vbix.com J. Wermont wrote: > > I have an extra ticket to the Lilith concert playing at the Shoreline > Amphitheater in Mountain View, CA. > > This concert features: > > Jewel > Sarah McLachlan > Paula Cole > Suzanne Vega > Tracy Chapman > > Total cost for ticket: $27.50 (includes the Bass handling fee). > > This is a *lawn seat* ticket, which means it is not reserved. > > When: Tuesday, July 8, 5:00 PM > > Send mail to this address for more info. > > J. Wermont > jwermont@netcom.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:16:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Cappacinos@aol.com Subject: I'm New HI everyone out there... i'm new to the mailing list and am really confused on alot of what is goin on...like what is EDA andEDAF. things of that nature if someone could please email me privately i would apreciate it. please us the heading Help for the newbie... Thanks... Amy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:17:17 -0400 (EDT) From: ANDYMAN878@aol.com Subject: lilith fair hey, are any angels going to the lilith fair in cincinnati, on august7? if so e-mail me. andyman ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 14:15:17 -0500 (CDT) From: Emilia Garvey Subject: Re: NJC: James Stewart (1908-1997) On Wed, 2 Jul 1997, Ben Simpelo wrote: > For those who didn't know yet, James Stewart, a Hollywood legend and one > of my favorite actors has died today of cardiac arrest in his home in > Beverly Hills. He acted in at least 75 movies including "Mr. Smith Goes > to Washington", "The Philadelphia Story", "Vertigo", and "It's a > Wonderful Life." James Stewart was 89 years old. I will truly miss him. > > "Every time a bell rings, an angel gets his wings." > > -It's a Wondeful Life > I will too!!! When my mother told me I said..."I have no reason to go on living. As one of those old idols..I think I truly believed people like him,George Burns, Katherine Hepburn..etc...are going to live for ever..even Bob Ross! :) I'm kinda sad too now..And right after Jacques Coustea...and *gulp* things do come in 3s!!! ok..bye now. Emilia "The Jilted Angel" Garvey A.K.A Gladys The Annoying Interrupting Cow _____________________________________________________________________ "Oh, I am the brainchild, I am the mortar, with a plastic trophy and an eating disorder and a vision as big as a great big wall and they tell me that I'll looked forward for the good of us all.." -Dar Williams "The Great Unknown ______________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 13:58:35 -0400 From: bedo7@juno.com (Emily S Tate) Subject: Re: Jewel Dreams/Nightmares > Have you ever had a nightmare where you can't >run? I have never had a dream like that but I have had dreams where I could not scream. It is so frustrating and scary. - -Em "You were never nothing less than beautiful." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Jul 97 10:23:46 GMT From: st_kuo@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Pro-Popularity Idiocy(supporting Beth) I think Beth expressed her points in ways that I could never had. I agree 100 percent with Beth and I feel that I must also clear up few misunderstandings of my own. I respect the opinion of all EDAs, including Sean, even though there are many posts that I have problems with. I do not wish to flame anybody or get into any conflict with anyone but I just want to state my opinions and respond to other opinions that I disagree with. I disagree with Sean with he said Selfishness is a virtue. I understand that he may mean it in a positive way so I will give him benefit of a doubt. I may be a newbie to this list thing and I didn't have the luck to see Jewel when she's still unknown, does that make me any less than someone who has? I like all Jewel songs, especially the songs that are not released and I read the lyrics of those songs like hundreds of times because I love them. Anyway, I just want to say that don't think that just someone knows Jewel through mass media like MTV or radio doesn't mean they are not EDAs. We all share our love for Jewel and her music and I am very proud to belong to this list and to get to know all the EDAs. Ok it's time for me to quit my babbling. Thanks for taking time to read this post just want to get something out of my chest. "We are everyday angels." -Jewel EDA always, Stanley ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:39:45 -0400 (EDT) From: FabCAGal@aol.com Subject: Re: apology In a message dated 97-07-03 09:18:35 EDT, bennhoff@bewellnet.com (Bob B) writes: << 'd like to apologize to all the EDA's out there for bringing in my personal beliefs into the mailing list. I am sorry and I will make sure it doesn't get out of hand again. Bob >> Bob! Bob! Bob! Don't EVER apologize for bringing yourself, or what you have to say, to anyone, or any public forum! I love seeing other views, opinions, and thoughts! Please, continue to share, regardless of potential flames. Too often, people are silenced by others...and that inhibits the soul...and denies the world of free thought and learning, which is a sad thing. Man-D the "surfer/skater/starrybartender" angel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 11:28:07 -0500 From: gosiam@juno.com (Margaret E Milsztajn) Subject: Re: Read This And You'll Be Sorry........ That is not the only thing that she did my friend!! She made fun of my boyfriend, The following I didnt' meantion in the letter cause it would be too long; she was snooping in my room ( I caught her going through my drawers!) She said that my mother is a B*tch because she wouoldn't let go somewhere with Annie ( My so-called friend) I don't blame her for that! And besides to me Jewel is NOTan Angel I never said she was... ONE More thing you ever call me BUNGHOLE again and it WILL GET UGLY....... HEHEHEH Just kidding.... Just do me a foavor OK? If you dont' know what really happened... Besides she's not the friend she used to be..... On Thu, 3 Jul 1997 00:55:50 -0400 (EDT) Buritohexd@aol.com writes: >bunghole, you ruined a relationship with a friend because she didn't >like >jewel, maybe i should give you a hint about how horny jewel is and how >horny >she is in real life. She is NOT NOT NOT the "angel" you think she is >bungholio, and now you don't have a friend because you so vehemently >defend a >musician whom may mean alot to you, but nevertheless know nothing >about. > bungholioioioioioioioioioioioio! >oh yeah HITTING PEOPLE SUCKS! >you have been buritobombed >Enjoy! >THE MIGHTY BURITOHEAD > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 10:11:51 EDT From: stratman7@juno.com (JAMES R BAILEY) Subject: Re: PLEASE READ: newbie angels are angels too Hi fellow EDA, i couldn't agree w/ you more on EVERYTHING you had to say. My husband and I have been a memeber for only 2 months now, and I stll dont know where I stand. I dont have alot of things in common w/ most of them, though i have helped out a few members personally when asked for advice, I cant write poetry, we dont make it to these rockfeast shows and so on, but bottom line, we all love Jewel, and what she stands for, and that is what I thought this list was all about. Then people are compaining that we call our selves EDAs and dont do our part. What are we supposed to do is what I would like to know.?!Fellow EDA, JULES (my personal addy is CRZYJULES@JUNO.COM) my hubby and I share this addy for EDAs feel free to write anytime. :0) " I'll get you my pretty..............and your little dog too." ~wicked witch of the west On Wed, 2 Jul 1997 20:31:31 -0500 (CDT) *Sometime to Return* writes: >> Again, a light in the darkness. As I sit and blast through my >three >> digests a day, ignoring Spice girls, talks on list politics, and >vacant >> comments on what peoples favorite clouds are, I'm wondering what I'm >> doing here. >> > >Thanks guys... >Way to make us newbies feel welcome... :) >I'm not trying to criticize, honestly...it's just seeing that all >these >posts downing the new people on the list and the new Jewel fans is >really >funny when seen next to all the "We are everyday angels" and "We >love everyone" mission statements I keep reading here... >The reason I say I'm not criticizing is because I can understand...I >know >what it's like to have a strong love and loyalty for a little-known >artist >and then see that artist become a big MtV star...In a way it's >painful...But as far as Jewel goes, you have to realize she's a >*unique* >artist...Because of her unusual (by today's pop music standards) >sincerety, gentleness, positive attitude and true poetic ability, >Jewel is >the kind of artist that is not goign to touch everybody...Sure, there >are >those out there who only like jewel because she's cute, or who are >only >into her radio singles...So be it...Maybe that sucks, but it's the way >it >is... >But you see, by the very nature of Jewels unusual and beautiful way of >touching people, the people she attracts and the very nature of her >attraction as a musician is different than that of say, No Doubt, or >even >Alanis...I don't think she can be exploited as easily as those others >because the people who would exploit her, her fans, usually do not >have >that in their natures...And the way we feel about Jewel, there's no >way >it would ever cross our minds to compromise her image in any way...I >hope >I'm explaining this right... >What I'm trying to get across is that if Jewel's music really touches >you, >it *TOUCHES* you...it doesn't matter if You've been a loyal follower >of >Jewel since the beginning or if you've just heard WWSYS for the first >time...transcendence is transcendence, and that's what I feel when I >listen to Jewel...It's a kind of positive energy I've needed for a >*LONG* >time...And this is coming from a total Cynical/Nirvana-loving/Flannel >wearing child of grunge, so it really means something when I say >that... :) >Basically, I'm saying please don't give up on Jewel, and please >don't sterotype those of us who are new here and who never got to >see her in person, never got to