From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V5 #178 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Monday, June 3 2002 Volume 05 : Number 178 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] Fugazi Tour Postponed [Andrew Walkingshaw ] Re: [idealcopy] NME RADIO [MrSodium@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Lyricist [Bart van Damme ] [idealcopy] BST [Wireviews ] Re: [idealcopy] all things flighing [Bart van Damme ] Re: [idealcopy] His name was Lubert Das [Bart van Damme ] Re: [idealcopy] Fugazi Tour Postponed ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] [idealcopy] Next: Colin Takes Over & Resonates ["Bill Hick" ] Re: [idealcopy] NME RADIO ["Keith Astbury" ] [idealcopy] Fwd: TV Episode Of Gilmore Girls With Big Takeover To Rerun On WB Network Tomorrow / Old New York Punk Rock Bands To Reunite For One Weekend, Another Original Band Added! / Reserve List For New York Thrash Reunion Weekend / Even Worse Retrospective LP / New Big Takeover Issue 50 Officially Released / LBE Finishes LP And Will Play With TV Smith Of The Adverts! [] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 09:58:54 +0100 From: Andrew Walkingshaw Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Fugazi Tour Postponed On Sun, Jun 02, 2002 at 05:13:11PM +0100, Bill Hick wrote: > Andrew's comparison of Idlewild to Fugazi seems very dubious to me, but I've > only heard IW in passing on the radio and maybe their first recordings are not > quite as bland as what I heard... Their first recordings are *drastically* more anarchic than what they're coming out with now. Politically/lyrically, of course, there isn't much comparison - but Idlewild were at that point stealing a lot of Fugazi's musical moves. Andrew - -- "Any day now, how's about getting out of this place anyway; got a lot of spare time, some of my youth, and all of my senses on overdrive " - Elbow, "Any Day Now" ('Asleep In The Back') adw27@cam.ac.uk (academic) | http://www.lexical.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 12:31:48 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Tali[hoo]Bill Funny how every time a read your angry-young-man-act mails I'm hearing it with the voice of Young One Richie. [you should try it folks - it's real fun] The main issue of our previous mail was my bit of criticism with R&B [and the fact you seem to agree in the first place - hence your question to Colin]. Nothing about that in your reply here. So we go on bitching about Blur a bit more... o well, if you're not tired of it, here we go: > The aphorism "Blur=Shite" became self evident: This is your idea of aphorisms? Hilarious! >> "He knows the swingers and their cavalry >> Says he can get in anywhere for free >> I began to go a little cross-eyed >> And from this charmless man I just had to hide" > >> [Blur - Charmless Man] > > Is nth rate Morrissey plagiarism the best those Britpappy bores could do? > Communist headbangers! Morrissey in reverse! This is your idea of plagiarism? Hilarious! > Could prozac help their cross eyed afflictions? I played the prozac-card already - entertain me! > Maybe the root of their problem is that charmless men feed their horses, but > they are too gormless to realise it. Hey, that ain't half bad! Can I quote that? > Con men (attempt to) charm people... > > In footy speak: an own goal! > > (Try another one, that was pure slapstic!) > > Start spreading the Wire News! > Blur have nothing to say > Start spreading the Wire News! > They still Blurble away Not bad at all! better than "Blur=Shite" x 20 You may follow in mr. Mayall's footsteps yet as a true people's poet! ["hands up who like me"] >>> I doubt it meets my criteria for 'rocking'!!!! >>> But I will bow to yr superior couch potatism here and say that yes of > course >>> just being able to 'rock' isn't necessarily enough!!!!!!!!! It helps > just a >>> little if the band can subvert the rock (Blur seemed incapable of this, > if you >>> disagree please name specific tracks! Describe the way they set it on > fire! >>> Where was their soul at? Did they burn with more than the refracted > pizzlings >>> of their cursed record collection?) >> >> I feel no particular reason to describe ANYthing to meet your personal >> criteria, I'm quite happy using my own [wich I've tried to air in previous >> mails] >> >> > You didn't understand. > Yet I feel no need to explain! I'm sorry I could not tell you where Blur's "soul were at". >>>> Yet of all Britpop's leading lights, >>>> Blur is one of the least guilty of "retro rot". >> >>> Still guilty though: There is no glory in britpappy stodigy! >> >> I think we've got your point now. You don't like Blur. > > Yet you still miss the point Because I don't agree with you? Maybe a little course in good ol' Plato wouldn't hurt here. A hot debate can be great fun, but without mutual respect there's not much point more than just sharpening our polemical crafts [wich can be fun too I must admit] >> You can't stand >> anyone else liking them? > > Why should I care what you like unless you can come up with something that I > haven't already had shoved down my throat over & over? Some people > occasionally discuss interesting non-Wire music on IC and both Mark and Gil > have introduced me to sounds that might otherwise have passed me by. Endless > discussion