From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V5 #329 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Thursday, September 26 2002 Volume 05 : Number 329 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States [Bart van Damme ] Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02 ["Keith Astbury" ] [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings (was Atlanta show 9/21/02(again)) [Ari B] Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings ["s.morlighem" ] Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings ["s.morlighem" ] Re: [idealcopy] nord/sud [Bart van Damme ] Re: [idealcopy] re:the Datsuns ["Keith Astbury" ] [idealcopy] I gots ta repruhzent fo Minneapolis . . . [Amy Myrbo ] Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States [RLynn9@aol.com] [idealcopy] Fwd: Gig reminder ["sjgtortfeezer" ] [idealcopy] colin's rekkid reviews ["dan bailey" ] Re: [idealcopy] IC (OT) Music To Sell Things By [rayographique ] Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States [Ari Britt ] Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States [Ari Britt ] RE: [idealcopy] OT - big boring playlist ["ian.s. jackson" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States >> Best of the north surely: Sonic Youth, Pixies, Nirvana, Lou Reed, Iggy, >> Ramones... > Teddibly soddy old man but Nirvana are most definitely of the 'WEST" > Cheahz, johnc Yeah, but then SY/Pixies/Reed would be "just" from the "EAST". Like the late 'n great Pavement sang in "Two States": two states! we want two states north and south two, two states Good health John! [Seattle climate?] Bart [40 Million Daggers! - x4] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 10:30:33 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02 > In a message dated 9/25/02 4:29:16 PM, dpbailey@worldnet.att.net writes: > > << the north gave us ... >> > > punk > > -paul (i'm a native new yawka) c.d. now that's a contentious one! did it start in US and McLaren just ripped it off, or was that something entirely different that just influenced the UK scene, blah blah blah! discuss. On second thoughts...don't ; ) Keith (UK Lister!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 03:05:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) rayographique wrote: - --- Ari Britt wrote: > ...there Must be more......Ari lynerd skynerd? James Tatlor (eeeek)from good ol' Chapel Hill,North Carolina(where Frank Zappa also lived awhile when his dad worked at UNC)Squirrell Nut Zippers,I could go on (like Bill) but I won't.Ari New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 10:13:28 +0000 From: "John Roberts" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States Which sounds nothing like 'The North Will Rise Again'. Notebooks out plagiarists. John Confirmed Pavement Hater >From: Bart van Damme >To: wire-news >Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States >Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 11:11:17 +0200 > > >> Best of the north surely: Sonic Youth, Pixies, Nirvana, Lou Reed, Iggy, > >> Ramones... > > > Teddibly soddy old man but Nirvana are most definitely of the 'WEST" > > Cheahz, johnc > >Yeah, but then SY/Pixies/Reed would be "just" from the "EAST". > >Like the late 'n great Pavement sang in "Two States": > >two states! >we want two states >north and south >two, two states > > >Good health John! [Seattle climate?] > >Bart [40 Million Daggers! - x4] http://www.captive.co.uk/bocca/ _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 03:20:24 -0700 (PDT) From: rayographique Subject: Re: [idealcopy] nord/sud - --- Bart van Damme wrote: > > the north gave us ... > > > Best of the north surely: Sonic Youth, Pixies, > Nirvana, Lou Reed, Iggy, > Ramones... > Any more in this league? the MC5 - straight outa DEEtroit and (if you dont accept the east/west thang) The New York Dolls (credited with kickin' the whole thing off in England's Burning) But back to the Stooges - back in the day, that was the $%|^ I've dropped said wisdom before: But consider this proposition - Chapel Hill gave us post-rock - Yeah I know they mostly moved north first, but you could claim birthplace rights ... if you wanna. Dan - i was at the pre-2000 fathering as well and couldn't cope with the Styx contingent either. There was a time when I was infatuated by a lass who was infatuated with Styx - the things we do for l... And why stop there? We had Kix (the band not the cereal), Enuf Znuf (less IS less) and if Chicago is not the birthplace of the Tribute Band it certainly is the retirement home. Dan Sutherland (half the team who brought you the wonderful documentary "So Wrong They're Right - The 8-Track Movie" and the 8-Track Mind zine) was working on a follow-up about tribute