From: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org (idealcopy-digest) To: idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Subject: idealcopy-digest V2 #154 Reply-To: idealcopy@smoe.org Sender: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-idealcopy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk idealcopy-digest Thursday, August 19 1999 Volume 02 : Number 154 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: C+M live [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: idealcopy-digest V2 #153 [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] Re: idealcopy-digest V2 #153 [aschi@bronze.lcs.mit.edu] Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... [Aaron Mandel ] Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... [Aaron Mandel ] Re: shiny silver people [fernando ] Re: shiny silver people [Obie Sanders ] shiny silver people - redux ["MacDaddy" ] Re: shiny silver people - redux [Obie Sanders ] Re[2]: Very brief note about the Boston show... [paul.rabjohn@ssab.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 10:39:53 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re: C+M live ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: C+M live Author: MIME:wireviews@yahoo.com at INTERNET Date: 18/08/1999 10:22 Just a quick note to say that if anyone feels the urge, submit a review of any of the C+M live stuff to me and I'll bung them on the web-site. Here's waiting for the UK date ... C. >>> too right. should be fun... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:04:33 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re: idealcopy-digest V2 #153 i Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 00:36:40 -0500 (EST) From: aschiÉbronze.lcs.mit.edu Subject: Very brief note about the Boston show... I just returned from the Boston (actually Cambridge) show. The crowd was fairly small, unfortunately, and the mix was rather bass heavy -- we could barely hear Colin's playing. I never remember instrumental titles, but they played tracks from Bastard as well as several of Malka's songs, including "Hacol Zaram Beyachad" and "It's Odd." I did see the Boston Globe's music reviewer at the show; if there's a review, I'll post it. Amanda >>>> what's the live line up ; is it just c&m or are they using other musicians too? who's playing what? backing tapes? just curious,p ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 07:42:57 -0500 (EST) From: aschi@bronze.lcs.mit.edu Subject: Re: idealcopy-digest V2 #153 > >>>> what's the live line up ; is it just c&m or are they using other musicians too? who's playing what? backing tapes? just curious,p It was just C&M, both playing guitar and singing. All of the other elements were preprogrammed. A. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 11:13:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... On Wed, 18 Aug 1999 aschi@bronze.lcs.mit.edu wrote: > I just returned from the Boston (actually Cambridge) show. The > crowd was fairly small, unfortunately, and the mix was rather bass > heavy -- we could barely hear Colin's playing. Amanda's being very generous to blame the mix. i thought the show was quite possibly the most boring i've been to. (i actually fell asleep at one point.) there's nothing avant-garde or exciting about bland pop songs mostly played off of tapes while two near-motionless people play short riffs on guitars. but, like the monotony of the music, the inanimation of Malka and Colin wasn't really complete enough to be a minimalist statement. Colin occasionally bobbed his head back and forth at the beginning of faster numbers, as though he was just about to totally rock out. this did not occur. aaron ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:22:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew N Westmeyer Subject: Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... Excerpts from mail: 18-Aug-99 Re: Very brief note about t.. by Aaron Mandel@eecs.harvar > i thought the show was quite possibly the most boring i've been to. It's refreshing to hear a review that *isn't* "oh how I love Colin, his words are poetry". This afternoon I'm leaving Phoenix to begin my journey to Toronto for Friday's show. Woo-hoo!!! If anybody took pictures from the shows, I'd love to throw some of them on the web page. (A)ndrew Westmeyer qwerty@cmu.edu www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/~qwerty "Why must I be surrounded by frickin' idiots?" -Dr. Evil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:35:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Joe Turner Subject: Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... (fwd) On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Aaron Mandel wrote: > > I just returned from the Boston (actually Cambridge) show. The > > crowd was fairly small, unfortunately, and the mix was rather bass > > heavy -- we could barely hear Colin's playing. > > Amanda's being very generous to blame the mix. i thought the show was > quite possibly the most boring i've been to. (i actually fell asleep at > one point.) I observed this. It was a -deep- sleep. I found the tedium almost unbearable. Malka's guitar playing was extremely timid and amateurish(!), Colin's guitar was indecipherable except when he would kick in a distorted buzz, and the backing track was muddy at best. And the songs would just go on and on. Perhaps, if we had been at a rave on ecstasy and seen them perform, it might be OK, as they can churn out typically anonymous jungle-ish bass and drums permutations just like anyone else these days -- but I guess that's my point. /j .