From: owner-jewel-digest To: jewel-digest@smoe.org Subject: jewel-digest V1 #770 Reply-To: jewel@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-jewel-digest Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "jewel-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. jewel-digest Friday, 15 November 1996 Volume 01 : Number 770 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Educate don't condemn educate dont condenm Re: Educate don't condemn Re: Educate don't condemn Re: NJC: Re: My Favorite Line NJC : Weekly EDA Book Review NJC - bunch-o-stuff Rosie O'donnell Re: Henry and Anais Re: Educate don't condemn Re: NJC: flames Smart Sean Re: Educate don't condemn Re: NJC: flames NJC: Re: Educate don't condemn Re: Jewel in New Hampshire December 3 NJC:what? Now we're slamming on girls? NJCRe: Educate don't condemn Re: Henry and Anais (NJC) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: haze@earthlink.net Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 08:19:18 -0500 Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn Sean Hooks wrote: > I know too many girls who have fucked more guys than books > they've read. This statement is so sad, and so true. I think we all know girls like this. What is up with them? > I may be an intellectual elitist... Then again, you may not... > But I am on that plain. umm...Don't you mean PLANE? > she writes evocative deep thought-provoking lyrics, What's so deep and thought-provoking about, "Put the phone machine on hold. Leave the dishes in the sink.."? Actually, now that I think about it, how do you put a phone machine on hold? > I'm not highly cultured or superior, I'm just smart, This is a relative statement...Smart by who's standards? Compared to who/what? Which reminds me of a saying that goes something like this.. "A man that is proud of his intelligence is like a prisoner that is proud of his large cell." > smart enough to educate myself and to know a lot of relevent information. Relevant? RELEVANT? That knowledge you have bothered to remember is about as useful as memorizing the periodic table of the elements... > It's like a great basketball player. He has > greater skill and talent than everyone else on his team. That frustrates > him to no end that his teammates don't have the same desire to win, the > same ability, the same commitment that he(or she) does. It's obvious by your posting of this viewpoint that you have never been in that position. > It infuriates me when people bathe in their own glorious ignorance.Then you must be pretty infuriated with yourself right now, huh? You have not only bathed, but have rewashed your self 100 times.... TURN OFF THE SHOWER PLEASE, your getting us all wet! > Ignorance may be blissful, but like most bliss inducing drugs, it > eventually destroys the mind and body. You should be more specific, and say "pharmacetuical drugs" Haze ------------------------------ From: Thirza Pearl Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:09:24 +0100 Subject: educate dont condenm To the, "wise one" I may not have read the books that you concider classics or "The most influencial book of the century" but hey what 14 year old has read " The tropics of cancer"? I have probably read 400 books in my 14 year old life (I'm serious), but most of them have been by the authors that I like (ie. R.L. stine , christopher pike....) stuff like that. So please lets stop fighting about this. thirza "cant we all just get along" pearl ------------------------------ From: Uilleann Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:16:36 -0500 Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn haze@earthlink.net wrote: > > Sean Hooks wrote: > > > I know too many girls who have fucked more guys than books > > they've read. > > This statement is so sad, and so true. I think we all know girls like >this. What is up with them? > Maybe they -did- read Tropic of Cancer! Heaven knows what an evil and insideous book it is! (j/k!) > > she writes evocative deep thought-provoking lyrics, > > What's so deep and thought-provoking about, "Put the phone machine on >hold. Leave the dishes in the sink.."