From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V4 #155 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Monday, May 21 2001 Volume 04 : Number 155 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] TFL and Wire more more more [Wireviews ] [idealcopy] OT-colourbox world cup theme ["ian jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] TFL and Wire more more more "To me, Wire albums have seemed like a continuous flow - - from Pink Flag [snip] to The Third Day, I hear a definite progression." I do... up until Third Day, which sounded like it was recorded in 1980, but then again, I guess it was a live practice session. Thankfully, 12 Times was a progression. [TFL] "Yes, but he said he can't use mailorder because of his mail growing legs. Finding this in a shop in the US might be tough." Well, seeing as Mute USA reissued their entire Wir(e) back catalogue only last year, I would be very surprised if you couldn't order a copy at your local record store. My experiences of (indie) USA stores have been good on the whole... " certainly not as unpopular as Manscape" Well, it's taken ages for the "TFL doesn't actually suck" brigade to appear; who knows if the "We love Manscape" people will also arrive? :) I think more so than TFL, which survived a mauling process, Manscape was ruined by crap production rather than material (although it obviously needed trimming). It still has some wonderful moments, such as Craftsman's Touch. As for TFL, I think it goes a bit rough on a couple of tracks (Cows being a memorable example), but So and Slow (single), Ticking Mouth and especially Big Glue Canal are all favourites of mine. BTW, anyone who likes this material should buy the So and Slow CD4 single from Mute, as it contains a remix of Take it that combines New York City, as mangled by LFO. It's probably the best second era Wir(e) piece... (those of you who've seen the Wire video FAQ -- it's the track that comes on when Colin starts mentioning a "squarely electronic musical stance...") Best Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. VMU: http://listen.to/veer SVA: http://welcome.to/snub - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 13:51:13 +0100 From: "ian jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] OT-colourbox world cup theme andrew wrote re:- colourbox world cup theme :- Blinding track, but was it ever used as a theme on tv or radio? i'm sure it's been used as incidental music on a few sports programmes, but as an 'official' theme, i'm not sure. i'll ask a particular friend who know's about these things and get back to you. On a similar subject was GBV's The Official Ironman Rally Song ever used in an official capacity? again, see above (but it should have been used for something like that!). Got my tickets for The Strokes in Oxford. Am I going to see 'this years thing'? probably yes, but there's a lot worse 'this year's things' around than them. ian.s.j. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 17:29:26 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= Subject: [idealcopy] You Made Me Realise Giluz said >>>>the 12 Times You approach is about doing loop-based electronic music with analogue sources, reconstructing them in a way where they can be referred to as songs structurally, but still maintain the notion that they're assembled from loops. It is not merely a technological thing - technology now being far more advanced as far as audio manipulation goes than in the late 80's - it is a post-electronic concept that probably couldn't have been made prior to the 90's. I was grasping at something without quite realising it. Giluz made me realise! When it comes down to it 12 Times You is the logical progression from Take It via The First Letter (Vien) to Wire (Now!). Perhaps? The First Letter is actually (to my ears) an amalgamated mutation of a hybrid of Reuters and Over Theirs and I have to say I think it is a VERY important step in the Wire story which some might be in danger of overlooking. This was where the 'retrospective' phase began perhaps. Or was it with Take It, taking a smple from Strange? Also The First Letter was drastically reworked by the Hafler Trio... Then step in Mr Newman, taking the live tapes of 12XU (as opposed to the radio session of The First Letter) and hacking them all into a concise and hard hitting humourous but drastically essential slab of modern rock action! There's another parallel: the h3O do two mixes on either side and Colin did just that on the 7". But yes Colin is doing something slightly different in that he's remaking the same track (not the same but different you see) and making it better. Has anyone else noticed how old and sluggish the original version of 12XU sounds in comparison? Whereas before 12 Times You it still sounded like one of the few timeless pieces to emerge from the 77 melee. 