From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V3 #158 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Friday, May 26 2000 Volume 03 : Number 158 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... ["lucifersam" ] Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... ["lucifersam" ] wiremailorder.com update ["webmaster" ] Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... ["stephen graziano" ] Re: The Onion [VoxxJaguar@aol.com] RE: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... ["Ciscon, Ray" ] Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... ["Katherine Pouliot" ] Re: FZ on CD ["Steve Loubert" ] Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... ["lucifersam" Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... Jerry Lewis was a child molester and a racist! end of story. I've never been a great lover of Elvis Costello, I realise that his word play is that of a genius and if anything would class him as one of the 20th centuries great 'poets'. "Alison" of course was, along with "Perfect Day" the greatest love song ever written! > > Yeah, Jerry Lee Lewis was always a geezer, anyway. I mean, a Lolita cousin > proved to be his downfall even when he was "of age." How do you think > Elvis Costello is holding up? > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 11:02:56 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... > As for Dance music, I find the whole culture overbearing....there was a > fundamental shift (not surprisingly, during the Thatcher years) when "the > kids" stopped thinking, and rebelling, and just "wanted to dance", as > release/escape from the grind... < good as Cabaret Voltaire to these ears, despite "advances" in technology. < anything but a very bad thing (see my earlier posts on Death in Vegas). << All I would say to this Mark is...Do you remember 'Old' Hippies like Bob Harris and the rest saying " But they cant play properly" when "Anarchy in the UK" came out???? > > I'm starting to sound like an old reactionary....< > Yeah, Jerry Lee Lewis was always a geezer, anyway. I mean, a Lolita cousin > proved to be his downfall even when he was "of age." How do you think > Elvis Costello is holding up? > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 14:16:00 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: RE: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... > Jerry Lewis was a child molester and a racist! end of story. Yeah, but musicwise he was a genius - much better than Elvis (Presly, that is). giluz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:17:22 +0100 From: Mark Short Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... lucifersam wrote: > > Jerry Lewis was a child molester and a racist! end of story. > I've never been a great lover of Elvis Costello, I realise that > his word play is that of a genius and if anything would class > him as one of the 20th centuries great 'poets'. "Alison" of course > was, along with "Perfect Day" the greatest love song ever > written! > > > > > Yeah, Jerry Lee Lewis was always a geezer, anyway. I mean, a Lolita > cousin > > proved to be his downfall even when he was "of age." How do you think > > Elvis Costello is holding up? > > Didn't Costello get punched out in bar in America, because he'd made a racist remark about Ray Charles? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 13:31:20 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... Didn't Costello get punched out in bar in America, because he'd made a racist remark about Ray Charles? >>>> yep , he told one of steven still's roadies that rc was "nothing but a blind nigger" to get a reaction ; he got one. he tells the story openly now with a lot of regret.p ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:43:42 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... Sorry chaps. Rock'n'Roll always left me cold. So i wont comment. - ----- Original Message ----- From: giluz To: IdealCopy Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 1:16 PM Subject: RE: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... > > Jerry Lewis was a child molester and a racist! end of story. > > Yeah, but musicwise he was a genius - much better than Elvis (Presly, that > is). > giluz > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:46:38 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... I have heard this story, but I cant believe that Elvis C. is a racist. Not taking into account his work over the years and his obvious leftist leanings. Maybe he was mis-quoted? Dunno. I wouldn't like to say. Le Cat Siamese. > Didn't Costello get punched out in bar in America, because he'd made a racist > remark about Ray Charles? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:53:20 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re[2]: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... er , isn't "perfect day" about smack? << Well I suppose you could "feed ducks in the park" with a needle hanging out of your arm!! LOL Actually, I suppose it's compulsorary in Central Park!!! hee hee ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... Author: MIME:lucifersam@supanet.com at INTERNET Date: 25/05/2000 12:39 Jerry Lewis was a child molester and a racist! end of story. I've never been a great lover of Elvis Costello, I realise that his word play is that of a genius and if anything would class him as one of the 20th centuries great 'poets'. "Alison" of course was, along with "Perfect Day" the greatest love song ever written! > > Yeah, Jerry Lee Lewis was always a geezer, anyway. I mean, a Lolita cousin > proved to be his downfall even when he was "of age." How do you think > Elvis Costello is holding up? > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:56:05 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Costello Didn't Costello get punched out in bar in America, because he'd made a racist remark about Ray Charles? > >>>> yep , he told one of steven still's roadies that rc was "nothing but a blind nigger" to get a reaction ; he got one. he tells the story openly now with a lot of regret.p > < Subject: wiremailorder.com update Hi All; Gilbertpossstenger CD is now available to order from the website. Please check under the WMO tab for album info, mp3 and real audio samples, and more. This is the Final WMO release! We've also added a link for the Real Video of Wire's All Tomorrows Parties performance under the LINKS page, check it out! Finally, we have updated the FAQ. thanks! charles / wmo shop@wiremailorder.com http://wiremailorder.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 13:08:51 EDT From: "stephen graziano" Subject: Re: Bowie Highs......Lest we Forget... That Ray Charles remark was made by Elvis C. on an early tour of America (could have been This Year's Model) when the boy was still in his spleen and vent mode. The way I understood it, it wasn't that E. meant to be disparaging to Ray but rather he was saying something to rile up bar compatriots who stood for everything he was standing against, i.e. "good ole fashioned American rockanroll (Stills and Bonnie Rait) and Middle America consumerist/complancent culture. He was playing the drunk punk trying to upset the establishment - which happened to have a couple of representatives present. In the ole West they used to have a rule, that in saloons you didn't discuss religion or politics. This is what happens when cultures collide under the influence of the demon rum! :) - Steve G. Now if you let this (sub)thread die, I'll tell you the story of when Colin Newman came to my apartment. ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 12:33:20 -0500 From: "JH3" Subject: Re: compartmentalism >"i generally appreciate politics from musicians about as >much as music from politicians" Hey, politicians have just as much potential to write killer pop hits, play scorchin' live gigs, and release stormin' rock albums as anybody else! This statement is sheer career- path discrimination! On a related note, the word out now is that U.S. Senator Orrin Hatch, known mostly for his ultra-conservative "pro-life" anti-abortion stance, plans to follow up his recent A/C gospel disc with a semi-experimental post-punk guitar album entitled "154", the title of course referring to the number of times he's tried to personally destroy the U.S. Constitution since being elected. More details when available... John "nearing my quota" Hedges ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 13:58:45 EDT From: VoxxJaguar@aol.com Subject: Re: The Onion In a message dated 5/25/00 3:32:54 AM Central Daylight Time, owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org writes: > > Also ironic that in a "story" about piracy, the article itself was > pirated, uncredited: > > www.theonion.com > > Always worth reading (and of course, the Wire interview from a week or so > ago is presumably in the archive). > > - --Jeff Jeff, I sent that privately to my old friend the SiamCat without the source, for comedic impact....Telling him afterwards. Meantime, he wanted to share it, here @ IdealCopy. The Wire interview is enroute to IdealCopy Digest, (*with* the authors' name and The Onion's name attatched) rgds, df ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 15:25:39 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: RE: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... Lucifersam wrote: > I dont dissagree about the 70's pedestal thing at all. But I believe credit where credit is due. If your talking 'Electronica' then take into account the chemical brothers 1st 2 LP's, or Orbital, Underworld (Romfords finest!), Leftfield, Add N to X, etc... Fine. Dance music has been the most creative music of the last decades.To me, "Timeless" by Goldie is the Sgt'Peppers' of the 1990's. I just see a lot of people slagging Bowies recent work and in the same breath ulogise retro nonsense like 'Shack', 'Richard Ashcroft'...'Sonic Fuckin' Youth' for christs sake!!!! eeeekkkkkkk.......Sorry, I've finished now.... Le Cat Siamese.... IMHO, the whole grunge thing just about killed popular music. For a five year span (early 90's), most of my friends listened almost exclusively to Nirvana and Pearl Jam and their various clones... I found the whole grunge thing to be a re-heated 70's heavy-metal overreaction to the 80's heavy-metal hair bands, i.e. Poison, Bon Jovi, etc. I never liked the heavy-metal hair bands, and grunge was interesting