From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V12 #342 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Thursday, September 11 2003 Volume 12 : Number 342 Today's Subjects: ----------------- I am back home [Eb ] Dr Who, and Hell freezes over [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] we ask the questions... [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Re: Potato ["Stewart C. Russell" ] the adventures of Robocow [HSatterfld@aol.com] Stars in his eyes ["Brian Hoare" ] Re: Calvin Johnson ["Matt Sewell" ] Will it ever render? (Finally, what the feg...) [Carrie Galbraith ] Re: the adventures of Robocow [Roberta Cowan ] Re: Will it ever render? (Finally, what the feg...) [Sebastian Hagedorn <] Re: Dr Who, and Hell freezes over [Jeff Dwarf ] Re: the adventures of Robocow ["Stewart C. Russell" ] RE: What is a feg ["Bachman, Michael" ] RE: we ask the questions... [Catherine Simpson ] Re: feg'yer maker [Groove Puppy ] RE: your mail ["Iosso, Ken" ] RE: What is a feg ["Brian" ] More questions ["Glen Uber" ] RE: What is a feg ["Bachman, Michael" ] The tour ["Glen Uber" ] RE: your mail [FSThomas ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2003 23:40:52 -0700 From: Eb Subject: I am back home Hi Natalie! Eb ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 21:12:09 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Dr Who, and Hell freezes over >i don't remember anyone mentioning this-- > >from _the fall of yquatine_, a bbc dr. who novel: > >Realising that haring along would draw unwelcome attention to himself, >[the Doctor] slowed to a stroll, stuck his hands in his trouser pockets >and walked off casually, humming a song about a man who often dreamed of >trains, looking for somewhere to poke his nose in. > >the books by a Nick Walters and the Doctor is the 8th (Paul McGann's), for >those of you who find either of those pieces of info useful. FWIW, one or two of those books are delightful in their knowledge of music. There's one in particular set in an alternative 1979 London called "No future" that is filled with loving punk (and other rock) in-jokes. - --- >What the heck is going on here? > >From the eMpTyV2 websight: > >In April, the legendary Pixies will reunite for the >first time in over a decade. The notoriously >quarrelsome quartet have buried the hatchet, clearing >the way for all four original members to hop onstage >together for a world tour, according to a spokesperson >for the band. Hell freezes over indeed. I was unnerved enough to see that Simon and Garfunkel are getting back together. Now the Pixies. Should I await the new McCartney/Ono album? James PS - in fact, the best in-joke in that book refers to Paul McCartney and the Brigadier James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 21:15:29 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: we ask the questions... >That's four or so fegs with that one, including myself. Someone claimed to >have three but I've never heard what the third one might be (nb. TMBG's >squid had been disqualified). I'd like to, because I might want it. I mentioned a Ween album which has both feggy lyrics and, I'm pretty sure, a Medusa on the cover. Could be wrong, though. Anyone confirm/deny? Various continental comments, such as: >Number of continents visited: 2, ours & yours (except James) >Number of continents visited: North America, Europe, Australia. Also >New Zealand, which isn't a continent but should count for something. And you didn't visit :( You could fly over my continent and never once spot land. It's the world's biggest continent, but 98% of it is very non-continental and wet. We're part of Oceania, along with such superpowers as Fiji, Kiribati, and the Northern Marianas (although the Aussies tend to call us part of Australasia - imperialist pig-dogs!). As to whether Oceania is a continent or not, in strict geographic terms it probably isn't (no major land-mass), but in geopolitical terms it is (with over a dozen countries linked geographically, politically, and - to an extent - socially). >Latest pet peeve: now there's a question I forgot to answer! The fact that, in light coloured socks for men with largish feet (size 11UK, 12US), you can get both colours - - grey AND black. Just maybe you can get a nice deep blue. Or brown. If you're really, really lucky, you can find something in a light tan brown. If I want lime green summer socks, or orange, or yellow, I have to find some of the lightest coloured ones I can and hand dye them. James PS - I was thinking you all go very slowly on the freeways, until I realised you were talking mph. D'oh! James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- =-.