From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V4 #100 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Tuesday, April 3 2001 Volume 04 : Number 100 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] RE:OT Cabaret Voltaire ["Wilson, Paul" ] RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle ["giluz" ] [idealcopy] RE: Punks disobey rules ["giluz" ] RE: [idealcopy] OT - Questions and trivia about different threads... ["gi] RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] [idealcopy] no gondolas [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] One Last Laugh (Tomorrow We Die) [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Ballet Sham Killed Punky Oatey [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT: Music Gone Sci-Fi [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [idealcopy] Re:babs ["ray\)\(o\)\(mac" ] [idealcopy] Re:4:33 ["ray\)\(o\)\(mac" ] [idealcopy] OT - Joy Division [Wireviews ] [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide [Wireviews ] Re: [idealcopy] Re:4:33 [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] [idealcopy] Re:Collapsing the New Math ["ray\)\(o\)\(mac" ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Joy Division [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] Advantage in Exile [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Questions and trivia about different threads... [Mar] Re: [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT: Music Gone Sci-Fi ["Ian B" ] [idealcopy] [semi-OT] Guided By Voices [Paul Pietromonaco ] [idealcopy] re: SciFi, or, Dr. Doolittle, updated [ot] [MrSodium@aol.com] RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide ["giluz" Subject: [idealcopy] RE:OT Cabaret Voltaire It's difficult to know what to recommend. It depends on what sort of stuff you like. Personally, my favourite is "Voice of America". But, for a good introduction, "Living Legends" is a good compilation, as is the double CD "Listen Up With..." (although this one is a bit 'harder' to 'get into'). I prefer the earlier work, but one to listen to is "Yashar" - there are two excellent versions of the dance track on the Mute CD Single "Nag Nag Nag". Also worth a look at is the video they did on Doublevision. I think this is still available from Mute. By the way, most of the Mute stuff is pretty good value for money (mid-price stuff). rezmole ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 11:50:50 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle > this months wireviews has a link to a page-worth of wire reviews > from this > guy. as a coda to the debate on "manscape" in recent weeks , he > describes it > as "phil collins on heroin". As opposed to Phil Collins on Cocaine, which is what you get on his own solo albums? giluz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 11:50:29 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: [idealcopy] RE: Punks disobey rules > >>>>A minimal set of no more than 2-3 chords per song; > > 'Ex Lion Tamer' was not punk. Find one punk band who > actually stuck to that rule! Does it really matter? I mean, you're right - you certainly caught me out of my depth here, but when I come to think of it, in almost every other artistic genre there are more exceptions to the patterns than people who actually do things 'by the rules'. It doesn't really matter because the rules are part of the punk myth. What people think about something is more important than what actually happened, in the sense that this is what they react to and not the 'real' situation. > >>>>(rhythm)guitar based music; > > Or noise as some would have it! Maybe the only rule that trully existed. > >>>>All of these are actually defined relating to > prog-rock > > I don't think The Damned, for example, sat down and > defined themselves in relation to anything. They just > did it! Stooges covers included... > Punk was not entirely reactionary. Certainly more punk > bands (Buzzcocks, Banshees, Warsaw, Slits, etc.) were > inspired by hearing other punk bands (most often the > Pistols) than as a reaction against anything. Boredom > was well documented as a motivator! Defining what they > were against came later. Where did the boredom come from then? It wasn't like the music scene of the mid-70's was fascinating and interesting. I know that lots of the reasons for the boredom were political-social, and weren't directly related to music, but most of these people wanted to make music, not paint or write novels. So they might have defined what they were against later, but they just put to words what they already did musically. They didn't operate in a vaccum. Maybe you think that when I was talking about rules, I was referring to some manifesto or an oral set of codes being secretly transferred from band to band in the murky depths of the marqee (naff pun not intentional, sorry). I was just trying to organise in words an unconscious attitude shared by punk musicians. I guess you all agree that there was something common to all those bands. Does it amount to just the 'anything goes' attitude or was there anything more concrete? > To me, this stuff isn't punk. I guess this is our > fundamental disagreement. Style over content was > always a bore! I don't think