? > Actually, now that I think about it, how do you put a phone machine on >hold? Acctually, I think that those ARE ddep lyrics! Well, sort of. IMO, Jewel is talking about ignoring culturally percieved notions of behavior (always answering a ringing phone, always doing the dishes, flaming people because you think you're right without taking the "bathroom ani-flame break") > > I'm not highly cultured or superior, I'm just smart, > > This is a relative statement...Smart by who's standards? Compared to > who/what? > Which reminds me of a saying that goes something like this.. > "A man that is proud of his intelligence is like a prisoner that is > proud of his large cell." > Huh? Okay, I understand the quote, but I'd have to disagree - well, maybe not. Being proud of ones accomplishment is a -good- thing, isn't it? If one has a talent, shouldn't htey be proud of it and not try to hide it? Isn't -that the problem with society (and many people) today? If you're not part of the solution about people's low self-esteem, you're part of the problem! (I'm being facetioius(spelling?), of course. People who think in such black and white terms have no business solving the world's problems) > > smart enough to educate myself and to know a lot of relevent information. > > Relevant? RELEVANT? That knowledge you have bothered to remember is >about as useful as memorizing the periodic > table of the elements... > The periodic table of elements is one of the more importantadvances in modern chemestry, even if boring to people who can't understand it. The table is used to describe not just what wierd and unexplicable letter combinations stand for the elements in chemical equations (equations like co2, h2o, naso2, etc) but as a means of understanding and describing the relationships and characteristics involved between chemicals. > > It's like a great basketball player. He has > > greater skill and talent than everyone else on his team. That > >frustrates > > him to no end that his teammates don't have the same desire > > to win,the > > same ability, the same commitment that he(or she) does. > > It's obvious by your posting of this viewpoint that you have never > been in that position. > How is that relevant? I understand what Sean is saying perfectly - I've been in the situation he is using the basketball analogy for - being intelligent in a world that doesn't support intellegence (but loves my sloppy spelling!) Intellegence aside, what about his post is obviously in support of this statement of yours, Haze? - -In jest and humor (mostly)... Jeffrey- - -- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- jeffm@genghis.com http://luna.genghis.com/jeff/index.htm - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ From: Eric Haglund Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:25:31 +0500 Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn This response was just yearning to get out. Sean,you seem to be an intelligent man but yet I don't think that a truly intelligent man would be one to place himself on another level than every one like you do and certainly not try to compare himself to someone who is considered, in this case, an Angel . That isn't intelligence. That is being conceited. You then go on to mention a great basket ball player and how they are frustrated that the rest of the team cannot be at the same level. All though this sounds like you are right it is competely the opposite. A great basketball player doesn't acknowledge his superior talents to the rest of the team. Instead he looks at the team as a whole. One great player is not a World Champion. How often do you think this situation has occured: Larry Bird or Magic Johnson get a little frustrated, like yourself, and then find it necessary to address the team, much like you did the list. Do you think the team is going to respect them? Hell no. That is what makes them legends. They are incredible players but yet they don't consider themselves to be legends. They consider themselves to be just like everyone else on the team. So I think you can learn a little bit from these basketball greats. - -Eric"that's my .02" Haglund "It is wise to keep in mind that no success or failure is necessarily final." Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn >> >> I want to do both. Some things need to be condemned. I may be an >> intellectual elitist for having half a brain and being well read. But I am >> on that plain. So is Jewel. It's sad how few people especially teens, high >> school students and college students, the majority of this list, read. >> Very sad. I know too many girls who have fucked more guys than books >> they've read. OK, if you're in ninth grade you prob'ly don't know who >> Henry Miller is, I did, but that was prob'ly just coincidence because he >> was referred to in Cape Fear. Don't call me condescending just because >> you're the ones being condescended. Jewel is well read and amazingly >> intelligent. She has lots of philosophies opinions theories and ethics >> which she espouses quite often. I admire that so much in today's world. >> The fact that she knows who Henry and Anais are, that she writes evocative >> deep thought-provoking lyrics, that she is existentialist, that she >> refused to settle, that she is living her dream. If you want to gain >> people's respect, be more like Jewel, the person who this list is >> supposedly about. I'm not highly cultured or superior, I'm just smart, >> smart enough to educate myself and to know a lot of relevent information. >> I never