From: owner-jewel-digest To: jewel-digest@smoe.org Subject: jewel-digest V1 #552 Reply-To: jewel@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-jewel-digest Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "jewel-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. jewel-digest Sunday, 8 September 1996 Volume 01 : Number 552 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Duet on "Carnivore" A life!!!!! NJC: Really F#@$% up poem!! Re: A life!!!!! re:Re: An article about Tori Amos duets again NJC: Pissing contest canceled Jewel's talent NJC: Why so emotional? NJC: Pissing contest canceled The Jewelstock Poetry NJC: gotta be a smartass Re: one last comment on Jewel v. Alanis stupid message--sorry :( feeling real good/musings on this list NJC: misuse of "Ironic" correction/followup ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: The Pirate King Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 13:39:47 -0700 Subject: Duet on "Carnivore" My entry into the Duets catalog would be Jewel and Brad Roberts of the Crash Test Dummies doing Miss Kilcher's very own "Carnivore." I can already hear Roberts' voice booming "Caaaaaarnivooooooore." Once there was this girl who went into a Denny's just so she could wash her hair but then these two old women blue-haired, they sneered and called her a hobo She left and some years later She flipped them off soooooo haaarrrd ... Mmmm mmmm mmmm mmmm - - Carter Navarro, Mannequin by Day, Crash Test Dummy by Night ------------------------------ From: Crunch Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 16:41:52 -0400 Subject: A life!!!!! Patric wrote: > Hoping everyone that needs a life gets one, > Patric=) I need a life. Do you, Patric, know where I can get a good one at a fair price? If it's a bargain, I'll take 3 or 4. =) Crunch ------------------------------ From: Raphael the archangel <75271.2740@CompuServe.COM> Date: 08 Sep 96 17:20:09 EDT Subject: NJC: Really F#@$% up poem!! Hello there: First poem I've written in 2-3 months. To tell you the truth I don't even like it, I find it too digresive and even disturbing. I didn't put any thought to it , so don't be offended. I wrote it in 5 minutes and it shows. Nevertheless I would like for you guys to give me feed back. "Fuck Me" Time to wake up the red blood pigmentation in her sheets. Hot nasseau (sp) in her breath... Thinning eyes and an open bottle of death lies half spilled between her breasts. A desperate push an indiferent pull... a small star smiling faintly at the act of a westbound escape. No more angels , for I've bled too much to ignore the possibilty of the existance of a drugged lost soul. Plant my heart in unfertile soil... let it be stripped off it's love, let it's true colors toll. Corrupted mother and her insolent child. Oil covered flower with petroleum for blood. Let me cry , unless you can change my views from realistic to idealistic. Blind fold me , spin me around ... let me walk straight to my grave, with a ignorant smile upon my face. Let me curse God , for that's what he wants me to do... so He has another reason to send me to hell. Spread her legs open , don't let the devil dive in. I'm fucked anyways.... by: Rafa p.s: it's kinda disgusting now that I've read it for the second time , give me feed back and if you want to insult me as a poetic pig , please do so!! p.p..s: WE WON THE SOCCER TOURNAMENT WE HAD THIS WEEKEND!!! ------------------------------ From: Selena Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 17:46:10 -0700 Subject: Re: A life!!!!! Crunch, Wanna pick up a few for me too? Make them charmed ones, if you don't mind. Selena ------------------------------ From: "The Great Cornholio" Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 17:52:41 EDT Subject: re:Re: An article about Tori Amos What does everyone think about this?? I think hes wrong.....I mean, its the same with Jewel. If he knew who she was, he'd be downing her too....I can't believe his ignorance. He doesn't understand about our connections with muscians. He think Tori Amos is a bullshitter. I say we write him and tell him WHY these artists mean something to us!!!!!!!!!! because until he hears someone other than "a naive 14 yr old" hes not going to understand. His name is Tom Quarles. His e mail address is violet13@fc.net.....write him. Tell him what you think. Chelsea I think he does have a point. Musicians, while having meaning to us personally, do not dictate society. They influence the masses, but they aren't personally responsible for any change in the world. That takes individuals. I think his point was that we shouldn't take so many musicians' word as our personal belief system. He sounds very angry at the youth of today who seem to worship