From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V5 #39 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, February 6 2002 Volume 05 : Number 039 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] New to list ["Martin" ] Re: [idealcopy] Very OT (some Wire content) [Ari Britt ] [idealcopy] Instrumentals [BillyD ] [idealcopy] awfully mimed [MrSodium@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] It's a Boy, too! [MrSodium@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Wire Ideal Copy Question [Paul Pietromonaco ] [idealcopy] Re : muzzies... ["ian.s. jackson" ] [idealcopy] OT Speaking of Dead or Alive [Tim ] Re: [idealcopy] 20 Year Mystery Song [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals [Bunny Smedley ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:55:42 -0000 From: "Martin" Subject: [idealcopy] New to list Just a few lines to introduce myself. I've been a Wire fan since just before the release of Pink Flag, I was working at the Hammersmith Odeon and they were supporting the 'Tubes'. The band I was playing in at the time used to rip them off terribly. I used to go to nearly every concert in and around the London area, but missed them at the South Bank a couple of years ago. At the time of Manscapes release, they finished the set at the Hibernian (Fulham Bdwy) and Reading (I think) festival with a brilliant number. Anyone any idea what it was called and if it has ever been released? as I've never heard it elsewhere. I'm also hunting for a copy of 'Vien' to buy or trade for. Any help would be much appreciated. Cheers Martin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 03:01:48 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Very OT (some Wire content) I'm self employed,I'm a one man house cleaning service (15 years and counting)with clients that go back that far,last year I worked 49 weeks,and earned $48.000 but it's hard work(keeps me fit)and one cannot be taking days off,reliability is the key. I'm hoping to open a club next year with a buddy o'mine.Ari ===== everything in moderation is good for you,including excess. Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 06:02:35 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Fwd: Lock Up Your Knees << > I hope this helps in some small way to alleviate the shocking tensions > caused by Howard Devoto's visible knees. Just be thankful that Mark E Smith > dons long kecks! 'Tis 'Long Keck Smithy'! > >> People in shorts drunk before ya! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 06:03:00 EST From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] New to list > I've been a Wire fan since just before the release of Pink Flag, I was > working at the Hammersmith Odeon and they were supporting the 'Tubes'. ///so how did wire go down? they also played birmingham odeon on that tour ; what a crap venue that was > At the time of Manscapes release, they finished the set at the Hibernian > (Fulham Bdwy) and Reading (I think) festival with a brilliant number. > Anyone any idea what it was called and if it has ever been released? as I've > never heard it elsewhere. ////its called "underwater experiences" , its on "document and eyewitness" in a much earlier form. you can get an italian book called "expoded views" which has a 4-track cd on the cover from that hibernian club gig , including "UE". the book isn't much , but the cd is great. try gemm.com. > > I'm also hunting for a copy of 'Vien' to buy or trade for. Any help would > be much appreciated. ///that's pretty rare now. gemm/netsounds would be good places to start. p > Cheers > Martin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 03:15:04 -0800 (PST) From: Ari Britt Subject: [idealcopy] to those that have sent me burned c.d's I thank you muchly,let me know if i can send anything to you.Ari(in cold north carolina) ===== everything in moderation is good for you,including excess. Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 06:19:13 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] New to list Martin, You can buy Exploded Views direct from the publishers, Stampa Alternativa, in Italy. They have a web site: http://www.stampalternativa.it/sconc.htm. It costs 20,000 Lire - about 14p ;-) The web site is in Italian but they understand emails in English. Mark << ////its called "underwater experiences" , its on "document and eyewitness" in a much earlier form. you can get an italian book called "expoded views" which has a 4-track cd on the cover from that hibernian club gig , including "UE". the book isn't much , but the cd is great. try gemm.com. >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:32:30 EST From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals In a message dated 2/4/02 6:04:14 PM Central Standard Time, keith.astbury10@virgin.net writes: << YEAH. WE'RE ALL ONE HAPPY FAMILY AGAIN! keith >> Cheers to the lot of ya!!! by the way....A friend of mine told me that if i like Fad Gadget so much that i would probably like Raw Power by Iggy (and the Stooges?)