go to Jewelstock, etc...She's one of >the >only artists I've ever heard who has publically talked about her >struggle >to maintain integrity and spirituality in a very commercial >business... >I don't think she will compromise herself in a way that will alienate >those of us who love her... > >Anyway... >Thanks for listening... > >heart, >Dancer > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:55:47 -0400 (EDT) From: JewelzEDA@aol.com Subject: Jewel in US Hiya Angelz Knowing me, this was probably already posted and i missed it, but listen to this. I was sitting in the dentist office waiting room, and i'm glancing over the magazines...WomansWorld, YM, People, basic office mags. Well, i see US, and usually there's pics of various artists, as well as articles. I pick up the US August issue, and in the right hand corner i see the name "JEWEL" yay!!! I flip through the mag, and find a great pics as well as a great article. It was a couple pages, with a pic of her in 3rd grade, talk about CUTE!! Well, the rebel that i am, i of course take (more like rip) the article out of the mag. I know I know, but i mean it was jewel...can u forgive me? 0: ) well, the point of the story is, go get the august issue of US Mag..cause its awesome!!! okies, biya i wuv u all 0: ) - -Symantha 0: ) the "crazi" angel http://www.geocities.com/hollywood/lot/7904/home.html IRC nick Symantha {\o/} /_\ "its just like chocolate, i love it" -Jewel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:31:43 -0400 (EDT) From: FabCAGal@aol.com Subject: Re: that JEWEL thing Christine: This is by far one of the best posts I have seen in a while due to your honesty, your sharing, and your great outlook that reflects a mature thought process. Be weary, flames will come, as they often do to me, whenever not completely being a "YES MAN" on this list, (oh, and some come behind your back too, amongst other "angels")...please stand true to what you feel...don't let them get you down. Read on... "But I believe the sexuality part that women are naturally associated with in our society cannot be changed. That doesn't mean that it's disrespectful necessarily. It's a compliment!" This is very true! I believe that aside from the problems that the beauty in women issue created years ago in regards to employment/voting, etc...that we have come a long way and should be greatful. Personally, I would NOT like to revert to a period where it is not kosher to be considered beautiful. Sexuality is a real issue that will be here no matter what. Now, as stated before, I know all the reasons for being a "Feminazi", so please no bleeding heart mail about the struggle for women...because I will say, "get over it, and work harder". (Bet I made a few cringe there! Oh well.) Anyway, I too, think it is a compliment that men find women such attractive sexual creatures. I am not one that wants to be ugly. And have found that men are viewing smart women as sexy too now...So, what's the problem with that? "Besides girls, we do it too! c'mon you can't tell me that you haven't been out with girlfriends and checked out some FINE guys and made some kinda sexual comment." I couldn't have said it better myself. We are just as guilty, as women, to the innuindos and jokes with our girlfriends as the men are. AND, we are even WORSE than men when it comes to criticizing other women! I run into problems every time I walk into a bar with the caddy nature of women, sitting at tables, yaking about how that girl is this, or that girl is that...and too much makeup...blah blah blah...well, guess what gals? That is jealousy. Get over it. And we totally check out dudes, and fantasize and talk smack, we are just less likely to admit it. I am glad that Christine admits it openly as I do! You go girl! "But I have to admit, I don't think I would like Jewel so much had my roommate not played her stupid CD over and OVER again. hehehe And it was truly only after seeing her in concert that I saw her so much more clearly, even though it was almost from the last row." I just love the honesty here. Seems like too many people feel that you have to be a die hard Jewel fan from the onset...or else you are somehow less of an EDA. I liked your openness Christine. "I can identify with what Sean, i think it was, said about hating how Jewel seems to have so much transient popularity now. Especially with her style, you don't want to let go of the moment because she's so very engaging." Ok...this is a concept that has been bothering me, but I chose not to address it simply because it will do no good. We all go through a growth stage in our lives where we are possessive of the "groups" we are a part of. This is usually in the teen years. So, the posts that were downing the "mainstream" or the country stations, yada yada yada, for playing Jewel, I simply wrote off as a time period in a young life that we all experience, and all later realize is rather trivial. I can assure you that when Jewel cashes the royalty checks, buys new clothes, a new