musicians as heroes. He has a point there in that I, too, think that people take musicians too seriously. Unless we plan to be musicians, we really shouldn't worship them as much as we do. He had no right to insult Tori Amos, but his point was valid. And the part about musicians being food was also not so bad. If the world fell apart, musicians would be merely entertainment, as they are now, and couldn't do any more to alleviate the situation than any other person. Anyway, I thought you should all consider that raving people sometimes have a valid point, they just don't make it well. later gators, newt "The wonderful thing about Tiggers is Tiggers are wonderful things Their tops are made out of rubber Their bottoms are made out of springs They're bouncy, trouncy, flouncy, pouncy, Fun, fun, fun, fun, fun About the most wonderful thing about Tiggers is I'm the only one I'M THE ONLY ONE!"- Tigger in "Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day" ------------------------------ From: "The Great Cornholio" Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 17:58:37 EDT Subject: duets again Here's one: Jewel and Cannibal Corpse!!! Oh, I suppose that wouldn't work well, would it? How about Pantera? No? Okay. Hmmm, let's see, Jewel and Weird Al!!! Now that's an idea!!! Speaking of which, I wonder if ol Weird Al is planning a Jewel parody. If anyone can do it, Al can! I'm still pushing for Jewel and Tull, though. She'd be great on Thick as a Brick or maybe something off of Songs from the Wood. Anyway, gotta go. later gators, newt "The wonderful thing about Tiggers is Tiggers are wonderful things Their tops are made out of rubber Their bottoms are made out of springs They're bouncy, trouncy, flouncy, pouncy, Fun, fun, fun, fun, fun About the most wonderful thing about Tiggers is I'm the only one I'M THE ONLY ONE!"- Tigger in "Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day" ------------------------------ From: Harrisbros@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 18:25:44 -0400 Subject: NJC: Pissing contest canceled <<>>styles... Jewel is talented and Alanis isn't.. Case closed. >Yeah, you're right. Alanis has about as little talent as Jewel has. >Case re-opened.>> ***Hunter then responded: >>Okay people who are arguing, this issue is not worth arguing, and is obviously going nowhere. When my firends went out and saw "Ace Ventura: Pet Detective", they were raving about how good it was. I later rented it, and decided that it was one of the worst movies that I had ever seen in my life.<< Please take this pissing contest to a side post, where it belongs. Let's talk about Jewel, her music or the EDA philosophy. We can all disagree on what is OR isn't. The only definite facts in life are death, taxes and that "Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls" (the sequel) is the WORST movie ANYONE has EVER seen! ;) - -- Dennis Harris p.s. Angels, don't be upset that Jewel didn't beat out Alanis. It speaks volumes for Jewel's creative uniqueness, something which must be diminished (or sold out) to become an MTV poster child! If she qualified, she wouldn't be the performer we all know and love... p.s.s. BTW, being a diversified guy, I also like Alanis' album... ------------------------------ From: "Steven Ludeke" Date: Sun, 8 Sep 96 17:27:27 -0500 Subject: Jewel's talent Ok guys, listen to this if you really are interested in this whole Alanis, Jewel deal. (note: if you just want to hear what I have to say about Jewel, skip the first paragraph) Alanis Morissette (didn't spell that right, did I?) is a produced phenomenon. She does not have much vocal talent. She has yet to demonstrate any instrumental talent. And songwriting? I'm sorry, but her stuff was written for her. This is no big secret. She didn't work real hard to break into the music business, they worked hard to break her into the top 10 charts. They saw an opening for a new style of "alternative rock" and created Alanis to be the poster child for it. Notice how quickly the imitators sprung up-that was the other record labels trying to catch up. Sorry, when I met songwriting, I met the musical part of the song. As for the lyrics, others on the list have gotten it right-rehashes of what everybody already knows and thinks. That's why it's resounded with everybody so well and created such great record sales. I'm sorry, but she gains no respect from me for her lyrics. Jewel, on the other hand, is a poet. She's a poet first, songwriter second. She is actually relatively straightforward with her words, unlike Billy Corgan from Smashing Pumpkins for example, or Kurt Cobain. But just because she doesn't try to be obtuse and hide her meanings it doesn't make her any less poetic. In fact, I personally