From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V3 #209 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Friday, July 7 2000 Volume 03 : Number 209 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Damage Manual ["giluz" ] Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes [MarkBursa@aol.c] RE: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes ["Ciscon, Ray" ] The Chemical Clitheroes [Alan Gray ] Re: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [MarkBursa@aol.com] RE: The Chemical Clitheroes ["Ciscon, Ray" ] Re: Damage Manual [Chris.Ray@medas.co.uk] RE: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ["giluz" ] Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in theSta tes [Dave Walker ] Re: The last day's of good American Radio ["Katherine Pouliot" ] RE: The last day's of good American Radio ["giluz" ] RE: The Chemical Clitheroes ["Andrew Lumbard" ] Re: The last day's of good American Radio ["Katherine Pouliot" ] Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes ["lucifersam" ] Re: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ["lucifersam" ] Re: Eighties Stations ["tube disaster" ] Re: Eighties Stations [Rob Warnock ] Re: Eighties Stations ["tube disaster" ] RE: The Chemical Clitheroes [Alistair Tear ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 13:09:48 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: Damage Manual Check out this cool Damage Manual flash site at http://www.invisiblerecords.com/ giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 09:14:27 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes Ray, << I'm a big fan of the Prodigy's last album, 'Fat of the Land'. >> Apparently they had originally intended to retitle the US version of the album 'Land of the Fat' Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 08:45:59 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: RE: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes Mark Bursa wrote: Ray, << I'm a big fan of the Prodigy's last album, 'Fat of the Land'. >> Apparently they had originally intended to retitle the US version of the album 'Land of the Fat' Hey! I resemble that remark! :) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 09:28:43 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: RE: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the States Giluz wrote: If you try to analyse Firestarter and Breathe, you will find the same old punk-rock songs elements which are mainstream today, especially in the US. I don't mind combining vocals with electronics (even though I prefer it to be instrumental), but I don't think the comparison between Fat of the Land and Chemical Bros., Moby and their like is accurate. The Chemical Bros. use vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and also as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of trashy hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). Moby is trying to create a new kind of post-electronic song writing. With the Prodigy I got the feeling that the vocals addition was a step backwards instead of forwards. Take the playback off and replace it with analogue guitars and drums and you'll basically have the same songs. You can't even imagine trying to do that with the Chemical Bros and Moby. ===================================================== I don't completely agree with you... You have a point on your example of los Bros. Chem.'s "Hey Girl Hey Boy", but that song got ZERO radio play in the US, and thus has ZERO chance to influence anyone who has no other way of hearing that song. You can't tell me that you think that the vocal's for 'Let Forever Be' are 'just another sound effect', or 'another electronic instrument'. Let's be honest, the vocal's on that particular song was an attempt at generating a hit in the US, where instrumental music just doesn't make the charts. Someone may hear 'Let Forever Be', like it, purchase the CD, and discover all of the other wonderful cuts on that release... but they've got to make that initial connection. Perhaps it's my fault for not bringing it up, but you're also forgetting that the average American radio listener still doesn't think that electronica can 'ROCK'... I've got reasonably intelligent, adult friends who think that any band that doesn't consist of two guitars, bass, and drums isn't a rock band, and that synthesizers suck... but then again, these friends don't listen to anything recorded after 1980, and live in a 'classic rock' haze. ==================================================================== > Most people in the US haven't heard of Kraftwerk, Orbital, Aphex > Twin, Juno > Reactor, Utah Saints, Squarepusher, The Orb, and many other electronica > artists that have had a modicum of success in the UK or Europe > because they > can't get any airplay at all here. > > So remember, you may not particularly care for the 'vocalized' version of > the Prodigy, but when all you hear is the Dave Matthews Band, Metallica, > Matchbox 20, etc. the Prodigy is a delightful change of pace. That's a completely different subject. Radio is crap everywhere I've ever been to (even though rumours say that US radio is the crappiest - I don't know, never been there). It's nice when you have something