From: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org (jewel-digest) To: jewel-digest@smoe.org Subject: jewel-digest V4 #139 Reply-To: jewel@smoe.org Sender: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-jewel-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk jewel-digest Wednesday, March 17 1999 Volume 04 : Number 139 * If you ever wish to unsubscribe, send an email to * jewel-digest-request@smoe.org with ONLY the word * unsubscribe in the body of the email * . * For the latest information on Jewel tour dates, go to: * http://jewel.zoonation.com and click on "TOUR" * OR * go to the OFFICIAL Jewel home page at http://www.jeweljk.com * and go to the "What, When, Where" section * . * PLEASE :) when you reply to this digest to send a post TO the list, * change the subject to reflect what your post is about. A subject * of Re: jewel-digest V4 #xxx or the like gives readers no clue * as to what your message is about. Today's Subjects: ----------------- =?ISO-8859-1?Q?ANY EDA=B4s in Germany??= [Recko9@aol.com] NJC: Smile When You Say "Vet", Tex... ;-) [Harrisbros@aol.com] NJC: Love those reviews, but Jewel, come home already! [Harrisbros@aol.c] NJC: Ummm...okay [Angeljlr98@aol.com] Re: My Jewel "Flu" and Jewel wishes to duet with Satan [Nat ] Re: Jewel a hypocrite for playing Singapore ["Harinder Grewal" From where I sit, you need to say four things >in your letter to qualify as a vet: >1. I haven't posted since (insert your time here) ...yesterday? >2. Talking about and to people that were here last time you posted ...yes, you were here yesterday, and I will undoubtedly talk to and about you ;-) >3. Saying the list sucks now ...not me, brother. This list is absolutely gonna fly! (oops, wrong answer -- guess now I'm NOT a vet -- yeehaw!) >4. Mentioning Jewelstock a minimum of 43 times ...well... JewelStock is a "trigger", Amias, so I'm liable to say it at least another 43 times! And I'll state what I've said 1,000 times: I'll do whatever it takes to get EDAs together. The second time I saw Jewel was at the Boston show that I think produced the BEST angelfood ever -- ""Jewel Rocks the Paradise". (get it and really appreciate Jewel) More important, the (arguably) first EDA Gathering occurred there. We agreed to meet beforehand at a pre-show appearance. It took me shamelessly waving a sign while standing on a bookcase at Borders Bookstore, but we all found each other. By the end of the night, there were at least 16 of us together. After the show, we hung out on the sidewalk and bs'ed with strangers on the street for an hour. At that point, I was hooked. Jewel was fine, but EDAs were better. >...saying these same things OVER and OVER again not only make the new people feel >unwanted, but it also kinda distracts from the purpose of this debate: to >make the list better. Right now, it's all just nostalgia. Kinda like all >the old EDAs have been prompted to have a collective flashback. Actually, it's just an attempt to give y'all new folks options. A glimpse at what's possible. When the "vets" first came on the scene circa 1996, there was already an "old guard" here -- the "ecto" folks who started this list. Some of them didn't seem to care for the EDA/friendship posts that suddenly littered the list, and many of them went their own way. But I'd venture to say that the "old guard" had a hell of a lot more interest in and knowledge of various artists and music in general than did the "newbies" (ie, today's vets) at that time. But, the vets "got" the EDA thing. What will today's newbies want to "get"? I value not my TIME on this list, but the QUALITY of my experiences. And I expect great things of everyone on this list, especially from all the folks I don't know. > I forget what his name was, but a new EDA recently posted and said he just >joined. His basic subject of the letter was "What the F*** is going on?" >And I REALLY REALLY wanted to cry for him. That has to suck to be thrown >into the middle of this having no clue that the list is having a personality crisis. Have you ever seen an exceptional movie (or read an exceptional book) that required some effort to keep up on the part of the participant? If it comes down to raising the awareness of the participant or lowering the value of the product/message, I say we work on the awareness. There are LOTS of places in the world to get basic info on Jewel. There are only TWO to discover and enjoy the EveryDay Angels experience: here on the Jewel list and by participating with the EveryDay Angels Foundation. (of course, chance meetings with EDAs work as well! ;-) > To be quite honest, if I had known that THIS was what went on in this list >nowdays, I'm not sure I would have joined. But I'm here now, and I want >things to get better. >- -Amias >The angel with a headache from reading big posts Take two aspirin and call me anytime, Amias. Also, think about going to the digest version to cut down the volume of mail (for yourself and the SMOE server). Seriously, from your addy I guess that you attend UT in Austin, Texas. That 's my hometown and I visit from time to time. Last Xmas, I met with the Second Harvest food bank folks in Austin to see what sort of volunteer support program they offer. It is EXCEPTIONAL, so I'd like to get you, and what seems to be quite a few local central Texas EDAs (including Tessa and Luna at UT) together for a gathering that might involve volunteering at the food bank... are you interested? That goes for ANYONE around the country. Email me (or email the EveryDay Angels Foundation at EDAFinfo@aol.com) and let us know where you are located and we'll try to match up enough of you to make it fun. Do what we've done in New