From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V13 #65 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Wednesday, March 3 2004 Volume 13 : Number 065 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Heads up... ["Rex.Broome" ] FW: Camila ["FS Thomas" ] More tenor instruments (Warning: TLC content) ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: Recent discoveries... [Capuchin ] Re: Recent discoveries... ["Palle Hoffstein" ] Re: Recent discoveries... [John Barrington Jones ] Re: Recent discoveries... [Capuchin ] Austin [tanter@tarleton.edu] Re: Recent discoveries... ["Fortissimo" ] Re: Wow ["Fortissimo" ] Re: Wow [steve ] Re: Wow [Capuchin ] Re: Wow [Capuchin ] Re: Fwd: regarding top QoL cities [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Re: Wow [steve ] A Proper Marriage Amendment [steve ] Re: Wow [Sebastian Hagedorn ] Finding Neko ["Marc Holden" ] Re: Wow [Capuchin ] Re: Wow [Capuchin ] Re: Wow [Sebastian Hagedorn ] Re: Wow [Capuchin ] somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! [rosso@videotron.ca] Some listmember has a virus. [rosso@videotron.ca] RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! ["Brian Huddell" ] RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! ["Brian Huddell" ] RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! ["FS Thomas" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:05:38 -0800 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: Heads up... Hey yo... At least feglister seems to have gotten a virus-laden e-mail from my address... subject heading "Greet the Day" or summat. Pitch it. Sorry. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:13:32 -0500 From: "FS Thomas" Subject: FW: Camila 'Allo, Feggy-types. Anyone else getting spammed lately with address that are suspiciously feggilicious? I've just today noticed these two come through: > -----Original Message----- > From: gene@hopstetter.co [mailto:gene@hopstetter.co] > Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 4:52 PM > Subject: Camila > -----Original Message----- > From: gshell@metronet.com [mailto:gshell@metronet.com] > Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 4:20 PM > Subject: The employee Curiously yours, Ferris. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:22:14 -0800 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: More tenor instruments (Warning: TLC content) Me: >>The now-dominant Quail person says: Erm, please make that "persona". See, it was a riff on the Quail/Bayard schizophrenia suggestion... not a suggestion that Quail dominates us all as a person. Some day, perhaps... Palle: >>I often seem to really like some of the most maligned cities. LA and >>Atlanta always score low, and they're two cities that I love, though I guess >>living there and visiting are very different experiences. LA. Yes indeed. Thanks for the vote of support. I always say... nice place to live, but I wouldn't want to visit there. >>I use the "cheater" tuning on tenor guitars myself. [...] In fact, I'm now guilty >>of playing tenor banjo the same way. For me, being drunk and able to pick >>up any instrument and bash away any song I know is worth the "cheating." 'Scuse my ignorance, but what's the standard tuning for tenor banjo? Is it an open chord, like a 5-string? 'Cause that one's hard to beat for drunken bashing. My tenor is tuned cheating-style, too. When it's tuned at all, that is. >>I love tenor guitars myself, just for the sound. A good tenor guitar is loud, clear >>and gloriously mid-rangey. Okay, me and Palle... who else here actually owns one of these beasts? Neko's were, I believe, the second and third ones I've ever seen in person after the one that hangs on my living room wall. It sounds mid-rangey, old, and slightly ass-like-- a fine vintage '50's but it's got some family history to it, so I like it fine. Sumi: >>Did we discuss the fact that Andy Partridge wrote the theme for the new >>Fox show "Wonder Falls" yet? Apparently, and also possibly of interest, Bob Mould wrote the theme song to the TLC show "In a Fix". Haven't caught this one yet... Miles? Eb: >>I can tell you were just SO happy to fit the words "Neko" and >>"three-way" into the same sentence. ;) Nah, I'd want her all to myself. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:46:09 -0800 From: Tom Clark Subject: Recent discoveries... I put out a feeler to the list a few weeks ago regarding James Kirk from the Scottish band Orange Juice. Despite a whopping zero responses I bought his solo album "You Can Make It If You Boogie". Oh man, such wonderment hasn't passed my ears since I got Brian Steven's solo effort. Great mix, great vocals, great songs. Dig it here: http://www.marina.com/ma57.htm Then I found Hugh Cornwell's "Hi Fi" on eMusic (they list it as a self titled album). I always liked The Stranglers when they were played on the radio, but never quite got around to picking up any of their stuff. Anyway, this came out in 2001 and includes live acoustic versions of "Golden Brown" and "Always The Sun" as the last tracks. Good stuff. I also picked up the Cracker/Leftover Salmon collaboration "O' Cracker Where Art Thou?" Fun, bluegrassey versions of Cracker hits. I don't get a chance to recommend too many finds, but these have really made my week so far. - -tc ob. name generator: < http://members.iglou.com/lyons/bitchGen.html > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:36:46 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Recent discoveries... On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Tom Clark wrote: > Then I found Hugh Cornwell's "Hi Fi" on eMusic (they list it as a self > titled album). I always liked The Stranglers when they were played on > the radio, but never quite got around to picking up any of their stuff. > Anyway, this came out in 2001 and includes live acoustic versions of > "Golden Brown" and "Always The Sun" as the last tracks. Good stuff. You know, I have only ever owned Dreamtime by The Stranglers and I just loved it when I was younger. I haven't listened to it in ages, but I wouldn't be surprised to find I had put it on my "Top 40 of the 80s" list we did here a few months back. I just looked at the AMG regarding The Stranglers and found that they rank Dreamtime quite low. I guess that's typical. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:59:21 -0800 From: "Palle Hoffstein" Subject: Re: Recent discoveries... > I just looked at the AMG regarding The Stranglers and found that they rank > Dreamtime quite low. > I tend to agree with AMG on that one. I like the album now, much more than I did when it came out. But after La Folie, Feline and Aural Sculptrure, which felt like three dark masterpieces in a row, Dreamtimes seemed very light, poppy and new-agey in a world-beat kind of way. It didn't fit my image of the band - which was as creators of some very dark, morbid, often jazzy or discordant music. It felt like a sell-out. That so many dark, experimental post-punk bands were suddenly very poppy at that time didn't help - it seemd yet one more band going light and slick (Simple Minds, Tears For Fears, Modern English, OMD, Psychadelic Furs - they all went top 40 about then). Looking back, I think Dreatime is a good pop album, but wholly unrepresentative of their overall body of work. Palle ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:14:54 -0800 (PST) From: John Barrington Jones Subject: Re: Recent discoveries... On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Palle Hoffstein wrote: > > I just looked at the AMG regarding The Stranglers and found that they rank > > Dreamtime quite low. I've never heard Dreamtime, but just had to chime in to say that I think The Stranglers are extremely underrated. Albums like The Raven, Feline, and Black and White are fantastic. I recently picked up a used copy of their Singles Box Set during the Christmas holidays (similar in concept to the Elvis Costello singles box sets, though the Stranglers box preceeded it), and have been listening to it regularly - great stuff. I wonder how the diehards would compare Dreamtime to Gospel According To The Meninblack?? Both albums get panned regularly. I really like Meninblack -it is a great rainy day record. =jbj= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:30:09 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Recent discoveries... On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Palle Hoffstein wrote: > I tend to agree with AMG on that one. I like the album now, much more > than I did when it came out. But after La Folie, Feline and Aural > Sculptrure, which felt like three dark masterpieces in a row, Dreamtimes > seemed very light, poppy and new-agey in a world-beat kind of way. It > didn't fit my image of the band - which was as creators of some very > dark, morbid, often jazzy or discordant music. > > It felt like a sell-out. That so many dark, experimental post-punk bands > were suddenly very poppy at that time didn't help - it seemd yet one > more band going light and slick (Simple Minds, Tears For Fears, Modern > English, OMD, Psychadelic Furs - they all went top 40 about then). > Looking back, I think Dreatime is a good pop album, but wholly > unrepresentative of their overall body of work. Well, now... there's where I have a problem, then. I don't think you should judge the work in comparison with the band's previous efforts. The work needs to stand on its own. What do they need to do, change the name of the band every time they want to try something new stylistically? The fact is that it's a good album (as you've been able to confess once you got over your emotional attachment to the time and place of its release). It's way better than the crappy 1.5 stars it was given. It's better than, say, anything Def Lepard ever made. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 21:58:39 -0600 (CST) From: tanter@tarleton.edu Subject: Austin Is there any hint that Robyn might be playing more shows than the one on the 20th? Marcy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 22:24:52 -0600 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: Recent discoveries... On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:46:09 -0800, "Tom Clark" said: > I put out a feeler to the list a few weeks ago regarding James Kirk from > the > Scottish band Orange Juice. No way - Jean Picard's band Creme Brulee is *way* better. - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: "In two thousand years, they'll still be looking for Elvis - :: this is nothing new," said the priest. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 22:31:01 -0600 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: Wow On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:26:59 -0800 (PST), "Jeff Dwarf" said: > http://www.salon.com/mwt/wire/2004/03/02/child/index.html > > March 2, 2004 | PHILADELPHIA (AP) -- Luz Cuevas took one > look at the dimpled, dark-haired little girl at a birthday > party and instantly knew two things: She was watching her > own daughter -- presumed killed in a 1997 fire -- and she > needed a way to prove it. This is so fucked up. On the one hand, how can the mother's feelings - and the truth of her claim - be denied? On the other (and for me, probably decisive), how do you take a six-year-old girl away from the woman she doubtless believes, regards, and loves as, her mother? (Unless of course there's severe abuse of the child...but since it's not mentioned, that probably isn't the case, fortunately.) - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: Solipsism is its own reward :: :: --Crow T. Robot ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 22:42:45 -0600 From: steve Subject: Re: Wow On Mar 2, 2004, at 10:31 PM, Fortissimo wrote: > This is so fucked up. On the one hand, how can the mother's feelings - > and the truth of her claim - be denied? On the other (and for me, > probably decisive), how do you take a six-year-old girl away from the > woman she doubtless believes, regards, and loves as, her mother? She can visit her "mother" in prison. - - Steve __________ It's an old shibboleth of those who want to inject religion into public life that they're honoring the spirit of the nation's founders. - David Greenberg ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:38:00 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Wow On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, steve wrote: > She can visit her "mother" in prison. I guess that's what we call "compassionate conservatism", eh? J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:40:12 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Wow On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Fortissimo wrote: > This is so fucked up. On the one hand, how can the mother's feelings - > and the truth of her claim - be denied? On the other (and for me, > probably decisive), how do you take a six-year-old girl away from the > woman she doubtless believes, regards, and loves as, her mother? (Unless > of course there's severe abuse of the child...but since it's not > mentioned, that probably isn't the case, fortunately.) Yeah, all I could think when I read that article was, "oh, dear... they'd've all been better off if she'd never found out." It's a fucked up situation and you hit the truth of it. That poor little girl is going to have some trouble. There's no way to make this right. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:44:15 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Re: Fwd: regarding top QoL cities >I was asked to forward this message from a feisty ex-Feglister who >wished to speak up on the issue of Auckland.... Eb yup - she emailed me about it directly as well. >- ----------------------------- >OK, James is clearly smoking the P (for provincial) here. I'll give >you this, James: Auckland's house prices are too high (although have >you scoped out Sydney's or London's or San Francisco's real estate >lately??), True; Auckland average is about $400,000. Dunedin - $150,000 for same quality house. >and it has some bad traffic during rush hour (and I have to >sit in it, so I know). However, I will not stand by and have my >hometown maligned as 'appalling' and 'unfriendly'! By the standards of >*whom*? the rest of the country! Compared with a lot of overseas centres, it's astonishingly friendly and beautiful. Compared with other New Zealand ones... far less so. >Trust me - on an objective judgement scale, pretty much *all* >of New Zealand's cities are beautiful, well-run, friendly, clean >places with a lot to recommend them. oh, I believe it - I was only comparing Auckland to the other cities in NZ! I was surprised it made the world's top ten - I'd have put it about 15 or 16, at a guess. >Auckland is >surrounded by beautiful swimming and surf beaches, both white and >black sand; it has *two* harbours; it has a terrific amount of green >space, including a giant reserve in the Waitakere Ranges right at its >doorstep; Hm... one of the country's best surf beaches is 400 metres from where I live. We only have one harbour, but that's enough for most people. The Otago peninsula (which has applied for World Heritage status) is ten minutes drive from here.... but yes, Auckland has lots of good stuff, I'll admit it. And it has a lot of cultural festivals and the like. It's a great place to visit. But there are numerous things that I'm far less than keen about with it. The pace of life is too fast; the weather is atrocious (when its not raining its muggy); and I like being able to travel to my partner's place, 14km away, in just 20 minutes. It would take me most of an hour in Auckland. >As we've discussed before privately, I love Dunedin. I think both it >and Wellington get shafted in surveys like these. I'd live in either >of the other two cities like a shot. And Auckland has its faults - but >'appalling'? No way! You don't know how good we have it down here. > >Danielle, of