said you aren't smart if you don't know a specific writer, just >> try to relate to me too. It's like a great basketball player. He has >> greater skill and talent than everyone else on his team. That frustrates >> him to no end that his teammates don't have the same desire to win, the >> same ability, the same commitment that he(or she) does. It infuriates me >> when people bathe in their own glorious ignorance. I hate to sound like I >> care more about Jewel than other people...I don't know, I'm just >> frustrated. I don't mind being the enemy sometime but just because I'm >> confrontational doesn't mean I'm a bad guy. Well, whatever, do what you >> want, it's your life. >> Later, >> Sean Hooks >> >> Ignorance may be blissful, but like most bliss inducing drugs, it >> eventually destroys the mind and body. > ------------------------------ From: Chopped Liver Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 07:38:05 -0700 (MST) Subject: Re: NJC: Re: My Favorite Line On Thu, 14 Nov 1996, Bob Kollmeyer wrote: > JACOBUS_JARED_G writes: > > > My favorite line is from "flower" > > > > > > "She's a flower that grows despite cinnamon toast, and she will > > > survive" > > > > > > Selena :) > > Isn't she a flower that grows despite cement posts? > > I'm pretty sure it's "And the girl with colitis goes by" ;) > > bob, who's sure at least _somebody_ will get it. Pretty good, Bob. But, "Excuse me while I kiss this guy". Chopped Liver (Charlie), who's not sure _anybody_ gets it. watkins@selway.umt.edu ------------------------------ From: Uilleann Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:48:57 -0500 Subject: NJC : Weekly EDA Book Review Thirza Pearl wrote: > > To the, "wise one" > > I may not have read the books that you concider classics or "The most > influencial book of the century" but hey what 14 year old has read " The > tropics of cancer"? Well, I did, but I was pretty unusual - I also didn't understand it as well as i could have (although I agree, I had a few pages marked, myself...) > I have probably read 400 books in my 14 year old life (I'm serious), > but most of them have been by the authors that I like (ie. R.L. stine , > christopher pike....) stuff like that. > Cool! Keep reading, keep looking for books that you like, and if you want to keep reading, look for books that challange your mind - it'll keep you interested. R.L. Stine, huh? I tried reading him when he first started - I liked the very first book he wrote, then I lost interest... When I looked up, he had written a kuh-zillion books, and I was too old and crotchety to read them.. then the tv show came out... *sigh* Man, am I old (turned 22 wedsnesday!) Lets see, what am I reading now... Umberto Eco - "The Island of the Day Before" - 4 out of 6 angels Robert Anton Wilson - "The Illumintas Trilogy" - 4 out of 6 - -I forgot- - "Ishmael" - 4 out of 6 - -Jeffrey- - -- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- jeffm@genghis.com http://luna.genghis.com/jeff/index.htm - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ From: Loomer Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 08:59:08 -0600 (CST) Subject: NJC - bunch-o-stuff hello again...... this is in response to several things that I read this morning as i was catching up on my email. - ------>1. dinner bell or train whistle....hmmmmm when i hear a dinner bell(my stomach growling) i immediatlely think of FOOD. But when I hear a train whistle it reminds me of "Fat Albert" saying Hey hey hey, get outa my way!!! espescially when he saw food.... - ------->2. I must have missed the original post about the "crash"... what happened??? 3. hey cole I can really tell that you are from St. Louis....MU330 was a band that started at the same high school that I went to. as a matter of fact I knew them while they were still in high school. so of course we would all go and see MU330 and the scb all the time. ok...ok i'll stop my ramblings. later John ------------------------------ From: Thirza Pearl Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:12:41 +0100 Subject: Rosie O'donnell I am watching Rosie O'donnell right now and she Just mentioned Jewel. She said something about a cute little girl, she said " she's very cute, she looks like Jewel!" Thirza ------------------------------ From: toni@indy.net (Toni Dunn) Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:11:38 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Henry and Anais I was really upset when I read the slam on the person for not knowing who HM and AN were. I consider myself very well read thanks to my parents, even though I am young. And I didn't know the story behind the authors until I asked greg about it. The way I see it, as long as someone is getting some exposure to these authors, even if it's through a movie or song, maybe they'll actually take