-=-.-=-.- You talk to me as if from a distance .-=-.-=-.-=-. -=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time .-=- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 07:28:27 -0400 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Potato Gene Hopstetter, Jr. wrote: > > http://www.weebls-stuff.com/toons/17/ I think I prefer And he does, you know. Shame he's a fascist. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 09:45:24 EDT From: HSatterfld@aol.com Subject: the adventures of Robocow http://tinyurl.com/mzw8 It's entertaining and educational. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:00:21 +0000 From: "Brian Hoare" Subject: Stars in his eyes Stewart: >I think I prefer >And he does, you know. Shame he's a fascist. It's not the first musical tribute to him. Another appears on Roger Ruskin Spear's 1972 album Electric Shocks - this, too, may have a had a visual component in the form of a mannequin with moving eyebrows. I can think of other songs that refer to astronomers but no others about a specific one. Brian _________________________________________________________________ Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 15:51:05 +0100 From: "Matt Sewell" Subject: Re: Calvin Johnson Sounds like I had a narrow escape! Made other plans in the end, but thanks for the warning... Cheers Matt >From: "Jason Brown \(Echo Services Inc\)" > > >Now, I know about the Robyn connection, but I'm after some info on >Calvin > > >Johnson... he's playing in a tiny wee venue here in Oxford tonight >and so > > >I'm wanting to know: is he worth going to see? The gig's a fiver, >btw... > > > > All I know about Calvin Johnson's live shows is what my friend Lauren >said > > to me... she said she was never so glad to hear a performer talk a lot > > between songs, because it meant he wasn't actually playing. I've only > > seen him DJ, myself... > >Your friend Lauren isn't that far off. I'm a huge fan of Calvin's >recorded work be it solo, with Beat Happening, or with Dub Narcotic >Sound System but as a solo performer Calvin is deadly dull, which was >really shocking to me because he is so dynamic and goofy when performing >with his bands. My advice is stay home. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Get a free connection, half-price modem and one month FREE, when you sign up for BT Broadband today! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 17:06:59 +0200 From: Carrie Galbraith Subject: Will it ever render? (Finally, what the feg...) Beer: Nope. Red wine, yes. Library: Frequently Glasses: off and on my whole life, which is strange because I have 20/15 vision. Sterilized: ah, no Starstuff: Sag, of course (open mouth, insert foot), Scorpio rising Married to (Zodiac-wise): n/a though my closest relationship of 13 years involves a sag, birthday the day after mine Ethnic background: Mother: Delaney (Irish masons) Father: Galbraith (Scottish anti-masons). Go figure. Other familial names include Leach, Bruce and Edison. There was some Dutch farm owners in New Amsterdam. The farm was near Wall Street, Trinity Church actually. Religion: No thanks, I just ate. No facial hair, thank god. Best anagram for full name: calibrating ajar here Number of times dressed in drag: once Least favorite food/food product: meat, mayonaisse, msg CA Gubernatorial Recall Candidate of Choice: no recall (voting absentee) Last three Halloween costumes: i don't do halloween Is it safe? "come on in boys, the water's fine" What if anything is written/depicted on you shirt/top right now? a small drop of caffe, dried, giving meaning to the drink "machiato" (meaning stain in italian) Feg Doppelganger? none out there, that i know How long? All night Last thing you can remember drawing? an hour ago, a person sitting on the waterbus, in my sketchbook In your car, on the floor of front passenger seat right now? no cars here, see medusae comment You gonna eat that? probably not Left or Right: Definitely right, but I practice with the left as much as possible. "I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrious" Number of continents visited: 2, sad, I know. Default browser home page: Google. Information, I must have information! Paper or plastic?: melmac Typical freeway speed: 9 miles over posted. It's well known that there is a 10 mile over grace from the cops. Picture on office wall: don't have an office anymore but my room has a huge map of Europa, one of the US and now a rather lovely detailed one of Transylvania. Dream Job: Film director, definitely. If asked to play God, which would you audition