From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V3 #300 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Wednesday, October 4 2000 Volume 03 : Number 300 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Tarwater ["giluz" ] the reckoning [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: the reckoning [John Roberts ] Re multi(thistle)colour area [alan gray ] ELO vs Styx [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] yet more eBay craziness ["Syarzhuk Kazachenka" ] Re: ELO vs Styx [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx ["tube disaster" ] Re: the reckoning ["tube disaster" ] Re: ELO vs Styx [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx ["tube disaster" ] Re: yet more eBay craziness [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: the reckoning [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx [PaulRabjohn@aol.com] Re: the reckoning [Paul Pietromonaco ] Re: ELO vs Styx [Paul Pietromonaco ] Re: the reckoning-ole elo [BillyD ] Re: ELO vs Styx [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: the reckoning [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: ELO vs Styx [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: ELO vs Styx (self-correcting idiocy) [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] PF-CM-154 box [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] You've got to be "Kid A"-ing ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 13:29:08 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: Tarwater Did anyone hear the last Tarwater album (and has any comment on it [i.e. is it worth anything])? giluz ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 07:57:16 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: the reckoning well i've fed all the relevant data into a special new computer program i've installed. results are as follows. apparently 25 pearl jam albums is worse than a complete AFOS collection , but still not as bad as a favourable mention for the Alan Parson's Project. sorry about this gilluz , but toyah actually ranks even worse than mr parsons and his so called project. i'm trying to feed in a failed attempt to buy an 8-track i couldn't play , but it is too abstract a concept for it to handle. if anyone wants me to try some other data then i could attempt to load it in.p ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 05:22:40 -0700 (PDT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: the reckoning Did you try putting ELO data in it? I think if you do that the PC turns into a multicoloured space ship which if you listen intently you'll hear Violinski wandering around the cargo section closely followed by the scutters all humming The Diary of Horace Wimp. Whatever you do don't put Styx in there - you won't be able to get near the keyboard for permed mullet hair. - --- PaulRabjohn@aol.com wrote: > well i've fed all the relevant data into a special > new computer program i've installed. results are as > follows. apparently 25 pearl jam albums is worse > than a complete AFOS collection , but still not as > bad as a favourable mention for the Alan Parson's > Project. sorry about this gilluz , but toyah > actually ranks even worse than mr parsons and his so > called project. i'm trying to feed in a failed > attempt to buy an 8-track i couldn't play , but it > is too abstract a concept for it to handle. if > anyone wants me to try some other data > then i could attempt to load it in.p > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free! http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 08:50:11 -0400 (EDT) From: alan gray Subject: Re multi(thistle)colour area >>Singing about politics is just >>like singing about anything else - it can be good or crap, >>depending on the >>talent of the writer. Musical talent plus sincerity. Alan - ----------------------------------------------- FREE! The World's Best Email Address @email.com Reserve your name now at http://www.email.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 11:34:37 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: ELO vs Styx well it took me a long time to plug in the data (all those holes in the ticker tape , it's such a chore) , but the official conclusion is that ELO are not quite as appalling as styx. both scored nil points for music , ELO scored 2 points for previous releases as the move whereas styx managed one point only for their sterling work supporting the root vegetable growers of the US of A. well its good to see their career was not entirely in vain.p ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2000 11:53:31 EDT From: "Syarzhuk Kazachenka" Subject: yet more eBay craziness Chairs Missing is going for $51 as of this writing: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=450973307 Never mind at the same time the PF/CM/154 box set is going for $42: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=450497695 Never mind at the same time CDNow sells the same box set for $39 Syarzhuk Be healthy, stay wealthy... Visit Belarusan Music Source - http://belmusic.hypermart.net _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 12:19:36 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx Hi Paul, Difficult call - ELO score bonus points for having had Roy Wood in the band at the start (10538 Overture is a top single) but it's all downhill from there. Styx have no redeeming features whatsoever so I think ELO edges it.... As for AFOS vs Pearl Jam, the result has to go to Seattle. Hell, I actually own some of their