guitar, or that new house, she really doesn't give a crap whether that CD sale was to a die hard fan, or one in passing. Not to mention that it really shouldn't matter if you are a devoted fan, or if she is just another part of your immense collection. It seems to bother too many people if you are not "Jewel Only". "But if she's selling triple platinum, i think that's saying more about how she is genuinely affecting a lot of people. I could be very wrong, but I'd rather give people the benefit of the doubt and be hopeful that someone like Jewel can change so many people. EDAs are living proof of that too!" Every little bit counts. Guys! Every one of YOU on this list, affect, or at least have the opportunity to affect peoples lives JUST AS JEWEL does...everyday of your life. You don't need fame and fortune, or the ability to write great lyrics with little guitar experience, to move people. Instead of idolizing Jewel, idolize YOURSELF and do things because YOU want to, not because Jewel inspired you, or Jewel would like that, or that's Jewel's message. C'mon guys, although it is nice that her message is pure and motivating, leave it at that. Find the essence of being an EDA within yourselves, not her music. Too often, people need motivation or inspiration from outside sources, instead of soul searching to do it themselves. "It's really amazing to see how we can all share each other's hardships together and to pull out of the mud together as well." Yes, the essence of the Jewel@smoe.org. This is why I love you guys! See you at StarryNight! Man-D the "surfer/skater/starrybartender" angel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 12:50:39 -0700 From: Victor Igor Wasylczenko Subject: STARRY NIGHT Gathering, changes in plans Due to information from CA Park Rangers that camping is not allowed at Point Sal, I have decided to postpone STARRY NIGHT for another time. Without camping and a starry night sky, the event wouldn't serve it's original purpose. A gathering is still planned because so many EDAs will be in the area for Lilith Fair. Man-D has volunteered to follow up and she is now the contact person for the new yet to be renamed event. I would like to apologize for any inconvenience I have caused. My intention was to present a place and a plan and a time that would give everyone a lifetime memory. Point Sal is still a place I would like to share with all of you. It is kept as a secret by so many that have visited it. It's empty beach and seclusion make it very special. In an old brochure about CA State Parks, it was listed as a primitive camp site with free camping. I have camped there many times since first discovering it including a few weeks ago when I did a dry run to check it out for us. The other reason to postpone this event is because of the Bearsville reunion. It falls on a specific date where SN was picked because of many EDAs passing through anyway. For many people that don't get to go to some of the gatherings, they still get to enjoy them with the posts. It would be unfair to have both events timed so close to each other. The pleasure of virtually attending through reading the posts would be diluted. STARRY NIGHT will be rescheduled for some time in early fall in a location that is a favorite of Jewel's. For info on the new gathering mailto:Man-D Igor ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 11:59:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Raymond Wong Subject: Re: Pro-Popularity Idiocy Well, since I posted an out of context defense, I guess I'll respond to Sean's post directly, too. :) Sean Hooks wrote: > love. I must warn you that this post is much more logical, realistic, and > less touchy, so dont anyone get their feelings hurt, dont get ruffled, > this isnt a flame, its just a point of view. What are you pro-popularity You state your own opinion's well, Sean, I don't debate that. Logic would also dictate you should also deal with opposing arguments that way, however, and on this you fall somewhat short. While I believe Sean has great intent, reducing each argument to a simple one line belief before responding still amounts to setting strawmen. Rhetoric is no substitute for reason, though this most recent post is probably one of the finest examples of rhetoric since Ronald Reagan's best speeches. > She4 is a celebrity. Then there was the guy who said that the small venues > are always better argument is wrong. That may hold true at coffeehouses > but not at small venue concerts. There is a difference, I never yearned in > my post or anytime for a return to Innerchange style lack of popularity. I > yearn for small under one thousand seat venues where Jewel headlines, and > although that me be impossible, at least keep it in the low thousands. My point wasn't simply that coffeehouse can be hostile. Each type of venue (indeed, each individual venue) has advantages and disadvantages. One of my favorite venues in Southern California (when I can get there) is the House Of Blues in Hollywood. Fire