like it less when you spend half your time thinking about the meaning of a poem/song than when you are able to understand the meaning instantly and then can spend the rest of the time analysing the thoughts represented. You know, I'm really not one of those pricks who spends their time thinking and writing things like this analysis of poetic meaning. In fact, I believe this to be the first. Really, if your one of those people who thinks poetically 24-7, take my advise and pick up a joke book or something. You all need to understand the whole world isn't meant to have meaning. Lighten UP! But I digress. About Jewel's musical talent, I have to be somewhat critical. As a guitar player, I can tell you her melodies are pretty yet relatively simple, not only to play but to write. This is why I say she is a poet, less a musician. Don't get me wrong, I love her guitar, it's just not her strongest area. As for her voice, it needs discipline. She falters sometimes, and one is not supposed to do that when they are a professional, especially not on a nationally released album. Great vocal chords, Mariah Carey like, but still needs a little more practice. On the whole, Jewel is a great artist, which is more than I can say for Alanis. Steven Ludeke ------------------------------ From: Harrisbros@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 19:02:42 -0400 Subject: NJC: Why so emotional? ***Patric wrote a very rough post for a mixed mail list, including: >>WHERE IS YOUR FUCKING COMMON SENSE???? I said it to a post when I joined the list, and I'll say it again-- if your mother was too stupid or inbred not to tell you this- "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."<< ***Igor reponded: >>Someone else take this part and comment. I'm sure Dennis has already written a presciption for what ails Patric. Dr. Harris will probably only prescribe a mild sedative because most everything else about Patric sounds OK. I'd like to only say that in my neighborhood, if you talk about someones mother, you might be lucky to get away without a bloody nose.<< EVERYONE CHILL. If you can't get your point across in one brief post, take it to a side post. Otherwise, you might come off looking like a performing circus monkey! And for those of us who have already seen our share of circus monkeys, you'll waste our time as well. Also, if you can't get your point across without attacking someone personally or using (or abusing the use of) blue language, then its obvious that YOU HAD NO POINT TO BEGIN WITH (or at best a weak one). F*ck is NOT the official adjective of the EveryDay Angels. Please curb its use, okay? So, let's show some of that common sense Patric calls for, and play nice. ;) - -- Dennis (everyone now go to their corner, please) Harris ------------------------------ From: Harrisbros@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 19:04:54 -0400 Subject: NJC: Pissing contest canceled <<>>styles... Jewel is talented and Alanis isn't.. Case closed. >Yeah, you're right. Alanis has about as little talent as Jewel has. >Case re-opened.>> ***Hunter then responded: >>Okay people who are arguing, this issue is not worth arguing, and is obviously going nowhere. When my firends went out and saw "Ace Ventura: Pet Detective", they were raving about how good it was. I later rented it, and decided that it was one of the worst movies that I had ever seen in my life.<< Please take this pissing contest to a side post, where it belongs. Let's talk about Jewel, her music or the EDA philosophy. We can all disagree on what is OR isn't. The only definite facts in life are death, taxes and that "Ace Ventura: When Nature Calls" (the sequel) is the WORST movie ANYONE has EVER seen! ;) - -- Dennis Harris p.s. Angels, don't be upset that Jewel didn't beat out Alanis. It speaks volumes for Jewel's creative uniqueness, something which must be diminished (or sold out) to become an MTV poster child! If she qualified, she wouldn't be the performer we all know and love... p.s.s. BTW, being a diversified guy, I also like Alanis' album... ------------------------------ From: ABershaw@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 19:08:10 -0400 Subject: The Jewelstock Poetry Hi all, A bunch of people are contacting us for the various JS Poetry transcriptions, so rather than contact you all individually, heres all of them together(below)for the first & last time. Mrs BB appreciates those who took the time to thank her privately. I must say that I was really surprised & dissipointed that no-one was intrigued enough to actually post comments or discuss any of these on the list. (It would be far more interesting than bashing artists you dont care for.) The last one certainly gives a lot of insight