From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V5 #358 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Tuesday, October 22 2002 Volume 05 : Number 358 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] barbican etc/Colin /pt.1.8 [Ari Britt ] Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 [Andrew Walkingshaw ] [idealcopy] Greatest Briton of All Time [RLynn9@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Blood (3rd This Mortal Coil LP) [Eardrumbuz@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] [OT] A new instrument? (was Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350) [] [idealcopy] You know you own too much music when... was Re: OT - Blood (3rd This Mortal Coil LP) [Andrew Walkingshaw ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 03:18:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] barbican etc/Colin /pt.1.8 - --------------------------------- Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 07:04:19 EDT From: HowardJSpencer@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Re: Not me/|Modern English In a message dated 21/10/02 9:31:56 am, owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org writes: << Secondly, the track is Not Me - as opposed to Not To. You can find Colin's version of Not Me on the CD of A-Z. It's a demo - he never recorded a "proper" version. >> This is a track that I searched for for years in the 80s/early 90s - a flatmate used to play it and I used to sing the chorus to people who might be in the know. Got nothing except some funny looks. Then bought the TMC album years after it came out and found it one glorious Saturday in 1994. Had no idea it was a Colin composition until I read the label - one of those reassuring moments, when you think 'hey, my critical faculties are sharp and ready'. The Modern English/TMC version is well worth seeking if you haven't heard it - - better than Colin's version, IMO, probably because that was only a demo. Lyrics are about being underwhelmed by the Salvador Dali museum in Figueres, something I can identify with. Howard ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 08:18:34 EDT From: HowardJSpencer@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Re: source for info re Not me Kevin's book I've been trained always to give sources - pretty obvious but my last post was from Kevin's book. Out of print last I heard - is now as ripe a time as any for a second edition, perhaps including a post 1991 update? Ahoy there Kevin! Howard ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 14:37:26 EDT From: Rain19c@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Colin's Desert Island Discs (I sent this yesterday - it might've bounced though) [It did. Size matters! - listowner Miles] http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/watw/02-10/colin-newman.shtml Desert Island Discs as of 18.10.02 (And of That Date Only) by Colin Newman of Wire The following are a selection of ten items drawn solely from the general "popular" music category. Other musics like classical, world, and folk are an interest but would make this already unwieldy process simply impossible. As my personal experience of this music genre extends from the 60's to the present day-- I have no real experience with 50's music and am not the kind of person who can discover a style years later-- I am fixing on a rule of two items from each decade which are good in themselves but also link to other items from that period that could also be chosen. Obviously, no order of preference is expressed. [A previous version of this article appeared in Blow Up magazine, Italy.] >> 60's The Beatles: White Album [Parlophone/EMI] Often, Revolver gets chosen for these kinds of lists, and although that's probably a better album, The White Album hints at many other kinds of musics which were around by '68, as well as having its roots in the classic pop of the 60's. It has nascent heavy rock without the dryness of Abbey Road that links the likes of Led Zeppelin (first album), weird corners which link it to the slightly more unhinged end of 60's stuff like Beefheart and Zappa, and of course, classic pop which stands for The Beach Boys, The Move, etc. John Cale & Terry Riley: Church of Anthrax [Columbia] A timeless work (apart from Cale's one rather terrible song). Here you have experimental pop (along the lines of Velvets) meets the "avant-garde" of classical music (and doubtless drugs) which link to Steve Reich and others. It's also remarkably forward-looking as it connects very well to mid-90's ambient and has been a definite influence on my own work with Immersion. >> 70's Kraftwerk: Trans-Europe Express [Capitol] Kraftwerk have been so influential not only rhythmically-- and this has been so well documented it's hardly worth repeating, but suffice to say, Afrika Bambaataa and all electro are indebted-- but also harmonically. Interestingly for me, it has direct connections backwards