From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V3 #162 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Tuesday, May 30 2000 Volume 03 : Number 162 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re[2]: lewis video etc [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: The Garage? ["lucifersam" ] Re: The Garage? [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: Re: LuciferSam.....Old Bloke..... ["lucifersam" ] Re: The Garage? [Carl Archer ] Re: Fwd: Re: LuciferSam.....Old Bloke..... ["Laurel G" ] Re: music from the '70s ["lucifersam" ] blimey! [Katherine P ] Re: blimey! ["tube disaster" ] Re: music from the '70s ["Laurel G" ] Re: Wire Onion Interview [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: blimey! ["Laurel G" ] Re: blimey! ["marlon" ] Re: music from the '70s ["stephen graziano" ] Re: blimey! ["stephen graziano" ] Faust / Post-Rock ["giluz" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 12:51:15 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: lewis video etc i think everyone was too busy sniggering at mr westwood to bother taking him on. probably best just to hand him plenty of rope.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: lewis video etc Author: MIME:mshort@lucent.com at INTERNET Date: 26/05/2000 18:48 paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > > ps anyone see tim westwood on the jo whiley show :-) A prize tosser. It's a shame that Jo Whiley didn't challenge any of the crap he was spouting. (For the record TW was talking about his recent elevation to Rap's Hall Of Fame, having recently "taken a bullet" as they say on the street.) > > pps can't wait for tomorrow night ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:10:00 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: The Garage? What a cock up that was...... The Garage opened it's doors at 8pm....dig?? The place stays open untill 2am.....dig???? Expect the band on at about 9.30-10.00pm....??? Got to the venue at 9.45pm........dig???? The bastards had been on stage for an hour..... Obviously old people need to get to bed early..... AAAAAAGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH.... "Another the Letter" played at 100MPH... Saw the last 3 songs plus the encore.......... Played a great tune that I dont know, sorta dub acid weird noises and stuff......... Did another one I didn't know sounded like Faust.. Ever heard "Krautrock"?...Like that on acid....... They looked really old....but I aint seen 'em for 21 years..!!!!!Dont s'pose I'm that pretty anymore! The End....Le Cat Siamese - ----- Original Message ----- From: ian barrett To: Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2000 12:59 PM Subject: The Garage? > Come on folks, there are some unfortunates among us who are only going to > experience the Garage vicariously.... > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 09:05:40 EDT From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Re: The Garage? Cat, << Played a great tune that I dont know, sorta dub acid weird noises and stuff.........>> It was 'Go ahead', the B-side of Map Ref.... Totally unexpected and absolutely made my night.... Robert on funky drums, Bruce on bass, Lewis on cheapo sampler and Colin on syndrum and vocals (from a lyric sheet). How's that for a 'beat combo'.... >>Did another one I didn't know sounded like Faust.. Ever heard "Krautrock"?...Like that on acid....... >> A deranged and largely instrumental 'Drill'.... Both of which you would have missed if you only went on Sunday. Full report to folllow.....what a tease, eh! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:58:49 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re: LuciferSam.....Old Bloke..... A late message regarding age and so to Lucifer Sam that got rerouted.. > And Im 38 and quite proud of it...< I did also see Wire at the Notre Dame Hall but then supported by Manicured > Noice and The The.< Styx and Kansas was among them) < saved me from symf rock - White Riot, Peaches and God save the queen. < 3 crackers to be sure Mats. But > the only concert I saw was Ultravox - but in those days it was something > extraordinary. < All the best > Mats > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 11:11:07 EDT From: "Kathy P" Subject: RE: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... >From: "giluz" >To: "IdealCopy" >Subject: RE: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... >Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 11:27:01 +0200 >Yeah, and the thing about raves, contrary to what we were used to at gigs, >is that most places think about people that just want to hang out without >dancing or just take a break from dancing. So they provide chill out rooms >and things like that. I know lots of people around my age that just do >that, >and the atmosphere