of the same old bands that have been done to death over & over > gets very dull. Its the price one has to pay for occasional Wire related > discussion which unfortunately tends to get buried in a sea of old views on > old topics already archived and (de)filed and forgotten and the repeat loops > just seem to close tighter each week. If we are driven into a rut the wheels > of parody begin to spin... Why take all this trouble [and time] bitching about something you don't give a fuck about. Why not just stick to writing with Mark and Giluz then? > What is the price of b'dum b'dum? > > A bunch of chummy ol' fruits saying little more than 'hello' to each other 6 > times a day or... "It takes strength to be gentle and kind" [Morrissey] "Oh how I love / all of the very simple things in life" [Morrissey] >> Taliban fundaMENTALism. > > Armies of Blur Haters massed on the border > Sweep up new Euro-religious order > That is small price of Mogshirt marauders > Exacted, enacted, hung, drawn and quartered Hey, it's the people's poet again! Do you have a tune to go with it? Catchy!! > There is an old internet aphorism: > He who calls someone a fascist has usually lost the argument or the plot... As opposed to winning it by writing "Blur=Shite" x20? > If those who say "Blur=Shite" are the same as the Taliban you'd better watch > out if Mogwai go to flying school!!!! Hehehe, nice image... But I'm sure you know the difference between literally and figuratively. So let me assure you so you can sleep at night - I don't think you're a Taliban.... but your attitude towards your fellow IC-ers seem borderline fundamentalist. >> That or someone hasn't been taking his Prozac... >> > Sorry I will try to act more like a cabbage in future just to keep you > happy, I love you so much! Ok, but NO tongues untill we've set a date! > Or were you referring to yourself? > In which case I wouldn't expect you to follow my advice, but that drug is > probably not a great prop. Eeeeeeeeeew... [gets handbag] >> Have a great night all - beautiful starry sky here... >> >> Bart >> >> > Nothing but dead fish in the water here > > God Save the Queen the Fascist Regime > (at least we got a fuckin' day off) Hehehe. Don't get me wrong, It's very entertaining 'n all, but are you for real? Or just the last surviving smelly ol' punk from '77? Oh well, if it make me laugh... [especially when read in Richie's voice] First day now for me in selfemployment - feels great! [and the suuuun is shiiiining] Who needs a job! Plenty of [dead?] fish in the sea! Cheers to y'all... Bart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 07:20:19 EDT From: MrSodium@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] NME RADIO keith e ecrit: << no, what i despise is the new spangly comic look, where everything is about look and not content. >> You mean it's like Rolling Stone, then. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 13:36:14 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Lyricist >> To me Colin is the greatest lyricist of all >> > To paraphrase John Lennon, he's not even the best lyricist in Wire... >>Now, could this be a case of plagiarism by Colin? ;-) > > Madman's Honey is almost certanly a Lewis lyric... > Generally Wire songs are based round Colin's musical interpretation of > Graham's texts. This is not how most bands work (ie the singer sings his own > words). Sometimes the words are provided by Bruce (eg two people in a room, > too late) and sometimes by Colin (eg the 15th). Bruce's tend to be pretty > direct, quite personal. Colin's tend to be simple and abstract. Graham's tend > to be obtuse but obviously the work of a writer. Can't really see Madman's > Honey as being anything other than a Lewis text... > Mark ;-) I too presumed each only sang their own stuff. Good to know this! Thnx Mark! bart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 04:49:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Wireviews Subject: [idealcopy] BST > What's BST? Is that British time zone or what? BST = British Summer Time. This is GMT + 1 hour. Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://www.wireviews.org News, reviews and dugga. VMU: http://www.vmuonline.com SVA: http://www.snubcommunications.com - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 13:59:01 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] all things flighing Keith: > whilst on the subject of this wks nme - don't know guided by voices myself, > but i know a few people here like them. their new 'everywhere with helicopter' > single gets a really good review in this weeks nme. 