Jersey and Massachusetts -- get together, volunteer four hours at the local food bank or beach cleanup, have lunch and then go do something together. Bring extra angelfood tapes for the folks who have none, extra copies of Jewel stuff, whatever! Share. Laugh. Make friends. Then tell us what you did. Inspire others to do the same. Give us NEW stories! It will be one of the best Saturdays you have ever had, trust me. Just don't say you're sick of hearing how good it HAS been in the past. It's history, but a damn fine one at that! Now, learn from it and improve on it. THAT'S THE RESPONSIBILITY OF EVERYONE CURRENTLY IN THIS COMMUNITY. BUILD ON THIS LIST'S ACHIEVEMENTS, AND IMPROVE IT. Listen to "Spirit" closely and look at the HGH Foundation goals, then try to tell me with a straight face that this attitude doesn't belong on this list! For my part, I'm scheming on this season's new "stupid EDA tricks"! Every year, we dream up new things to do, and somehow pull them off by the end of the summer. My biggest joy on this list is to get 50 or so of y'all together and see everyone acting like eight year olds (in the good way, of course!). We've done water fights, laser tag, paintball, theme parks, twister, beach Jewelympics, etcetera. I have two interesting things in mind, and even the *serious* MrBB seemed to like the ideas (or was that the wacky Alan Bershaw?)... Dennis (I feel the silly dance coming on) Harris Oh, BTW... Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock Jewelstock ... (and THAT is the minimum! ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 03:47:52 EST From: Harrisbros@aol.com Subject: NJC: Love those reviews, but Jewel, come home already! I gotta say how much I love reading the reviews from the folks on the other side of the world who are lucky enough to finally get to see Jewel! Keep 'em coming, while we U.S. EDAs plot our nefarious plans for world domination! :-) BTW, who else thinks that Steve Poltz may have finally met his drinking match with the Australian music fans? ;-) Dennis Harris, who thinks Fuzzy would've been MUCH cuter as a koala bear... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:09:57 EST From: Angeljlr98@aol.com Subject: NJC: Ummm...okay In a message dated 3/16/99 11:06:41 PM, you wrote: <> Sorry...I just had to respond to this post from Scott. Ummm...who's insulting the vets? People are giving their opinions. And ummm...who's sayng anything about respecting elders? Vet does not equal elder...not in thi situation. Jamie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 08:47:21 From: Nat Subject: Re: My Jewel "Flu" and Jewel wishes to duet with Satan >Also I don't know if it has been mentioned but Jewel is on the cover of Teen >magazine and it quotes her as saying "I worship Marilyn Manson. Were different >sides of the same coin. He wants to do the same thing I do-break down >boundaries and teach people to be more open. I'd love to do a duet with him." > >My opinion-Well I love Jewel but has she lost her damn mind? Manson the guy is >a total sicko. Lets compare >Jewel-Optimistic has faith in God and a love for people. >Manson-Pesimitic,AKA Satan. Complete Wacko would kill everyone. Believes >people are inherently bad. Overall not a nice guy. > >PS Feel free to share your opinion on the matter but if you flame me you will >burn in hell:) >I aint got nothing but Love for all EDA's I tend to agree with you. I did try and understand why on earth she or anyone would say that, but I'm still stuck. I mean, "breaking down boundaries" blah blah? Come on, this guy, image or not, does nothing but promote, as you said, pessimism and hate. It is so simplistic to just think, oh he's breaking down boundaries, without considering WHAT boundaries. With such logic, we should admire Hitler for following through with his ideals! Perhaps it was a throw away comment and she didn't think about it. I don't know, I'm open to reasons. Does anyone have a possible explanation or think the same? Nat the confused, but still classical angel. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 19:37:45 +1000 From: Shane Subject: Oh no, you got me posting about the lists future :) You've done it now, you've got me posting 3 things in oneday. This can only mean one thing is about to happen, im going to voice my oppinion *hears crowds going wild*. Where to start. How about the newbies + vets bit. I coudnt sum it up any better than Dennis did but i would like to add my humble oppinion to the body count. Vets are only here to help, i joined in early 97, and without the help of people such as Mike, Gian, Greg and tom, (more to mention to) i would have been a lost wittle boy. I think newbies have to remember that the vets saw the really true great years of the list, and the great gatherings they had. We cant be harsh on them just because they like to talk about something they loved dearly, like Jewelstock. I know i would have loved to have been there, and i woundnt have stopped talking about it ever, but alas i live in Australia, the land of Kangaroo pouch racing, and crocidile wrasling (yes i spelt wrestling wrong on purpose) What im trying to say is the vets have a right to tell there stories to us, there not showing off, (even tho i would) here just being proud of what they did. So relax people. I love hearing there stories and huggable antics, and i wish they would post more. To much moderation or lack of it: I would like to see this list unmoderated for awhile, but look what happened last time, that might have been just a one night fling so to speak. I believe with the guidance of Mike, Alan and the rest of the vets, and us newbies and the rest (im not a newbie, but not a