From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V6 #378 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, December 17 2003 Volume 06 : Number 378 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End [Alistair Tear ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End ["Keith Astbury" ] [idealcopy] Yearendroundup [Fergus Kelly ] Re: [idealcopy] no excuse ["John Roberts" ] Re: [idealcopy] Ex [Bart van Damme ] RE: [idealcopy] Signing Ideal Copy - Colin ["John Roberts" ] [idealcopy] RE: no excuse ["Clements, Bruno - BUP" ] Re: [idealcopy] no excuse [Ari Britt ] RE: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d [Ari Britt ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 10:10:44 -0000 From: Alistair Tear Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End Scarily, Big Ron was on room 101 last night and they ran the closing credits over a (mercifully short) clip of him 'singing' his xmas 'song' the horror...the horror! A > -----Original Message----- > From: Keith Astbury [mailto:keith.astbury10@virgin.net] > Sent: 16 December 2003 01:18 > To: Keith Knight; Idealcopy > Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End > > > > Is anyone else out there as enamoured as I am by The > Darkness' Christmas > > single? It sounds like it's been around for ever and has > everything you > > want from a Christmas #1 - bells, children's choir, guitar > breaks which > > were minted in 1972 and falsetto singing in an increasingly > hysterical > > way by a long-haired man from Lowestoft wearing fringes on his arms. > > I'm a sucker for a good Christmas tune. Marvellous stuff. > > Well, these boys certainly are hilarious and - in fairness to > them - I think > they know it. But where's Big Ron when you need him? > > Keith > ************************************************************************* The contents of the e-mail and any transmitted files are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. Transport for London Street Management hereby excludes any warranty and any liability as to the quality or accuracy of the contents of this e-mail and any attached transmitted files. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify postmaster@Streetmanagement.org.uk. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of computer viruses. ************************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 02:33:48 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Newman interview Tim wrote: > Which leads us back to the age-old question/why 'them' and not Wire............. > > >80s Decadent Trevor Horn Pop Chromakey Glossy Shit with a conscience is the thing.< > > this lines a bit too graemesque for me......] Why? I can't see Graeme being keen on any of the above, but I say bring it on. I mean it maaan! Hi Tim,wasn't infering Graeme would like any of the above,it's your choice of words and the way you string them together that does i.keep it up (stop sniggering Bart) Ari New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 11:57:52 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End > Scarily, Big Ron was on room 101 last night > and they ran the closing credits over a > (mercifully short) clip of him 'singing' > his xmas 'song' > the horror...the horror! > > A Shit. Missed it. It's usually repeated on a Saturday so I'll try and catch it then. Whilst (sort of) on the subject, last weeks Have I Got News... with Boris Johnson as guest presenter, was simply sublime. Tim's right about The Darkness and their Queen like-wise. But spare a thought for Muse who thought they had that corner covered, but forgot the Freddie comedy factor. K ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 12:06:47 +0000 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End On Tue, Dec 16, 2003 at 11:57:52AM -0000, Keith Astbury wrote: > Tim's right about The Darkness and their Queen like-wise. But spare a > thought for Muse who thought they had that corner covered, but forgot the > Freddie comedy factor. One of the downsides of living in Cambridge is that, outside of London, we have one of the largest goth subcultures in the country. At any street corner, or in any bar, you're likely to be assailed by the sight of black knee-length boots and badly streaked purple hair; face-powder and snakebite-and-black. To a man (and woman), they seem to love Muse. Muse aren't the new Queen, they're the new Sisters of Mercy, and God save us all. - - Andrew - -- home - email: andrew@lexical.org.uk http://www.lexical.org.uk/ work - email: adw27@esc.cam.ac.uk http://www.esc.cam.ac.uk/ radio: http://www.cur1350.co.uk/ (5pm Mon) http://www.lexical.org.uk/blog/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 12:20:39 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End > At any > street corner, or in any bar, you're likely to be assailed by the sight > of black knee-length boots and badly streaked purple hair; face-powder > and snakebite-and-black. Depends what sort of place you choose to drink, Andrew ; ) > To a man (and woman), they seem to love Muse. Muse aren't the new Queen, > they're the new Sisters of Mercy, and God save us all. Forget what their fans look like - You don't think Muse sound like Queen???? Keith (who despite himself finds the odd Muse track entertaining. Sorry!) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 12:17:45 +0000 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End On Tue, Dec 16, 2003 at 12:20:39PM -0000, Keith Astbury wrote: > Forget what their fans look like - You don't think Muse sound like Queen???? Oh, of course they do; but so did any number of 80s vaguely-hardish-rock bands with showoff guitarists. Muse do take it to histrionic heights, though, mainly because of Matt Bellamy's falsetto. > > Keith (who despite himself finds the odd Muse track entertaining. Sorry!) Their cover of "House of the Rising Sun" probably qualifies as a chemical weapon. - - A - -- home - email: andrew@lexical.org.uk http://www.lexical.org.uk/ work - email: adw27@esc.cam.ac.uk http://www.esc.cam.ac.uk/ radio: http://www.cur1350.co.uk/ (5pm Mon) http://www.lexical.org.uk/blog/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:11:03 +0100 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Newman interview >> Why? I can't see Graeme being keen on any of the above, but I say bring it >> on. I mean it maaan! > Hi Tim, wasn't infering Graeme would like any of the above,it's your choice of > words and the way you string them together that does i. keep it up Cheer up Ari, maybe Santa will send you an inflatable Graeme doll! ;-) > (stop sniggering Bart) Ari I'm Being Watched! PARANOID! Bart ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 06:08:46 -0800 (PST) From: Fergus Kelly Subject: [idealcopy] Yearendroundup I've not gotten many 2003 releases this year, but of those I did, these few warrant a mention: Akatombo: Trace Elements It's all been said about this record. It's still fucking great though. Melt Banana: Cell-scape Outstanding. Bursting at the seams with manic cartoon energy. Very nicely produced. Saw them for the first time in Dublin last month, and couldn't stop laughing. Outrageous. A hoot. And (vocalist) Yako is so cute. The Jimmycake: Dublin gone, everybody dead Dublin 10-piece just go from strength to strength. A great blend of post-rock/jazz/improv/whatever-you're-havin'-yourself that is incredibly infectious (especially live). Saw Dutch anarcho-punk-jazz-ethnic outfit The Ex for the first time last weekend and was completely blown away. I urge everyone to see 'em. Unfortunately they've just finished their tour. http://www.theex.nl 2 guitars, stand up bass, drums and vocals. Musicianship outrageously good but incredibly fluid (not virtuosic). The guitarists were jumping about like marionettes jabbed by cattle prods. I thought they were going to explode. The classically trained bassist underpinning the tangled, knotty guitars with some serious welly (definitely develops her biceps !) The woman on drums just made my jaw drop (great to see some women in powerful positions for a change !) In fact I couldn't stop grinning - a bit like that effect AT Keith (I think it was ) talked about re Wire in Brighton; that sense of watching a band doing EXACTLY what they wanted to do, doing it outrageously well, and with an absolutely infectious sense of enthusiasm and commitment. Hardcore. I couldn't sleep. Fergus np - John Duncan: Send __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:10:33 +0000 From: "John Roberts" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] no excuse If people want to talk to Graeme Rowland they can do so via his email address. Can we turn this back into the Wire list please? I had enough of Graeme discourse when he was on this list let alone now he's off it. Cheers John http://www.surf.to/ambition >From: MarkBursa@aol.com >To: RLynn9@aol.com, threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com, idealcopy@smoe.org >Subject: Re: [idealcopy] no excuse >Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 22:30:24 EST > > > >>what exactly is missed so much? his constant bragging about how many > > shows he goes to whilst we are all dolts because we work for "the man" ? > > > > or the abuse hurled at those who like something that doesn't quite fit >in > > with is oh-so- sterling taste in music?