From: owner-harbinger-digest@smoe.org (harbinger-digest) To: harbinger-digest@smoe.org Subject: harbinger-digest V2 #80 Reply-To: harbinger@smoe.org Sender: owner-harbinger-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-harbinger-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk harbinger-digest Saturday, September 27 1997 Volume 02 : Number 080 HARBINGER DIGEST To post, mail harbinger@smoe.org To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger-digest To get list info file, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: info harbinger-digest Today's Subjects: ---------------- Re: (harbinger) Re: Talk,talk,talk ["mark boyle" ] Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? [Honoku@aol.com] Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? [Casey ] Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? [Casey ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 00:34:15 PDT From: "mark boyle" Subject: Re: (harbinger) Re: Talk,talk,talk Don't dis an artist you don't care for... show some respect!!!!although i agree that this comparison blather has got to go why has the paula page been any place for other artist discussions? mb >From owner-harbinger@smoe.org Thu Sep 25 18:27:36 1997 >Received: from jane.smoe.org (majordom@smoe.org [204.167.97.154]) > by relay1.shore.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA03127; > Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:27:20 -0400 (EDT) >Received: from localhost by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-listq-jane) > id VAA13061; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:02:47 -0400 >Received: by jane.smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.5); Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:02:39 -0400 >Received: by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-listq-jane) > id VAA13021; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:00:40 -0400 >Received: from emout07.mail.aol.com by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-daemon-mode-relay2) > id VAA13017; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:00:33 -0400 >From: RMest22585@aol.com >Received: (from root@localhost) > by emout07.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) > id UAA11644 for harbinger@smoe.org; > Thu, 25 Sep 1997 20:59:11 -0400 (EDT) >Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 20:59:11 -0400 (EDT) >Message-ID: <970925205651_-430268582@emout07.mail.aol.com> >To: harbinger@smoe.org >Subject: (harbinger) Re: Talk,talk,talk >Sender: owner-harbinger@smoe.org >Reply-To: harbinger@smoe.org >Precedence: bulk > > > > All this talk about Tori is boring, she is a wonnab !! a KATE BUSH >wont-a-be. > she whishes. > RM > >------------------------------ >To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: >unsubscribe harbinger > >Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: >http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html >For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 00:41:04 PDT From: "mark boyle" Subject: Re: (harbinger)Tori and Sarah question... HELLO!!!!!!!WHY ARE PEOPLE GIVING SO MUCH THOUGHT AND ENERGY AND POWER TO A STALKER? That's what they want: to be talked about.. that's what they thrive on... isn't that the same mentality that breeds serial killers?? I THINK THAT SARAH MOVED ON TO OTHER TOPICS TO WRITE ABOUT. I think carly simon said it best with, "YOU'RE SO VAIN". Right? sarcasm inserted here. mb >From owner-harbinger@smoe.org Thu Sep 25 20:26:41 1997 >Received: from jane.smoe.org (majordom@smoe.org [204.167.97.154]) > by relay1.shore.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA05775; > Thu, 25 Sep 1997 23:26:34 -0400 (EDT) >Received: from localhost by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-listq-jane) > id XAA15309; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 23:03:00 -0400 >Received: by jane.smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.5); Thu, 25 Sep 1997 23:02:48 -0400 >Received: by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-listq-jane) > id WAA15036; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 22:46:35 -0400 >Received: from mia.tisd.net by jane.smoe.org (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4-daemon-mode-relay2) > id WAA15020; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 22:46:10 -0400 >Received: from [207.243.120.45] (vic-1-15.tisd.net [207.243.120.45]) by mia.tisd.