From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V5 #266 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, August 14 2002 Volume 05 : Number 266 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer ["Keith Astbury" ] Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer [RLynn9@aol.com] [idealcopy] Photos and other stuff [Mark McQuitty ] Re: [idealcopy] Photos and other stuff [RLynn9@aol.com] RE: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot ["Andrew Lumbard" ] Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot [CHRISWIRE@aol.com] Re: RE: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot [Eardrumbuz@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot [RLynn9@aol.com] [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick (was: XTC advice ot) [Paul Pietromonaco ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:26:19 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer > Primal Scream are the perfect band...on paper. > > Their music tastes are in the right ballpark: PiL, Brian Wilson, Can, Sex > Pistols, Funkadelic etc etc. The only reason why anyone who likes Neu, Sex Pistols, Joy Division, The Stooges, MBV, etc wouldn't like the towering XTRMNTR is surely pre-conceived notions about 'Bobbie G'. Does anyone else here like the new single, are am I the only one who likes it when an ex-tubthumper with greasy hair who is old enough to know better, screams 'Shake it baby'! Never mind me coat. I've got me dressing gown and I'm taking to my bed ; ) Keith NP David Holmes - Bow Down to the Exit Sign ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:32:41 +0000 From: "John Roberts" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer I didn't know that there was a book on Mr Perrett tbh. I'll have to track a copy down. Thanks for the tip. Never saw the Only Ones but I did see his short lived The One project at the Charlotte in Leicester. Threw in a (un)healthy selection of Only Ones to keep us happy. Cheers John np Pere Ubu - St Arkansas >From: "Keith Astbury" >To: "John Roberts" , >Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer >Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 00:11:51 +0100 > >John said > > And this from the same man who quite rightly stood up for the Only Ones? > > Keith - you're a man with strange tastes. 8-) > >Why, sir. I thank you! > >Seriously though, I can understand why some people dislike Primal Scream. >Gillespie's likes to come on like some 70's rock star (but with a >conscience!) and his voice can be a bit on the whiny side, but I honestly >think he's made some great records. > >XTRMNTR was a barnstorming album - from the excellently titled opening >track >Kill All Hippies to the thunderous Shoot Speed..., with it's excellent Mani >'Hookie-in-Neu' bassline. > >Talking of The Only Ones though - anyone read the naffly titled The One & >Only Peter Perrett - Homme Fatale. He doesn't come out of it too well to be >honest. A very sad case. > >Keith > >NP V/A - Dubwise & Otherwise 2 > > http://www.captive.co.uk/bocca/ _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:40:03 +0000 From: "John Roberts" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer My point of reference for Primal Scream is The Mission: both bands formed by chancers who always wanted to remain in their original bands but had egos too large to (a) play a lesser role in their original band and (b) realise that they weren't as talented as the key figures in their original bands. When a band relies on tales of so called rock n roll excess then it's a sure sign that they've not got an original idea in their head(s). Every time I've read about the "wild" days of Bobby Gillespie I just yawn. Whereas The Only Ones turned their experiences of rock n roll excess into some finely crafted songs. I've yet to see/hear Mr Gillespie achieve this. Cheers John >From: "Keith Astbury" >To: , "Tim" >Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer >Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 01:58:32 +0100 > > > Keith says > > > > >I know there's a few people here who can't stand Primal Scream - isn't >it >the > > >one thing (Wire apart) that the Manchester members agree on > > > Surely they should be the greatest band on earth? > > > > So why are their records so shite? > >Manchester. So much to answer for. http://www.captive.co.uk/bocca/ _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 11:56:39 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer On Tue, Aug 13, 2002 at 10:40:03AM +0000, John Roberts wrote: > My point of reference for Primal Scream is The Mission: both bands formed > by chancers who always wanted to remain in their original bands but had > egos too large to (a) play a lesser role in their original band and (b) > realise that they weren't as talented as the key figures in their original > bands. When a band relies on tales of so called rock n roll excess then > it's a sure sign that they've not got an original idea in their head(s). > Every time I've read about the "wild" days of Bobby Gillespie I just yawn. > Whereas The Only Ones turned their experiences of rock n roll excess into > some finely crafted songs. I've yet to see/hear Mr Gillespie achieve this. Ah, but *he* doesn't. All the best moments of Primal Scream are someone else's doing: "Loaded" - Andy Weatherall, effectively "Higher than the Sun" - Martin Duffy, I believe, and my favourite Primal Scream track - I like Screamadelica and XTMNTR, not heard the latest