code capacity is about 1000, it is always standing room only, because there are no chairs. :) (Actually, they have chairs in the bar, and in the restaurant area, as well as some they can drag out for cabaret style acts. just an aside.) It's still not a perfect venue. Most small venues like this rely heavily on walk-up and bar business. It's still a place to be social, not just a dedicated concert venue. What's this got to do with anything? Simply, my original point was that there is never a perfect amount of popularity. It was when she was still in the sub1000 level that she got hit by the frisbee, wasn't it? My point is that we're over-romanticizing the past. I don't personally like the way she's playing arenas now either, but this is still a wonderful and useful time. She's making enough money that she'll never need to go hungry again, unless the recoupable funds expenditures turn out to have been greater than expected. As someone else already said, in those crowds of thousands, perhaps a few dozen have found, amidst the screaming, meaning within a song. This is no fewer than those halcyon days of small clubs, there are simply many others who still miss the point, instead of missing the chance. I can't really speak for those others whose posts you reduced to fortune cookie philosophy, so I'll leave that to them. :) > But that is a bit extreme. Why cant she be more like Tori Amos who is > ironically also on Atlantic proving my point. Tori has 3 albums already > compared to Jewels one and she has had NUMEROUS opportunities to release > singles and get huge and has chosen not to. That is why you dont see her Tori probably has released more singles than Eric Clapton has albums... > on MTV and pop top 40 radio, it is her choice. Jewel has the same choice, I haven't? Actually, I haven't because I don't follow either much. I saw Tori's Unplugged show and I saw Jewel's. Similar hype, actually. > no? Or what about Phish who undoubtedly has the fan base to become super > huge pop successes and have many pop sounding songs. They go as far as to Now you've lost me, I must admit. What does the fan base have to do with becoming even more popular? They have very devoted fans, but pretty much anyone who isn't a fan couldn't care less about them. This would be like saying the Grateful Dead could have been the Beatles. > examples but you can see my point. Jewel has choices, she is not just a > pawn to Atlantic. Another point somebody brought up is that soon she will That's certainly a point worth acknowledging. Jewel is definitely consenting to all this. However, Jewel is not perfect. (sorry) She's not experienced, either. Didn't Jenny Price (I think that's her name) the original A&R who signed her leave Atlantic? While she's got choices, that doesn't mean she can see everything that's going on. It also doesn't mean she's blind, however. Perhaps she can see more than we realize. Maybe she has a bigger plan, to burn out all the fair weather fans with this first album so she can go back to the small groups that can appreciate her. Maybe her popularity shouldn't be "blamed" on anyone when it's still uncertain that popularity is bad. Artistic control matters, but there's nothing for me to debate when the 'issue' of fault requires the assumption that popularity is bad. > fade from popularity and the spotlight sighting Pearl Jam and Alannis as > examples. Well, Pearl Jam had to try damn hard and endure an afwul lot to > become unpopular. And Alannis is still huge, bad example there. So why Did they? Making a public war against Ticketbastards is hardly an act of those who want to become unpopular. If you want a nice example, point out that a band like Fugazi has been touring and selling out small clubs for $15 for years now. It's a tough way of life for them, however. As for Alanis, where is she on the charts now, and when was the last time I had a chance to see her in concert? If you need a more dramatic example, let's see how well Hootie's next album does. > would Jewel just suddenly become unpopular? As long as she looks good mass > media pop mainstream will exploit her. Speaking of looks, this may be what Sorry, good looks are enough to make it impossible to become unpopular? Obvious example, in going from 3 million to 250,000 to 50,000 albums sold, was my other favorite artist, Deborah (Debbie) Gibson suddenly unnattractive? I didn't particularly like the haircut in '91, but if that was the reason, maybe Jewel should just have a couple of bad-hair days, and all your problems will be solved. :) Seriously, being so popular as to be stuck playing arenas is always transient. Jewel is in this for the long haul, as she's said. How do bands that have only become popular in the 90s tell us anything about where Jewel will be in the future? Pearl Jam and Alanis and the others are her CONTEMPORARIES. If she's still performing at arenas after the year 2002, I might consider the point. For today's example, the Rolling Stones may be the only act big in the 80's