From: owner-good-noise-digest@smoe.org (good-noise-digest) To: good-noise-digest@smoe.org Subject: good-noise-digest V3 #66 Reply-To: good-noise@smoe.org Sender: owner-good-noise-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-good-noise-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk good-noise-digest Friday, August 18 2000 Volume 03 : Number 066 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: JG Compilation [ThePsyche@aol.com] Re: good-noise-digest V3 #65 [Smithfinn@aol.com] Re: JG Compilation [Greg Steele ] Fwd: an inquiry [Davidfta@aol.com] Re: JG Compilation ["Mary Sansone" ] Re: JG compilation ["josanne" ] Re: JG compilation [ThePsyche@aol.com] Re: JG compilation ["Mike Smith" ] Re: JG Compilation [ThePsyche@aol.com] Re: JG compilation [Joe DeRouen ] Re: JG Compilation [JSJPMize@aol.com] Re: first limited bootleg of John Gorka sold out in 24 hours ! [JSJPMize@] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 08:02:47 EDT From: ThePsyche@aol.com Subject: Re: JG Compilation Barbara writes: << The argument of 'hunger and passion for new Gorka material' is as inane as that of a rapist who claims he 'just had to have' his victim.>> Comparing the wanting a bootleg CD to a rapist is just plain wrong. You are never the same after a rape happens to you. The pain and aftermath of a rape, a life altering event, is hardly analogous to buying a CD of Gorka music taped of Dutch radio. I am surprised at your comparison and even more surprised at the anger this seems to have generated in you. As for your comment: <> This ISN'T Survivor or Big Brother. No one kicks anyone else out. You choose to stay and be part of this list yourself. Your opinion is just that, your opinion. Dissenting opinions happen often on these kinds of lists. So do angry, attacking posts that are easy to write with the anonymity of a keyboard and a screen to hide behind. I would welcome a dialogue about bootlegs and making tapes for friends, etc. What you did in your post only creates anger and is destructive to unity and friendship in this kind of community. My comment, Bryn, a thief, plain and simple? Sure there are wars, disease, injustice Rich men walking on your hands But tell me how can you ever take a breath of hope Talking down your fellow man? John Gorka ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 09:20:54 EDT From: Smithfinn@aol.com Subject: Re: good-noise-digest V3 #65 Bryn is having troiuble getting this post through and asked me to try again for her.... Subj: my response Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 9:30:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time From: ThePsyche To: Smithfinn jderouen@sparkynet.com writes: << I think I missed something - who's selling the compilations? And can I get a copy? :) Joe DeRouen >> I think what Joe wrote pretty much sums up how I feel about the compilation being made and sent out to Gorka-Heads. We want the music, we love the music. For as long as there has been a way to share music, people have done that. With the growth of the Internet it has happened more and I understand the management position on that. But as a music buying fan, I find it simply amazing that one wonderful soul across the ocean is offering to make these cost. Jos has been a part of this community almost from the beginning and has shared her beautiful photos at the web site and has time and again written about her love of this music. While I understand the worry of quality and quantity, I think it should be made clear that Jos is not making any money on these. It is friends sharing music. The $15 is what it cost for the making of and mailing of the CD. A year or more ago I made a tape of John's music for a friend who had never heard him. It was 60 minutes of my favorite Gorka songs. Since that time, he has gone out and bought all the CDs and seen John perform twice. I think it is important to mention that those of us who participate here have long understood the bootleg thing and in no way make money by selling John's music. It is in fact the other way around....by sharing our love of the music, we in turn introduce others to it. That is one of the main reasons I joined the house concert stream. There are so many musicians and singer/songwriters I love and yet so many of my friends still listen to the music they listened to in High School. Every few months now, a different independent artist comes to the house, sings to about 30 people sitting on folding chairs in my living room, they sell their CDs and tell their stories and spend the night with us, have breakfast and go on their way. My house will never feel the same since the music has filled this space. People who come love the experience and I can not tell you how many times I have heard people