From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V16 #613 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Wednesday, May 28 2008 Volume 16 : Number 613 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Shortest LPs [Rex ] Re: Shortest LPs ["kevin studyvin" ] Re: Fleece 2000 (royalty) [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] Re: Israel, copyeditors, etc. ["Benjamin Lukoff" ] Re: Fleece 2000 [HSatterfld@aol.com] Re: Fleece 2000 [Rex ] Re: Shortest LPs [2fs ] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [2fs ] Re: Fleece 2000 [2fs ] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] RE: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) ["Bachman, Michael" ] Re: Shortest LPs [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [Rex ] Re: Shortest LPs ["kevin studyvin" ] Re: Shortest LPs [2fs ] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [2fs ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [grutness@slingshot.co.nz] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [2fs ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 ["kevin studyvin" ] Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) [Rex ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [Rex ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [craigie* ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [Jeff Dwarf ] EP discussion (MMT) [HwyCDRrev@aol.com] Re: EP discussion (MMT) [Rex ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [Rex ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 [2fs ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 09:19:05 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Shortest LPs On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 6:23 AM, 2fs wrote: > . > > But an iTunes playlist of the original tracks on TNBB is only 28:33 - so > you're right about it being among the shorter Byrds albums. Curious that > their stuff is all so short! I'd venture that if you try that "original tracks only" trick, you'll find that's not uncommon. How long are the Springfield records? The first Love album? Any of the early British Invasion records? Recall also that these were following on the heels of the sorta-forgotten folk revival, the K3 and PP&M etc... those albums are all damned short, with most of them being reissued on CD as twofers that could just as well be threefers. The 10 to 14 song rule thing was pretty well adhered to, and the songs were always short because "vocal music" (as opposed for the most part, jazz) just plain didn't have instrumental solos like it soon would. A one-verse guitar/piano/sax verse, maybe, per the country-blues model. Songs was short. Poets studied rule of verse and stuff. np. "Snakes in Brighton", Stray Cats - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 09:19:20 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: Shortest LPs > This throws a wrinkle into the works (of my list, anyway), since for some > Byrds releases I have the original CD issues (which have only the LP > tracks) > and for others (such as TNBB) I have the reissues, with bonus tracks. > > But an iTunes playlist of the original tracks on TNBB is only 28:33 - so > you're right about it being among the shorter Byrds albums. Curious that > their stuff is all so short! > Quick look at yr old SImon & Garfunkel releases shows Sounds Of SIlence clocking in at 28:36, PSRT at 27:51 and Bookends at 29:13. Those were different times, as somebody said... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 12:45:13 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (royalty) at least in the 1960s - royalties on US LPs were increased with each track on UK LPs - there was a certain amount set aside for royalties - and the songs were divided evenly that's why US Beatles LPs has about 11-12 songs per LP and UK LPs had 14 AND that's why Abbey Road had a higher list price (6.98 instead of 5.98) In a message dated 5/26/2008 4:54:13 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jeffreyw2fs.j@gmail.com writes: (The other consideration is that if I recall, royalty rates have nothing to do with the length of the song but with the number of songs...country music is notorious for insiting that you just don't put more than 12 (or maybe 14) songs on a single release, regardless of how short they might be. The list's legal department might weigh in on this one.) **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 12:45:11 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) Neil Young and the Shocking Pinks - Everybody's Rockin' was pretty short too In a message dated 5/26/2008 4:54:13 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, jeffreyw2fs.j@gmail.com writes: Shortest entries from Enormous Major Huge Artists (see also Byrds, above): Beatles' _A Hard Day's Night_ UK version 30:24 The Who _Magic Bus_ 30:54 Rolling Stones _England's Newest Hitmakers_ 31:03 **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 09:54:43 -0700 From: "Benjamin Lukoff" Subject: Re: Israel, copyeditors, etc. > From: "Stacked Crooked" > > mention--but we won't go there.> > > arguments can be made in defense of the invasions of afghanistan and iraq, > too. the important question is whether *reasonable* arguments can be made. I don't know...what would YOU do if your country was attacked from all sides? It's true that an argument could be made that Israel never should have existed in the first place (for that matter, what are you and I doing living in the Pacific Northwest?), but the fact remains that it does, and the Jews aren't going anywhere. Neither, of course, are the Palestinians. So any proposed solution is going to have to take both those facts into account. > > <<(of course, i suppose i'd be unemployable, given that i'd be unswavering > in my insistence upon logical close-quotes punctuation...)