better than Metallica played on the radio, and it's even nicer to think that some kids will perhaps get to be acquainted with less commercialised music through it. Still, radio is not everything. For the last 10 years radio has stopped being a source of new music for me. There are lots of alternative sources today, especially via the internet. Even if it were not so, it's not an excuse for making bad music, or even for making something which isn't bad but just a bit worse than what one did before. I would accept it if you just said that you liked vocalised electronics, but I don't accept that argument about reaching more people by making the music more accessible. ================================================================ I'm here to tell you... US Radio is the crappiest! It's worse now than it ever was. Radio in the US is so balkanized that I'm waiting for a Billboard Magazine chart that lists the top 100 for 'Balding men, approaching 40 who don't like heavy metal, and have never heard a song by the Spice Girls, any of the boy bands, or any jail-bait singer'... I would fall into that demographic. For the most part, radio has stopped being a source of new music for me as well. In the last few years, I've heard, and bought, more CD's after hearing MP3's I've downloaded. I actually prefer my electronica sans vocals, or with minimal vocals, i.e. Orbital's 'Halcyon + on + on'. But the thrust of my message was that ANY music that is purely instrumental will NEVER receive airplay in the US. Your statement, "I don't accept that argument about reaching more people by making the music more accessible" flies in the face of logic! Music HAS to have some level of accessibility or it will never reach an audience. Bringing this line of thought full circle back to Wire, I didn't even hear a Wire song until the late 80's when a local station played 'Eardrum Buzz' off of IBTABA. Enjoying the pop accessibility of the song, I bought that CD, then went out and bought the rest of Wire's back catalog. If it wasn't for the accessibility of songs like 'Eardrum Buzz', 'Ahead', and 'Kidney Bingos', I'd never learn to enjoy the esoteric and inaccessible 'Up to the Sun', 'Drill', or 'Free Falling Divisions'. I hope that makes my point a little clearer. > > Cheers, > > Ray Ciscon > > Go White Sox! The best team in Baseball! > giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 18:12:39 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > > If it hadn't have been for The Ramones, there wouldn't have been a Sex > Pistols or the Clash. And, if it hadn't have been for The Stooges, there > wouldn't have been The Ramones. > That's something that goes throughout the history of rock - the British ripping off American music that no-one in America listened to (well, hardly no-one, I know that there are some good people out there as well). 10 or 20 years later, it's reinvented in America and goes big time, but by that time it's neither new nor interesting. Needless to say that the original artists who got ripped-off in the first place don't get their much deserved recognition and/or cash. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 16:40:43 +-100 From: Alan Gray Subject: The Chemical Clitheroes >>The Chemical Bros. use >>vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and also >>as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of trashy >>hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious >>example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). Damn! so its not Jimmy Clitheroe on vocals after all. Alan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 11:45:35 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Giluz << That's something that goes throughout the history of rock - the British ripping off American music that no-one in America listened to (well, hardly no-one, I know that there are some good people out there as well). 10 or 20 years later, it's reinvented in America and goes big time, but by that time it's neither new nor interesting. Needless to say that the original artists who got ripped-off in the first place don't get their much deserved recognition and/or cash. >> I wouldn't say it was all one-way traffic. While the original roots of the rock'n'roll tree are in the US with the blues, country music was a pretty essential part of the mix and you can trace a lot of those roots back to English folk music. In the 60s you had a situation where British bands were picking up on the Blues and playing speeded up, pop versions. these bands - the Stones, Them and (especially) the Yardbirds - were then picked up by bored American teenagers, creating the 60s garage rock/punk scene. Bands like the Stooges and the MC5 - direct influences on 70s punk - came directly from the 60s US garage rock scene. In the 70s you had bands like the New York Dolls who fused the Stooges rock with Glam - a VERY British phenomenon - and this led directly to the Sex Pistols etc. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 11:02:34 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: RE: The Chemical Clitheroes Who, or what is a Jimmy Clitheroe? Cheers, Ray Ciscon Remote Office LAN/WAN Support Manager Comark, Inc. In order to provide the best level of support, please contact: The I.S. Support Center at extension 4357 ** Every support call should begin with a call to the I. S. Support Center. ** -----Original Message----- From: Alan Gray [mailto:alan.gray@twa-group.com] Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 11:41 AM To: 'idealcopy@smoe.org' Subject: The Chemical Clitheroes >>The Chemical Bros. use >>vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and also >>as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of trashy >>hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious >>example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). Damn! so its not Jimmy Clitheroe on vocals after all. Alan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 17:11:09 +0100 From: Chris.Ray@medas.co.uk Subject: Re: Damage Manual And the Mean Fiddler has a nice intro too: http://www.meanfiddler.com Chris. "giluz" on 06/07/2000 12:09:48 To: "IdealCopy" cc: (bcc: Chris Ray/Finance/MEDAS) Subject: Damage Manual Check out this cool Damage Manual flash site at http://www.invisiblerecords.com/ giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 19:16:17 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, I didn't mean like REALLY ripping-off. All these brits musicians were real fans of their American predecessors. The nicest thing was that nothing was actually copied, cause the transfer from one culture to another caused lots of unexpected changes. Looking at it from a musical point of view, the musical structures of 50's rockabilly and 70's punk don't have many differences, but so many nuances have been added to it that it turned into something completely new. Of course it wasn't a one-way exchange, as there are lots of British influences on American music as well, but the American public has always been more conservative than the British, and took more time to digest the new musical innovations, and this always pissed me off. It all comes down to the kind of boring mainstream that we have today. In the early 80's in Britain, for example, you could find good songs that actually reached the top 20 in the charts. I don't think that kinda thing happened in the States since the 60's. giluz > -----Original Message----- > From: george.m.hook@ac.com [mailto:george.m.hook@ac.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 5:18 PM > To: giluz > Subject: RE: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > > > > Well, I prefer the term cross-cultural exchange. I guess Zep was sued by > Willie Dixon's estate the other day, for ripping off his stuff. > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 12:18:02 -0400 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in theSta tes lucifersam wrote: > All i would say Ray, Is that "Fat of the Land" is techno by numbers. > "The Fat of the Land" is not techno. -d.w. crotchety Detroiter ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 19:25:16 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here inthe States Ray wrote: > I don't completely agree with you... You have a point on your > example of los > Bros. Chem.'s "Hey Girl Hey Boy", but that song got ZERO radio play in the > US, and thus has ZERO chance to influence anyone who has no other way of > hearing that song. > > You can't tell me that you think that the vocal's for 'Let Forever Be' are > 'just another sound effect', or 'another electronic instrument'. Let's be > honest, the vocal's on that particular song was an attempt at generating a > hit in the US, where instrumental music just doesn't make the charts. > Someone may hear 'Let Forever Be', like it, purchase the CD, and discover > all of the other wonderful cuts on that release... but they've got to make > that initial connection. > > Perhaps it's my fault for not bringing it up, but you're also forgetting > that the average American radio listener still doesn't think that > electronica can 'ROCK'... I've got reasonably intelligent, adult > friends who > think that any band that doesn't consist of two guitars, bass, and drums > isn't a rock band, and that synthesizers suck... but then again, these > friends don't listen to anything recorded after 1980, and live in > a 'classic > rock' haze. Well, OK, you've certainly got a few points there. Maybe it's hard for me to understand this, 'cause Israel is much closer to Europe as far as electronics go. Chemical Bros., Prodigy, Orbital and all of those electronics artists are quite big in Israel. Still, most of it is not due to extensive airplay these bands got on the radio, because they didn't. I have to admit that I had a problem with instrumental tracks myself, till I got into electronics, but that's something completely different - pre-electronics instrumental tracks being more fusion/jazz/muzak stuff. "Let Forever Be" and "Out of Control" are definitely hits targeted towards the US, or just people who are not electronics enthusiasts. I was really disapointed when I heard the Surrender for the first few times. I thought it had the same attitude as "Land of the Fat". After listening to it a few more times and seeing the Bros. at the Lowlands Festival last year, I found out I was wrong. Even those two songs are more than just hits. they might be more accessible, but they're far