From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V9 #244 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, September 20 2006 Volume 09 : Number 244 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] FW: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb ["Andy Lumbard" ] Re: [idealcopy] Fall [MarkBursa@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 16:47:13 +0100 From: "Andy Lumbard" Subject: [idealcopy] FW: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb - -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lumbard [mailto:andrew@lumbard.co.uk] Sent: 19 September 2006 08:03 To: 'Derek White' Subject: RE: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb I was rolling back the memories watching the Stiff documentaries. Saw the Stiffs 2 tour, Elvis & Ian D at various times; Lene Lovich at Sheffield Univ was the first gig I took my future wife to! It was great fun at the time. The believers of music trends being circular may be interested that as a result of watching the documentary my 13 year old son spent Sunday morning copying tracks from my Stiff 4 cd box set onto his mp3 player, rather than doing his homework. AndyL __________________________________________________________________________ Regarding other stuff on the Beeb, did any UK listees see that 2-parter about the rise and fall of Stiff records that was on BBC3 this last weekend? I watched mainly out of curiosity, as despite liking the DIY ethos of the label, their roster of artistes never really did it for me:- be it Ian Dury and his band of sundry old rockers ('Glencoe', anyone?) or Elvis Costello's nasal whining, Ms Lovich's studied oddness, hoary old pub-rockers.......etc etc What was most striking about the film(s) was the way in which Stiff's judgement failed somewhat after Jake Riviera's departure, and they then signed up allsorts of bands (The Equators? Rachel Sweet?? Any Trouble ??? ) who failed both critically and commercially, destined to fall into a big black hole, never to see a recording studio again. My question would be: Did Stiff *really* warrant 6 hours of documentary footage ? Discuss.... .....or not? - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 15/09/2006 - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 15/09/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 21:00:36 +0100 From: "Keith Knight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] FW: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb I saw what I'm pretty sure was the last night of the Stiffs tour at Lancaster University and got backstage afterwards on the basis that a friend I was with was writing up the gig for the student rag. Memories of that are: Wreckless Eric absolutely legless, falling over on a ddressing room floor which was covered in some sort of gunk. Ian Dury politely being interviewed by some other 'journalist'. Costello, with a room of his own unlike the others, slamming the door shut as I passed with a scowl on his face. Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Andy Lumbard Sent: 19 September 2006 16:47 To: idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: [idealcopy] FW: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb - -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lumbard [mailto:andrew@lumbard.co.uk] Sent: 19 September 2006 08:03 To: 'Derek White' Subject: RE: Stiff records documentaries on Beeb I was rolling back the memories watching the Stiff documentaries. Saw the Stiffs 2 tour, Elvis & Ian D at various times; Lene Lovich at Sheffield Univ was the first gig I took my future wife to! It was great fun at the time. The believers of music trends being circular may be interested that as a result of watching the documentary my 13 year old son spent Sunday morning copying tracks from my Stiff 4 cd box set onto his mp3 player, rather than doing his homework. AndyL ________________________________________________________________________ __ Regarding other stuff on the Beeb, did any UK listees see that 2-parter about the rise and fall of Stiff records that was on BBC3 this last weekend? I watched mainly out of curiosity, as despite liking the DIY ethos of the label, their roster of artistes never really did it for me:- be it Ian Dury and his band of sundry old rockers ('Glencoe', anyone?) or Elvis Costello's nasal whining, Ms Lovich's studied oddness, hoary old pub-rockers.......etc etc What was most striking about the film(s) was the way in which Stiff's judgement failed somewhat after Jake Riviera's departure, and they then signed up allsorts of bands (The Equators? Rachel Sweet?? Any Trouble ??? ) who failed both critically and commercially, destined to fall into a big black hole, never to see a recording studio again. My question would be: Did Stiff *really* warrant 6 hours of documentary footage ? Discuss.... .....or not? - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 15/09/2006 - -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 15/09/2006 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1999 12:25:25 -0000 From: "Ian B" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Fall A good friend of mine who I was out at a gig with last night (evening of electronic music by artistes I'd not heard of, and wasn't particularly impressed by) who is by no means a major Fall fan, but is quite receptive to their work (and once got bawled at by Hanley for accidentally entering their dressing room pre-gig) saw them recently at (I think) the Leeds festival. He said they were absolutely dreadful. I didn't explore this with him too much as I didn't want to add to the cacophany of people chattering away against the best efforts of the performers Ian B - ----- Original Message ----- From: Derek White > I'd be interested to hear how competent *this* new Fall line-up is, as apparently the gig at Barrow's Canteen Media Centre that was meant to follow the British Sea Power gig last November is now slated for this October (the 13th, I think):- as the venue is a mere 10 mins away I've no real excuse for not going.**** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 20:03:53 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Fall Derek, >> I'd be interested to hear how competent *this* new Fall line-up is, as apparently the gig at Barrow's Canteen Media Centre that was meant to follow the British Sea Power gig last November is now slated for this October (the 13th, I think):- as the venue is a mere 10 mins away I've no real excuse for not going.****<< Saw them last week at the 93ft East in London - though the band that's playing Barrow will almost certainly bear little resemblance to the one I saw! Such is the "granny on bongos" nature of the Fall now that there appears to be two complete bands - one is the US band that took over the US tour earlier in the year when MES sacked the established bass/gtr/drums trio (ie the band on the BBC4 doc); the other appears to be the "subs' bench" that has stood in when the yanks were unavailable - for example at the Reading and Leeds festivals. To make matters more confusing, the band I saw was a hybrid of the two - the three Americans - who are very good, even if the bassist would probably have been turned down for a job in Grandaddy for "looking too much like a beardy backwoodsman" ;-) plus the "subs' bench bass player (so two basses throughout, impressively). The current band was very heavy - as heavy a version of the Fall as there's been since the two guitar line-up from about 1993. And everything is very minimal - new songs seem to be based round giant, unchanging riffs; no chorus; no middle 8 etc. Like very heavy krautrock, which is a fine thing in my book. And easy enough for new musicians to learn! The subs' bench bassist is really very good indeed. Plays like a session man; looks nails. Really clangy, metallic sound. Can't imagine him taking much shit from anyone, even Mark. No idea who the subs' bench drummer is; the guitarist is from perennial Fall support band Pubic Fringe (who are actually rather good in a beefheartian kind of way, despite their abysmal name). The drummer is not from the Fringe - as he's currently in the Nightingales (along with the Fringe bassist) Confused? You will be.... It loooks like the October dates will be MES & Eleni plus the subs' bench. Perhaps permanently (inasmuch as anything is permanent in the Fall). The Yanks went back to America after the recent London gigs; MES apparently said "say goodbye to the new band" from the stage at one of the London dates! Experience suggests the Fall are more likely to put on a good show in out of the way places, so I expect you'll enjoy yourself...no matter whose granny is on the bongos. As John Peel said, The Fall - always different, always the same! Mark ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V9 #244 *******************************