it's punk either - but the fact that it has stylistical similarities to punk forces the 'true' punk to go look for different styles. You can't have a 'real' punk band doing Green Day stuff - right? > > >>>>Corporations had to ignore the ideological aspect > of punk because it > was so threatening, and accept the genristic aspect of > it 'cause it sold so > well. > > I don't think those in slow dinosaur corporations > think so deeply about punk that they'd even realise > there was an idea! Hence the Pistols getting EMI and > A&M so confused they paid them to go away! Harvest > didn't seem interested in Wire's artistic ideas - here > come the weirdos, give 'em some money and they'll go > away. Wire sold so well they got dropped! That's what always happens with record companies: The first phase of a new style/genre is always the best and only time where completely uncommercial artists could be signed to major record companies. They're signed not because the record executives think they're good or understand their music. It's a hype thing and this company should have several artists operating in this genre. Very fast, they realise the extent of the mistake they did and get rid of those uncommercial artists. Another phase usually happens years later, when you have record executives who actually used to be fans of that same (now changed without recognition if not dead) genre: That's when the real cooptation happens, when record companies sign artists and label and market them as 'punk' for example, in the case of Green Day. > I agree that Cutler's 'File Under Popular' presented > an interesting perspective, but it was also highly > personal and too reductionist (after all, no one can > listen to everything). One always has to remember that > Cutler abhors repetition in music, which rather limits > the appeal of anything sticking to the 'punk rock > musical genre' rules. Cutler saw punk as a glitch with > little relevance to progression in music and I think > this is partly because he failed to entertain it as an > idea as opposed to a genre. Cutler said lots of nonsense, but it's always interesting nonsense. In the 80's for example, he prophesised that the upcoming digital revolution is gonna isolate the musicians and turn music from being a collective experience into an individual narcisistic experience. I'm not saying that some of this never happened, but electronic artists do have the need to collaborate with others and to perform in front of audiences. Music and the way we make it are too basic and too primal to our social existence to change so drastically just because of technology. cheers, giluz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 11:52:23 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Questions and trivia about different threads... > -Since I know about 2 people who have actually heard > of Joy Division, I don't have much to go on, but were > they actually considered a punk band??? They seemed > way too moody and atmospheric to fit that genre. Kind > of like lumping JG Ballard writing with sword and > sorcery SF. I quite agree with the Ballard comparison, but where did the sword and sorcery come from? There's something very surreal in Joy Division (Ballard), but also a strong sense of urban realism. > -My personal opinion is that King Crimson stopped > being a "progressive/Prog" band when they reformed in > the early 80's. At that point they were producing more > powerful energy (live, at least) than alot of > punk/metal bands will ever muster. True, but they still had a certain kind of prog-rock attitude. KC never simply rocked. They always did something else, very complicated musically. What made them so great is the fact that they did these prog-rock things and also rocked (what Fripp once described as music for the feet and for the head). giluz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2001 06:05:55 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle ....i might have guessed mogadon was phil collins drug of choice. or night nurse? p ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2001 06:59:40 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] no gondolas i have dug into this a little and it appears wire will not be playing at the venice biennale as previously advised. seems like crossed wires etc (pardon the pun). shame as i had great visions of being punted around the canals in an "idealcopy" gondola with a ghetto blaster blaring out something suitable. but sadly this now appears unlikely. .......wonder if this whitechapel gallery thing involves a live performance or just soundtracking an installation? here's hoping.p ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 07:50:23 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] One Last Laugh (Tomorrow We Die) Graeme, << Another good bit of Coleman negative showbiz was on some late night video jukebox jury type affair. Participants were able to stop a video by leaping up and pushing a button. Of course dear ol' Jaz stopped every single one almost immediately and had a huge amount of vitriol for the Blue Aeroplanes in particular. >> C4's Night Network. First all-night TV we'd had in the UK, late '80s. Astonishingly had Mark E Smith on as a guest once. Stopped one video immediately because "the bass player had a pony tail". Saw Blue Aeroplanes once - too many people in the band, including a Bez-style dancer. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 08:18:18 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Ballet Sham Killed Punky Oatey I saw Jimmy Pursey about 6 months ago, doing his shopping in Waitrose (Weybridge branch)...just a couple of miles from 'Ersham. Failed to check footwear/trouserine for lace up boots & corduroys unfortunately. Apparently he's rude to the staff if they don't recognise him. That's what the check-out girl who pointed him out to me said. Mark << > > Punk was dead when Sham 'singer' Jimmy Pursey did the > > most inept ballet ever seen on TV. > > It laughed itself to death. > > > Would that be the one to The Stranglers' Meninblack? > > > //////// sadly , yes. it got shown again recently on one of these endless > "top 10" shows they use to fill up saturday night tv cheaply. exceedingly > poor , even by jimy p's standards. his 2 solo albums used to fill every > dump bin in the british isles for about 25p a go. but no , i never was > quite that curious.p ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 09:33:14 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT: Music Gone Sci-Fi On Mon, 2 Apr 2001 voyteck@webtv.net wrote: > 'sampled' and applied. Interestingly, I heard of someone a few years ago > who went into the jungles with a sound sampler to record animal (& > insect?) sounds for a record project. Did, whoever this person was / is, > simply overdub in recording the jungle sounds, or was it digitally > precise intro-outro editing / mixing, as to which he could insert / > excerpt samples (juxtapositioning) at will as to what sounded best? If > anyone knows about this "jungle sampler", please post info (he may also > have done a similar "city sounds" sampler). Reading recent posts Isn't this Coldcut? There have been at least two records composed entirely of sampled animal noises - one that came out a few years back whose name I can't recall, and one that came out on Ralph Records (I think) by Big City Orchestra, I think called _Animal Religion_ or something like that. Scares my cat. > Tomita - 'The Planets' (sci-fi "communications") Uh...isn't this just a version of Holst's orchestral suite done up with cheesy synths? There's nothing particularly "sci-fi" about it - unless "planets" are "sci-fi" in themselves, or synths are. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::sex, drugs, revolt, Eskimos, atheism:: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 10:58:33 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] no gondolas In a message dated 4/2/2001 12:10:36 PM GMT Daylight Time, PaulRabjohn@aol.com writes: << i have dug into this a little and it appears wire will not be playing at the venice biennale as previously advised. seems like crossed wires etc (pardon the pun). shame as i had great visions of being punted around the canals in an "idealcopy" gondola with a ghetto blaster blaring out something suitable. but sadly this now appears unlikely.<< I was in Las Vegas recently where an Ideal Copy Venice has been create. It's called the Venetian Hotel and Casino (tm) and has full-size replicas of the Doge's Palace, Rialto bridge etc...all in the wrong orientation but hey! The Rialto bridge has an authentic 15th century trav-o-lator qhich takes you to the Grand Canal shopping mall. Nice restaurant in St Mark's square. They have gondolas too, taking Japanese tourists down the "canal", which has a blue bottom like a swimming pool. Maybe Wire should play there instead. It definitely qualifies as the gambling museum. >> .......wonder if this whitechapel gallery thing involves a live performance or just soundtracking an installation? here's hoping.p >> Me too. I would probably have gone to the Venice thing too as EasyJet fly there for $30. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 17:40:20 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] no gondolas > i have dug into this a little and it appears wire will not be > playing at the venice biennale as previously advised. seems like > crossed wires etc (pardon the pun). shame as i had great visions > of being punted around the canals in an "idealcopy" gondola with > a ghetto blaster blaring out something suitable. but sadly this > now appears unlikely. Hehehe - just imagine those Italian gondola guys singing a romantic version of 12XU. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 11:16:46 -0500 From: "ray\)\(o\)\(mac" Subject: [idealcopy] Re:babs Barabara and Other Musical Instruments was the album she recorded with Orchestra and Kitchen Appliances. I seem to remember Maxwell Anderson's hand in there somwhere, but it is not on my shelves at this time ^_^ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 11:26:26 -0500 From: "ray\)\(o\)\(mac" Subject: [idealcopy] Re:4:33 being pedantic again: 4:33 is not about the performer doing nothing that semi-famous story 'bout david tudor (btw - does anyone know if it is true or mythic?) obscures the point that the structure of the piece is whateveer non-deliberate sounds occur in the proscribed time period it is extremely math-based in that the *only* compositional component is the duration the performer is entirely superfluous ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 09:31:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Wireviews Subject: [idealcopy] OT - Joy Division "Since I know about 2 people who have actually heard of Joy Division, I don't have much to go on, but were they actually considered a punk band???" Pre-Joy Division = Warsaw, which was punkier, but still not really "traditional" punk. I wouldn't lump Joy Division in with punk at all. If anything, their music is more similar to '80s dance music than anything else, albeit with a gloomier stance. Think New Order - technology + more guitars * miserable "someone stole my sandwiches type day". Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 09:35:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Wireviews Subject: [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide Paul Rabjohn wrote: " this months wireviews has a link to a page-worth of wire reviews from this guy. as a coda to the debate on "manscape" in recent weeks , he describes it as "phil collins on heroin". meanwhile 154 is a goth album and "the ideal copy" is likened to INXS. er , what can you say?" To be honest, I can't say I really agree with (m)any of the reviews and I'm not particularly endeared to the writing style. However, it'd be somewhat superfluous adding my comments, what with editing a site with lots of Wire reviews already! :-) Mind you, Paul, didn't anyone tell you: "everything after 154 sucks" :-) Craig. PS: if anyone on this list can help out with the fledgeling buyer's guide on my site (off-list, obviously) then it'd be much appreciated... ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 10:18:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Rick Hindman Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Questions and trivia about different threads... > I quite agree with the Ballard comparison, but where > did the sword and > sorcery come from? There's something very surreal in > Joy Division (Ballard), > but also a strong sense of urban realism. Perhaps it's a bad analogy, but I was imagining Ballard/JD vs most punk/Conan-style search and destroy SF books. They are worlds apart, but tend to end up on the same shelf in alot of bookstores around here. > True, but they still had a certain kind of prog-rock > attitude. KC never > simply rocked. They always did something else, very > complicated musically. > What made them so great is the fact that they did > these prog-rock things and > also rocked (what Fripp once described as music for > the feet and for the > head). I can see that point. In terms of how they do the interlocking guitar parts, use odd time signatures, and chording is certainly in the spirit that lead alot of prog bands away from standard pop song structures in the 60's/70's. Writing that bit reminded me of a moment at one of their Nashville rehearsals last May. During a quieter passage in one song, Adrian Belew chuckled in his mike and said something like "I just love watching people try to dance in 9/15 time!" I guess they showed their true colors that night! Hasta, RJH ===== - ----------------------------------------------------------- "Learn to handle hot things, keep your knives sharp, and above all, have a good time. - -Julia Child - ----------------------------------------------------------- Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 18:19:50 +0100 (BST) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Graeme=20Rowland?= Subject: [idealcopy] Advantage in Exile Looking at the lyrics on 'The Wire Page' I found the word 'Terraze' in the song 'Advantage In Height'. Is this an archaic word? What is a Terraze? Could the line in question actually be 'To erase, wipe out'? "A brief Bombay, Colosseus encounter" could be "A big Bombay Colossus encounter" Should be a 'Bee Driver'. "Two men in white"? I always sang "To men in white"! Its a tricky one! Ally In Exile / d+e "Receives no welcome despite" should be "Receives an unwelcome dispatch" I think... Comments please! Graeme ===== Cracked Machine irregular cyberzine http://www.webinfo.co.uk/crackedmachine "What one thinks of as extremes seldom are" :: BC Gilbert Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 19:44:28 +0100 From: "Stephen Jackson" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Advantage in Exile >What is a Terraze? >Could the line in question actually be 'To erase, wipe >out'? Dunno, but that's what it says in the lyric book....your interpretation seems to make more sense.... >"Two men in white"? >I always sang "To men in white"! >Its a tricky one! Nah, two men..the Pope and errr the other one....the Bombay colosseus? >"Receives no welcome despite" should be >"Receives an unwelcome dispatch" I think... > Definitely. I said so myself about 2 years ago ;-P Steve. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ They use the head and not the fist. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 14:05:43 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re:4:33 On Mon, 2 Apr 2001, ray)(o)(mac wrote: > being pedantic again: > 4:33 is not about the performer doing nothing I see your pedanticism and raise it: I didn't say it was *about* that; I only said that's what the performer does. The rest of my post should make clear that I agree with you that: > the structure of the piece is whatever non-deliberate sounds occur in > the proscribed time period... such as the sounds in the room, noise from outside, nervous coughing and shuffling, etc. However, when you say... > it is extremely math-based in that the *only* compositional component is > the duration... I again disagree, because there's nothing "math-based" about a particular duration. We happen to measure and subdivide time numerically; one doesn't have to (other cultures don't - they might denote duration by the length of common tasks or time of day or season by certain natural events). Just because it has numbers involved doesn't mean it's math. Is "1 2 X U" math, then? ;) - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::"In two thousand years, they'll still be looking for Elvis - :: this is nothing new," said the priest. np: The Fall _This Nation's Saving Grace_ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 15:04:41 -0500 From: "ray\)\(o\)\(mac" Subject: [idealcopy] Re:Collapsing the New Math > Every Wire fan should have a Neubauten disc or seven. agreed the band who single-handedly redefined "Heavy Metal" I saw Neubauten open for JG Thrillwell in a church in Kansas City some years back Einheit sliced his leg open junping around in a contact-mic-ed shopping cart and required some 20 stitches, but not before they finished the set Mr. Thrillwell was very pale by comparison and I lost what limited enthusiasm I had held after seeing his 'performance' in that light. A tough act to follow indeed. > I met my wife at a Neubauten gig. I met mine at the Smart Bar in Chicago, but we danced to the 12" remix of CV's Yashar to keep that thread alive. I spent months looking for that tune not realizing it was the Cabs. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 16:23:43 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re:4:33 In a message dated 4/2/2001 5:39:10 PM GMT Daylight Time, dmack2002@yahoo.com writes: << being pedantic again: 4:33 is not about the performer doing nothing that semi-famous story 'bout david tudor (btw - does anyone know if it is true or mythic?) obscures the point that the structure of the piece is whateveer non-deliberate sounds occur in the proscribed time period it is extremely math-based in that the *only* compositional component is the duration the performer is entirely superfluous >> Being hugely pedantic.... The performer IS involved. The piece is in three movements, which are signalled by the performer. (It is a piano piece). Part way through the third movement the performer has to close the piano lid. I'll check the recording I have for the exact timings if you like. Cage's joke is that 4'33'' has to be performed by a proper classically trained musician as part of an orchestral concert programme. The performer should be in evening dress, and has to physically not play the piano. Most people think it is just a recording of nothing. Far from it! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 15:29:47 -0500 From: "ray\)\(o\)\(mac" Subject: [idealcopy] Re:4'33'' I stand corrected: http://www.azstarnet.com/~solo/4min33se.htm#3.%20Description%20of%20a for more detail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 16:29:24 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Joy Division Craig, << Pre-Joy Division = Warsaw, which was punkier, but still not really "traditional" punk.<< Totally punk IMO. Almost heavy metal (eg Novelty), but if you check out Warsaw's contribution to "Short Circuit" next to that of the Drones on the same album there's not a lot in it! >> I wouldn't lump Joy Division in with punk at all.<< Really something else entirely. But Wire circa 154 are definitely in the same area, only more detached. What separated JD was the raw emotion that other "gloom" bands of the time lacked... >> If anything, their music is more similar to '80s dance music than anything else, albeit with a gloomier stance. << Only towards the end. Though NO did pretty much invent 80s dance music, once the technology caught up with them! >>Think New Order - technology + more guitars * miserable "someone stole my sandwiches type day". >> For some of us it meant a bit more than that ;-) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 16:36:01 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Advantage in Exile Graeme, >>What is a Terraze? Could the line in question actually be 'To erase, wipe out'?<< Therese? << "Two men in white"? I always sang "To men in white"! Its a tricky one!<< I always assumed it said "Do men in white have an advantage in height?" Fits the pope vs Bombay colossus theme. >>Ally In Exile / d+e "Receives no welcome despite" should be "Receives an unwelcome dispatch" I think... >> "An ally in exile - Receives an urgent dispatch" according to Colin's lyric sheet from Edinburgh! But it could have been changed since D&E Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 16:38:27 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Questions and trivia about different threads... Rick, << I can see that point. In terms of how they do the interlocking guitar parts, use odd time signatures, and chording is certainly in the spirit that lead alot of prog bands away from standard pop song structures in the 60's/70's. >> Probably why I don't like them! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 16:43:09 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide In a message dated 02/04/01 17:45:39 GMT Daylight Time, wireviews@yahoo.com writes: > PS: if anyone on this list can help out with the > fledgeling buyer's guide on my site (off-list, > obviously) then it'd be much appreciated... > > /////// just to say something i saw today on ebay. 2 different people have > put up "154 test pressings". one has started the bidding at $69 and the > other $3.50. now what's one worth........? must say test pressings are one of those things i can't get worked up about. like cassettes. does anyone collect cassettes? still wish i'd got that 8-track though.p ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 22:19:32 +0100 From: "Ian B" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT: Music Gone Sci-Fi - ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey > Isn't this Coldcut? There have been at least two records composed entirely > of sampled animal noises - one that came out a few years back whose name I > can't recall, and one that came out on Ralph Records (I think) by Big City > Orchestra, I think called _Animal Religion_ or something like that. Scares > my cat. > There are a couple of Coldcut / Hexstatic tracks/videos, Natural Rhythm and Timber, where the sounds and visuals are made up almost exclusively of animal and logging sounds respectively. The former are culled from natural history programmes rather than from direct field recordings. Also (and I don't know because I've never heard it) was Nurse With Wound's 'Insect and Individual Silenced' album made up of magnified insect sounds? Or am I thinking of some recording project by SPK's Graeme Revell? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 14:59:21 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: [idealcopy] [semi-OT] Guided By Voices Hi everyone, I went to see Guided By Voices last Friday night at the Showbox theater here in Seattle. A really amazing show, and I'm glad I went, even though I was sick as a dog the next morning. (Stay away eating pasta late at night after drinking many "Seven & Sevens". (^_^) ) They played over two hours of classic and brand new Guided By Voices songs, and the energy was tremendous. (That, and since Jack Daniels was banned on the Seattle stage due to an incident involving the band last year, they were largely sober this year. (^_^)) That was the Semi-Off Topic part of the e-mail. Here's the semi-on topic part: As has been mentioned on this mailing list a number of times, the lead singer of Guided By Voices, Robert Pollard, is a Wire fan. One of the songs on a solo album of his, "Subspace Biographies", sounds for all of the world like a Wire out-take. Well, even though it was a Guided By Voices show, and not a Robert Pollard solo show, they played "Subspace Biographies". I thought of all of you listmembers at that point. (^_^) Cheers, Paul *********************************************************** Brain: "Pinky, Are You Pondering What I'm Pondering?" Pinky: "I think so Brain, but can the gummy worms really live in peace with the marshmallow chips?" Paul Pietromonaco Test Engineer - Reflection X WRQ, Inc. E-Mail: paulp@wrq.com *********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 22:20:15 EDT From: MrSodium@aol.com Subject: [idealcopy] re: SciFi, or, Dr. Doolittle, updated [ot] >I heard of someone a few years ago > who went into the jungles with a sound sampler to record animal (& > insect?) sounds for a record project. Did, whoever this person was / is, > simply overdub in recording the jungle sounds, or was it digitally > precise intro-outro editing / mixing, as to which he could insert / > excerpt samples (juxtapositioning) at will as to what sounded best? If > anyone knows about this "jungle sampler", please post info The first one of these that I know about is "Gorillas in the Mix," by Bernie Krause from 1988. Here is some of what the Rykodisc website says about it: Krause, who travels the world gathering natural sounds, delved into his massive library of material to compose and produce GORILLAS IN THE MIX. Every sound on GORILLAS IN THE MIX has been created from the voices of animals and the natural environment. The album is dedicated to the memory of Francisco (Chico) Mendes Filho, who was murdered in December 1988 while working to save the Brazilian rainforest. Go to http://www.rykodisc.com/Catalog/dump/rykoalbums_305.asp for more info. Most of the sounds are heavily gated, processed and generally "monkeyed" around with. (Sorry, couldn't resist). I don't mind a car hitting me, but I do mind a driver trying to hit me. MrNa ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 09:52:21 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] mark prindle/Wire buyer's guide > Mind you, Paul, didn't anyone tell you: "everything > after 154 sucks" :-) That's "Everything after Pink Flag sucks" (and some say that even before). giluz ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V4 #100 *******************************