<< > >And that doesn't illuminate your day? C'mon. It's a mailing list about an >arty punk rock group. A certain amount of attitude should be the norm, not >frowned upon. > >Mark _________________________________________________________________ Tired of 56k? Get a FREE BT Broadband connection http://www.msn.co.uk/specials/btbroadband ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:17:56 +0100 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Ex So they made a good impression Fergus? Nice review! I couldn't help sending it to their web-site - hope you don't mind :-) I think I'll have a look when they play the Eurosonic Festival in Groningen (January 8, 2004) Here's what I wrote earlier offlist: > Yeah I've seen them a couple of times and though not my very faves I've always > found them quite an interesting band. Beginning (late 70's) sorta Crass-like > (I still got a couple of their first singles) they moved more towards Sonic > Youth (seen the two bands together on a double bill in Utrecht some 10 years > ago) to embrasing world cultures (there's a good documentary about them > visiting and touring Africa) and even jazz (with experimental trompetplayer > Tom Cora). Bart ============== Upcoming 2004 The Ex 08-01 Groningen (NL), Huize Maas (Eurosonic) 09-01 Amsterdam (NL), Vrankrijk (Fort van Sjakoo's Party) 23-01 Amsterdam (NL), OT301 (Magpie Weekend) 24-01 Amsterdam (NL), OT301 (Magpie Weekend) 12-02 Paris (FRA), Batclan - w/ Tjtes Raides 14-03 Eindhoven (NL), Effenaar (Zuid Nederlands Jazzfestival) Improvisation with saxophonist Umezu (JAP) The Ex & Han Bennink + 10 Ethiopian Azmaris 04-03 Melkweg, Amsterdam 05-03 Utrecht (NL), Rasa 06-03 Gent (BEL),Vooruit 07-03 Rotterdam (NL), Lantaren/Venster ============== > Saw Dutch anarcho-punk-jazz-ethnic outfit The Ex for > the first time last weekend and was completely blown > away. I urge everyone to see 'em. Unfortunately > they've just finished their tour. http://www.theex.nl > > 2 guitars, stand up bass, drums and vocals. > Musicianship outrageously good but incredibly fluid > (not virtuosic). The guitarists were jumping about > like marionettes jabbed by cattle prods. I thought > they were going to explode. > > The classically trained bassist underpinning the > tangled, knotty guitars with some serious welly > (definitely develops her biceps !) The woman on drums > just made my jaw drop (great to see some women in > powerful positions for a change !) > > In fact I couldn't stop grinning - a bit like that > effect AT Keith (I think it was ) talked about re Wire > in Brighton; that sense of watching a band doing > EXACTLY what they wanted to do, doing it outrageously > well, and with an absolutely infectious sense of > enthusiasm and commitment. Hardcore. I couldn't sleep. > > Fergus ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:45:19 +0000 From: "John Roberts" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Signing Ideal Copy - Colin Colin no doubt said 'Am I on this one?' when he signed the Ideal Copy CD because he left the band half way through its recording and had little to do with how it turned out. Cheers John http://www.surf.to/ambition _________________________________________________________________ Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 17:01:49 +0100 From: "Jan J Noorda" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Ex They were my first ever concert at Simplon Groningen together with the Workmates. That must be 1980. My favourite by them The Spanish Revolution with real book and ep, but probably hard to get. Jan J > So they made a good impression Fergus? Nice review! I couldn't help sending > it to their web-site - hope you don't mind :-) > > I think I'll have a look when they play the Eurosonic Festival in Groningen > (January 8, 2004) > > Here's what I wrote earlier offlist: > > > Yeah I've seen them a couple of times and though not my very faves I've always > > found them quite an interesting band. Beginning (late 70's) sorta Crass-like > > (I still got a couple of their first singles) they moved more towards Sonic > > Youth (seen the two bands together on a double bill in Utrecht some 10 years > > ago) to embrasing world cultures (there's a good documentary about them > > visiting and touring Africa) and even jazz (with experimental trompetplayer > > Tom Cora). > > Bart > > ============== > > Upcoming 2004 > > The Ex > 08-01 Groningen (NL), Huize Maas (Eurosonic) > 09-01 Amsterdam (NL), Vrankrijk (Fort van Sjakoo's Party) > 23-01 Amsterdam (NL), OT301 (Magpie Weekend) > 24-01 Amsterdam (NL), OT301 (Magpie Weekend) > 12-02 Paris (FRA), Batclan - w/ Tjtes Raides > 14-03 Eindhoven (NL), Effenaar (Zuid Nederlands Jazzfestival) > Improvisation with saxophonist Umezu (JAP) > > The Ex & Han Bennink + 10 Ethiopian Azmaris > 04-03 Melkweg, Amsterdam > 05-03 Utrecht (NL), Rasa > 06-03 Gent (BEL),Vooruit > 07-03 Rotterdam (NL), Lantaren/Venster > > ============== > > > Saw Dutch anarcho-punk-jazz-ethnic outfit The Ex for > > the first time last weekend and was completely blown > > away. I urge everyone to see 'em. Unfortunately > > they've just finished their tour. http://www.theex.nl > > > > 2 guitars, stand up bass, drums and vocals. > > Musicianship outrageously good but incredibly fluid > > (not virtuosic). The guitarists were jumping about > > like marionettes jabbed by cattle prods. I thought > > they were going to explode. > > > > The classically trained bassist underpinning the > > tangled, knotty