From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V16 #215 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, May 25 2007 Volume 16 : Number 215 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 ["Lauren Elizabeth" ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [Christopher Gross ] i don't know about this... ["Lauren Elizabeth" ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [Benjamin Lukoff ] RE: Monkey Trouble ["Bachman, Michael" ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [Jeff Dwarf ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [2fs ] RE: i don't know about this... ["Sarah Jones" ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 ["Lauren Elizabeth" ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 [grutness@slingshot.co.nz] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 [grutness@slingshot.co.nz] Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 [grutness@slingshot.co.nz] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 ["Stewart C. Russell" ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [Rex ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 [Rex ] Re: 101 uses for a dead cat topic [Rex ] Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 ["Lauren Elizabeth" ] Re: 101 uses for a dead cat topic ["Michael Sweeney" ] RE: Don't bogart that list part 2 ["Bachman, Michael" ] Re: don't bogart late 70's rock [2fs ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 14:25:46 -0400 From: "Lauren Elizabeth" Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 Michael Wells says: > Of course there's an argument that these are all good tunes *anyway*, > but it is a proven fact that these particular ones sound better on the > doobage. okay, i'll admit it, i hate pot. talk about "the creeps." at any rate, i'm wondering what qualities make a song a good pot song. the ones on this list that i would relate to would be "euro trash girl" and "comfortably numb." they seem like pot songs. now explain the others. or maybe it's like the sex dwarf thing where if i don't get it, it can't be explained to me. re: "comfortably numb" - a guy at work once said he had a friend that had a "comfortably numb" tape. it was an entire tape of the song "comfortably numb." and he said he thought it was recorded from vinyl which made it more admirable because of the effort. at any rate, i thought this was a great idea and subsequently made a few such tapes. the ones i remember where with "33" by smashing pumpkins (a band i don't care for except a few songs which i really love) and a live version of "fake plastic trees". obviously i don't really get sick of songs, or if i do, it's temporary. xo - -- - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "People with opinions just go around bothering one another." - The Buddha ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 11:42:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Monkey Trouble On Wed, 23 May 2007, Jeff Dwarf wrote: > vivien lyon wrote: >> Isn't there a movie called Monkey Trouble, and isn't it in fact the >> origins of Jeme being erstwhile known as Capuchin? > > Gilbert Gottfried vehicle, no? Thora Birch and Harvey Keitel. I can't believe anyone remembers that story. This monkey is trouble. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin _______________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 15:11:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 > > > Come Sail Away - Styx > > > > Nope, sorry: I can only ever hear Eric Cartman singing this one. > > > > Not that it DIDN'T SUCK WITH MOST FURIOUS HORRENDOUSLY GAWDAWFUL SUCKAGE IN > > THE ENTIRE HISTORY OF THIS AND ALL OTHER UNIVERSES to begin with... > > > > (You did that on purpose, didn't you.) > > i was never really subjected to that one. is styx one of those guy > bands that guys listen to with their guy friends? the song just > reminds me of the prom scene in "the virgin suicides." that It always makes *me* think of the last scene of the first episode of Freaks and Geeks. Because of this, I actually kinda like the song. - --Chris (who really only watches about four hours of TV a week, honest) ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 14:57:56 -0400 From: "Lauren Elizabeth" Subject: i don't know about this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6657775,00.html "It's really basically about women and empowerment" ??? whoops i think she made a typo, that was supposed to say: "It's really basically about modern medicine. " this is another one of those things that makes me think of how strangely resources are allocated. "half the world's starving, and half the world bloats." xo - -- - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "People with opinions just go around bothering one another." - The Buddha ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 12:57:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Benjamin Lukoff Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 On Thu, 24 May 2007, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > Michael Wells says: > > Of course there's an argument that these are all good tunes *anyway*, > > but it is a proven fact that these particular ones sound better on the > > doobage. > > okay, i'll admit it, i hate pot. talk about "the creeps." at any > rate, i'm wondering what qualities make a song a good pot song. the > ones on this list that i would relate to would be "euro trash girl" > and "comfortably numb." they seem like pot songs. now explain the > others. You haven't lived till you've listened to "Please Please Me" on acid. Or so I hear. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 16:06:02 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: Monkey Trouble - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org [mailto:owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Capuchin Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 2:42 PM To: And Rex Hamilton as Abraham Lincoln Subject: Re: Monkey Trouble On Wed, 23 May 2007, Jeff Dwarf wrote: > vivien lyon wrote: >> Isn't there a movie called Monkey Trouble, and isn't it in fact the >> origins of Jeme being erstwhile known as Capuchin? > > Gilbert Gottfried vehicle, no? >Thora Birch and Harvey Keitel. She sure disappeared after Ghost World. Maybe she caught that bus at the end of the movie in real life? MJ Bachman ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 16:39:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Carrie Galbraith Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 - -----Original Message----- >From: Benjamin Lukoff >Sent: May 24, 2007 3:57 PM >Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 >You haven't lived till you've listened to "Please Please Me" on acid. Or >so I hear. I swear I levitated listening to "Great Gig In The Sky" after a few bong hits the day that album was released. - - c ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 15:51:15 -0500 From: "Michael Wells" Subject: RE: Don't bogart that list part 2 > or maybe it's like the sex dwarf thing where if i don't get it, it can't be explained to me. Sex dwarves are *really* funny on pot. Let's all pull some bingers and have grape races in the microwave, Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 13:52:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > or maybe it's like the sex dwarf thing where if i don't get it, it > can't be explained to me. what's so hard to understand about luring disco dollies to a life of vice? > re: "comfortably numb" - a guy at work once said he had a friend > that had a "comfortably numb" tape. it was an entire tape of the > song "comfortably numb." and he said he thought it was recorded > from vinyl which made it more admirable because of the effort. at > any rate, i thought this was a great idea and subsequently made a > few such tapes. > the ones i remember where with "33" by smashing pumpkins (a band i > don't care for except a few songs which i really love) and a live > version of "fake plastic trees". obviously i don't really get sick > of songs, or if i do, it's temporary. One of the tapes in my father's truck when he died was a c90 alternating between "Voodoo Chile" and "Voodoo Child (Slight Return)" all the way through. "Children have always enjoyed my movies. They are just not allowed to watch many of them." -- John Waters . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 13:57:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 Christopher Gross wrote: > [Come Sail Away - Styx] always makes *me* think of the last scene > of the first episode of Freaks and Geeks. Because of this, I > actually kinda like the song. Because of that, I never was willing to watch another episode until the DVDs came out a few years ago. Kim Kelly would have walked up and broken the record had she been there, right? Right??? "Children have always enjoyed my movies. They are just not allowed to watch many of them." -- John Waters . ____________________________________________________________________________________Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 16:34:34 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > 2fs says: > > On 5/24/07, Michael Wells wrote: > > > > Come Sail Away - Styx > > > > Not that it DIDN'T SUCK WITH MOST FURIOUS HORRENDOUSLY GAWDAWFUL SUCKAGE > IN > > THE ENTIRE HISTORY OF THIS AND ALL OTHER UNIVERSES to begin with... > > i was never really subjected to that one. is styx one of those guy > bands that guys listen to with their guy friends? The name might suggest that...but basically, Styx was kinda like if you took a band like REO Speedwagon (polished, chart-ready pop with vaguely rockish pretensions) and mixed it with the occasional slight progginess derived from Kansas or somebody (stupid keyboards and occasional time-signature switches) and hired a singer who quite obviously would rather have been singing Broadway musicals (which is what he ended up doing) and then made songs with condescending lyrics that often assured its teenage audience that they were cool, really. I'm not sure why, but for me Styx is one of the most purely *irritating* bands ever. Just about everything about them seems smarmily calculated and stupid on top of that. So, to sum up: I do not like Styx. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 21:33:56 +0000 From: "Sarah Jones" Subject: RE: i don't know about this... Good luck to the lady with her twins! I can only speak for the NHS in the UK at present, but we end up with a huge budget for fertility treatment and no space on an operating list for a woman presenting with breast cancer. How you make the call to balance the equation I have no idea but its frustrating. I worked in a hospital where we ran out of morphine, that really is the bottom line. Sarah >From: "Lauren Elizabeth" >Reply-To: "Lauren Elizabeth" >To: "a sweet little cupcake...baked by the devil!" >Subject: i don't know about this... >Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 14:57:56 -0400 > >http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6657775,00.html > >"It's really basically about women and empowerment" > >??? > >whoops i think she made a typo, that was supposed to say: >"It's really basically about modern medicine. " > >this is another one of those things that makes me think of how >strangely resources are allocated. "half the world's starving, and >half the world bloats." > >xo > >-- >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >"People with opinions just go around bothering one another." > > - The Buddha _________________________________________________________________ New, exclusive and FREE - Download Madonna's "Hey You" now! http://www.liveearth.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 16:36:41 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list On 5/23/07, michael wells wrote: If you're of the mind, try these instead. You'll thank me for it later. > > (pops head around corner with mischievous grin) - How about side 6 of _Sandinista!_? - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:26:22 -0400 From: "Lauren Elizabeth" Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 2fs says: > The name might suggest that...but basically, Styx was kinda like if you took > a band like REO Speedwagon (polished, chart-ready pop with vaguely rockish > pretensions) and mixed it with the occasional slight progginess derived from > Kansas or somebody sometimes 1 + 1 does equal 3. and not in a good way. xo - -- - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "People with opinions just go around bothering one another." - The Buddha ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 15:55:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Benjamin Lukoff Subject: RE: i don't know about this... I didn't click through to the story, but is this about the 60-year-old mother? I think that's borderline irresponsible, if only because those kids are probably going to be deprived of their mother at a younger age than is preferable. On Thu, 24 May 2007, Sarah Jones wrote: > Good luck to the lady with her twins! > > I can only speak for the NHS in the UK at present, but we end up with a huge > budget for fertility treatment and no space on an operating list for a woman > presenting with breast cancer. How you make the call to balance the > equation I have no idea but its frustrating. I worked in a hospital where we > ran out of morphine, that really is the bottom line. > > Sarah > > > > >From: "Lauren Elizabeth" > >Reply-To: "Lauren Elizabeth" > >To: "a sweet little cupcake...baked by the devil!" > >Subject: i don't know about this... > >Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 14:57:56 -0400 > > > >http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6657775,00.html > > > >"It's really basically about women and empowerment" > > > >??? > > > >whoops i think she made a typo, that was supposed to say: > >"It's really basically about modern medicine. " > > > >this is another one of those things that makes me think of how > >strangely resources are allocated. "half the world's starving, and > >half the world bloats." > > > >xo > > > >-- > >-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >"People with opinions just go around bothering one another." > > > > - The Buddha > > _________________________________________________________________ > New, exclusive and FREE - Download Madonna's "Hey You" now! > http://www.liveearth.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 11:35:52 +1200 From: grutness@slingshot.co.nz Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 >None of which truly helps us solve the Sweeney Conundrum. Is Hal "Briggs" Holbrook still with us? Or Carl "Kung fu fighting" Douglas? Or is there some connectionI cannot see to Don Ho, Freddy Fender or Aaron Spelling? James - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:13:04 +1200 From: grutness@slingshot.co.nz Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 >Question for the Brits: I've recently read that British crosswords are >infinitely more opaque and impossible to crack than ours are. They sound so >multi-layered as to be almost "meta". Has anyone crossworded on both sides >of the Atlantic and lived to tell the tale? The few US crosswords I've done weren't worth doing - all straightforward, nothing cryptic at all. Where's the enjoyment in that? Mind you, I'll also swimagainst the tide and say my day hasn't started p[roperly until I've had a coffee and done the sudoku. >Where one might buy snacks - and possibly lied, Tom having confused senses >this way. (13) > >Delicatessens Strangely, the one cryptic crossword I have written contained delicatessen as one of its anwers. The clue - "Food from a