for about two weeks. If it wasn't for electronica the 90's would have been a vast musical wasteland for me. I'm a strict armchair enthusiast, never been to a rave and have no desire to go, but for my musical tastes, 90's electronica has been the only thing that's come close to being something unique. I'd take an Orbital or Underworld album over a Smashing Pumpkins or Dave Matthews Band album any day of the week. How did I get into Electronica? An almost direct path from Wir's 'The First Letter' to Underworld's 'dubnobasswithmyheadman'. It all seems to circle back to Wir(e) somehow doesn't it! Cheers, Ray ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 16:45:47 -0400 From: "Katherine Pouliot" Subject: Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... > IMHO, the whole grunge thing just about killed popular music. For a five > year span (early 90's), most of my friends listened almost exclusively to > Nirvana and Pearl Jam and their various clones... I found the whole grunge > thing to be a re-heated 70's heavy-metal overreaction to the 80's > heavy-metal hair bands, i.e. Poison, Bon Jovi, etc. I never liked the > heavy-metal hair bands, and grunge was interesting for about two weeks. > I agree with you on that. Although I can say that I am guilty of seeing various heavy metal hair bands in concert in the 80's for lack of anything better to do! haha > If it wasn't for electronica the 90's would have been a vast musical > wasteland for me. > > I'm a strict armchair enthusiast, never been to a rave and have no desire to > go, but for my musical tastes, 90's electronica has been the only thing > that's come close to being something unique. I'd take an Orbital or > Underworld album over a Smashing Pumpkins or Dave Matthews Band album any > day of the week. I would love to go to a rave, except that I'm too old for it, and I'm not into drugs - I'd just like to go and experience the music and hang out with people who like it. I love Orbital and Underworld too. I don't own any SP CDs but pleas edon't compare them to Dave Matthews Band! yuck! At least SP are somewhat interesting. Dave Matthews Band is stoner crunchy hippie music. yuck! > > How did I get into Electronica? An almost direct path from Wir's 'The First > Letter' to Underworld's 'dubnobasswithmyheadman'. > > It all seems to circle back to Wir(e) somehow doesn't it! > That's what we like to hear ! Katherine > Cheers, > > Ray > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 16:54:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Joshua Subject: Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... On Thu, 25 May 2000, Katherine Pouliot wrote: > I would love to go to a rave, except that I'm too old for it, and I'm not > into drugs - I'd just like to go and experience the music and hang out with > people who like it. I love Orbital and Underworld too. Drugs are optional. So the only thing holding you back is that you feel old. Tim Leary used to hit raves pretty regularly and he was, what, 78? > I don't own any SP CDs but pleas edon't compare them to Dave Matthews Band! > yuck! > At least SP are somewhat interesting. Dave Matthews Band is stoner crunchy > hippie music. yuck! Dave Matthews Band is pretty much Fratboy music. Stoner crunchy hippies tend to listen to either old-school rock or the dull end of electronica, in my rather profuse experience. However, while we're comparing things to the Dave Matthews Band, I have to say that I can't tell the difference between Dave Matthews and Hootie and the Blowfish. I just can't tell them apart. - -Joshua ___ ___ http://www.swingpad.com (Digital Art and Artisanship) - --- --- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 17:18:54 -0400 From: "Katherine Pouliot" Subject: Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... > Drugs are optional. So the only thing holding you back is that you feel > old. Tim Leary used to hit raves pretty regularly and he was, what, 78? That and actually being in the loop to find out when and where they are happening. got my glowsticks and I'm ready to go! I guess I don't really feel old. I just have to get to feel more comfortable with hanging out with people 10+ years younger than myself and hopefully not looking too much like a goob > Dave Matthews Band is pretty much Fratboy music. Stoner crunchy hippies > tend to listen to either old-school rock or the dull end of electronica, > in my rather profuse experience. Well, around here it's DMB, Phish and GD and lots of other old tired-out endless jam crap. I honestly have never heard any of them listening to electronica, dull or otherwise. My coworker thinks that I would love Phish because their music just keeps on going and changing. He thought my description of the Wire show was similar to Phish shows. I assured him that although Wire's songs change as they go on and release more sounds and depth, (except for those short ones!) they don't go on for eternity or put you to sleep like Phish's do. IMO! > However, while we're comparing things to the Dave Matthews Band, I have to > say that I can't tell the difference between Dave Matthews and Hootie and > the Blowfish. > > I just can't tell them apart. Excellent observation - I'm right