From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V3 #56 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Monday, March 6 2000 Volume 03 : Number 056 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Take It / New York City ["Mark McQuitty" ] RE: RFH Set List [Wireviews ] Re: RFH Set List [Carl Archer ] Chicago tickets ["D.T. Viecelli" ] Re: RFH Set List ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] Behind The Curtain question ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] For Trainspotters Only... ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] Re: For Trainspotters Only... ["giluz" ] Re: Behind The Curtain question [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: For Trainspotters Only... ["Paul Pietromonaco" ] *HUGE* Wireviews update [Wireviews ] Copyright etc [MarkBursa@aol.com] Re: For Trainspotters Only... ["MackDaddyD" ] Re: For Trainspotters Only... [Wireviews ] Re[2]: RFH Set List [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: For Trainspotters Only... ["giluz" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 09:45:00 -0000 From: "Mark McQuitty" Subject: Take It / New York City Craig wrote : >>> It's a rather drastic 1991 LFO remix (and, IMO, one of >>> the very best Wir(e) pieces) of Take It, I agree, one of my favourite wir pieces and a superb example of an 'intelligent' remix. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 04:45:04 -0800 (PST) From: Wireviews Subject: RE: RFH Set List - --- Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > I'm assuming htbt is "Heartbeat". But, what is > "Another Time"? > a.k.a. Another the Letter. Craig/Wireviews. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 09:50:32 -0500 From: Carl Archer Subject: Re: RFH Set List I hope that play that song in NYC. If anybody has spent their adolescence noodling with digital delay pedals as much as I did, they'll have to see that. > From: Wireviews > Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 04:45:04 -0800 (PST) > To: idealcopy@smoe.org > Subject: RE: RFH Set List > > --- Paul Pietromonaco wrote: >> I'm assuming htbt is "Heartbeat". But, what is >> "Another Time"? >> > > a.k.a. Another the Letter. > > > Craig/Wireviews. > > > > > ===== > ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- > http://welcome.to/wireviews > News, reviews and dugga. > > Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub > Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer > -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. > http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 08:57:10 -0600 From: "D.T. Viecelli" Subject: Chicago tickets I have absolutely no idea why those tickets were not made available on the Ticketmaster system on Saturday. Only last Monday, I reconfirmed with Metro that March 4 was indeed the on-sale date we had selected. I'll post news tomorrow when I have it. ***************************************************** David T. Viecelli / Boche Billions President THE BILLIONS CORPORATION 833 W. Chicago Ave., ste. 101 Chicago, IL 60622-5497 tel: 312-997-9999 fax: 312-997-2287 web: http://www.billions.com and introducing: BILLIONS AUSTRALIA Adelaide Brisbane Chicago Melbourne Perth Sydney Ask me about it! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 08:16:50 -0800 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Re: RFH Set List Hi Craig, Thanks! I was so overwhelmed by the evening, and also the fact that it was the first time I'd ever seen Wire live, that I need the set list to remember exactly what was played, and what I'm imagining they played. Not to mention the jet lag. (^_-) So does anyone have an actual copy of the set list from the stagefloor? (Charles?) Any chance we could get to you to scan it and post it to the list? Pretty please? (^_^) Take care, Paul - ---------- > From: Wireviews > To: idealcopy@smoe.org > Subject: RE: RFH Set List > Date: Sunday, March 05, 2000 4:45 AM > > --- Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > > I'm assuming htbt is "Heartbeat". But, what is > > "Another Time"? > > > > a.k.a. Another the Letter. > > > Craig/Wireviews. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 08:50:46 -0800 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Behind The Curtain question Man, I'm in a chatty mood. Sorry about that! Must be the PG Tips today... So, now I'm listening to Behind The Curtain, and I've always had a question about it, so - darn it! - I'm gonna ask it. First, though, a little history. This album was never released in the US. And, this came out before the big on-line CD sites, so I had to go thru a few hoops to get it. Long story short - the copy I own has a small sticker "Made in Canada" pasted over the words "Imported By EMI Music Canada". The CD itself says "Made In The UK" and the CD matrix is from the EMI Swindon plant. I don't know if this is a different edition than the U.K., but I don't think so. Anyway, it might have some bearing on my question, which is as follows: Were tracks 16 - 21 originally mono, and electronically re-processed for stereo? They seem to have more treble on the left channel, and more bass on the right. I'm wondering if they were released that way in the UK, or if the Canadian edition has some extra reprocessing. Thanks for the space to ask this question - I'm not sure who else would even know what I'm talking about. (^_^) Cheers, Paul ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 08:11:46 -0800 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: For Trainspotters Only... ...which, by definition of being a Wire fan, means everyone on this list, right? (^_^) Anyway, I'm still going thru the $800.00 (US) worth of CDs (!) I brought back from England. 3 of them were the EMI "Mid Price" issues of Pink Flag, Chairs Missing, 154. I had the American Restless Retro editions, but I thought that the EMI editions had a better selection of bonus tracks (which seems to eliminate the need to pick up On Returning) and were probably a new remaster. Well, they are indeed a new remaster - nice and punchy sounding. Unfortunately, also a little distorted. Check out "Being Sucked In Again" on Chairs Missing - at about 1:26 into the song. That's the sound of digital overload. (You might need to play it fairly loud to hear it against the track - as if that's a problem (^_^)) I compared it against my older edition which was recorded at a lower signal level (as verified on my DAT deck via digital connection) - no digital breakup. I'll have to listen to the rest of them (again - not much of a problem, really (^_^)) to see if I notice it on any other tracks. What's the story behind these re-issues? Not being on that side of the Atlantic too often, I really don't know the history. (^_^) Yours in all things Wire (and looking forward to the Seattle show) - -Paul ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 20:31:13 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... "Paul Pietromonaco" wrote: > What's the story behind these re-issues? Not being on that side of the > Atlantic too often, I really don't know the history. (^_^) You don't have to be English to know the story behind these reissues: Big company hears about Wire reunion and wants to make some money off it. So they remaster it, probably using an engineer that never heard the originals on vinyl and uses the old reissue CD's as reference, put in some bonus tracks, and release it. Distortion? Who cares? Being a big company, we're just gonna give the minimum to re-release those old CD's. They don't have many fans anyway. They never really had, and what's left now is just a bunch of intellectual-punk-hasbeens. We do this just for the unlikely chance that the Wire reunion will go big, so that we'll have something to sell if it does. That's my opinion, anyway. It's not that I'm against reissues, but I think it's about time the record companies do it properly. And the bonus tracks, which are one of the main reasons for buying them, could be put on a CD single, so that the continuity of the original LP's will not be flawed. I just bought TheFall's Perverted By Language CD (which I had already bought 3 times in the past - all those issues diappeared mysteriously). I was very happy to find lots of bonus tracks, one of which I never even heard in its studio version (Plaster On The Hands), but why did they have to be at the start and at the end of the CD, so that the original LP is envelopped by other songs, which weren't supposed to be on it. giluz ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 13:26:13 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: Behind The Curtain question nOn Sun, 5 Mar 2000, Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > So, now I'm listening to Behind The Curtain, and I've always had a question > about it, so - darn it! - I'm gonna ask it. > > First, though, a little history. This album was never released in the US. > And, this came out before the big on-line CD sites, so I had to go thru a > few hoops to get it. A few hoops? I just ordered mine direct from WMO - as should we all have done ;) - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html ::This is America. People do whatever the fuck they feel like doing.... ::As a result, this country has one of the worst economies in the world. __Neal Stephenson, SNOW CRASH__ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 12:19:51 -0800 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Re: Behind The Curtain question Yeah, but I got this *before* there was a WMO.... (^_^;) - -Paul - ---------- > From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey > To: Grand Mute Proof > Subject: Re: Behind The Curtain question > Date: Sunday, March 05, 2000 11:26 AM > > nOn Sun, 5 Mar 2000, Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > > > So, now I'm listening to Behind The Curtain, and I've always had a question > > about it, so - darn it! - I'm gonna ask it. > > > > First, though, a little history. This album was never released in the US. > > And, this came out before the big on-line CD sites, so I had to go thru a > > few hoops to get it. > > A few hoops? I just ordered mine direct from WMO - as should we all have > done ;) > > --Jeff > > J e f f r e y N o r m a n > The Architectural Dance Society > www.uwm.edu/~jenor/reviews.html > ::This is America. People do whatever the fuck they feel like doing.... > ::As a result, this country has one of the worst economies in the world. > __Neal Stephenson, SNOW CRASH__ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 12:27:37 -0800 From: "Paul Pietromonaco" Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... Actually, I quite like the bonus cuts. Sure, they don't quite match the sequence of the original album. But, if they bother you, you could always program them out. And, luckily, they're at the end of the CDs, after the main sequence of the albums. They seem to compliment the release - not interrupt it, IMHO. Also, the original U.S. CDs had the same bonus cuts, which are basically B-sides and one EP. They were just not on the right discs. They were also missing the A-sides. So, you had to buy On Returning to complete the picture. EMI moved the single A-sides to the appropriate CD, more or less, and added the accompanying B-Side. This is actually a good thing. Thematically, the singles do fit with the albums. And, it's especially nice for those of us trying to put together a complete picture of Wire long after the fact. (Especially if you live on the wrong side of the Atlantic.) As for EMI's motives, I think I'll stay out of that debate. (^_-) Trainspottingly yours, Paul - ---------- > From: giluz > To: IdealCopy > Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... > Date: Sunday, March 05, 2000 10:31 AM > > > "Paul Pietromonaco" wrote: > > > What's the story behind these re-issues? Not being on that side of the > > Atlantic too often, I really don't know the history. (^_^) > > You don't have to be English to know the story behind these reissues: Big > company hears about Wire reunion and wants to make some money off it. So > they remaster it, probably using an engineer that never heard the originals > on vinyl and uses the old reissue CD's as reference, put in some bonus > tracks, and release it. Distortion? Who cares? Being a big company, we're > just gonna give the minimum to re-release those old CD's. They don't have > many fans anyway. They never really had, and what's left now is just a bunch > of intellectual-punk-hasbeens. We do this just for the unlikely chance that > the Wire reunion will go big, so that we'll have something to sell if it > does. > > That's my opinion, anyway. It's not that I'm against reissues, but I think > it's about time the record companies do it properly. And the bonus tracks, > which are one of the main reasons for buying them, could be put on a CD > single, so that the continuity of the original LP's will not be flawed. I > just bought TheFall's Perverted By Language CD (which I had already bought 3 > times in the past - all those issues diappeared mysteriously). I was very > happy to find lots of bonus tracks, one of which I never even heard in its > studio version (Plaster On The Hands), but why did they have to be at the > start and at the end of the CD, so that the original LP is envelopped by > other songs, which weren't supposed to be on it. > > giluz ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 13:18:48 -0800 (PST) From: Wireviews Subject: *HUGE* Wireviews update Dear all, Wireviews has been updated, and blimey, what an update! You want reviews? Well, we've got a bucketload this month including the brand new disc from Swim~ Records, Swim Team #1 and the EMI reissue of On Returning. Also reviewed is a plethora of Bruce and Graham material including He Said's Hail and Take Care, Bruce's Music for Fruit, Ab Ovo, In Esse, This Way to the Shivering Man and Insiding, and the Mute/Dome collaboration Duet Emmo's Or So it Seems. Oh, and Wire's new disc, Third Day. Along with that, there is my review of It's all in the Brochure (Royal Festical Hall), along with some photos. There are also various comments about said gig from Ideal Copyists. Uri Baran has sent a great report of the Nottingham gig, and there's a whole bunch of other news tid-bits too! As if that wasn't enough there's also the WMO March newsletter, which covers evey Wire event from 12/99-02/00, Pink Flag has finally been ousted from the top of the A List, and Wireviews also takes a look at Monomania's new EP. Time for a lie down now, methinks! Best, Craig/Wireviews. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 20:09:51 EST From: MarkBursa@aol.com Subject: Copyright etc Hi Andrew, >>No no no, that is definitely not true! For example, you can't put online a copy of the new John Grisham book, whether or not you give him credit! It's the same with magazines and newspapers. You are allowed to make small excerpts, properly cited (movie posters and books do this to cite reviewers' comments). I think it's US Code 13 which discusses all of this. Full copies are only allowed to be made for *private* scholarly work. The second part you said (about the worst that could happen) is definitely true. Usually the publisher will give a warning first; if you remove the article then, then you're probably OK.<< Oh sure, but that is an extreme example. Putting a novel ( which is actively being sold) on a web site will surely get you into court...and rightly so. But we're talking about ancient archive cuttings, and putting them on a web site deprives nobody of any earnings....the NME is not selling 1978 issues any more. If you fully credit the source, the worst that the publisher can REASONABLY ask is that you remove them. It is better to ask permission, but then you run the risk of having some crappy lawyer asking for fees....so it's actually better to take a chance on nobody noticing. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 20:35:23 -0600 From: "MackDaddyD" Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... Are the EMI reissues comparable to the Japan reissues of a few years back? > Also, the original U.S. CDs had the same bonus cuts, which are basically > B-sides and one EP. They were just not on the right discs. They were also > missing the A-sides. So, you had to buy On Returning to complete the > picture. EMI moved the single A-sides to the appropriate CD, more or less, > and added the accompanying B-Side. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 00:41:15 -0800 (PST) From: Wireviews Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... - --- MackDaddyD wrote: > Are the EMI reissues comparable to the Japan > reissues of a few years back? The Japan reissued also contained large chunks of the material that would later be found on Behind the Curtain. BTW, as far as I know EMI's only cash in on Wire 2000 is On Returning. PF, 154 and CM were reissued in 1995 (presumably to cash in on Brit-pop), but not since. Craig. ===== - ------- Craig Grannell / Wireviews --- http://welcome.to/wireviews News, reviews and dugga. Snub.Comms: http://welcome.to/snub Veer Audio: http://listen.to/veer - -------------- wireviews@yahoo.com --- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 10:06:24 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: RFH Set List i'll scan in my nottm one some time this week.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: RFH Set List Author: MIME:paulp@wrq.com at INTERNET Date: 06/03/2000 08:47 Hi Craig, Thanks! I was so overwhelmed by the evening, and also the fact that it was the first time I'd ever seen Wire live, that I need the set list to remember exactly what was played, and what I'm imagining they played. Not to mention the jet lag. (^_-) So does anyone have an actual copy of the set list from the stagefloor? (Charles?) Any chance we could get to you to scan it and post it to the list? Pretty please? (^_^) Take care, Paul - ---------- > From: Wireviews > To: idealcopy@smoe.org > Subject: RE: RFH Set List > Date: Sunday, March 05, 2000 4:45 AM > > --- Paul Pietromonaco wrote: > > I'm assuming htbt is "Heartbeat". But, what is > > "Another Time"? > > > > a.k.a. Another the Letter. > > > Craig/Wireviews. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2000 11:16:24 +0200 From: "giluz" Subject: Re: For Trainspotters Only... "Paul Pietromonaco" wrote: > Actually, I quite like the bonus cuts. Sure, they don't quite match the > sequence of the original album. But, if they bother you, you could always > program them out. And, luckily, they're at the end of the CDs, after the > main sequence of the albums. They seem to compliment the release - not > interrupt it, IMHO. > Actually, I like bonus tracks as well, and the Wire bonus tracks of the EMI reissues especially. I just would have preferred it if they came as an additional CD single with the original. It's OK if they're at the end of the CD, but sometimes they aren't, and that really pisses me off. It's all a question of the respect the big record companies show towards its clients, which is almost null, to my opinion. giluz ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V3 #56 ******************************