for?: some minor deity, third from left, no speaking part Reward credit cards: Amex, platinum (leftover from the corporate days) Last cd purchased: "Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid" Soundtrack, Dylan. Favorite arthropod? they scare me Have you ever been Knighted by a Government Official? not in my religion Number of records owned with medusae on cover? none, that i remember. My life is in storage Pets/Pets names: 1 cat, Pierpz Angus Ali Mohammed Morales Wong. He's a big cat. Longest-Running Purchase Streak Whose Sole Unifying Trait Is Record Label: Rhino reissue (getting all that Firesign on CD) Written/depicted on your favorite coffee mug: an old orange chipped thing with no images/text Last time entered a WalMart: driving across America in 2001 in nowhere, Kansas Windham Hill records: none ECM: Jarret, Jan Gabrielak (spelled wrong) Avro Paart, more I can't remember (see, medusae comments) First psych pop album owned: I'm not much into music these days Elephant Six (or related) Records owned: ditto, mostly opera and early music and getting back in to jazz. Be Seeing You, - - Ethyl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 08:32:15 -0700 From: Eleanore Adams Subject: What is a feg Ok, this is too much fun.... Beer - any and all, even Bud. Library - yes, going there today. Go there for work a lot. Research! Glasses - Had Lasix surgery!!! got rid of my specks! Sterilization - OrthoNovum 777 for life. member of Population Connection, which used to be Zero Population Growth. Sign - Aries Married to - Aries Ethnic Background - Polish, very. Dad's off the boat. Born Sujdak, and had my name changed to Adams to become americanized. Religion - born Catholic. Never practice. hate the Pope. Suing the Catholic Church right now for clients No facial hair ever, except eyebrows, which I do pluck. Anagram for name? too long. Have nickname = Elle Drag? - well in this day and age, that would be a daily occurrance. I wear pant suits. Least favorite food - Kim Chee hands down. Yuck. Sweat socks. CA recall - Keep Davis, vote Bustamonte. (But very tempted to go Green, but don't want to be a spoiler) Halloween - don't do halloween usually - give candy to kids at the door and see how cute they are. Shirt - white tee plain Don't draw Car is clean "I will eat that, but I am trying to do Atkins. Oh, a bit won't hurt." Left or right? - right handed Continents visited - just 2, Old world and New world Default homepage - yahoo Paper pr plastic - depends on if I have to walk, Plastic doesn't break when walking home from the store. Kind of ironic. Walk = plastic, drive = paper. often take a backpack. freeway speed - I don't speed Picture on wall - my degree and that is it. i am boring. Dream job - writer for National Geographic Play god? = That drunk greek god, Baccus?? Reward credit cards - no Last CD bought - Interpol favorite arthropod - crawfish? is that an arthropod? Crabs are cute! Knighted? wrong sex Medusa records - not to my knowledge Pets -2 cats Wal-mart - NEVER!! they screw their employees - -Eleanore ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 11:55:18 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Roberta Cowan Subject: Re: the adventures of Robocow I'm very disappointed that my web browser at work doesn't like flash very well--sounds like it's right up my alley! Roberta ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 18:16:54 +0200 From: Sebastian Hagedorn Subject: Re: Will it ever render? (Finally, what the feg...) Hi Carrie, - --On Donnerstag, 11. September 2003 17:06 Uhr +0200 Carrie Galbraith wrote: > Typical freeway speed: 9 miles over posted. It's well known that there is > a 10 mile over grace from the cops. funny, they they basically the same thing in Germany, only there it's ten km/h, not mph. So apparently the grace, hmm, zone perhaps, is larger in countries where speed is measured in mph ... I haven't driven a car in years, so what do I care ;-) Cheers, Sebastian - -- Sebastian Hagedorn PGP key ID: 0x4D105B45 Ehrenfeldg|rtel 156 50823 Kvln http://www.spinfo.uni-koeln.de/~hgd/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 09:53:52 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: Dr Who, and Hell freezes over James Dignan wrote: > Hell freezes over indeed. I was unnerved enough to see > that Simon and Garfunkel are getting back together. Now > the Pixies. Should I await the new McCartney/Ono album? The only reunions yet to occur are Joy Division, The Jimi Hendrix Experience, and Nirvana. While their singers are somewhat inconveniently unavailable, it should be pointed out that didn't, of