into Jewel's inspiration as well as the road-weary feelings she goes through. Anyway, sorry for the length, but here they are in the order they were recited. Expand that email window for best viewing. Enjoy! Mr BB 1. GOD KNOWS WHAT TIME IT IS by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 God knows what time it is And I awakened by what? Perhaps a noise unsettled me Or a fitful dream filled me with sour grapes and snowstorms Limbs torn at the joints with a heavy and transluscent burden He was on my lips again Haunting me Soiled linen Bloody and tangled About my intestines I want to get out So I sit and I sweat A blond flame of a refugee Throwing up words Like gravestones In the bathroom 2. HAUNTED BY 2 LIPS AT 3:00 A.M. by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 This cigar will not leave me And I too lazy to get my book Write on random pages To further dizzy and dilute Any scrap of discipline I dreamt I gained by the silly age of 22 Not even coated in nickel or copper Just a harsh brass That stares me down in a mirror On nights like this While my lover sleeps His razor sharp princess Disillusioned by falling stars And haunted by 2 lips at 3:00 A.M. 3. INFATUATION by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 Infatuation is a strange thing A bony creature Thin from feeding on itself It is addicted not to its subject But to it's own vain hunger And needs but a pretty face To fuel its rampant imagination It's humid couch and sweaty palms It's fleshy carpets ablaze with conquest But when conquering is complete The blood leaves its limbs And it becomes disenchanted Dissipointed even to the point of disgust With its subject who sits there Like a hollow trunk emptied of its cargo And left to fade like defeated naval ships A seed relieved of its transparent husk To dissolve finally On a rough and impatient toungue 4. Son Bathing by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 I read a book and the man thinks I cannot see the wrinkled posture of his son while he is nudged He thinks I cannot sense four eyes upon my flesh As the father tries to bond with his teenage boy by oogling my breasts 5. I GUESS WHAT I WANTED by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 I guess what I wanted was to hear you'd stay with me always I guess what I wanted was to see those hands vowing never to leave my own I guess what I wanted to know was that I am not living in vain 6. FAT by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 There she sat a mound of flesh With just two eyes to comprehend The extensiveness of her being She made a mountain of herself So no-one could look down So no-one would miss or fail to see The tiny woman hands that talked Desperately of delicate things Through a fistful of rings To all who would stop and listen 7. TAKING THE SLAVE by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 Burn her eyes without hope of understanding them Kiss her mouth that you may fathom its strange toungue Rape her mind because it is not your own But so sweet, So familiar Like coming home to a native land Your pale and inbred hands can only faintly fathom 8. LOST,ALONE,FEAR,DESPERATION,HOPE,GRACE by Jewel Kilcher LOST is a puzzle of stars that breaths like water and chews like stone. ALONE is a reminder of how far your acceptance is from your understanding. FEAR is a bird that believes itself into extinction. DESPERATION - the honest recognition of a false truth. HOPE- seeing who you really are at your highest is who you will become. GRACE- the refinement of a soul through time. 9. I AM NOT FROM HERE by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 I am not fom here My hair smells of the wind and is full of constellations And I move about this world with a healthy disbelief And I approach my days and my work with vaporous consequence A touch that is translucent, but can violate stone 10. AS A CHILD I WALKED... by Jewel Kilcher 7/96 As a child I walked with noisy fingers Along the hemline of so many meadows of back home Green fabric stretched out, shy earth, shock of sky I'd sit on logs like pulpits Listen to the sermons of sparrows And find God in simplicity There among the dandelions and thorn Now I frequent hotel lobbies Like a chain smoker having a bad day A nasty habit that breeds itself Delivering each day to the needy next Each with the promise of glitter and glory But how my tiny heart aches to return Like a daisy rooted in rot and rubbish Asked to grow in strange rooms Fed neon and cold pizza I fear I may wither with forgetfulness So I pull these pages close about my ears Tiny leafy limbs pale with impression My pen a single flame to keep me warm Like a beacon holding memory Until I am able to go back to my lovely mountains