From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V4 #183 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Thursday, June 14 2001 Volume 04 : Number 183 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice [MarkBursa@aol.com] RE: [idealcopy] OffTopic - Situation In Israel ["Steve Speight" ] [none] ["Cambra, Robert" ] Re: [idealcopy] RE: idealcopy-digest V4 #182 [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey <] [idealcopy] OT - 'The Lamb...' and others ["ian jackson" ] Re: [idealcopy] Plaid compared to Wire?! [Mark Short ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 04:59:55 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice Sean, << Then there's a tune: Millions Like Us which I think is the Purple Hearts(??). Correct. Their second appearance of the week. Just don't let the Merton Parkas in here... >> Next up is something that sounds very much like "Midget Submarines" with a great cacophony of sound at the end of it. >> Swell Maps. Some of the others are ringing vague bells. I'll get back to you! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:34:01 +0100 From: "Steve Speight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OffTopic - Situation In Israel Yes you did. Us Brits and our good old Yankee mates across the pond are no doubt discretely stoking the fire so we can keep selling the Israeli's state of the art fighters, bombers and other military goodies. Now if only the IMF would lend Yassa a few billion we would sell him our military surplus and stoke the fire some more. Keeps our taxes down and lets be honest in post Thatcherite Britain that's top of the list. Steve - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of HeySean@aol.com Sent: 13 June 2001 08:37 To: giluz@nettalk.com; idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OffTopic - Situation In Israel well now my understanding might be a bit on the simplistic side (you see my grandad was in the IRA) but I think it goes something like this: the Palestinians want to kill the Jews and the Jews want to kill the Palestinians...did I leave something out? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2001 20:48:21 +0100 From: "Steve Speight" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice Then there's another tune (male singer) " I ain't never been nothin' I ain't never had nothin' I wanna go out in a puff of smoke I'm gonna go out in a puff of smoke" This is the Angelic Upstarts - the man singing is Mensi (catchphrase "lend us a pound") I think the song is called "Never 'ad Nothing" Then a tune that goes "black ones black ones, your face don't fit, black ones black ones, you ain't no Brits" "brown ones brown ones your face don't fit...etc This is Stiff Little Fingers. Track is called White Noise from the Inflammable Material album. Steve (who got into the Radiohead gig at the BBC on Saturday and loved every minute of it) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org]On Behalf Of HeySean@aol.com Sent: 13 June 2001 09:22 To: ian@ibarrett.fsnet.co.uk; idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice ok gents (and ladies..though I've only seen a few here) I am looking for some of that keen British insight regarding things musical. Instead of arguing about radiohead, HELP me! A friend of mine, a right wanker as you blokes would say, used to travel to England way back when and he would record tapes there. Then he'd make me a copy with NO liner notes whatsoever. I have, on a compilation tape that is over 20 years of old age, a recording of a band, lead singer female, that I think is called Vermillion. I think the title of the song is "I Can't Stop Fucking Around" , at least that is what is sung as the chorus and it ends with the rejoinder "eat me" . She sings " a scarlet woman has got no soul, she loves her man until she's got a hole, when everything starts looking good, that's when she falls for no good". Another song features a male voice singing "You're so hideous, you're not one of us. Let me make it clear to you, I don't want you." Then there's another tune (male singer) " I ain't never been nothin' I ain't never had nothin' I wanna go out in a puff of smoke I'm gonna go out in a puff of smoke" Then there's a tune: Millions Like Us which I think is the Purple Hearts(??). Next up is something that sounds very much like "Midget Submarines" with a great cacophony of sound at the end of it. Then a tune that goes "black ones black ones, your face don't fit, black ones black ones, you ain't no Brits" "brown ones brown ones your face don't fit...etc Next up is another female singer: "In the beginning there was a void, except for the written word...see how they run, sheep to the fold...now I got my bleeding heart and I wear my crown of thorns...read another bible story, I've got to find the truth..." If any of these ring a bell please help out this poor Copyist! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 07:07:04 -0500 From: "wiremailorder.com" Subject: [idealcopy] RE: idealcopy-digest V4 #182 > Whilst Phil was in Genesis, he was also in Brand X > that included Percy Jones on bass (also on AGW and > MFF. Don't forget Morris Pert! Most of this clan (Brand X) was united at sessions for the Eddie Howell Gramaphone Record. Lumely went on to produce Peter And The Wolf with Jack Lancaster, which included Mssrs. Collins, Eno, Bruford, usw... Narrator was none other than the late Viv Stanshall. Roxy Music was also a bit of a whore's den for so-called "prog" musicians. I believe Collins also played on Fripp's first solo album. Whilst it may be true that Genesis reached a creative plateau with the Lamb, an entire genre was influenced by Trick of the Tale and Wind and Wuthering! Collins duets at that time with both Bruford (1977 tour) and Chester Thompson were still pretty sharp. I'd go as far as to say that And Then There were Three still had some good songs on it, a similarly dark production, and the absolute beginning of the end for Genesis! To the comment about The Lamb being audio torture - you should seriously re-evaluate your musical tastes. And spare the vitriol, we've heard it all before..... charles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 07:32:27 -0500 From: "dan bailey" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice >Next up is another female singer: "In the beginning there was a void, except >for the written word...see how they run, sheep to the fold...now I got my >bleeding heart and I wear my crown of thorns...read another bible story, I've >got to find the truth..." Corpus Christi, by the Avengers. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 07:40:13 -0500 From: "dan bailey" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] hmmmm a little help would be nice >Then a tune that goes "black ones black ones, your face don't fit, black >ones >black ones, you ain't no Brits" "brown ones brown ones your face don't >fit...etc > >This is Stiff Little Fingers. Track is called White Noise from the >Inflammable Material album. of course, the lyrics are actually "black WOGS," etc. dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:45:50 EDT From: Rain19c@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] warp records starting points.... since many people here are into this label i was wondering if anyone could give me any recommendations of what to start out with or what to download. are those recently released compilations ("routine", "classics", "influences"...etc) a good way to go? they were cheaply priced too. i have the "we are reasonable people" compilation and i think its decent enough, albeit ive only given it a couple spins at present time. thanks in advance for anyone's help ~michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:01:31 +0100 From: timrobinson@cwcom.net Subject: [idealcopy] Different Hats for Different Tracks... wireviews wrote: >Subject: [idealcopy] (OT) Appeal for Band Names! > >Tim wrote: >"we need some pseudonyms for our band so we can send >out different kids of track." > >Shame you don't want to use the same name for >everything and thus prove your diversity. I'd rather have a few different hats and have the freedom to do different things. Anyway, you need a very strong band identity and be a much better musician/writer than me to be diverse but coherent to the listener. Wire managed to cover a lot of musical bases while maintaining their essential 'Wireness'. Then again, any more dramatic plot deviations were confined to solo projects. Someone should have mentioned this to A Certain Ratio who veered wildly through Joy Division doom-rock, dub, latin street-beats, slick jazzy soul, AOR pop, acid house etc etc. to fanbase-shredding effect! Anyway its fun to have a few different hats, good cure for writers block...assume another identity! I've always enjoyed the way people like Richard H Kirk or Aphex Twin had lots of pseudonyms. Tonight Matthew I'm going to be.....Caustic Window! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:50:45 +0100 From: timrobinson@cwcom.net Subject: [idealcopy] OT: Flaming Lips Graeme Wrote: >As for Flaming Lips I still have a soft spot for the >Telepathic Surgery album which was the first one I >heard by them. Oh My Gawd! is also good but the first >album less so... >Wayne Coyne was a very talkative and effusive >interviewee. Do you not care for The Soft Bulletin then?. I reckon its their best. It is rather grandiose and maybe a little sugary for some tastes, but sonically it is quite something. Lots of weird bass sounds, lots of stereo whirling and twirling, and of course those daft, piledriver drum tracks. A few Lips fans on the list aren't there? Did anyone see them on their last tour? A 'virtual' drummer on a VCR screen behind the band, Lots of balloons, glitter, confetti, fake blood, a strobe light worn as a waistcoat, explosions, rockets and of course that great bastion of prog rock..a big Gong at the back of the stage! Oh and a cover of Somewhere Over the Rainbow. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 17:28:06 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= Subject: [idealcopy] Turn Up the White Noise? Heysean asked about this tune: >>>>Then a tune that goes "black ones black ones, your face don't fit, black ones black ones, you ain't no Brits" "brown ones brown ones your face don't fit...etc I think this is White Noise by Stiff Little Fingers. Mark cryed >>>>Yet now you display an intolerance of any taste outside your own narrow world view that borders on fascism. So you call me boring I call you boring Therefore I am a fascist? No, actually what I was lampooning was the fact that you say that nothing much interesting as compared to 77-80 is going on and then profess ignorance of many interesting things and state views which make it clear you haven't really listened to the stuff you are talking about. I doubt if either of us are fascists. No offence meant, Graeme ===== Cracked Machine irregular cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine "What one thinks of as extremes seldom are" :: BC Gilbert Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 14:11:01 -0400 From: "DAN L ROSE" Subject: [idealcopy] OT: Flaming Lips Had the pleasure of living in Norman, OK (the Lips home base) while my wife did her residency. Caught a Christmas show in which they gave the audience fifty cruddy boomboxes, each w/ a cassette of pre-recorded music. Coyne (sp?) "conducted" the audience, creating some of the most beautiful sounds I've ever