bands. Great potential there - never realized. New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 03:21:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings (was Atlanta show 9/21/02(again)) Keith Astbury wrote: > In a message dated 9/25/02 4:29:16 PM, dpbailey@worldnet.att.net writes: > > << the north gave us ... >> > > punk > > -paul (i'm a native new yawka) c.d. now that's a contentious one! did it start in US and McLaren just ripped it off, or was that something entirely different that just influenced the UK scene, blah blah blah! discuss. On second thoughts...don't ; ) Keith (UK Lister!) The Ramones Keith,The Ramones..............'though I still contend that Punk started with Velvet Underground many years before(white Light......)Ari New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:30:24 +0200 From: "s.morlighem" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings No North, no South, no US punk, no UK punk ? In fact, punk was french first : http://members.aol.com/and125/punks.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 03:43:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings "s.morlighem" wrote: No North, no South, no US punk, no UK punk ? In fact, punk was french first : http://members.aol.com/and125/punks.htm Yeah Right....Not.Ari (those pesky french think they invented everything)Ari New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:56:59 +0200 From: "s.morlighem" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings > > "s.morlighem" wrote: > > No North, no South, no US punk, no UK punk ? > > In fact, punk was french first : http://members.aol.com/and125/punks.htm > > Yeah Right....Not.Ari (those pesky french think they invented everything)Ari Even the awful french football team, mud baths & leathers trousers ;0) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:29:36 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings >> Yeah Right....Not.Ari (those pesky french think they invented everything)Ari > > Even the awful french football team, mud baths & leathers trousers ;0) I pogo therefor I'm a punk! [Guy Descartes - the younger, more nasty brother] Bart ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:44:30 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings > though I still contend that Punk started with Velvet Underground many years > before(white Light......)Ari Helter Skelter might be a good contender too, though from a year later. With the Ramones, I see those as possible prepunk songs. For me the real punk DID began with McLaren - Nu Yawk ripp off or not. Bart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 14:08:06 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States > John > Confirmed Pavement Hater How come? Fall influence on their first albums? Bart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 14:11:03 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] nord/sud >> Best of the north surely: Sonic Youth, Pixies, >> Nirvana, Lou Reed, Iggy, >> Ramones... >> Any more in this league? > the MC5 > The New York Dolls Not bad... Bart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 14:05:51 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] re:the Datsuns > ...will they change their name to the Nissans???? > > (Ari in a humorous mood) I doubt it Ari. These guys sound firmly rooted in the past! Keith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 14:16:29 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Wire @ Irving Plaza 9/18/2002 notes > I would have enjoyed the Oxes' music but found their bogus stage > gimmicks (wearing dresses, jumping in the audience, puerile banter) > insufferable. And I was just started to think your description made them seem interesting! Keith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 06:15:18 -0700 (PDT) From: rayographique Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings The Count 5 (of course texans think they are a nation unto themselves) they have this in common with the french New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 14:27:53 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] nord/sud > But back to the Stooges reminds me... The UK dad's amongst you may have noticed that the BBC are using No Fun to advertise Ceebees (childrens BBC programmes). Little kid dancing to it I think. How great is that - toddlers all over the country being exposed to one of the great riffs of all time at such a tender age! Keith NP Wire - 3rd day ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:57:22 -0500 (CDT) From: Amy Myrbo Subject: [idealcopy] I gots ta repruhzent fo Minneapolis . . . > Best of the north surely: Sonic Youth, Pixies, Nirvana, Lou Reed, Iggy, > Ramones... > Any more in this league? > > Bart Replacements, at least for a while. - - - - - - Amy Myrbo Core Lab Manager Limnological Research Center University of Minnesota 310 Pillsbury Dr SE Mpls MN 55455 612-626-7889 fax 612-625-3819 amyrbo@umn.edu http://lrc.geo.umn.edu http://www.myrbo.com - - - - - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 10:09:04 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) In a message dated 9/25/02 8:43:25 PM Central Daylight Time, rayographique@yahoo.com writes: << > ...there Must be more......Ari lynerd skynerd? >> molly hatchet? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 15:37:08 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - big boring playlist > can anyone share any info on the music heard a single a while back and it was shit to be blunt! Keith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 09:37:33 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) At 02:19 PM 9/25/2002 -0700, Ari Britt wrote: >Dan,how COULD you forget Cajun music,Blue Grass,Zydeco,there Must be >more......Ari Hey folks. The Chicago trip was quickly followed by another long weekend, this one in Cincinnati to see the final three Reds games in Riverfront Stadium, so I've been out of touch for most of the last fortnight. If we're talking genres, other than (ack!) "Southern Rock" (i.e., Skynyrd, Molly Hatchet, Marshall Tucker, et al, with the only decent proponents being maybe maybe maybe the Allman Brothers), I think we're about to give out here. If we're talking about rock bands, and good 'uns, even with R.E.M., Pylon, the B-52's, the dB's (I guess Hoboken can claim 'em too, but they're also North Carolina boys), Let's Active, the current crop of Nashpop bands, etc., don't think that the South can measure up to the northeast or the west coast. And yes, though I saw Wire this time in Chicago, I've lived my whole life in West-By-God-Virginia and Nashville, Tennessee. Less of a statement about the region than just (1) the accident of birth and (2) where the grad school and then job opportunities for me were. Like any other place, it's got its good and bad points. Can't say as I perceive there being a disproportionate number of US southerners on the list, though. I'd say we have the highest percentage of U.K. listmembers of any list to which I belong! I'm very glad Wire played Atlanta, even if a previously scheduled trip prevented me from attending. If we count the Austin show as at least being on the periphery of the South, that makes two Wire-in-the-South shows, which is two more than most people's tours. I do suggest a Nashville stop to break up the drive next time around! :-) later, Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:09:21 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Wire magazine review > this month's Uncut.... > includes a review of R&B 01, inside.....did you miss it Keith? > > AndyL Only 3 (out of 5) stars but a very favourable review! I'll have to have a listen to the Interpol track in a mo... Keith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 07:22:49 -0800 From: "jaime janzen" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings > > > "s.morlighem" wrote: > > > No North, no South, no US punk, no UK punk ? > > > > In fact, punk was french first : >http://members.aol.com/and125/punks.htm > > > > Yeah Right....Not.Ari (those pesky french think they invented >everything)Ari > >Even the awful french football team, mud baths & leathers trousers ;0) Boys, you sure have a thing for leather..What about french fries, french toast? Jaime _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:31:19 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings > Boys, you sure have a thing for leather..What about french fries, french > toast? > Jaime First thing comes to mind is french kiss! Bart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 18:04:17 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States > Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just > leave the WEST out of it, and thank you > Cheez, johnc Gee, didn't know the "united" states were THAT devided... Bart PS - btw, saying cheese to a dutchman is very, very rude ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:11:45 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States << Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just > leave the WEST out of it, and thank you > Cheez, johnc >> sure thing, as long as you promise to leave Los Angeles out of everything altogether....it should be renamed Scumsville and hopefully devasted in an earthquake and sink into the ocean...oh no, that would work.the oceans are already polluted enough.... RL ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:47:18 -0000 From: "sjgtortfeezer" Subject: [idealcopy] Fwd: Gig