an intrest in the books these authors wrote. It's just a matter of exposure. There are books that I read that I'm sure most people would not have heard of, and I consider them to be very popular. Okay, I'm done with my rambling/venting-Toni "Now she's sitting in the bedroom and she's crying,"-Jewel "I thought that we just drove across the parking lot!" ------------------------------ From: CONNELL@taurus.cs.lmco.com Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:23:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn EDAs, Sorry, but I just can't let this one go without a comment. This is to Sean Hooks (the author) and Haze (replier, who agreed) who commented about knowing "too many girls who have _____ more guys than books they've read" (I REFUSE to use vulgarity in this context in a PUBLIC forum) Are you two serious? Don't you think that comment goes for both sexes and 'maybe' even more the other way around? I know too many guys that are worse. All they read is comics, the funny pages and the sports page. In my case these are men in their 30's with good paying HI-Tech jobs. It was worse ten years ago when I knew these same guys. It was the similar when I was in college. The statement by Sean is so sexist it dumbfounds me. Remember this, (it's old but still the best way to state it) "it takes two to tango, a woman AND a man". Tell me Sean and Haze (I know your name but would never reveal it), do you think for one moment that the guys that are doing it with these girls you are referring to are are Rhodes Scholars or something? Even if so, what makes them better than the girls you are referring to? I think both of you owe each and every girl on this list an apology. Mike Connell (who doesn't hide behind a nickname) ------------------------------ From: James McGarry Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:33:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: NJC: flames On Thu, 14 Nov 1996, James H. Judd wrote: > James, who's no hippie but he's sensitive And he'd "like to stay that way..."? :-) :-) (Sorry, couldn't resist.) :-) James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ From: Matthew Milner Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:37:56 -0500 Subject: Smart Sean Well, as just a dumb computer engineering senior, I guess I can't say much to combat Sean Hooks' wisdom. I'll just sit here in ignorance doing stupid easy tasks like designing microprocessors and dreaming that one day I could be as smart as Sean Hooks, who apparently is a genius for knowing Miller and Nin! The smartest people are the ones who know there is much they don't know Matt Milner ****************************************************** Matthew Milner mmilner@motown.lmco.com st92homi@post.drexel.edu Lockheed Martin Drexel University Love is like quicksilver in the hand. Leave the fingers open and it stays. Clutch it, and it darts away. -- Dorothy Parker GO FLYERS!!!!!!!! ****************************************************** ------------------------------ From: CONNELL@taurus.cs.lmco.com Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:49:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Educate don't condemn Haze, I want to say that the rest of your post was right on and I agree with a great deal of it and what you were doing with it. I posted my previous post to this list after I read the "girls" comment which I was upset with, and before I read the rest of your EMAIL. Putting Mr Controversy in his place was OK, IMHO. I would also like to publically apologize to you for the "Mike Connell (who doesn't hide behind a nickname)" comment that I signed off with. I perhaps assumed something before I read the rest of your post. I am still, of course, upset with the comments about girls that Sean wrote and you agreed with. Mike Connell ------------------------------ From: Uilleann Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:51:41 -0500 Subject: Re: NJC: flames On Thu, 14 Nov 1996, James H. Judd wrote: > James, who's no hippie but he's sensitive > Boy, where'd the impression come from that only hippies are sensitive? Reminds me of an HBO special on cyber-sex lives of "real" people I saw - the quote I just -loved was" "I just love having a Goth boyfriend - he doesn't talk about football all the time!" then, I swear to all I hold sacred, that she gave the most air-headed giggle I've ever heard... Not hiding behind a nick either, Mike! - -Jeffrey, living in a land of Virtual Reality!