say, "I didn't know there was this kind of music out there. How did you find it or hear it?" The Internet. As for quality...well, that is John's life and that is what he should be concerned with. But let me say this: This past Saturday a friend called me from The Festival in The Pines in MA. John was performing there. When I picked up the phone, John was just beginning Branching Out and I got to listen for the next 40 minutes or so. I heard old familiar songs and a couple new songs too. The quality...via a satellite connection on a scratchy cell phone.....perfect for a Gorkanatic. That is what is special about this community of good noise folks. It is the connection made to the lyrics and the stories and the humor. No wonder I jumped at the chance to have some new Gorka music all the way from Holland. And with the new music comes a connection made, a new friend. And that, to me, is the best reason to be a part of the good noise list. To have a place to meet folks who share my good taste in music. FYI if you are in the Chicago area or want to travel: October 22, On The Map House Concerts welcomes singer/songwriters Justin Roth and Chris Cunningham. For more info email me privately. I have a bootleg of their music. JUST KIDDING! Adios, Bryn, music junkie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 07:32:16 -0400 From: Greg Steele Subject: Re: JG Compilation I think had this been done a little differently, it wouldn't have the same smack of "bootleg" to it. On another maillist I belong to, and with the artist's permission, live recordings and other unreleased material is offered free in exchange for trades of other music or blank tapes and postage. I realize it takes time to make these copies, so one's time should be considered before offering to do such. It has worked extremely well, great music gets around, the word gets spread, and no one is profiting at the expense of the artist. With regard to John's stuff (and with the greatest love and respect for his music), it is not likely that some pirate CD mill is going to churn out thousands of copies of this little compilation and sell them. And I know Jos has contributed a lot to the fan site (now sadly running on auto-pilot) that Anne had. But the principle is (or should be), if the stuff is in released form, buy it in that form. Preferable at a show, where he gets more of the purchase price, if I understand that system correctly. The compilation that Jos was offering might not cut into John's income stream tremendously, but don't you think some of John's fans could appreciate hearing more of the music of the other artists on those cds and samplers? Just my 2 cents... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 10:49:22 EDT From: Davidfta@aol.com Subject: Fwd: an inquiry - --part1_61.6706887.26cd5572_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/16/2000 9:32:54 AM Eastern Daylight Time, ThePsyche@aol.com writes: << good-noise@smoe.org >> The cd is in the works, with a hopeful release date of late Jan. We should know if the next couple weeks if that is going to happen or not. We'll keep everyone updated...David - --part1_61.6706887.26cd5572_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (rly-yb02.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.2]) by air-yb02.mail.aol.com (v75_b3.11) with ESMTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:32:54 -0400 Received: from smoe.org (jane.smoe.org [216.200.102.14]) by rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (v75_b3.9) with ESMTP; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:32:32 -0400 Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) with SMTP id JAA21273; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:26:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: by smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.10); Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:26:05 -0400 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) id JAA21258 for good-noise-outgoing; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:25:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imo-d10.mx.aol.com (imo-d10.mx.aol.com [205.188.157.42]) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/daemon-mode-jane) with ESMTP id JAA21252 for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:25:49 -0400 (EDT) From: ThePsyche@aol.com Received: from ThePsyche@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v27.12.) id p.6a.5c266cb (4204) for ; Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:25:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6a.5c266cb.26cbf039@aol.com> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:25:13 EDT Subject: an inquiry To: good-noise@smoe.