From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V15 #276 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, November 17 2006 Volume 15 : Number 276 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Bragg on DRM [FSThomas ] reap [Christopher Gross ] Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 [Eb ] Robyn Hitchcock on Soundcheck WNYC ["James Francis" ] Joanna Newsom [Jill Brand ] Re: Joanna Newsom ["Stewart Russell" ] Re: Joanna Newsom ["Spotted Eagle Ray" ] Re: reap [2fs ] Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 [2fs ] RE: overgrown gapless Ferndale ["Maximilian Lang" ] reap ["michael wells" ] Re: reap [2fs ] Re: reap [Eb ] filming at Sunday Hoboken show ["James Francis" ] RE: filming at Sunday Hoboken show ["Michael Wells" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 13:04:32 -0500 From: FSThomas Subject: Bragg on DRM Billy in a BBC interview talking on DRM and whose pension should be paid with his music: http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42316000/jpg/_42316790_bragg_bbc203.jpg Industry considers digital future By Kevin Young Entertainment reporter, BBC News Members of the record industry are worried about the internet. New technology has led to far greater availability of cheaply-priced music. Discounted charts album from online retailers can take business from traditional high-street stores, while the illegal sharing of files threatens sales of official releases, labels say. The past year has also seen the rise of social networking sites such as MySpace, seen by some as a great way to reach potential fans and, with unsigned acts, talent-spotters who can offer record deals. But it is easy for material to be placed online illegally - and singer-songwriter Billy Bragg, now in his 30th year in the business, has particular concerns. He is among leading figures who have been gathering in London to mould the music industry for a digital future. 'Incredible potential' "The majority of people posting songs on to social-networking sites don't have a record deal," he says. "They're using the site as a way of getting attention to get a deal, so often the first legal contract they're entering into regarding their work will be through the terms and conditions of that site. "If we're in a situation where sites are harvesting intellectual property rights, it almost becomes impossible to use these sites without consulting a lawyer." Bragg removed his work from MySpace earlier this year when he realised that its terms and conditions meant he would lose some of the ownership rights to his own material. He concedes the sites do have "incredible potential". "I reckon if they'd been around 25 years ago, it would have saved me two years of playing in dingy pubs in south London," he says. But there is a need for an industry-standard rights agreement "that recognises that ownership resides ultimately with the originator" of any music, the 48-year-old says. "Undoubtedly Rupert Murdoch is making a lot of money selling advertising on MySpace and he's not paying a penny for content." High street 'collapse' Bragg's manager Peter Jenner, who has also worked with Pink Floyd and The Clash in a career spanning five decades, has analysed the situation for the Music Tank organisation. He is certain the mindset of the record industry must change, especially with regards to retailers. "The supply to Tesco, Sainsbury's and Asda is going to lead to the collapse of HMV as a record business," he predicts. "HMV is now almost already mainly video and games with some music still in there, and I think that retreat will go on. The big-store model, with all the titles, is a dead duck." Jenner believes that the record industry has been wrong to license tracks which appear on CDs given away by magazines and newspapers. This signalled discs "did not have a great value - that they were incredibly cheap to make", he says. "I suspect that making them cheaper is the record companies' latest own-goal. They're cheapening their premium product." He also fears the internet is misunderstood by labels. HMV's shop in Piccadilly Circus, London Traditional stores are in jeopardy because of discounting, Jenner says "They weren't really able to come to grips with the essential truth of the internet, which is that it's all about sharing of files." A protection system known as digital rights management (DRM) restricts the distribution and accessibility of music files can be tightly controlled. However, this is "a complete turn-off to the consumers and doesn't work", Jenner claims - and is another area he says needs to be changed. "Labels were trying to stop the internet doing what it does - exchange files - and try to chain it, put lead weights on it, so files wouldn't move around. "All it does is penalise the honest." Pension Bragg agrees the music industry should have less control over artists' material in general. "I don't want to be in a situation where I'm still playing when I'm 70 but you can't get my records, because either they're owned by a label that doesn't exist any more and no-one knows who owns the rights, or there is a label and they're just sitting on them. "The ability of a song that I've written to still be raising money 90 years later raises the question of whose pension that piece of work should be. "Someone at the record company - or my pension, for the benefit of my heirs." It is clear which he would prefer. - -- FS Thomas | Interactive Developer | fsthomas-at-ochremedia.com 404.758.8616 (home/office) | 404.274.1632 (mobile) | ferraatu (AIM) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 13:26:35 -0500 (EST) From: Christopher Gross Subject: reap Free-market economist Milton Friedman, 94. (Musical connection: he was a big influence on the Reagan administration, and thus indirectly on '80s hardcore punk.) - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 10:37:28 -0800 From: Eb Subject: Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 great white shark wrote: > Well fuck that, no-one stops the great white shark and > the Victorian squid from seeing Robyn bloody Hitchcock for the first > time ever A shame that you couldn't convey any of your sincere excitement over seeing Hitchcock for the first time, and instead had to hide behind all that contrived "surreal" spew. Eb ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 10:43:14 -0800 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 On Nov 16, 2006, at 5:03 AM, great white shark wrote: > Fegs > > I am back again although I promised I would go, but its not often a > great white shark gets to see Mr H , in fact it was the first time, > so heres a belated review of the gig for your consumption .... Fucking brilliant. - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 13:47:49 -0500 From: The Great Quail Subject: Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 Eb writes, > A shame that you couldn't convey any of your sincere excitement over > seeing Hitchcock for the first time, and instead had to hide behind > all that contrived "surreal" spew. Ha ha ha! Ah, now *that's* like the good old days. - --Q ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 11:15:17 -0800 From: Eb Subject: Re: 9/11 and such 2fs wrote: > I believe the relevant aspect of the post wasn't the farting > itself, but the > farting in its context. This is one of those sentences which I never really expected to see during my lifetime. My big discovery of the past week is blogs which post entire albums. Wow! I've heard (or will hear) some pretty arcane psych/UK folk/prog stuff which I wondered if I'd ever hear at all. http://ourpsychblog.blogspot.com was kinda the first one I stumbled upon...then I started following the links to other blogs.... Amazin'. Eb, who has now heard the *second* Sagittarius album (though it wasn't much good) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 14:09:51 -0500 From: "James Francis" Subject: Robyn Hitchcock on Soundcheck WNYC Hi, An intriguing lineup on Soundcheck today on WNYC (see below). I wonder whether Robyn has met McCartney and what that meeting would be like. I'm enjoying the idea of the two of them in the same studio (though they may not be doing this live, I don't know). It should be streaming right about now, and then it's archived as well. Jim Francis www.wnyc.org Sir Paul, Composer Thursday, November 16, 2006 Paul McCartneys been a teen heart throb, a rock icon, and a classical music composer. Today, he discusses his most recent New York premiere at Carnegie Hall. Also: the history of folk music in the big city. And: a live performance by British pscyhedelic rocker Robyn Hitchcock. Stop the Forest Service from killing more wolves, bears, cougars, and other animals in the wild: http://go.care2.com/99055 http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps nonprofits. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 13:16:29 -0800 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: Robyn Hitchcock on Soundcheck WNYC On Nov 16, 2006, at 11:09 AM, James Francis wrote: > Hi, > > An intriguing lineup on Soundcheck today on WNYC (see below). I > wonder whether Robyn has met McCartney and what that meeting would > be like. I seem to remember a story, or one of Robyn's bullet-point autobiographies, where he says he met Sir Paul around 1972 or so and asked him for a joint. - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 17:34:45 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Brand Subject: Joanna Newsom I'm sorry, but I just can't buy into her. She makes me laugh out loud in the same way that System of a Down makes me laugh. I'm sure it's for different reasons, however. I knew the song Bridges and Balloons because Colin Meloy/The Decemberists have covered it. It sounded like a pretty OK song...until I heard her sing it. Someone said that she had done Bjork one better. I LOVE to listen to Bjork; she doesn't sound like a little squeak box. Fire away. Jill ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:20:47 -0500 From: "Stewart Russell" Subject: Re: Joanna Newsom On 16/11/06, Jill Brand wrote: > > I LOVE to listen to Bjork; she doesn't sound like a little > squeak box. A little squeak box?! Fie, I'll have none of it. True, Joanna's voice has come on a lot; if it was hard to take on MEM, you'd cringe to hear her two early releases, Yarn & Glue and Walnut Whales. With Ys, her range and control are much better; sometimes jazzy, sometimes out there, but always sweet. There's none of the harshness that made me skip "Three Little Babes" on MEM (and almost made Catherine bail out of the car in mid-Michigan snow). Colin kind of phoned in the vocals on that B&B cover. Seriously. Plus, she has mad harp arpeggio skillz. And she sometimes plays in a punk band. If you hate Joanna, you hate America. Stewart - -- http://scruss.com/blog/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 15:29:02 -0800 From: "Spotted Eagle Ray" Subject: Re: Joanna Newsom On 11/16/06, Jill Brand wrote: > > I'm sorry, but I just can't buy into her. She makes me laugh out loud in > the same way that System of a Down makes me laugh. I've been trying to come up with a good analogy... it's like she took the honest rootsy oddness of Victoria Williams and made it all serious and self-consciously arty, and I feel like there should be a formulation for it... Joanna Newsom : Victoria Williams as.... ...Tori Amos : Kate Bush? ...Live : R.E.M.? ...Bell & Sebastian : Nick Drake? ...Helmet : Sonic Youth? ...Mellencamp (later) : Springsteen? ...but none of that is quite right. The follower is usually less baroque than the originator, so maybe she's a unique talent in that way. I don't hate her, but I didn't fall in love with that first record, so in a way it's a relief to hear that the new one is the kind of thing I'd probably like even less. Otherwise I'd probably put some effort into it. Hell, maybe nobody else hears the Vic Williams thing. I dunno. I sure don't hear Bjork (but then I've just discovered how much Bjork copied from Ari Up, so there's that). Isn't she also kinda part of that E6-like "you have to like them all" collective clustered around Devandra Banhardt (or is it the other guy)? I always have a hard time with that stuff. - -SER ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:07:07 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: reap On 11/16/06, Christopher Gross wrote: > > Free-market economist Milton Friedman, 94. > > (Musical connection: he was a big influence on the Reagan administration, > and thus indirectly on '80s hardcore punk.) 'Tis true: even in his 70s, he was a hell of a drummer. Plus, he invented the renowned reggae "supply-side" beat. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com (ps to Marc A.: I actually know Friedman didn't swing that way so much - but "supply-side beat" just sounds better) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:11:25 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: RH & Venus Three at the Governor Hindmarsh Hotel 10-14-06 On 11/16/06, Eb wrote: > > great white shark wrote: > > > Well fuck that, no-one stops the great white shark and > > the Victorian squid from seeing Robyn bloody Hitchcock for the first > > time ever > > A shame that you couldn't convey any of your sincere excitement over > seeing Hitchcock for the first time, and instead had to hide behind > all that contrived "surreal" spew. A mere squib, sir - on a rickety wooden milking stool in a rust-weathered, corrugated-metal lean-to. (Dammit - now I've got that Throwing Muses song in my head) NP: Fuzzy Warbles 8 - the box is brilliant. - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:33:08 -0800 From: "michael wells" Subject: overgrown gapless Ferndale Caroline: > I've noticed it when I watch him play guitar. I figured it had to do with intense concentration... That's an excellent observation, I would agree. Brian "unable to follow simple directions" Nupp: > http://aycu17.webshots.com/image/4736/2003921637824604067_rs.jpg For those unfamiliar, this outtake photo from American Male features (L-R) Mr. Bachman, Nuppy, and me. Or as I like to refer to us: Athos, Aramis and...Pathos. I have to say that the excellence of the evening in Ferndale did much to ameliorate my general hatred for Detroit (seriously, if we went ahead and bulldozed the entire city, just pushed the whole thing into Lake St. Clair and said "look, we fucked up - let's just start again from scratch" would anyone really be that upset? Honestly?). There was surprisingly good sushi right next door to the venue, I found a copy of 'Silverlock' at a hole-in-the-wall used bookshop, fellow fegs were great company and the show was terrific. On whole, a better (and longer) performance than Chicago. Another nice thing was sprinting the five or so hours home right afterwards. I love driving at night, and especially after a good show - you get a chance to run the evening back in your head while trying to find jazz on low-power NPR stations. Another advantage is that after 2 a.m. you can drive long distances in the starkers; I covered most of central and western Michigan on I-94 wearing not much more than a smile. Probably more than you needed to know, actually. Commander Lang: > As I gazed around the venue I saw that Cthulhu and Nyarlathotep had arrived late and were busy devouring the sound-man up the back You'd be surprised how often this actually happens; I've stopped asking for board patches for fear of being too close when the Elder ones show up and the tentacles start flying. > A shame that you couldn't convey any of your sincere excitement over seeing Hitchcock for the first time, and instead had to hide behind all that contrived "surreal" spew. I rather enjoyed it, but am more puzzled at how he was able to type all that without opposable thumbs. You know, being a shark and all. Sebastian: > But I just love the jangly goodness of Underground Sun. After many listens, I think this will be the one that sticks with me the longest. It's Document-era R.E.M. at its finest. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 22:51:21 -0500 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: RE: overgrown gapless Ferndale >From: "michael wells" >To: >Subject: overgrown gapless Ferndale >Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 18:33:08 -0800 >Brian "unable to follow simple directions" Nupp: > > http://aycu17.webshots.com/image/4736/2003921637824604067_rs.jpg >For those unfamiliar, this outtake photo from American Male features (L-R) >Mr. Bachman, Nuppy, and me. Or as I like to refer to us: Athos, Aramis >and...Pathos. All I think of it Mezcal when I see this picture...inside joke...continue as before. Max _________________________________________________________________ Talk now to your Hotmail contacts with Windows Live Messenger. http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwme0020000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://get.live.com/messenger/overview ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 22:06:27 -0800 From: "michael wells" Subject: reap George Michael's Sports Machine, a fixture of my youth: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=2665135 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 22:25:53 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: reap On 11/17/06, michael wells wrote: > > George Michael's Sports Machine, a fixture of my youth: > > http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=2665135 Is that George Michael the pop singer, or George Michael the Arrested Development character? Has anyone ever seen them in the same room? - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 22:12:30 -0800 From: Eb Subject: Re: reap > George Michael's Sports Machine, a fixture of my youth: > > http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?id=2665135 Wow...I had no idea it had been on the air that long. Does he have a better timeslot elsewhere in the world? Because here, I think he's on around 11:35pm on Sunday night? Not exactly coveted turf. Eb ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 12:04:40 -0500 From: "James Francis" Subject: filming at Sunday Hoboken show Apologies if I'm repeating information that's already out there (I'm a digest subsciber), but on WNYC yesterday Robyn said that the Sunday night show in Hoboken will feature 1) filming for a documentary about the next record with the Venus Three, 2) new songs from said unreleased record, and 3) Morris Windsor. I had been planning on going to only the Saturday show, but this news was enough to make me order a ticket for Sunday. Just sending this along in case anyone's still on the fence about going. Stop the Forest Service from killing more wolves, bears, cougars, and other animals in the wild: http://go.care2.com/99055 http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps nonprofits. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 11:40:14 -0600 From: "Michael Wells" Subject: RE: filming at Sunday Hoboken show > Apologies if I'm repeating information that's already out there (I'm a digest subsciber), but on WNYC yesterday Robyn said that the Sunday night show in Hoboken will feature 3) Morris Windsor. Wha...? Is Reiflin off taking in a "how not to be a dick to fans" seminar or something? Or do they need another harmony vocal? And why would you film footage for the next album at a show where the drummer isn't there...unless he's not the drummer? Or am I reading way too much into this? ION, I think it was jbj who turned me onto Josh Ritter, and I've really been enjoying his ANIMAL YEARS from earlier this year. Sounds like the flinty gravity of M. Ward with a depth of sound like early Grant Lee Buffalo. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 09:57:36 -0800 From: "Spotted Eagle Ray" Subject: Re: filming at Sunday Hoboken show On 11/17/06, Michael Wells wrote: > > > Apologies if I'm repeating information that's already out there (I'm a > digest subsciber), but on WNYC yesterday Robyn said that the Sunday > night show in Hoboken will feature > > 3) Morris Windsor. > > Wha...? Is Reiflin off taking in a "how not to be a dick to fans" > seminar or something? I assume it's Morris singing and perchance percussingm but Rieflin still behind the kit? My questions are: 1) Is this unrelease recorded the previously-alluded-to one that they've already recorded? Because it would be lame to make a documentary about making a record that's already made. 2) If not, does that mean there's one record done and unreleased, and another one about to started? Is the Venus Three about to instantaneously equal the Soft Boys for sheer number of official records? Whoa. 3) Who's doing the documentary? 4) When the hell is REM going to have any time to be REM with all of this going on? Or is Robyn doing a public service by keeping these guys too busy for that to happen? Whutta guy. Good time to be a Robyn fan, innit? - -SER ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 12:15:43 -0600 From: 2fs Subject: Re: filming at Sunday Hoboken show On 11/17/06, Spotted Eagle Ray wrote: > > > 4) When the hell is REM going to have any time to be REM with all of this > going on? Or is Robyn doing a public service by keeping these guys too > busy > for that to happen? Whutta guy. I'm hoping that working with Robyn reminds Peter Buck how to write good songs again (and arrange them interestingly while he's at it). Of course, for all I know he's been trying to do that, and Mills and/or Stipe are the problem. (I would tend to believe it would be Stipe, in that if that's the case, the decline in the quality of the lyrics - which are Stipey's, no? - would parallel the decline in musical quality. To be clear: I think it's really only the last 2 CDs that are heavily suck-weighted - I'm not one of those "oh, the moment they left IRS they sucked" people.) - -- ...Jeff Norman The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V15 #276 ********************************