vet, im in between) we can make this mailing list something really special, and something for us to be proud of even more. Look to the future, dont dwell on the past, but by all means talk about the good things that happened in the past. Dont sit there and say, "Hrmph, i want the list like it use to be" it wont be the same, but that doesnt mean it cant be as special. One more thing, What happened to all you people that went on #EDA on undernet, The IRC Chat lines. We use to have 20 peeps (people) or more on at one time sometimes, what happened to that. I was there just before (im a IRC junkie *cant sleep irc needs me*) and there was hardly any one there. Anywho, mIRC is a great tool, go get it at www.mirc.com :) One more thing *hears groans* im coming to America real soon, so watch out all gatherings taking place. Im a good source of entertainment value tho, you can play games like trying to understand what the rambling Aussie is saying, and pin the tail on the Aussie. :) And many more :) Anywho Take 2 I love this list and everyone in it :) Why cant we all be happy chappy's :) Cya's :) Take care all :) Shane :) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 02:10:17 PST From: "Chris Ryan" Subject: She "saved" my life Hello All: After sitting back & listening to you banter back & forth about "newbies vs vets" & "she changed on us", I felt I had to write in with a story/my opinion. My first experience finding Jewel was on a night when I felt my life could not get any worse & I was wallowing deep in the pit of despair. The gun was on the table & I was a hairbreadth away from using it. Then, "Amen" came on the radio, & I was immediately taken aback by the melody & or course, the breathtaking beauty of that angelic voice. She sang, "you are nothing less than beautiful". That made me realize that I do have something to contribute to humanity & my whole outlook on life changed after that. So, I guess I just wanted to say that life is short & you only get one go-round at it. Do you want to waste time feuding about things so minute & petty? Or do you want to make the most of life & meet new people, make new friends, & maybe clean a beach or two? Cause friends, there is a lot of things we can do to contribute to the wellness of each other! Remember, Jewel's message is one of optimism, togetherness, & that we all have to "be the difference that makes a difference." BTW: I live in Minnesota, am 24, have never seen Jewel live, & am a "newbie" to this list. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. Chris cryan10@hotmail.com "The ever-so-glad he's alive" angel Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 20:47:02 PST From: "Harinder Grewal" Subject: Re: Jewel a hypocrite for playing Singapore Who the hell do you think you are, Sean Hooks, to decide who's a hypocrite and who isnt, or which country is worthy and which is not. Firstly, what the hell has Michael Fay got to do with Jewel? He's such an angel, I hear his own father in Dayton Ohio had the police called in to deal with his angel who was threatening him with a knife. He's another who's had the pleasure of knowing the oh-so-brilliant and faultless American justice system from the inside. The same justice system that let OJ off for murder. The same justice system that has a young law-abiding man in jail for life (?) for hitting another kid in the home of his girlfriend (one punch!), after his girlfriend left him for the other guy. Wow, life for a punch. Second, Micheal was caned 4 times, I believe. I trust according to your definition, the first strike was torture, the second flogging, the third, caning and the fourth whipping. What's the difference, pray tell, and the need to describe it in four different ways? And despite what the reliable American media made it out to be, and how Michael himself described it on I believe it was Larry King Live, caning is not done in public. Such a reliable and trustworthy character, him. And of course he has to make a big deal out of his suffering. After all, the story has to sell - I believe he was offered huge amounts of money for rights to a book and movie. Was his suffering any more than any of the others who are caned and manage to make good lives for themselves after they get out? Michael was a visitor in my country, living a rather priviledged life as the kid of an expatriate. As a student here, he was aware of the laws and the punishments associated with breaking those laws (the Amercian School makes it a point to teach students the laws of the country they are in). Despite knowing them, he flouted them knowing full well the punishment in store for him shoud he get caught. Maybe he was hoping, being an American or having a step-dad who's in an infleuntial position (his company did threaten to take their biz elsewhere if the punishment was not reduced) that he'd be above our law and get away with it. Well, tough luck, Michael - you're no better than the rest of us. Justice in Singapore is blind, unlike what it may be elsewhere. Personally, I think caning is too harsh a punishment for vandalism, But the fact is it was the law at the time, he knew it (well, he should have if he was paying attention in school), despite that committed several crimes several times, and so deserved to be punished. No one should expect preferential treatment here. And I'm glad our government did not given in to the pressure from Clinton despite the possible dire consequences (the US is our biggest trading partner). And Clinton was smart enough to know that Micheal Fay was not worth the effort. Also, in case it's slipped your mind, let me remind you that racism, sexism, and other hate crimes are very much a reality