I can think of that still commands large audiences. Tina Turner has again returned to whatever she does, Pink Floyd is, well, not on the charts. Van Halen may still be popular, but they aren't likely to sell out an arena (at least not until they get back together for more than a week)... Cindy Lauper is selling albums again, but nowhere near the numbers implied. Even Madonna's most recent releases aren't all that popular. > listened, again see above. This is the guy who says he wouldve never seen > her if not for large venues? Well why not? Do you only attend shows of > artists that everyone knows that are on the radio and TV? Why would you > say you can only attent big shows, that just makes no sense to me. And I think you're missing the point. Not everyone had the chance to hear her at small venues. There were only so many of them, and only in certain areas of the country. Do you think that everyone has the exact same set of opportunities you do? For many people, their first exposure to Jewel was after she was popular, their first chance to catch her performing was at a big venue, because if she hadn't become popular, she might not have come to that person's area. > Its the baggage that comes with the popularity that insenses me, not the > fact that lots of people are becoming fans or hearing a message. That I > adore and respect and is the only saving grace of becoming more popular. I think you've done a marvelous job of encapsulating our differences here. I agree there's a lot of baggage that comes with popularity, the difference is that I (and others) see that there can be good things that come from all this popularity, too. We all see that which we wish to see. For me the world is a pretty darn nice place. =) Ray Wong PO BOX 6163 negativl@best.com, negativl@netcom.com Hayward, CA 94540-6163 Member #11537, Deborah Gibson International Fan Club Co-Founder and Charter Member, Sutton Foster International Fan Club ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 02:21:46 -0700 From: "Adrian du Plessis" Subject: Anti-popularity idiocies Other EDAs have noted the negative presumptions made about the use of a body double in a previous post to this list, so I'd just point our the irony (or some would prefer to say hypocrisy) of any post that professes to be bothered by misogynists looking at Jewel and at the same time contains an utterly offensive and hateful sentence like "What the f**k is up with this caked on ugly ass makes her look like a slut-whore makeup?!?!?!?!" That sort of talk is beneath all of us here -- I would hope. And any guys that don't understand that should go back to square one. Jewel, as are all women (and men for that matter) in our society, is a free individual and not subject to the hateful judgements of those who would impose their view of physicality on another living creature. Ugly is what we see in the mirror when we stoop to such trash talk. Adrian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 16:42:28 -0500 (EST) From: SM_KARTALOPO@ACAD.FANDM.EDU Subject: Bearsville '97, Angel Needs a Ride Take II Hello again my loves... Just so you all know ahead of time, I will not have access to my email between, this evening when I leave my school's computer lab and Monday when it re-opens after the 4th of July holiday weekend. Any and all email you send me will be taken care oof promptly and quickly. =) =) =) =) =) Well, dears, today there have been some interesting developments in the carpooling arrangements for Bearsville '97. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE make sure you get in touch with me regarding carpooling information. Please set your subject to BEARSVILLE 97 so I don't miss your email or anything, ok? Here is the information we have right now... RIDING WITH: *Tom Miles, tmiles@aol.com, Ephrata, PA: Stephanie Kartalopoulos (me), sm_kartalopo@acad.fandm.edu, Lncster, PA Josh Baummer, Buffalo@yberia.com, York, PA Eric Montas, BooyCrash@aol.com, Union, NJ Erica Cavello, vcavello@aol.com, Naugatuck, CT *Crunch (Mark Nissley), nestle@ptd.net, Mt. Joy, PA: Ali Fraser, EFraser311@aol.com, Harrisburg, PA *Tammy & Rob Campbell, TLCathome@aol.com, Old Bridge, NJ their two beautiful children, Ahmetia and Katerina *Tom O'Brien (tentative as per discussion with Tammy), MorpheusOB@aol.com, NY Mitch Weiss ????????????????? Rachel Martin, Crnflkgl@aol.com, W. Mass. Abel Rosario, rosarioa@cuny.campus.mci.net *Bill Bartholomew, wdb@obll.bidmc.harvard.edu, Boston Area, MA Albert Wang, bahamude@@@user1.channel1.com, Boston Area, MA *****ROOM FOR ONE MORE PERSON****** IN SEARCH OF A RIDE: Steve Messina, GroovyLime@aol.com, Staten Island, NY Carl Jamison, cjj2seas.upenn.edu, Philadelphia, PA Rick Bond, rickbond@concentric.net, somewhere in New Hampshire ABLE TO GIVE PEOPLE RIDES: Akira, sdf4@ix.netcom.com, Northern NJ Bill Bartholomew (as previously mentioned), wdb@obl.bidmc.harvard.edu, Boston *ROOM FOR 1 MORE PERSON* John ??, shallowend@asan.com, NY, NY MIGHT NEED A RIDE: Pat Brown (aka Tom