From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V19 #7 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, January 28 2011 Volume 19 : Number 007 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Dave's kid's been misbehaving [2fs ] Re: Dave's kid's been misbehaving [Jeremy Osner ] Buddy, can you hear me? [Jill Brand ] Re: Buddy, can you hear me? [Jason Brown ] Re: Buddy, can you hear me? [Rex Broome ] Re: Buddy, can you hear me? [2fs ] Re: Buddy, can you hear me? [Rex Broome ] Re:WTF? [grutness@slingshot.co.nz] Re: WTF? [Rex Broome ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 17:23:27 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Dave's kid's been misbehaving On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 4:24 PM, FS Thomas wrote: > > http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jtwjjCgPpM5JtJ1zxVTFmmVIBk > ww?docId=CNG.7bfcfd891f40aa72354703f627bc22bc.9f1 > "mannequin leg"? I wonder if he'd been...uh, comfortably numb beforehand? - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.wordpress.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:25:31 -0500 From: Jeremy Osner Subject: Re: Dave's kid's been misbehaving The mannequin leg is a nice touch. 2011/1/27 FS Thomas : > http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jtwjjCgPpM5JtJ1zxVTFmmVIBk > ww?docId=CNG.7bfcfd891f40aa72354703f627bc22bc.9f1 > > Son of Pink Floyd star charged over student protest > > (AFP) 1 hour ago > > LONDON The son of Pink Floyd guitarist David Gilmour was charged Thursday > with violent disorder and theft of a mannequin leg after he was pictured > swinging off Britain's national war memorial during a student riot. > > Charlie Gilmour, 21, was one of seven people charged by London's > Metropolitan Police force and will appear at City of Westminster > Magistrates' Court on February 10. > > A further five people were cautioned as part of Operation Malone, which was > launched by the force to investigate large scale protests which were staged > in London during November and December. > > The son of journalist Polly Samson, Gilmour was adopted by the Pink Floyd > star after the couple married in 1994. > > Gilmour said in a statement issued after the December 9 protest that he was > sorry for the "terrible insult" to the country's war dead after he was > pictured clambering up the Cenotaph and swinging on a British flag. > > "I feel nothing but shame. Running along with a crowd of people who had just > been violently repelled by the police, I got caught up in the spirit of the > moment," Gilmore added. > > A former model who now studies history at Britain's prestigious Cambridge > University, Gilmour said he did not realise it was the Cenotaph at the time. > > Police did not say where the mannequin leg was stolen from. > > A car carrying Prince Charles, the heir to the throne, and his wife Camilla > was attacked during the demonstration which turned violent after parliament > voted in favour of raising university tuition fees as much as threefold. > > Police arrested the student at his Sussex home on December 12. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 22:37:18 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Brand Subject: Buddy, can you hear me? I mean, really? It's almost the exact same fucking song, just not as good. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 20:00:57 -0800 From: Jason Brown Subject: Re: Buddy, can you hear me? Maybe they actually credited Robyn on the CD liner notes and sent his publishing comapny a portion of their likely non-existent royalties? I'm guessing not but one can hope. This sort of thing has long history in folk and blues music. And one example recent is the Old 97's song "Champaign, Illinois" which uses the tune of Dylan's "Desolation Row" and was approved by Bob himself. You can hear the song here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uVDoYdYS8w Any other modern examples of this phenomenon? - -- Man of wisdom, and man of compromise, man of weak flesh in an armored disguise, all fall down. - - Robert Pollard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 20:21:58 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: Re: Buddy, can you hear me? On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 8:00 PM, Jason Brown wrote: > Maybe they actually credited Robyn on the CD liner notes and sent his > publishing comapny a portion of their likely non-existent royalties? > I'm guessing not but one can hope. > I said as much in my blog post: we may be lacking context, RH may be credited, etc. But generally then this is done, you either put the name of the original tune in parentheses after the new title, or you make sure that every bit of press, the tagged mp3s that go out, etc. make note that it is a reworked cover. Especially since a lot of bands get noticed initially by doing unusual covers. So it could be innocent, yes. But it's also naive to borrow someone's tune and then not take precautions against getting the exact reaction we're having. Hell, if we'd been introduced to this in some form where the artist tipped his hat to Robyn, we might well think it was cool and then we'd be all into Buddy (I feel like a De La Soul dropout saying that), but as it is we're sort of pissed at him/them. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 22:44:47 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Buddy, can you hear me? On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 10:21 PM, Rex Broome wrote: > On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 8:00 PM, Jason Brown > wrote: > > > Maybe they actually credited Robyn on the CD liner notes and sent his > > publishing comapny a portion of their likely non-existent royalties? > > I'm guessing not but one can hope. > > > > I said as much in my blog post: we may be lacking context, RH may be > credited, etc. But generally then this is done, you either put the name of > the original tune in parentheses after the new title, or you make sure that > every bit of press, the tagged mp3s that go out, etc. make note that it is > a > reworked cover. Especially since a lot of bands get noticed initially by > doing unusual covers. > > So it could be innocent, yes. But it's also naive to borrow someone's tune > and then not take precautions against getting the exact reaction we're > having. Hell, if we'd been introduced to this in some form where the > artist > tipped his hat to Robyn, we might well think it was cool and then we'd be > all into Buddy (I feel like a De La Soul dropout saying that), but as it is > we're sort of pissed at him/them. > Right. First, however much we sometimes like to pretend, the original isn't really in the "folk idiom" (neither is most so-called "folk music") in that it's thoroughly enmeshed in a commercial network. And note, too, this is entirely different from, say, unauthorized sampling, etc....which is bits and pieces. There's "being influenced," or even "trying to write a song that sounds like" (lotsa '60s hits that do that...)...and then there's "we are fucking lazy and played this song with a few wrong chords and wrote our own half-assed words on top of it." There's even "this is the same song and we're nudging and winking at it": in the chalkhills.orgseries of XTC tributes, for example, there's a version of "Helicopter" that totally steals the bass part from "Walk on the Wild Side": that's an obvious homage. But - note that Lou's song is so famous that nearly everyone would recognize it w/o having to give any credit...plus the performers go on to do something more with it. Seriously, if the song had been called "It's Cold in Silverlake (Homage to Robyn)" or something, I wouldn't care. Or even "It's Cold in Silverlake (Flesh Number Two)." Something to acknowledge the obvious borrowing. I do wonder if Robyn or his publishers are aware of this. On the one hand, if they're being magnanimous, I get that...although this one's *so* obvious I kinda want to see the band get slapped (esp. since it got placed in a TV show or movie, right?). - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.wordpress.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 08:35:29 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: Re: Buddy, can you hear me? On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 8:44 PM, 2fs wrote: > > I do wonder if Robyn or his publishers are aware of this. On the one hand, > if they're being magnanimous, I get that...although this one's *so* obvious > I kinda want to see the band get slapped (esp. since it got placed in a TV > show or movie, right?). > > I think so... what's definitely clear is that the majority of Buddy's exposure is through licensing: their site lists at least five or six shows, ads or movies featuring their tunes. There are a LOT of indie bands relying on that as their bread and butter. I'm not sure how I feel about that whole phenomenon. The part that feels ooky to me is not so much the traditional "sellout"/commercialism knock, but more the idea of cobbling together your whole fanbase from slavish subgroups of other, nonmusical fandoms... there are a lot of people whose only exposure to new music is through their favorite show (think "Glee" but on a million smaller scales) and they literally will like any band whose music appears on said show. So you're hitching your musical success to those several wagons, and it smacks a little bit of, I dunno, taking advantage of retarded people or something. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2011 10:51:38 +1300 From: grutness@slingshot.co.nz Subject: Re:WTF? BTW, don't think I've ever mentioned thishere before, but some of you might get ba kick or laugh out of the fact that one of NZ's most famous academics and historians was Sir Peter Buck. James - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 16:33:08 -0800 From: Rex Broome Subject: Re: WTF? On Fri, Jan 28, 2011 at 1:51 PM, wrote: > BTW, don't think I've ever mentioned thishere before, but some of you > might get ba kick or laugh out of the fact that one of NZ's most famous > academics and historians was Sir Peter Buck. > And was he famous for his numerous and acrimonious dismissals of the works of Sir Thomas Clark? ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V19 #7 ******************************