12XU was of course a massively influential song... Will 12 Times You follow suit (not Mr Suit)? Giluz>>>90's audio manipulation usually tried to conceal the analogue nature of its sources, and was also about using samples taken from other sources, not created independantly. Actually quite a lot of people have sampled their own playing... Robert Hampson of Main (who of course was massively influenced by Wire and made a great album in collaboration with Bruce Gilbert) springs instantly to mind here. The Deliquesce live album is a record of a performance where he manipulates samples of his guitar from 4 CD-ROMs. Of course Lewis was sampling Gilbert's guitar on his SK1 at Wire gigs. Dr Vol>>>>Do you mean its a strange sample or a sample from the song 'Strange'.? The latter - a sample of that chunga chunga riff. I used to think that The First Letter would've made an awesome EP - A Bargain (Russell Haswell & Colin vox) Ticking Mouth (Bruce vox) Take It (Graham vox) Naked, Whooping & Suchlike (Claude Bessy vox) I think all Wire related albums are worth hearing (even He Said Take Care has a few redeeming qualities - - but leaves me wondering if Lewis ever seriously considered doing a Captain Sensible?) but some are obviously better than others. The First Letter (Vien) is way better than The First Letter album, even if Colin & Bruce both opine that the Vien mix is a mess (its chaotic aspect is one of its greatest strengths IMO). >>>>Never liked the idea of Colin with Pony Tail, Lewis with Mullet, Gilbert in bad shades, and no Gotobed. At the time I was only aware of the Robert lack. The other fashion shtick factors only became apparent later when I saw the Slow video. In the interests of accuracy I must point that Lewis' mullet actually predates The First Letter (always ahead that man) Has anyone else noticed that Bruce only grows his hair long when in a not-Wire period (ie. pre-Wire 75, early Dome, Wir)? >>>>Have you heard the last Silo single that Colin remixed? No!!! Is it still available? >>>I prefer to buy in shops rather than over the net because I live in a flat and mail sometimes goes walkies before it gets to my mailbox. Try recorded delivery... not guaranteed, due to low postman IQ's, but slightly less risky. >>>>Was that the show presented by the dreaded Mary Anne Hobbs? I know someone who knows her and she knows jack shit about music, has about 10 cds in her flat and bases her selection on bands that invite her to parties and give her coke to shove up her rotting nose. She is indeed the only media halfwit left who I am obliged to dread on weekly basis. In order not to piss my wife off completely I have to listen to something else otherwise I just start shouting insults at the silly young crone (Hobbs not my wife). Yes, I know she can't hear me out there in her silver studio with the editor of Kerrang and Ozzy blowing coke up her arse so she'll keep really believing that she likes heavy metal corporate cock rocks when in fact she only really likes rock cocks. But who am I to be critical? And now a couple of words from Lemmy: "Shkunk Anunshie!" Wouldn't You? Graeme ===== Cracked Machine irregular cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine "What one thinks of as extremes seldom are" :: BC Gilbert Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 17:30:58 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= Subject: [idealcopy] V/Vm Virus Mutates Without A Sound Ian said>>> this is classic 'UK-village' stuff. here, a band with the right contacts can create a fuss before they even release their first single, V/Vm have released a lot of singles though. Have a look here if you don't believe me! http://brainwashed.com/vvm Way too many for anyone of reasonably sound mind to bother buying! Only the snooker loopy need apply! I recommend their 'Come All Ye Industrial' from a long gone Xmas platter that apes Genesis Porridge getting the yuletide faith. The vinyl may be gone, but the MP3 lingers on. Also try Stock, Hausen & Walkman's Simply on which they perfromn the almost miraculous feat of convincing Paul McCartney to let Yamantaka Eye be the singer of Wings for a day! The Goodie Pal's 3xFalco Punishment is very good too. Also V/Vm are not students, they are professional butchers. Someone who likes Radiohead and REM doesn't really have much room to complain about so called 'student' shtick. The one time a friend played the Joy Division Permanent CD, I made her take it off before the LWTUA remix! I was not interested and I can quite believe that it would be WORSE than anything V/Vm can hack. But the proof of the pudding is in the eating (and the puking up after). Retch! Graeme ===== Cracked Machine irregular cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine "What one thinks of as extremes seldom are" :: BC Gilbert Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 23:01:09 +0100 From: "ian jackson" Subject: [idealcopy] Re:...Virus Mutates Without A Sound graeme wrote :- >Ian said>>> >this is classic 'UK-village' stuff. >here, a band with the right contacts can create a fuss >before they even release their first single, >... have released a lot of singles though. i'm aware of that fact, but i DID say 'a' band, not necessarily the 'one' discussed... i hereby terminate my participation in this thread. 'you're pushing too hard'...^_^ ian.s.j. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V4 #155 *******************************