reminder - --- In certaingeneral@y..., "sjgtortfeezer" wrote: Just want to remind everyone that Certain General are appearing at the Galapogos Art Space in Brooklyn, NY, Sat. 9/28 at midnight. The line-up is the original 4-peice of Parker, Phil, Marcy and Russell. It promises to be a smashing night. Keep your eyes open for news of the upcoming Corvairs "best of" CD on SourMash USA, soon. Also, in passing, I just bought the new Julee Cruise CD (you know she's collaborated extensively w/ Certain General and has a couple of tracks in the can with them for future release) and see that Parker's managed to get his picture on the CD cover, pretty funny. http://www.galapagosartspace.com http://www.sourmashusa.com - - Steve. G (wading in the waters of Isidore) - --- End forwarded message --- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:05:09 -0500 From: "dan bailey" Subject: [idealcopy] colin's rekkid reviews apologies if this has already been posted -- i've been remiss at reading everything -- but the following appeared in the Atlanta weekly Creative Loafing in advance of the 9/21 gig -- Influence peddling Wire's Colin Newman charts the precursors and knockoffs BY TONY WARE As vocalist/guitarist for the angular, art-school Anglos in Wire, Colin Newman helped introduce a tense, dissonant minimalism into the post-punk petri dish. Creative Loafing recently played Newman a series of records that have picked up on the fragmented riff, across four decades, to see if he could identify -- and identify with -- the many strains of the Wire mutation. He proved surprisingly conversant in new music. "It's my job running a label to know what's going on in music," he says, "so I'm an utter fashion victim." The Modern Lovers, "Roadrunner" (1972) Colin Newman: Ah, yes, "Roadrunner" by the Modern Lovers. What would become punk rock in [England] can probably be traced as far back as 1975. Really, the first things you could get out of America were Jonathan Richman, Patti Smith, the Ramones. All different, but each of those had a conceptual aspect to them. And they were quite liberating, because around that time everyone was expected to play really well. That fairly rudimentary musical approach was something all those bands had in common. The Modern Lovers was kind of spotty, weedy college music -- and not afraid to be that. At times, it seemed almost a bit rubbish. But that was very refreshing from the mid-Atlantic folk that was around. The Cure, "A Forest" (1980) The Cure is responsible for some of the worst bands that wanted to sound like them. There was one thing that happened -- and I'm not saying this as boasting - - - but I did a tour in the mid-'80s, and the guy who was tour-managing me had toured with the Cure extensively. And when I came off stage on the first night, he walked up to me and said, "Now I know where Robert Smith got it all from." So that's one of the reasons it makes me queasy -- because if the Cure are responsible for a bunch of dreadful bands trying to emulate them, and Wire are responsible for the Cure, then God help Wire. What was kind of weird is that by 1980, there was that first general wave of post-punk bands. And some of them were influenced by Wire, but we weren't interested in why they did that. More interesting in hindsight are the American hardcore bands influenced by Pink Flag. Bands like Black Flag. And all those D.C. hardcore bands. R.E.M., "Catapult" (1983) They sound a bit Joy Division. But then Joy Division were a bit influenced by Wire as well. They moved the angularities from the guitar to the bass. Ah, R.E.M. But I hate what R.E.M. stand for. They're so mainstream and yet they've got this whole pretense about being a little arty and underground. Just be who you are, guys. Big Black, "The Model" (1987) Obviously, it's a Kraftwerk song, but I don't know who it is. Oh, Albini's group. I didn't know Big Black in the '80s. But his production now is quite impressive. As for Kraftwerk, I absolutely adored them. They were not important just from the perspective of rhythm, but harmonically as well. They married a very European classical tradition and made it refreshing and pure. Now electro is enjoying its 57th revival, and Kraftwerk is a band whose profile doesn't diminish. I remember in the '70s playing Chairs Missing to some German journalists who, after the record was off, said, 'Ja, very good, but not as original as Kraftwerk.' So there you go, and probably true. Kraftwerk were a very, very original item. Elastica, "Connection" (1994) Dear old Elastica. At that point, around 1995, the only music I was interested in was drum 'n' bass. I really didn't like Brit-pop. I didn't want to be anywhere associated with what they were doing. It got a bit weird because Justine