course, stop The Doors. ===== "Pentagon officials says Americanizing Iraq is difficult because Iraqis have had little to no reliable information for the past 35 years, and have lived on a diet of innuendo, rumor, conspiracy theories, fear, and propaganda. Sounds like the problem is they're too Americanized." -- Bill Maher "Being accused of hating America by people like Ann Coulter or Laura Ingraham is like being accused of hating children by Michael Jackson or (Cardinal) Bernard Law." -- anonymous . __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 12:55:28 -0400 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: the adventures of Robocow HSatterfld wrote: > > It's entertaining and educational. Hey, only in Canada! Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 13:55:22 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: What is a feg Beer - I like trying new ones. Some favorites are Double Diamond, Anchor Steam, Old Speckled Hen. Library - It's been a while. Glasses - Used to, but the bilberry pills have improved my vision where I don't need them anymore. Sterilization - Not planning on it. Sign - Aquarius Married to - used to be to a Libra Ethnic Background - 50% German, 25% Hispanic and the rest is English Irish and a touch of French. Religion - born Catholic, I guess Episcopalian now, but it's been a while. I believe, but I don't go to church much. Facial hair - a moustache at this point in time. Anagram for name? Belch Ham Maniac Drag? - No, I am more of a road racing type than a 1/4 miler. Least favorite food - oysters probably CA recall - I'll go with keeping Gray Halloween - Used to have a G. Marx mask that I wore a few times Shirt - No logos on todays shirt Don't draw Front seat area is clean Are you going to eat that - Maybe with some Cajun sauce added. Left or right? - right handed Continents visited - Stuck in NA all my life. Europe someday I hope. Default homepage - yahoo Paper or plastic - I hate cheap paper bags that break, so I usually do the plastic thing at the store. freeway speed - I tend to do about 10 over when possible. Picture on wall - Stuck in a cube at work. Dream job - Owner of The Village Vanguard or any cool Jazz club. Play god? = Gregory Peck, like his Atticus Finch in To Kill A Mockingbird Reward credit cards - no Last CD bought - Blood & Chocolate, Mr Tambourine Man, Luxor, Rum Sodomy & The Lash, Fragile, The Boy Next Door by Stacey Kent are all on the way from Amazon. Last one that I bought and got right away was Daydream by Karrin Allyson at her 8/31/03 show at the Firefly Club in Ann Arbor. favorite arthropod - Rock Lobster Knighted? Not in this life. Medusa records - Submarine Bells Pets - Mustang in the garage is as close as it gets. Fish in the past. Wal-mart - I have never been in one and have been avoiding them. Michael B. NP Tom Rush The Circle Game ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 10:57:44 -0700 From: Catherine Simpson Subject: RE: we ask the questions... James Dignan said: >>I mentioned a Ween album which has both feggy lyrics and, I'm pretty sure, >>a Medusa on the cover. Could be wrong, though. Anyone confirm/deny? Yes, it was "The Mollusk", a great Ween release that contains the classic "Waving my Dick in the Wind"! It was one of my "medusae" covers, as well :) Catherine ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 11:58:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Groove Puppy Subject: Re: feg'yer maker Written/depicted on your favorite coffee mug: Plain black Last time entered a WalMart: Last weekend Number of continents visited: 2 (unless you also count England) Default browser home page: mlb.com Paper or plastic?: paper Typical freeway speed: 75-80 Picture on office wall: A bunch of small cards. My fave is a card my wife gave me of a kittens face with a big human smile stuck on it. I think it's hilarious but it seems to really freak some people out. Windham Hill records: What? Reward credit cards: No Current job: Manufacturing Engineer. As exciting as it sounds, unless of course you think it sounds exciting. Dirtiest job ever held: Cleaner in a psychiatric hospital. Dream Job: Owner/operator of small recording studio. Left or Right: Right. Pets/Pets names: Two goldfish. Cow and Chicken. Longest-Running Purchase Streak Whose Sole Unifying Trait Is Record Label: Probably Fat Wreck Chords. If asked to play God, which would you audition for? There's others? Number of ECM titles owned: Ah, your questions are so cute. Elephant Six (or related) Records owned: See, another. Latest pet peeve: Ikea, always Ikea. Latest CDs: Dolph Chaney "New Bird Rise" Idlewild "The Remote Part" 311 "Soundsystem" Squeeze "Play" & "East Side Story" Sublime "Robbin The Hood" Last movie seen: At home "Weekend At Bernies" At theatre "Pirates Of The Carribean" Last DVD: Don't really buy 'em. "Moulin Rouge" I guess. Additional least favorite food: Additional McNuggets! (H) np - Dolph Chaney "New Bird Rise" ===== CHUCKHOLE All that great punk rock taste with only half the calories. http://clix.to/chuckhole http://www.mp3.com/chuckhole __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:18:38 -0500 From: "Iosso, Ken" Subject: RE: your mail I just had to respond to this. I have to agree that Washington Redskins is offensive - not the least because Washington is the capital of the country that slaughtered native Americans in every conceivable way and swindled them out of their land. And the argument that "most people do not think of redskin as a negative term" is unimportant as well as doubtful. What matters when using questionable racial or gender terms is how the people who are being called it feel. Here in Minnesota there are a lot of Native Americans and they may be comfortable being called Indians, but I don't know any who are comfortable with the term "redskin." If you've talked to a lot of Native Americans who feel differently let me know. The subtler problem with even names like '"Braves" or "Indians" is that they imply that either the Indian is an animal akin to other sports names - Jaguars, Bengals, Tigers, Falcons or a mythical group that no longer exists like the Celtics or the Knickerbockers. Native Americans are real people, not mascots or animals. There, I'm off the soapbox. Ken Iosso - -----Original Message----- From: gshell@metronet.com [mailto:gshell@metronet.com] Sent: Sunday, September 07, 2003 7:42 PM To: Glen Uber Cc: Oppressive Udders Subject: Re: your mail On Sun, 7 Sep 2003, Glen Uber wrote: > gshell@metronet.com earnestly scribbled: > > >what racism or ignorance is inherent in the name? > > The term "redskin" is as offensive to Native Americans as "nigger" is to > blacks. Should we have teams called the San Francisco Slant-Eyes, the El > Paso Wetbacks, and the Los Angeles Chinks, too? Maybe Boston could field > a team called the Mickeys, New Jersey could field a team called the Wops > and Detroit could have a team called the Ragheads. the big difference is that most people do not think of redskin as a negative term. when was the last time you heard someone refer to an indian as a "dirty fucking redskin", for instance? the term redskin is in fact used in the opposite connotion. there are few americans left who don't feel some form of respect or appreciation and even adoration for the american indians, even considering the little they actually know about them. and it's these people in particular who do not use or consider the term as a negative reference. the fact that a few people receive it negatively could even point to their ignorance or misunderstanding of the very society they are calling to guilt. > Do you know anything about the racist policies of the team in the 50s and > 60s? what does that have to do with a team name in 2003? they were not the only team, organzation or system that was permeated with racism. > They were the last professional sports team to integrate their > roster. It came in 1963 after many protests by Redskins fans and > resistance by the owner to keep the team "white". what a surprise that must be to some to know that racism was still prevalant so far north. i don't think the team name was created to offend anyone, but that fact that it does offend a few and not the majority should also be considered. > > what about the chiefs, > >braves, indians, seminoles etc.. does that also offend? > > The Indians were the 2nd professional team to integrate their roster, > adding Larry Doby a few weeks after the Dodgers signed Jackie Robinson. > None of those names are personally offensive to me because they seem to > pay tribute to traits (Braves), strengths, positions of power (Chiefs), > and local heritage (the Seminole). That said, I think the "Tomahawk Chop" > is offensive to the nth degree. so sometimes it's ok and sometimes it not ok to use terms that represent tha native american as a team name or mascot or slogan? i mean it's not like teams started using these names because they don't respect the association. that is the only thing that needs to be considered. and i would completly understand being offended at team names like 'the big fat indian chiefs' or 'the dumbass seminoles' but the names in question were choosen with the opposite effect in mind, not as a specific slogan or ideal