From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V16 #709 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Sunday, September 14 2008 Volume 16 : Number 709 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology ["Brian Huddell" ] Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology ["kevin studyvin" ] Reap ["Jeremy Osner" ] Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology ["Stewart C. Russell" ] it warms the heart [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology ["kevin studyvin" Subject: RE: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology Jeff: > Weighing in on the "advanced degrees in English" front: I will say that > it's overstated to say it's "not knowing what the word is," as if > pronunciation is an eternal aspect of a word essential to its identity. Generally, yes, but I really think in the case of "nucular" it is a result of people not bothering to notice in what order the letters occur (and then other people growing up and hanging out with those people). I think that's why some of us find it so grating. What I have always thought about "nucular" is that "nuclear" contains a combination of syllables that isn't found in many English words outside of the world of science. So people use familiar words like "spectacular" and "jocular" as models, assuming that "nuclear" belongs in that family instead of the less familiar "nucleus" family. Doesn't bother me coming from any but those who get to read the label on the "Nuclear Annihilation" button. Even then it's just irritating -- not worthy of a superior dance. +brian ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 12:05:50 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology On 9/13/08, Brian Huddell wrote: > > What I have always thought about > "nucular" is that "nuclear" contains a combination of syllables that isn't > found in many English words outside of the world of science. So people use > familiar words like "spectacular" and "jocular" as models, assuming that > "nuclear" belongs in that family instead of the less familiar "nucleus" > family. "Molecular." - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 10:15:57 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology > Generally, yes, but I really think in the case of "nucular" it is a result > of people not bothering to notice in what order the letters occur > The technical term is "illiteracy." > What I have always thought about "nucular" is that "nuclear" contains a > combination of syllables that isn't found in many English words outside of > the world of science. So people use familiar words like "spectacular" and > "jocular" as models, assuming that "nuclear" belongs in that family instead > of the less familiar "nucleus" family. > Good point. Which makes it a special case of illiteracy - the science kind. Whatever the formal name for that is. > > > Doesn't bother me coming from any but those who get to read the label on > the "Nuclear Annihilation" button. Even then it's just irritating -- not > worthy of a superior dance. > But if you're old enough to remember back in the olden days when being smart was a social asset, and mere literacy was taken for granted, it just generally kind of sucks. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 10:57:05 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology On Sat, Sep 13, 2008 at 7:54 AM, 2fs wrote: > "Nucular" is the latter, for me and for many > others. I think it's quite likely that by now, Bush and some of the other > folks in his admin and circle who pronounce it that way actually know how > it's pronounced, but mispronounce it intentionally both to curry favor with > the redneck I'M IGNINT AN PRUOD! crowd and to annoy those elitist liberals > prissily insisting on some high-falutin' Harvard pronunciation. > Yep. I'm dead sure that some who had previously pronounced the word properly have been coached to mispronounce it for exactly this effect. The Palin charade is finally wearing thin, even among the lowfalutin folks,... right? Right? - -Rex, mediumfalutin, most days ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 11:16:18 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology The Palin charade is finally wearing thin, even among the lowfalutin folks,... right? Right? We can only hope. I fear the moist and clammy hand of Rove, weaving its vile spell once more... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 16:39:51 -0400 From: "Stewart Russell" Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology 2008/9/13 kevin studyvin : > > The technical term is "illiteracy." That's a bit harsh (mainly 'cos Catherine, a Eng Lit PhD and Marshall Scholar, pronounces it that way). I still think it's a regional thing, like "warsh", and Scotland's "eastren", "westren" and "pattren". Mind you, I don't think it excuses that Faux-Texas Yankee. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 11:01:44 +1200 From: James Dignan Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology >I think it's quite likely that by now, Bush and some of the other >folks in his admin and circle who pronounce it that way actually know how >it's pronounced, but mispronounce it intentionally both to curry favor with >the redneck I'M IGNINT AN PRUOD! crowd and to annoy those elitist liberals >prissily insisting on some high-falutin' Harvard pronunciation. which pretty much sums up everything you need to know about US politics at the highest level - it's more important that you're hypocritically pretending an accent to condescend to rednecks than it is that you appear like morons to the rest of the world. James (hey, "morons" - isnt that what's about to be smashed together in that LHC thingy?) - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 18:52:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Poem Lover Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology I understand what you're saying, but I disagree a bit only because pronunciation and spelling are two different things. If one pronounces the word as it is spelled, one is unlikely to say "nukular." That's all I meant. - --- On Sat, 9/13/08, 2fs wrote: From: 2fs Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology To: "Poem Lover" Cc: fegmaniax@smoe.org Date: Saturday, September 13, 2008, 2:54 PM On 9/13/08, Poem Lover wrote: > > It's not pronouncing it wrong, it's not knowing what the word is! It's > NUCLEAR, not NUKULER and yet people still get it wrong. I find it > irritating, > too, but I'm an English professor so I'm allowed. Weighing in on the "advanced degrees in English" front: I will say that it's overstated to say it's "not knowing what the word is," as if pronunciation is an eternal aspect of a word essential to its identity. It's entirely possible that the accepted pronunciation of the word (any word) will change over time, such that people might be surprised to find that it was pronounced quite differently a hundred years before. For whatever reason, though, some of those changes seem harmless or even salutary, while others come across like fingernails on a chalkboard run through a stack of Marshalls. "Nucular" is the latter, for me and for many others. I think it's quite likely that by now, Bush and some of the other folks in his admin and circle who pronounce it that way actually know how it's pronounced, but mispronounce it intentionally both to curry favor with the redneck I'M IGNINT AN PRUOD! crowd and to annoy those elitist liberals prissily insisting on some high-falutin' Harvard pronunciation. - -- ....Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 18:55:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Poem Lover Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology Oh! I see your point. I missed it before---sorry. I'm half awake due to very late Friday night lights. I have 2 kids in the band and we had a game that didn't get us home until 1 or something. - --- On Sat, 9/13/08, Rex wrote: From: Rex Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology To: "2fs" Cc: "Poem Lover" , fegmaniax@smoe.org Date: Saturday, September 13, 2008, 5:57 PM On Sat, Sep 13, 2008 at 7:54 AM, 2fs wrote: > "Nucular" is the latter, for me and for many > others. I think it's quite likely that by now, Bush and some of the other > folks in his admin and circle who pronounce it that way actually know how > it's pronounced, but mispronounce it intentionally both to curry favor with > the redneck I'M IGNINT AN PRUOD! crowd and to annoy those elitist liberals > prissily insisting on some high-falutin' Harvard pronunciation. > Yep. I'm dead sure that some who had previously pronounced the word properly have been coached to mispronounce it for exactly this effect. The Palin charade is finally wearing thin, even among the lowfalutin folks,... right? Right? - -Rex, mediumfalutin, most days ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 02:18:28 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: NEW on DiME: RHE 1991-11-01 *FM* Town & Country Club London UK http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-details.php?id=214416 Robyn Hitchcock & The Egyptians 1991-11-01 Town & Country Club London UK taping date: 1992-01-05 lineage: KITS 105.3 FM broadcast > Sony SLV-676UC VHS VCR [EP speed PCM] > Panasonic DMR-ES35V playback > Audacity (capture) > CD Wave Editor (tracksplits) > FLAC(6) Opening for Billy Bragg. Not known if this is their entire set or if this was edited for broadcast. Tracklist: 00 - announcer (Mark Hamilton) intro [0:31] 01 - Oceanside [3:51] 02 - Birds In Perspex [3:54] 03 - Chinese Bones [4:25] 04 - Somewhere Apart [2:59] 05 - Ride [4:44] 06 - So You Think You're In Love [2:47] 07 - Child Of The Universe [3:41] 08 - Ultra Unbelievable Love [3:58] 09 - announcer (Mark Hamilton) outro [0:36] TOTAL [31:26] See http://www.jh3.com/robyn/base/gig.asp?chubb=377 for identifying intro. All announcer talkovers have been kept for program continuity. There's an announcer interstital between 'Somewhere Apart' and 'Ride', which has been tracked to be the end of 'Somewhere Apart'. There's a brief dropout about 0:18 into 'Ride', this actually sounds like a broadcasting glitch rather than a capture issue, but I can't be totally sure. I kept meticulous records, but had to scrouge around eBay for a while trying to find a matching picture of the VCR I used. BTW, the Sony SLV-676UC was a really good unit (4-head with flying erase head) that fell afoul of the common eject/tape munch problem caused by a failing reverse cam gear. I'm in the process of ordering another identical unit as while the Panasonic deck used here is a great standalone VHS > DVD converter, it has some problems with tracking the 100+ VHS tapes I've amassed with these sorts of PCM recordings. lammah my blog is "Yer Blog" http://fab4yerblog.blogspot.com/ http://robotsarestealingmyluggage.blogspot.com/ **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com. (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 00:40:34 -0700 From: "Benjamin Lukoff" Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #708 > From: 2fs > > All the rest of whom? Northwesterners? "Nookyooler" is quite popular > > 'round these parts -- I even grew up pronouncing it that way. > > It may be popular but that doesn't make it any less wrong - or illogical > given the word's spelling. > Nonstandard != wrong Illogical given spelling yes, but then so is "iron" (eye-urn) > > I know, I know, I know...language changes, etc. etc. > But "nucular" still grates - and whenever I hear it, my estimation of the > speaker's intelligence is dramatically revised downward. > Fair enough. Too bad you would have thought it of me, though, if you'd met me 20 years ago! > From: 2fs > On 9/13/08, Poem Lover wrote: > > > > It's not pronouncing it wrong, it's not knowing what the word is! It's > > NUCLEAR, not NUKULER and yet people still get it wrong. I find it > > irritating, > > too, but I'm an English professor so I'm allowed. > English lit? > > Weighing in on the "advanced degrees in English" front: I will say that > it's > overstated to say it's "not knowing what the word is," as if pronunciation > is an eternal aspect of a word essential to its identity. It's entirely > possible that the accepted pronunciation of the word (any word) will change > over time, such that people might be surprised to find that it was > pronounced quite differently a hundred years before. > Indeed. Nothing about language is static. > > For whatever reason, though, some of those changes seem harmless or even > salutary, while others come across like fingernails on a chalkboard run > through a stack of Marshalls. "Nucular" is the latter, for me and for many > Isn't that "some reason" the fact that certain changes are associated with social groups you simply don't like? Not saying there's anything wrong with you for this; we all do it. But surely you wouldn't find "nucular" grating if it were associated with... well, if that was the way you pronounced it, for example, you obviously wouldn't find it grating. Nor would you likely find it grating if it were the standard newscaster pronunciation. But "nucular" is associated with hicks and W, and my guess is you're not too fond of both... > others. I think it's quite likely that by now, Bush and some of the other > folks in his admin and circle who pronounce it that way actually know how > it's pronounced, but mispronounce it intentionally both to curry favor with > the redneck I'M IGNINT AN PRUOD! crowd and to annoy those elitist liberals > prissily insisting on some high-falutin' Harvard pronunciation. > > Probably. Just like they still say "Democrat Party." I'm sure that started out as a hick-type variant, caused some consternation on the left, and then became adopted as a badge of honor. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 07:13:52 -0400 From: "Jeremy Osner" Subject: Reap David Foster Wallace hanged himself on Friday. http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/california/la-me-wallace14-2008sep14,0,4713013.story Any of you who are not familiar with his work, well, *Infinite Jest* is a pretty key contemporary American novel, and sui generis. Learn more about his life and his work at http://www.davidfosterwallace.com/ J - -- READIN 2.0 http://www.readin.com/blog/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 08:07:06 -0400 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology James Dignan wrote: > > James (hey, "morons" - isnt that what's about to be smashed together in > that LHC thingy?) No, that's hardons ... Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 08:34:00 -0400 From: "(0% rh)" Subject: Re: Reap > David Foster Wallace hanged himself on Friday. > http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/california/la-me-wallace14-2008sep14,0,4713013.story > > Any of you who are not familiar with his work, well, *Infinite Jest* > is a pretty key contemporary American novel, and sui generis. Learn > more about his life and his work at http://www.davidfosterwallace.com/ okay, i know i *can* handle this, but i just want to kind of scream: i can't handle this! i've written all of two or three fan letters my adult life. one was to wallace (to which he kindly replied) basically saying (in a way that i'm sure is less Single White Female that it will sound) that i was happy that he existed. alas. on a "bad timing" note, i had left a phone message about my mother's death with my ex-boyfriend yesterday, and received a short e-mail of condolences, saying that "i know how much you cared about *him*" (emphasis mine.) there was then a bit of confusion. as ever lauren - -- "people with opinions just go around bothering one another." -- the buddha ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 10:52:05 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: it warms the heart this recording was made by the same person who taped many of the shows from the capitol theater in port chester,ny from 70-71.the opening act was trapeze with glenn hughes. The Port Chester Restoration project Capitol Theatre- Port Chester, NY Audience recordings by Ken and Judy Lee 1970-1971 Ken and Judy Lee didn't think anyone would be interested in hearing their recordings... Between the years 1970 and 1971, Ken worked security at The Capitol Theatre in Port Chester, New York, while his girlfriend Judy ran movie projections between sets. One of a few live music taping enthusiasts of the time, Ken was granted exclusive permission by club promoter Howard Stein to record the shows at the theatre for his own personal use. Judy