From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V7 #203 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Saturday, July 10 2004 Volume 07 : Number 203 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] 1st fast, 2nd nature, 3rd degree [Tim ] Re: [idealcopy] 1st fast, 2nd nature, 3rd degree [Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 1st fast, 2nd nature, 3rd degree MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > Simple straight line from Outdoor Miner to Loveless, via the Jesus & Mary > Chain. Well to pre-'Isn't Anything' MBV perhaps...add Dinasour JR, Acid House and lots of drugs before you arrive at Loveless > > >>>the "cold psychedelic" electronica of Boards of Canada's more alien > > moments,<< > > More a case of sharing common roots (Kraftwerk especially) rather than a > direct influence? Not sure the BoC/Autechre types are much influenced by the > past at all. They are influenced by the really early Electro/Hip Hop stuff. Autechre especially, were North Manchester b-boys into breakdance and graffiti, the whole thing. They constantly reference back to what, at the time, would have been alien, otherworldy sounds (so commonplace now). What Autechre do however, is constantly push forward the basic components of their beloved 80s electro/rap to continually re-create that initial excitement, but not worrying about whether it still makes sense, or is danceable....its taken to an extreme but its still basically bass, beats and breaks...just in stronger and stronger doses. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2004 19:07:26 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] post-punk 12 >> Surely these would have been OJ LP's? OJ didn't split up till, I guess, > 1985.<< There's a thin line between late OJ and Edwyn's solo career. The later OJ line-ups had no original members apart from Ed and featured the likes of former Vic sideman (and failed Bernie Rhodes starlet) Johnny Britton and future M Person Paul Heard. A group in name only - it was the Edwyn Collins show. Johnny Britton was also in Edwyn's late '80s solo band (along with Paul Cook!) >> Edwyn's debut LP was - to the best of my knowledge - Hope &Despair - > and that wasn't released till 1989. And a fine album it was too. In fact, I > think most* of Edwyn's solo albums are excellent. Great lyricist, too. I > always place more importance on music than lyrics, but What Presence is > definitely one of my faves in this respect.<< What Presence was the last decent OJ song. Hope & Despair is OK, but it's remained unplayed on the shelf for a while ! In fact probably since quite soon after it was bought, judging by its condition! Must give it a spin. >>////// a couple of guys i knew really well were mega collins fans , maybe it was latter day OJ though as my memory is a littel hazy. sorry but he just doesn't float my boat. to me its just pastiche with no soul at all. << The problem is the tendency to smart-arsery , but I wouldn't call him soulless - when he played it straight (I remember seeing a late OJ gig at the Hacienda, where the on-stage clowning was minimised) and was struck by how soulful his singing was... >>(ever see him do "what presence" with vic godard ? that was better......p<< Where was that from? Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 00:18:55 +0100 From: Tim Subject: Re: [idealcopy] kings of the wire frontier Keith Astbury wrote: >>but one of the time-filling ideas they had was about 15 minutes of > > interviews with tim booth's fans about their > >>thoughts on the great man. for fuck's sake , i have never seen such dull TV > > in all > >>my life. i have never seen such dull TV in all my life. Whenever I switched on Glasto, that awful band Keane seemed to be on. 3 podgy faced Public schoolboys gathered round a Piano doing ColdSailor shit. > Did you not see that programme in the early 90's where Wayne Hussey met a > fan, and they sat an watched the telly together. Now that was excruciating! > Yes I did! What on earth was that on? Something on Def 2 springs to mind.... never meet your heroes they say, especially if your "hero" is a drunken 3rd division Goth. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2004 19:25:14 -0400 From: "Mike Edwards" Subject: [idealcopy] 12 Times You I've written a screenplay with quite a few Wire references (not the least of which is the title) and I present it to you, my fellow Wire fans, to rip apart. It's not actually about Wire, it's just sub text. Enjoy. Or don't. It's available at http://www.mcrow.net. adieu- Mike Edwards ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 01:38:18 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 1st fast, 2nd nature, 3rd degree > Having listened to it pretty regularly for a quarter of a century (yikes!), > it has achieved a kind of timelessness that is reserved for truly great > pieces of work. Not sure it was in step with any context at the time, other > than the act of doing what was not expected... Eno/Bowie/Pop Berlin albums as closest relatives perhaps? Bart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Jul 2004 21:11:50 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 1st fast, 2nd nature, 3rd degree >>Eno/Bowie/Pop Berlin albums as closest relatives perhaps?<< Eno's '70s albums are one of the few 'overt' influences I can hear on CM/154, for sure... Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 03:36:14 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] post-punk 12 On Fri, Jul 09, 2004 at 06:57:40PM -0400, MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > In fact one of his previous bands (the Karelia) got as far as > releasing an album as far back as 1997. Its producer? Step forward > Mr Bid (for it is he) - so no surprise Alex has heard of the 'Set. I heard he played on Kewpies like Watermelon by Urusei Yatsura, and on the Yummy Fur's records. - - A - -- Earth Sciences, University of Cambridge http://www.esc.cam.ac.uk/ Programme Controller, CUR1350 http://www.cur1350.co.uk/ email: andrew@lexical.org.uk Random Walk ::: Wednesday, 10pm ::: cur1350.co.uk ::: is this music? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 00:41:53 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] send/ The Great Dichotomy of Pop In a message dated 7/9/04 4:33:38 PM, RLynn9@aol.com writes: << of course...i was speaking of the obvious, surface level stuff....Iggy Popo and Television were not huge radio "pop/rock" acts... >> oops, i didn't realise the original post about nothing good between glam and punk was referring only to popular music... as gilda radner used to say... nevermind oh, and In a message dated 7/9/04 12:05:19 PM, lockupyourhats@yahoo.com writes: << Art of stopping Marx's table Being watched Comet(Send version) Germ ship Ist fast Read & burn Spent Trash/treasure Nice streets (edited version) You can't leave now 99.9 >> i could replace germ ship with raft ants and be very happy with that tracklist. i listen to all of those, with the exception of spent and you can't leave now, more than the rest of the r&b/send stuff. 'course i like it all. i just listen to these songs more. - -paul c.d. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 03:05:03 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] post-punk 12 In a message dated 10/07/2004 00:07:26 GMT Standard Time, Mark Bursa writes: > The problem is the tendency to smart-arsery , but I wouldn't call him > soulless - when he played it straight (I remember seeing a late OJ gig at the > Hacienda, where the on-stage clowning was minimised) and was struck by how > soulful his singing was... /////to each their own , i just find him really smug and self-satisfied > > >>(ever see him do "what presence" with vic godard ? that was better......p<< > > > Where was that from? ///// one of the few records he's been involved that i ever go back to was vic's "end of the surrey people". he was guitarist/ producer and also played in the live band for the tour. never saw it live but this was one of the shows in a late 80's / early 90's middle-of-the-night in-concert show on central ITV (they also had things like the wolfgang press and cope , very leftfield for ITV.........). basically they ran through the "surrey people" album but edwyn got to sing one of his songs too. paul cook was in there as well of course. good gig. p ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2004 03:06:58 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] post-punk 12 In a message dated 10/07/2004 03:41:15 GMT Standard Time, andrew-wire@lexical.org.uk writes: > >In fact one of his previous bands (the Karelia) got as far as > >releasing an album as far back as 1997. Its producer? Step forward > >Mr Bid (for it is he) - so no surprise Alex has heard of the 'Set. > > I heard he played on Kewpies like Watermelon by Urusei Yatsura, and on > the Yummy Fur's records. > ////i'd seen these karelia cd's on ebay and i thought they were like bid solo albums. and , circling back to my orginal point , bid was of course in the original adam and the ants. heh , heh , the plot thins ;-) p ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V7 #203 *******************************