From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V6 #172 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Thursday, June 12 2003 Volume 06 : Number 172 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] Re: how many dead or alive in 1985? ["Jason Rogers" ] RE: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? ["Keith Knight" ] Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz ["John Goddard" ] Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz ["John Goddard" ] Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? [CHRISWIRE@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? [CHRISWIRE@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz [CHRISWIRE@aol.com] [idealcopy] None of Them Burn (Seven Times Spent) ["Bill Hick" ] [idealcopy] song check? (Quiz 1a) ["John Goddard" Subject: [idealcopy] Re: how many dead or alive in 1985? >Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 12:52:14 -0500 >From: Miles Goosens >Subject: RE: [idealcopy] how many dead or alive in 1985? > >The idea that 1985 was a poor year for music simply boggles my feeble lil' >mind. 1985 may be my favorite year in music ever. In fact, much earlier >this year, I did a four-disc compilation of '85 music for some friends, and >after completion of said project, have even thought of enough omitted >quality tracks to do a fifth disc. I consider all of these worthy of at >least an A-, four stars out of five, or whatever equals very good and >above: > > 5) X, Ain't Love Grand [minority opinion, I know] >21) Husker Du, Flip Your Wig >22) Husker Du, New Day Rising > >Miles I'm glad to see another X fan on the list. The 1985 X album, Ain't Love Grand, is one that I like better than I expected to. "Around My Heart" is my favorite song on the album and it redeems the other less-than-perfect tracks; it's one of my favorite songs in the X catalogue. I'm going to see X in concert tonight here in Atlanta. This will be the first time that the fully reunited X (guitarist Billy Zoom is back with the band) has visited Georgia since regrouping. I'm expecting some great performances of X classics from Los Angeles, Wild Gift, etc. I'm also glad to see Husker Du on your list. New Day Rising is on my All-Time Top Ten Albums list. I like the idea of your four-CD compilation of music from 1985. It reminds me of a "1989 Mix" that I made a year or so ago to commemorate my appreciation for the music of that year. 1989 Mix: 1. The Stone Roses - "I Wanna Be Adored" 2. Robyn Hitchcock And The Egyptians - "Madonna Of The Wasps" 3. Ian McCulloch - "Proud To Fall" 4. The Connells - "Fun & Games" 5. Guadalcanal Diary - "Always Saturday" 6. The Mighty Lemon Drops - "Where Do We Go From Heaven" 7. Morrissey - "The Last Of The Famous International Playboys" 8. New Order - "Run" 9. The Cure - "Fascination Street" 10. Bob Mould - "Dreaming I Am" 11. The Swans - "Saved" 12. Camper Van Beethoven - "I Was Born In A Laundromat" 13. The Replacements - "I'll Be You" 14. XTC - "The Mayor Of Simpleton" 15. Wire - "Eardrum Buzz (12" version)" 16. The Jesus And Mary Chain - "Head On" 17. Pixies - "Monkey Gone To Heaven" 18. The Ramones - "Pet Sematary" 19. Public Image Ltd. - "Disappointed" Yeah...gotta love it. I was still in high school back in 1989 and remember it fondly as a time before everything became so damn complicated. Anyway, the above is my soundtrack for that year. 1989 was also the year that I discovered this cool band called Wire. So...Wire's "Eardrum Buzz"...represent!!! Jason Now Playing: Guadalcanal Diary - "Fear Of God" (Yesterday, Guadalcanal Diary released a single-CD reissue combining their first two albums, Walking In The Shadow Of A Big Man and Jamboree; this is the first time that Jamboree has ever been released on CD. So, if you are a fan of Guadalcanal Diary and even if you aren't, get thee to a record store and purchase this one.) _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:47:14 +0100 From: rys01ajc@gold.ac.uk Subject: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle Would that be "7 Year Itch". I thought it was mediocre too. It makes me think that so many of the bands I liked from the pre-punk days keep churning out watered-down AOR versions of their former stuff in stark contrast to Wire (Pere Ubu/The Fall). Maybe prog whimsey inclines more to this sort of thing although I guess punk would descend into a different kind of self-parody. As to Pip Pyle's activities - I have a friend who is a Canterbury obsessive who can probably report on his bowel movements. - --On 10 June 2003 16:01 -0400 CHRISWIRE@aol.com wrote: > OK I'll try this time.Got an album by Pip Pyle of Hatfield & The North > fame which is to be honest mediocre.I rate him as one absolutely > fantastic drummer - in the same league as one Robert Gotobed/Gray.Anybody > know what became of Pip ? > > Chris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 16:37:47 +0000 From: "Derek White" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? . >OK I'll try this time.Got an album by Pip Pyle of Hatfield & The >North......... I rate him as one absolutely >fantastic drummer -in the same >league as one Robert Gotobed/Gray. Anybody know what became of Pip Beyond a short spell with renowned hash-heads and free-festival favourites Daevid Allen & Gong, nothing for years....wasn't he also in Blodwyn Pig? My chronology may be awry here: were they before or after Hatfield & the North? Nurse!...........dw _________________________________________________________________ Find a cheaper internet access deal - choose one to suit you. http://www.msn.co.uk/internetaccess ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:08:20 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle In a message dated 11/06/2003 13:47:55 GMT Daylight Time, rys01ajc@gold.ac.uk writes: > As to Pip Pyle's activities - I have a friend who is a > Canterbury obsessive who can probably report on his bowel movements. > Yes 7 year Itch is the LP & that did make me laugh ! Chris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:50:05 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Another the... > There was also a letter from an American reader thanking them for the > picture of Wire. As for his first name? > Bart! > (Another the!!!) People asking me if that Jean Claude dude is related is one thing, but Another the Bart? I dunno if I can cope. Also... he sounds like a bootlicker to me! Bart ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:07:37 +0100 From: "Keith Knight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? Checking on the Blodwyn Pig website (and I can't believe I've just done that) you're getting confused with their bassist Andy Pyle, Derek. At least I assume they're not the same person. I really loved the first Hatfield and the North album at the time, but wasn't impressed by the follow-up The Rotter's Club (subsequently the title of a novel by Jonathan Coe which I've been meaning to read for some time - anybody? I know that Henry Cow are the subject of some discussion in it which is good enough for me - it's about boys growing up in the 70s). I played the first album again probably about six years ago but it did nothing for me then - unlike that other great 74 Virgin release, Rock Bottom, which I still play regularly. I should probably give it another try though. As we're way off topic in the early 70s I'm going to take the chance to mention the reasonably priced three CD set 'The Best Prog Rock Album in the World Ever' which is just out and which is good enough to include all 20+ minutes of Van der Graaf Generator's definitive 'A Plague Of Lighthouse Keepers'. But there's some strange company - Roxy Music? ELO?? Zappa??? And Hatfield and the North. I haven't got it despite it being advertised as a Father's Day present. I'm getting the Zeppelin DVD instead. Oh yes. Another the Keith - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Derek White Sent: 11 June 2003 17:38 To: idealcopy@smoe.org; CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? . >OK I'll try this time.Got an album by Pip Pyle of Hatfield & The >North......... I rate him as one absolutely >fantastic drummer -in the same >league as one Robert Gotobed/Gray. Anybody know what became of Pip Beyond a short spell with renowned hash-heads and free-festival favourites Daevid Allen & Gong, nothing for years....wasn't he also in Blodwyn Pig? My chronology may be awry here: were they before or after Hatfield & the North? Nurse!...........dw _________________________________________________________________ Find a cheaper internet access deal - choose one to suit you. http://www.msn.co.uk/internetaccess ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 14:10:36 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] off topic: Associates 7" maybe one of you Ideal Copyists can help me out...i am driving myself insane trying to find the Associates single (7") "The Affectionate Punch b/w You Were Young"..if anyone has a copy they would like to sell to me..i would greatly appreciate it...or a cd-r or cassette would be nice...i really want to hear the difference in the "Affectionate Punch" and the b-side "You Were Young" (which i have never heard)...i would gladly give you a cassette or cd-r of either version of the Affectionate Punch album (i have the