records....mind you, I've seen AFOS three times (including twice in a week - all support slots I hasten to add) against PJ only once. AFOS gain points for being namechecked in Pulp Fiction while being mates with Neil Young definitely weighs in PJ's favour. Now Neil jamming with AFOS would be something else..... actually would probably turn out like Trans.... I'm off to HMV to buy some 'nice price' Wire albums to sell on Ebay... Mark << well it took me a long time to plug in the data (all those holes in the ticker tape , it's such a chore) , but the official conclusion is that ELO are not quite as appalling as styx. both scored nil points for music , ELO scored 2 points for previous releases as the move whereas styx managed one point only for their sterling work supporting the root vegetable growers of the US of A. well its good to see their career was not entirely in vain.p >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 11:51:03 -0500 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx >As for AFOS vs Pearl Jam, the result has to go to Seattle. Hell, I actually >own some of their records....mind you, I've seen AFOS three times (including >twice in a week - all support slots I hasten to add) against PJ only once. >AFOS gain points for being namechecked in Pulp Fiction while being mates with >Neil Young definitely weighs in PJ's favour. Now Neil jamming with AFOS would >be something else..... Of course, that may make PJ worshippers, by association, of Ronald Reagan, since Neil was precisely that in the '80s -- perhaps that's enough demerits to give AFOS the edge. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 11:54:35 -0500 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: the reckoning Damnation, am I getting confused. I own only 2 AFOS LPs (like virtually every synthpoppish band I can think of --with the exception of, I guess, Cowboys International, though Nonstop Erotic Cabaret holds up pretty well, too, if memory serves -- in my mind they were a singles band, period) as compared to, I think, 1 PJ single (Spin the Black Circle) ... I wonder where my old pocket calculator is, & if it can handle the necessary numbers. Dan >well i've fed all the relevant data into a special new computer program i've installed. results are as follows. apparently 25 pearl jam albums is worse than a complete AFOS collection , but still not as bad as a favourable mention for the Alan Parson's Project. sorry about this gilluz , but toyah actually ranks even worse than mr parsons and his so called project. i'm trying to feed in a failed attempt to buy an 8-track i couldn't play , but it is too abstract a concept for it to handle. if anyone wants me to try some other data >then i could attempt to load it in.p > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 14:10:54 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx Dan, You just won't give up with them will you ;-) Only two albums though - I thought you'd have a complete discography..... Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still remember the relief when Eldorado came out. Mark << Of course, that may make PJ worshippers, by association, of Ronald Reagan, since Neil was precisely that in the '80s -- perhaps that's enough demerits to give AFOS the edge. >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 13:16:40 -0500 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx Nah ... for my money (& very little of it, since the 2 LPs I bought years after the fact were used) they came out with maybe 4 great singles, & that's it. But hell, last I looked, that's about 4 more than 99.9 percent of all bands (esp. if you exclude the acts represented on my shelves). Dan >Dan, > >You just won't give up with them will you ;-) Only two albums though - I >thought you'd have a complete discography..... > >Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still remember >the relief when Eldorado came out. > >Mark > ><< Of course, that may make PJ worshippers, by association, of Ronald Reagan, > since Neil was precisely that in the '80s -- perhaps that's enough demerits > to give AFOS the edge. > >> > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:09:55 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: yet more eBay craziness Chairs Missing is going for $51 as of this writing: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=450973307 Never mind at the same time the PF/CM/154 box set is going for $42: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=450497695 Never mind at the same time CDNow sells the same box set for $39 ///// meanwhile there are copies of both "midnight bahnhof cafe" and "not about to die" bootlegs for $20 each , maybe both 1000x as rare as an old emi album..... also a des simmons lp for any of you trainspotters.p ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:16:22 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: the reckoning In a message dated 03/10/00 18:09:19 GMT Daylight Time, dpbailey@worldnet.att.net writes: << Damnation, am I getting confused. I own only 2 AFOS LPs (like virtually every synthpoppish band I can think of --with the exception of, I guess, Cowboys International, though Nonstop Erotic Cabaret holds up pretty well, too, if memory serves -- in my mind they were a singles band, period) as compared to, I think, 1 PJ single (Spin the Black Circle) ... I wonder where my old pocket calculator is, & if it can handle the necessary numbers. Dan >> //////// well i quite liked NSEC (and the 2nd soft cell album). probably as good as electopop