had said to the news that she'd spoken to me and I was cool about [their appropriating a Wire melody]. Well, to this day I've never spoken to Justine Frischmann. Anyone has the right to use any reference they want, but if the reference is high profile enough, you have to pay for intellectual property. Fischerspooner, "The 15th" (2000) Fischerspooner -- Yes, they're a very, very peculiar thing. One thing that's great is that it's a [Wire] cover, so there's no messing around. There's no half-assed sampling of a bit or any of this. It's a straight-up cover, which any band has the right to do. It's also a good cover. It's not at all embarrassing. What is fascinating is that Fischerspooner is already their own absurd thing. It's like Cats. And they do "The 15th" during a bit where Spooner gets spanked by a fan. I really thought I would hate it, but it's so ridiculous -- there's no reason to hate it, or even judge it. I think that version of "The 15th" is a good cover. Milemarker, "Shrink to Fit" (2001) It's a bit in the area of The Rapture. I don't know this group. Milemarker? I think Liars are really the best band in that kind of thing. It's that kind of jerkiness. It's a bit what we'd call arch, which means arty with attitude, but not necessarily snotty attitude. It's nice to have that going on with bands so young. A lot of it sounds too much like '77 to me, but the ones who do it right take the same energy and do something else. It's not only helping rock music, but it's revitalizing dance music. What I'm playing as a DJ has been called pogo-techno. It's an unholy marriage that's utterly fascinating. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:13:02 -0500 From: "dan bailey" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) i certainly didn't mean to imply that the north, west, uk, etc haven't given us *vastly* better & more interesting music the last several decades than my own homeland ... only southern act i can think of at the moment that i find in any way intriguing is the rock-a-teens, who i believe are out of atlanta, & even there i haven't been really impressed since their first couple of albums, about the time kelly hogan left the band. probably some of the bloodshot label acts have at least some southern components, but in general they seem more chicago- &/or western-centric. as a historian by education, avocation & inclination (albeit an ink-stained wretched by vocation), i merely meant to point out that virtually all of what a lot of us listen to (this wouldn't apply to, say, classical or opera, but those are off my personal radar screen anyway) can trace its antecedents to the south, & more specifically memphis, new orleans & points in between. dan > >If we're talking genres, other than (ack!) "Southern Rock" (i.e., Skynyrd, >Molly Hatchet, Marshall Tucker, et al, with the only decent proponents >being maybe maybe maybe the Allman Brothers), I think we're about to give >out here. > >If we're talking about rock bands, and good 'uns, even with R.E.M., Pylon, >the B-52's, the dB's (I guess Hoboken can claim 'em too, but they're also >North Carolina boys), Let's Active, the current crop of Nashpop bands, >etc., don't think that the South can measure up to the northeast or the >west coast. > >And yes, though I saw Wire this time in Chicago, I've lived my whole life >in West-By-God-Virginia and Nashville, Tennessee. Less of a statement >about the region than just (1) the accident of birth and (2) where the grad >school and then job opportunities for me were. Like any other place, it's >got its good and bad points. Can't say as I perceive there being a >disproportionate number of US southerners on the list, though. I'd say we >have the highest percentage of U.K. listmembers of any list to which I belong! > >I'm very glad Wire played Atlanta, even if a previously scheduled trip >prevented me from attending. If we count the Austin show as at least being >on the periphery of the South, that makes two Wire-in-the-South shows, >which is two more than most people's tours. I do suggest a Nashville stop >to break up the drive next time around! :-) > >later, > >Miles ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:17:01 -0500 From: "dan bailey" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States >> Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just >> leave the WEST out of it, and thank you >> Cheez, johnc > > >Gee, didn't know the "united" states were THAT devided... > >Bart oh, intrastate & -regional rivalries are pretty commonplace (& often sports-based, as would seem a common enough theme on this list). lots of us in "flyover country" resent nyc & la, for instance, & as a native arkansan i'm duty-bound to wish obliteration on texas &, to a lesser