original and remixed) HELP! Robert ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 20:13:19 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy]OT:Money spines, balanced plank, Chapman's laughter in the bank Perhaps for a lot of you the Chapmans spoiled the Barbican gig a bit and from what I understood I wasn't convinced by their contribution either, but I must say I do like their (own) work very much. I was blown away by their restrospective in the Groninger Museum half a year ago. http://www.groninger-museum.nl (english/search). Their work has depth, edge and a fine sence of humour. Also, I liked the carved tribal figures (which I hadn't seen before) in the Guardian link below enormously. And "laughter in the bank"... If one has to make a living I'd certainly choose a career like the Chapmans any time! Bart > I don't know if anybody has mentioned this, but it seems Jake & Dinos > Chapman have made the shortlist for the annual jamboree of brick-pilers, > bed-soilers and shark-picklers, aka The Turner Prize? > I overheard a brief burst of an arts program on Radio 4 that included them > amongst the candidates, and the Guardian has them on the official shortlist, > too. > www.guardian.co.uk/arts/gallery/0,8542,966373,00.html > I wait to see *which* US TV show they'll video and loop for this > 'piece'. Or perhaps they have footage of them chortling whilst pointing at > incredulous Wire fans at the Barbican? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:02:58 +0000 From: "Derek White" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? >>wasn't he also in Blodwyn Pig? >Checking on the Blodwyn Pig website (and I can't believe I've just done >that) you're getting confused with their bassist Andy Pyle, Derek. At >least I assume they're not the same person. I stand corrected. Not everyday you get disabused of a 25-year old case of mistaken identity. And *I* can't believe you went to the Blodwyn Pig site, either....... ;-) _________________________________________________________________ It's fast, it's easy and it's free. Get MSN Messenger today! http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:27:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Fwd: Re: [idealcopy] Another the... Bart van Damme wrote > There was also a letter from an American reader thanking them for the > picture of Wire. As for his first name? > Bart! > (Another the!!!) People asking me if that Jean Claude dude is related is one thing, but Another the Bart? I dunno if I can cope. Also... he sounds like a bootlicker to me! Bart ................................... If ya can't take the heat change yer name:SOME SUGGESTIONS THEN: art,cart,dart,fart,mart,part,tart,wart,start,chart,he-art.any more anyone? I'll get me plane ticket.Ari Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 09:56:34 +0100 From: Mark McQuitty Subject: [idealcopy] Dif Juz >>oneloveonebagonenil@hotmail.com writes: >>> Dif Juz - Extractions >>> >>chriswire@aol.com writes: >>Massively good album. Good call both. I LOVE that album. All their work is worth a listen. The Hurmenics EP got a remaster on the Soundpool CD released a year or two back on 4AD. Anyone know what any of them are doing nowadays? MarkM ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:23:21 +0100 From: "John Goddard" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz How about TIME CLOCKS TURN BACK Cassette only release? By Dif Juz more of the same but in a rawer playback Excellent Anyone else heard this one? - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark McQuitty" To: Cc: "Ideal Copy (E-mail)" Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 9:56 AM Subject: [idealcopy] Dif Juz > >>oneloveonebagonenil@hotmail.com writes: > > >>> Dif Juz - Extractions > >>> > > >>chriswire@aol.com writes: > >>Massively good album. > > > Good call both. I LOVE that album. All their work is worth a listen. The > Hurmenics EP got a remaster on the Soundpool CD released a year or two back > on 4AD. > > Anyone know what any of them are doing nowadays? > > MarkM ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:25:06 +0100 From: "John Goddard" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz Has anyone on the list had the pleasure of taking in Dif Juz live? i certainly didn't have the pleasure. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark McQuitty" To: Cc: "Ideal Copy (E-mail)" Sent: Wednesday, June 11, 2003 9:56 AM Subject: [idealcopy] Dif Juz > >>oneloveonebagonenil@hotmail.com writes: > > >>> Dif Juz - Extractions > >>> > > >>chriswire@aol.com writes: > >>Massively good album. > > > Good call both. I LOVE that album. All their work is worth a listen. The > Hurmenics EP got a remaster on the Soundpool CD released a year or two back > on 4AD. > > Anyone know what any of them are doing nowadays? > > MarkM ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:27:28 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? In a message dated 11/06/2003 19:09:18 GMT Daylight Time, steeleknight@lineone.net writes: > really loved the first Hatfield and the North album at the time, but > wasn't impressed by the follow-up The Rotter's Club (subsequently the > title of a novel by Jonathan Coe which I've been meaning to read for > some time - anybody? I know that Henry Cow are the subject of some > discussion in it which is good enough for me - it's about boys growing > up in the 70s). I played the first album again probably about six years > ago but it did nothing for me then - unlike that other great 74 Virgin > release, Rock Bottom, which I still play regularly. I should probably > give it another try though. > > Oh God .Another The Keith has struck again.I am reading The Rotters Club right now.It's thoroughly enjoyable & encapsulates the Brown world of the 1970's & growing up as a teenager as we all were perfectly.It's set in the West Midlands & mentions Barclay James Harvest on the first page.I think the music paper I used to get Sounds is mentioned on the second.Just sheer nostalgia but with a very funny & well written novel as its mouthpiece.Highly recommended stuff. Chris NP Stereolab - Cobra & Phases Group Play Voltage In The Milky Night ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:29:21 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: OT Pip Pyle...where is he now? In a message dated 11/06/2003 19:09:47 GMT Daylight Time, steeleknight@lineone.net writes: > I'm getting the Zeppelin > DVD instead. Oh yes. > > Another the Keith > Oh & in The Rotters Club, Led Zep is mentioned profusely.Must read now keith I feel. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 17:37:49 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz In a message dated 11/06/2003 22:24:08 GMT Daylight Time, puzzleoyster@blueyonder.co.uk writes: > How about TIME CLOCKS TURN BACK Cassette only release? By Dif Juz more of > the same but in a rawer playback > > Excellent > No.Must admit not heard that,But sure would like to. Talking of Prog Rock does anyone remember a band I have great affection for as I heard them on Alan Freeman on a Saturday afternoon once & bought the LP.The band were AFT (Automatic Fine Tuning) & it's a great record to my ears still.The main track - The Great Panjandrum Wheel parts 1 & 2 gives you an idea they were not a singles band but the Proggy Copyists amongst us may remember or discover & enjoy. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 23:14:33 +0100 From: "Bill Hick" Subject: [idealcopy] None of Them Burn (Seven Times Spent) >>>"which track from 'Send' should be a single?" None of them. You've already paid for some of those tracks 3 times over if you bought send, R&B 01 & 02 & the redux. So why the fuck do you want to pay for one of them again? I know DJs are sometimes a bit dull & brainless (especially Mum & Dad of Manchester who delight in playing the worst of the 80s crapchartpoprocks to drunk victims that reminded me why I started listening to Sonic Youth, Big Black, Wire & The Fall), but surely even the most stupid fucker can program a track from a CD? If like me you got The Wire Tapper, Metro CD, redux, send, r&b02, Peel Session & Peel ATP broadcast you'll have Spent 7 times in 4 different versions - why would you want it again???? Go buy the new Bardo Pond album instead. It's the first album I've heard this year that is better than Send... If Wire wanted to do another 7" wouldn't it be a lot more interesting if they flogged us a taste of the next move (Read and Burn 03) eg. The Art of Persistance ? or Zoom ? c/w something exclusive eg. DJ Fuck Off's Drill or He Knows (Albini session) Cracked Machine Highly Irregular Cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine NP Bardo Pond - On the Ellipse "Existance, well what does it matter?" (Joy Davidson - Hearth Unsold, Read & Burn) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 18:31:33 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] None of Them Burn (Seven Times Spent) In a message dated 11/06/2003 23:17:34 GMT Daylight Time, umur_ot@hotmail.com writes: > You've already paid for some of those tracks 3 times over if you bought > send, > R&B 01 & 02 & the redux. So why the fuck do you want to pay for one of them > again? > Graeme I think I personally would just like to see Wire get a lot more attention & airplay & most of