...He says that Fad Gadget must have been influenced by this lp...any truth to that? Unfortunately i have never heard Raw Power so i have no idea what it sounds like....I own Funhouse and Iggy's The Idiot lps....any help? Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:36:54 EST From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Wire Ideal Copy Question I just realized that my copy of the IDEAL COPY does not include Ahead2 what the hell !!??? which single was this on? (i forgot but i know i have it)...thanks Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:17:22 -0500 From: "Eric Klaver" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Very OT (some Wire content) I started my own Landscape Architecture firm in April with two partners after we were all laid off. We're now really rockin' but I'm still scared shitless. Eric in Toronto - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of BillyD Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 9:48 PM To: idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: [idealcopy] Very OT (some Wire content) A serious question here: Is anyone one the list self employed? I'm almost 37 & tired of workin' for the man. What's out there? I'd appreciate any help. Cheers, Billy oh yeah... Wire Rules!!! ===== . ./\/\/\. [ . . ] /\ -- -Get Well Sammy! (R)SOT Ltd. http://depechemode.acmecity.com/freestate/54 http://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:40:23 -0500 From: "Eric Klaver" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Wire Ideal Copy Question I can't find any reference to Ahead2 on a single in any of the Wire Pages. I believe, Robert, that you have the Enigma version (which would have been the one available ion the US) of IC which omits that track. The one I picked up is the Mute version (cd stumm 42). Hope it helps. Eric in Toronto - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of RLynn9@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 9:37 AM To: CHRISWIRE@aol.com; idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: [idealcopy] Wire Ideal Copy Question I just realized that my copy of the IDEAL COPY does not include Ahead2 what the hell !!??? which single was this on? (i forgot but i know i have it)...thanks Robert ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 10:07:40 -0600 From: Michael Flaherty Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals Unfortunately i have never heard Raw Power so i have >no idea what it sounds like....I own Funhouse and Iggy's The Idiot lps....any >help? > >Robert While Funhouse is my fav. Stooges, I would say if you love Funhouse, get Raw Power, and you'll almost certainly like it. No free-form-hippy-instrumentals, :) but very much in the spirit of F's "rockers" throughout. Michael Flaherty ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:15:09 -0000 From: "Keith Astbury" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals > Unfortunately i have never heard Raw Power so i have > >no idea what it sounds like....I own Funhouse and Iggy's The Idiot > lps....any > >help? > > > >Robert > > While Funhouse is my fav. Stooges, I would say if you love Funhouse, get > Raw Power, and you'll almost certainly like it. No > free-form-hippy-instrumentals, :) but very much in the spirit of F's > "rockers" throughout. > > Michael Flaherty i concur! i've only got a passing knowledge of fad gadget, but i have to say they/he never made me think of 'raw power'. keith p.s. just bought the hives fave new band cd. i know they were subject of debate here when i first tuned in, but it sounds ok even if it isn't the most original thing i've ever heard. 'hate to say...' - one of the ones they did on 'later' is great. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 12:33:02 -0500 From: "Eric Klaver" Subject: [idealcopy] It's a Boy, too! all this talk about Ahead2 also reminds me how much I like Wire (and wire related) instrumental versions like "It's a Boy" and "Alone on Piano". It is testament to the strength of a song to be able to produce quality variations. Eric as below elysium structures + landform incorporated 110 Spadina Avenue studio 903 Toronto Ontario M5V 2K4 www.elysium-sl.