From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V2 #259 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Friday, January 7 2000 Volume 02 : Number 259 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re[2]: RFH [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] deutscher tv [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] leckie [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: leckie [Mark Short ] Re: deutscher tv / Rockpalast [Wireviews ] Re[2]: deutscher tv / Rockpalast [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: RFH [John Roberts ] Re: spizzenergi [John Roberts ] Re: RFH [John Roberts ] Re: leckie [John Roberts ] Re[2]: leckie [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: Re[2]: leckie [John Roberts ] Re[2]: spizzenergi [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re[4]: leckie [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: leckie [Mark Short ] Re: leckie [Joe Turner ] Re[2]: leckie [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: leckie [John Roberts ] Re: Re[2]: leckie ["MackDaddyD" ] Re: leckie ["Stephen Jackson" ] Re: leckie [Joe Turner ] More Off Topic Rants - Simple Minds and Shriekback ["Ciscon, Ray" ] Re[2]: deutscher tv / Rockpalast [professor ned ] Re[2]: leckie [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] top 10 [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 10:37:44 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: RFH i'll try to remember the 10 ; horses the ramones bollocks pink flag the clash another music a pere ubu one i'm stranded damned damned damned (i think) i've got the magazine at home so i'll go look it up tonight. but i fear you are totally correct in guessing that the rudimentary peni missed the cut.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: RFH Author: MIME:dpbailey@worldnet.att.net at INTERNET Date: 06/01/2000 10:19 >>good to see pink flag in record collectors all-time punk top 10 (between "bollocks" and "another music" , an excellent place to be). no disputes there then.p<< So tell us, how does the entire ranking go? I'll bet it (a) starts with The Clash & (b) shamefully omits Rudimentary Peni's Death Church ... Apologies if someone has already posted this info ... I'm only just now scrabbling toward lucidity after a half-week with the flu or whatever the hell the crap going around here right now is called ... Dan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 10:42:23 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: deutscher tv well here's a dumb question. i've scrounged a satellite decoder off a friend so now i can get about 30 german channels for free. is anyone out there in germany who could tell me if there is such a thing as a decent music tv program over there. i know there was the "rockpalast" show which had some really good acts on it , is there anything good running now? i was surprised to see they have a german version of "top of the pops" , i saw the review of the year and the #1 track was that dreadful cher "dance" single. i suppose that's better than the scorpions or krokus but i'd rather not consider that one at length.p ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 10:47:45 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: leckie rewinding a bit , i dug out my old pil albums and all the ones up to "this is what you want" are self-produced. maybe jl did some of the later mcgeogh era ones? not the good ones though.p ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 10:37:27 +0000 From: Mark Short Subject: Re: leckie paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > > rewinding a bit , i dug out my old pil albums and all the ones up to "this is what you want" are self-produced. maybe jl did some of the later mcgeogh era ones? not the good ones though.p I read an interview with XTC, around 1980, in which they said that PIL had given their [XTC's] producer/engineer a hard time. I can't remember who they were referring to, but imagined it was John Leckie. Might have been Hugh Padham. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 03:11:35 -0800 (PST) From: Wireviews Subject: Re: deutscher tv / Rockpalast - --- paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > well here's a dumb question. i've scrounged a > satellite decoder off a friend so now i can get > about 30 german channels for free. is anyone out > there in germany who could tell me if there is such > a thing as a decent music tv program over there. i > know there was the "rockpalast" show which had some > really good acts on it , is there anything good > running now? Well, I'm not German, but Rockpalast is still going after all these years, alternating between current and old acts. I believe the Wire gig was repeated a couple of years back. Recent gigs they've shown include a very young Neil Young, a very crap Cure from the mid '90s, and a fairly recent Garbage gig, which wasn't bad. If you have Sky (maybe not the digital version) you should be able to pick up WDR - on my set-up, it's #42. PS: RP web-site: http://www.rockpalast.de/ Craig. ===== >>> Craig Grannell / Wireviews >>> Visit Wireviews at: http://welcome.to/wireviews http://www.snub.dircon.co.uk/wirehome.html >>> wireviews@yahoo.com >>> __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 14:37:10 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: deutscher tv / Rockpalast i think wdr is available for free (i've just inherited a non-digital dish). any idea what sort of time of day rockpalast is on? ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: deutscher tv / Rockpalast Author: MIME:wireviews@yahoo.com at INTERNET Date: 06/01/2000 12:19 - --- paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > well here's a dumb question. i've scrounged a > satellite decoder off a friend so now i can get > about 30 german channels for free. is anyone out > there in germany who could tell me if there is such > a thing as a decent music tv program over there. i > know there was the "rockpalast" show which had some > really good acts on it , is there anything good > running now? Well, I'm not German, but Rockpalast is still going after all these years, alternating between current and old acts. I believe the Wire gig was repeated a couple of years back. Recent gigs they've shown include a very young Neil Young, a very crap Cure from the mid '90s, and a fairly recent Garbage gig, which wasn't bad. If you have Sky (maybe not the digital version) you should be able to pick up WDR - on my set-up, it's #42. PS: RP web-site: http://www.rockpalast.de/ Craig. ===== >>> Craig Grannell / Wireviews >>> Visit Wireviews at: http://welcome.to/wireviews http://www.snub.dircon.co.uk/wirehome.html >>> wireviews@yahoo.com >>> __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:03:35 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: RFH > and a happy new year to you all. i'll ask an off-topic question that bugged me over xmas. i got bought a copy of the magazine "rays and hail" compilation which says how great all 4 albums were and promptly takes 4 tracks each off the first 3 and just one off the last one. is the final album any good? how about "play"? must admit these 2 have never made it onto my turntable and i was curious. This is spooky. I was playing Magic Murder and the Weather this morning! I picked it the CD in a remainder shop for a couple of quid. Ive already got it on vinyl but at that price couldn't resist it. It has its moments i.e. About the Weather and a couple of tracks like This Poison and that other reggae-ish one. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:14:41 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: spizzenergi > Dunno about that, but it's certainly pretty good ... I remain very fond of > Airships, in particular, to this day. OTOH, whatever the follow-up was > called -- Spiky Dream Flowers? -- was quite a comedown, I thought. Even the > Star Trek song isn't anywhere near the calibre of Where's Capt. Kirk & > Spock's Missing ... Nah... No Room is THE classic Spizz track. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:16:13 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: RFH > So tell us, how does the entire ranking go? I'll bet it (a) starts with The > Clash & (b) shamefully omits Rudimentary Peni's Death Church ... And 'Cacophony' which if you listen to now sounds well ahead of its time. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:20:24 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: leckie But Nick Launay (if that's how you spell it) engineered Flowers of Romance and gets a thanks credit on the sleeve. Given PiL's credits on the first album i.e. thanks to nobody this suggests that Mr Launay DID contribute more than an engineer normally does in the studio. Did he produce anything by XTC? Sorry I'm not really an XTC fan so my anorak of a brain is letting me down here. On Thu, 6 Jan 2000, Mark Short wrote: > paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > > > > rewinding a bit , i dug out my old pil albums and all the ones up to "this is what you want" are self-produced. maybe jl did some of the later mcgeogh era ones? not the good ones though.p > > I read an interview with XTC, around 1980, in which they said that PIL had given > their [XTC's] producer/engineer a hard time. I can't remember who they were > referring to, but imagined it was John Leckie. Might have been Hugh Padham. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:37:21 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: leckie leckie produced go2 , not sure about other xtc releases. i think nick launay was one of the few people ever to get a sleeve credit on early killing joke records so the guy must be one hell of a diplomat given the records of pil and kj falling out with themselves and most of their collaborators.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: leckie Author: MIME:jarobert@dmu.ac.uk at INTERNET Date: 06/01/2000 16:22 But Nick Launay (if that's how you spell it) engineered Flowers of Romance and gets a thanks credit on the sleeve. Given PiL's credits on the first album i.e. thanks to nobody this suggests that Mr Launay DID contribute more than an engineer normally does in the studio. Did he produce anything by XTC? Sorry I'm not really an XTC fan so my anorak of a brain is letting me down here. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:47:17 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: Re[2]: leckie Hmmm. Mr Launay prod Fire Dances didn't he? The first two were prod by the band themselves and Conny Plank did Revelations. By the time of Fire Dances the band had calmed down a bit hadn't they and stopped predicting the end of the world, running off to Iceland etc? Mind you. I STILL wouldn't want to be stuck in a studio for a few months with them even now. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:42:45 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: spizzenergi i was always more of a soldier soldier / virginia plain fan meself , although 6000 crazy was worth a laugh.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: spizzenergi Author: MIME:jarobert@dmu.ac.uk at INTERNET Date: 06/01/2000 16:17 > Dunno about that, but it's certainly pretty good ... I remain very fond of > Airships, in particular, to this day. OTOH, whatever the follow-up was > called -- Spiky Dream Flowers? -- was quite a comedown, I thought. Even the > Star Trek song isn't anywhere near the calibre of Where's Capt. Kirk & > Spock's Missing ... Nah... No Room is THE classic Spizz track. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:02:25 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[4]: leckie it really made me laugh when youth ended up really famous and producing things like kylie and bananarama , must have been a great meeting of minds. i saw kj with youth twice and (against stiff competition) i don't think i have ever seen anyone further out of it.p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Re[2]: leckie Author: MIME:jarobert@dmu.ac.uk at INTERNET Date: 06/01/2000 16:50 Hmmm. Mr Launay prod Fire Dances didn't he? The first two were prod by the band themselves and Conny Plank did Revelations. By the time of Fire Dances the band had calmed down a bit hadn't they and stopped predicting the end of the world, running off to Iceland etc? Mind you. I STILL wouldn't want to be stuck in a studio for a few months with them even now. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 16:11:54 +0000 From: Mark Short Subject: Re: leckie paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > > it really made me laugh when youth ended up really famous and producing things like kylie and bananarama , must have been a great meeting of minds. i saw kj with youth twice and (against stiff competition) i don't think i have ever seen anyone further out of it.p > One of the Jokers has become a Serious Classical Composer, in New Zealand. I don't recall his name, but he came from Cheltenham. > ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ > Subject: Re: Re[2]: leckie > Author: MIME:jarobert@dmu.ac.uk at INTERNET > Date: 06/01/2000 16:50 > > Hmmm. Mr Launay prod Fire Dances didn't he? The first two were > prod by the band themselves and Conny Plank did Revelations. By the time of Fire Dances the band had calmed down a bit hadn't they and stopped predicting the end of the world, running off to Iceland etc? Mind you. I STILL wouldn't want to be stuck in a studio for a few months with them even now. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 11:46:40 -0500 (EST) From: Joe Turner Subject: Re: leckie On Thu, 6 Jan 2000, Mark Short wrote: > One of the Jokers has become a Serious Classical Composer, in New Zealand. I > don't recall his name, but he came from Cheltenham. I beleive that's Jaz Coleman you're talkin' 'bout. Yup, Youth plays on an '80s Kate Bush LP and Jaz does instrumental world music with Anne Dudley (ex-"Art of Noise"). For sanity's sake! ;-) /j ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:27:30 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: leckie paul.rabjohn@ssab.com wrote: > > it really made me laugh when youth ended up really famous and producing things like kylie and bananarama , must have been a great meeting of minds. i saw kj with youth twice and (against stiff competition) i don't think i have ever seen anyone further out of it.p > One of the Jokers has become a Serious Classical Composer, in New Zealand. I don't recall his name, but he came from Cheltenham. >>>>> it was jazz coleman (singer/keyboarder/lyricist). i also saw he did an album with ann (full monty) dudley ; i avoided that too.p ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:44:48 +0000 (GMT) From: John Roberts Subject: Re: leckie > One of the Jokers has become a Serious Classical Composer, in New Zealand. I > don't recall his name, but he came from Cheltenham. Jaz Coleman did that album with Anne Dudley from Art of Noise which I'm led to believe was a classical album. Something about Egypt if my memory serves me right. I don't know how strict this list is but if anyone IS getting annoyed about wandering off topic I apologise. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 12:13:05 -0600 From: "MackDaddyD" Subject: Re: Re[2]: leckie i advise steering clear of ms. dudleys recent 'classical' outings in general i 'won' an auction for the most recent on eBay recently (my bidding judgement just isn't too sharp at 1 am i did not pay much ($5 + S&H) but it was too much sorta the same problem i have with dead can dance - early music is better earlier > >>>>> it was jazz coleman (singer/keyboarder/lyricist). i also saw he did an album with ann (full monty) dudley ; i avoided that too.p > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 19:11:13 -0000 From: "Stephen Jackson" Subject: Re: leckie > >Yup, Youth plays on an '80s Kate Bush LP and Jaz does instrumental world >music with Anne Dudley (ex-"Art of Noise"). For sanity's sake! ;-) Yes, Youth played on "The Big Sky" off the Hounds of Love and was dating Ms Bush at some point in the 80s. Leckie produced "White Music" and "Go2" as well as the two Dukes of Stratosphear albums (XTC's alter-ego). He also produced the first 3 Simple Minds albums of which one (Empires and Dance) in my opinion is a European Dance classic. Please don't flame me. Steve. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ No room to move, no room for doubt. - -----Original Message----- From: Joe Turner To: idealcopy@smoe.org Date: 06 January 2000 17:04 Subject: Re: leckie >On Thu, 6 Jan 2000, Mark Short wrote: > >> One of the Jokers has become a Serious Classical Composer, in New Zealand. I >> don't recall his name, but he came from Cheltenham. > >I beleive that's Jaz Coleman you're talkin' 'bout. > > >/j ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:18:43 -0500 (EST) From: Joe Turner Subject: Re: leckie On Thu, 6 Jan 2000, Stephen Jackson wrote: > Yes, Youth played on "The Big Sky" off the Hounds of Love and was dating Ms > Bush at some point in the 80s. Entirely off-topic, but... hunh?! She's been with her bassist Del Palmer continuously since the early 80s, as far as I knew. (An odd combo, if true, though, and would show a prediliction for bass players.) > Leckie produced "White Music" and "Go2" as well as the two Dukes of > Stratosphear albums (XTC's alter-ego). ...as well as their first release, the "3D EP". He also did some Woodentops tracks under the goof name of "Swami Anand Nagara", and of course the Stone Roses' first LP. Rrrrrrreaching back into the 80's, there... > He also produced the first 3 Simple > Minds albums of which one (Empires and Dance) in my opinion is a European > Dance classic. Please don't flame me. Simple Minds, while not exactly this-list-y, were pretty cool up to and including (kiss my 80's-adolescent rear if you don't agree) "Don't You Forget About Me". Never knew he was responsible for the earlier stuff, though. Although in an ironic twist of list mentions, I saw Shriekback open up for Simple Minds in Boston many years ago and they blew SM off the stage. /j "We see the fish below the ice sometimes." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:29:14 -0600 From: "Ciscon, Ray" Subject: More Off Topic Rants - Simple Minds and Shriekback I never saw Simple Minds live, but they always struck me as a very 'studio' band. I too saw the Carl Marsh-less Shriekback live on their 'Oil and Gold' tour in the mid 80's and they were indeed a sight to behold! They were one of the few 80's synth-dominated bands who could pull it off on stage. They, much like Wire, would present live versions of their songs that were in some cases radically different, but equally good, than the studio versions. Compare the live and studio versions of 'Hammerheads' from 'The Dancing Years', and 'Oil & Gold' ... Does anyone have any information on what any of the Shriekback alumni are doing these days? I know that bassist extraordinaire Dave Allen is involved with World Domination records (Dr. Evil's favorite record label BTW)... but what ever happened to Carl Marsh, ex-XTC keyboardist Barry Andrews, or Martyn Barker beyond the King Swamp and HappyHead projects? Cheers, Ray Ciscon In order to provide the best level of support, please contact: The I.S. Support Center at extension 4357 ** Every support call should begin with a call to the I. S. Support Center. ** -----Original Message----- From: Joe Turner [mailto:cutter@abunai.com] Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2000 4:19 PM To: idealcopy@smoe.org Subject: Re: leckie On Thu, 6 Jan 2000, Stephen Jackson wrote: > Yes, Youth played on "The Big Sky" off the Hounds of Love and was dating Ms > Bush at some point in the 80s. Entirely off-topic, but... hunh?! She's been with her bassist Del Palmer continuously since the early 80s, as far as I knew. (An odd combo, if true, though, and would show a prediliction for bass players.) > Leckie produced "White Music" and "Go2" as well as the two Dukes of > Stratosphear albums (XTC's alter-ego). ...as well as their first release, the "3D EP". He also did some Woodentops tracks under the goof name of "Swami Anand Nagara", and of course the Stone Roses' first LP. Rrrrrrreaching back into the 80's, there... > He also produced the first 3 Simple > Minds albums of which one (Empires and Dance) in my opinion is a European > Dance classic. Please don't flame me. Simple Minds, while not exactly this-list-y, were pretty cool up to and including (kiss my 80's-adolescent rear if you don't agree) "Don't You Forget About Me". Never knew he was responsible for the earlier stuff, though. Although in an ironic twist of list mentions, I saw Shriekback open up for Simple Minds in Boston many years ago and they blew SM off the stage. /j "We see the fish below the ice sometimes." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 15:06:48 -0800 (PST) From: BillyD Subject: Shriekback I just now found this at yalplay.com Shriekback Naked Apes And Pond Life Format: CD Album Label: Weatherbox Catalogue Number: MAUVE001 Released: 24/01/00 £10.50 Anybody have any more information? I think I'll order a copy. Cheers, Billy ===== . ./\/\/\. [ . . ] /\ -- -Get Well Sammy! (R)SOT Ltd. http://depechemode.acmecity.com/freestate/54 http://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 11:00:51 -0600 From: professor ned Subject: Re[2]: deutscher tv / Rockpalast >i think wdr is available for free (i've just inherited a non-digital >dish). any idea what sort of time of day rockpalast is on? Go check out http://www.rockpalast.de/termine.html - what's happening on WDR when. From midnight to 6am on the 9th (their time, of course, so 7 hours earlier for us) they're showing some bits from last year's Bizarre festival. Not all that exciting, but better than the Tom Petty and Joe Zawinul they've got lined up for the rest of the month. I also tried to dig up the websites of some of the German TV guides, but they all just say things like "This is where the internet presence of the domain "tv-spiel.de" will eventually be". ned ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2000 10:02:37 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: leckie > He also produced the first 3 Simple > Minds albums of which one (Empires and Dance) in my opinion is a European > Dance classic. Please don't flame me. Simple Minds, while not exactly this-list-y, were pretty cool up to and including (kiss my 80's-adolescent rear if you don't agree) "Don't You Forget About Me". Never knew he was responsible for the earlier stuff, though. >>>> i always think simple minds are a bizarre case of a band who started awful , got really good very briefly (empires and dance/the american etc) then plummetted to unbelievable lows. mind you , i bet jim couldn't get patsy's thongs on......... (topical uk joke there)p ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2000 10:07:43 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: top 10 the one i missed off that list was "rattus norvegicus" , what a boring choice. my own list would go for the subway sect/slits/atv/x ray spex end of things rather than damned/stranglers/saints/pere ubu but there , indeed , you go. p ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V2 #259 *******************************