>> > > > http://www.chicagotribune.com/features/chi-typo-guys-0521may21,0,701362.stor > y> > > as much as i think those guys are fucking *awesome* (which doesn't, note, > Why am I not surprised ;) > preclude their also being fools), i'm far too lazy to end up like them. Good :) > > >>Back on the street, Deck said poor use of the apostrophe was their most > commonly encountered typo. "It's like a virus," he said. Herson agreed: "It > really is contagious, I think. Especially the lack of them in > possessives."<< > > hmm, it seems to me that their use in plurals is more common? I would guess so. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 13:27:26 EDT From: HSatterfld@aol.com Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 <> 97% of all country albums from the seventies are under half an hour. Are you a Willie Nelson fan by any chance? Or perhaps Olivia Newton-John? **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 10:50:25 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 10:27 AM, wrote: > < hour. Any idea what it was?>> > > 97% of all country albums from the seventies are under half an hour. > From the fifties *through* the seventies. A surprisingly high percentage of them are good, too. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 13:20:22 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Shortest LPs On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 11:19 AM, kevin studyvin wrote: > > > > Quick look at yr old SImon & Garfunkel releases shows Sounds Of SIlence > clocking in at 28:36, PSRT at 27:51 and Bookends at 29:13. Those were > different times, as somebody said... > It was a "Lewis Firbank," I believe. > > > -- > > ...Jeff Norman > > The Architectural Dance Society > http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 13:29:26 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 11:45 AM, wrote: > Neil Young and the Shocking Pinks - Everybody's Rockin' > was pretty short too The Stones are short. Pink Floyd are short. Mr. Grumbly, with a white Ferrari, is short. > > > -- > > ...Jeff Norman > > The Architectural Dance Society > http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 13:30:54 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 12:27 PM, wrote: > > > 97% of all country albums from the seventies are under half an hour. Reason No. 5,397 why Mike Oldfield wasn't a country musician. > > > -- > > ...Jeff Norman > > The Architectural Dance Society > http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 15:56:51 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) The Small Faces ........................ and Martin Short In a message dated 5/27/2008 3:55:37 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, Michael.Bachman@fanucrobotics.com writes: The Tanya, David, Kristen and Leslie original Throwing Muses line-up were all pretty short as well. **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 15:54:47 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org [mailto:owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org] On Behalf Of 2fs Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 2:29 PM To: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Cc: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 11:45 AM, wrote: > > Neil Young and the Shocking Pinks - Everybody's Rockin' > >was pretty short too >The Stones are short. Pink Floyd are short. Mr. Grumbly, with a white Ferrari, is short. The Tanya, David, Kristen and Leslie original Throwing Muses line-up were all pretty short as well. Michael B. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 16:29:08 -0700 From: "Terrence Marks" Subject: Shortest LPs Any of the Beach Boys' early LPs are in the vicinity of 24 minutes (or, long enough for two of them plus a half-dozen bonus tracks to fit on one CD - I wonder if the twofers are still in print). And sometimes that's *with* three minutes of chatter for padding. And there wasn't a hard limit of 12 songs per album back in the day. That was just all the band would get paid for. Otherwise, if you're paid for the song, why not include a few hundred ten-second-long songs with the the hit single and make serious royalty money. Terrence ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 19:47:42 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: Re: Shortest LPs yes- there are in print IIRC they were replaced with the standard, boring, one-album-+-no-bonus-tracks per CD when some hot shot took over the reigns at Capitol - when he was replaced - someone rightfully brought back the 2fer packs they are currently on sale for 9.97 @ Amazon In a message dated 5/27/2008 7:31:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, terrence.marks@gmail.com writes: Any of the Beach Boys' early LPs are in the vicinity of 24 minutes (or, long enough for two of them plus a half-dozen bonus tracks to fit on one CD - I wonder if the twofers are still in print). And sometimes that's *with* three minutes of chatter for padding. **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 16:54:11 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 11:29 AM, 2fs wrote: > On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 11:45 AM, wrote: > > > Neil Young and the Shocking Pinks - Everybody's Rockin' > > was pretty short too > > > The Stones are short. Pink Floyd are short. Mr. Grumbly, with a white > Ferrari, is short. Can't let this go without posting another one of these. Brix introduces the new Rick! That must be a custom Rickenbacker based on her classic white-with-black-hardware 330, right? http://video.aol.com/video-detail/brix-smith-start-unveils-the-new-rick-owens-collection/2019765968?icid=acvsv1 Or not! np. Snakes Post-TLC, The Fall, which is aging fairly well-- not as strong as its predecessors (Snakes Heads Roll and Snakes on the Click) but one of the most enduringly funny Fall albums ever. - -Rex ps, you've just split up with your LONG LEGGED RAP CHICKUH! I think. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 17:13:46 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: Shortest LPs Thanx for the word - I need to scoop up a few of those. On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 4:47 PM, wrote: > yes- there are in print > > IIRC they were replaced with the standard, boring, > one-album-+-no-bonus-tracks per CD > when some hot shot took over the reigns > at Capitol - > > when he was replaced - someone rightfully brought back > the 2fer packs > > they are currently on sale for 9.97 @ Amazon > > > > In a message dated 5/27/2008 7:31:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > terrence.marks@gmail.com writes: > > Any of the Beach Boys' early LPs are in the vicinity of 24 minutes > (or, long enough for two of them plus a half-dozen bonus tracks to fit > on one CD - I wonder if the twofers are still in print). And > sometimes that's *with* three minutes of chatter for padding. > > > > > > **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with > Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. > (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 19:42:01 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Shortest LPs On 5/27/08, Terrence Marks wrote: > > > And there wasn't a hard limit of 12 songs per album back in the day. > That was just all the band would get paid for. Otherwise, if you're > paid for the song, why not include a few hundred ten-second-long songs > with the the hit single and make serious royalty money. Ah - that's it: I knew there was something missing in my "12 songs per album" scenario. Obviously when that setup was put forth, it was just assumed that a "song" was an intro, a verse, a chorus, a verse, a bridge, a chorus, etc., and that its length would vary between just under 2 minutes to just over 3 minutes depending largely on tempo. Has anyone looked at the lengths of pre-rock chart singles to see what sort of variation there was? Obviously, there could be some - you could vary the structure somewhat, and that intro might vary in length, or be chopped off. And of course, there's the much older notion of separate introductory material (the Beatles did that a couple-few times - the examples that leap to mind are "If I Fell" and "Here There and Everywhere") that isn't repeated in any form - and intros could vary (is it "Night and Day" that has a really long intro?). Anyway, I imagine that there was a bit less variability then. Those very same Beatles started messing with the formula of song structure - even in their earliest days, there'd be slightly odd phrase lengths (other than the typical 4-bar phrasing), and by the time you get to _Rubber Soul_ and _Revolver_, they're beginning to stretch out quite a bit...and of course there's the notorious "Beatle coda" featured on a whole bunch of tracks ("Hello Goodbye," "All You Need Is Love," "I Am the Walrus," etc. etc. etc. - - brought to its enormous conclusion with "Hey Jude"). (Once again, I direct you to ) But country musicians still hew largely to traditional song structures - so it's not surprising that country-based labels might still tend to structure deals so that artists get paid for only up to 12 tracks/album (I remember reading this a mere one or two years ago, btw). I imagine jazz artists fought this one, too - since they'd improvise on chorus after chorus, their songs were typically much longer than pop songs...and a jazz album that's only 4 or 5 songs total was fairly common from the early '50s onward, I think. 'Course jazz artists probably got ripped off every which way from Sunday - that would be the typical deal... - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 20:16:38 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) On 5/27/08, Rex wrote: > > > np. Snakes Post-TLC, The Fall, which is aging fairly well-- not as strong > as its predecessors (Snakes Heads Roll and Snakes on the Click) but one of > the most enduringly funny Fall albums ever. > That seems about right. It has its moments, to be sure - and it actually sounds as if the band's having fun - something relatively rare in MES's career...yet the same is true of the Von Sudenfed project, and also of the new one. This just won't do: MES in a good mood? "I'm a fifty-year-old man - what're you gonna do about it?" I can't remember right now the line about "that Steve Albini" - but it's pretty damned funny. And does it come before or after the bit about tossing all the hotel towels on the floor then pissing on them? He's such a cutup. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 12:53:57 +1200 From: grutness@slingshot.co.nz Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 > by the way, were sugar trying to invent a new category in calling *Beaster* > a "short-form album"? didn't catch on, i guess. There had beens everal bvefore that, but usually called "Mini-albums" - - FWIW one of my favourite Flying Nun releases ("Send you", by Sneaky Feelings) is officially a mini-album. Then you get oddments like the tall Dwarfs' "That's the short and the long of it", which had one side 33rpm (9 tracks) and one side 45 rpm (2 tracks) James - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 22:11:41 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 On 5/27/08, grutness@slingshot.co.nz wrote: > > by the way, were sugar trying to invent a new category in calling >> *Beaster* >> a "short-form album"? didn't catch on, i guess. >> > > There had beens everal bvefore