------------------------------------------------------------. | Joe Turner | email: cutter@abunai.com | web: www.abunai.com | `------------------------------------------------------------' ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:36:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Joe Turner Subject: Re: Silver Apples (I apologize for being tardy with this remark -- it never made it to the list.) On 10 Aug 1999, nicholas marcilio wrote: > I mentioned the Silver Apples in my 3 band blurb, but it didn't get any > reaction. I was very pleased to have been able to see them at Terrastock (Providence RI, 1997). They opened the festival and were well-received. (My humble combo had the honor of going on after them!) > The material sounds like mothing else- 60's music but electro fuzz. The semi-Sebadoh side project "Folk Implosion" was reported to have been hugely influenced by Silver Apples. They even drop some SA lyrics into some of the stuff on the "Kids" soundtrack. > check out www.silverapples.com > > It's not quite up to date, Simeon and Danny are playing in London in > about 3 weeks. Indeed, and less than a year after Simeon and Danny were both in a rather awful car accident that left Danny unhurt and Simeon paralyzed and unable to move a muscle. (And, again, my humble combo has the honor of playing with them at that London date -- Terrastock 3. www.terrascope.org has more info.) /joe ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 13:45:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Very brief note about the Boston show... On Wed, 18 Aug 1999, Andrew N Westmeyer wrote: > It's refreshing to hear a review that *isn't* "oh how I love Colin, > his words are poetry". words... yes, there's another thing that might have improved the show. Malka's english lyrics were pretty dopey; she might be better in her native language, though the fact that i was able to follow most of the hebrew lyrics too suggests that they weren't exactly "Cheeking Tongues" in terms of verbal complexity. Colin sang one song which i kept thinking was "It Seems", though it wasn't. it might just be the effect of hearing a familiar voice after half and hour of tedium, but i came the closest to liking that song of any they played. "why did you even bother going to the show if you didn't like Malka's new album OR the Oracle album OR Bastard?" you might well ask. but when i caught Bruce in london, i had a good time (unexpectedly) and started appreciating his solo records more. perhaps i thought this would be similar. a p.s. dunno if they came up in the "new bands we like" thread, but Underworld's Beaucoup Fish reminds me a lot of He Said. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 17:04:59 -0500 From: "MacDaddy" Subject: shiny silver people > p.s. dunno if they came up in the "new bands we like" thread, but > Underworld's Beaucoup Fish reminds me a lot of He Said. Just another bunch w/out an original idea as well (everybody has a history - and their's tells alot - doot doot my arse) d ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:23:03 -0700 From: fernando Subject: Re: shiny silver people At 03.04p -0700 18.08.99, MacDaddy wrote: >> p.s. dunno if they came up in the "new bands we like" thread, but >> Underworld's Beaucoup Fish reminds me a lot of He Said. >Just another bunch w/out an original idea as well >(everybody has a history - and their's tells alot - doot doot my arse) In order for music to be good, it does not have to be original... likewise, something very original can be terribly boring or just worth for one listen. I think that a good distillaton of influences and executed well can be more satisfying than something original. Also, not all music has to satisfy an intellectual aspect, and there is room for fun music. I know that some people do not see it this way and have to claim that original music is all there is... which is fine by me as well. It jus does not make it fact. If Underworld doesn't do it for you in any of these aspects, that is fine too... but I think that just hitting on a group for an "original idea" criterion is a bit silly. In the case of Underworld, I personally do not think that they are increadible, but the have a good ear for sequenced percussion and provide some really fun music for many satisfying listens. cheers! - -fernando ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 15:47:48 -0700 From: Obie Sanders Subject: Re: shiny silver people I have to agree with fernando. I would consider "the Boredom's" original. They are inventive , but also, it's hard to just chill out and enjoy one of their records. Where as Orbital or Underworld lets say , may not be the most Original music out there , but very enjoyable none the less. I will also say that "Beaucoup Fish" sounds quite different form "second toughest" with sound really different from "dubbemessingwithmyhead" . as does "middle of nowhere sound quite different then "insides". There is something to be said for that. I am now rambling on. .. more then 2 cents worth ... fernando wrote: > > At 03.04p -0700 18.08.99, MacDaddy wrote: > >> p.s. dunno if they came up in the "new bands we like" thread, but > >> Underworld's Beaucoup Fish reminds me a lot of He Said. > >Just another bunch w/out an original idea as well > >(everybody has a history - and their's tells alot - doot doot my arse) > > In order for music to be good, it does not have to be original... likewise, > something very original can be terribly boring or just worth for one > listen. I think that a good distillaton of