was on hand to perform the tape flips while Ken was busy doing his job. In 1968, the couple took Judy's brother Mark, who was nine years old to his first concert at "Cafe Wha?" in New York City. The Monkees were on tour and Jimi Hendrix was along for the ride as their opening act. Several years later, Mark was introduced to the music of the Grateful Dead at the Nassau Coliseum on March 19th, 1973 in Uniondale, Long Island. This single event marked the beginning of a life long odyssey of musical experiences with the band that affected him most deeply. Along with his good friend, John Jay Hance, who Mark met at a Dead show in 1979, the two traveled around the United States with the band in search of the ultimate musical experience, attending over 350 shows together. The two also shared a common interest in seeing live music of a wide variety of genres, and during the 23 years that they knew each other attended more than 1000 total concerts together, until Mark's untimely death in November of 2002. Mark knew of brother in-law Ken's recordings from the Capitol Theatre, and had a strong interest in having the shows circulated; however, being true to his word to Howard Stein, Ken kept the recordings under wraps and the tapes never saw the light of the trading domain (One noteworthy bending of this rule occurred when Ken agreed at Mark's request to circulate the late show that the Grateful Dead did on June 24th of 1970. This show is highly regarded as an all-time magical performance by the Dead during their 30 year history as a band). It was not until John Jay, who also knew Ken Lee, and of the Port Chester tapes, ran into Ken at Mark's funeral in 2002 that the fateful discussion of having the recordings released occurred. At that time, Ken didn't think anyone would have any desire to listen to his tapes. They had been sitting up in the attic of his present home for over 20 years going through the early stages of decay. Because such a great deal of time had elapsed since Ken made his agreement with Howard Stein, and the fact that John Jay was insisting that there was an overwhelming interest by music lovers to hear these recordings, Ken agreed to open the flood gates and the Port Chester Restoration Project began, which is ultimately a tribute to Mark Cohen's passion for live music. By fortune and coincidence, John Jay Hance, a master at the art of recording and restoring live music himself had already developed his own method for preserving fragile, decaying audio tapes with a heating method commonly known as "baking." The process of restoring Ken's recordings presents an even greater challenge, however. The cassette shells which encase the audio tapes first have to be removed and replaced because they are too fragile to be played. This is extremely difficult, being that these cassettes were glued together during manufacturing (as opposed to the use of screws, today). The halves of the shell must be carefully removed without doing damage to the tape inside. Once the analog tape is restored and rebuilt, it must then be then played back one time through an analog to digital converter onto a cd, which is then cleaned of hiss and other extraneous noises. Then it can be replicated and introduced to the world of music trading. For the cleanup job, John Jay enlisted the help of "Sound Forge" software guru Peter G to help make what exists from the master tapes sound just exactly perfect. Having listened to the first installment of this project, Janis Joplin and Full Tilt Boogie from August 8, 1970 several times, I can tell you that the sound is brilliant! Keep in mind that Ken and Judy recorded nearly EVERY show at the Capitol during '70 and '71, on an estimated 300-500 cassettes (one box of cassettes is believed to be missing). While many are labeled with correct dates and the music they contain, much of what exists is still a mystery. Several gems containing long forgotten performances and musical collaborations have already surfaced. Expect some nice surprises in the years to come. Enjoy Ken and Judy's recordings from the Capitol Theatre and appreciate the great care and quality of craftsmanship that went into their creation and is currently going into their preservation. Remastered so far b #1- 8/8/70 Janis Joplin & Full Tilt Boogie,Seatrain #2-3/21/70 Grateful Dead early & late shows #3-1/20/71 John Hammond,Jr./Big Brother & The Holding Co./Electric Hot Tuna #4-11/13/70 Electric Hot Tuna/Jefferson Airplane #5-6/24/70 NRPS/Grateful Dead early & late shows #6-7/29/70 McKendree Spring/Livingston Taylor/Jethro Tull #7-11/8/70 NRPS/Grateful Dead #8 3/27/71 The Kinks,Trapeze ( Colden Auditorium at Queens College ) #9 5/16/70 James Taylor #10 6/26 or 27/70 Traffic #11 4/27/71 Jethro Tull http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-details.php?id=214447 my blog is "Yer Blog" http://fab4yerblog.blogspot.com/ http://robotsarestealingmyluggage.blogspot.com/ **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com. (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 10:12:42 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: iTunes Genius + regional dialectology I thought they were looking for bosuns? On Sun, Sep 14, 2008 at 5:07 AM, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > James Dignan wrote: > > > > James (hey, "morons" - isnt that what's about to be smashed together in > > that LHC thingy?) > > No, that's hardons ... > > Stewart ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V16 #709 ********************************