- - -- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- jeffm@genghis.com http://luna.genghis.com/jeff/index.htm - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ From: James McGarry Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 11:03:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: NJC: Re: Educate don't condemn On Fri, 15 Nov 1996 CONNELL@taurus.cs.lmco.com wrote: > and 'maybe' even more the other way around? I know too many guys that are > worse. All they read is comics, the funny pages and the sports page. In > my case these are men in their 30's with good paying HI-Tech jobs. It was > worse ten years ago when I knew these same guys. It was the similar > when I was in college. I would have to agree with Mike. I'd say anecdotally of the people I know, women are more like to read books and are also more likely to read "serious" books (e.g. like "Tropic of Cancer", etc.) And these are "educated" "professional" men. Though in my peer group women are also more likely to hold more advanced degrees... 'Though, this also has a funny side, i.e. trying to sell the idea of renting Henry V one night. I start off by telling the 'guys' "...there's lots of killing and battle scenes... ...did I mention the killing?... ok.. yeah there's some talking for a while, but then more killing!" While pitching the same idea to their female counterparts was much simpler: "Shakespeare. Kenneth Brannaugh." > I think both of you owe each and every girl on this list an apology. And the women/wimmin too ;-) (Don't worry Mike, I get hell for that one about once a week on average.) :-) James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ From: Eddy Kim Date: Fri, 15 Nov 96 08:05:55 Subject: Re: Jewel in New Hampshire December 3 On Thu, 14 Nov 1996 12:44:55 -0500 (EST), Kate Kosteva wrote: >Hi everyone, [...] >Has anyone heard of The Bodeans or Nada Surf? Are they local to my area >and I'm just out of the loop of current music in Durham? Or are they >universal and I'm out of the loop of music in general? The Bodeans are kinda country/cowboy. I've heard two of their albums: One is a live double CD thingie, which I really liked. It had a touch of country, but not too twangie. The other one that I listened to sounded waaayy too country. Kinda made me queasy. ;) Nada Surf? No Smurf!?! OH NOOOOOO! - -Ed ======== |Eddy H. Kim | ekim@platinum.com (310) 337-5160 |PLATINUM Technology Inc. Los Angeles labs |... Write your complaints in this box-----> [] ------------------------------ From: toni@indy.net (Toni Dunn) Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 11:10:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: NJC:what? Now we're slamming on girls? I have to say that the comment about girls sleeping with a greater number of guys than a number of books that they had read. EXCUSE ME??? Okay, this might be true for a lot of girls, it might also be true for a lot of guys! Why wasn't the word PEOPLE used instead of girls? Why was that generalization made that all girls are sluts? I'm not saying that I've never met any girls who've had a huge amount of sex in their lives. But I also know a lot of guys who didn't know that relationships and sex could be intertwined. Example: I know a guy from a club I went to who lost his virginity when he was 12 and has had on average, one to two parteners per week! I'm sorry to vent this to the list but that comment earlier REALLY got to me! PLEASE, think before you make a statement like that!-Toni "Now she's sitting in the bedroom and she's crying,"-Jewel "I thought that we just drove across the parking lot!" ------------------------------ From: toni@indy.net (Toni Dunn) Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:19:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: NJCRe: Educate don't condemn > This response was just yearning to get out. Sean,you seem to be an >intelligent man but yet I don't think that a truly intelligent man would be My guitarist and I have a theory. Smart people are constantly bragging about how intelligent they are. But the truly intelligent ones sit there and shut their mouths, they don't need to prove anything to anyone. I'm not slamming on sean, but this has always proved to be true in the past-Toni "Now she's sitting in the bedroom and she's crying,"-Jewel "I thought that we just drove across the parking lot!" ------------------------------ From: Chopped Liver Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:28:24 -0700 (MST) Subject: Re: Henry and Anais (NJC) On Thu, 14 Nov 1996, Sean Hooks wrote: > Not to put you down Thirza, you are a new but dedicated > Jewel fan but you should have known who they were before you saw Henry and > June. > Later, > Sean Hooks Everybody has to learn something for the first time. I shall loosely quote the Beatles: There's nothing you can know that can't be known. There's nothing you can show that can't be shown. There's now way you can be that you were't meant to be. Chopped Liver (Charlie) watkins@selway.umt.edu Share publicly, flame privately, " 'Cause anyone can start a conflict it's harder yet to disregard it ". ------------------------------ End of jewel-digest V1 #770 ***************************