From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V4 #17 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, January 17 2001 Volume 04 : Number 017 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [idealcopy] Dating the Wires [Wireviews ] RE: [idealcopy] APB for Wire stuff! ["giluz" ] [idealcopy] Wir live [Howard Spencer ] [idealcopy] Michel Faber's Under the Skin ["giluz" ] Re: [idealcopy] Wir live [MarkBursa@aol.com] [idealcopy] Skip and Fall [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [idealcopy] worst single ever [John Roberts ] Re: [idealcopy] Re: packaging-going off and on topic [John Roberts ] RE: [idealcopy] Skip and Fall ["giluz" ] RE: [idealcopy] Skip and Fall [John Roberts ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' ["Jerry" ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [Paul Pietromonaco ] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' [Aaron Mandel ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 01:33:19 -0800 (PST) From: Wireviews Subject: [idealcopy] Dating the Wires " I'm really interested in hearing what people's reactions were to the 80's stuff as their introduction to Wire and what their reactions were later when they heard the early stuff. Anyone care to comment? " My introduction to Wire was when a friend who knew I liked electronic music gave me a tape with a load of tracks on it. The first was 'Ahead'. Over the next few years I got hold of most of the Mute stuff, including D&E. When the reissues came out, I bought CM & 154 first, and then Pink Flag. During the above time I also grabbed a load of the solo stuff, such as Dome 1-4 and CN's early work. In terms of what I like most; well, that's pretty subjective, but 154 would take it by a whisker. When I mentioned recently that it sounds like a compilation, that wasn't necessarily a derogatory comment. I still stand by that remark -- for me, the album doesn't feel like a whole, but I still rate it very highly. First Letter would have that accolade if it was produced better. When I first heard 154 I thought it was really good. I liked the level of experimentation within the pop framework, the diversity of sound. Although I still think it sounds a little of its time, that wasn't an overriding problem, unlike with Pink Flag, which like then I still find a somewhat tedious and unrewarding listening experience. As for the '80s, well, production lets most of the albums down badly, with the obvious exception of IBTABA, which actually reminds me a lot of what Wire are doing now. Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:40:07 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] APB for Wire stuff! > I wanted to find out if anyone out there has access > to the "Everybody Loves a History" book and/or the > "Free Speech..." CD. It was available from WMO until recently - perhaps they still have a copy. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:35:24 +0000 From: Howard Spencer Subject: [idealcopy] Wir live >>I've only ever seen the Wir videos and, yes, they're pretty bad, but I don't think they were really taking things that seriously then -- the break was immanent. << Can't agree with this at all, although I can see that the Kilburn footage of Wir might lead one to suppose it. It sounds as if I went to the same gig (mean fidder) as Mark Bursa. I was completely blown away by them (sounds as if Mark was a little more reserved about it) and it felt very intense, very committed. I would say the same of the Clapham Grand appearance in 92 - afaik their last. I recall the person I went with said to me afterwards 'I hope that they've got happy home lives' - it was very brooding and dark - absolutely no sense of going through the motions. Interesting to read in the garage interview - which, incidentally, seems to be reproduced more fully on Craig's site than it was on cracked machine - that EGL was having a bad time of it around 91/92, when doing the interviews for Kevin's book. It is one of life's regrets that I bogged off to get the bakerloo line in the middle Of a stupendous Wir encore of drill at the mean fiddler - anyone else remember this? Howard ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:33:55 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: [idealcopy] Michel Faber's Under the Skin Just finished the book and all I can say is a big WOW!!! Faber has the talent of making characters come alive before your eyes with just a few paragraphs. I won't tell you anything about the plot, 'cause it will spoil it for you, or you'd probably form the wrong impressions. It's really really very good. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:52:58 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Wir live Howard, << Can't agree with this at all, although I can see that the Kilburn footage of Wir might lead one to suppose it. It sounds as if I went to the same gig (mean fidder) as Mark Bursa. I was completely blown away by them (sounds as if Mark was a little more reserved about it) and it felt very intense, very committed. >> By comparison to the previous Wire gig I'd been to (Astoria '88) it was tame. They'd completely changed direction to compensate for the lack of Robert and had become, effectively, a different band. They were certainly committed, I agree. Highlight was Ticking Mouth, with Bruce on vocals. I remember he sat down at a keyboard near the back of the stage, and put his glasses on, before singing. Rock 'n' roll...phew! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 10:42:54 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: [idealcopy] Skip and Fall On Tue, 16 Jan 2001, Wilson, Paul wrote: > Speaking of The Fall on CD. I have a Fall CD (one of VERY many), which > actually jumps! Well, the CD doesn't skip, the tracks jump! It was obviously > mastered from the vinyl version of the album, and whoever did it, wasn't > listening to the damn thing when he did it. The LP jumps, so the CD > recording does! Can't remember which CD it is off hand - but it's either > "Fall in a Hole" or "A Part of America Therein". I was going to return it to > the shop, but the problem would have been on all copies of the CD, and it > seemed to me that they would be unlikely to get the recording sorted out > properly, so I hung on to the one I had. it's _Fall in a Hole_. A few years back, when I was on Fallnet, this title was highly sought after and very hard to find. Naturally, when I saw it on CD, I snapped it up. But yeah, it's obviously just burned directly from the vinyl - and a not very well maintained piece of vinyl at that. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html ::playing around with the decentered self is all fun and games ::until somebody loses an I. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 09:09:53 -0800 (PST) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: [idealcopy] worst single ever We've had this conversation before I'm sure of it. I remember constructing a table of the differences between all the US and UK CD single releases. A filofax is a piece of leather that yuppies use to use to keep lists in of who they know. They do this due to their cocaine addled brains being unable to remember such information. Now.. where did I put mine... John - --- Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > > mention by certain listers of various 3"cd's > brings to mind a pet hate of > > > mine. isn't the silk skin paws "filofax cd" the > crappiest idea ever? did > the > > US edition have this genius package format? must > have been a great lunch > at > > mute mansions to come up with that one.p > > Hi everyone, > Okay - for us "out of the loop" americans (^_^) - > What exactly is a > filofax? I think I know, but before I type > something really dumb, I better > make sure. > The american edition silk skin paws 3" CD I have is > in a thin-line full > size jewel case. In fact, with the exception of > Eardrum Buzz 3", which > came in a small cardboard/heavy paper sleeve, all of > the Enigma 3" CDs were > in 5" single plastic jewel boxes. > Cheers, > Paul Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 09:11:32 -0800 (PST) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: [idealcopy] worst single ever > actually i have real trouble playing 3" cd's , > neither my home or car player > will accept them. thankfully they seem to have died > now as a concept. p I think its a zen thing. It can be done without a spindle player...you just need to sit there for hours trying to position the 3" CD in such a position as to pre empt its trajectory when the drawer slides shut... Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 09:17:07 -0800 (PST) From: Rick Hindman Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Ideal Copiers~ It seems to pop up on this list alot, but I have to confess to having absolutely no knowledge of The Fall. I don't think I've ever heard them for that matter and was inspired by the list's collective interest to check them out at the local CD shop and found 20 or so different albums ?!? So how long have they been around? And what is a good starting point regarding their music? I realize the 2nd question is a bit subjective...but so what! Lemme Know! TIA y'all RJH Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 09:23:55 -0800 (PST) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: [idealcopy] Re: packaging-going off and on topic I always wondered why there wasn't any Wire merchandise from the Mute days. I bought a Kidney Bingos tshirt at (I think) the Town and Country Club and I have a number of promo posters, A5 flyers and postcards for the various Mute singles/LPs but apart from that... And I think the t-shirt was merely a pile found at the back of the Mute warehouse. If anyone hasn't seen them they're a black star with a white background surrounded by a red square. Top text: Wire bottom text: Kidney Bingos. White t-shirt. Anyone else got one? John - --- PaulRabjohn@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 14/01/01 04:05:11 GMT Standard > Time, Eardrumbuz@aol.com > writes: > > << i'm a sucker for nice packaging. have we > discussed favorite wire > artwork/packages yet? interesting that manscape is > the least favorite album > of most listers (myself included), yet the > cardboard manscape package is my > favorite wire package design. i also really like > the photo on the drill 12" > cover, and the pink flag cover design as well. what > do you all think of wire > cover art/package design? > >> > //////// i must say almost all the EMI releases had > classic sleeves. except > maybe "map ref" , which is a bit amateur. > > however , there aren't many of the mute sleeves i > could get excited about. > snakedrill , ABIAC, kidney bingos are all nice. but > a lot of the others are > pretty uninspired ; ideal copy , silk skin paws , > manscape , ahead to name > but 4. shame because most of the solo releases were > well-packaged and yet the > later wire releases i felt could have been realised > better. wonder whose idea > they all were? p Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:33:34 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] worst single ever > I think its a zen thing. It can be done without a > spindle player...you just need to sit there for hours > trying to position the 3" CD in such a position as to > pre empt its trajectory when the drawer slides shut... Hey, it's just like trying to position those old 7" singles with the big hole in the centre of the turntable if you don't have that adaptor thing (but probably even harder). giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:36:29 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Skip and Fall > it's _Fall in a Hole_. A few years back, when I was on Fallnet, this title > was highly sought after and very hard to find. Naturally, when I saw it on > CD, I snapped it up. But yeah, it's obviously just burned directly from > the vinyl - and a not very well maintained piece of vinyl at that. Yeah, I've got it as well, and I kinda like the fact that it's burned from vinyl - that's such a typical Fall attitude, and I think they couldn't have done it any other way. This record was a rarity for years, it was released only in New Zealand, of all places (well - that's where the gig took place so it makes sense), and the master tapes were probably lost or eaten by a sheep. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 09:49:13 -0800 (PST) From: John Roberts Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Skip and Fall All copies of Fall in a Hole vinyl edition have the jump. There's a Laibach double on Sub Rosa which had the same problem too. A lot of Fall comps whether vinyl or CD are mastered from vinyl. I think I'm right in saying that Hip Priest and Kamerads has a crack through a few secs of Lie Dream of a Casino Soul... - --- giluz wrote: > > it's _Fall in a Hole_. A few years back, when I > was on Fallnet, this title > > was highly sought after and very hard to find. > Naturally, when I saw it on > > CD, I snapped it up. But yeah, it's obviously just > burned directly from > > the vinyl - and a not very well maintained piece > of vinyl at that. > > Yeah, I've got it as well, and I kinda like the fact > that it's burned from > vinyl - that's such a typical Fall attitude, and I > think they couldn't have > done it any other way. This record was a rarity for > years, it was released > only in New Zealand, of all places (well - that's > where the gig took place > so it makes sense), and the master tapes were > probably lost or eaten by a > sheep. > > giluz Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:49:52 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Rick, The Fall hail from Manchester and have been around constantly since 1977. Main man Mark E Smith operates a revolving door policy with band members - most of the current line-up have only been in the band for a couple of years. Strict work ethic - a new studio album every year. On top of that there are endless compilations (mainly due to bad licencing deals) and a number of live albums. As for recommendations, you won't get a consensus on this list, that's for sure! My favourite period is from 79 to 83, with a good revival in the early 90s. New album is the best for ages. My best suggestion would be to start at the beginning and work through! For more info, go to the official web site: http://www.visi.com/fall/ Cheers, Mark << It seems to pop up on this list alot, but I have to confess to having absolutely no knowledge of The Fall. I don't think I've ever heard them for that matter and was inspired by the list's collective interest to check them out at the local CD shop and found 20 or so different albums ?!? So how long have they been around? And what is a good starting point regarding their music? I realize the 2nd question is a bit subjective...but so what! Lemme Know! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:10:47 -0000 From: "Jerry" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Rick, My suggestion comes from the angle of a some time Fall listener who got in through the, shall we say, slightly more 'accessible' stuff. I suggest "The Frenz Experiment" featuring such classics as "Athlete Cured" and, um, some other ones. j > << It seems to pop up on this list alot, but I have to > confess to having absolutely no knowledge of The Fall. > I don't think I've ever heard them for that matter and > was inspired by the list's collective interest to > check them out at the local CD shop and found 20 or so > different albums ?!? > > So how long have they been around? And what is a good > starting point regarding their music? I realize the > 2nd question is a bit subjective...but so what! Lemme > Know! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:29:15 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Jerry, There you go! Frenz Experiment is probably my least favourite Fall album.....you'll never find consensus, even among die-hard fans! Personally, I'd recommend Hex Enduction Hour, or Perverted by Language, or Grotesque.... Mark << My suggestion comes from the angle of a some time Fall listener who got in through the, shall we say, slightly more 'accessible' stuff. I suggest "The Frenz Experiment" featuring such classics as "Athlete Cured" and, um, some other ones. >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 13:44:42 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Very early: _Live at the Witch Trials_ (not live) Early: _Hex Enduction Hour_ or _Slates_ Middle: _This Nation's Saving Grace_, _The Wonderful & Frightening World of The Fall_ Later: gets patchier - but still plenty of good stuff if you like the above. My minority opinion here might go with _Middle Class Revolt_ or even _Cerebral Caustic_ Please note: "taking 'The Fall'" happened to our listowner Miles about a year ago - ever noticed how infrequently he's communicated since then? Word to the etc...! - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html ::PLEASE! You are sending cheese information to me. I don't want it. ::I have no goats or cows or any other milk producing animal! __"raus"__ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:12:31 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Another variation on The Fall's best, just to keep you really lost: Early: Palace of Swords Reversed (collection) / Perverted By Language Middle: Bend Sinister / This Nation's Saving Grace / The Wonderful & Frightening World of / B sides (collection) Later: Extricate / Code Selfish / The Unutterable (the new one) cheers, giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:21:02 -0800 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' >And what is a good >starting point regarding their music? I realize the >2nd question is a bit subjective...but so what! Lemme >Know! > Hiya! Well, I'm going to defer to the more knowledgeable Fall members on the list, but I would suggest starting with a compilation if you can find it: Peel Sessions - Strange Fruit SFRSCD048 25 January 1998 (CD). The performances are pretty groovy, the compilation covers a fair amount of the differing Fall lineups and sounds (bar the latest), and it has some of my favorite songs on it. Bear in mind that this is a Peel session compilation, so the performances won't match the albums, but it does give you a good feel for what's going on with this band. There's a pretty decent compilation of their last decade: A Past Gone Mad - Artful ARTFULCD17 19 April 1999 (CD). Some fans have quibbled with the track selection, but as a Fall neophyte, I've quite enjoyed the collection. Individual albums are very subjective. The Infotainment Scan is highly regarded. This Nations Saving Grace and The Strange And Frightening World Of The Fall are pretty highly regarded, too. Then, it gets pretty subjective. Their latest one - The Unutterable - is pretty fun. I have the Frenz Experiment somewhere. Not one of my faves, but it does have "Victoria" which is the closest they've ever come to a U.S. hit, I think. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:58:09 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Paul, << Peel Sessions - Strange Fruit SFRSCD048 25 January 1998 (CD). The performances are pretty groovy, the compilation covers a fair amount of the differing Fall lineups and sounds (bar the latest), and it has some of my favorite songs on it.Bear in mind that this is a Peel session compilation, so the performances won't match the albums,<< It is pretty good. By "not match the albums" you presumably mean the Peel performances are professionally engineered using proper microphones, not ones that came with 1970s cassette recorders! The Peel 'New Face in Hell" way outstrips the one on Grotesque. Hell, you can even hear the cymbals! >> There's a pretty decent compilation of their last decade: A Past Gone Mad - Artful ARTFULCD17 19 April 1999 (CD). Some fans have quibbled with the track selection, but as a Fall neophyte, I've quite enjoyed the collection. >> Now this is a really good compilation, though I have to say I took one look at the track listing and thought "where the hell is.......(fill in about 10 really well-known '90s fall tracks)" - but it really works as an album. In fact, to cover the last 10 years of the Fall's career, you need A Past Gone Mad, Extricate, Shift-work and The Unutterable. All the best bits of all the other albums are on APGM. Compiled by alt. comedian Stewart Lee. What I'd give to be able to do the definitive '80s Fall comp :-) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:19:13 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' On Tue, 16 Jan 2001 MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > In fact, to cover the last 10 years of the Fall's career, you need A > Past Gone Mad, Extricate, Shift-work and The Unutterable. All the best > bits of all the other albums are on APGM. good grief; i knew Fall fans always disagree about the best albums, but i didn't know anybody considered Shift-Work essential! APGM doesn't have any of the good tracks from Cerebral Caustic or The Light-User Syndrome, imperfect though those records may have been as wholes. so i must take exception to your statement. to start with, though, i'd recommend Perverted