with Riley and the minimalists but also forward to so much synth and beats-oriented music (everything from New Order to G-Man). There's also a direct influence of the nascent British "electronic" scene (Cabaret Voltaire, etc). The Buzzcocks: Spiral Scratch [Mute] In a way, Spiral Scratch has to stand for all punk rock from its US roots (Iggy and VU on to The Ramones, Patti Smith, and others) to its short UK flowering on debut records by bands like the Sex Pistols and The Damned. There is another point, though: Spiral Scratch represents the moment when punk collided with the formalisms of UK art-rockers such as Bowie and Roxy Music. It's so very "arch", and it's undoubtedly true that had Howie not left and Shelley not slipped into the "sulphate love songs" formula (however good), Wire's job would have been a great deal more difficult in the 70's. >> 80's My Bloody Valentine: Loveless [Creation/Sire] In a way, this has to stand for all "indie" music from the 80's, but the amazing thing about MBV was the way they transcended their roots through a series of increasingly daring twelve-inches that culminated in this album. They brought back substance and timeless beauty at the end of a period of pop insubstantiality. Other 80's indie gods include Happy Mondays and the Stone Roses. Aphex Twin: Digeridoo EP [R&S] The latter half of the 80's crackled with new rhythms and tones-- Chicago house, Detroit techno, and new scenes in Gent, Rotterdam, Leeds, and London. It's a period difficult to define with one record. There was so much that about all I can say is that the first time I heard "Digeridoo" I became aware that this music could convey much darker and more powerful emotions providing a real counterpoint to the period's tendency to be a bit emotionally lightweight. >> 90's Various Artists: "Black" Series [No-U-Turn] By the 90's, any notion of a credible mainstream that had been the mainstay of 60's and 70's music had all but disappeared. However, it is absolutely impossible to look at the mid-90's without taking in drum 'n' bass. From its roots in the suburban hardcore scene, drum and bass grew exponentially through '94 and '95 to a point where there was simply no other music to be into. LTJ Bukem's "Looking Good/Good Looking" series of twelve-inches at the time really defined the sound, but are almost impossible to listen to now in any other than a nostalgic way (you can take it I'm not very big on nostalgia). Towards the end of the scene, a series of very dark-sounding, almost industrial tunes were released on records with an entirely black label, in a black bag-- you had to be "in" to know what they were!! For me, these records marked nothing less than the re-emergence of rock music, this time with machines! And have set the tenor for a lot of my rhythmically connected work over the last few years. Tortoise: Millions Now Living Will Never Die [Thrill Jockey] The Tortoise story is, in a way, quite remarkable: a bunch of guys moonlighting from other bands create some kind of mutated "jazz-rock" (later called "post-rock") which is hated in their native Chicago but which breaks big with the "post-breakbeat" crowd in the UK. They go on to influence a generation of bands (most of which would deny it by now :) The classic track is "Djed" which directly connects with Riley/Reich minimalism. (See also: Fridge, Mogwai, Silo, etc.) The 90's also saw the emergence of my own Swim label. Honorable mention should be made of Lobe, Ronnie & Clyde, Malka Spigel, G-Man, dol-lop, and Symptoms, who have helped define the new "post-electronic" age. >> '00's McLusky: Do Dallas [Beggars] Liars They Threw Us All in a Trench... [Mute] I've chosen these to represent both the absolute return to "rock" and the re-emergence of jerky art formalism, both of which, alongside electrodirt and "heavy metal dancefloor" (which I just made up), totally inform the current Wire output.Otherwise, the most culturally significant act of the past two years has been The Strokes (not the saviors of Western Civilization but not entirely crap because they aren't). They, of course, have opened the floodgates to all shades of "rawk", arty, retro, cutting edge, and, er... not so cutting edge-- we've been on a somewhat "diverting" trip from 1977 to 1980 (via 1962, courtesy of the Hives) in the company of a clutch of bands from Brooklyn, a bunch of rather sorry UK retro bands and, oh yeah, the "Australian Nirvana". 