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA09057 for ; Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:44:47 -0500 >Message-Id: <199709260244.VAA09057@mia.tisd.net> >Subject: Re: (harbinger)Tori and Sarah question... >Date: Thu, 25 Sep 97 21:51:17 -0000 >x-sender: casey@mail.tisd.net >x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 >From: Casey >To: "Paula Mailing List" >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" >Sender: owner-harbinger@smoe.org >Reply-To: harbinger@smoe.org >Precedence: bulk > >>song. We have come to the conclusion that there is a slight chance of this >>detailing the stalker? Does anyone agree? If you listen to a lot of the >>lyrics you can clearly get that idea. But who knows, its also contradicted by >>"beautiful fucked up man" and such. > >Well, I can see where you're coming from ... but really *listen* to the >lyrics and I think you'll see why it's not. Other than "beautiful fucked >up man", and the line "...so careful when I'm in your arms". I don't >think she was ever in the stalker's arms. There are some more lines, but >I won't waste anymore mailbox space w/ them ;) > >-Casey > >P.S. >besides, she already wrote a song about the stalker ... "Possession" >-C. > >-+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+- >casey@tisd.net >http://www.tisd.net/~casey/ > >"If I shed a tear, I won't cage it ... if I feel a rage >I won't deny it ... I won't fear love" >-Sarah McLachlan > >"I have my own parties. They involve being barefoot with >a piece of fried chicken and a margarita in each hand." >-Tori Amos >-+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+- > > >------------------------------ >To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: >unsubscribe harbinger > >Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: >http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html >For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 15:13:54 +0300 From: sstewart@NTCGEN01HE.ntc.nokia.com (Stewart Steven NTC/INP-He) Subject: (harbinger) ani difranco? I've seen a few quotes from ani on a few of your posts. I've heard one song of hers on the Mountain CD compilation that had Paula's guitar version of Happy Home and another on the Best Friend's Wedding Soundtrack. I liked her voice and I like the wit in the lyrics I have seen. What album would you recommend for an ani virgin? I almost got the live double album, but decided I would wait to get some feedback first. Glad to know IDWTW is on a single here in Europe (Odd that they chose Hitler's Brothers as a track for a German release considering our recent conversations :)) I, too, would assume that IDWTW is the radio edit and the other two tracks are album cuts, but I haven't seen it here, so I don't know. Thanks, Steve Helsinki - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 09:44:27 -0400 From: Chris Tower Subject: (harbinger) Sarah BAM PETER G & Tori-Sarah, whew! On some date, yesterday I think, Kate, I believe, wrote: >>I dunno, for awile my friend and I have been discussing the meaning of this song. We have come to the conclusion that there is a slight chance of thi= s detailing the stalker? Does anyone agree? If you listen to a lot of the lyrics you can clearly get that idea. But who knows, its also contradicte= d by "beautiful fucked up man" and such. Just a thought.......<< I don't think it's contradicted by "beautiful fucked up man." It's possible that if this is a song about a stalker that Sarah can embrace hi= m at the same time as she wants him to go away. She has shown such tendenci= es before. On the other hand, I think trying to figure out what a song means to the musician is a pointless task. We all know that Sarah's songs are rarely autobiographical and often about another person or a combination of peopl= e. I think the important thing is what each of as individuals think the song= s means. Like, what does it mean to me? Looking for authorial intent is considered a logical fallacy by many critics and scholars, same thing her= e. Besides how will Sarah's autobiographical experience speak to me? It's probably too specific and narrow to inform my life whereas the song is mo= re universal and I can relate to that on symbolic and abstract levels. But then, there's the natural tendency in all of us to guess at other people's lives. I will constantly contradict myself by looking for autobi= o meaning in a musician's songs, like Paula's for instance. WHAT SONG would Paula sing if she covered a Gabriel tune asked BOB.... =46rom the singer who has a range from "throwing stones" to "me," I think= she and I have much in common. :-) = I would think that her voice is well suited to "Wallflower" off SECURITY.= AND Sara wrote that ------------------> >>I too am a journalist and reviewer and while comparisons are made i think they are too often against women. It is fairly rare to read a comparison of two male singers. << Agreed. You're absoutlely correct. I think we're on the same page here, totally. I go out of my way to never denigrate people unneccessarily (as opposed to constructive, necessary criticism). BUT this is another issue though, I think. It's unfortunate that there's been an "attitude" about female musicians/vocalists in the industry, but there it is. I think it's= changing. And I don't believe that it is at all useful to avoid making comparisons simply because they have been often used "against" women. I think comparisons can be made in a positive sense. I admit that when I first heard Tori, my reaction was that she was JUST a Kate Bush rip off. = To my ear, "Little Earthquakes" is heavily influenced by early Bush. But I kept listening to Tori because people I respected lauded her so highly. N= ow I would tell people that "if you like Kate Bush or will probably like Tori." As to the comparison thing used more between women than men, this may be true but there have been comparisons between male singers, often. >>Yes but it can also be damaging, eg tori comparisons to Kate Bush. Man= y people get turned off by comparisons to Kate even though they like tori.