By Language or The Frenz Experiment. or maybe the Beggars Banquet singles collection 458489A. there's also a new 3-CD collection of the best pre-Beggars stuff called Psykick Dancehall; on the one hand, it's a mind-blowing accumulation of goodness, but on the other hand, it costs a substantial fraction of what you'd spend to get the six albums it distills in their entirety. no, i tell a lie... it's seven. eight. maybe nine, now that i think about it. Early Years, Live At The Witch Trials, Dragnet, Grotesque, Slates, Room To Live, Hex Enduction Hour, Perverted By Language, Totale's Turns, Palace Of Swords Reversed... okay, the 3-CD set is a good idea. a ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:01:08 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' Aaron, << good grief; i knew Fall fans always disagree about the best albums, but i didn't know anybody considered Shift-Work essential! << Yep. Easily my favourite '90s Fall album, followed closely by Extricate. Middle Class Revolt is good, but they get progressively worse after that, with The Unutterable a real return to form. >>though APGM doesn't have any of the good tracks from Cerebral Caustic or The Light-User Syndrome, imperfect though those records may have been as wholes. so i must take exception to your statement.<< Well, I guess we agree they're imperfect. Light User Syndrome is pretty weak. >> to start with, though, i'd recommend Perverted By Language or The Frenz Experiment. or maybe the Beggars Banquet singles collection 458489A.<< PBL absolutely. Another favourite of mine. But Frenz is at the other end of the spectrum for me! And get the B-sides part of 458489 as well as the A-sides. Many of the B-sides from the Brix-era are better than the A-sides... >> there's also a new 3-CD collection of the best pre-Beggars stuff called Psykick Dancehall; on the one hand, it's a mind-blowing accumulation of goodness, but on the other hand, it costs a substantial fraction of what you'd spend to get the six albums it distills in their entirety. no, i tell a lie... it's seven. eight. maybe nine, now that i think about it. Early Years, Live At The Witch Trials, Dragnet, Grotesque, Slates, Room To Live, Hex Enduction Hour, Perverted By Language, Totale's Turns, Palace Of Swords Reversed... okay, the 3-CD set is a good idea. >> Whoa! Buyer beware here. These tacked-together compilations are NOT proper products - MES sees no money from them, as they are the result of dodgy old licencing deals. Personally I won't buy them on principle (the principle being that most of them are utter shit). There is one (I think it's Fiend with a Violin) which has tracks not by the Fall on it..... Also see earlier posts about these things being mastered off vinyl. Check out the Fall web site discography for details. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 23:22:26 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' On Tue, 16 Jan 2001 MarkBursa@aol.com wrote: > Whoa! Buyer beware here. These tacked-together compilations are NOT > proper products - MES sees no money from them, as they are the result > of dodgy old licencing deals. Personally I won't buy them on principle > (the principle being that most of them are utter shit). i don't know the ins and out of MES's licensing deals, but i had thought that this one (Psykick Dancehall) was fully authorized since it's released by Eagle Records, the same people who put out The Unutterable. and i haven't heard it, so the sound quality might be as bad as the Cog Sinister reissues were, but the track listing is crammed with essential tracks, unlike those crappy Receiver Records collections of a few years ago. a ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:03:25 -0600 From: "dan bailey" Subject: Re: [idealcopy] OT - Taking the 'Fall' This one's as close as anyone is likely to come to my own recommendations, though I'd have to stick in Live at the Witch Trials (surely Palace & Perverted can't be considered "early" ... that would apply to Live & the Early Years collection, though), insert Frenz Experiment, drop Extricate & replace it with Infotainment Scan, Light User Syndrome & maybe Cerebral Caustic. Dan >Another variation on The Fall's best, just to keep you really lost: > >Early: Palace of Swords Reversed (collection) / Perverted By Language >Middle: Bend Sinister / This Nation's Saving Grace / The Wonderful & >Frightening World of / B sides (collection) >Later: Extricate / Code Selfish / The Unutterable (the new one) > > >cheers, >giluz ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:14:22 -0000 From: "Andrew Lumbard" Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Dating the Wires - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of giluz Sent: 15 January 2001 16:15 To: IdealCopy; Wireviews Subject: RE: [idealcopy] Dating the Wires (I once heard that even Dire Straits were referred to as a punk band by record executives, just because they were a new band from Newcastle), giluz Oh those memories. I,too, remember this reference and on the strength of it, and thinking that Sultans of Swing was one of their slower ones, I went to see tham live at Sheffield Uni in about '77. Dull was the word that first sprang to mind. AndyL ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V4 #17 ******************************