extent, louisiana. of course, now that i live here, i'm learning to hate alabama, too. dan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:26:25 -0700 (PDT) From: rayographique Subject: Re: [idealcopy] colin's rekkid reviews > Milemarker, "Shrink to Fit" (2001) > It's a bit in the area of The Rapture. I don't know > this group. Milemarker? ... Who opened for Wire in Chi. Very energetic set which reminded me of any number of late 70s detroit bands none of you have heard of (77 was spot on) melded with a tad of post-nirvana angst. their kb player urged the audience to 'stick around for wire' at the end of their set. Ah, youth's sweet arrogance. New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:35:37 -0700 (PDT) From: rayographique Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) various southerners wrote various things... i have to apologize for my cheap skynerd shot - restraint is often better even when the shot is just soooo easy... but... dans original point is extremely well taken - and some of the rap/hiphop comin' out of the south these days will be echoed back for decades to come in particular - outKast echoes the parlimenfunkdelicitech thang in a particularly swell manner theres a certain rhythmic sensibility which has really only begun to set in so - off the mainlane entirely np: sandii and jazztronic new release - an occasional man New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 20:45:14 +0100 From: "Ian B" Subject: [idealcopy] IC (OT) Music To Sell Things By Noticed that Sky TV are running an advert for their own TV guide magazine which uses Joy Division's Atmosphere. I don't understand. Ian B ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 20:34:03 +0100 From: "Ian B" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Michel Faber? Not just your typo Robert - I've seen it reviewed in the UK press as Michael Faber. If it's our Michel and you catch up with him, say hello from the IC. Ian B - ----- Original Message ----- From: Cambra, Robert To: ; Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 10:19 PM Subject: [idealcopy] Michel Faber? > That was my typo, Ian--same author and former list member. > > Monday, when a friend of mine was doing an in-store appearance for her book > at The Booksmith on Haight Street (just down the street from where the > I-Beam was, where I first saw Wire in 1987, sadly recently torn down) I got > the list of authors appearing there in October. It's quite a list, including > Chip Kidd, Irvine Welsh, Daniel Clowes and--Michel Faber. I might just have > to go and meet a one-time list member for the first time, say hello, buy a > book and expand my literary horizons. The reviews couldn't be better: ". . > . a book like this is even better than sex."--Time > > Robert (another the) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:13:45 -0700 (PDT) From: rayographique Subject: Re: [idealcopy] IC (OT) Music To Sell Things By nothing will quite match hearing genesis p. and psychic tv's 'roman p' in a volkswagon advert nothing like tying your product to pedophilia and mass murder that one didn't run too long now they're sell in g cars to the clinically depressed with 'pink moon' hey britain - now that the teletbbies are mainstream stateside - what 'cha got in store for us next? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 21:28:19 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Punk's Beginings > > Boys, you sure have a thing for leather..What about french fries, french > > toast? > > Jaime > > > First thing comes to mind is french kiss! > > Bart which inevitably leads to French letters ; ) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 21:46:43 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: Wire magazine review > > this month's Uncut....includes a review of R&B 01, > > > > AndyL > > Only 3 (out of 5) stars but a very favourable review! > And this months Q has a review of R&B1 too. Another 3 out of 5 that reads better than that. Keith NP Primal Scream - Evil Heat (The splendidly named Krautrock track Autobahn 66 is fab!) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:40:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) RLynn9@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 9/25/02 8:43:25 PM Central Daylight Time, rayographique@yahoo.com writes: << > ...there Must be more......Ari lynerd skynerd? >> molly hatchet? Souther Culture on the Skids....Ari New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:36:11 EDT From: Superflyww9@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Dave Eggers To writer Dave Eggers, size does matter First novel not offered to big chains in U.S. By Judy Stoffman Entertainment reporter U.S. writer Dave Eggers, founder of the hot literary periodical McSweeney's, has a habit of challenging the accepted practices of American publishing. His magazine has no ads and he himself no literary agent for the domestic market. Forget readings, media interviews, sending out review copies or even getting your book distributed into as many bookstores as possible all so uncool. Eggers shot to fame and fortune two years ago at the age of 29 with his ironic memoir A Heartbreaking Work Of Staggering Genius, an account of the death of his parents five weeks apart from cancer and his subsequent attempts to raise his little brother Toph in bachelor squalor. The memoir, published by Scribners, reportedly earned Eggers more than $1 million U.S. and a reputation as the authentic wiseass voice of his generation. "He way Dave Eggers does things may seem unusual to those who are familiar only with the big-publishing-house way of working, but not to someone who's been involved in `zines or self-publishing; he's kind of brought the ethos and aesthetics of 'zines to a large mainstream audience," explains Toronto writer Sheila Heti, author of The Middle Stories, whose career was given a boost when her haunting adult fairy tales appeared two years ago in McSweeney's. (The magazine has also showcased the whimsical drawings of Winnipeg artist Marcel Dzama.) Eggers has just published his first novel  on Friday copies arrived by boat in Boston from the printers in Iceland, according to Barb Bersche, president of McSweeney's Books. It has already been excerpted in the New Yorker. On Friday he will appear at the New Yorker-sponsored literary festival in Manhattan to discuss it or maybe to just make sly jokes, as he did in Toronto two years ago when he appeared at the Horseshoe Tavern on Queen St. W. in the company of a man dressed as the comic-book character Wolverine. Titled You Shall Know Our Velocity, the self-published novel is being sold through the McSweeney's Web site and selected independent bookstores in the U.S. It's not available through Amazon or the big American chains, Barnes & Noble and Borders. No copies have yet arrived in Canada, where the novel is being distributed by Doormouse, normally a distributor for high-end periodicals including McSweeney's (the magazine is named after a nut-bar uncle of Eggers, whose story is told in issue #6), or shipped directly from the U.S. to a select few bookstores such as This Ain't the Rosedale Library on Church St. Kimberley Kerr, manager of Doormouse, says the edict against chain stores does not apply in Canada. "If Chapters/Indigo wants it, we'd supply it to them." Meka Bareket, assistant manager at Book City on Bloor St. W., says, "Absolutely, we've ordered some  we hope to get as many copies as possible  but the U.S. usually swallows up most of McSweeney's output so we tend to get only part of our order. Canada is secondary for them." Reached by phone in San Francisco, where the company has recently moved its head office from Brooklyn, Barb Bersche says the chain stores were bypassed simply because the print run was so small (how small? "That's a trade secret"). By the time the independents' ordered, no books were left for the chains. There has been "no final decision" to go back to press for more copies: "We're a small publisher (11 books issued so far, in addition to the magazine) and we just don't have the money for a big print run," said Bersche. She says the book was edited in-house. "We all edited it, but Dave did the most editing." This is sometimes called vanity publishing; publishers who turn into writers (Anna Porter or Michael Korda, for instance) take their work to other houses to avoid the label. Bersche says Eggers could have "taken a bigger contract with a big house  lots of people wanted to publish the book" but chose to use his new book to grow his company. You Shall Know Our Velocity is a meditation on philanthropy. It tells the story of Will and Hand, two unstable young Americans travelling around the world while giving away their inherited fortune over a single week. Eggers himself appears uneasy with his windfall royalties and has given most of it to cancer research and to setting up a writing program for underprivileged kids in the Bay area. "In other countries, the feeling is different, in that you don't know as much about the circumstances of the poor if you're travelling through quickly," Eggers says on his Web site, "but there is that same instinct to fix things. And that instinct is at war with all the punditry in your head, which tells us not to meddle." He defends self-publishing the book as "one good way to make sure it comes out the way you'd envisioned. But we'll see. It could all go horribly, horribly wrong." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 21:43:42 +0100 From: "ian.s. jackson" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] IC (OT) Music To Sell Things By >hey britain - now that the teletbbies are mainstream >stateside - what 'cha got in store for us next? Michael Barrymore presenting a new version of 'Fingerbobs'... ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:47:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta show 9/21/02(again) Miles Goosens wrote:At 02:19 PM 9/25/2002 -0700, Ari Britt wrote: >Dan,how COULD you forget Cajun music,Blue Grass,Zydeco,there Must be >more......Ari Hey folks. The Chicago trip was quickly followed by another long weekend, this one in Cincinnati to see the final three Reds games in Riverfront Stadium, so I've been out of touch for most of the last fortnight. If we're talking genres, other than (ack!) "Southern Rock" (i.e., Skynyrd, Molly Hatchet, Marshall Tucker, et al, with the only decent proponents being maybe maybe maybe the Allman Brothers), I think we're about to give out here. If we're talking about rock bands, and good 'uns, even with R.E.M., Pylon, the B-52's, the dB's (I guess Hoboken can claim 'em too, but they're also North Carolina boys), Let's Active, the current crop of Nashpop bands, etc., don't think that the South can measure up to the northeast or the west coast. And yes, though I saw Wire this time in Chicago, I've lived my whole life in West-By-God-Virginia and Nashville, Tennessee. Less of a statement about the region than just (1) the accident of birth and (2) where the grad school and then job opportunities for me were. Like any other place, it's got its good and bad points. Can't say as I perceive there being a disproportionate number of US southerners on the list, though. I'd say we have the highest percentage of U.K. listmembers of any list to which I belong! I'm very glad Wire played Atlanta, even if a previously scheduled trip prevented me from attending. If we count the Austin show as at least being on the periphery of the South, that makes two Wire-in-the-South shows, which is two more than most people's tours. I do suggest a Nashville stop to break up the drive next time around! :-) later, Milesl and they should include Chapel Hill on their next tour just because (a) I live here and (b) I must be their oldest fan............Ari New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:53:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States Bart van Damme wrote: > Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just > leave the WEST out of it, and thank you > Cheez, johnc Gee, didn't know the "united" states were THAT devided... Bart then you don't know the good ol' yewnited states.Ari PS - btw, saying cheese to a dutchman is very, very rude ;-) New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:54:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States Bart van Damme wrote: > Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just > leave the WEST out of it, and thank you > Cheez, johnc Gee, didn't know the "united" states were THAT devided... Bart then you don't know the good ol' yewnited states.Ari PS - btw, saying cheese to a dutchman is very, very rude ;-) New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 13:56:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Atlanta/Two States RLynn9@aol.com wrote: << Once again -You May have your North and South, that's fine and dandy - just > leave the WEST out of it, and thank you > Cheez, johnc >> sure thing, as long as you promise to leave Los Angeles out of everything altogether....it should be renamed Scumsville and hopefully devasted in an earthquake and sink into the ocean...oh no, that would work.the oceans are already polluted enough.... RL it should be renamed Scumsville and hopefully devasted devasted?must be a northern saying.....A New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 21:58:20 +0100 From: "ian.s. jackson" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - big boring playlist >From: Woerner Frank >can anyone share any info on the music, the shining >and the last queens of the stone age cd? ...only Q.O.T.S.A...just started to really like their 'Rated R' LP after being a bit unsure about them initially...like their new single after a few hearings (with Dave Grohl on drums), not heard the new LP as yet. it's not particularly ingenious stuff, pretty straight rock music, a la Foo Fighters, but i like it. they came out of a band called Kyuss, i believe, who were around when Nirvana were massive (hence the link-up with Grohl, presumably...) though i never checked them out... forget about The Music, over-hyped major bollocks...The Shining...? ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V5 #329 *******************************