2001 was the year when my much-predicted rock renaissance actually happened. By '02 we're already looking for the next thing! Certainly one of those will be rock music recorded and manipulated on home computers (Swim have a new band called Rhodes who do just that). Of course, I'm also keeping an eye on if the much talked-about British Heavy Metal renaissance is going to amount to more than Raging Speedhorn, as well as keeping a weather eye on electro in all its myriad forms (best in its dirtier version-- Fat truckers and Adult are the soup). DVDs The 00's has not yet had enough years to produce two "real" titles that can represent the decade, but I can say what I think what could be a significant development. So far, the medium of DVD has seen very little of worth relating to the emotional complexity of music beyond what you can get through TV broadcasts (live concerts and pop videos). However, cheaper and easier video editing and DVD authoring (Macs have really focused on this) allied with imminent widespread DVD-player ownership means the possibility to realize DVD items which are new hybrids of sound and vision. Certainly, this is something that Malka & I are currently working towards... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:57:47 EDT From: Gstoll4@cs.com Subject: [idealcopy] wire LPs I have near-mint LPs of Pink Flag and Chairs Missing on Harvest EMI England. I brought them to a record show and dealers were begging me for them, but I'd rather they go to a real Wire fan. Please e-mail me with offers if interested. Tahnks. Gary ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 15:27:17 +0100 From: Alistair Tear Subject: [idealcopy] M25 Quite an interesting piece here... http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/features/story/0,11710,814770,00.html later A ************************************************************************* The contents of the e-mail and any transmitted files are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. Transport for London Street Management hereby excludes any warranty and any liability as to the quality or accuracy of the contents of this e-mail and any attached transmitted files. If you are not the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify postmaster@Streetmanagement.org.uk. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept for the presence of computer viruses. ************************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 20:48:00 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 On Mon, Oct 14, 2002 at 07:24:41PM +0100, Keith Knight wrote: > I find it interesting, Andrew, that Sgt Pepper nearly gets a top ten vote > from you. I've always considered it to be a record which was hugely > overrated. It's got loads of weak stuff on it IMO - can an album with 'When > I'm 64' be regarded as great? It's a tough call. The best bits of Sgt. Peppers' are unbelievably good (and I'd class "A Day in the Life" in that), the worst bits are at best pleasant and mildly amusing, and at worst glib and deeply annoying. McCartney has a lot of natural talent, but some truly alarming lapses of taste. Of course, "Abbey Road" has this syndrome worse: "Maxwell's Silver Hammer". As such, I'd contend the Beatles' best album was certainly Revolver, though that does have Yellow Submarine (which is enough to keep it out my top 10). Revolver is weak for a few tracks: "I'm Only Sleeping" is tolerable, "Yellow Submarine" is annoying, "Good Day Sunshine" is steeped in saccharine in a way the otherwise-similarly-motivated "Here Comes the Sun" manages to avoid a bit (off "Abbey Road"). "Eleanor Rigby" is clever, and elegant, but again nowhere near its' press. However, "Taxman" is the best rock song (with "Revolution") the Beatles ever wrote, and "For No One", "Got to Get You Into My Life", and "Tomorrow Never Knows" I all really like. "A Day in the Life" is good enough for me to think about the album; but it was never going to hit my top 10 with the amount of, basically, filler on it. However, if the original plan for Peppers' had been followed, it'd be in my top ten: the double A-side, Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane, was pulled off it during the recording process. (George Martin said this was the "greatest mistake of his career", incidentally... reference: "Revolution in the Head", by Ian MacDonald) > (mind you I'd argue the same in re 'Frankly Mr > Shankly' and 'The Queen is Dead'). I can see that argument, but the single _key_ Morrisey lyric "I'd rather be famous / than righteous or holy / any day, any day" redeems that song to a large extent for me. Basically, the worst moments of the Beatles are when McCartney's sweet tooth ran riot - which is possibly why, though I've not heard it, I've heard it claimed that "Flowers in the Dirt" is the only tolerable solo album of his (co-written with Elvis Costello). > I'm sure that it's not on your list > because of it's 'classic' status - your posts clearly show you to be someone > who would not be swayed by this - so I'd be interested in your opinions. I'm swayed in that there's records I've bought purely because I think I should have heard them: sometimes successful, sometimes mixed, sometimes not. > (being, eek! over twice you age). Give me Beefheart and the Velvets anytime > from that era, artistes who still sound radical today - played 'Velvet > Underground and Nico' yesterday and it still sounds freshly minted. Another album I like a lot. Knew there'd be some I'd forget - another was Love's "Forever Changes". (If I were to name a Bowie album, which seems a popular path to go, I actually prefer Hunky Dory to Low, though I've never actually heard all of Ziggy Stardust - I can see why Low is the more *important* record, and I enjoy listening to it, but... "Life on Mars?". Enough said.) - - Andrew - -- "And I'm too tired to care about this; Can't you see this in my face, my face?" - - Blur, "Coping" ('Modern Life is Rubbish') adw27@cam.ac.uk (academic) | http://www.lexical.