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:46:57 -0800 (PST) From: BillyD Subject: [idealcopy] Instrumentals We were listening to some old Electronic singles last night and was reminded how good New Order was with instrumentals. I wouldn't mind a whole album of instrumentals from Wire or New Order. Probably my fave instrumental is a song by Nash The Slash called Womble. There were so many vocal-less songs done very well by a variety of bands. Perhaps I'll put a compilation together. Cheers, Billy ===== . ./\/\/\. [ . . ] /\ -- -Get Well Sammy! (R)SOT Ltd. http://depechemode.acmecity.com/freestate/54 http://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 12:57:35 EST From: MrSodium@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] awfully mimed > I have a fairly poor copy of Wire on that doing PMP, it's occasionally in > colour too. Awfully mimed. > > Uri Is there any other type of miming ? Here's my naive question for the day: Why do musicians bother to go on these shows if they don't actually play? Would a dancer show up and sit in a chair? In the battle of the bands from the recent football halftime shows, U2 is the hands down winner over Sheryl Crow, who gets extra negative marks for turning the mic on to say "Hi Pittsburgh" or whatever at the inception of the "performance" in a reedy and windblown voice and then turning in a crystalline clear version of whatever MOR crap her record co. will be foisting on an unsuspecting public. Plus, she was all covered up in a pseudo Grizzly Adams get up, and it wasn't even that cold. At least YooTwo got out and played some real notes amid all the hoopla. Must say Paul H. threw me for a bit of a loop with the American flag display, however. My favorite "Hello Pittsburgh" moment came at the last ever stadium show I went to, back in 1976 or so. It was one of those ghastly festival doodads, headlined by Yes, touring in support of "Going #1" or whatever it was called--you know, the one with the guy displaying his bung on the cover. Anyway, Jon Anderson steps up to the mic after the first opus was completed and says "Hello....." and tails off because he has no earthy idea where he was. It took a prompting from Chris Squire to clue him in, speaking volumes as to Anderson's degree of being out of it. Later that summer, I heard the Pistols on a little station in the middle of nowhere while driving thru Pennsylvania, played as a curiosity by a clearly bemused deejay. The rest is history. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 13:18:21 EST From: MrSodium@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] It's a Boy, too! "It is a testament to the strength of a song to be able to produce quality variations." Is it? Once there is a significant variation from the original, don't you have a new piece? While I generally enjoy good remixes (defined below), I also tend to agree with an old Julie Burchill quote on the topic of FGTH remix mania: "Only that which is fundamentally mediocre can be endlessly revised." A good remix is one that uses the original as a base from which a new piece is constructed. It should retain enough of the source to be true to its origins, but must also break some new ground and create its own identity. While not technically a remix, "Alone on Piano" is good; while "In Vivo(dance mix)" is not. M.S. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:43:11 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals << just bought the hives fave new band cd. i know they were subject of debate here when i first tuned in, but it sounds ok even if it isn't the most original thing i've ever heard. 'hate to say...' - one of the ones they did on 'later' is great. >> I'm still going with the "Bill Drummond scam" conspiracy theory there. No serious band would have a bass player with a moustache. Except Husker Du. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:57:37 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals << > I'm still going with the "Bill Drummond scam" conspiracy theory there. No > serious band would have a bass player with a moustache. > > Except Husker Du. And (very early) Joy Division. >> Indeed. Not to mention the guitarist ;-{o Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:53:43 -0800 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Wire Ideal Copy Question >I just realized that my copy of the IDEAL COPY does not include Ahead2 what >the hell !!??? which single was this on? (i forgot but i know i have >it)...thanks > Hi everyone, As previously noted, Ahead II is only on the Mute UK CD edition of The Ideal Copy. It is not the same as the 2nd track on the Enigma 12" vinyl single of Ahead. Actually, that version is a 7" edit of the regular Ahead track. As for its history, Andrew Westmeyer and I asked the man himself, Colin Newman, about it. I have the e-mail archived at home, so I can't quote it exactly here, but, paraphrasing from memory, he told us that it came out of an early mixdown session where he and the engineer noticed that if you took the elements of the piece (sequence, etc.), and set them up a certain way, you'd get this type of sound, which was worlds different from the way they were playing it. I'll dig up that quote and post it to the list. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 00:21:14 +0000 From: "ian.s. jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] muzzies... Mark wrote : >No serious band would have a bass player with a moustache. > >Except Husker Du. ...or New Order, Mark? ;) (ok, a muzzy/beard combo...let's not nitpick here...) ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 00:24:38 +0000 From: "ian.s. jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] Re : muzzies... > And (very early) Joy Division. >> shit...someone beat me to the punch...bah!!! (mental note to self...*must keep up*...) ;) ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 00:46:02 +0000 From: Tim Subject: [idealcopy] OT Speaking of Dead or Alive Anyone see Pete Burns on 'Never Mind the Buzzcocks' last night? He looked like Jaime Gump from Silence of the Lambs when he puts the human skin suit on...with Cher's wig, and Steve Tylers lips, around 'The Joker'/William Pop-Idol mouth. With the voice of Lily Savage. And the musical talent of...well, Pete Burns out of Dead or Alive. And the body of Steve Priest of the Sweet (today mind, not in the 70s) Lamarr and Sean Hughes refrained from taking the p. until the last question which poked fun at his scary cologen enhanced smackers.... "complete the following lyric: Lip Up Fatty...." ________________________________________ Tim Robinson is unwell. www.kidsindestructible.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:47:46 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] 20 Year Mystery Song This is still bugging me. Ed, any more clues? Does it have a chorus? Mark << Hi, I've been following the recent thread about identifying post-punk songs from basic descriptions and some lyrics with some interest. In common with many of you, I used to regularly tape the Peel show in the late 70's and early 80's. Some time in the mid-80's I made a compilation of the best stuff that I hadn't got elsewhere, however there was one song that Peel had not identified and it's been a mystery to me for the best part of 20 years ! Style-wise is very early New Order-ish, mid-paced, military style drums, big bass, ethereal synths and, most tellingly, a melodica floats in and out during the song. Lyrics, as far as I can make out, start like this : "Stranger where are you taking me We passed my stop an hour ago Do I know what day it is I'm in too deep to turn back now" Any info most gratefully accepted. >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 22:47:22 +0000 From: Bunny Smedley Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: free-form "hippy" instrumentals > I'm still going with the "Bill Drummond scam" conspiracy theory there. No > serious band would have a bass player with a moustache. > > Except Husker Du. And (very early) Joy Division. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:25:12 -0500 From: "Eric Klaver" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Fwd: Lock Up Your Knees Personally I think it is rather silly that GR uns*bscribes in a huff and yet still reads the digest. Was he looking for a good dramatic excuse to leave because he didn't have the time to sort through a lot of OT (I want to say nonsense)? GR's contributions, as anyone's are welcome, but I am not pining for his return. Eric in Toronto - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of CHRISWIRE@aol.com Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 8:11 PM To: idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: [idealcopy] Fwd: Lock Up Your Knees In a message dated 04/02/2002 20:31:11 GMT Standard Time, crackedmac@hotmail.com writes: > OK, Chris. Send this to Ideal Copy if you want... > > Although I unsubscribed from IC, I check the Smoe archive from time to > time. > > I am amused that I seem to get discussed almost as much as Wire... :-O > ...and nearly as much as Blancmange, Julian Cope, Paul Weller, Morrissey > and > the legs of Howard Devoto & Peter Perret ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:45:48 EST From: Hatsephsut@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Re: idealcopy-digest V5 #37 In a message dated 2/4/02 3:32:05 AM Central Standard Time, owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org writes: > Subject: [idealcopy] (totally OT) jazz alert > > well i will pass this info on , i know certain listers have a liking for > prog/jazz type stuff ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 