'sticky with pollards > mccartney-like keen and psyche pop attitude. US pop would be immeasurably > poorer without GBV...' I should have known Robert Pollard would come up with a title like that. He has such a hangup with aeroplanes and such. I keep saying it, if you don't know GBV go and listen to them people! Remember Pollard rates Wire's 154 as the 2nd album of all time! If that doesn't do the trick I don't know what will... > live review of fisherspoon describes their version of 'the 15th' as > gorgeous... Kinda liked it myself. Crystalclear 80's-like sound! Thought the voice was a bit nancy sometimes though... Bart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 14:02:44 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] BST >> What's BST? Is that British time zone or what? > > BST = British Summer Time. This is GMT + 1 hour. > > Craig. What's GMT? Is that Greenland Maritime Time zone or what? ;o) Bart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 16:01:03 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] His name was Lubert Das > Bart didn't have much to add >>>> Nice to hear someone else is interested too. I knew the Bosch painting [and > the great song of course] but never linked the two together. I've always loved > those moments when things seem to fall in place. > GREAT stuff! > Have you seen the picture online Ian? This Charming Bill... > Ian replied >>>> seen it...? its set as my desktop wallpaper already...!!!!!! > > I've had a scan of the Dome Disobey flyer on the desktop for ages. It's this > photo of a strange statue of a masked mutant kid with a long head and only > one I. Maybe his name is Tervis? > > If anyone would like a copy I can email a j-peg to them off list. > > Bart tried feeding parrots fishbones >>>> Now, could this be a case of plagiarism by Colin? ;-) > > Unlikely since Graham wrote the Lubert Das lyric. Your concept of plagiarism > seems as wooly as your concept of bravery. Shame you keep being nasty here, but like I told Mark, I presumed it was Colin's... > Lewis: "The original idea for Madman's Honey was from a photograph I saw of a > civilisation in Northern Turkey, which has no written record. They have these > incredibly grand statues. But all that's known is that in this place they > brewed a mead from honey, and the people came from miles around to celebrate > and drink, and when they drank the mead they went mad. The Lubert Das > reference is from a Hieronymous Bosch painting called The Cure of Folly." > (from 'Everybody Loves A History' / Kevin Eden) Seems I'm going to have to read Kevin's book after all to dig... > In other words the mead got them very drunk... > So one interpretation is that MH is just a more intellectual take on Sham 69's > 'Hurry Up Harry.' Funny :-) > Here's another interpretation... > > "The dreamy chorus, which is about the experience of becoming mad, invokes the > medieval image of Fortune's Wheel, whose capricious rotations determine the > changing fates of human beings: "How does it feel/With one turn of the > wheel/You reach the living end?". There are still more esoteric references in > the song. "Master cut the stone out,/My name is Lubbert Das" is a translation > of the inscription above Hieronymus Bosch's The Stone Operation (alternatively > titled The Cure of Folly) which depicts a surgeon removing an object > (apparently a tulip rather than a stone) from a patient's head. > This entirely fictional operation was performed by medieval quacks as a cure > for madness. > Indeed, Bosch's painting is an elucidation of human gullibility (in medieval > Dutch literature, the name 'Lubbert' designates persons of unusual stupidity). > It is not too far-fetched to regard the painting as a metaphor for Wire's > artistic program, insofar as Wire's canvases depict the folly of society. Like > Bosch, Wire are concerned less with individual foibles than with moral and > symbolic types, from hedonistic yuppies to the homeless." > > http://www.wireviews.com/wireviews/articles/e_stephen_harper.html Madman's Honey allways was a bit of a fave- and a mystery to me, but I've allways loved those lyrics. It's great to hear this stuff...Very inspiring! Thnx! [Lub]bart [of to remove some tulips] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 13:01:00 +0200 From: Woerner Frank Subject: AW: [idealcopy] Yikes!! > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Santa Cruzer [mailto:r_j_h@yahoo.com] > Gesendet: Sonntag, 2. Juni 2002 19:32 > An: Temple Folks; Chris Benkert; IdealCopy > Betreff: [idealcopy] Yikes!! > > > Not sure how I missed this one, but Nina Hagen's going > on tour in the US!!!! > > http://pollstar.com/tour/searchall.pl?By=Artist&Content=NINHAG&Key=Y > > So far she only gets as far as Ventura, but you never know! And I hope she never comes back ... FrankfromBavaria ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 08:43:53 -0700 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Fugazi Tour Postponed > Fugazi seem to offer nothing > particularly original, but shout a lot. Not a lot of shouting on their last couple, "End Hits" and "The Argument". Fugazi have changed a lot from their earliest days. You might be pleasantly surprised. Plus, any band who's incarnation covered a Wire song can't be all bad. (^_^) Cheers, Paul P.S. Met 'em once when I was doing door security for their show. Nice guys. Sorry to hear about the reasons for their tour postponement. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 18:37:58 +0200 From: Bart van Damme Subject: Re: [idealcopy] more throaty mingy shouty blokies > Whilst you characterise me as 'raging' I am more often laughing a hell of a > lot at the carpfish I send to this list, although of course I am aware that > my humour often goes over some peoples' heads. Nah, "raging bill" just a scorcesian pun. I've seen the humour in your mails before, many of whom I had a chuckle about. >> Why did you go and ask Colin that question in the first place then? >> Must have been something to do with the effect the songs made on you or >> not? > > Many aspects of the songs reminded me of Pink Flag songs (specifically Pink > Flag, Lowdown, Surgeon's Girl, 12XU) > > Therefore it seemed logical to ask if it was intentional to reference these > songs. Colin said 'No intention to be retro.' So unless Colin is lying it > seems there wasn't a 'deliberate' attempt to ape Pink Flag. However this > dialogue is continuing... > >> And were his answer satisfying enough for you? > > I have no reason to suspect his honesty. > To me this is not a question of honesty rather than a personal observation. I mean, I don't see why Colin's "no intention to be retro" would have to make me hear it otherwise. But that doesn't make him a liar. His intentions and my perception are two different things. >> You consider R&B not retro because Colin told you it wasn't. > > No I don't. I consider it not to be retro because it couldn't have been made > the way it was in Pink Flag time. There is no way Wire could've sounded like > this 25, 20, 15 years ago even though they might have been able to write a > song very similar to Comet... > > *How does 'In The Art of Stopping' relate to the Pink Flag album? It doesn't, but you mentioned (specifically Pink Flag, Lowdown, Surgeon's Girl, 12XU). I had something similar in mind. >> What are you now, disciple Bill spreading the [fundamentalist] word? > > I am The Divergent Wasp, the fly in the ointment who can spread more > dis-ease than the fleas > > I used to be the boiling boy until my atoms exited. Nice one! ;-) That sounds like a fair enough description. >> No room for other opinions but your own - >> [wich has proven to be Colin's really]. > Plenty of room for lots of opinions. You haven't PROVED anything. > I thought Colin's take on his own creation might be of interest to a list that > is allegedly about Wire... > OK, I suppose we'll just have to email Colin now to let him know that he was > wrong, he was DELIBERATELY being retro, even though he said he wasn't. I was just hoping I could attribute my observations in my own manner without you going for the kill. I don't know about you, but for me it is still fascinating to be able to talk to people all over the world about a subject I'm passionate about. What I don't like is to be cut down just because I don't live up to certain expectations you have of people on this list. You can easily pick out what is relevant for you, sparing yourself and the rest lots of aggravation. >> At least I had the guts to speak my mind about something very dear to me. > > Sending email takes guts now? > I think we have very different concepts of bravery... Well, I wasn't really speaking Arthurian here... >> A shame you >> can't appreciate a healthy discussion amongst equals here. > > A shame you can't usually manage much more than mundane and pointless > bandwidth wasting relevant-content bereft posts and when you do make the > effort with a longer reply, you don't actually say much. I can only repeat the formentioned: You can easily pick out what is relevant for you, sparing yourself and the rest lots of aggravation. But you don't. Why is that? >> What to do now >> with this heretic Bart? > Tie him to an inflatable jet. > It's so obvious Isn't that the new Robert Pollard cd? Loved to be tied to that one! >>I don't see all that much difference between ripping your own catalogue >> or someone else's. >> >>> Why? >>> Surely taking your own ideas and honing them and refining them is >>> preferable >>> to watering down someone else's and then making their legacy a joke by >>> listing your own execration upon it? >> >> Feeble arguements of a 13 year old. Try harder [and don't lose your cool >> this time]. >> > You try harder. If they are feeble arguments, rubbish them! Just guessing my > age isn't a 'healthy discussion amongst equals.' So if all are equal are we > all 13? Rrrright! We're back to literally again... >>> So do you have a problem with Wire being relatively original compared to >>> yr crappy britpap faves? >> >> I don't have a problem with Wire at all. > > Except for being disappointed by RnB01? Relatively dissapointed yes, but that is no problem at all. Heresy, Bill? [now where's that warm jet?] >> Wire is the greatest band on the >> planet and worthy of healthy criticism. > > Whereas Blur are just shite, and not really worthy of serious discussion. > Mogwai's T-shirt really was the level of critique they richly deserved. > >> It's halfwitted fundamentalism I >> have a problem with. > Are you calling me a halfwitted fundamentalist, or just making the usual > irrelevent comments? If you are letting a bit of criticism on R&B get this far out of hand I'm not sure what to call it I'm afraid. >>>> Why not look at this as retro too? >> >>> Because whilst some of the rock idiom might seem to be calling on the >>> bands' own past (and indeed the past of Lemmy / Motorhead / Hawkwind on >>> Comet & Agfers) the recording techniques are rather more contemporary. >> >> You're hiding behind "Recording techniques" now? Boy, this sounds >> desperate. > > Not half as desperate as your pointless attempt at a reply! > Recording and editing techniques have some small bearing on how a record > sounds, thus seem to be a relevant aspect for discussion in any critique. > Perhaps like many you underestimate the importance of