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 10:41:00 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 >>However, "Taxman" is the best rock song (with "Revolution") the Beatles ever wrote, << Paperback Writer?? Rain??? Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 15:49:05 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 On Mon, Oct 21, 2002 at 10:41:00AM -0400, MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > >>However, "Taxman" is the > best rock song (with "Revolution") the Beatles ever wrote, << > > Paperback Writer?? Rain??? Opinions clearly vary: I prefer Taxman to both, to be honest. Now, you could probably make a case for quite a few songs here, actually... - -- "I know it's true, all I do counts for confusion, Innocence making a case for illusion..." - - the Delgados, "Everything Goes Around the Water" ('Peloton') adw27@cam.ac.uk (academic) | http://www.lexical.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 15:03:33 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: [idealcopy] 24 hour party people It's been discussed here before, but I thought I'd just a*d me two penneth... Watched 24 Hour Party People last night. I have to admit I wasn't particularly arsed about seeing it, BUT...I loved it! It mightn't be the Factory story that some people wanted - and I include myself in this equation till I saw it - but it was one of the funniest films I've seen in years. I laughed out loud at least half a dozen times, which is roughly twice the laugh counter I've registered with the first two episodes of the new series of League of Gentlemen. Ironic considering how austere Factory's image was... Those of you who haven't seen it please excuse the following, but the scene with God in Tony Wilsons image, regretting not signing the Smiths creased me up. And of course it featured the Chester Clock - a real local (fave) landmark for me... Keith NP Various - Gigantic ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 02:25:19 +0100 (BST) From: timothy.j.robinson@btinternet.com Subject: [idealcopy] OT: Nag Nag Nag Again Didn't realise this electroclash remix thing was an official CV item. Was it a bootleg at first? Now Here it is: http://www.mute.com/mute/novamute/cabaret_voltaire/ Great re-use of the original sleeve. Can't wait to hear the Akufen version and Richard H Kirks version. Wonder what the 90s kids will make of the Cabs? I think they'll 'get it'. Mute are also releasing a 'Best of' Cabs 78/82. Not sure whats on it. And there is also mention of another box-set, presumably from the same era.. And is it really true that Mal from the Cabs has produced the new Shaun Ryder LP?! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:02:04 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 > However, "Taxman" is the > best rock song (with "Revolution") the Beatles ever wrote, and "For No One", > "Got to Get You Into My Life", and "Tomorrow Never Knows" I all really like. I love Got To Get You In to My Life. I think it's great that The Beatles were able to take on a particular style (in this case 60's soul) and make it sound pretty bloody authentic. I like the Cliff Bennett version too. > incidentally... reference: "Revolution in the Head", by Ian MacDonald) Can I just say at this point that I hate Ian MacDonald. What a dull fucking writer. I've read articles/reviews by him that relate to HEROES of mine and I've struggled to finish them cos they're just so BORING! > Basically, the worst moments of the Beatles > are when McCartney's sweet tooth ran riot Or when George got his blood sitar out. The Inner Light anyone... > which is possibly why, though > I've not heard it, I've heard it claimed that "Flowers in the Dirt" is the > only tolerable solo album of his (co-written with Elvis Costello). Are we including Wings in that statement? Band on the Run was a good album in it's day... Cue 'Mamonia Mamonia oh oh oh'!!! Keith ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 09:56:05 -0700 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 > However, if the original plan for Peppers' had been followed, it'd be > in my top ten: the double A-side, Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny > Lane, was pulled off it during the recording process. (George Martin > said this was the "greatest mistake of his career", > incidentally... reference: "Revolution in the Head", by Ian MacDonald) > Yes, the book "The Beatles Recording Sessions" by Mark Lewisohn mentions that Strawberry Fields Forever & Penny Lane were in contention for Sgt. Pepper, but since they were released as a single, they were dropped from the running. "[Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane] followed standard 1960s record company practice - the release of the two songs as a single effectively [ruled] out the opportunity of including the songs on a album." The book also mentions that "Only A Northern Song" was also being considered for Pepper. Certainly, it wouldn't have sounded out of place there. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 20:48:54 +0100 From: "ian.s. jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] OT - Blood (3rd This Mortal Coil LP) >i never got the third one. anyone have it and/or recommend it? > >-paul c.d. 'Blood' is worth the money alone for the version of Chris Bell's (Big Star) 'You And Your Sister', sung by Kim Deal and Tanya Donnelly, strings by Martin McCarrick...it's exquisite, has to be one of THE best cover versions ever recorded IMO... it also has covers of Bell's 'I Am The Cosmos' and Syd Barrett's 'Late Night' amongst others...find it 2nd-hand if you can... if not, mail me dude...!!! ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free! Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 16:08:48 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: [idealcopy] [WAY OT] Camper Van Beethoven is touring ...no really. Pretty much the original lineup: courtesy of http://www.crackerweb.f9.co.uk Camper Van Beethoven tour again 06 Oct 2002: David Lowery: "After 3 successful residencies this summer, CVB has decided to mount something that resembles a tour. Look for the band in January 2003. Northeast and Upper Midwest. Expect dates in Washington DC, Philly, NYC, Boston, Chicago, Minneapolis, St. Louis ... And London Queen Elizabeth Hall, February 02 2003." I think the lineup will be: David Lowery, Jonathan Segel, Victor Krummenacher, Greg Lisher, along with Cracker's back row, Frank Funaro and Kenny Margolis. Just thought this might be of interest to some people. (^_^) Cheers, Paul *********************************************************** Brain: "Pinky, Are You Pondering What I'm Pondering?" Pinky: "I think so Brain, but can the gummy worms really live in peace with the marshmallow chips?" Paul Pietromonaco Test Engineer - Reflection X WRQ, Inc. E-Mail: paulp@wrq.com *********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 16:13:20 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: [idealcopy] [OT] A new instrument? (was Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350) >> Basically, the worst moments of the Beatles >> are when McCartney's sweet tooth ran riot > >Or when George got his blood sitar out. The Inner Light anyone... > I know this is most likely a typo, but I sorta want to play a "blood sitar". It sounds intriguing. Anyone else? (^_^) Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:27:10 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Colin's Desert Island Discs > >> 80's > > My Bloody Valentine: Loveless [Creation/Sire] Remember when Rolling Stone chose Londons Calling as their album of the 80's, even though it was released in 1979. And we Brits scoffed at our US friends! Now just because it's Colin doesn't mean that us pedants are gonna ignore this does it - Surely Loveless is from 1991! Interesting choices though. Some of my fave records - Loveless, Spiral Scratch, etc - and mentions for The Beach Boys and The Move. Thanks for sharing this one Michael. Keith ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:38:15 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] A new instrument? (was Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350) > >Or when George got his blood sitar out. The Inner Light anyone... > > > I know this is most likely a typo, but I sorta want to play a "blood > sitar". > > It sounds intriguing. Anyone else? (^_^) Hahahaha!!! Excellent Paul. I want one too! Keith (typo!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:10:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] A new instrument? (was Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350) Paul Pietromonaco wrote: >> Basically, the worst moments of the Beatles >> are when McCartney's sweet tooth ran riot > >Or when George got his blood sitar out. The Inner Light anyone... > I know this is most likely a typo, but I sorta want to play a "blood sitar". It sounds intriguing. Anyone else? (^_^) Cheers, Paul He used his Blood Sitar when listening to this mortal coil or was that this faulty oil he also used it to point at people he didn't like.....to turn up the heat( read make their' blood ' 'boil') this mortal boil anyone?Ari(all in vein) n.p:Wilco at the 930 club last tuesday in D.C Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 05:18:27 -0500 From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] barbican etc/Colin /pt.1.8 - --------------------------------- Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:01:11 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 In a message dated 10/21/02 10:45:41 AM, MarkBursa@aol.com writes: > >Paperback Writer?? Rain??? 2 of my faves, especially rain! as colin noted, the white album touches on several areas of interest, really making it a more rounded choice than revolver or sgt pepper. while i prefer listening to revolver (of the 3), i can certainly see his point with regards to greatness. - -paul c.d. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:04:14 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 24 hour party people In a message dated 10/21/02 11:03:07 AM, keith.astbury10@virgin.net writes: >creased me >up never heard this expression before. i like it! i guess the film creased me up a bit too :o) - -paul c.d. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 23:52:03 -0400 From: "Stephen Graziano" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 other 67ish Beatles songs - "All You Need Is Love" was written just before the Our World Broadcast (July 28? 1967) and Baby You're a Rich Man was about the 14 Hour Technicolor Dream concert (May/June 67 - well after Pepper was in the can). Though I can certainly sympathize with the dream of recreating the original concept of Pepper as a double album by adding tunes historically close to it. Though those extra 5 tracks would have made it a nice length single CD. Anybody want to suggest a revamped running order. Pepper historically is never going to carry the weight of it's reputation. We simply can't recreate the times or the mindset of when it was released. Even without discussing it's musical (for rock anyway) inovations and strides in album art, Pepper represents a high-water mark of 60's culture. Even more so than Woodstock - which was an assembly for the freaks, Pepper was when it all came together, for everyone. The expanses and vistas opened were vast. The sense of optimism unbridled, the possibilities endless - Anything was possible. The entire youth culture - today so multi-fragmented was united and coherent and the Beatles were the ambassadors and the bridge - between youth culture and the establishment, between high and low art, between sanity and insanity even. In the summer of 67, before the advent of FM, album oriented rock, Pepper - which had nary a single on it - was broadcast continously, everywhere - it was the unifying blanket - the lingua franca of the summer. So much of what we now take for granted in pop music and culture as a whole, and in album conception and production in particular was given birth in Sgt Pepper and its reception by the world. And even today, if I try very hard, I can listen to it with "fresh ears" and try to recreate the sheer mindblowingness of this torrent of rock creativity. And yes, parts of it today sound creaky and some of it's weaker parts carry the excess of it's age. But on the other hand, after hearing what they were able to do with the remix of Yellow Submarine, I live for the day when Pepper gets a 5.1 stereo surround mix and what was done for Lucy In The Sky and the title track can happen for the whole album - and I guarantee you young whippersnappers - It'll Be A REVELATION. Steve. G - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Pietromonaco" To: Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350 > > However, if the original plan for Peppers' had been followed, it'd be > > in my top ten: the double A-side, Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny > > Lane, was pulled off it during the recording process. (George Martin > > said this was the "greatest mistake of his career", > > incidentally... reference: "Revolution in the Head", by Ian MacDonald) > > > > Yes, the book "The Beatles Recording Sessions" by Mark Lewisohn mentions > that Strawberry Fields Forever & Penny Lane were in contention for Sgt. > Pepper, but since they were released as a single, they were dropped from > the running. "[Strawberry Fields Forever/Penny Lane] followed standard > 1960s record company practice - the release of the two songs as a single > effectively [ruled] out the opportunity of including the songs on a album." > The book also mentions that "Only A Northern Song" was also being > considered for Pepper. Certainly, it wouldn't have sounded out of place > there. > > Cheers, > Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 22:41:00 -0400 From: Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Colin's Desert Island Discs On Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:27:10 +0100 Keith Astbury wrote: > > >> 80's > > > > My Bloody Valentine: Loveless [Creation/Sire] > > Remember when Rolling Stone chose Londons > Calling as their album of the > 80's, even though it was released in 1979. And > we Brits scoffed at our US > friends! No offense to Keith, but I am so tired of this one. Yes, LONDON CALLING came out in the *U.K.