From: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org (jewel-digest) To: jewel-digest@smoe.org Subject: jewel-digest V5 #298 Reply-To: jewel@smoe.org Sender: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk jewel-digest Tuesday, September 19 2000 Volume 05 : Number 298 * If you ever wish to unsubscribe from this digest, send an email to * jewel-digest-request@smoe.org with ONLY the word * unsubscribe in the BODY of the email * . * For the latest news on what Jewel is up to, go to * the OFFICIAL Jewel web site at http://www.jeweljk.com * and click on "what's new" * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: jewel-digest V5 #xxx or the like gives fellow list readers * no clue as to what your message is about. Today's Subjects: ----------------- * Sean and Kelli ["Karacostas, Derrick W." ] [EDA] Re: * Sean Hooks' Latest Inflammatory Post ["Amanda Sharp" ] [EDA] Pullyap [ZinzyGurl@aol.com] [EDA] List mail now has a NEW subject prefix [Mike Connell ] [EDA] Re: * Any Puyallup Show Angels? ["Matthew Alan" Subject: * Sean and Kelli Being another long time list member, and after reading the recent posts about the occurences at the beach clean-up, I must say I'm kind of torn between both sides. I tend to believe what Sean and Kelli are saying, simply because they have no reason to make anything up. Knowing Dennis and having met him, I can say that his letter didn't surprise me at all either. I think both sides are being a little distorted, and I don't think any one person is 100% right. I just think some people took things out of context, and while no harm was intended, evidently some was caused. And I'd even go as far to say that jealousy may even be entering into this equation some. Just a thought. I wasn't there so I can't say alot really, but from a third person's perspective, I think everyone is distorting things slightly. Maybe the best thing is for everyone to go their separate ways. Everyone can't get along, no matter what some may think. So just go your own way, and move on. Derrick ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:14:30 -0400 From: "Amanda Sharp" Subject: [EDA] Re: * Sean Hooks' Latest Inflammatory Post All i want to know is one thing. WHy on earth, did you bring the ENTIRE eda community into this sean? I mean seriously. We have all been filling up mail boxes with exactly what we SHOULD be filling them up with. Memories, and well wishes for Mykles family, and about the loss of an obviously dear EDA. Then.. out of the blue, an email about you ranting and raving, and being as stereotypical as i have ever seen anyone be. I think it is rediculous that such an email did make it through the list, as it really had NOTHING AT ALL to do with anyone except the few people involved. I completly agree with Dennis on this, its completly crazy that some things make it (such as this), and some things dont. and as far as this EDA community goes, lets get back to the more appropriate topics and refocus our attention. Dennis...Thanks :o) Have a great day angels Amanda- The College student (as of tomorrow) angel :o) im ssssssccccccaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrreeeeeeeedddddddddd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:27:48 EDT From: JohnnyPlus@aol.com Subject: [EDA] duckets... hey there... whats all this blah blah going on here???... i hear all this complaining about stuff i dont even know about or want to know... all i want is jewel 24/7 pumping through my computer... none of this crying about personality... to say the least ive said the least... good day to a good day... i saw jewel smoking the bob marley... and she was happy... peace... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 15:30:43 CDT From: "Rowdy White" Subject: [EDA] moderation.... Hey, Putting the "He said, she said, that he said" stuff aside for the moment... Who said anything about going back to an unmoderated list? I think what Dennis meant about 'getting the true EDA community back' is not to drop the moderation, but to expand the narrow window into the list. Okay, so we are all dying to know what shade of eye shadow jewel wore yesterday, but personally I wouldn't mind reading about how some EDA(teenage or elderly) was inspired to go out and work at a food bank, or perhaps relate of some good causes that could use a little help. Expanding the list to include things like that does not mean that we must let the moderation fly out the window. I understand that there are some really unsuitable things that get posted sometimes, and perhaps poetry should be posted to the "Thoughts" list, but allowing some more of the "old time" style posts to come through won't hurt. Volume of Mail? Well, right now it seems that the volume of posts is way down, so including a few 'goody-goody' posts shouldn't cause everyone's mail box to overflow. And when the volume picks up during other times (jewel shows, appearances, etc) then why not moderate the posts we're discussing now? I think that would be a fair compromise between the "jewel Only!" hawks and the people who miss what the list used to be... Anyway, just an idea.. take care rowdy PS (Speaking of which, Besides the feud, How did the Beach Clean up go? ) >From: "T Hall" >To: >Subject: Re: * Sean Hooks' Latest Inflammatory Post >Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:47:15 +0200 > ><> >Having the 'true EDA community' back would be great, but really it's not >gonna happen... The list started