got. mike thorne did a lot of those bands , didn't he. it always made me smile to see keith levine playing on that cowboys intl lp , not very obvious bedfellows. i've got a couple of singles but never heard the album ; ken lockie was more famous as a producer i seem to recall. i don't mind PJ in short doses , but a bit "rock" for me ; they always came a massively poor 2nd to nirvana in my book. but 25 live cd's .....c'mon.p ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:17:44 EDT From: PaulRabjohn@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx In a message dated 03/10/00 19:25:09 GMT Daylight Time, MarkBursa@aol.com writes: << Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still remember the relief when Eldorado came out. >> //// wasn't that ELO's disco cash-in album? p ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:32:47 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: the reckoning >i don't mind PJ in short doses , but a bit "rock" for me ; they always came a >massively poor 2nd to nirvana in my book. but 25 live cd's .....c'mon.p Actually, speaking as someone who owns all 25 sets (there's actually 2 CDs per set - 50 discs(!) altogether), they're pretty amazing. I've opened maybe 10%, and so far, the sets have been well played. Sure, an occasional bum note, but for the most part, the performances are spot on. Hey - it beats the bootleggers charging U.S. $50.00 per show. I got 'em for U.S. $12.99 each at Tower. Suggesting starting point - either of the two shows in Poland. (Sets 15 & 16.) (^_^) Cheers, Paul P.S. I mostly agree with the Nirvana comment. I generally prefer Nirvana to Pearl Jam. However, since I live in Seattle, I have to like both, right? (^_^) Now, Hammerbox - that was a hell of a band. Quick - - grab me some flannel!!!!! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:36:56 -0700 From: Paul Pietromonaco Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx > Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still remember > the relief when Eldorado came out. >> > >//// wasn't that ELO's disco cash-in album? Yes, but it was also the title of a Neil Young CD that was only released in Japan. (EP length). According to the story I heard, Neil wasn't too happy with it, and he didn't want the record label marketing it as a "return to form" so he authorized its release in Japan only, figuring that the rich people would buy it and the poor people would bootleg it. Which is exactly what happened. Neil kinda predated the whole "Smashing Pumpkins/Offspring giving away their albums by allowing MP3 bootlegs" controversy about 10 years ago with cassette tapes. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 15:56:12 -0700 (PDT) From: BillyD Subject: Re: the reckoning-ole elo Don't forget your paper spaceship from Out of the Blue... - --- John Roberts wrote: > Did you try putting ELO data in it? I think if you > do > that the PC turns into a multicoloured space ship > which if you listen intently you'll hear Violinski > wandering around the cargo section closely followed > by > the scutters all humming The Diary of Horace Wimp. > Whatever you do don't put Styx in there - you won't > be > able to get near the keyboard for permed mullet > hair. > > --- PaulRabjohn@aol.com wrote: > > well i've fed all the relevant data into a special > > new computer program i've installed. results are > as > > follows. apparently 25 pearl jam albums is worse > > than a complete AFOS collection , but still not as > > bad as a favourable mention for the Alan Parson's > > Project. sorry about this gilluz , but toyah > > actually ranks even worse than mr parsons and his > so > > called project. i'm trying to feed in a failed > > attempt to buy an 8-track i couldn't play , but it > > is too abstract a concept for it to handle. if > > anyone wants me to try some other data > > then i could attempt to load it in.p > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 > Free! > http://photos.yahoo.com/ ===== . ./\/\/\. [ . . ] /\ -- -Get Well Sammy! (R)SOT Ltd. http://depechemode.acmecity.com/freestate/54 http://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free! http://photos.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 21:11:58 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx Paul, Now just HOW did you know that ;-) Come on, out of the closet, you're with friends..... Mark << Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still remember the relief when Eldorado came out. >> //// wasn't that ELO's disco cash-in album? p >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 21:14:59 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx George, << Who namechecked Flock of Seagulls in Pulp Fiction >> Samuel L Jackson ("Shut yo' ass, Flock of Seagulls" to the layabout on the sofa with the floppy fringe. Before he shoots him.) Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 21:17:48 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: the reckoning Paul, << i don't mind PJ in short doses , but a bit "rock" for me ; they always came a massively poor 2nd to nirvana in my book. but 25 live cd's .....c'mon.p >> The less rock the better. The first two albums are way too rock. No Code is a good one. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 21:22:19 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx Paul, << Yes, but it was also the title of a Neil Young CD that was only released in Japan. (EP length). According to the story I heard, Neil wasn't too happy with it, and he didn't want the record label marketing it as a "return to form" so he authorized its release in Japan only, figuring that the rich people would buy it and the poor people would bootleg it. >> Not quite as I heard it. It was chopped back from an album to an EP, but I can't remember if that was Neil or the label's decision.... Not sure what happened to the rest of the tracks - I think Wrecking Ball on Freedom is from the same sessions. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2000 00:14:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx On Tue, 3 Oct 2000, Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > > Poor old Neil wasn't really with us in the '80s was he? I can still > remember > > the relief when Eldorado came out. >> > > > >//// wasn't that ELO's disco cash-in album? > > Yes... No. I like the first three ELO albums pretty much unreservedly, and when I'm in a glossy pop mood, the next three or so fairly well. (_Eldorado_ was the first and sounds not the least disco-ey. Pop, to be sure - but not disco-pop. No four-on-the-floor thud.) Wait - this isn't the "Confess to a Virtual Priest" list? Damn... - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html ::Drive ten thousand miles across America and you will know more about ::the country than all the institutes of sociology and political science ::put together. __Jean Baudrillard__ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2000 00:28:04 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: ELO vs Styx (self-correcting idiocy) On Wed, 4 Oct 2000, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > I like the first three ELO albums pretty much unreservedly, and when I'm > in a glossy pop mood, the next three or so fairly well. (_Eldorado_ was > the first insert "of the next three" and sounds not the least disco-ey. Pop, to be sure - but not > disco-pop. No four-on-the-floor thud.) - --Jeff, foot so far in his mouth it's coming out his ass J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html ::I play the guitar. Sometimes I play the fool:: __John Lennon__ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 22:32:02 -0700 From: fernando Subject: Re: Tarwater I did not think much of it... listenable, but not as engaging as the first album, or even the remix EPs. It is not horrible or some such, just don't rush out to buy it... or try really hard to listen to it before you buy. - -fernando At 01:29 p +0200 10/03/2000, giluz wrote: >Did anyone hear the last Tarwater album (and has any comment on it [i.e. is >it worth anything])? > >giluz ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2000 00:35:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: PF-CM-154 box Are these the re-made/re-modeled versions thereof? - -j ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2000 00:50:19 -0700 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: You've got to be "Kid A"-ing (This is primarily a review of Radiohead's Kid A. There might be some ideas in this record of interest to Wire fans. However, if Radiohead is totally without interest to you, then feel free to delete this message - I'm not trying to waste anyone's time here.) Hi everyone, I just had to use that subject line. (^_^) So, I got Kid A tonight, and I've been listening to it for a while. (Well, a couple of hours, anyway) And, here's my opinion. Remember how OK Computer sounded like somebody took the fairly traditional pop song structures found on "The Bends" and put them into a blender? So that OK Computer sounded less like a pop album, but more like a great collection of moods? Well, Kid A is the blender version of OK Computer. The "songs" (and I use that term loosely) resemble dada-ist collages more than anything else. In other words, there's very little you could "hum" here. I can see why Katherine's radio station is playing Optimistic - it's one of the few pieces that actually approximates song structure. I wouldn't bother asking for another tune - there's precious little else that could be played on modern rock radio. (Possibly "Idioteque", if your radio station is progressive enough. Actually, "Everything In Its Right Place" is probably worth a try. Cool synth line on this song. Even if Thom is singing about lemons.) Capitol Records (Parlophone in the UK?) must be absolutely having a aneurysm about this one. (^_^) The CD art is very interesting. The main booklet appears to be creased on purpose. There's a triangular fold that's visible from the front. Inside there's a lot of art reminiscent of the front cover on a number of fold-out pages, and translucent paper stock. There's also a second book of art - but you're gonna have to find that one on your own. (^_^). This book is comprised mostly of words, plus weird pictures of cartoon cats, with sharp teeth. (There's also a more expensive "Special Edition" that looks like a small book. I bought it, but I'm not gonna open it - so there! (^_^)) Some reviewers have compared this CD to work done by Aphex Twin, and the comparison is not unjust. Some of the songs on here would not sound out of place on Aphex Twin's last couple of releases. No guitars to speak of until, say the fourth song or so. The bottom line: Do I like it? Hmmm. It's tough to answer that question. I really want to like it, just because it is the total antithesis of Brittany Spears, 98 Degrees, et al. I definitely appreciate it. But, it just hasn't grabbed me. Let me mull it over a few days before I give a final answer. Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V3 #300 *******************************