there with ya. hahah! You go Josh! Katherine > -Joshua > http://www.swingpad.com (Digital Art and Artisanship) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 16:14:54 -0500 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: RE: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... Joshua wrote: >> I would love to go to a rave, except that I'm too old for it, and I'm not >> into drugs - I'd just like to go and experience the music and hang out with >> people who like it. I love Orbital and Underworld too. >Drugs are optional. So the only thing holding you back is that you feel >old. Tim Leary used to hit raves pretty regularly and he was, what, 78? I'd recommend seeing them live in concert. I've seen both Orbital and Underworld, and there's enough going on in their shows to keep armchair enthusiasts involved. Orbital is one of the few Electronica acts that can pull off a 'rock concert'. >> I don't own any SP CDs but pleas edon't compare them to Dave Matthews Band! >> yuck! >> At least SP are somewhat interesting. Dave Matthews Band is stoner crunchy >> hippie music. yuck! >Dave Matthews Band is pretty much Fratboy music. Stoner crunchy hippies >tend to listen to either old-school rock or the dull end of electronica, >in my rather profuse experience. You must be from the U.K. because no self respecting American hippie would be caught dead listening to ANY kind of electronica as long as they can trip out to Phish, Rusted Root, Blues Traveler, etc. to listen to! Give them out of tune, psuedo-boogie woogie and their happy. >However, while we're comparing things to the Dave Matthews Band, I have to >say that I can't tell the difference between Dave Matthews and Hootie and >the Blowfish. >I just can't tell them apart. It's easy to tell them apart. Hootie and the Blowfish NEVER aspired to be more than what they are, a frat house band that wrote some nice pop songs with hooks. The Dave Matthews Band aspires to produce ART, and the fail miserably every time. No discernable hooks at all, just those goddammed jangly acoustic guitars. Cheers, Ray Ciscon ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 16:25:56 -0500 From: "Steve Loubert" Subject: Re: FZ on CD Why, sure, we should. And we do! Just to set the record straight, the vinyl was far superior to anything that has been released on CD so far. And it's likely to stay that way. For the full story check out: http://home5.swipnet.se/%7Ew-59501/vinylvscds/money.html There, aren't you sorry you asked? Yet Another Steve - ----- Original Message ----- From: giluz To: IdealCopy Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 3:44 AM Subject: FZ > > "His wife's attending an orchid show > > She squealed for a week to get him to go" -FZ > > > > Sorry kids, before your time. > > Hey - you don't have to be over 40 to like FZ. Personally, I prefer his > earlier stuff, especially "We're Only In It For The Money" - one of the best > rock satires ever, written and performed even before much of what it was > referring to happened. Production-wise and soundwise it's simply > unbelievable, especially considering it being recorded on a 3-track before > Sgt.Pepper. Could it just be the digital mastering or did it sound that > brilliant when it was released on vinyl as well? (You old 40-something > geezers should know - right?) > > giluz > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 23:22:19 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: Re[2]: wire and steve albini.... > IMHO, the whole grunge thing just about killed popular music. For a five > year span (early 90's), most of my friends listened almost exclusively to > Nirvana and Pearl Jam and their various clones... I found the whole grunge > thing to be a re-heated 70's heavy-metal overreaction to the 80's > heavy-metal hair bands, i.e. Poison, Bon Jovi, etc. I never liked the > heavy-metal hair bands, and grunge was interesting for about two weeks. <<<<<<<< I couldn't agree moreRay. Grunge was fucking hatefull...grrrrr > If it wasn't for electronica the 90's would have been a vast musical > wasteland for me. > <<<< I'm a strict armchair enthusiast, never been to a rave and have no desire to > go, but for my musical tastes, 90's electronica has been the only thing > that's come close to being something unique. I'd take an Orbital or > Underworld album over a Smashing Pumpkins or Dave Matthews Band album any > day of the week. > <<< How did I get into Electronica? An almost direct path from Wir's 'The First > Letter' to Underworld's 'dubnobasswithmyheadman'. > > It all seems to circle back to Wir(e) somehow doesn't it!<<<< > Cheers, > > Ray > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 18:37:40 EDT From: Eardrumbuz@aol.com Subject: Re: wire and steve albini....very punny In a message dated 5/23/0 11:43:41 AM, paulp@wrq.com writes: >I'd call it an "unvarnished" sound. hehe. if albini's production on shellac recordings is unvarnished, then could we assume that those of us who were disappointed with the recent wire gigs felt that perhaps the band were a bit "diconnected" from their performance? sorry, i couldn't resist :o) -paul ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V3 #158 *******************************