Or until I am strong enough to bring the essence to the rest of these hungry people Who long to remember the simplicity which lies beyond the cities inbred streets And the Godliness that resides in us all ------------------------------ From: "The Great Cornholio" Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 19:16:24 EDT Subject: NJC: gotta be a smartass Dennis wrote that we must not use blue language to the nth degree. well, FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCKIN FUCK AND FUCK ;) gotta be a smartass, fuckin newt, beeeeeooooooch "The wonderful thing about Tiggers is Tiggers are wonderful things Their tops are made out of rubber Their bottoms are made out of springs They're bouncy, trouncy, flouncy, pouncy, Fun, fun, fun, fun, fun About the most wonderful thing about Tiggers is I'm the only one I'M THE ONLY ONE!"- Tigger in "Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day" ------------------------------ From: Dominic Jules DeVito Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 06:35:51 -0700 Subject: Re: one last comment on Jewel v. Alanis Angela6359@aol.com wrote: > talent can be measured by how the simplicity, or lack of it, in a song. They > are both great artists, but Alanis won at MTV because she has sold a lot more > albums. well, not to keep this slightly sub-par thread going (wink wink), but i'd like to add a counterpoint to this fine example of rationale for eMpTyVee's behavior in this matter: in 1989, the folks at MTV showed a RARE (emphasis on RARE here) shred of class and awarded Neil Young's fantastic video for "this note's for you" the right to be called the best of that pathetic year. it beat out vids by such cash cows as madonna and michael jackson. i think that neil's video got played once by the network before MTV's sponsors started screaming bloody murder because in the song and the video, neil slammed pepsi, coke, and budweiser. a truly IRONIC (not in the incorrect way that alanis uses the word) yet monumental statement by MTV. it seems they have reverted back to their old ways, unfortunately. just as we are all understandably pissed that jewel didn't win for a video, which, while belonging to a great song, doesn't really do much for me (then again, videos rarely do, unless you've seen the most recent ones by the orb, radiohead, or pavement), we have to remember that these awards are based mostly on record sales figures and not so much on originality and talent. no matter, though...i'm sure as time passes we'll all get over ourselves. i could go on for the next 10 years slamming alanis til i'm blue in the face but it won't take away from the fact that a lot of people like her (can you believe that her record is still in the top 3 after all this time?) and i still have to sell it with a smile on my face at the record store. but i can choose to ignore alanis and i can at least try to influence my customers by playing jewel in the store and recommending her and other worthy-yet-neglected artists (such as ani difranco) to them. all in a day's work. anyway, this has gone on too long...just one more thing: anyone know why i was automatically unsubbed 2 days ago? i was wondering why i wasn't getting my usual 300+ messages per day...i was only down to 200!!! (i'm NOT kidding!) peace out, dominic ps more irony: tortoise's "oval remixes" 12" being named the #1 "alternative album" in the new rolling stone. are there ANY other tortoise fans out there???? ------------------------------ From: Patric Oesterheld Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 19:55:59 -0400 Subject: stupid message--sorry :( I hope that I didn't offend anyone with my message. I made the M.C.J.S.(Mike Connell-JewelStock) mistake of writing when I was upset. I am a HUGE Alanis fan, a HUGE Jewel fan, and alot of other groups that no one else likes(Dogs D'Amour, e.g.) I try never to say anything bad about them. To anyone that I did offend, I apologize. Many thanks to Igor for my gentle flaming- it couldn't have come from a nicer source. Patric ------------------------------ From: Fuzzy & Piglet Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 19:38:41 +0600 Subject: feeling real good/musings on this list hey all, after eating some good chinese food and putting back a few Lowenbrows I thought I would throw off my lurker status for a bit. this whole slaming other artists, ahh I don't think I've ever trashed so many emails with out reading them before in my life. someone likes Alanis or else how would she of sold so many albums, hell someone buys John Tesh and the guy from baywatch albums. a blasfamy as it may sound I know a few who would buy a Jewel album if it was for a dollar. all I can say to wrap that up is that everybody loves somebody sometimes, yeah its a song but I forget who did it, Dean Martin? been sitting back here in my cave all weekend reading the fueding, at least its nice fueding, unlike some in the past. kids don't drink and try to write, it gets hard anyone going to see Ani DiFranco at JMU/Harrisonburg? Or going to see Patty Griffin in DC? 