out as a group of people interested in an >independent, unknown artist. As time's gone on she's become a superstar, a >celebrity, and the fans are now way too diverse a group to agree on a lot >of >things... I joined the list 3 years ago and, yes, it was a lot better for >those few months I was on when it was unmoderated, but the list is still >good for information about Jewel, as well as the occasional 'true >EDA-style' >post... I've never been to a gathering or anything (Europe isn't exactly >famous for those), so I can't comment on them... But I have to say that, in >terms of the 'EDA spirit', FTE is a lot more like the old EDA list I >joined... > >That said, these kind of discussions went on before... And that time when >Mike decided to let the list go unmoderated for a few days wasn't exactly >the best few days on the list :)... Hey, let's do it again [1]! Hmmmm... > >Tom. >The I don't have an Angel-name Angel. >With 'this probably won't get through, will it [2] ?' issues. > >[1] - seriously, let's go unmoderated again, it was very interesting, at >least! >[2] - oops... 2nd FTE reference in one post [3]... will I get kicked or >just >flamed for that? >[3] - is it even legal to be a Jewel *and* Sarah fan [4] at the same time? >[4] - I also like Dido... And Mary Beth... Oh, and Tara... Any objections? > > > _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:34:37 EDT From: ZinzyGurl@aol.com Subject: [EDA] Pullyap Hey everyone, just an interesting thing I saw about the Pallyup Fair. I was watching Big Brother (Go George!) LoL and they were talking about a mini-house, at the Pallyup Fair! Wow, interesting I thought. The name sounded familiar, and now I know where I heard it from. Anyhow, it is being done by a local pop radio station, wouldn't it be cool if Jewel stayed in it for the day she is there? LoL Just a thought. Oh, and thank you to everyone who responded about my father. It feels great to know that there are so many caring people out there, even if I don't know everyone personally, I feel we know each other spiritually. Gina EastAngel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 16:39:30 -0400 From: Mike Connell Subject: [EDA] List mail now has a NEW subject prefix Just wanted to let you know that as of like 15 minutes ago, I changed the list so that emails from the EDA/Jewel@smoe.org lists automatically begin with [EDA] instead of the * we used to use. Please note that you do NOT have to put this in your subject when you send a post, the list serve software does it automatically. Mike :-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 13:58:30 -0700 From: "The wise and powerful Chuckman" Subject: [EDA] Re: * Any Puyallup Show Angels? What is that? Saturday school? Well, the living room tour etc lacked EDA participation, so all of that has reluctantly been cancelled although I am definately going to the cocert! (Even though ticket-bastard still hasn't gotten the tickets to me) some friends and I will be hanging around the fair earlier in that day too, lemme know if anyone wants to get together there. Well, just got back from vacation for two weeks, so I have to go sort through the other 342 messages in my inbox. Hope to meet a few of you there. :) Charles The sullen, pensive angel. ALVolkle@aol.com wrote: >Hey John- > Well you KNOW I am going to be there..I can hardly wait!!!! I am so glad I >have school on Saturday so my day will go fast!!! See you there:) > TTYS Amy > > - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Why is College Club the largest and fastest growing college student site? Find out for yourself at http://www.collegeclub.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:00:11 EDT From: ZinzyGurl@aol.com Subject: [EDA] ROFLMAO!!!! LoL Ha, that was pretty good, that little clip of Jewel doing Dolores from the Cranberries. I am a fan of them, but you know, when something's funny, you can't help but laughing! Gina EastAngel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:00:30 EDT From: ZinzyGurl@aol.com Subject: [EDA] What is with the EDA being in brackets in the mailings now? Just wondering if I had missed something :~) Gina EastAngel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:37:26 EDT From: Poet2811@aol.com Subject: [EDA] *sigh* I have said this before, and I will repeat it again. If people would just calm down a little bit and take what other people say with a grain of salt, none of this would be happening... Everyone just needs to calm down cause in the big picture...none of this maters. I can understand how Sean feels, because often times the things that he says are reacted to angrily and such...we all know this. This topic has been chewed over (I say you go Sean! But who am I?) before. IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH SOMEONE AND YOU KNOW THIS DELEATE THE E-MAIL. IT'S NOT THAT HARD!!!! If you think something that someone will say will offend you you have a few choices. [1] Deleate the e-mail, as I do, BEFORE reading it, being mature and recognizing the e-mail may cause a disturbance. ie- the subject of Sean's last e-mail was obviously going to ruffle some feathers. [2] Read it and don't react. IT'S A MAILING LIST! NOT LIFE! spend your energy worrying about something more important. [3] read it and react negativly, causing angst and hurt feelings to sweep through the list. Everyone has the right to at least state something. You also have the right to remain silent about what the