more exciting than what Prodigy did with their attempt at commercialism. > ==================================================================== > > Your statement, "I don't accept that argument about reaching more > people by > making the music more accessible" flies in the face of logic! Music HAS to > have some level of accessibility or it will never reach an audience. > Bringing this line of thought full circle back to Wire, I didn't > even hear a > Wire song until the late 80's when a local station played > 'Eardrum Buzz' off > of IBTABA. Enjoying the pop accessibility of the song, I bought that CD, > then went out and bought the rest of Wire's back catalog. If it wasn't for > the accessibility of songs like 'Eardrum Buzz', 'Ahead', and 'Kidney > Bingos', I'd never learn to enjoy the esoteric and inaccessible 'Up to the > Sun', 'Drill', or 'Free Falling Divisions'. > > I hope that makes my point a little clearer. > I discovered lots of esoteric artists through their more accessible songs played on the radio as well. The problem is that most musicians don't write commercial songs for the purpose of finding new audiences that will then buy their more obscure stuff as well. They usually do it for more basic reasons, such as money. If they make it, they usually keep on doing that same commercial stuff and stop being interesting. Lots of my musical discoveries were due to more commercial stuff heard via the radio. I think it stopped working that way since the 90's. I don't know why but that's how I feel about it. Anyone like to comment on that? giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 11:21:26 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: The last day's of good American Radio Giluz wrote: Yeah, I didn't mean like REALLY ripping-off. All these brits musicians were real fans of their American predecessors. The nicest thing was that nothing was actually copied, cause the transfer from one culture to another caused lots of unexpected changes. Looking at it from a musical point of view, the musical structures of 50's rockabilly and 70's punk don't have many differences, but so many nuances have been added to it that it turned into something completely new. Of course it wasn't a one-way exchange, as there are lots of British influences on American music as well, but the American public has always been more conservative than the British, and took more time to digest the new musical innovations, and this always pissed me off. It all comes down to the kind of boring mainstream that we have today. In the early 80's in Britain, for example, you could find good songs that actually reached the top 20 in the charts. I don't think that kinda thing happened in the States since the 60's. ======================================== Actually, that kind of thing hasn't happened in the US since the mid 1970's, when Kraftwerk's 'Autobahn' actually charted in the Top 40, and a heavily modified single got decent airplay on AM radio. The internet and MP3's are the only thing that gets me to listen to 'new' music these days... thank god for that! Cheers, Ray Ciscon ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 13:17:58 -0400 From: "Katherine Pouliot" Subject: Re: The last day's of good American Radio > The internet and MP3's are the only thing that gets me to listen to 'new' > music these days... thank god for that! > > Cheers, > > Ray Ciscon Ray, I agree with you on that! Although I don't think that all radio stations are a complete waste. There are a lot of stations out there playing a mix of things, a few good songs a day, and that is about it, in my opinion. I also try to listen to the new music shows (for non top-40 music) and I try to tape 120 minutes when I can, and skim through to find things I like. Almost every music store has listening stations now, too, which are a good place to find something that looks interesting and listen to it. I've found a few good CDs that way in the past few years. I also have the radio toolbar up on my MSIE on the pc at work, which lets me choose from stations all over the world. Any recommendations from anyone?? I believe that we have to glean what we can from the entire gamut, and try not to shut too much out, otherwise, it can get very limiting! kath Katherine Pouliot kep99@hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 20:54:56 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: The last day's of good American Radio > I believe that we have to glean what we can from the entire gamut, and try > not to shut too much out, otherwise, it can get very limiting! > > kath > > Katherine Pouliot > kep99@hotmail.com Yeah, and also recommend new CD's that we buy. Now, let's all hold hands and pray for universal love and unity... giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 21:13:53 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: The last day's of good American Radio Nothing against it personally, just a touch of bad humour, no offence intended. And I was serious about the recommendations stuff. Can't help you there, I'm afraid, cause my last purchases were Neu, recommended by you people. giluz > -----Original Message----- > From: george.m.hook@ac.com [mailto:george.m.hook@ac.