influences and executed well can > be more satisfying than something original. ********************************* Obie Sanders/ System Administrator. ADN ********************************* ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 19:03:17 -0500 From: "MacDaddy" Subject: shiny silver people - redux - ----- Original Message ----- From: MacDaddy To: Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 6:53 PM Subject: shiny silver people - redux > Ah, I was hoping to stir things up a tad. > But, to clarify - the thing I have against Underworld/Freur... is the > flavour-of-the-week aspect to their recorded work > Esp - if you consider the consensioully dissed Sire record (S?) > Bros Harnal on the other hand seem to have a conviction - whether or not you > like their music - > There is no question that Underworld's work is well crafted > I , myself , preferconviction to craft any day of the week. > In U's favour is the fact that the end result is eminently listenable, > unlike so many who, in searching for commercial validation (and a way out of > that dodgy day job) glom onto this year's trend and ruin a perfectly good > personal voice. So often it is 'management' who encorages this nonsense. A > really decent post new-wave guitar and synth combo I was in headed the way > of 'grunge' (without me) and ran straight into the ground because our > principle songwriter and front man is the furthest thing from 'grungy'. I > have another friend who left his band after the label encoraged (and paid > for) vocal coaching, then upon hearing the results in the next set of demos, > rejected tham saying they wanted something "along the lines of Alanis > Morrisette". THe dumb leading the blind. > Oh well - enough ranting - just a little background into my 'personal' > feelings about flags of convenience and thos who fly them (however > successfully). > I think every Underworld success story gives validations to the teeming > hordes of 'A&R' and 'artistic directors' out there. > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 17:36:30 -0700 From: Obie Sanders Subject: Re: shiny silver people - redux Point well taken. I do think , in the case of Underworld , they are a far cry from "doot-doot" I commend them on that. Maybe I would have been better with a different example like U2 or the WHO would have worked for me. ;-) MacDaddy wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: MacDaddy > To: > Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 6:53 PM > Subject: shiny silver people - redux > > > Ah, I was hoping to stir things up a tad. > > But, to clarify - the thing I have against Underworld/Freur... is the > > flavour-of-the-week aspect to their recorded work > > Esp - if you consider the consensioully dissed Sire record (S?) > > Bros Harnal on the other hand seem to have a conviction - whether or not > you > > like their music - > > There is no question that Underworld's work is well crafted > > I , myself , preferconviction to craft any day of the week. > > In U's favour is the fact that the end result is eminently listenable, > > unlike so many who, in searching for commercial validation (and a way out > of > > that dodgy day job) glom onto this year's trend and ruin a perfectly good > > personal voice. So often it is 'management' who encorages this nonsense. > A > > really decent post new-wave guitar and synth combo I was in headed the way > > of 'grunge' (without me) and ran straight into the ground because our > > principle songwriter and front man is the furthest thing from 'grungy'. I > > have another friend who left his band after the label encoraged (and paid > > for) vocal coaching, then upon hearing the results in the next set of > demos, > > rejected tham saying they wanted something "along the lines of Alanis > > Morrisette". THe dumb leading the blind. > > Oh well - enough ranting - just a little background into my 'personal' > > feelings about flags of convenience and thos who fly them (however > > successfully). > > I think every Underworld success story gives validations to the teeming > > hordes of 'A&R' and 'artistic directors' out there. > > - -- ********************************* Obie Sanders/ System Administrator. ADN ********************************* ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Aug 1999 10:11:09 +0100 From: paul.rabjohn@ssab.com Subject: Re[2]: Very brief note about the Boston show... "why did you even bother going to the show if you didn't like Malka's new album OR the Oracle album OR Bastard?" you might well ask >>>> i guess some tapes of these shows are going to get passed around and i look forward to hearing what these sets were like , although opinions seem , shall we say , "mixed". i thought maybe the bastard/my pet fish stuff might take off live and loud , from comments made it doesn't seem like they did it that way. i still hope response to these us gigs makes them try it out in the uk as i'd love to see it for myself. p.s. dunno if they came up in the "new bands we like" thread, but Underworld's Beaucoup Fish reminds me a lot of He Said. and talking of electro music played live , i saw underworld at v98 last year and they were excellent. maybe this type of stuff works better in a big , loud venue with lots of films and lights and volume. i'm going to v99 at the weekend which includes orbital , they look good on film and i'm looking forward to seeing how they work it live. i never thought about underworld/he said but i think i see it a bit.p ------------------------------ End of idealcopy-digest V2 #154 *******************************