other person states. Obseve the right to remain silent. It helps. SO...calm down...There is no reason to get all upset. There is no reason to point fingers at Sean or Dennis or certainly not Mike. All of us need to get off our high horses. IT"S A MAILING LIST! Rachel *the only slightly lonely poetic angel* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 15:48:54 -0700 (PDT) From: Sable Jewell Subject: [EDA] My idea I got an idea. Why don't the EDA's have an award that they give to an EDA that has done something good for someone else or for the good of humanity or something like that? It's just an idea i had.P.S. you probably don't know who i am, because i haven't posted very many times. Sable"The ????? Angel" (I need an angel name, any ideas?) P.S. you probably don't know who i am, because i haven't posted very many times. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 17:10:31 PDT From: "Matthew Alan" Subject: [EDA] Re: * Any Puyallup Show Angels? Hey everyone, I'll be going to the Puyallup show and can't wait for it. This will be my first Jewel concert. Hope to see angels there. Matt Alan <~The Marauder Angel~ _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 21:59:13 EDT From: PiecesofKate34@aol.com Subject: [EDA] *bicker=fun? angels, i know that some of you have very strong opinions about this whole situation from the beach cleanup this weekend and with sean..etc but i would , as would some other EDA's im sure, be very happy if this could be between the people who went, and not the rest of the EDA's who try to enjoy the list and the positive posts. I know that Sean started it by posting to the whole list, but do we all have to do the same thing he did? no-- if you have words with Sean, please tell him, not me. It is none of my business. i hope everything works out and everyone can be happy again :) thank you katie :) *the theater angel* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:09:43 EDT From: QTpie324@aol.com Subject: [EDA] I'm new too! Hi, My name is Victoria. I absolutely love Jewel and my sister, ChrissyPf1, started me with the eda's. i just wanted to say hi to everyone and im very sorry i never got to talk to michael. he seems like her must have been a very special man and my prayers go out to his family. Hope to hear from you guys soon! ~Victoria~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 13:47:53 +1100 From: Dung Nguyen Subject: [EDA] you guys need to sort it out it's sad to see fellow EDA members quarreling over something so trivial. it's even worse when the whole EDA list is dragged into the argument. such petty arguments should be settled between those involved. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:55:51 EDT From: "Devin Starr" Subject: [EDA] yet another personal opinion to add to the pile Hey angels if anyone is still on this list and reading anything instead of just hitting delet as i do a lot of the time do to excessive crap like this stuff, Hi. ok, so once again as a community we falter, as do most at some time. The post origianlly done by Sean (who i dont know) should have been sent privately to those involved, and probably typed after a good nite sleep and a nice drink. The post by Dennis, should have been a bit less NAZI-ESQUE. by this i mean TRUE EDA. last time i heard something like this it was anti jewish comments, and then they gased as many as possible, looted, burned ect (read a history book for detail)And Kelli was good to defend herself, if it was indeed she being spoken about, but once more.. entire thing should have been done on hte private scale. i have never met any EDA's. I have talked to a few of them, and i am glad i have (hey rich! hey stacey! hey all.. you know who you are!) but honestly i cant help but never want to ever attend an EDA gathering if this is how everyone is when they are just on the net.. if we all met would it come to blows?? i havent met those involved, and to be honest... i dont really want to now. im probably not the only one. but if i am thats cool.. i will be the unknown EDA... but we all need to remember than some messages need to be posted to certain people, and i know that i am not hte best person to talk to about this, as i was involved in the CAN/AMERICA relations issue, but that was eventually brought private longer than anyone else knows. I here by think that we should not be called EDA's but EDP, because in the end we are every day people.. we arent angel, but we can still try. Jess angel with broken wings _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 23:52:24 EDT From: Sean35RL@aol.com Subject: [EDA] The "EDA Community" plus distortions from Dennis and defending myself I'm Sean Hooks and I've been just as active on the list as Dennis, also since 1996. He's been more active outside of the list: meeting other EDAs, saving the world, etc. I believe this post accomplishes two things. First, it covers what I think is a big problem in the "EDA community", and secondly it allows me a chance to defend myself against Dennis's allegations. So: >Quite frankly, Sean's predatory conduct (ie, showing up on Saturday night >and immediately targeting and hitting VERY hard on female EDAs) at the >two Bearsville campouts he did attend offends me (I have made this quite >clear to both Sean and several other EDAs involved). Predatory conduct? God forbid I try to use the list gatherings as a chance to actually meet and interact with people on an intimate personal level. Does