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 118 Sender: owner-good-noise@smoe.org Reply-To: good-noise@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Hello Good-Noisers. I am looking for and inquiring if there are still Fleming-Tamulevich representatives on this list. I have a question. There was some buzz a while back about a new CD coming out in the fall. Is that still going to happen? This year sometime? Or later? All the Red House Record updates that come out rarely even mention John's name let alone any stuff about a new CD or where he is touring. Thanks. Adios, Bryn, music junkie - --part1_61.6706887.26cd5572_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 16:31:03 -0500 From: "Mary Sansone" Subject: Re: JG Compilation Bryn, I hope someday to make it to Chicago for one of your house concerts....and when I do I will ask you to play this CD for me because I didnt get one. NOT because I thought it wrong, just because I was short on cash this month and didnt get an email to Jos. Perfect Gorka verse for unnessecary hostiliy. It was through a friend (and a bootleg CD) that I came to know John's music and I have bought each of his CDs, (a few at his concerts) plus several that he has one song on. Peace and hugs Mary - -Original Message----- From: ThePsyche@aol.com To: good-noise@smoe.org Date: Thursday, August 17, 2000 7:14 AM >Sure there are wars, disease, injustice >Rich men walking on your hands >But tell me how can you ever take a breath of hope >Talking down your fellow man? > >John Gorka > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 00:12:58 +0200 From: "josanne" Subject: Re: JG compilation Hi David (John's manager !) this is Jos from Holland (the bad guy !!) I am proud that John want to have a copy of the (again; very limited) bootleg CD. You are lucky because after making the 10 copies I wanted to delete the CD from my harddisk. Now I make one more for John and than it's over (sorry Bill Eley, Joe DeRouen and many others who also want a copy) I a'm just a great John Gorka fan from the other side of your world and I don't want to "make" money with John's music. (And you can not make money this way because it cost a lot of time to make a CD with a very good quality printed cover.It takes about one hour each CD and than the shipping things etc) Ofcourse John don't have to pay for this CD: It is a nice way for me to "pay" for the royalties !! Greg Steele wrote: "live recordings and other unreleased material is offered free in exchange for trades of other music or blank tapes and postage" For year I tried to exchange for trades but I think there are not so many people who have a live tape of John Gorka. Another thing for me is that I wanted to provoke the record label with this small illegal action (Red house records be honest: we have to wait to long for a new record. Make for example 1000 copies of a live show like we saw on that wonderfull video "the artist Profile" for the hardcore fans, or make a sampler with all the songs John made for other samplers). Regards from Jos ps1; David (Davidfta@aol.com ) can you give me the adress from John Gorka for his CD. ps2: Thanks Bryn for the nice words, you wrote "Jos has been a part of this community almost from the beginning and has shared her beautiful photos at the web site and has time and again written about her love of this music." But there is one thing: I am a man ! My name is Jos and my girlfriend, who is also my wife, is named Anne so both we are "josanne". ps 3 And again sorry for my bad English. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 18:29:15 EDT From: ThePsyche@aol.com Subject: Re: JG compilation j.h.m.van.vliet01@freeler.nl writes: << Thanks Bryn for the nice words, you wrote "Jos has been a part of this community almost from the beginning and has shared her beautiful photos at the web site and has time and again written about her love of this music." But there is one thing: I am a man ! My name is Jos and my girlfriend, who is also my wife, is named Anne so both we are "josanne". >> I told someone else you were a man, a good and decent and gentle man who would never make money off the back of a poor folk song boy, but they talked me into believing that you were josanne. Next time, I will listen to my instincts. You have the bad English of a guy. I love that you think of your wife as your girlfriend. Such a lovely image. Thank you for your very genuine writing, especially in the face of such angry words earlier. You said it all eloquently. I would like to leave you all with this Dutch poem: Ben ik in Nederland geland, voel ik dit is mijn vaderland. Ik zie de molens en de gracht, de haringkar, de bloemenpracht, de markten en de pofferkraam, schone gordijntjes voor elk raam, patat, terrassen en de zee, het draaiorgel, een bruin