that, but usually called "Mini-albums" I don't believe there's any real distinction among these categories, is there? As I pointed out, the "E" in "EP" (for "extended") makes sense only in reference to singles...and as singles declined relative to albums throughout the '70s and into the '80s, perhaps terms like "mini-album" and "short-form album" were meant to describe a similar thing (a collection of a handful of tracks, typically totalling between 15 and 30 minutes) with name that seemed more accurate. I'd be very surprised indeed if anyone could find a non-arbitrary distinction characterizing an "EP" as distinct from a "mini-album" as distinct from a "short-form album"... - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 May 2008 21:47:46 -0700 From: "kevin studyvin" Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 > I don't believe there's any real distinction among these categories, is > there? As I pointed out, the "E" in "EP" (for "extended") makes sense only > in reference to singles...and as singles declined relative to albums > throughout the '70s and into the '80s, perhaps terms like "mini-album" and > "short-form album" were meant to describe a similar thing (a collection of > a > handful of tracks, typically totalling between 15 and 30 minutes) with name > that seemed more accurate. > > I'd be very surprised indeed if anyone could find a non-arbitrary > distinction characterizing an "EP" as distinct from a "mini-album" as > distinct from a "short-form album"... > Recollect Columbia tried to market something of the kind around 1980, putting out a series of 10-inchers on the Epic label that they called Nu Disks including releases by Cheap Trick and the original version of Black Market Clash (which I still have - wonder what that goes for in the vinyl market these days?)... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 00:11:27 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Fleece 2000 (Short Albums) On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 6:16 PM, 2fs wrote: > On 5/27/08, Rex wrote: > > This just won't do: MES in a good mood? "I'm a fifty-year-old man - what're > you gonna do about it?" I can't remember right now the line about "that > Steve Albini" - but it's pretty damned funny. And does it come before or > after the bit about tossing all the hotel towels on the floor then pissing > on them? > After, I think, but before the banjo interlude. That's a hell of a song, really. Or maybe it's five hells of five songs. Through the years, I've always liked the parts where MES cracks himself up. The first one I can remember is "British People in Hot Weather", but there were probably some before that. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 00:27:08 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 8:11 PM, 2fs wrote: > > I'd be very surprised indeed if anyone could find a non-arbitrary > distinction characterizing an "EP" as distinct from a "mini-album" as > distinct from a "short-form album"... It's totally arbitrary, but related to your note about the E for Extended, relative to single length: taken literally, there's a connotation of "here's a single with some shit tacked onto it-- outtakes and live tracks and stuff", whereas the other two terms *suggest* something more intentionally put together as a collection (Beaster being as good an example as any). In practice, though, all bets are off: there are plenty of things that both match the latter description and are called EP's. Once the term is out there, you're gonna have artists saying "Hey, let's make an EP", meaning a singular-work-shorter-than-an-album, since they have some of those in their collections and their favorite bands probably debuted with one, so off they go, and who's to stop them? Ideally there'd be terms to distinguish between records that offer up a newly recorded (but short) body of work, and records of the same length that are basically a single with a lot of b-sides (the lead track usually being separately available on an LP). But the terms at hand don't really do that, drat it all... why is the LP version of "Ole! Tarantula" on the live EP again? - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 09:22:59 +0100 From: craigie* Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 And, bucking the trend completely, The Beatles' Magical Mystery Tour EP was in fact two singles: one with two tracks and one with three... Ah, those crazy Beatles! c* On 28/05/2008, Rex wrote: > > On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 8:11 PM, 2fs wrote: > > > > > I'd be very surprised indeed if anyone could find a non-arbitrary > > distinction characterizing an "EP" as distinct from a "mini-album" as > > distinct from a "short-form album"... > > > It's totally arbitrary, but related to your note about the E for Extended, > relative to single length: taken literally, there's a connotation of > "here's > a single with some shit tacked onto it-- outtakes and live tracks and > stuff", whereas the other two terms *suggest* something more intentionally > put together as a collection (Beaster being as good an example as any). In > practice, though, all bets are off: there are plenty of things that both > match the latter description and are called EP's. Once the term is out > there, you're gonna have artists saying "Hey, let's make an EP", meaning a > singular-work-shorter-than-an-album, since they have some of those in their > collections and their favorite bands probably debuted with one, so off they > go, and who's to stop them? > > Ideally there'd be terms to distinguish between records that offer up a > newly recorded (but short) body of work, and records of the same length > that > are basically a single with a lot of b-sides (the lead track usually being > separately available on an LP). But the terms at hand don't really do > that, > drat it all... why is the LP version of "Ole! Tarantula" on the live EP > again? > > -Rex > - -- first things first, but not necessarily in that order... I like my girls to be the same as my records - independent, attractively packaged and in black vinyl (if at all possible)... Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc (the motto of the Addams Family: "We gladly feast on those who would subdue us") ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 02:28:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 craigie* wrote: > And, bucking the trend completely, The Beatles' Magical Mystery > Tour EP was in fact two singles: one with two tracks and one with > three... > > Ah, those crazy Beatles! I thought it was a double EP in the UK, with three songs on each disc (the US just putting those 6 songs on one side, and putting 5 other then-recent vintage non-album tracks on the other (SFF, PL, AYNIS, HG, & BYARM). "I'm not tempted to write a song about George W. Bush. I couldn't figure out what sort of song I would write. That's the problem: I don't want to satirize George Bush and his puppeteers, I want to vaporize them." -- Tom Lehrer "The eyes are the groin of the head." -- Dwight Schrute . ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 10:03:38 EDT From: HwyCDRrev@aol.com Subject: EP discussion (MMT) yes - it was 2 x 7' singles - each with 3 songs and it included the booklet which was enlarged and added to the US LP version In a message dated 5/28/2008 5:37:51 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, munki1972@yahoo.com writes: I thought it was a double EP in the UK, with three songs on each disc (the US just putting those 6 songs on one side, and putting 5 other then-recent vintage non-album tracks on the other (SFF, PL, AYNIS, HG, & BYARM). **************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food. (http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 08:40:33 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: EP discussion (MMT) On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 7:03 AM, wrote: > yes - it was 2 x 7' singles - each with 3 songs > and it included the booklet which was enlarged > and added to the US LP version > > > In a message dated 5/28/2008 5:37:51 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > munki1972@yahoo.com writes: > > I thought it was a double EP in the UK, with three songs on each disc > (the US just putting those 6 songs on one side, and putting 5 other > then-recent vintage non-album tracks on the other (SFF, PL, AYNIS, > HG, & BYARM). > Really? I thought the CD reissues hewed to the British original releases. Is the MMM CD then an abberation? - -Rex, learning something new every day ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 09:09:30 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:22 AM, craigie* wrote: > And, bucking the trend completely, The Beatles' Magical Mystery Tour EP was > in fact two singles: one with two tracks and one with three... Another delicious anomaly is Cocteau Twins' "Echoes in a Shallow Bay" and "Tiny Dynamine" EP's. They are separate entitities, but conjoined by being in the same gatefold with similar artwork. Each record has two tracks to a side, for a total of eight songs and a Beach-Boy-spanking total run time of just under 32 minutes; neither are "singles" in the sense of having a title track or shared material with an LP. Besides which, taken as a whole, it's one of the band's best collections. But since it's two separate things released at the same time, I'm not sure what order it would go in if treated as sides A, B, C and D. Side note: the kids and I have raised a lot of butterflies lately, and although I had known for a little while that the song title "Great Spangled Fritillary" from this... er, double maxi extended play single(s) took its name from a butterfly, I just found out this weekend, in the course of releasing seven painted lady butterflies into the wild, that the song "Plain Tiger" is named after a butterfly as well. Dunno about "Sultitan Itan", but we're raising some swallowtails next. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 May 2008 11:39:08 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #612 On 5/28/08, Rex wrote: > > > > On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 8:11 PM, 2fs wrote: > >> >> I'd be very surprised indeed if anyone could find a non-arbitrary >> distinction characterizing an "EP" as distinct from a "mini-album" as >> distinct from a "short-form album"... > > > It's totally arbitrary, but related to your note about the E for Extended, > relative to single length: taken literally, there's a connotation of "here's > a single with some shit tacked onto it-- outtakes and live tracks and > stuff", whereas the other two terms *suggest* something more intentionally > put together as a collection > Yeah - but I'm guessing most people don't really think of the meaning of the terms, or their connotations...if they're even aware what "EP" stands for (or were aware what "LP" stood for - interesting how "EP" has survived the transition to CDs, whereas "LP" hasn't). And of course, a "long-player" is long only in relation to another outmoded medium, the 78 rpm 12-inch record. Someone mentioned Columbia's attempt to sell 10-inch records in the late '70s and early '80s...please someone tell me they were smart enough to release Aerosmith's version of the appropriate song in that format! (Aerosmith was, of course, a Columbia act.) But as we all know, Kira's got the ten-and-a-half... - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V16 #613 ********************************