<= < Sure. But this is unavoidable. Some people get turned off by the use of t= he words "turned off." It's impossible to preclude the judgements of overly judgemental people. Even me. Hey, I didn't much like Tori at first. See above. But I have learned to love her work. >>In a tori interview i read she said she hated it as female musicians are often pitted against each other by the media.<< I think there's a difference between being "pitted against" and simply making comparisons. Look, Sara, big smile here..... :-) ....... I was just reacting to your "comparisons are unfair" statement. Are you really going to suggest that journalists and scholars of music (that's us!) should NEVER compare two musicians because it's "unfair" to them? >>if i have come across the wrong way then i am sorry, everything is said= nicely.<< You're cool. I was hoping that you could see me grinning, so I added some= grinning so you know I'm just trying to make the list more lively........= =2E. ;-) peace cbt - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 12:35:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Pipkyn@aol.com Subject: Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? > Paula's guitar version of Happy Home and another on the Best Friend's Wedding > Soundtrack. She has a song on the B.F.W. soundtrack? I've looked at that album and I don't remember Paula being on there. What song? > Glad to know IDWTW is on a single here in Europe (Odd that they chose > Hitler's Brothers as a track for a German release considering our recent > conversations :)) I, too, would assume that IDWTW is the radio edit and the > other two tracks are album cuts I find it interesting that they included Hitler's Bros. on this single, given the fact that it was included on the Ordinary single. I would assume it's NOT an album cut, but if anyone can confirm this, please do. I still haven't found the single out here (L.A. area). Irene - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 10:32:06 -0600 From: Rachel Cahn Subject: Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? Stewart Steven NTC/INP wrote: > What album would you recommend for an ani virgin? I almost got the live > double album, but decided I would wait to get some feedback first. I would definitely recommend "Living in Clip" at the top of the list. Ani is so incredible in her performances and that energy is captured in her live albumn. A friend of mine told me Ani had once said that all her studio albumns were mistakes -- they just fall short somehow but all the heat and heart of her songs is on the live one, IMHO. Yay, seeing Ani again next month! Rachel - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 14:51:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Honoku@aol.com Subject: Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? out of range ,is my favorite ani album. - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 97 22:15:45 -0000 From: Casey Subject: Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? >> Paula's guitar version of Happy Home and another on the Best Friend's >Wedding >> Soundtrack. >She has a song on the B.F.W. soundtrack? I've looked at that album and I >don't remember Paula being on there. What song? No, Paula didn't ... Ani did. - -C. - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Sep 97 22:14:27 -0000 From: Casey Subject: Re: (harbinger) ani difranco? >What album would you recommend for an ani virgin? I almost got the live >double album, but decided I would wait to get some feedback first. I have all of Ani's albums and I think "Living in Clip" is a great CD to start with. It has a lot of variety of her songs from all the different albums, plus her humor and personality really shine through with the between-song chatter. If you want a studio album, I'd suggest "Dilate". It's a very strong CD and I think her best and most mature to date. Most music critics agree. As far as my favorite studio album, it's a three-way tie between "Dilate", "Not A Pretty Girl", and "Out of Range". I don't think you'll be disappointed in any of them. Good luck, - -Casey - -+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+- casey@tisd.net http://www.tisd.net/~casey/ "If I shed a tear, I won't cage it ... if I feel a rage I won't deny it ... I won't fear love" - -Sarah McLachlan "I have my own parties. They involve being barefoot with a piece of fried chicken and a margarita in each hand." - -Tori Amos - -+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+--+-+-+-+- - ------------------------------ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe harbinger Digest, further unsub and problems FAQ at: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/harbinger.html For This Fire kinda-lyrics write Riphug@aol.com ------------------------------ End of harbinger-digest V2 #80 ******************************