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 7:54 PM > To: giluz > Subject: RE: The last day's of good American Radio > > > > Hey, what's so funny about peace, love, and understanding?????? > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 19:17:33 +0100 From: "Andrew Lumbard" Subject: RE: The Chemical Clitheroes No, but I'm sure it's Olive from On The Buses behind the mixing desk. Damn, showing my age again.:) AndyL - -----Original Message----- From: owner-idealcopy@smoe.org [mailto:owner-idealcopy@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Alan Gray Sent: 06 July 2000 18:41 To: 'idealcopy@smoe.org' Subject: The Chemical Clitheroes >>The Chemical Bros. use >>vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and also >>as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of trashy >>hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious >>example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). Damn! so its not Jimmy Clitheroe on vocals after all. Alan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 21:11:32 +0100 From: "ian barrett" Subject: Newman on Boxman Just checking out on Boxman under Colin Newman and alongside Not To/Singing Fish they have a vinyl release listed, entitled 'Newman,' label listed as Southern Record Dist, release date 14/6/99, genre 'Dance,' for £8.99. Which one is this? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 17:04:58 -0400 From: "Katherine Pouliot" Subject: Re: The last day's of good American Radio No offense taken. I'm probably worse than you are at giving recommendations for new CDs. A friend recommended the new Groove Armada, and I had bought the new Sinead O'Connor, as I'm a fan, but can't say I really like it that much. Way too different than the first CD she put out when she was still all angry. Other than that, sheesh, I gotta search! Katherine - ----- Original Message ----- From: giluz To: IdealCopy ; Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 3:13 PM Subject: RE: The last day's of good American Radio > Nothing against it personally, just a touch of bad humour, no offence > intended. And I was serious about the recommendations stuff. Can't help you > there, I'm afraid, cause my last purchases were Neu, recommended by you > people. > > giluz > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: george.m.hook@ac.com [mailto:george.m.hook@ac.com] > > Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 7:54 PM > > To: giluz > > Subject: RE: The last day's of good American Radio > > > > > > > > Hey, what's so funny about peace, love, and understanding?????? > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 17:45:30 -0500 From: george.m.hook@ac.com Subject: Eighties Stations Just curious, fellow Wire enthusiasts. Is anyone out there familiar with the new Eighties radio station format? Do you have one in your city (UK and other points beyond included)? I just discovered the one in Chicago (103.1) and I will have to admit, I enjoy the mindless fun. Maybe because silly summer season is upon us. Thompson Twins, Devo, Cindy Lauper, FOSL, Duran Duran ... all those wacky acts we debate on this line are being played on this station. Haven't heard any Wire yet (or Heaven 17's We Don't Need that Fascist Groove Thing). I had forgotten that the Dazz Band had their own "Whip It" song ..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 19:03:53 -0400 From: Carl Archer Subject: Re: The last day's of good American Radio http://www.cracknation.com/flash/newcrackpage2.html Acumen nation. Good stuff. Heard it on Princeton University's radio station. Check out www.wprb.com for a Real Audio streaming version which can be heard anywhere. - -Carl > From: "Katherine Pouliot" > Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 13:17:58 -0400 > To: "Ciscon, Ray" , "IdealCopy" > Subject: Re: The last day's of good American Radio > > >> The internet and MP3's are the only thing that gets me to listen to 'new' >> music these days... thank god for that! >> >> Cheers, >> >> Ray Ciscon > > Ray, > I agree with you on that! Although I don't think that all radio stations > are a complete waste. There are a lot of stations out there playing a mix > of things, a few good songs a day, and that is about it, in my opinion. I > also try to listen to the new music shows (for non top-40 music) and I try > to tape 120 minutes when I can, and skim through to find things I like. > Almost every music store has listening stations now, too, which are a good > place to find something that looks interesting and listen to it. I've found > a few good CDs that way in the past few years. I also have the radio > toolbar up on my MSIE on the pc at work, which lets me choose from stations > all over the world. Any recommendations from anyone?? > > I believe that we have to glean what we can from the entire gamut, and try > not to shut too much out, otherwise, it can get very limiting! > > kath > > Katherine Pouliot > kep99@hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 23:10:41 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes Bravo sir! Very good...hee hee........ - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 2:14 PM Subject: Re: Your Missing the Point on the Prodigy... at least here in the Sta tes > Ray, > > << I'm a big fan of the Prodigy's last album, 'Fat of the Land'. >> > > Apparently they had originally intended to retitle the US version of the > album 'Land of the Fat' > > Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 23:20:21 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: The Chemical Clitheroes You really dont wanna know Ray! - ----- Original Message ----- From: Ciscon, Ray To: Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 5:02 PM Subject: RE: The Chemical Clitheroes > Who, or what is a Jimmy Clitheroe? > > Cheers, > > Ray Ciscon > Remote Office LAN/WAN Support Manager > Comark, Inc. > > In order to provide the best level of support, please contact: > The I.S. Support Center at extension 4357 > ** Every support call should begin with a call to the I. S. Support Center. > ** > > -----Original Message----- > From: Alan Gray [mailto:alan.gray@twa-group.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 11:41 AM > To: 'idealcopy@smoe.org' > Subject: The Chemical Clitheroes > > >>The Chemical Bros. use > >>vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and > also > >>as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of trashy > >>hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious > >>example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). > > Damn! so its not Jimmy Clitheroe on vocals after all. > > Alan > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 23:23:33 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Personally, I dont think that The Sex Pistols have anything to do with The Ramones. They were far better, much more intelligent (in Lydon & Maclaren) and in a different league. The Ramones were, none the less, brilliant! - ----- Original Message ----- From: giluz To: IdealCopy Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 5:12 PM Subject: RE: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > > > > If it hadn't have been for The Ramones, there wouldn't have been a Sex > > Pistols or the Clash. And, if it hadn't have been for The Stooges, there > > wouldn't have been The Ramones. > > > > That's something that goes throughout the history of rock - the British > ripping off American music that no-one in America listened to (well, hardly > no-one, I know that there are some good people out there as well). 10 or 20 > years later, it's reinvented in America and goes big time, but by that time > it's neither new nor interesting. Needless to say that the original artists > who got ripped-off in the first place don't get their much deserved > recognition and/or cash. > > giluz > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 23:26:21 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re Londons burning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is of course the same new york dolls who wanted desperatley to be the 'Stones.... > > In the 70s you had bands like the New York Dolls who fused the Stooges rock > with Glam - a VERY British phenomenon - and this led directly to the Sex > Pistols etc. > > Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 20:47:44 -0400 From: Katherine Pouliot Subject: Re: Eighties Stations Much to the delight of many on this list just waiting to whip me into shape, I would love to have one of those 'eighties format' radio stations here. I was a teenager in the 80's and love a lot of that music, including AFOS, etc. I would be surprised if they play Wire at all, I never ever heard Wire on the radio, only on Mtv back in the Kidney Bingos days. I will see if I can get that station on the radio internet thingie on my pc at work... Eighties rule!!! hahhaa Katherine > From: george.m.hook@ac.com > Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 17:45:30 -0500 > To: idealcopy@smoe.org > Cc: idealcopy@smoe.org > Subject: Eighties Stations > > Just curious, fellow Wire enthusiasts. Is anyone out there familiar with > the new Eighties radio station format? Do you have one in your city (UK > and other points beyond included)? I just discovered the one in Chicago > (103.1) and I will have to admit, I enjoy the mindless fun. Maybe because > silly summer season is upon us. Thompson Twins, Devo, Cindy Lauper, FOSL, > Duran Duran ... all those wacky acts we debate on this line are being > played on this station. Haven't heard any Wire yet (or Heaven 17's We > Don't Need that Fascist Groove Thing). I had forgotten that the Dazz Band > had their own "Whip It" song ..... > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 20:11:11 -0700 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: Eighties Stations >Just curious, fellow Wire enthusiasts. Is anyone out there familiar with >the new Eighties radio station format? Do you have one in your city (UK >and other points beyond included)? I just discovered the one in Chicago >(103.1) As it happens, I found that one (or maybe a predecessor with the same format) on my dial while driving into the city last November for the Buzzcocks. Memphis' "commercial alternative" station added a heaping helping of '80s to their mix last year sometime, though I rarely get over there anymore (it's 2 hours up the interstate -- only time I've been there in the last 6 months was for a Jazz Butcher gig). Coming back from Yo La Tengo's Nashville