* on December 14th, 1979, a date so ridiculously late in the year, allowing so little time for listening and assessment, that it's pretty much necessary to consider LONDON CALLING a 1980 album even from that vantage point. But even if you do choose to be that pedantic, LONDON CALLING's U.S. release date was in January 1980. For this U.S.-dweller (who lived far, far away from any import bins in those days of yore and who pretty much had to wait for a U.S. domestic release and then keep his fingers crossed that one of the local department stores would carry it), this pretty much cements it. I know it's easy and fun to sneer at ROLLING STONE, but can't we just focus on Jan rigging ratings and lists for his buddies instead of something that's arguably correct? later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 21:37:00 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Greatest Briton of All Time The BBC in their infinite populist wisdom are running a whole series of programmes asking for votes for the "Greatest Briton" of all time. No.38 in the nominations is Wm. Blake - but far odder is that Aleister Crowley is on the list at 73 (should of course have been 20 higher). http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/programmes/greatbritons/list.shtml (Oh, and Alan Turing is no. 21, Bowie 29 and Charles Babbage no. 80 fwiw) Cheers Antron>>>>>> this was from a friend on the Coil list...i thought some of you might find it interesting or have a laugh... Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:26:52 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Blood (3rd This Mortal Coil LP) In a message dated 10/21/02 3:50:09 PM, iansjackson@hotmail.com writes: >>i never got the third one. anyone have it and/or recommend it? >> >>-paul c.d. > >'Blood' is worth the money alone for the version of Chris Bell's (Big Star) > >'You And Your Sister', sung by Kim Deal and Tanya Donnelly, strings by > >Martin McCarrick...it's exquisite, has to be one of THE best cover versions > >ever recorded IMO... doh! how big an idiot am i? go ahead, tell me... of course i have this album! i remembered that cover being on the breeders pod lp, so when ian wrote the above post i went to check and...here i am listening to blood right now. - -another the paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 00:33:45 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] A new instrument? (was Re: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #350) In a message dated 10/21/02 7:13:40 PM, paulp@wrq.com writes: > >>Or when George got his blood sitar out. The Inner Light anyone... >> > >I know this is most likely a typo, but I sorta want to play a "blood >sitar". > >It sounds intriguing. Anyone else? (^_^) i love all george tunes, blood drenched sitar or not! - -paul c.d. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 08:05:34 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: [idealcopy] You know you own too much music when... was Re: OT - Blood (3rd This Mortal Coil LP) On Tue, Oct 22, 2002 at 12:26:52AM -0400, Eardrumbuz@aol.com wrote: > doh! how big an idiot am i? go ahead, tell me... of course i have this album! > i remembered that cover being on the breeders pod lp, so when ian wrote the > above post i went to check and...here i am listening to blood right now. > > -another the paul This is why, I suspect, a lot of people (including me, though it's not linked) have lists of their CD collections on their websites or similar :) Sad but true, really. Andrew (recent playlist: Pavement - "Terror Twilight", REM - "Document(No. 5)", Wire - "Read and Burn 02", Elbow - "Asleep in the Back" (UK 1st ed - missing the title track, later issued as a single...), Rival Schools - "United by Fate" (OK, it's modern-rock and a fellow traveller of the so-called emo movement, most of which is frankly utter rubbish, but I like this record. Blame my sweet tooth again. I like At the Drive-In too... though they were somewhat more anarchic. Anyway. I think that's enough asides for now.) - -- "Thinking it over, I've been sad; thinking it over, I'd be more than glad, to change my ways for the asking; ask me and I will play, all the love that I hold inside..." - Simon and Garfunkel, "Song for the Asking" adw27@cam.ac.uk (academic) | http://www.lexical.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 09:09:23 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Blood >'Blood' is worth the money alone for the version of Chris Bell's (Big Star) > >'You And Your Sister', sung by Kim Deal and Tanya Donnelly, strings by > >Martin McCarrick...it's exquisite, has to be one of THE best cover versions > >ever recorded IMO... "You And Your Sister" indeed is a devine track. Haven't played Blood for years... in fact I'll do so today. Thnx for the reminder. Bart ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V5 #358 *******************************