pointlessly fragile German city (12)" - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:13:04 +1200 From: grutness@slingshot.co.nz Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 >Question for the Brits: I've recently read that British crosswords are >infinitely more opaque and impossible to crack than ours are. They sound so >multi-layered as to be almost "meta". Has anyone crossworded on both sides >of the Atlantic and lived to tell the tale? The few US crosswords I've done weren't worth doing - all straightforward, nothing cryptic at all. Where's the enjoyment in that? Mind you, I'll also swimagainst the tide and say my day hasn't started p[roperly until I've had a coffee and done the sudoku. >Where one might buy snacks - and possibly lied, Tom having confused senses >this way. (13) > >Delicatessens Strangely, the one cryptic crossword I have written contained delicatessen as one of its anwers. The clue - "Food from a pointlessly fragile German city (12)" - -- James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 20:37:12 -0400 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 Pretty much any track by Colleen would be toketastic. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:43:28 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V16 #214 On 5/24/07, grutness@slingshot.co.nz wrote: > > > The few US crosswords I've done weren't worth doing - all > straightforward, nothing cryptic at all. Where's the enjoyment in > that? They're somewhat cryptic, but not really encrypted. They-- well, the harder ones-- do require a certain amount of vocabulary, history, pop culture, etc., and there are certain tricks that only the truly indoctrinated pick up on... just not that many. Solving US crosswords is really a subset of general knowledge, the kind of thing that would help one at Jeopardy or Scrabble, not a skill set of its own. The British model is a lot tougher... I reckon it'd take more practice than I have time for for me to get any good at cracking them. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:47:45 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > Michael Wells says: > > Of course there's an argument that these are all good tunes *anyway*, > > but it is a proven fact that these particular ones sound better on the > > doobage. > > okay, i'll admit it, i hate pot. (raises hand again) Me, too. I think I'm allergic to it. Some people react to this news by saying that they feel sorry for me, but they shouldn't... I don't feel like I'm missing anything other than an unpleasant coma. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:48:54 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 On 5/24/07, 2fs wrote: > > On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > > > 2fs says: > > > On 5/24/07, Michael Wells wrote: > > > > > > Come Sail Away - Styx > > > > > > Not that it DIDN'T SUCK WITH MOST FURIOUS HORRENDOUSLY GAWDAWFUL > SUCKAGE > > IN > > > THE ENTIRE HISTORY OF THIS AND ALL OTHER UNIVERSES to begin with... > > > > i was never really subjected to that one. is styx one of those guy > > bands that guys listen to with their guy friends? I've known girls to like them a lot, too. But only stoner girls. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:57:36 -0700 From: Rex Subject: Re: 101 uses for a dead cat topic On 5/24/07, Tom Clark wrote: > > > yeah, the whole "lolcats" phenomenon. Just today it's spread to U.S. > presidents: > http://forums.fark.com/cgi/fark/comments.pl?IDLink=2823158 > > If you're not in on it it's just plain stupid. If you are it's LOL > funny. > > -t ROFLCOPTER c I can't pin down why I find this stuff so funny. It's an almost anthropological thrill... like watching a whole new grammar of stupidity unfolding before your eyes, one that you can mock without using a "dumb guy" voice (because it's not spoken) and one where half of the people inventing it are actually really smart people making fun of the other half... in "real time", even. I was afraid that when the "new language" arrived it would be either scarily alienating or just inscrutable, but instead we got "hilarious". Score one for the future; now where's my jet pak? - -Rex - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 00:53:02 -0400 From: "Lauren Elizabeth" Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 Rex says: > > On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > > i was never really subjected to that one. is styx one of those guy > > > bands that guys listen to with their guy friends? > > I've known girls to like them a lot, too. But only stoner girls. i'm starting to think that the girls you know are girls who like all the stuff that guys like; i mean, don't say this to their faces or anything, but they're what's known as "outlying data points." xo - -- - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "People with opinions just go around bothering one another." - The Buddha ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 23:59:19 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > Rex says: > > > On 5/24/07, Lauren Elizabeth wrote: > > > > i was never really subjected to that one. is styx one of those guy > > > > bands that guys listen to with their guy friends? > > > > I've known girls to like them a lot, too. But only stoner girls. > > i'm starting to think that the girls you know are girls who like all > the stuff that guys like; i mean, don't say this to their faces or > anything, but they're what's known as "outlying data points."