show about 3 months ago, though, I got an earful of blasts from the past, none of which I can really remember now ... other than Ian Dury's Hit Me With Your Rhythm Stick, which I'd never heard on the radio before. (Dunno if the person who picked the song knew it, but I learned within the next 24 hours that Dury had just died.) *May* have heard the Flying Lizards' version of Money, which after all came close to making the Top 40 here. and I will have to admit, I enjoy the mindless fun. Maybe because >silly summer season is upon us. Thompson Twins, Devo, Cindy Lauper, FOSL, >Duran Duran ... all those wacky acts we debate on this line are being >played on this station. Haven't heard any Wire yet (or Heaven 17's We >Don't Need that Fascist Groove Thing). I had forgotten that the Dazz Band >had their own "Whip It" song ..... Which was called, if memory serves, Let It Whip. I've got the 7" tucked away somewhere. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 21:49:04 -0500 From: Rob Warnock Subject: Re: Eighties Stations I think the only time you're likely to hear anything even close to Wire or Heaven 17 on 103.1 is at 10 o'clock on weeknights. They have a show called The Deep End where they play "more alternative" stuff. I've only heard it a couple of times, but it sounded pretty good. At least you don't have to hear things like Rockwell or Night Ranger like you would during the day. - -Rob- george.m.hook@ac.com wrote: > > Just curious, fellow Wire enthusiasts. Is anyone out there familiar with > the new Eighties radio station format? Do you have one in your city (UK > and other points beyond included)? I just discovered the one in Chicago > (103.1) and I will have to admit, I enjoy the mindless fun. Maybe because > silly summer season is upon us. Thompson Twins, Devo, Cindy Lauper, FOSL, > Duran Duran ... all those wacky acts we debate on this line are being > played on this station. Haven't heard any Wire yet (or Heaven 17's We > Don't Need that Fascist Groove Thing). I had forgotten that the Dazz Band > had their own "Whip It" song ..... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 20:44:57 -0700 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: Eighties Stations >Much to the delight of many on this list just waiting to whip me into shape, >I would love to have one of those 'eighties format' radio stations here. I >was a teenager in the 80's Whereas I wasn't, so I don't know what my excuse is. Maybe because I was still in "student mode," having stayed in grad school till 5/84, at which point things became much drearier -- no doubt because I moved back to my rural SW Arkansas home & left behind all traces of even half-decent radio, real record shops, etc. *sigh* What a rude introduction to the real world ... Dan and love a lot of that music, including AFOS, >etc. I would be surprised if they play Wire at all, I never ever heard Wire >on the radio, only on Mtv back in the Kidney Bingos days. I will see if I >can get that station on the radio internet thingie on my pc at work... > >Eighties rule!!! hahhaa > >Katherine > >> From: george.m.hook@ac.com >> Date: Thu, 6 Jul 2000 17:45:30 -0500 >> To: idealcopy@smoe.org >> Cc: idealcopy@smoe.org >> Subject: Eighties Stations >> >> Just curious, fellow Wire enthusiasts. Is anyone out there familiar with >> the new Eighties radio station format? Do you have one in your city (UK >> and other points beyond included)? I just discovered the one in Chicago >> (103.1) and I will have to admit, I enjoy the mindless fun. Maybe because >> silly summer season is upon us. Thompson Twins, Devo, Cindy Lauper, FOSL, >> Duran Duran ... all those wacky acts we debate on this line are being >> played on this station. Haven't heard any Wire yet (or Heaven 17's We >> Don't Need that Fascist Groove Thing). I had forgotten that the Dazz Band >> had their own "Whip It" song ..... >> >> > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2000 08:40:52 -0000 From: Alistair Tear Subject: RE: The Chemical Clitheroes Dear Ray, You're gonna be sorry you asked! regards, Alistair > -----Original Message----- > From: Ciscon, Ray [SMTP:RCiscon@comark.com] > Sent: 06 July 2000 16:03 > To: 'idealcopy@smoe.org' > Subject: RE: The Chemical Clitheroes > >Who, or what is a Jimmy Clitheroe? >Cheers, >Ray Ciscon > Remote Office LAN/WAN Support Manager > Comark, Inc. > > In order to provide the best level of support, please contact: > The I.S. Support Center at extension 4357 > ** Every support call should begin with a call to the I. S. Support > Center. > ** > > -----Original Message----- > From: Alan Gray [mailto:alan.gray@twa-group.com] > Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 11:41 AM > To: 'idealcopy@smoe.org' > Subject: The Chemical Clitheroes > > >>The Chemical Bros. use > >>vocals just as another sound effect, another electronic instrument, and > also > >>as a kinda post-modern commentary on pop music. You've got lots of > trashy > >>hyper-commercialised elements like this in Surrender (the most obvious > >>example being the oscillators in "Hey Girl Hey Boy"). > > Damn! so its not Jimmy Clitheroe on vocals after all. > > Alan > ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V3 #209 *******************************