in the US, maybe even more so than in many other countries, developed or developing. The KKK and skinhead movements are gaining popularity. The police in some areas in the US are infamous for brutality, especially those involving African Amercians. Women in the US workforce face more discrimination than most developed countries (I'm not guessing, these are based on surveys and reports). There are many more examples. So, why isn't Jewel a hypocrite for performing in the US? I'm sure she'd be more aware of the atrocities committed there even if she is not aware of those allegedly committed here, like you hypothesize. You said "The poor, unemployed, and working class are routinely subjected to such dehumanization and violence at the hands of the Singapore government." You speak with such authority, I'm sure convincing people who dont know better. But you obviously have no idea what you're talking about. You've never been here, but apparently you're privy to information I have no knowledge of, despite having lived here all my life. Please enlighten me if you have proof to the contrary, I'd be glad to hear it. To my knowledge, the govt has implemented programmes to help people, not dehumanise them. We have no homeless people roaming the streets and scouring the bins for leftovers; we had full employment until the Asian crisis hit last year, so I dont know how the govt could even have been dehumanising the unemployed. Since last year, the govt has set up avenues to help the unemployed find jobs, including matching employers with candidates, and funding training to help the unemployed pick up skills that may enable them to get higher skill jobs, since its mostly those working in low-skill jobs in the factories of multi national companies that are losing their jobs. What working class? Are u aware of a class system here in Singapore? Pray let me know how it's classified - I did a paper on social stratification in Singapore, and had a bloody tough time operationalising my hypothesis because there are hardly any real obvious class indicators as such. This is because we are a meritocratic society - if you have a good education, you'll probably have a good job, a good income and a good home. And all kids, rich or poor, have access to that good education, so the poverty cycle as such does not exist. I'm from a minority race here, barely 1% of the population. Singapore is home to many races, although one race, the Chinese, makes up over 75% of teh population. Despite this imbalance and diversity, I have never encountered any racial episodes like those we hear about in the US. Singapore can truly call itself a multi-racial, multi-lingual and multi-religious country. Can the US? I just read a report (a US mag) that blacks and whites are becoming increasingly segregated in the US. Very few white kids have black friends, and vice-versa. Isnt it a fact that many whites are even scared of blacks? How many Chinese Americans havent been taunted with slurs like "Chink", "go home, rice-eater"? I've NEVER heard any racial taunts like these in SIngapore. I have close friends who are Chinese, Malays, Indians, Sikhs, Eurasians, and Caucasians. We all appreciate each other's cultures, and celebrate in our diversity, as we celebrate each others festivals together (visiting each other). Tell me, can u say you feel safe walking down the streets late at night all alone? I'm female, and can say I do. I do it all the time, in fact, as I often work late. And I'll take that sense of security for myself, and everyone I care about over protection for criminals any day. Why the hell should I have to live in fear just to protect them? I think I should have the right to live my life without always worrying for my safety and for the saftey of those I love. Why do I have to take precautions to keep safe, like not going out late alone, carrying mace, etc? I dont want to live in fear, and am grateful for the freedom I have here. I love travelling and have travelled a fair bit, both near and far. Having seen a variety of systems, I am more aware of and appreciative of the good life I have - I am proud to call myself a Singaporean and to say that I live in Singapore. As beautiful and engaging as other countries have been, I'd never be able to have the life I have here anywhere else - one of security, a high standard of living, a meritocratic and good education system for my kids, good friends and neighbours, and of great importance to someone like me who is a minority wherever I go, a truly multi-racial country, where all races co-exist peacefully with one another in the same neighbourhhoods and go to the same schools, appreciate each other's differences while relishing our underlying similaritiess, and where discrimination and racial attacks are practically unheard of and abhored. Sean, I was extremely shocked and disappointed to read your post this morning. I see others have responded. I have not read their responses yet. Whatever it is they've said, I just want to say that if all Jewel fans on this list are as narrow-minded and self-righteous as you, I have no desire to stay on this list. I joined this list last week, for news on Jewel, and to share and exchange views. But not views espousing such hypocrisy and self-righteousness. I think it'll be sad that the only list I've ever had to leave for such a reason is the Jewel list. I dont know, but I kinda expected more of people who appreciate Jewel's music. I wonder what Jewel would say if she read your post? I would like to know, cos if she agreed with you, I'd tear up my concert tix right away. harin ------------------------------ End of jewel-digest V4 #139 ***************************