= I like girls with outlying data points. (You know, *someone* had to say that...might as well be me...) - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 05:10:44 +0000 From: "Michael Sweeney" Subject: Re: 101 uses for a dead cat topic ...OK -- to stir up the silence: the promised next hint... The song mentioning the 3rd dead-last-summer real-life person is on... Greatest Hits - Robyn Hitchcock and the Egyptians ...And, no, it's not "Beatle Dennis" (who would be, what?, the 7th or 8th Beatle?) (all I know is that Ringo will always be "the undisputed 4th Beatle" to me...) or Vera Lynn. Michael "The 'joke' / reference / 'stinger' is below this time" Sweeney "There's a house burning down on the radio" - hey, along with the name check in "Freeze," I believe that's another D. Byrne / T. Heads reference... _________________________________________________________________ More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 11:21:15 +0100 From: craigie* Subject: Re: 101 uses for a dead cat topic It *IS* Balloon Man!! Woes!! c* On 25/05/07, Michael Sweeney wrote: > > ...OK -- to stir up the silence: the promised next hint... > > The song mentioning the 3rd dead-last-summer real-life person is on... > > Greatest Hits - Robyn Hitchcock and the Egyptians > > ...And, no, it's not "Beatle Dennis" (who would be, what?, the 7th or 8th > Beatle?) (all I know is that Ringo will always be "the undisputed 4th > Beatle" to me...) or Vera Lynn. > > > Michael "The 'joke' / reference / 'stinger' is below this time" Sweeney > "There's a house burning down on the radio" - hey, along with the name > check > in "Freeze," I believe that's another D. Byrne / T. Heads reference... > > _________________________________________________________________ > More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live > Hotmail. > > http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration _HM_mini_2G_0507 > - -- first things first, but not necessarily in that order... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 09:10:42 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: Don't bogart that list part 2 - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org [mailto:owner-fegmaniax@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Lauren Elizabeth Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 6:26 PM To: a sweet little cupcake...baked by the devil! Subject: Re: Don't bogart that list part 2 2fs says: >> The name might suggest that...but basically, Styx was kinda like if >> you took a band like REO Speedwagon (polished, chart-ready pop with >> vaguely rockish >> pretensions) and mixed it with the occasional slight progginess >> derived from Kansas or somebody Our Lauren wrote: >sometimes 1 + 1 does equal 3. and not in a good way. I always had the impression that Supertramp was on the edge of descending into the Styx/REO Speedwagon morass, but in their better moments I would tend to lump them on a higher plain with Cheap Trick. MJ Bachman NP Kendra Smith - Five Ways of Disappearing ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 08:51:23 -0500 From: "Michael Wells" Subject: don't bogart late 70's rock Jeff: > The name might suggest that...but basically, Styx was kinda like if you took a band like REO Speedwagon (polished, chart-ready pop with vaguely rockish pretensions) and mixed it with the occasional slight progginess derived from Kansas or somebody (stupid keyboards and occasional time-signature switches) and hired a singer who quite obviously would rather have been singing Broadway musicals (which is what he ended up doing) and then made songs with condescending lyrics that often assured its teenage audience that they were cool, really. OK, somebody has to reply to this. What a vast and terrible oversimplification. Styx had at least three distinct periods, only the last of which comes off as you describe. The early years (up through CRYSTAL BALL) was stoner rock with some prog and occasional dream-like episodes...this was the 70's, after all. The classic albums - GRAND ILLUSION through CORNERSTONE - had hard rockers, precision harmonies, excellent songwriting and great drumming. There wasn't anything remotely condescending about it. Only after PARADISE THEATER did it descend into something a little more absurd. A pretty long run of good albums there, actually. REO had a very distinct break at HI INFIDELITY - prior to that album they were a hard rocking, ass-kicking, drug-fueled bar band from downstate Illinois with a stellar guitarist (Gary Richrath). The first few albums were unmemorable rockers - I sold them off rather quickly - but they nailed it with "Riding the Storm Out," "Flying Turkey (aka Tuna) Trot," "157 Riverside Avenue," "Roll With the Changes" etc. After 1980 things went downhill pretty fast, but for a while there they were the shit. There was nothing pretentious or chart-ready about it - they had success through relentless touring and producing long-form rock that people