all bought to a wider audience who would not necessarily have heard their music before.Obviously a repeatedly played single would give them that.I wasn't necessarily just thinking from my point of view but from a public awareness standpoint. I would like to see the band sell more units so that they can carry on making more music like Send.Agree that R & B 03 will be well anticipated by us Ideal Copyists but a good airing of Comet or Spent on the Radio & moreover on MTV 2 or whatever wouldn't go amiss & would not be before time.It might also swell the ranks of this meeting place & Miles would be prouder than he already is. What I need is a small venue where Wire will kick it in again so I can get The Barbican out of my system once & for all.Chapmanless so to speak. Chris NP African Groove - Sampler /Putumayo Records ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 18:36:52 EDT From: Tisbili@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Dif Juz diffuse inquiries about dif juz.... Richie Thomas' playing with CTwins is relatively well known; he was purported to have a release coming out on EBV (FSOL's imprint). This was years ago, so its probably bunk. Last time I saw their website, there were vague suggestions of future releases. I'm not holding my breath. better to burn out than to fade away? BillE ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ rp: eno * bell studies for the clock of the long now; music for white cube herrman und kleine yello * solid pleasure four tet * rounds dvoa * hafted maul move d vs pete namlook sneaker pimps * bloodsport ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 23:45:10 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] None of Them Burn (Seven Times Spent) On Wed, Jun 11, 2003 at 11:14:33PM +0100, Bill Hick wrote: > >>>"which track from 'Send' should be a single?" > > > None of them. > > You've already paid for some of those tracks 3 times over if you bought send, > R&B 01 & 02 & the redux. So why the fuck do you want to pay for one of them > again? I don't, particularly. I have Spent four times in two different versions, and as you say, I don't need any more - however, a single is easier to get a radio push for, is easier to promote, is easier *to get across to the general populace* - which is a worthy goal. > I know DJs are sometimes a bit dull & brainless (especially Mum & Dad of > Manchester who delight in playing the worst of the 80s crapchartpoprocks to > drunk victims that reminded me why I started listening to Sonic Youth, Big > Black, Wire & The Fall), but surely even the most stupid fucker can program a > track from a CD? I appear to be able to manage that, which may be why I've played quite so much off Send and LatM on this term's shows. I'd like to think I'm not brainless; frequently naive and underinformed, yes, but half of the world is with me there. I'll rephrase the question I intended, even though I suspect you know fine well what it was; "If you were going to introduce people who've NEVER HEARD Wire to a song off Send, which song would you choose?" > Go buy the new Bardo Pond album instead. > It's the first album I've heard this year that is better than Send... I'll have a listen. Thanks for the pointer. > If Wire wanted to do another 7" wouldn't it be a lot more interesting if they > flogged us a taste of the next move (Read and Burn 03) [list of rarities] From my perspective, that's one big (DJ) fuck-off YES. I'd love that. However, that wasn't the point I was trying to make. Oh well. *shrug* - -A - -- home - email: andrew@lexical.org.uk | http://www.lexical.org.uk/ work - email: adw27@esc.cam.ac.uk | http://www.esc.cam.ac.uk/ radio - 11pm Wednesdays, "Random Walk" | http://www.cur1350.co.uk/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 18:03:16 -0500 From: Michael Flaherty Subject: [idealcopy] Recent Listening ... I've been listening to: Wire: Send and Metro G, L, + M: MZUI Brian Eno: Bell Studies Von Schlippenbach Quartet (w/ Evan Parker): Hunting the Snake Wally Shoup, Paul Flaherty, Thurston Moore, and Chris Carsano: At the Tonic Michael Flaherty ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 02:29:22 +0100 From: "John Goddard" Subject: [idealcopy] song check? (Quiz 1a) If i am on Euston station observng Pigeons picking up and eating Human Puke Which song am i? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:19:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: [idealcopy] None of Them Burn (Seven Times Spent) ......exactly........ Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM). ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V6 #172 *******************************