From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V2 #239 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Friday, December 3 1999 Volume 02 : Number 239 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Long Fin Killie / Bows [Ian Grant ] Re: justification 2 [Ian Grant ] Re: Long Fin Killie / Bows [professor ned ] Re: frank tovey? (was:Long Fin Killie / Bows) ["tube disaster" ] Re: Save the wave. ["tube disaster" ] Re: Rejustification. [voxman@arvotek.net] YCLEPT=BRILLIANT!!! [BillyD ] Re: Scala [rivethed@slip.net] Re[2]: Justify my lov...er...Wire [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 14:56:13 +0000 From: Ian Grant Subject: Long Fin Killie / Bows At 04:30 02/12/99 -0500, you wrote: >Does anyone on this list listen to Long Fin Killie or Scala? I've never heard Long Fin Killie but Luke Sutherland of (I believe) said combo is now doing something called Bows. There's an LP called "Big Wings", also on Too Pure, which is well worth investigation - nothing especially ground-breaking, in that it wanders around in that whole post-MBV, post-Portishead, post-jungle area, but it did a damn good job of soundtracking my summer. Cheers, ig. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 14:48:26 +0000 From: Ian Grant Subject: Re: justification 2 At 04:30 02/12/99 -0500, Casper wrote: >My own idea of what punk rock is today (today as in right now) would be >digital hardcore in germany, uk breakbeat, and whatever the americans >are making in experimental noise. Rave culture is moving in and making >DandB obsolete as a progressive music mainly because Rave and DandB work >too well together. Although DandB acts like Squarepusher and RDJ are >pushing the boundries of what is music. That's a whole kettle of stuff right there, really. I know and appreciate where you're coming from on this...but I'd really rather leave notions like "progressive" and "experimental" for history to decide. What counts for me is whether it works as pop music *right now*, not whether it'll have an impact on the future. That clearly requires a certain pioneering spirit but also a desire to make music that works in practice as well as in theory. On that level, give me a d+b track that slays the dancefloor against an "experimental" prototype any day. The two needn't be exclusive, of course, and it's when they combine that things get particularly thrilling...which is why I could easily live without Squarepusher but certainly not without Dillinja or Trace or whoever. It's about getting a balance, walking a tightrope between tediously repeating a formula on the one hand and disappearing up your own asshole on the other. And (desperate attempt to steer this back onto topic coming up...) it's a tightrope that Wire have always walked particularly well, I think. Cheers, ig. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 09:12:15 -0600 From: professor ned Subject: Re: Long Fin Killie / Bows >At 04:30 02/12/99 -0500, Ian wrote: >I've never heard Long Fin Killie but Luke Sutherland of (I believe) said >combo is now doing something called Bows. There's an LP called "Big >Wings", also on Too Pure, which is well worth investigation - nothing >especially ground-breaking, in that it wanders around in that whole >post-MBV, post-Portishead, post-jungle area, but it did a damn good job of >soundtracking my summer. Bows is quite nice stuff - saw them with FX Randomize, Oval & Mouse On Mars (bit of an odd line-up no?) at PopKomm this summer. The violin was great but after a while I couldn't tell if the violinist was actually playing or not... ned ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 10:28:03 -0800 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: frank tovey? (was:Long Fin Killie / Bows) Changing the subject (&, yes, staying off-topic) -- "professor ned" rings a bell ... are you the guy I e-mailed a couple of years ago, after stumbling across a Frank Tovey website, about a few late-'80s videos of his (Luddite Joe, Bridge St Shuffle, Sam Hall) that actually made MTV's 120 Minutes? Dan >Bows is quite nice stuff - saw them with FX Randomize, Oval & Mouse On Mars >(bit of an odd line-up no?) at PopKomm this summer. The violin was great >but after a while I couldn't tell if the violinist was actually playing or >not... > >ned > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 10:38:31 -0500 From: Dave Walker Subject: Re: Long Fin Killie / Bows professor ned wrote: > Bows is quite nice stuff - saw them with FX Randomize, Oval & Mouse On Mars > (bit of an odd line-up no?) at PopKomm this summer. The violin was great > but after a while I couldn't tell if the violinist was actually playing or > not... That lineup doesn't strike me as being _that_ strange -- Mouse on Mars are the linking element all around: labelmates with Bows (Too Pure), label mates with FX Randomiz (a.Musik), and Jan St. Werner collaborates with Markus Popp from Oval in Microstoria. -d.w. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 10:43:17 -0800 From: "tube disaster" Subject: Re: Save the wave. What he said. I ate that stuff up in the early '80s (of course, I must've been quite the omnivore, because at the same time I was also eating up anarchopunk, non-anarchopunk, funk, electrofunk & early rap), & every now & then I'll find myself in a strange mood (possibly tantamount to senility, admittedly) & want to hear nothing else but early Human League, old Heaven 17, The Units (got their first 7", the 4-song High Pressure Days, through eBay a few days ago -- great stuff, complementing the Digital Stimulation LP nicely, at times staking out the ground between Fast-label Human Lg & the Screamers), Ultravox &, yes, even AFOS. Give me Men Without Hats or give me death, Dan >This new wave bashing has got to stop. Remember there were *some* good bands that >fell under the new wave category. Some that come to mind: Wall of Voodoo, Devo, and >Missing Persons (j/k on that last one). Wire's 80's keyboard driven pop qualifies as >new wave afaik, but there's nothing wrong with that. The new wave category happily >accomadated punk bands that became constrained by the 4-chord mohawk that punk had >degenerated into. Admittedly, new wave had some memorable haircuts of it's own >(flock of seagulls) but at least it never became a uniform. >-So lend me your frendship bracelets, your weary cyndi lauper overflowing out of >neon spandex, and we'll play Ms. Pacman once more- > >===== >The Skeek revolution! (caution: may offend) >http://www.geocities.com/PicketFence/3954/ >http://www.angelfire.com/fl2/miner49er ------------------------------ Date: 2 Dec 1999 14:48:20 +0000 From: voxman@arvotek.net Subject: Re: Rejustification. >On Mard 30 nove 1999 10:45, Casper Milquetoast wrote: > >I say I say sun you say you don't like 154 maybe all that genetic > >engineering is a catching up to you boy. I say you should go back > >and get some education boy. >First of all, I thought all the responses before this were well thought >out and honestly tried to prove a point about how they felt about the >albums following Pink Flags and Chairs Missing. But the case of this >last response, I don't appreciate being called "boy" or telling me "you >should go back and get some education boy." But in the spirit of >beautiful idiocy I'd like to say fuck you and your high horse. >Conversing intelligently doesn't seem to be an option. I find this rather amusing. I don't think that the merrits of two albums from twenty two years ago could justify a discussion list, such as "Ideal Copy". And intrestingly enough somwhere on the I-95, or Pallisades Parkway there was a converstion about caring or not caring what the audiance thinks, we do what we do if you don't like it so what. And someone brought forth the statement "Well I used to think that way when I was 22", which at the time seemed to be intended as an insult. But when you think about it when that person was 22 or thereabouts, when those two albums were made. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:30:28 -0800 (PST) From: BillyD Subject: YCLEPT=BRILLIANT!!! I am listening to my just opened copy now! I especially like 'Vertical Seeding'. Is that really a cat being strangled?? Wait till I play it at work tomorrow... Cheers, Billy ===== . ./\/\/\. [ . . ] /\ -- -Get Well Sammy! (R)SOT Ltd. http://depechemode.acmecity.com/freestate/54 http://www.fortunecity.com/uproar/mental/111/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 16:33:11 -0800 From: rivethed@slip.net Subject: Re: Scala Speaking of Scala, has anyone heard Marc Van Hoen's CD "Last Flowers From The Darkness"? Great stuff! Supposedly a new CD is due soon. t0m ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:03:53 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: Justify my lov...er...Wire i recall the live reviews for the astoria 88 show (which i attended). sounds gave it a rave review and the nme slagged it off , accusing the band of doing it for the money and ripping off the cure and new order. couldn't really see it myself and although i suppose a lot of albums are dated by the current technology of the time i never think of ideal copy in that way. i think there's a "hardness" to that album that sets it well away from something like the cure (who i gave up on around "primary" i'm afraid)p ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Justify my lov...er...Wire Author: MIME:dpbailey@worldnet.att.net at INTERNET Date: 01/12/1999 00:04 > Reply to: re: Justify my lov...er...Wire > >I was always a little skeptical of The Ideal Copy. It was too short, like a cobbled-together Capitol Beatles' album, and unlike Snakedrill it sounded self-conscious. "Ahead" sounded like someone involved in the production had been listening to New Order circa "Everything's Gone Green," or even (argh!) the Cure circa "The Head on the Door" or whatever it was. Which may well explain my immediate fondness for Ahead, since the Cure remain favorites of mine, even though they've done nothing that's really blown me away for the last 12 years or so. Dan ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V2 #239 *******************************