wanted to hear. > So, to sum up: I do not like Styx. That much is clear. Michael "I had a big old mirror with R-E-O written out in cocaine...I was feeling GOOD!" Wells ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 09:26:09 -0500 From: 2fs Subject: Re: don't bogart late 70's rock On 5/25/07, Michael Wells wrote: > > Jeff: > > The name might suggest that...but basically, Styx was kinda like if > you took a band like REO Speedwagon (polished, chart-ready pop with > vaguely rockish pretensions) and mixed it with the occasional slight > progginess derived from Kansas or somebody (stupid keyboards and > occasional time-signature switches) and hired a singer who quite > obviously would rather have been singing Broadway musicals (which is > what he ended up doing) and then made songs with condescending lyrics > that often assured its teenage audience that they were cool, really. > > > OK, somebody has to reply to this. What a vast and terrible > oversimplification. > > Styx had at least three distinct periods, only the last of which comes > off as you describe. The early years (up through CRYSTAL BALL) was > stoner rock with some prog and occasional dream-like episodes...this was > the 70's, after all. The classic albums - GRAND ILLUSION through > CORNERSTONE - had hard rockers, precision harmonies, excellent > songwriting and great drumming. There wasn't anything remotely > condescending about it. Only after PARADISE THEATER did it descend into > something a little more absurd. A pretty long run of good albums there, > actually. I've heard bits and pieces of almost all of these, and while you're right that their music became (even more) intolerable in their later years, I might agree with your description of the band's strengths...except one - and that I can agree and still dislike their music strongly might say something about the differences in our aesthetics. Specifically: okay, they were good at singing harmonies, I'll concede that the drumming was "great" (although that's only because off the top of my head I can't think of any of it), maybe even that their rockers rocked - but to me, none of that matters, because even if it's all true, to me the songwriting was anything but excellent. And its lack of excellence to me is entirely because of a range of poor strategies that, to me, indicate either a bit of (what the technical term is is) stoopid, or condescension. To me the shifts in their musical focus and direction had more to do with flailing about trying to decide whether they were going to be a stonerish, prog band, a hard-rockin' midwestern (by way of the south once Tommy Shaw joined) bar band, a ballad-singing pop band (the execrable "Babe"), or something else entirely. There was talent in the band, to be sure. I'd say the same about Billy Joel (another '70s guy whose career has a stink about it, to me, because of a pervasive insincerity, an overriding sense of "do you like this? How about this? See - I can do this too!" ), not that the two acts are otherwise similar. I'm guessing that, to you, what I'm describing is instead a strength, a sign of the band's diverse interests and skills, and that their ability to shift styles is why they're a good band. And here's the thing: usually, if I don't like a band, it's because...uh, I don't like their music. Then I try to figure out why. And so explanations of the band's failings, missteps, annoying qualities, etc., are generally ex post facto attempts to figure out why I don't like the music. What that means, in turn, is that it's quite often the case that I'll like Band A...even though I hate Band B, despite the fact that the music of both bands might be described similarly. Anyway: REO had a very distinct break at HI INFIDELITY - prior to that album > they were a hard rocking, ass-kicking, drug-fueled bar band from > downstate Illinois with a stellar guitarist (Gary Richrath). The first > few albums were unmemorable rockers - I sold them off rather quickly - > but they nailed it with "Riding the Storm Out," "Flying Turkey (aka > Tuna) Trot," "157 Riverside Avenue," "Roll With the Changes" etc. After > 1980 things went downhill pretty fast, but for a while there they were > the shit. There was nothing pretentious or chart-ready about it - they > had success through relentless touring and producing long-form rock that > people wanted to hear. I'd agree that REO weren't at all pretentious : the pretentious gene in my attempted Styx genealogy is not from REO. "Chart-ready" doesn't necessarily imply they were sellouts or trying too hard - only that the songs they wrote were often right in the mainstream of '70s rock. As evidenced by their having several hits... I don't mind REO so much (except the later ballads), but I don't like them that much either. True about the break in their career...but to me it doesn't seem as dramatic. Tendencies already present were polished (in some cases, effectively: some of those singles were pretty good, in fact) - it's not as if they utterly reinvented themselves (as Journey from jazzish ex-Santana folks to singles artists with even-more-annoying-than-Dennis-DeYoung singer...). - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V16 #215 ********************************