From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V7 #326 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, November 10 2004 Volume 07 : Number 326 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] RE Two new (mainstream) CDs ["Clements, Bruno - BUP" ] RE: [idealcopy] [OT] Two new (mainstream) CDs [Derek White ] Re: [idealcopy] RE Two new (mainstream) CDs [Paul Pietromonaco ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 12:05:10 -0000 From: "Clements, Bruno - BUP" Subject: [idealcopy] RE Two new (mainstream) CDs Played The Pixies CD (official Purple Tape tracks disc) just before leaving for work. It's good stuff - I must revisit Pilgrim. Perhaps it's the production on Pilgrim I find hard work rather than the songs! >>>Hi Bruno, The funny thing is - some of the later material was recorded for the Purple tape, but left off of Come On Pilgrim. Even Subbacultcha from Trompe Le Monde shows up in the Purple Tape *and* in these demos! (^_^) I think Frank knew what he was doing all along! (^_^)<<< ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 12:44:46 -0000 From: "Clements, Bruno - BUP" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] IBTABA >>>Manscape limped in at equal 16. Here's the rest (and chart breakdown!) for those who are interested... 11.DOCUMENT & EYEWITNESS 12.DOME 2 13.DRILL 14.IT'S ALL IN THE BROCHURE 15.COATINGS 16.= MANSCAPE 16.=SNAKEDRILL 18.=THIS WAY TO THE SHIVERING MAN 18.=BEHIND THE CURTAIN 20.COMMERCIAL SUICIDE<<< I wonder how many contributors have Commercial Suicide? It gets far more plays by me than Document and Eyewitness (which I was disappointed with at the time and still don't enjoy. I mean, I'm glad they released it but that's about as far as it goes). Coatings has some fine moments but it's very much a compilation while CM sounds like an album - and not far off a good Wire album either! ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 06:49:57 -0800 (PST) From: Derek White Subject: RE: [idealcopy] [OT] Two new (mainstream) CDs And yet another formerly inspiritional artiste falls victim to 'Muso's Syndrome'...... Where the sufferer takes decent pieces, and re-arranges with any *slightly* esoteric instruments that happen to be lying around and /or passing by the studio. Usual recipe includes slopping liberal sauce of digi-FX over top,& garnish with pro-tools: serve lukewarm....... Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > I think Frank knew what he was doing all along! (^_^) > Until I listened to the "treated" disc two in the Frank Black Francis set. Oh my... ...goodness... ...this is awful. Imagine Frank Black slowly singing Pixies songs accompanied by jazzy guitar and trumpet in a lounge somewhere in the heart of suburbia, and that begins to capture the horror. Now, add production courtesy of Marvin The Paranoid Android, and you have the second disc. Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 14:58:10 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Future heads? > Assuming we're talking about the black scouse guy, in my days of > watching Blue's Clues I thought he was an immensely talented performer > given that he had to perform with a bunch of animated pre-school > characters. I found his sincerity and timing really impressive. Yeah I like him, too. He really gives it everything, doesn't he. Know what Paul meant with the Craig Charles comparison though - looks and sounds not dissimilar, but luckily isn't anywhere near as objectionable! > God, a three way conversation about Blue's Clues. Sometimes I love this > list. Yeah!! But back to the Futureheads... There's barely a Futureheads review that doesn't mention Wire somewhere, even though they sound much more like XTC. Good album though, and their version of Kate Bush's Hounds of Love has to be *the* cover of the year as far as I'm concerned. Bonkers!! > Another the Keith (really pleased that Marc Almond is getting better - > about time we had some good news. I am, BTW, actively thinking of going > to Peel's memorial service on Friday in Bury St Edmonds cathedral, which > is a slightly weird thing to do but I feel compelled especially as I can > make it and it's only about 90 minutes drive from here) If you wanna go, go. I'd probably go myself if I was a bit nearer, though that didn't stop me going to Bolan's funeral, aged 16! K ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 15:02:53 -0000 From: "Clements, Bruno - BUP" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Future heads? > Another the Keith (really pleased that Marc Almond is getting better - > about time we had some good news. I am, BTW, actively thinking of going > to Peel's memorial service on Friday in Bury St Edmonds cathedral, which > is a slightly weird thing to do but I feel compelled especially as I can > make it and it's only about 90 minutes drive from here) Yes, I'd go if I lived closer. No shame in paying your respects. Planning to go to Pere Ubu in Bristol that evening - first heard them on Peel, of course. ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Nov 2004 16:21:42 +0100 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Future heads? > If you wanna go, go. I'd probably go myself if I was a bit nearer, though > that didn't stop me going to Bolan's funeral, aged 16! Funeral? Didn't you tell us the other day Bolan was cremated? ;-) Bart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Nov 2004 08:36:18 -0800 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: [idealcopy] RE Two new (mainstream) CDs Clements, Bruno - BUP wrote: > Played The Pixies CD (official Purple Tape tracks disc) just before leaving > for work. It's good stuff - I must revisit Pilgrim. Perhaps it's the > production on Pilgrim I find hard work rather than the songs! > > Okay - here's where it gets interesting. The Purple Tape had 17 songs on it. Ivo Watts-Russell at 4AD picked 8 songs and released them as Come On Pilgrim. The other 9 songs languished on a shelf somewhere until Spin-Art picked them up for the "Pixies" CD - which is the disc I believe you played. So, I think the problem you might be having with Come On Pilgrim is context - the production is actually the same between the two discs. All 17 tracks are from a tracking session at Fort Apache, produced by Gary Smith. If you take both discs, you can recreate the actual "Purple" tape, which makes a *very* compelling album. To try this at home, use the listing from my previous post. If you're creating a CD, normalize the resultant disc to help ameliorate level differences between the two source discs. Frank Blank had mentioned that there was an attempt to release the Spin-Art disc as the entire Purple tape, but various label pressures - I'm guessing Elektra here - prevented them from releasing the complete sessions, hence the truncated 9 track release. Isn't the Pixies discography fun? (^_^) Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Nov 2004 08:41:20 -0800 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Two new (mainstream) CDs Derek White wrote: > And yet another formerly inspiritional artiste falls victim to 'Muso's > Syndrome'...... > Where the sufferer takes decent pieces, and re-arranges with any > *slightly* esoteric instruments that happen to be lying around and /or > passing by the studio. > Usual recipe includes slopping liberal sauce of digi-FX over top,& > garnish with pro-tools: serve lukewarm....... > For the dear readers of IdealCopy, I will attempt to listen to this disc again. I will also try to approach the listening session with a mind unclouded by preconceived notions of what these songs should sound like. Nah - maybe not! (^_^) Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 17:01:50 -0000 From: "Clements, Bruno - BUP" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] RE Two new (mainstream) CDs >>>The Purple Tape had 17 songs on it. Ivo Watts-Russell at 4AD picked 8 songs and released them as Come On Pilgrim. The other 9 songs languished on a shelf somewhere until Spin-Art picked them up for the "Pixies" CD - which is the disc I believe you played.<<< Ah, yes. All recorded at the same session - that rings a bell now. Yes, I have The Pixies CD (which is quite expensive in the UK considering the running time but I snapped up a copy on eBay). Now I understand why we didn't just get a full Purple Tape disc and forget about Come on you Pilgrim. It's Surfer Rosa I have more of a problem with... produced by Steve Albini. Mind you, in the UK we tend to get Surfer Rosa and Pilgrim on the same disc! Perhaps I should pay more attention to which album I'm listening too... I bet non-Pixies fans are enjoying this! ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 18:20:02 +0200 From: "Glenn & Cecile" Subject: [idealcopy] Re: Top 20 (was IBTABA) > '154' won quite comfortably I couldn't agree more. > 20.COMMERCIAL SUICIDE I think this one is exquisite ! Goes to show ;) Glenn. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Nov 2004 18:50:54 +0100 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Frank Black Francis > Until I listened to the "treated" disc two in the Frank Black Francis set. > Oh my... > > ...goodness... > > ...this is awful. Found another the review... Bart ======== You can say this for Frank Black: The man cares about his fans. The liner notes for his archival record Frank Black Francis-- the latest in his long string of solo albums, but the first to sport both of his stage names simultaneously and focus on Pixies material-- fret almost comically that the album will either not provide listeners value for their money, or will anger them because he's chosen to tamper with his classic material. Well, there's certainly no question that his concerns are well-founded. The first disc-- a set of solo acoustic demos Black recorded at producer Gary Smith's Allston, Mass., apartment before the Pixies hit the studio for their legendary first sessions at Fort Apache-- isn't going to speak to anyone who doesn't already know the material inside and out. Those who do, however, will no doubt lose their shit for a chance to hear these naked versions of some of the best-loved Pixies songs. Black's stated concern that the quality of the recordings is too bootleg is actually misplaced. Although it was recorded into Smith's cassette Walkman with nothing more than a little reverb added, the tape sounds startlingly fresh and clear. Plus, Black's disarming asides and spirited performance give the recordings a verve that helps them stand up well in the face of the canonical final versions that we've all played half to death (they're too good to ever really be killed). On the other hand, the second disc-- newly recorded version of 13 Pixies tracks-- is a total oddity. Many listeners who will salivate while the first disc spins might find themselves choking back the bile while listening to the second. Our relationship with the artists who change us the most are funny things, and hearing the songs of one of those bands as radically re-interpreted as they are here can be jarring, even upsetting, if you don't keep an open mind about it. Black, mostly independent of the rest of the Pixies (Joey Santiago does pop in for "additional editing"), re-recorded these stone-cold Pixies classics with Two Pale Boys, veterans of collaboration with Pere Ubu's David Thomas, and as re-workings go, these amount to total detonations of their forebears. Once you get past the fact that you're hearing "Subbacultcha" re-imagined as a Tom Waits-ian electro-acoustic coffee shop rant or "Caribou" as if it dropped out of Wayne Coyne's back pocket, Black and the Boys-- known to their mothers as Andy Diagram and Keith Moline-- actually have done a pretty interesting job of "messing with the gospel," as Black puts it in his liners. It's not all successful, however: "Velouria" is tragically slaughtered by a lugubrious pace and intestinal bass, while "Monkey Gone to Heaven" needs the Pixies' mayhem more than the bendy elasto-synths it gets here. And the limping ambient version of "Where Is My Mind?" is what I imagine being killed with plastic cocktail swords would be like. But three strikeouts in 13 at-bats won't necessarily lose you a game, and the mind-bending readings of "Caribou" and "Nimrod's Son" are home runs that help to validate the endeavor. "Caribou" finds Black's falsetto in unusually supple, tender form as a whirling electronic background swells and pulses with his every vocal tic, while "Nimrod's Son" becomes seasick burlesque wrapped in a dubby echo. "Wave of Mutilation" playfully nods to the Doolittle arrangement as "waves" of manipulated static wash over the chorus. Is there anything here that bests or equals an original? Absolutely not, but at least the trio land some punches and go down swinging. Back on Disc 1, "Caribou" positively burns with razor-throated intensity, even as Black quickly explains to Smith, "I'm supposed to be screaming here," and then veers off into wild shrieks and alley cat noises. He does his best to convey the basic outline of the weird "Broken Face" intro, but otherwise gives the song a good, rapid-fire run-through, and his Spanish accent is remarkably authentic on both "Vamos" and "Isla de Encanta". In all my years of listening to Black surrounded by other guitarists, I don't think it ever occurred to me how much facility the man himself has with the six-string. Here, his percussive strumming, odd picking patterns, and animated runs are impressive, often providing clues to these song's eventual arrangements. If you've read this far and you're not familiar with the Pixies' studio albums, please understand that under no circumstances should you begin your acquaintance with the band's material here. There are whole Pixies albums for that, and they're all worth owning. Those of you who have been with the band since the days of torn flannel and 120 Minutes are obviously the target audience of this release, which is a thoughtful presentation of what essentially was the final unreleased material in the Pixies vault. The