06:40:45 +0100 From: "bartvandamme@home" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Instrumentals Well, I suppose we all go that vocal-less phase every now and again... Lately I've been playing very little but Aphex Twin. [though there' is the occasional voice on it] Talking about compilations. I just compiled a double cdr with all weird and nasty "lovesongs" [for newlywed sister-in-law] Designed a sleeve and cd-sticker - looks just like a real cd! Cheers, Bart http://www.bartvandamme.com bartvandamme@home.nl > We were listening to some old Electronic singles last > night and was reminded how good New Order was with > instrumentals. > I wouldn't mind a whole album of instrumentals from > Wire or New Order. > Probably my fave instrumental is a song by Nash The > Slash called Womble. > There were so many vocal-less songs done very well by > a variety of bands. > Perhaps I'll put a compilation together. > > Cheers, > Billy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 01:24:15 EST From: Hatsephsut@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] Re: my stupid mistake - OT Sorry about that last one - was meaning to ask Paul a question off list (if that's ok with him) and goofed totally - great... anyway, while I'm here - Ta, Ian (as YOU people would say?) - you know I do wonder sometimes if any of you can actually hear me talking - oh, I'm just kidding, but I do wonder if anyone knows I'm even in this cab - ok, I'll stop, couldn't resist though - it's my own fault really, I mostly lurk and when I do say something it's usually girlie gibberish :-) - but like you, I'm totally bogged down lately and can't seem to get a moment's peace to read, much less comment - it's certainly no lack of interest, I'm reading along even if I'm not commenting and don't think all this arsenal/football talk is confusing me for one minute gentlemen - I know quite well that it's played on a target range by men wearing white jumpers (sometimes used for goalposts) (last one, honest) and combat boots who toss grenades to the batsman's rifle after the scrum - then, they all go on the pitch and kick this silly dalmation looking thing around and around till someone either takes all the other teams weapons, captures their flag, or hits the bullseye with the dalmation thingy - I DO feel sorry for them at times, especially when it bounces off their heads - you never know if they took live ammo from the arsenal or it's a blank - mistakes can be made you know and we wouldn't want to see them all suffer under the same stigma and worry as being a Spinal Tap drummer - and did you know that West Ham is mentioned in the Harry Potter books? - those hog ranchers should be very proud - too bad John Wayne isn't around to make a hog drive movie - I'm up for a good western - but I do have a question - can any of you explain to me what "offsides" is? (I know, I promised I wouldn't do it anymore, but I'm a woman and a brash American to boot, what did you expect?) (and no, I don't really want to know, it's a joke) Laurel I'll get MY coat now ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 07:26:50 +0100 From: "bartvandamme@home" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT Speaking of Dead or Alive I taped it and was going to watch it tonight actually... Was Pete in yesteryear's lineup or in the panel? I remember Buster Bloodvessel was in the lineup once - tongue out, of course... hilarious! I always wondered why the fuck these semi-forgotten stars would appear here. Obviously not all of them were having a good time. Perhaps their agent...? Bart http://www.bartvandamme.com bartvandamme@home.nl > Anyone see Pete Burns on 'Never Mind the Buzzcocks' last night? > > He looked like Jaime Gump from Silence of the Lambs when he puts the human > skin suit on...with Cher's wig, and Steve Tylers lips, around 'The > Joker'/William Pop-Idol mouth. With the voice of Lily Savage. And the > musical talent of...well, Pete Burns out of Dead or Alive. And the body of > Steve Priest of the Sweet (today mind, not in the 70s) > > Lamarr and Sean Hughes refrained from taking the p. until the last question > which poked fun at his scary cologen enhanced smackers.... > > "complete the following lyric: Lip Up Fatty...." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 00:31:21 -0800 (PST) From: kevin eden Subject: [idealcopy] SET SALE BITS Ok there is another set sale list available (mostly vinyl) for those who want toa sk. First come first served again. Thanks ===== kevin eden wmo, po box 112, stockport, cheshire, sk3 9fd, uk e-mail: wmouk@yahoo.com web: www.wireviews.org "dreams that money can buy" Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V5 #39 ******************************