production and sonic > texture in favour of songwriting? My question was so simple. This feels like talking to a politician. >> My question still stands... > > Which question? "Why not look at this as retro too?" But I guess we covered that... >>> The lyrics are also a cut above the average. >> >> As always waaay above! To me Colin is the greatest lyricist of all >> [Pollard >> being a good 2nd]. >> > > Are you aware that Graham writes more of Wire's lyrics than Colin and Bruce > also has some considerable input? Many songs are combined attacks (Eardrum > Buzz for example) No, I wasn't sufficiently aware of that [like Istated that in my earlier "His name was Lubert Das" mail]. >>> Funny how you judge Wire so much more harshly than these other shitty >>> bands that this list isn't about. >> >> I can tell you: It's because I take Wire way more seriously than any other >> band [and I presume that goes for all IC-ers - why else bother with these >> loads of mail every day] > > We could drastically cut down on all these mails by stopping sending one > word nothing replies and deleting some of the bits we reply to which don't > need repeating. > You could help cut inbox overflow by sending one word replies like 'Thanks' > to the sender you wish to thank and not the whole list. > btw anyone replying to anything I write on IC need only send it to IC, I > don't really need 2 copies of everything! I rarely check email more than > once a day... These are truely good advices! [take notes all]. >> My expectations of them are high. Your not very >> good with criticism are you? > > All you said was that you were disappointed because you weren't surprised > and you were reminded of Pink Flag. True, simple as that. so what's the fuss? > Wire have reworked similar ideas many times in the past. > Drill references 12XU > The First (Vien) Letter mashes up Reuters & Over Theirs > IBTABA is mostly reworked oldies > Underwater Experiences wouldn't stay submerged > Take It samples Strange > etc. > I'd say its you who is not very good AT criticism. > Prove me wrong! Again, sorry that my abilities don't live up to your expectations. My remarks were simple and short enough to be dealt with quickly in a friendly sort of way. >> Tell me Bill, have you ever had any critique on Wire? > Yes. > eg. The review I wrote of RnB01 made some criticisms. > > I find some of the synthnoises on the 'Berlin Drill' very dated and cheesy. > > I was so critical of Robert leaving after Manscape and so disappointed by > 'Slow & So' that I didn't buy The First Letter until a couple of years after > it was released and even then found most of it a bit lightweight and > unmemorable. It has grown in over the years though. Interesting enough. I had a similar experience with the First Letter. For me the concept still stands, but the sound hasn't aged as well as a lot of '86-'89 albums. > Tell me Bart, do you actually consider what you are writing to be insightful > enough to critique? "Insightful enough!" They seem to be the keywords in this whole argument. You have a few Wire-facts on me and therefor I must shut up and be in awe of an allknowing master. Isn't this the case, Bill? >>> If you have criticisms then be more specific, less generic. This is the >>> WIRE list after all, I think it would be deemed acceptable to get to the >>> nitty gritty! >> Nah... I wish you all the best with your precious set of rules, but I'd >> rather stick to my own. > > Please elucidate: > What are my precious rules? Telling people what they should or should not do. Prove me this and that. Don't like that very much. If you don't like my contributions to IC skip 'm. Reacting the way you do doesn't do anybody a favour. > Nah, I suspect its because you can't actually manage to come up with > anything close to an interesting critique, and can't even come close to > living up to the set of rules you say you abide by. > > Go ahead, prove me wrong... Here we go again. "Bet you can't do this or you don't know that". [and let's leave Joe Strummer out of this!] >>> NP Breeders Last Splash >> Like I said earlier, maybe there's hope for you yet. > No hope for any of us I'm afraid. > Doom, doom and more doom. > > Ten years after? > More doom! Oooow you crybaby you... > ShoutyBloke Alec Empire hit the nail when he said > "We all die!" Another crybaby! Now there's one with insight! [shoutybloke seems to be the word of the week] >> Wow, aren't you the edgy little fella... >> > Wow, aren't you the patronising little fella yes, I kinda was, wasn't I! ]:-) >> My advice, go and see a couple of Scorcese films and deal with whatever >> existence crisis your in. Everything will turn out right, believe me. >> > It'll take more than a couple of arty films to sort out the mess we've made > of this planet. > WAKE UP! > When people are asleep we must all become alarm clocks > The sharks outlived the dinosaurs People allways have been pregnant with thoughts of Armageddon [Strummer again?]