guitars with some serious welly > > (definitely develops her biceps !) The woman on drums > > just made my jaw drop (great to see some women in > > powerful positions for a change !) > > > > In fact I couldn't stop grinning - a bit like that > > effect AT Keith (I think it was ) talked about re Wire > > in Brighton; that sense of watching a band doing > > EXACTLY what they wanted to do, doing it outrageously > > well, and with an absolutely infectious sense of > > enthusiasm and commitment. Hardcore. I couldn't sleep. > > > > Fergus ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:09:48 -0000 From: "Clements, Bruno - BUP" Subject: [idealcopy] RE: no excuse - ----If people want to talk to Graeme Rowland they can do so via his email address. Can we turn this back into the Wire list please? I had enough of Graeme discourse when he was on this list let alone now he's off it. Cheers John Well, as long as what he says is not criminal (ie, racist, violent threats, etc) I can't support a restriction of free speech. Wouldn't ignoring him have the same effect, without being a form of censorship? If Graeme makes nasty comments offlist then he'll still have the addresses of his 'victims' anyway! Ultimately it's down to Miles, of course. Bruno (I'm off until Thursday now so don't take my lack of response on this subject personally!) ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:25:15 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Newman interview > "We ran a lot of danger of that in the 80s. Oddly or otherwise, despite > their mid-80s version being probably their most commercially successful, the > group as a whole feel their work back then was a bit awful. > > Sorry I think the Colin hasn't quite got his finger on the button here and > I'm sure some my fellow cultural pundits on this list would agree. Aye. He needs a good kick up the arse for saying that!! Nowt wrong with 80's Wire IMO. Snakedrill, IC, ABIAC, IBTABA are all excellent. It's in the 90's things started going awry IMO... BTW Got Commercial Suicide this morning. Never heard it before. Like it a lot so far. Keith ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:32:55 EST From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End In a message dated 12/15/03 8:32:13 PM Central Standard Time, tim@kidsindestructible.com writes: > This years Pop Idol...(the fat one or the boring one)?,>>>> do you mean Kelly Clarkson, Britney, Christina, or Pink? Beyonce?>>>>> wouldn't that be the fat one? (along with J.Lo, Pink, and sometimes Britney) Fucking > Atomic Kitten>>>>> die and fucking Coldplay >>>> die harder and even the dreaded Travis are back>>>> never heard of.... RL np - Tetsu Inoue "Fragment Dots" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:22:29 -0000 From: "Keith Knight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End Surely everyone recognises that Greg Lake's 'I Believe in Father Christmas' is a masterpiece by anyone's standard? I listen to it regularly at this time of year and it stands the test every time - the Prokofiev, the build to a Spectoresque finish, the 'I believed in the Israelite' line (which is spat out), the great last line 'The Christmas we get we deserve' (is this the first use of this idiom?) - almost a proto-Rotten lyric. And the best thing ever released by a member of ELP. Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: MarkBursa@aol.com [mailto:MarkBursa@aol.com] >>Quite like Andrew's continuum of egregious Saturnalian badness, although there are plenty of others I'd have at the Geldof end instead of the Band Aid single as I can still listen to that without too much bother, such is my sunny mood at this time of year. Cliff is another story, however...<< But where does Greg Lake fit in, oh progmeister general? Mark ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:24:03 -0000 From: "Keith Knight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d This Television talk reminds me to ask - has the re-released Marquee Moon reinstated the proper ending to the title track (as discussed here earlier in the year)? Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of MarkBursa@aol.com Sent: 16 December 2003 00:15 To: threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com; idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d > Live at the old waldorf,San Fran, 6/29/78 is well worth having. > Nice one. Thanks for the tip! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:29:36 -0000 From: "Keith Knight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End Excellent stuff, Tim, and a true enough about the Freddie-shaped hole. But who can replace him? I think it took Live Aid to give Queen that status anyway, which was over a decade after they started out - I can't think of anyone out there who can plug that gap. But The Darkness' popularity is certainly evidence that the need for guitar-wank Metal is out there burning up the culture. Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Tim Sent: 16 December 2003 02:30 To: Idealcopy Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End I've seen The Darkness live recently. It was like shagging someone with whom can't hold a decent conversation afterwards...nice way to spend an evening but you probably wouldn't want to see them on a regular basis. The Darkness are a quick wank for a troubled United Kingdom that is frustrated at waiting for a new Queen or a new Slade. Do we need a new Freddie so much that some greasy ex-students from Lowestoft will do for now?! I'm not joking, I'm serious. Queen were the Peoples Music. We Are The Champions. One Vision. Flash! AHAAAA! What have we got now? This years Pop Idol...(the fat one or the boring one)?, Beyonce? Fucking Atomic Kitten and fucking Coldplay and even the dreaded Travis are back. There is a massive, Freddie Mercury-shaped hole in British Pop Culture and The Darkness can't plug it with their paltry offerings. Bet I won't be moaning about them this time next year. After the "Ironic" Media rush of "Ho Ho he's wearing a cat suit", "Ho Ho he's got Long Hair" , "Isn't Heavy Metal Funny!" you are left with the simple fact that the The Darkness only have 2 decent pop songs ( including the Xmas single) and the rest are turgid AC/DC-style chuggers. They will not do. They are the fucking Metal version of the Barron Knights....fuck 'em and bring me the Real New Queen! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Knight" To: "Idealcopy" Sent: Monday, December 15, 2003 11:31 PM Subject: [idealcopy] OT - Bell's End > Is anyone else out there as enamoured as I am by The Darkness' Christmas > single? It sounds like it's been around for ever and has everything you > want from a Christmas #1 - bells, children's choir, guitar breaks which > were minted in 1972 and falsetto singing in an increasingly hysterical > way by a long-haired man from Lowestoft wearing fringes on his arms. > I'm a sucker for a good Christmas tune. Marvellous stuff. > > Are The Darkness known outside the UK yet? > > Another the Keith (who could say something here about fashion vs image > in the context of The Darkness but I'm not sure what I would say if I > thought about it - something about them being the exception that proves > the rule probably) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:21:20 -0600 From: "Jack Alberson" Subject: Eighties Wire (was RE: [idealcopy] Newman interview) Strictly my two cents: I think if anything the production on the Eighties Wire material diminishes it somewhat. I personally think they were trying for things in the Eighties that technology was too primitive to successfully facilitate. That's not to say I don't enjoy that era of Wire--I do--but I can see as an artist where Colin is coming from when he speaks with some regrets about that era of their work. You do the best you can with what you have to work with and sometimes that doesn't always stand the test of time with you. If the group were to revisit some of the 'beat combo' material today the end results would be amazing. In the case of Manscape, it is not a matter of technology but a question of bad judgement on the behalf of producer Dave Allen, who was accustomed to producing Cure records and brought everything in the music to the foreground...thus the miasma of sounds present in the current mix of Manscape. I personally enjoy the bulk of The First Letter, Robert or no. I think technology had started to catch up with Wir(e)'s brilliant minds and ideas. Obviously now technology is at a place where it can serve the group well rather than prove as an obstacle. Jack L. Alberson Property Administrator CB Richard Ellis First Tennessee Building 165 Madison Avenue Memphis, TN 38103 (901) 521-1748 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2003 12:01:35 -0000 From: "Ian B" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 45/33 > > << Turns out that all this time he had been listening to it on 45rpm instead of 33-1/3rpm as there were no notes as to the speed of the record Had this 'problem' with Cupol's Kluba Cupol. It works at either. (and Chrome's Informations, which is borderline pointless anyway) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:37:06 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] no excuse this is,within boundaries,a democratic list John,no-one here telling you what not to write. by the way I deleted your last 'ambition' email,there was an article about a Blues group,who were they and how do I aquire one of their c.d's?I emailed them but no reply.Have a great christmas (or whatever) Ari John Roberts wrote: If people want to talk to Graeme Rowland they can do so via his email address. Can we turn this back into the Wire list please? I had enough of Graeme discourse when he was on this list let alone now he's off it. Cheers John http://www.surf.to/ambition >From: MarkBursa@aol.com >To: RLynn9@aol.com, threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com, idealcopy@smoe.org >Subject: Re: [idealcopy] no excuse >Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2003 22:30:24 EST > > > >>what exactly is missed so much? his constant bragging about how many > > shows he goes to whilst we are all dolts because we work for "the man" ? > > > > or the abuse hurled at those who like something that doesn't quite fit >in > > with is oh-so- sterling taste in music?