the fact that I also spent a lot of time alone with Mike Connell mean I was "hitting VERY hard on" him? I'm a Saturday night kind of guy, I like to hang out and have a good time and have meaningful conversations. I can understand say, Tammy being offended, because I directly questioned some of her beliefs. Why should Dennis be so "offended" simply because I enjoy female companionship? >Ironically, Sean's"defender" repeatedly -- and angrily -- rejected his highly >aggressive advances this past summer, whether she remembers it or not. Other >than riding watch on Sean that night, I have always greeted Sean with open arms. Bullshit. Ask Kelli. She simply didn't want to have a one night fling. And as our relationship proves, I think we did the right thing. If she was rejecting anyone's advances it was XXXXXXXXXX. And as for Dennis "riding watch." This is true, he did spend a lot of time keeping an eye on Kelli and me. But not for the reasons he states. To QUOTE him, he said, to me, in regards to my spending time with Kelli and his refusing to leave us alone: "If we're(referring to himself and XXXXXXXXXX) not getting any, you aren't either." Is this someone staunchly defending female EDAs(which is a sexist act that implies that women need defending by men), or is it someone dealing with his own "issues," to use his phrasing, most notably jealousy. >I dislike public piss fights; they leave everyone dirty and >unsatisfied. I only speak publically about this situation because Sean >has chosen to publically slander EDAs who actually DO positive things. This is judgmental nonsense. This is Dennis acting like he and the people who engage in volunteerism and community service are somehow better than those of us on the list who would rather just discuss Jewel's life and music, instead of using her and her organization(the J-team) as an "inspiration" to organize altruistic events. >What I CANNOT understand is why the list moderator (Mike) will publish >Sean's bullshit post, and those discussing such "deep" topics as Jewel's >breasts and similar shallow threads, while REFUSING to publish posts from >teenage EveryDay Angels who write how they do positive things in their >communities or are inspired by Jewel and their fellow list members to >live their lives to the fullest. Yeah, right, because I'm not out there saving the baby seals I'm not living my life to the fullest. And maybe Mike published my post because unlike those of you at the beach cleanup, he actually has taken the time to get to know me personally, rather than just act standoffish to me because I am different. You(Dennis) are advocating censorship. You personally think altruistic efforts are more important than discussing Jewel's appearance. Fine, you're entitled to your opinion. Others would disagree. But there's no need for you to try to impose your standards on Mike(the list manager), or the list. >The EDA community has steadily eroded over the past two years (in the >opinion of myself and many other longtime EDAs). I would venture to make >an educated guess that the J-team would prefer community building and >leading by example Maybe it has "eroded," but if so, it's because of close-mindedness and not appreciating our differences and scorning anyone who thinks differently, who dares say(gasp!) a critical or negative thing about Jewel's music. And as for the J-team, I would venture an educated guess that the VAST majority of list members barely know who they are, nor do they care what they think. Most EDAs I would think view this as a forum to express their own opinions and trade thoughts and ideas with other EDAs, not have the J-team tell them what to think or what organizations to donate their time and efforts to. Philanthropy and altruism may be for you Dennis, but they are not for everyone, that is not the purpose of this list. >For Sean Hooks to interrupt the recent thread of tributes for a true EDA >like the late Mykle Mariette... If people want to talk about him, fine. But again, this is Dennis preaching at us about what we should be discussing. There's no such thing as a "true EDA." I for one am tired of feeling like if I died, the EDA vets would throw a party and say "Thank god we got rid of him, he wasn't a nice, good, altruistic soul like ourselves." Unlike Dennis I have no "obvious bitterness" to feel sorry about, nor any of his apparent jealousy. I have no ill will towards anyone on the list. Even Dennis himself, I kinda like him for the most part. He's pretty smart and funny and outgoing. And I'll close with an example: Even though I might have disagreed with some of Tammy's beliefs at the last Bearsville, and called her on them to her face, I'd be the first one to say that she does a good thing by organizing the Bearsville gatherings to begin with and I also told her that, to her face, right before I left and she invited me back next year(she and Mike can attest to that as they were both there). Just a quick example there, anyway, I've gone on long enough but I do believe my post addresses the two things I set out to do. I defended myself while hopefully addressing a larger and more "on-topic" problem, that of the EDA community as a whole. Be well, Sean Hooks "Where there's service, there's someone being served. The man who speaks to you of sacrifice, speaks of slaves and masters. And intends to be the master." - -Ayn Rand ------------------------------ End of jewel-digest V5 #298 ***************************