. Merely a reflection of our personal mortality. Not to worry... Momento Mori = Hunky Dory Bart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 14:29:37 -0400 From: "Eric Klaver" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Bart Nibbled Away Bill Bloats: Whilst you characterise me as 'raging' I am more often laughing a hell of a lot at the carpfish I send to this list, although of course I am aware that my humour often goes over some peoples' heads. ///////////////////// Folks, this gives me no end of insight into His personality Eric in Toronto ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 23:12:13 +0100 From: "Bill Hick" Subject: [idealcopy] Next: Colin Takes Over & Resonates Colin & 2 Liars were playing records for 2 hours on Resonance FM earlier this evening. Heralded by an Autechre exclusive from the preceding prog, Colin span 'Loose Nuts on the Velodrome' by Liars which to me recalled the energetic electrojerk noise pioneered by Brainiac a few years back. The program seemed to be choc full of bands who sounded like shadows of Brainiac, who sadly ended prematurely when their singers car crashed and killed him. Former Brainiac guitarist John Schmersal's band are in the UK on tour this month. Colin played 3 Wire exclusives - 2 tracks from RnB02 and a live recording of Pink Flag from the Garage gigs 2000. Didn't catch the title of the 2nd track, but it was another fast one in the 12 Times You fly by cut up vein, but with more computer sound than most of RnB01. Nice Streets (with LewisDalek vox?) was a hard electrobeat instant classic which makes all these post-Add N to X electroclashers seem a bit piddly diddly. Could it be the lead track? They played some nice oldies from Cecil Taylor & Can; Erase Errata (allegedly Thurston Moore's favourite live band, yo ho ho) Melt Banana (Neat Neat Neat) A new band Rhodes (?) whose Saintsish demo is perhaps going to get a Swim release (!); very good Plastic Venus track I'd never heard... Messy Elliot freak bootymix Adult for old 1980 Mutewarp The Locust utter HC damage Computer went offline for most of XBXRX, prompting me to dig out the compilation I have on which they feature to listen to again. Lots of bands you never heard before? Does anyone know where the Flux Information Sciences track was from? It isn't off their excellent 'Private/Public' album... Next program was cheekily opened with a Chris Watson recording which sounded very Gilbert & Lewis (Lewis has done an as yet unreleased Chris Watson remix for Touch). Continued with Ikue Mori, John Zorn, Fennesz, Ornette Coleman, Stockhausen... Isn't it about time that we got a national radio station that plays listenable music intelligently programmed by people who know what they're doing instead of the usual procession of witless media whore bozos? More like this instead of endless doses of sugar coated tooth rot corporate moneymuzak shite & chummy nothing moronchat? Hats off to Ed baxter as usual! Cracked Machine Highly Irregular Cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine/zero21.htm When there's no future how can there be sin? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 22:58:47 +0100 From: "Bill Hick" Subject: [idealcopy] Re: Jolly Ol' John Peel's Lightning Bolts >>Lightning Bolt (fuckin' great experi-mental onslaught) Michael's progress chomped down easy: >>>>this is some good stuff indeed, i'm glad it finally got reissued here in the states this year.... Load records seems like a totally demented label. The other 2 Load records he played were short fast, lo-fi and damaged, but Lightning Bolt sounded hilariously fucked up and hard hitting. One to hear all the way through for sure! >>Catheters (blind carbon Mudhoney) >>>>they've played boston a bunch of times, but i heard their record in the record store once and wasn't too impressed...i have a bunch of friends who love them though Yeah it isn't anything new, but might be fun live. Are you in Boston? Do you know any of the people involved with www.brainwashed.com? >>Dymaxion >>>>now these guys are great. their one record so far, "dymaxion x 4 + 3 = 38:33" is an excellent compilation of all some stray 7 inch/compilation tracks they've done. The idea was to make some radio sound collages and then have the band (guitar/drums/bass) play "rock" arrangements of them. Most of the pieces are like 1 minute long and end up sounding a bit quirky. plus there is a cover of the fall's "us 80s-90s" I'm going to buy the album eventually. Had it in my hands a few weeks back, but went for Otomo Yoshihide & Vibracathedral Orchestra & Sator Rotas instead... The 7" I bought a few years back is a great funny little rhythmic spytrack feast that begged repeated listening. They're still a bit of a mystery to me though. Like Lightning Bolt they don't seem to sound much like anyone else, which is always a good thing. >>Liars Peel session approaching? >>>>still can't get into the liars yet! played the cd 5 times and nothing has stuck... I've heard a few tracks on Peel which sounded OK, but nothing earth shattering. Paul Smith has a pretty good track record for picking up interesting groups for Blast First (Most recently Labradford, Pan Sonic, Hovercraft), so I'm going to give them a shot when I get round to it... the song titles betray a sense of humour. Hovercraft took a while to grow on me... Their third album seems a long time coming. Oxes Peel Wednesday will rock the BBC!!! Cracked Machine Highly Irregular Cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine/zero21.htm No Future ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 18:33:12 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Next: Colin Takes Over & Resonates In a message dated 6/3/02 5:22:34 PM Central Daylight Time, umur_ot@hotmail.com writes: > Colin & 2 Liars were playing records for 2 hours on Resonance FM earlier > this > evening. Heralded by an Autechre exclusive from the preceding prog, do you know if this was this from the forthcoming ep "Gantz Graf" on Warp records? just curious...thanks for the info... Robert Lynn ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 15:42:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Bart Nibbled Away Personaly I love his sense of humus.Ari - --- Eric Klaver wrote: > Bill Bloats: > Whilst you characterise me as 'raging' I am more > often laughing a hell of a > lot at the carpfish I send to this list, although of > course I am aware that > my humour often goes over some peoples' heads. > ///////////////////// > > Folks, this gives me no end of insight into His > personality > > Eric in Toronto ===== everything in moderation is good for you,including excess. Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 23:49:55 +0100 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] NME RADIO > keith e ecrit: > > << no, what i despise is the new spangly comic look, where everything is > about > look and not content. >> > > You mean it's like Rolling Stone, then. god i haven't read one of those in a LONG time! i used to check it out when i saw it over here, but i don't even do that now. even so, i reckon the nme is more comic-like than the last rolling stone i saw. keith ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 3 Jun 2002 15:40:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Ari Britt Subject: [idealcopy] Fwd: TV Episode Of Gilmore Girls With Big Takeover To Rerun On WB Network Tomorrow / Old New York Punk Rock Bands To Reunite For One Weekend, Another Original Band Added! / Reserve List For New York Thrash Reunion Weekend / Even Worse Retrospective LP / New Big Takeover Issue 50 Officially Released / LBE Finishes LP And Will Play With TV Smith Of The Adverts! - --- jack rabid wrote: > Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 12:42:31 -0400 > Subject: TV Episode Of Gilmore Girls With Big > Takeover To Rerun On WB > Network Tomorrow / Old New York Punk Rock Bands To > Reunite For One > Weekend, Another Original Band Added! / Reserve > List For New York Thrash > Reunion Weekend / Even Worse Retrospective LP / > New Big Takeover Issue 50 > Officially Released / LBE Finishes LP And Will > Play With TV Smith Of The > Adverts! > From: "jack rabid" > To: jrabid@bigtakeover.com > > TV EPISODE OF GILMORE GIRLS WITH BIG TAKEOVER TO > RERUN ON WB NETWORK > TOMORROW / OLD NEW YORK PUNK ROCK BANDS TO REUNITE > FOR ONE WEEKEND, ANOTHER > ORIGINAL BAND ADDED! / RESERVE LIST FOR NEW YORK > THRASH REUNION WEEKEND / > EVEN WORSE RETROSPECTIVE LP / NEW BIG TAKEOVER ISSUE > 50 OFFICIALLY RELEASED > / LBE FINISHES LP AND WILL PLAY WITH TV SMITH OF THE > ADVERTS! > > ---- > > TV EPISODE OF GILMORE GIRLS WITH BIG TAKEOVER TO > RERUN ON WB NETWORK > TOMORROW > For those who missed it the first time when it ran > on January 15, episode > #11 of The Gilmore Girls, titled 3Secrets and > Loans,2 with a cameo > appearance of The Big Takeover, will be rerunning on > the WB network > tomorrow, Tuesday, June 4. Look for one of the main > characters on the hip, > hit show to be pictured reading our recent issue 48: > Robert Pollard's giant > head on the cover is quite noticeable, for a solid > minute! The show is on > here at 8 PM EST, not sure what time in other time > zones. Here's what to > look for: It's just at the top of a scene where Rory > is sitting on the steps > outside Stars Hollow High reading our mag, and she > continues to hold it, > visible to the camera, as she begins to talk to one > of her male schoolmates. > Yes, The Big Takeover has proven to be a huge > favorite of really cool > fictional characters on nationally syndicated TV > shows. In any case, how's > that for taste? Don't miss it!!! This is truly a > first for our mag!!!! And > we remain amused as hell! > > OLD NEW YORK PUNK ROCK BANDS TO REUNITE FOR ONE > WEEKEND, ANOTHER ORIGINAL > BAND ADDED!: > A quick reminder that 3The Big Takeover and Complete > Control Entertainment > present the 20th Anniversary of the New York Thrash > tape/CD!2 For this > special weekend, Friday and Saturday, June 21-22, > several bands of that > legendary 1980-1981 New York punk rock scene will be > reuniting to play > together one more time, at the equally legendary > CBGB, where many of them > played two decades ago. Since out last announcement, > we9re pleased to > announce that ANDY APATHY and PAUL CRIPPLE of REAGAN > YOUTH have been added > to the bill to do the band9s old songs, in partial > tribute to late singer > Dave Insurgent. And we9re having discussions with > HEART ATTACK about also > possible appearing. Tickets will be a super low $12 > a night! So far also > confirmed are KRAUT (all four original members, > Doug, Donny, Davy, and > Johnny), Jack Rabid9s old band EVEN WORSE (all four > members from the lineup > on that CD, with Rebecca, Bobby and Eric), ADRENALIN > O.D. (all four original > members, Paul, Dave, Bruce, and Jack), FALSE > PROPHETS (Stephen, Steve, and > Peter), NIHILISTICS (with Ron and Chris), THE MOB > (all four original > members), and THE MISGUIDED (all