album, please keep "Give Out But Don't Give Up" *as far away from me as possible*, thanks. XTMNTR: Mani, Kevin Shields, Jagz Kooner, Darren Mooney (Shoot Speed/Kill Light would be *nothing* without that drum part), etc etc etc... Gillespie's a total chancer, but he hangs out with some genuinely talented people, and a proportion of what they produce is damn good. You just have to be willing to filter through the tedious stuff to get to the gems. (The same could be said of the band in my signature, incidentally. Damon Albarn is definitely talented in the "classical" sense, but he's an opportunist and a scam-artist: he's interesting when he gives himself away by accident, rather than when he's trying to "be emotional", or "witty", or whatever - see "Dan Abnormal" or "No Distance Left to Run" for some of his worst excesses in that regard. "Popscene", however, is still a fantastic single, and I maintain that Blur have produced a *lot* of very good work. They're scapegoated for Britpop, and I don't believe that to be entirely fair. They were at fault, yeah, but they weren't the sole cause and not all the blame is theirs.) - - Andrew ("and in the absence of a way of life, I'll repeat this again and again...") - -- "London ice cracks on a seamless line, We're hanging on for dear life." - Blur, "For Tomorrow" ('Modern Life is Rubbish') adw27@cam.ac.uk (academic) | http://www.lexical.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 08:48:52 -0400 From: Michael Subject: [idealcopy] XTC advice There seems to be a number of different countries releasing remastered, bonus-track packed, original artwork-included etc. versions of the original ?10 or 11 XTC albums. Japan, USA and ?UK. Which version(s) should I buy, and why? I prefer the music, and could care less about packaging (to a poinT. thanks, michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:12:27 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer In a message dated 8/13/02 4:18:37 AM Central Daylight Time, keith.astbury10@virgin.net writes: << Never mind me coat. I've got me dressing gown and I'm taking to my bed ; ) Keith >> i thought you slept in leather pants ?? Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 15:30:25 +0100 From: Mark McQuitty Subject: [idealcopy] Photos and other stuff Fergus & Graeme, sorry to say I didn't take my camera to the ICA. Wish I had now. Graham and Colin screaming "I don't understand!" was a sight to behold. If I had taken my camera, I think the most interesting photos would have been taken in the bar afterwards! Graeme, Is an IC zine still relevant in the age of the website? Discuss... If list members have desires to publish then I'm sure Craig would willingly provide a platform. Maybe flyers should be distributed at the next Wire gigs to publicise Wireviews, Cracked Machine etc? I know it's a way off, but is it the intention of the UK IC Massive to attend Brighton? Cheers, MarkM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 16:59:41 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer John... >my point of reference for Primal Scream is The Mission: both bands formed by > chancers who always wanted to remain in their original bands but had egos > too large to (a) play a lesser role in their original band and (b) realise > that they weren't as talented as the key figures in their original bands. That's a really interesting comparison. And ultimately I would agree that the Reid Bros were far more talented than Bobbie, though I rate XTRMNTR as highly as most of the JAMC stuff (and I loved the Mary Chain...) > When a band relies on tales of so called rock n roll excess then it's a sure > sign that they've not got an original idea in their head(s). Every time > I've read about the "wild" days of Bobby Gillespie I just yawn. Yeah I know what you mean. Though you know what the press are like - once they get an 'angle'. To quote Vic'n'Bob, 'They wouldn't let it lie!' > > Whereas The Only Ones turned their experiences of rock n roll excess into > > some finely crafted songs. Yeah, Perrett's drug problem definitely inspired one of his best ever songs (The Beast), no matter how much he denied it at the time. I suppose the difference is that Perretts songwriting produced songs that sounded more like a lament than anything wild and boastful. >I've yet to see/hear Mr Gillespie achieve this. > > Ah, but *he* doesn't. All the best moments of Primal Scream are someone > else's doing: Ah hello Andrew. Pleased to have you aboard. I hadn't felt that lonely since I said I liked Standing on the Shoulder of Giants! > "Loaded" - Andy Weatherall, effectively > "Higher than the Sun" - Martin Duffy, I believe, and my favourite Primal Scream > track - I like Screamadelica and XTMNTR, not heard the latest album, please > keep "Give Out But Don't Give Up" *as far away from me as possible*, thanks. > > XTMNTR: Mani, Kevin Shields, Jagz Kooner, Darren Mooney (Shoot Speed/Kill > Light would be *nothing* without that drum part), etc etc etc... And let's not forget two of my personal faves - Jah Wobble and Augustus Pablo. > Gillespie's a total chancer, but he hangs out with some genuinely > talented people, and a proportion of what they produce is damn good. > You just have to be willing to filter through the tedious stuff to get > to the gems. Not sure this is true nowadays. Haven't heard the new album yet, but the last couple have been virtually dross-free. > (The same could be said of the band in my signature, incidentally. Damon > Albarn is definitely talented in the "classical" sense, but he's an > opportunist and a scam-artist: he's interesting when he gives himself > away by accident, rather than when he's trying to "be emotional" I like Tender a lot. >, or "witty", And Clint Eastwood... > or whatever - see "Dan Abnormal" or "No Distance Left to Run" for some > of his worst excesses in that regard. "Popscene", however, is still > a fantastic single, and I maintain that Blur have produced a *lot* of very > good work. They're scapegoated for Britpop, and I don't believe that to > be entirely fair. They were at fault, yeah, but they weren't the sole cause > and not all the blame is theirs.) Surely Britpop was a media creation that lumped two very different successful bands together (and anyone else who was British who could write a tune). Blur had already made one very good album (Modern Life...) that was very much in the vein of what later became Britpop. The fact that the likes of Ocean Colour Scene then sold a lot of records is not something Damon should be held responsible for IMO - anymore than I would blame J. Lydon Esq. for the likes of Stiff Little Fingers. Chancers will always try and fly into the nations hearts/wallets, clinging onto the shirt-tails of the talented. Some of you will, of course, think that brings us full circle to Mr Gillespie. Me - well I'd love to hear Austin Powers doing a version of Miss Lucifer and not Hard Knock Life. Shake it baby ; ) Keith NP B.A.L.L. - 4/hardball ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 17:05:16 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Miss Lucifer > << Never mind me coat. I've got me dressing gown and I'm taking to my bed ; ) > > Keith > >> > > > i thought you slept in leather pants ???? > > Robert No. I go more for the Noel Coward look myself ; ) Keith ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:40:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Mr Grumpy Subject: [idealcopy] OT: XTC advice/remasters Does anyone know if these remasters have the 'Homo Safari' series? MG - --- Michael wrote: > There seems to be a number of different countries > releasing remastered, > bonus-track packed, original artwork-included etc. > versions of the > original ?10 or 11 XTC albums. Japan, USA and ?UK. > > Which version(s) should I buy, and why? I prefer the > music, and could > care less about packaging (to a poinT. > thanks, > michael ===== /\/\/\ { . . } /\ -- -bollocks! (R)GWS Ltdhttp://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ HotJobs - Search Thousands of New Jobs http://www.hotjobs.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 13:14:05 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Photos and other stuff In a message dated 8/13/02 9:30:00 AM Central Daylight Time, Mark.McQuitty@dickinsoncontrol.co.uk writes: << Graeme, Is an IC zine still relevant in the age of the website? Discuss... If list members have desires to publish then I'm sure Craig would willingly provide a platform. >> i believe that the DIY good old fashioned photocopied zine should never die ! i think it is just as relevant as online zines....not everyone has a computer (some don't even want one)....i'm also someone who hopes that good old fashioned comic books never die as well...go figure.... RL ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 18:15:37 +0100 From: "Andrew Lumbard" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot Michael enquired >> There seems to be a number of different countries releasing remastered, >> bonus-track packed, original artwork-included etc. versions of the >> original ?10 or 11 XTC albums. Japan, USA and ?UK. 10 XTC (White Music to Nonsuch) plus eleventh - Dukes of Stratosphere >> >> Which version(s) should I buy, and why? Just do as I did and wait till the remastered ones cropped up in the markdowns at HMV for 5.99. Caught some Geffen releases in the cheapies in the States as well. >> I prefer the music, and could care less about packaging The packaging on these remastered ones is total pants. The vinyl sleve shrunk to cd size. One needs a magnifying glass to read the lyrics on English Settlement. A Microscope would come in handy for Go 2! If you've not found it yet www.chalkhills.org The Wireviews equivalent. AndyL ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 13:32:12 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot > >> There seems to be a number of different countries releasing remastered, > >> bonus-track packed, original artwork-included etc. versions of the > >> original ?10 or 11 XTC albums. Japan, USA and ?UK.<< The albums were remastered a couple of years ago (in normal jewel cases, with "remastered" on the artwork) and then reissued this year with little cardboard LP-alike sleeves on Japanese import. Same mastering though, so just buy on price. The jewel case ones are usually very cheap, whereas the Japanese import ones seem expensive. And original Vinyl XTC albums are a quid in Oxfam. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 13:33:33 EDT From: CHRISWIRE@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot Hi Someone asked about the Homo Safari series which can be found on the dub experiments CD which also includes Andy Partridges "Take Away The Lure Of Salvage" or something like that.Top stuff. Chris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 16:38:24 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: RE: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot In a message dated 8/13/02 1:17:41 PM, andrew@lumbard.co.uk writes: >The packaging on these remastered ones is total pants. The vinyl sleve > >shrunk to cd size. One needs a magnifying glass to read the lyrics on > >English Settlement. A Microscope would come in handy for Go 2! yeah, but the english settlement cd cover is textured, and the black sea cd comes in the green paper bag...hey, i'm a sucker for nifty looking packaging... so what's madchen amick doing these days? - -paul c.d. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 17:16:56 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] XTC advice ot In a message dated 8/13/02 3:39:49 PM Central Daylight Time, Eardrumbuz@aol.com writes: << so what's madchen amick doing these days? -paul c.d. >> Paul..Paul...Paul...you had to bring her up again...sigh...i was just starting to forget...now i gotta go to my local video store...sigh...curse you Paul... RL ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 14:24:21 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick (was: XTC advice ot) ><< so what's madchen amick doing these days? > >Paul..Paul...Paul...you had to bring her up again...sigh...i was just >starting to forget...now i gotta go to my local video store...sigh...curse >you Paul... > According to imdb.com: Actress - filmography (2000s) (1990s) (1980s) 1. Lucky (2002/II) (TV) .... Theresa McWatt 2. Face to Face (2001) .... Jamie 3. Risque (2001) 4. Colony, The (2001) .... Susan ... aka Rats, The (2001/II) (USA) 5. Scenes of the Crime (2001) .... Carmen 6. Hangman (2000/II) (TV) .... Grace Mitchell 7. List, The (2000) .... Gabrielle Mitchell Notable TV guest appearances 1. "Gilmore Girls" (2000) playing "Sherry" in episode: "It Should've Been Lorelai" (episode # 2.14) 2/12/2002 2. "Dawson's Creek" (1998) playing "Nicole Kennedy" in episode: "Reunited" (episode # 2.20) 5/12/1999 3. "Dawson's Creek" (1998) playing "Nicole Kennedy" in episode: "Perfect Wedding, A" (episode # 2.18) 4/28/1999 4. "Dawson's Creek" (1998) playing "Nicole Kennedy" in episode: "Psychic Friends" (episode # 2.17) 3/10/1999 Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 17:31:32 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick (was: XTC advice ot) In a message dated 8/13/02 4:26:53 PM Central Daylight Time, paulp@wrq.com writes: << According to imdb.com: Actress - filmography (2000s) (1990s) (1980s) 1. Lucky (2002/II) (TV) .... Theresa McWatt 2. Face to Face (2001) .... Jamie 3. Risque (2001) 4. Colony, The (2001) .... Susan ... aka Rats, The (2001/II) (USA) 5. Scenes of the Crime (2001) .... Carmen 6. Hangman (2000/II) (TV) .... Grace Mitchell 7. List, The (2000) .... Gabrielle Mitchell >> what about Sleepwalkers and that film with James Spader where she was his coniving wife who had him put in the nuthouse and took all of his money? RL ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 14:43:14 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick (was: XTC advice ot) >what about Sleepwalkers and that film with James Spader where she was his >coniving wife who had him put in the nuthouse and took all of his money? > >RL Sorry - I didn't post the whole IMDB entry. The original question was "What has Madchen been up to lately?", so I only included the last couple of years. (^_^) All of her roles are there. Just go to http://www.imdb.com/ and use Amick as the search key. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 17:49:13 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick (was: XTC advice ot) In a message dated 8/13/02 4:46:05 PM Central Daylight Time, paulp@wrq.com writes: << >what about Sleepwalkers and that film with James Spader where she was his >coniving wife who had him put in the nuthouse and took all of his money? > >RL Sorry - I didn't post the whole IMDB entry. The original question was "What has Madchen been up to lately?", so I only included the last couple of years. (^_^) All of her roles are there. Just go to http://www.imdb.com/ and use Amick as the search key. Cheers, Paul >> oh ok..i get it now! ..pardon me, we Amick fans are a rowdy bunch aren't we? !!! RL ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2002 08:30:54 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] [OT] Madchen Amick > so what's madchen amick doing these days? *sigh* > what about Sleepwalkers and that film with James Spader where she was his > coniving wife who had him put in the nuthouse and took all of his money? Anyone who does THAT to poo-faced Spader deserves my warm sympathy! Bart [still waiting for the full TP series to appear on dvd] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2002 09:07:56 +0100 From: "Garry Phillipson" Subject: [idealcopy] CN1 About CN1. (Which is a 6-track CD supplied free with the first 3000 copies of the combined Not To/Singing Fish release by Colin Newman.) Does anyone have any ideas about how to get hold of the songs on this in some format? There's a copy on e-bay at the moment, but since it's just got to #21 and climbing I'm starting to lose interest in that particular route. Is there any chance of those nice people at WMO releasing it? Alternatively - I don't want to rob Mr Newman of his rightful royalties, but if someone were able to run off a CD-R and I sent a suitable sum to the burner for expenses, and to Mr Newman for royalties, that would be alright wouldn't it (morally, if not legally)? ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V5 #266 *******************************