heard. Wonderful stuff. Have a tough time w/ a good bit of their official releases (though Soft Bulletin is very nice), but this was genius. There was even a Christmas tune w/ lights. Graeme Wrote: >As for Flaming Lips I still have a soft spot for the >Telepathic Surgery album which was the first one I >heard by them. Oh My Gawd! is also good but the first >album less so... >Wayne Coyne was a very talkative and effusive >interviewee. Do you not care for The Soft Bulletin then?. I reckon its their best. It is rather grandiose and maybe a little sugary for some tastes, but sonically it is quite something. Lots of weird bass sounds, lots of stereo whirling and twirling, and of course those daft, piledriver drum tracks. A few Lips fans on the list aren't there? Did anyone see them on their last tour? A 'virtual' drummer on a VCR screen behind the band, Lots of balloons, glitter, confetti, fake blood, a strobe light worn as a waistcoat, explosions, rockets and of course that great bastion of prog rock..a big Gong at the back of the stage! Oh and a cover of Somewhere Over the Rainbow. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 16:00:53 -0400 From: "Cambra, Robert" Subject: [none] Bryan Olson said on idealcopy two weeks ago: "I'm glad to know I'm not the only person who was once obsessive compulsive about music." Isn't that why we are all here? Robert ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 22:16:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [idealcopy] RE: idealcopy-digest V4 #182 On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, wiremailorder.com wrote: > Whilst it may be true that Genesis reached a creative plateau with the Lamb, > an entire genre was influenced by Trick of the Tale and Wind and > Wuthering! "An entire genre"? What genre would that be? - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::does "anal retentive" have a hyphen?:: ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:09:59 +0100 From: "ian jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] OT - 'The Lamb...' and others jeff wrote :- so I'll forgive him Genesis up through, oh, _Lamb... i used to hear the odd Genesis lp through guys i knew at school who were into 'serious' music when they were like 13 or 14, and who bought the NME at the time (which was another planet to me then) all that shit. i REALLY only got to know them a year or two later, when punk hit me like a train and i started listeningto Peel and buying the NME/Sounds, therefore i was now 'cool' enough to talk to. i ended up playing with one of these guys in my first few bands (until he got signed to a major and turned megalomaniac, luckily i'd got sick of him earlier and was spared the disastrous consequences). anyway, he looked 'a bit' like Gabriel, (he had hair down to his arse in '75, a crew cut in '77) and therefore thought he was just as talented. at his 'pad', i used to suffer endless plays of 'The Lamb...', Foxtrot, Selling England..., Wind & Wuthering, Gabriel's solo lp's (the 1st i can still stand), as well as various stuff i liked a bit or totally disliked from King Crimson, Yes, Peter Hammill (again, i'll still stand by 'Nadir's Last Chance'), Van Der Graff, Gentle Giant, you get the picture. no matter how much dope and red wine we got through in one night, if he played 'The Lamb...', it never did anything to me otherthan want to go one better than Van Gogh. anyway, last year, when i'd finally stopped hating this guy and only pitied him, i decided to get hold of a copy of 'The Lamb...' and see if anything had changed in my opinion of this 'legendary' pain in the arse from my past. i found, much to my surprise, that i can now actually listen to the title track (mainly for the bass line) and 'Carpet Crawlers', which i like a lot but i'm still not sure why, maybe it's that 'got to get in, to get out' line... the rest though, to quote from 'Amadeus'...'too many notes...' ian.s.j. (the burgermeister) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:13:03 +0100 From: "ian jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] OT - PIL Ian B wrote, re 1st PIL lp :- >Maybe one day I'll revisit someday. It's been over twenty years and I was a youngster then. But even then it seemed like they'd simply run out of ideas whilst recording it. lyrically 'Fodderstompf', (the track i think you're refering to) could well be an example of what you mean...it did come at the end of the lp! but the backing track is a killer, even so i liked the abuse the engineer got and the fire extinguisher going off! >My disappointment didn't put me off though - I thought Metal Box was a massive improvement, agreed Metal Box and Flowers Of Romance (as discussed already on the list) are THE definitive PIL lp's... >and they were sporadically interesting for a while before ending at a different kind of awful. again agreed, something happened after 'F.O.R.', who knows? apart from bits of 'Album' (inc. 'Rise') and 'Open Up', Lydon has talked it far better than he's walked it. ian.s.j. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2001 08:51:29 +0100 From: Mark Short Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Plaid compared to Wire?! Dr Volume wrote: > > In a review of the new Plaid LP (entitled 'Double Figure' on Warp > records) in this months Uncut magazine, the reviewer states that the > first track 'Eyen' "...recalls Wire in one of their more elegant and > laid-back instrumental moments." > Can't see the similarity myself, although it is a very fine record. > I didn't see the similarity when I first listened to it, but going back to it with a Wire head on, the track does resemble "A Public Place". ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V4 #183 *******************************