four original > members). This is truly a > unique weekend, and we hope all who fondly remember > that scene and that > amazing compilation LP, or wish they could have seen > it, will come to New > York for the two shows. We9re still trying to get a > few of the other bands > or their members on the tape/CD, Beastie Boys, Bad > Brains, Mad, Stimulators, > etc. involved, so stay tuned! The shows will also be > recorded for possible > release! So come on out! We sure don9t plan to do > this again! > > RESERVE LIST FOR NEW YORK THRASH REUNION WEEKEND: > As many of you from out of town have inquired about > traveling to New York to > attend these two unusual, one-time-only shows, we9re > setting up a reserve > list, to insure that your travel will not be in > vain. Although there are no > advance tickets, email Jack Rabid at > jrabid@bigtakeover.com and tell him > you9re coming from far away and want to be on the > reserve list, and he will > add your name to it, for either night or both > (please specify!!!). All > you9ll need to do is show up to buy your ticket on > the nights in question > prior to 10 P.M. (the shows start at 8, and exits > aren9t final), and we9ll > find your name on this list, so you9ll be protected > even if the shows sell > out. > > EVEN WORSE RETROSPECTIVE LP: > In conjunction with these shows and their reunion, > Jack Rabid9s old punk > band Even Worse will also release a retrospective > LP, 3You9ve Ruined > Everything2 on L.A. punk label Grand Theft Audio. > It9s a 26-track overview > which includes all the studio tracks like 3We Suck,2 > 3Last Night9s Blimpee,2 > and 3Emptying the Madhouse2 that formed their lost > LP (unissued when this > lineup broke up instead in 1982), and an entire > 3Live at Max9s Kansas City2 > performance from August 27, 1981,2 with the group9s > hilarious exchanges > between the crowd and frontwoman Rebecca (R.B.) > Korbet. We expect the CDs > will be ready in time for these two weekend shows. > Bands will be selling > such CDs and shirts on the pool table, which is to > the left just after you > walk into the club. Those unable to make the shows > will be able to order it > later from the Big Takeover web site, as we9ll be > buying more copies from > the label. > > ****** > > NEW BIG TAKEOVER ISSUE 50 OFFICIALLY RELEASED: > In other Big Takeover news, the brand new issue 50 > has now passed the > printing stage and is hereby officially released! > Its 17,000 copies are now > currently shipping to distributors and subscribers. > (We9ve already seen it > at some stores here in New York, such as Other > Music, Etherea, Rocket > Scientist, and Sound and Fury, who all got early > copies) It is the biggest > Big Takeover ever, clocking in at an even 300 pages! > (Contents highlights > below.) This is the perfect time to renew your > subscription if you haven9t > had a chance, or to subscribe if you haven9t yet. > It9s easy to do with our > new secure on-line store at www.bigtakeover.com. Or, > if you haven9t a Visa > or Mastercard, you can always send us a check for > the $20 to Jack Rabid, The > Big Takeover, 249 Eldridge St. #14, New York, NY > 10002, USA. ($20, $26 to > Canada, $28 overseas, check made out on U.S. bank in > U.S. dollars, or > international postal money order, or well-concealed > cash). > > Here9s the lineup for the upcoming issue 50: Social > Distortion9s Mike Ness > (the cover), Mission of Burma (all 3!), The > Breeders9 Kim Deal, Ash, Super > Furry Animals, The Damned, Part 2, Radio Birdman, > Part 2, Saves the Day, The > Shins, Elbow, The Church, Rebecca Gates, Sigur Rss, > Spiritualized, James > Williamson on his days in The Stooges, Mike Watt, > Slaughter & the Dogs, Mike > Azerrad (author, Our Band Could be Your Life), Brian > Jonestown Massacre, > Soundtrack of Our Lives, Pinback, Divine Comedy9 > Neil Hannon, Stephen Duffy > of The Lilac Time, The Good Life, The Monarchs > (ex-Hoodoo Gurus and Glide), > The Lassie Foundation, Youth Brigade/BYO Records > 20th anniversary, Dillinger > Four, The Sights, Black Rebel Motorcycle Club, and > editorials on independent > distribution problems, the O Brother LP phenomenon, > and the major labels9 > bad executive business practices. And more! > > ************ > > LBE FINISHES LP AND WILL PLAY WITH TV SMITH OF THE > ADVERTS! > Finally, in Last Burning Embers news, the band have > now finished sequencing > and mastering their first LP, and will be shopping > it around soon. After a > brief 3what the hell2 appearance playing two Ramones > covers at a special > 1977 tribute show at CBGB tomorrow, June 4, the > group will play their first > real gigs since December in July, Sat. the 6th at > Knitting Factory (please > note, this show might be moved to another venue, > we9ll let you know in a > future announcement), and Sunday the 7th at > Maxwells, with T.V. Smith ex-The > Adverts. Smith has only previously played one gig in > the U.S. in his 25 year > career, at South By South West, and these will be > his debut New York shows. > For the occasion, LBE will even back him on several > Adverts numbers like > 3Gary Gilmour9s Eyes,2 3The Adverts,2 and 3One Chord > Wonders.2 Man! > ===== everything in moderation is good for you,including excess. Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V5 #178 *******************************