second disc is ultimately little more than a curiosity for most-- and will no doubt be complete anathema for some-- but given that the entire package retails for a single-disc price, that's hardly a reason for a die-hard to opt out. The fact is, as a fan, I enjoyed the hell out of hearing Black's demos, and my guess is you will too. - -Joe Tangari, October 11th, 2004 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 18:57:45 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Future heads? gifthead? > Funeral? Didn't you tell us the other day Bolan was cremated? ;-) He was. He still had a service though! np DIV - satan's circus (this is excellent!) Keith ps just seen the following advertised on sister ray's weekly update... COLIN NEWMAN + SCANNER: Gifthead ...........CD 6.99 Gifthead, eh? Sounds an altogether nicer proposition, don't you think!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 17:33:54 EST From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Future heads? In a message dated 08/11/2004 23:30:57 GMT Standard Time, steeleknight@lineone.net writes: Another the Keith (really pleased that Marc Almond is getting better - about time we had some good news. I am, BTW, actively thinking of going to Peel's memorial service on Friday in Bury St Edmonds cathedral, which is a slightly weird thing to do but I feel compelled especially as I can make it and it's only about 90 minutes drive from here) I might see you there Keith.I too am only an hour or so away.I can imagine not even getting in for the crowd but as you say I feel compelled. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 23:20:02 -0000 From: "Ian B" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] RE: The Road ahead is quiteuncertain...Interpol Excellent Derek! I was puzzled until I scrolled down. Best laugh of the day! Don't remember anything much about the squiggle band, apart from the ridicule. Incidentally this was the first posting from IC which carried a Freeserve SPAM warning in the title ----- Original Message ----- From: Derek White To: Ian B ; idealcopy Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 3:49 PM Subject: *** SPAM *** Re: [idealcopy] RE: The Road ahead is quiteuncertain...Interpol A Freudian slip, Ian ? ;-) As for the 'squiggle' band, I don't remember *them* at all? Who / what were *they*?? They didn't perchance release one of *the* first picture disks *ever*, did they, by the name of 'Saturnalia' ? ** ** [ It even pre-dated Curved Air's "Air conditioning" I think, which was another early picture-disk release ] Oh, and I thought the 'Peel tribute' was a touch thin, too. There's another one airing on Channel Four this week sometime though. That *may* be better.......... . Although, IIRC, it was Ch 4 that did JP's "Sounds of the Suburbs", so they may just re-hash one of those. Lazy stuff, really, if *that's* all it is. Half an hour of Talking Heads? Didn't see *that*, though....... Ian B wrote: I redmember in the early 80s there was a band over here (UK) who decided to have a weird squiggle for a name. I can't remember if they ascribed any phonetic representation to it, but they were killed by the music press (or Sounds,at least) deciding to refer to them as Elephant With A Stick of Rhubarb. Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 23:35:35 -0000 From: "John Goddard" Subject: [idealcopy] Ken Garners In session tonight Not having a copy of Ken Garner's Book "In Session Tonight", has indeed but me at a disadvantage in my research for a couple of BBC Session attendees i need clarified infomation on, then i thought The IC Listees could help?, just a tiny jaunt to the bookshelf for one or two of you fortunate to have this tome! Heres the easy stuff for you to extract for me who is finding it hard without! Dates/Tracks for 23 Skidoo Tom Verlaine Solo ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2004 02:45:56 GMT From: "P J Kane" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Future heads? in a note related to the thread title, but not the current digression re: Peel's funeral, Futureheads played Atlanta on Monday night. they put on a great set, and i really enjoyed them. the opener, Asobi Seksu, was amazing though, and really blew them away, IMHO. go to http://www.asobiseksu.com/ and follow the links to Audio and there are a few MP3s. really good pop..... anyway, a fun night and i heartily endorse seeing either band on tour. just thought i'd chime in and bring things back on topic! PJK please don't hate me because i can't type..... - --- All the cool kids are doing it: HTTP://www.EvilSponge.org ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V7 #326 *******************************