the 'can't we all just get along?' school yeah - we can :) I was a bit harsh on Auckland, but I still stand by my comments that - *compared to the other centres in NZ*, it is congested, and overpriced (I'll skip the unfriendly bit - I'd forgotten at leat one friendly person in the city :). Compared to nearly everywhere else on the planet, it's pretty marvellous. And you forget, I do know what it's like overseas - I was born there, remember! James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:55:45 -0600 From: steve Subject: Re: Wow On Mar 2, 2004, at 11:38 PM, Capuchin wrote: > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, steve wrote: >> She can visit her "mother" in prison. > > I guess that's what we call "compassionate conservatism", eh? You guys are being squishheads. "Mom" is guilty of kidnapping, arson, and a number of other lesser offenses. She can't be allowed to profit from her crimes, even though it puts the little girl in an unfortunate position. I would expect that the state has resources to ease the transition. If wise, real mom will take her daughter to visit former mom, and put a charitable interpretation on the situation. Next case. - - Steve __________ A coward, a bully, a bigmouth, and a queer-basher. Yes, we have been here before. The word is fascism, in case you are wondering, and we don't have to sit through that movie again. - Christopher Hitchens, on Mel Gibson ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:03:00 -0600 From: steve Subject: A Proper Marriage Amendment - - Steve __________ rope snakebird draftsman cupful dill thresh deferred mastery danish dialogue newton capacitor ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:50:07 +0100 From: Sebastian Hagedorn Subject: Re: Wow - --On Dienstag, 2. Mdrz 2004 21:40 Uhr -0800 Capuchin wrote: > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Fortissimo wrote: >> This is so fucked up. On the one hand, how can the mother's feelings - >> and the truth of her claim - be denied? On the other (and for me, >> probably decisive), how do you take a six-year-old girl away from the >> woman she doubtless believes, regards, and loves as, her mother? (Unless >> of course there's severe abuse of the child...but since it's not >> mentioned, that probably isn't the case, fortunately.) > > Yeah, all I could think when I read that article was, "oh, dear... > they'd've all been better off if she'd never found out." Not the real mother ... > It's a fucked up situation and you hit the truth of it. That poor little > girl is going to have some trouble. > > There's no way to make this right. You're right about that. - -- Sebastian Hagedorn PGP key ID: 0x4D105B45 http://www.spinfo.uni-koeln.de/~hgd/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:33:18 -0700 From: "Marc Holden" Subject: Finding Neko Rex said: >Saw Neko Case at the Derby this weekend, too. Actually it was kind of a three-way show >featuring singer/songwriters from Bloodshot--- Neko, Kelly Hogan, and Carolyn Mark >(the "other Corn Sister"), with minimal backing from Rauhouse on pedal/lap steel and >banjo, and another gent on lead guitar inna slightly-twangier Chet Atkins stylee. Countrier >than hell and featuring a lot of traditional or old-school country covers, it was totally not >what I'd expected-- they only did one song that's ever been on a Case record, and even >that one was a cover-- but it was great. Gorgeous three-part harmonies, especially >impressive since the overall feel was very casual and thrown-together, with lots of >funny banter from all three women. Really glad to have seen the show. Quite agreed. I just got back from seeing the same line-up at Solar Culture in Tucson. Man, it was just amazingly enjoyable. Like I told the friend I went with, "If I ever go completely deaf, at least I heard that..." My friend had talked me into going because I originally I was thinking about passing on it. I'm trying to get everything situated at work before I go on vacation, and I've been swamped beyond belief. Last night, I had about 45 reports to review before the end of the work day, today. I decided to get a bit of sleep then wake up early and knock them out. My day has been non-stop since 3:30 am. In less than an hour it will be 24 hours since I had my 3 hour nap. Anyway, my friend was fairly insistent and felt like he owed it to me. When we saw Neko with Calexico earlier this year, Neko was signing CDs at the merchandise table. He was feeling too shy to go up and say 'hello', so when she was signing my CD, I mentioned to her that my friend could use a hug. She grabbed him like they were old friends and left him nearly speechless. It was worth the price of admission right there. Solar Culture is a bit of an independent art gallery. Before the music started, we were standing in front of the mixing board, checking out the paintings on the walls. The crowd was starting to get packed in a bit. Someone rushing through the crowd ran into me and kept on going. Before I could turn, I could tell by the look on my friend's face that it had been Neko who side-swiped me. Royce is totally smitten with her, and he's made sure that I made it to each of the last 3 shows Neko's played in our area. Each time has been totally different--the New Pornographers/with her band and with Calexico/and "three-way show" with pedal steel guitar--and all have been immensely entertaining. Maybe I'm becoming smitten, too. Later, Marc I think the mistake a lot of us make is thinking the state-appointed psychiatrist is our "friend." Jack Handey ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:06:53 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Wow On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Sebastian Hagedorn wrote: > > Yeah, all I could think when I read that article was, "oh, dear... > > they'd've all been better off if she'd never found out." > > Not the real mother ... I don't know. I mean, I think that before she saw her daughter alive, she thought she was the victim of a great and tragic accident. Now, she feels like she is the victim of betrayal and a planned violation. Will she be able to trust people again? Will she and her daughter bond properly? Will she be overly protective? Will she seek vengeance and wish pain on others? I think that, in many ways, she was better off as the victim of a tragic accident. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:14:30 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Wow On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, steve wrote: > On Mar 2, 2004, at 11:38 PM, Capuchin wrote: > > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, steve wrote: > >> She can visit her "mother" in prison. > > > > I guess that's what we call "compassionate conservatism", eh? > > You guys are being squishheads. Yeah, we're a bunch of fucking bleeding hearts over here. Now do you see why I don't think Democrats and Republicans are all that different? > "Mom" is guilty of kidnapping, arson, and a number of other lesser > offenses. OK. > She can't be allowed to profit from her crimes, even though it puts the > little girl in an unfortunate position. Allowed? Profit? She did some things that hurt other people and that's bad. But will taking the daughter away from the only mother she's ever known (and also taking away the daughter that the woman got in what she probably believed was the only way she ever could) make the pain she caused any less? Will the problems caused by her actions go away because she's been "caught" and "punished"? > If wise, real mom will take her daughter to visit former mom, and put a > charitable interpretation on the situation. If wise, real mom would just go and visit daughter and put a charitable interpretation on her own situation. > Next case. Steve Schiavo, Supreme Arbiter of Taste and Justice, has spoken. Book 'em, Steve-o. Kill 'em all, let God sort 'em out. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:23:55 +0100 From: Sebastian Hagedorn Subject: Re: Wow - --On Mittwoch, 3. Mdrz 2004 2:06 Uhr -0800 Capuchin wrote: > On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Sebastian Hagedorn wrote: >> > Yeah, all I could think when I read that article was, "oh, dear... >> > they'd've all been better off if she'd never found out." >> >> Not the real mother ... > > I don't know. I mean, I think that before she saw her daughter alive, she > thought she was the victim of a great and tragic accident. Now, she feels > like she is the victim of betrayal and a planned violation. Will she be > able to trust people again? Will she and her daughter bond properly? > Will she be overly protective? Will she seek vengeance and wish pain on > others? OK, so basically you're saying ignorance is bliss? We'd all be happier if we never had learned about some things ... it's hard to choose what's better, but I guess I'd usually take "truth" (note the quotes) over ignorance anyway. - -- Sebastian Hagedorn PGP key ID: 0x4D105B45 http://www.spinfo.uni-koeln.de/~hgd/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:35:37 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Wow On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Sebastian Hagedorn wrote: > OK, so basically you're saying ignorance is bliss? Sometimes. Certainly not always. > We'd all be happier if we never had learned about some things ... it's > hard to choose what's better, but I guess I'd usually take "truth" (note > the quotes) over ignorance anyway. Sure... and that's exactly what that mother is thinking if she's even considering the pain and suffering that are going to be caused by her discovery as a bad thing. But the discovery of "truth" is the ONLY positive outcome here, near as I can tell, and it doesn't seem to outweigh the negatives. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 19:19:46 -0500 From: rosso@videotron.ca Subject: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! I just got a letter with Rex Broome's return address. The subject header was "Greet the Day" and the attachment was named dbdcad.zip. It's a virus. Bagle spoofs the return address, so it's most likely that somebody on fegmaniax has the virus. I thought you folks were smarter than that! http://www.arnnet.com.au/index.php?id=983392526 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 19:32:37 -0500 From: rosso@videotron.ca Subject: Some listmember has a virus. Yup, it was Bagle.C. Tsk, tsk, tsk. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:13:37 -0600 From: "Brian Huddell" Subject: RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! > Bagle spoofs the return address, so it's most likely that somebody on > fegmaniax has the virus. Actually, all it means is that somebody with Rex's address in *their* address book has a Bagle variant. Need not be a feg (assuming, and I do, that Rex has friends in the real world). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:30:12 -0600 From: "Brian Huddell" Subject: RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! I must not write email first thing in the morning. *Actually* it means that someone with both Rex's and Ross's addresses in their address book has the virus, a considerably narrower field. Ross is right, probably a feg. > > Bagle spoofs the return address, so it's most likely that > somebody on > > fegmaniax has the virus. > > Actually, all it means is that somebody with Rex's address in *their* > address book has a Bagle variant. Need not be a feg > (assuming, and I do, > that Rex has friends in the real world). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:30:45 -0500 From: "FS Thomas" Subject: RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! > -----Original Message----- > From: Brian Huddell > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 8:14 AM > To: fegmaniax@smoe.org > Subject: RE: somebody on fegmaniax probably has a Bagle variant! > > Actually, all it means is that somebody with Rex's address in > *their* address book has a Bagle variant. Need not be a feg > (assuming, and I do, that Rex has friends in the real world). It's probably someone on the list. As I sent in an earlier email, I've also gotten variant messages where the return addresses included gene@hopstetter.com and gshell@metronet.com. Bad bad bad. - -ferris. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 07:31:38 -0600 From: "Fortissimo" Subject: Re: Wow On Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:55:45 -0600, "steve" said: > On Mar 2, 2004, at 11:38 PM, Capuchin wrote: > > > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, steve wrote: > >> She can visit her "mother" in prison. > > > > I guess that's what we call "compassionate conservatism", eh? > > You guys are being squishheads. "Mom" is guilty of kidnapping, arson, > and a number of other lesser offenses. She can't be allowed to profit > from her crimes, even though it puts the little girl in an unfortunate > position. "Unfortunate position"? Steve, we're talking about forcibly taking a six-year-old girl from her mother, and "unfortunate position" is queasily euphemistic. I'm omitting the quotes this time, because from the child's perspective (and, presuming again no abuse, viewing mothering as practice) that's exactly what's happening. An adult has the potential capability to comprehend why (for example) it would be better for her daughter to stay where she is, to not be torn from the fabric of family, though it hurts that adult in a way I can't even begin to comprehend. A child has no such capability. On the other hand: certainly, one can't just do nothing. (When we say "ignorance is bliss," we mean actual ignorance - not willed, attempted "ignorance" That is, in many ways it's unfortunate that the biological mother discovered the situation. *All* parties would have been better off in many ways.) And going back to that child: if Bio-Mom withdraws, says nothing now, does she never tell her daughter? If she tells her daughter later, when daughter's an adult and might understand, is the daughter going to understand why Bio-Mom let her live a lie for fifteen years or so? Finally: one does have to ask, if a woman is capable of arson, kidnapping, and inflicting the associated trauma of an apparently dead child, all to feed a grossly overblown need to be a mother, how likely is it that she's stable enough to raise a child well? And yes, legally, and ethically, she should be punished. The reason I described it as a "fucked-up situation" is that there are no easy answers. Actually, by blithely asserting that the kidnapper should go to prison, you highlight a serious problem with prevailing judicial policy: if we consider it wrong to harm innocent people - for example, to deprive a mother of her daughter - then how is it not a problem when innocent people are harmed by actions of the state - as when a child is deprived of a mother (effectively) by imprisoning her? Shouldn't the grounds on which the state claims the right to punish criminals - that their actions cause unwarranted harm - also apply to the actions of the state? If, for example, the state's actions cause more harm than those of the criminal, who wins? Certainly not the victims. What "justice" is it that creates more, not less, victimhood? This situation holds true for any convicted criminal who has children, or a spouse: the innocent are punished as well. And despite my speculation above, people are complex enough that one can, in fact, be a good parent and also rob liquor stores - or worse. I don't have a solution - but you'd think one ought to pay enough attention to the problem not to dismiss it with "lock 'em up." - ------------------------------- ...Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society http://spanghew.blogspot.com/ :: "In two thousand years, they'll still be looking for Elvis - :: this is nothing new," said the priest. ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V13 #65 *******************************