From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V4 #224 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Monday, July 23 2001 Volume 04 : Number 224 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] zhzhzhzhzhzhzhzhzh [Wireviews ] [idealcopy] Think of a number [=?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= ] Re: [idealcopy] Another Torn Hook [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Don't Start Me Off Across The Water [RLynn9@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Another Torn Hook [fernando ] [idealcopy] this weekend i have been entranced by the following.... [kevi] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 05:04:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Wireviews Subject: [idealcopy] zhzhzhzhzhzhzhzhzh Graeme thusly said: "Craig's definition of noise seemed odd to me. I think GPS improvised rather than composed the Disobey performances." Hmmm... I can see that I've gone in a circle of sorts here. Maybe I just meant that there was more for me to 'grab' in 'GPS' than 'In Esse'. For me, 'In Esse' is the TV with static, whereas 'GPS' is the one nearing a tuned-in station or five. "But why do you assume that there is any less composition going on for 'In Esse' than for GPS or MZUI?" Perceived rather than actual. "plink" Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. VMU: http://listen.to/veer SVA: http://welcome.to/snub - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 19:03:36 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= Subject: [idealcopy] Think of a number Craig on Elastical filched Colin riff >>>>And nicked his riff, which was then used for the Superbowl and a few TV shows, like Trigger Happy TV... Charles on everything "rock/pop" >>>>However, appropriation is one of the greatest strengths of "rock/pop" Not if Connection is the best the 'artists' can do! Reappropriation has led to much more interesting sonic delights than rockpops plagiarism, such as Deconstruct (Disobey compilation)* Philip Jeck - Vinyl Coda IV Stock, Hausen & Walkman - Hairballs MC Hellshit & DJ Carhouse - Live at Disobey 3"* Ground Zero - Revolutionary Pekinese Opera Christian Marclay - Records 10" etc... etc... *sadly out of print And Sunday afternoon tidied flat to Melt Banana - Teeny Shiny (A-Zap) IBM - The Oval Recording (Mego) Improvised Music New York 81 - Derek Bailey, John Zorn, Fred Frith, Sonny Sharrock, Bill Laswell, Charles K. Noyes (Muworks) Uzeda - 4 (Touch & Go) Foetus / Chrome Cranks - Vice Squad Dick (PCP) Paul Panhuysan - Partitas for Long Strings (XI) Matt Wand - 1 1/2 Volt Music 3" (Hot Air) Ulan Bator - Ego:Echo (Young God) Divide it by 2! Graeme ===== Cracked Machine irregular cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine "What one thinks of as extremes seldom are" :: BC Gilbert Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 22:10:33 +0200 From: "J J Noorda" Subject: [idealcopy] thanks to CN or not Here is another message of an artist who thanks one of our men probably with the same name for something. I can't believe but on the last ceedee from Gary Moore - called Back to the Blues is mentioned thanks to Colin Newman. That's what I've been told. Should this be our man? Records of last weekend CM v Hauswolff - Basic another one called Operations of Spirit Communication Ocsid - Opening Sweep Mirror - Islands Phill Niblock - A young persons guide .. (thanks to he knows) IBM - The Oval recordings Immersion - Low Impact Silo - Instar A Bell is a Cup .... You're a strange one, are there any more like you ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 20:07:12 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Another Torn Hook Graeme, << Lewis does not like to be compared to Hook.<< Artists, eh? >> A reviewer compared Ahead to Temptation at the time Ahead was released. Lewis took exception to that.<< Too close to home! But so what, the songs are very different. >>Wire were more likely a Joy Division influence than the other way round. >> Certainly. But JD/NO took the 'lead bass concept a lot further down the line - - and when Wire returned (with subtle differences in sound) it looked like they were moving into NO's terrain. 'Beat combo' 80s Wire featured Graham playing those active electronics Steinberger 'rail' basses which give a much more up-front and distorted sound than the good old Fender Precision - a sound much closer to the direction Hook's bass had gone in New Order. Remember there is a serious difference between Hook's bass playing in New Order compared to in Joy Division. Again this is largely a change of gear - in JD he used a Rickenbacker copy (a very full, fruity sound) whereas in NO a lot of the stuff is played on the mighty Shergold Marathon 6-string (cleaner, with a deeper bass and of course more treble range). He used different 4-strings too (Yamaha, Gibson and those custom-made semi-acoustics he still uses now). Also he's playing through more effects, which gives similar results to EGL's active electronics etc. I think there is a fundamental difference between Hook and Lewis - Granted both are of the post-punk 'lead bass' school, though I consider EGL a more conventional player. However he's more likely to spring a surprise (eg Advantage in Height, or Serious of Snakes). Hook you can spot a mile off. His sound is completely unique. Indeed, he's the single most distinctive, inimitable sound element of New Order. In Wire, the sound is denser - and the inimitable element is not Graham's bass - it's Bruce's guitar. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 21:11:23 EDT From: RLynn9@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Don't Start Me Off Across The Water In a message dated 7/21/01 12:00:06 PM Central Daylight Time, crackedmachine@yahoo.co.uk writes: > I had a compilation CD-R of Wire related > ultra-obscurities on the other day (cheers Paul R) and > a song came on which had me scratching my head and > wondering what the hell a Brian Eno song was doing on > it (I'd been listening to Another Green World a few > times in the preceding weeks). Turned out it was a > Gilbert & Lewis produced The The song... > > can i get a copy of this cd-r? sounds good! wire rarities! yum! thanks, Robert ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 18:44:15 -0700 From: fernando Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Another Torn Hook At 8:07 PM -0400 7/22/01, MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > Indeed, he's the single most distinctive, >inimitable sound element of New Order. In Wire, the sound is denser - and the >inimitable element is not Graham's bass - it's Bruce's guitar. I agree with this... especially in a name-that-tune contest. At a deeper level, the biggest change (of many) in JD->nO is that of Stephen's drumming... although perhaps easier to discern his influences than Peter, his change from Movement to PC&L opened up the gates for nO's mark in pop... Perhaps the easiest example is the not-so-obvious, but not Keith Moon either, drumming in As It Is, When It Was... it always sounds a bit odd, but appealing, for that tempo... this has continued through Republic (I have not heard the new stuff, even with the availability of mp3s). Anyway, this is a bit more distinctive to me, with some others following Peter's lead into the bass style (e.g., The Cure in Disintegration, etc.). In terms of 80s Wire, to me the distinctive sound is that of Gotobed's high-hat/snare-drum playing... which was rather endearing to me for some reasons, though other drummers did not find it appealing. - -fernando ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 00:28:10 -0700 (PDT) From: kevin eden Subject: [idealcopy] this weekend i have been entranced by the following.... Remember Shakti - The Believer McCoy Tyner - Extensions (with Alice Coltrane) Herbie Hancock - Sextant I have also been engrossed with the prescence of Alice Coltrane: The Monastic Trio Ptah, The El Daoud Journey To Satchidananda World Galaxy Eternity Elements (with Joe Henderson) Illuminations (with Carlos Santana) and also listened to the 'Soul Riot' compilation free with Mojo. What a corker!! Some great grooves, great vibes and some suprises (Syl Johnson's 'Is It Because I a Black?' - awesome!) Enough for any mere mortal ===== kevin eden wmo limited, po box 112, stockport, cheshire, sk3 9fd, uk e-mail: wmouk@yahoo.com web: www.wiremailorder.com "dreams that money can buy" Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V4 #224 *******************************