is really infectious and people on E are really nice and >easy to communicate with even when you're not on drugs. The music itself is >something that has to be experienced in a club/rave context. It added a lot >to my understanding of that whole electronic music thing, and it's really >really fun. So age shouldn't concern you when it comes to raves. > >giluz Sounds great - like I said before, I just have to find where they are happening and find some of my friends to check it out with me. Everyone I know goes to bed before midnight now! haha Katherine > ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:17:08 -0400 From: Carl Archer Subject: Re: The Garage? They did Go Ahead? I wish they did that at Irving Plaza. If anybody really loves that song, you should really buy some Tones on Tail stuff. Sounds just like it. > From: MarkBursa@aol.com > Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 09:05:40 EDT > To: lucifersam@supanet.com, idealcopy@smoe.org > Subject: Re: The Garage? > > Cat, > > << Played a great tune that I dont know, sorta dub acid > weird noises and stuff.........>> > > It was 'Go ahead', the B-side of Map Ref.... Totally unexpected and > absolutely made my night.... Robert on funky drums, Bruce on bass, Lewis on > cheapo sampler and Colin on syndrum and vocals (from a lyric sheet). How's > that for a 'beat combo'.... > >>> Did another one I didn't know sounded like Faust.. > Ever heard "Krautrock"?...Like that on acid....... >> > > A deranged and largely instrumental 'Drill'.... > > Both of which you would have missed if you only went on Sunday. > > Full report to folllow.....what a tease, eh! > > Mark ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 13:12:28 CDT From: "Laurel G" Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: LuciferSam.....Old Bloke..... >Styx and Kansas was among them) but I also bought three singles >Mats Styx - saw Styx in a high school gymnasium before they were "big guys" - the question I have is how do you feel about them now? I reserve judgement pending your answer :-) Laurel *still debating Foghat hehe ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 15:21:04 EDT From: "stephen graziano" Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: LuciferSam.....Old Bloke..... I saw Styx around 1979-80. They were the middle of a three band bill. BeBop Deluxe (who I love to this day)(Drastic Plastic Tour), Styx (pompous,overbearing, overpostured midAmerican Progrock) They had a little guy up front, and a big guy who looked like a Wookie. Third band was City Boy whose first two albums I'm still fond of. To me BeBop, City Boy, 10cc, first 5 album Roxy Music,Sparks (Kimono), Queen (albums 1 - Day at the Races)early solo Eno, Nasty Pop, ELO (through New World Record) were the kind of "progressive pop/rock" bands that got me through the mid 70's (of course they were all UK bands, but NY radio used to have a show call "Things from England" on WNEW-FM on Fri. afternoons - mostly chart things, but often the only chance to here these groups. American groups were few and far between - can only think of the Raspberries off hand (Starting Over is a great lost early Who album - also protopunk cf "I Don't Know What I Want, But I Want It Now), oh, and maybe some of the early Beserkly Records people. When punk hit, there was so much fresh new sounds happening that it seemed like the music world was reborn. But even so, I retained my fandom of the above mentioned bands. I always liked people that played with production and melody - heritage of Pet Sounds and Sgt Pepper rather than "muso artistes" like ELP, Floyd (Dark Side on Out), Starcastle, Kansas, Rush, Yes, and their ilk who so dominated American radio in the 70's along with the California sleep mafia of Steely Dan, Eagles, FMac (two girlversion), Jackson Browne, etc. ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 16:16:59 -0400 From: Katherine P Subject: music from the '70s ELO was the second concert I saw ever back in '78 or '79, either that or the first before The Cars. Can't remember, but they were in the same year or so. Both at the Cumberland County Civic Center in Portland, Maine. It was their tour with the album that had a space ship on it -"Out of the Blue". They were in full regalia with cellos, violins, electric keyboards, and an awesome laser show. It was one of the most memorable concerts I ever saw, even to this day. I don't think I would have gotten into electronic music, or knew what it was, if it weren't for those bands, and of course my parents. Not many people out there that I've met who admit they were fans of ELO or The Cars, even. It's nice to see people talking about their past and remembering it in a good light, instead of complaining about it all. Katherine on 5/29/00 3:21 PM, stephen graziano at sjgraziano@hotmail.com wrote: > I saw Styx around 1979-80. They were the middle of a three band bill. > BeBop Deluxe (who I love to this day)(Drastic Plastic Tour), Styx > (pompous,overbearing, overpostured midAmerican Progrock) They had a little > guy up front, and a big guy who looked like a Wookie. Third band was City > Boy whose first two albums I'm still fond of. To me BeBop, City Boy, > 10cc, first 5 album Roxy Music,Sparks (Kimono), Queen (albums 1 - Day at the > Races)early solo Eno, Nasty Pop, ELO (through New World Record) were the > kind of "progressive pop/rock" bands that got me through the mid 70's (of > course they were all UK bands, but NY radio used to have a show call "Things > from England" on WNEW-FM on Fri. afternoons - mostly chart things, but often > the only chance to here these groups. American groups were few and far > between - can only think of the Raspberries off hand (Starting Over is a > great lost early Who album - also protopunk cf "I Don't Know What I Want, > But I Want It Now), oh, and maybe some of the early Beserkly Records people. > When punk hit, there was so much fresh new sounds happening that it seemed > like the music world was reborn. But even so, I retained my fandom of the > above mentioned bands. I always liked people that played with production > and melody - heritage of Pet Sounds and Sgt Pepper rather than "muso > artistes" like ELP, Floyd (Dark Side on Out), Starcastle, Kansas, Rush, Yes, > and their ilk who so dominated American radio in the 70's along with the > California sleep mafia of Steely Dan, Eagles, FMac (two girlversion), > Jackson Browne, etc. > ________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 21:14:21 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: music from the '70s Blimey Katherine...I've heard people like Kraftwerk, or Can or even Bowie and Eno mentioned as influences in Electronic music, but ELO??? Blimey...I think I need to go and lay down...;-) - ----- Original Message ----- From: Katherine P To: ; Sent: Monday, May 29, 2000 9:16 PM Subject: music from the '70s > ELO was the second concert I saw ever back in '78 or '79, either that or the > first before The Cars. Can't remember, but they were in the same year or > so. Both at the Cumberland County Civic Center in Portland, Maine. It was > their tour with the album that had a space ship on it -"Out of the Blue". > They were in full regalia with cellos, violins, electric keyboards, and an > awesome laser show. It was one of the most memorable concerts I ever saw, > even to this day. I don't think I would have gotten into electronic music, > or knew what it was, if it weren't for those bands, and of course my > parents. Not many people out there that I've met who admit they were fans > of ELO or The Cars, even. It's nice to see people talking about their past > and remembering it in a good light, instead of complaining about it all. > > Katherine > > > > on 5/29/00 3:21 PM, stephen graziano at sjgraziano@hotmail.com wrote: > > > I saw Styx around 1979-80. They were the middle of a three band bill. > > BeBop Deluxe (who I love to this day)(Drastic Plastic Tour), Styx > > (pompous,overbearing, overpostured midAmerican Progrock) They had a little > > guy up front, and a big guy who looked like a Wookie. Third band was City > > Boy whose first two albums I'm still fond of. To me BeBop, City Boy, > > 10cc, first 5 album Roxy Music,Sparks (Kimono), Queen (albums 1 - Day at the > > Races)early solo Eno, Nasty Pop, ELO (through New World Record) were the > > kind of "progressive pop/rock" bands that got me through the mid 70's (of > > course they were all UK bands, but NY radio used to have a show call "Things > > from England" on WNEW-FM on Fri. afternoons - mostly chart things, but often > > the only chance to here these groups. American groups were few and far > > between - can only think of the Raspberries off hand (Starting Over is a > > great lost early Who album - also protopunk cf "I Don't Know What I Want, > > But I Want It Now), oh, and maybe some of the early Beserkly Records people. > > When punk hit, there was so much fresh new sounds happening that it seemed > > like the music world was reborn. But even so, I retained my fandom of the > > above mentioned bands. I always liked people that played with production > > and melody - heritage of Pet Sounds and Sgt Pepper rather than "muso > > artistes" like ELP, Floyd (Dark Side on Out), Starcastle, Kansas, Rush, Yes, > > and their ilk who so dominated American radio in the 70's along with the > > California sleep mafia of Steely Dan, Eagles, FMac (two girlversion), > > Jackson Browne, etc. > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 18:48:58 -0400 From: Katherine P Subject: blimey! on 5/29/00 4:14 PM, lucifersam at lucifersam@supanet.com wrote: > Blimey Katherine...I've heard people like Kraftwerk, or Can or even > Bowie and Eno mentioned as influences in Electronic music, but ELO??? > Blimey...I think I need to go and lay down...;-) Don't get too freaked out! haha I used to like Kraftwerk too, when I got a bit older. I don't sit around listening to ELO, I was 8 or 9 years old when I really liked them and saw them live. I don't regret it for a minute. It's important to remember our musical "roots" and otherwise. ELO used some really cool synthesizer stuff and so did The Cars. They did some pioneering, and they deserve credit... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 17:04:22 -0700 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: blimey! Yep. Looking back, ELO were definitely one of the better radio singles acts of the late '70s (which may not be esp. high praise, actually, but take it for what it is). And the Cars' first LP was, for '78, a freakin' pop masterpiece that I find still holds up pretty damned well. (I still remember a review from those days in Creem by, I think, Simon Frith [which means it would've actually been his "Letter From Britain" column], noting a similar, deliberate "coldness" in that LP & something by Wire, possibly Used To, or maybe the entire Chairs Missing LP. He threw someone else into the mix, too, though I can't remember who ... it was a bit early for Gary Numan. The Banshees, perhaps, or Talking Heads.) Dan >on 5/29/00 4:14 PM, lucifersam at lucifersam@supanet.com wrote: > >> Blimey Katherine...I've heard people like Kraftwerk, or Can or even >> Bowie and Eno mentioned as influences in Electronic music, but ELO??? >> Blimey...I think I need to go and lay down...;-) > >Don't get too freaked out! haha I used to like Kraftwerk too, when I got a >bit older. I don't sit around listening to ELO, I was 8 or 9 years old when >I really liked them and saw them live. I don't regret it for a minute. >It's important to remember our musical "roots" and otherwise. ELO used some >really cool synthesizer stuff and so did The Cars. They did some >pioneering, and they deserve credit... > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 18:53:36 CDT From: "Laurel G" Subject: Re: music from the '70s Hi Katherine, >ELO was the second concert I saw ever back in '78 or '79, either that or >the first before The Cars. Could be we saw the same tour - I saw them here in Chicago at the Chicago Theater - I'm trying to get a time frame by who I went with - may have been '77, so maybe they did a couple of tours back to back almost? - can't remember much else about it except the laser show - was very good for the times I was telling someone off list that I saw them two summers ago here at an outdoor festival - tried a light show but doesn't work too well outdoors - not all the original members, but still sounded fairly decent . Not many people out there that I've met who admit they were fans >of ELO or The Cars, even. It's nice to see people talking about their past >and remembering it in a good light, instead of complaining about it all. > >Katherine ditto - although I wasn't a fan of ELO per se - it was a show, we went to every show we could regardless of who was playing, and pretty much enjoyed them all - except Moody Blues, have to admit it was the most boring show I'd ever been to and we walked out about half way through - as we got older we got a bit more discriminating my first "official" concert was Mason Profit with REO Speedwagon opening - think it was 7th or 8th grade at a local skating rink - makes it 71, 72 ish Laurel ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 18:54:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: Wire Onion Interview On Fri, 26 May 2000 VoxxJaguar@aol.com wrote: > Well i sent the Wire interview > from the Onion on 5/24 (to this list) > but it > has yet to appear. > Has the list owner refused it, > or maybe it was too long? I'm not the list owner, so I've no idea whether Miles did anything or the list itself did anything - but in general, it's a very bad idea to post lengthy attachments to mailing lists - esp. when they're already available on the web. Instead, post the URL, and let everyone go there on their own - again, some folks here have limited mailbox space, while others pay for their connections by time - and if you're running only a 28.8 dialup modem, large files (even large text files) take a good long time to load. Thanks for the effort, though: the direct URL is: http://www.theavclub.com/avclub3617/avfeature_3617.html - -j ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 19:09:49 CDT From: "Laurel G" Subject: Re: blimey! > >Don't get too freaked out! haha I used to like Kraftwerk too, when I got a >bit older. I don't sit around listening to ELO, I was 8 or 9 years old >when >I really liked them and saw them live. I don't regret it for a minute. >It's important to remember our musical "roots" and otherwise. ELO used >some >really cool synthesizer stuff and so did The Cars. They did some >pioneering, and they deserve credit... > Absolutely - people forget what times were like then - ELO, for the times - was almost verging on radical around here Laurel *still like Kraftwerk ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 18:39:57 -0700 From: "marlon" Subject: Re: blimey! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Laurel G" To: Sent: Monday, May 29, 2000 5:09 PM Subject: Re: blimey! > Absolutely - people forget what times were like then - ELO, for the times - > was almost verging on radical around here > > Laurel *still like Kraftwerk i agree, ELO was amazing for the time, i still on occasion find myself humming "Larado Tornado" from Eldorado ( IMO their best). sometimes i think in the downpouring of retch called pop, we forget that pop can be great. look at the Beatles, the Buzzcocks. Foo Fighters are great pop. Outdoor Miner is great pop. Princess Tinymeat did my all time fav pop song "Wigs on the Green", it sounded like the end of the world with a dance beat, that careened ever so slightly like a 45 on an old record player. the Names were great pop, Attack of the Mole Men by the Dickies, still gets me up and twisting. pop came be wonderful, when its good. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 22:29:21 EDT From: "stephen graziano" Subject: Re: music from the '70s >From: Katherine P >To: , >Subject: music from the '70s >Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 16:16:59 -0400 > >ELO was the second concert I saw ever back in '78 or '79, It was >their tour with the album that had a space ship on it -"Out of the Blue". >They were in full regalia with cellos, violins, electric keyboards, and an >awesome laser show I was in highschool from 71-75. My best friend's older brother was 2 or three years ahead of us and so went on to college SUNY New Paltz and became a dj at the campus station. Through him I Heard the Move, Incredible String Band, and some others. But the Move wowed me and I rapidly followed up on the member's careers. Roy Wood was with Wizzard, but Lynne had stayed on with ELO. I admit that ELO was probably an idea that sounded better on paper, than reality (in regards to the first album, though it still features some amazing arch/art rock) but by the time they got to Eldorado they made a great psuedoBeatles album. I also loved New World Record but they got more disco-Bee Gees sounding and another case of a band losing the experimental side once they got a taste of public/chart success. As history has borne out Jeff Lynne always wanted to be a Beatle and he finally got his chance with the Wilbury's. If you want a sample of great live ELO, I strongly urge you to listen to "The Night the Light Went Out in Long Beach" recorded back in 1973, a great set. I know that there are some live BBC recordings from the early 70's just released but haven't gotten a chance to hear them. Anybody? ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 22:37:48 EDT From: "stephen graziano" Subject: Re: blimey! >really cool synthesizer stuff and so did The Cars. They did some >pioneering, and they deserve credit... > > First Cars album - produced by Roy Thomas Baker. The closest any American act got to Queen/Eno/Roxy cool thing. Still the defining point of "new wave" ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 10:20:12 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: Faust / Post-Rock > >>> Did another one I didn't know sounded like Faust.. > > Ever heard "Krautrock"?...Like that on acid....... >> > > > > A deranged and largely instrumental 'Drill'.... > > I don't know if anyone's aware of it (and if they do they probably don't care) but Faust still exist - they reformed a few years ago and started releasing albums and touring again. I'd recommend their last one, Ravivando, which is a very dark heavy improvised session. To anyone expecting the old "soft" Faust songs, like Picnic on a Frozen River (I think it was called) forget it. They're not into that kind of stuff right now. Different subject: I just bought Silo's Instar (produced by Colin) and I'm quite enthusiastic. Anyone familliar with the Swim Team CD probably knows Templates and Bulk - well, it's sort of the same, only more rhythmically complicated (they love using copmplex rhythms like 5/8, 15/16, etc.), very monotonous, but in a hypnotic way. Which brings me back to the subject of Post Rock: I mean, I know it's just this labelling shit, but what's the real difference between this kind of music and pre-electronic stuff which was also repetitive and hypnotic, like the krautrock bands of the 70's, for example? giluz ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V3 #162 *******************************