cafe. Maar na een week zie ik de regen, verbogen borden, volle wegen, huizen met te dunne muren, de overlast van zoveel buren. Op Zondag nooit een winkel open, voor de T.V. maar blijven hopen, de hondepoep, school met den Bijbel, in de families altijd heibel. De vakantie doet me leren waarom we gingen emigreren. Truusje Schenkels Kaas & Co. U.S.A. Ahh, they have EVERYTHING on this thing called the Internet....everything that is except a decent John Gorka Web Site. Namaste Jos, Anne and everyone else, Bryn, music junkie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:46:05 GMT From: "Mike Smith" Subject: Re: JG compilation David, I have a question for you related to all the controversy on the list lately. I've had thoughts of working together with others on this list to get singles by John that appear on CD's other than his own and burning them into a single CD. I love his music above all others, but have no interest in paying $14.00 or whatever the CD cost to get to the one song by John. My question is this. With the internet, and the ability to transfer music acrossed it to just about anywhere in the world, has John, or the people who work for John, ever considered selling these "singles" over the internet to people like me, or the people on this list, to download? I'm sure there would be legal hoops to be jumped through, but the good people on this list (me included) wouldn't have to feel like bandits to get to hear these other songs. Any thoughts? Mike ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:42:35 EDT From: ThePsyche@aol.com Subject: Re: JG Compilation gsteele@steelerubber.com writes: << And I know Jos has contributed a lot to the fan site (now sadly running on auto-pilot) that Anne had. >> Some inside scoop for all you good noisers. I have it on good authority that the site is being revamped and taken over by some diehard, bootlegger type chicks. Watch here for information. Adios, Bryn, gorka junkie ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 22:16:41 -0500 From: Joe DeRouen Subject: Re: JG compilation If anyone who actually got a copy of this wants to send it to me, I'll gladly make CD copies for everyone who wants one for the cost of CDs and postage. Joe josanne wrote: > I am proud that John want to have a copy of the (again; very limited) > bootleg CD. You are lucky because after making the 10 copies I wanted to > delete the CD from my harddisk. Now I make one more for John and than it's > over (sorry Bill Eley, Joe DeRouen and many others who also want a copy) I > a'm just a great John Gorka fan from the other side of your world and I > don't want to "make" money with John's music. (And you can not make money > this way because it cost a lot of time to make a CD with a very good quality > printed cover.It takes about one hour each CD and than the shipping things > etc) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 23:38:41 EDT From: JSJPMize@aol.com Subject: Re: JG Compilation Hi Bryn, I've never written before, but am one of the evil ones who ordered a bootleg and wanted to say a few things. Being a singer/songwriter myself I agree that artists should be compensated for their art. But, as was said previously, we Gorka fans were and are not out to make John bankrupt. Those who ordered the CD I assume have every recording of his and have driven miles and miles to attend 5, 7, 10 plus shows in their life times. To the one named "Barbara" - it is rather unfortunate that she would compare such a horrid act as "rape" to recording a couple of tunes to share with others. I would like to ask Barbara, "Have you ever borrowed a book from someone or loaned one out to read? If so, did you send a check to the author? Have you ever read a magazine in a waiting room or lobby and not paid the columnist? Have you ever made a xerox from something copywrited without giving money to the originator? Have you ever stood and listened to a street artist or a coffee house amatuer and walked away without tipping or simply giving them a mere dollar or two?" There is theft and there is common sense - which I would hope all Gorka fans have after pondering his music. Anway, thanks Bryn for the things you do. Your last name isn't "Scott" is it? Also, I know Justin Roth and am familiar with Chris Cunningham. They are awesome! Hope the house concert goes well! - peace - mpj ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2000 23:51:32 EDT From: JSJPMize@aol.com Subject: Re: first limited bootleg of John Gorka sold out in 24 hours ! Hi Jos This is Josh Misner - one of the buyers - I'm sending you the cash tomorrow - just to let you know! thanks - you're not a thief! -mpj (misner p. josh) ------------------------------ End of good-noise-digest V3 #66 *******************************