<< > >And that doesn't illuminate your day? C'mon. It's a mailing list about an >arty punk rock group. A certain amount of attitude should be the norm, not >frowned upon. > >Mark _________________________________________________________________ Tired of 56k? Get a FREE BT Broadband connection http://www.msn.co.uk/specials/btbroadband New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:45:44 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d So I'm told Keith,I'v got it on order.Ari Keith Knight wrote:This Television talk reminds me to ask - has the re-released Marquee Moon reinstated the proper ending to the title track (as discussed here earlier in the year)? Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of MarkBursa@aol.com Sent: 16 December 2003 00:15 To: threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com; idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d > Live at the old waldorf,San Fran, 6/29/78 is well worth having. > Nice one. Thanks for the tip! Mark New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:51:36 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen Jack wrote >In the case of Manscape, it is not a matter of technology but a question of bad judgement on the behalf of producer Dave Allen, who was accustomed to producing Cure records and brought everything in the music to the foreground...thus the miasma of sounds present in the current mix of Manscape. < Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 18:22:07 EST From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen In a message dated 16/12/2003 23:02:01 GMT Standard Time, threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com writes: > Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and > are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft > discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari > Would you be referring to the David Allen of Gong fame Ari ? Chris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:31:34 -0800 (PST) From: fernando Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen I cannot remember exactly, but I thought that one of them went by David M. Allen... and that is the one that produced The Chameleon's Strange Times, which is a fantastic record (IMO), and I would not think of the Cure's stuff. Are these the two Dave Allen? - --- CHRISWIRE@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 16/12/2003 23:02:01 GMT Standard Time, > threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com writes: > > > Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and > > are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft > > discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari > > > > Would you be referring to the David Allen of Gong fame Ari ? > Chris __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 23:43:04 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen > > Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and > > are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft > > discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari There's only one as far as I'm concerned, and that's the Irish guy with the finger missing. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 18:41:51 EST From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen In a message dated 16/12/2003 23:37:41 GMT Standard Time, keith.astbury10@virgin.net writes: > >>Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and > >>are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft > >>discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari > > There's only one as far as I'm concerned, and that's the Irish guy with the > finger missing. > Now you're talking.I have seen that Mr Allen live & he is very funny.But not as funny as Peter Kay in my opinion.Who is my wife's favourite comedian... other than me of course. Laugh a minute Chris ( West Brom have lost 2-0 to the Gooners) not laughing now. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:06:49 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Television's new c.d > So I'm told Keith,I'v got it on order.Ari > > Keith Knight wrote:This Television talk reminds > me to ask - has the re-released Marquee > Moon reinstated the proper ending to the title track (as discussed here > earlier in the year)? > You're told wrong in that case. It's the same as the last remaster, with the fade removed and the horrible rawk ending in place. This was by order of Verlaine, so now it's sadly the "official" version. Fucking idiot. It's a shame because it ruins an otherwise fine package - the sound is great, it's well assembled, and the CD is even printed with a proper Elektra label with the butterfly. You get alternative takes of MM (quite different, especially the solos, all improvised by TV), See no evil and Friction, plus Little Johnny Jewel on CD for the 1st time. And a rubbish surf-style instrumental that serves no purpose other than to show that bands prat about in the studio with half-formed ideas. Ah well, time to make another CDR with a manual fade-out. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:16:58 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen CHRISWIRE@aol.com wrote:In a message dated 16/12/2003 23:02:01 GMT Standard Time, threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com writes: Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari Would you be referring to the David Allen of Gong fame Ari ? Chris Not sure Chris,as I sed,there was always some confusion as to exactly who the 'other' Dave Allen was.Ari New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:19:22 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen fernando wrote: I cannot remember exactly, but I thought that one of them went by David M. Allen... and that is the one that produced The Chameleon's Strange Times, which is a fantastic record (IMO), and I would not think of the Cure's stuff. Are these the two Dave Allen? I don't THINK so Fernando,the albums discussed back then always had 'Dave Allen,Producer' not Dave 'M' Allen.Ari - --- CHRISWIRE@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 16/12/2003 23:02:01 GMT Standard Time, > threeduggaduggas@yahoo.com writes: > > > Interestingly there are TWO Dave Allen's and they BOTH produce music and > > are often confused with one another.I know this for a fact as it was oft > > discussed on the Shriekback list when I was a member of that list.Ari > > > > Would you be referring to the David Allen of Gong fame Ari ? > Chris __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing. http://photos.yahoo.com/ New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:42:23 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen Well what a mess you've got yourselves in. There are four Dave Allens - the Go4/Shriekback bassist one, the producer one, the digitally-impaired Irish comedian one, and the one out of Gong who adds an extraneous 'e' to differentiate himself from the others (ie Daevid). Either that or he's apretentious twat. Or else he's actually called that. One or the other. Or the other. But not the other. There are also two Andy Gills. The Go4 guitarist/Michael Hutchence producer (!!) one and the Sheffield-based ex-NME hack. There's also the confusing Alan Gill, proto-tache-wearing scouser of Reward-era Teardrop Expoldes/Dalek I notoriety. Go4 singer Jon King should of course not be confused with Joanthan King, the renowned pop mogul-turned-nonce. However, as far as I'm aware, there's only one Hugo Burnham.....one Hugo Buuuuurnhaaam! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:54:26 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] eighties Wire/Dave Allen MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: Well what a mess you've got yourselves in. There are four Dave Allens - the Go4/Shriekback bassist one, WHO ALSO PRODUCES MARK.... the producer one, HE'S THE 'OTHER' ONE the digitally-impaired Irish comedian one, and the one out of Gong who adds an extraneous 'e' to differentiate himself from the others (ie Daevid). Either that or he's apretentious twat. Or else he's actually called that. One or the other. Or the other. But not the other. There are also two Andy Gills. The Go4 guitarist/Michael Hutchence producer (!!) one and the Sheffield-based ex-NME hack. There's also the confusing Alan Gill, proto-tache-wearing scouser of Reward-era Teardrop Expoldes/Dalek I notoriety. Go4 singer Jon King should of course not be confused with Joanthan King, the renowned pop mogul-turned-nonce. However, as far as I'm aware, there's only one Hugo Burnham.....one Hugo Buuuuurnhaaam! Mark New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 08:40:37 -0000 From: "sean bowen" Subject: [idealcopy] Greg Lake Mark B wrote : > > But where does Greg Lake fit in, oh progmeister general? > > Mark ;-) "I Believe in Father Christmas" is quite simply THE best Xmas single of all time. Definitely. No arguments. Better than Slade, Wizzard, Shakey, Macca, Wham, Showaddywaddy and even Cliff. I'll never forget Xmas '75. 28 years on I'm still convinced that the chart was fiddled. To this day I've never listened to Queen in protest. On the subject of Xmas records, Crepuscule did a compilation in '81, but it was all rubbish except Cabaret Voltaire's "Invocation". ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V6 #378 *******************************