'cause it would be real cool to run into some of you again. Hey I've got an idea, how about an EDA family reunion? Could make it a yearly event, or even more often than that. Could have one on the west coast, east coast, and in the middle of the country and not all at the same time so that those that could couldgo to several. One of my roomates just went to vegas for the week for a mining engineering convention and its only costing him $250. rooms are cheap, food is cheap all 24 hour buffets. So what say we all meet there, its kinda in the middle of the country and should appease the west coasters who couldn't make JS speaking of JS, where did you go Rachelle? I think it is time to have another "hey my name is..." thread, what with some many new people joining the list. I'll start. My name is Amigo Montoya ;P My name is Robert (Robb) Wilson Leigh aka Piglet. My mother has called me that since I was as big as one, and I don't think it came from the Winnie the Pooh books but from the fact that I was a dirty little boy. Now I'm a 21yo senior at Virginia Tech majoring in Biology, I want to teach Highschool here in Southern Virginia, no I'm not like the guy off of Boston Commons, though the place where he is supposed to be from and where the actor grew up is only a county away from me and there are people like him around here. Hobbies include this list, rpgs, writing poetry (only when I'm inspired though), stories, and editorials (see my web page), riding my bike recklessly, music, taking care of Fuzzy, going to the theater and movies, reading everything from pulp horror to classics and all in between. I'm kinda tall 5'11" with almost shoulder length brown curly/wavy hair (depends on how it wants to behave on a given day) with natural red highlights, hazel eyes, and a moustache (though not pencil thin) I like good import beers, longisland ice-teas, sweet watermellon (well any fresh fruit), jellies and fresh bread. I love to cook and learning about women, yes I'm still single (sigh). But I don't let it get me down, well most of the time, well okay it bothers me but with you all to support me (love you Selena) and distract me (love you Rachel) I get by. Have I wasted alot of your time, if so sorry ("Don't say your sorry," Jewel said that to me :), see like East coast Tom I'm gonna be on a boot, though I didn't mean to). anyways those beers I had are kickin' in so I gotta go, he :) take care all and look out for your neighbors, Robb "I'm gonna take you on" -- Republica Rant 'n Rage (9/4/96): http://www.vt.edu:10021/R/rleigh/robb.html rleigh@vt.edu ------------------------------ From: Simmons Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 17:48:27 -0600 Subject: NJC: misuse of "Ironic" While I respect each person's views as to Alanis' talent and ability (or lack thereof) as being a matter of personal opinion, I have to take issue with the accusation that she misuses the meaning of irony in the song "Ironic". While Alanis does not meet the most common meaning of irony, she does meet the definition of another, also rather common, kind of irony. According to Webster's New World Dictionary, third college edition, definition #3, irony is "a combination of circumstances or a result that is the opposite of what is or might be expected or considered appropriate". Regardless of how one might feel about Alanis' value as a musician, her use of irony is flawless. Because the Llama told me to -Loki ------------------------------ From: Dominic Jules DeVito Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 07:00:40 -0700 Subject: correction/followup i have to correct a glaring error in my recent post (as if anyone read it in its entirety)... i referred to a video by the orb. i goofed on the band name. i was actually talking about the most righteous video by the band orbital. i think it's called "the box." it's rad, that's all i have to say. it should win video of the year next year. you know how all those damn british ambient band names are... another thing...any of you chicago-area EDAs want/need tickets to see either bob mould (of sugar and husker du fame)on the 11th or 12th at the metro or freddy jones band on the 14th? i've got extras for all 3 shows (which, by the way are all sold out). if so, let me know and we'll meet up outside the venues. more peace, etc., dominic ------------------------------ End of jewel-digest V1 #552 ***************************