Harris), tiltedhalo@juno.com ***************PLEASE CONTINUE READING********************* OK, ok, I *KNOW* that more people than Steve, Carl (CJ), and Rick need rides, but the thing is, y'all hafta email me!!!!!!! =) =) =) PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE keep those emails coming to me with your name, email address, where you are from, if you need a ride, if you have a ride (yes I still need to know who is carpooling with who if you have that already worked out), if you can give a ride, how many people you can bring, etc. HERE IS WHAT YOU SHOULD DO... 1. Email Mark at: BRSVL97@aol.com with your RSVP 2. Email Tammy at: TLCathome@aol.com with information on *when you are arriving to the campsite* and with all questions and concerns about the campsite we are staying at, which is Steve's Campsite. 3. Email ME, Stephanie, at: sm_kartalopo@acad.fandm.edu with all information you can give me on your transportation plans. I NEED TO KNOW...remember that, loves... 4. Visit Mike Connell's *BEAUTIFUL* website for Bearsville '97 at: http://www.spectra.net/~ducksoup/bv97/bv97.htm 5. Come to Bearsville 97! I CAN NOT WAIT TO GIVE EACH AND EVERYONE OF YOU GREAT BIG WARM HAPPY HUGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I love you all so much. Keep those emails coming to Crunch, Tammy and me. And please please visit Mike's website. Not only does it have a list of motels for those of you who do not want to camp out, but it has information on directions, a list of attendees, links to email addresses, and a lot of very important information which he will be keeping very very very up to date. I hope that all of you have really really great 4th of July wekends. ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((JEWEL@SMOE.ORG)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) love stephanie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 16:54:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Chaplain Dan Subject: Happy July 4 Happy july 4th to any and all. May you enjoy it ineach to your own special way. Just make sure that if you have some of those exploding thingies, that you are real careful(ie. Killer, do not go chomping down on them, we don't want to miss your great howling voice). May you celbrate this great american holiday in aq joyous celbration of independence. For those who are not of this great country, I wish each and every one of you a special day, and my best wishes and hopes are with you. For those americans, remember that this day is a celebration of the fact that we gained our independence and true freedom from those hated redcoats(taking the words o the time frame, not the present day). Remember the privileges that we have today, that our American forefathers fought and gave their lives for (yes, people have actually died for this great country, ie. we do need a standing military{shameless plug for an army, navy, Marine corps, Airforce, and Coast Gaurd}) our life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. So again HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4 HAPPY JULY 4. Enough said Dan Perugini dperugin@medmail.mcg.edu "One man, one goal, one mission, one heart, one goal, just one solution, one flash of light, yeah, one god, one vision" Queen "One Vision" "Get up, get back on your feet You're the one they can't beat and you know it" Styx "Fooling Yourself" "With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see that right, let us strive to finish the work we are in." Abraham Lincoln ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 17:56:41 -0400 (EDT) From: HDENANGEL@aol.com Subject: Re: Backing up stanley(Jewel's popularity) Beth wrote: > I just wanted to back up what Stanley said earlier about Jewel's growing > popularity. Isn't this why Jewel quit her meaningless Jobs and lived in > her van? Jewel has a wonderful opportunity to spread her message through > her music to literally millions of people and I for one am very happy for > her. I am also very happy for the thousands of people who would not have > ever heard of Jewel had it not been for her rising fame. I am amazed that > some people are just sitting around waiting for the fame to go away so that > Jewel can return to the small coffee house concerts. Sorry, but I would i've been an eda over a year- i saw jewel open for dylan and play in small little clubs- but i want to remind you jewel's reason for becoming a musician was not to "spread her message to millions" but quite simply to sing - her goal wasn't fame- it's just came along for the ride- i'm not waiting for fame to go away- but i guarentee you that ih a year the number of eda's will go down drasticly- and all the little preps that concider jewel a pop icon will be long gone and as far as i'm concerned- it's goog ridiance- i'm sure she'd rather true angels at her concerts then imposters $0.02- "i'll make myself translucent- to let you in"- the hidden{\0/} /_\ ------------------------------ End of jewel-digest V2 #525 ***************************