meant to offend. > In most cases, the names were chosen as a reflection of the times. Sadly, > most of the names are less than fitting these days. besides the ones already listed, which other professional or college team names give you grief? > I'm no P.C. nut and am not easily offended. I simply think that, of all > the team names one could point to as blatantly racist, the name > "Redskins" is certainly it. Who do you know that thinks bad things about indians when they hear the words, "the washington redskins"? gSs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 11:29:24 -0800 From: "Brian" Subject: RE: What is a feg said: > Drag? - No, I am more of a road racing type than a 1/4 miler. Nice. Very creative Michael... Have you ever dragged in drag whiling dragging on a cigarette? - -- Brian nightshadecat@mailbolt.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 12:37:24 -0700 From: "Glen Uber" Subject: More questions Favorite playground game: Watching others have fun while I sat by myself. Favorite Star Wars line: "Who is more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows the fool?" First album ever owned: Disney's The Chilling Thrilling Sounds of the Haunted House Celebrities you look like: Peter Ustinov (actor/director/novelist/ playwright); Julian Schnabel (writer/director/painter); Jason Schmidt (San Francisco Giants' pitcher). Favorite joke: Q: "How many keyboardists does it take to change a lightbulb?" A: "Just one, but the lead guitarist gets laid because of it." How do you think you will die: I know how I want to die, but I don't think I'll be able to afford all those hookers and all that booze in the same night. Favorite literary device: My library card. Favorite element: It's a tie between Hydrogen and Oxygen because without these two, there'd be no water which is an essential ingredient in beer. Favorite Ninja Turtle: Donatello -- he's the one no one can remember. Favorite thing your mom threw away without asking: My mom has never thrown anything away. Ever. Conan O'Brien or Craig Kilborn? Usually depends on the musical guest. The one musical act whose popularity you just don't "get": The mother- fucking Dave Matthews Band Do you like it when I do that? Oh, God, yes! - -- Cheers! - -g- "Work is the curse of the drinking class." - --Oscar Wilde ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 15:51:17 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: What is a feg said: > Drag? - No, I am more of a road racing type than a 1/4 miler. The Nupster retorted: >Nice. Very creative Michael... Have you ever dragged in drag whiling >dragging on a cigarette? No, but it sounds like someone should have done it in the movies after American Graffiti came out, a bad AG knock-off like Hollywood Knights would have been a good spot for it. Michael NP Billie Holiday + Lester Young A Musical Romance ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 12:54:08 -0700 From: "Glen Uber" Subject: The tour Any word on opening acts for the fall mini-tour? - -- Cheers! - -g- "Soylens Viridis Homines Est" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 16:23:05 -0400 From: FSThomas Subject: RE: your mail [Note: I know I shouldn't respond to this thread, but, like driving past a vicious car wreck, I feel compelled to have a look.] From a different (but equally valid) soapbox: >Here in Minnesota there are a lot of Native >Americans and they may be comfortable being called Indians, but I don't know >any who are comfortable with the term "redskin." That's exactly the point. You *don't* know how many would be/are offended. With some level of certainty I could say that the majority of Americans (the Amercians you stop on the street corner, not the ones who fully throw themselves into the hobby of weekend agitators) couldn't give a toss if the Washington football team was called the Redskins or not, with the exception of the fact that they've been the Redskins for seventy years. (The franchise was founded in '32 in Boston, Massachusetts, as the Boston Braves. In 1933 the team was moved to Fenway Park and changed the team name to the Redskins.) Does seventy years of an offensive name suddenly make it all right? No. Is there a statute of limitations where a racial slur/derogatory term suddenly fall into the mainstream and lose its stigma? No. It's just plainly not that offensive a name, IMHO. It calls to mind a dark, solid warrior image. One to be reveared. Feared, even. If they were the D.C. Moonshine Mohicans, I could see where someone might be offended. Might. >The subtler problem with even names like '"Braves" or "Indians" is that they >imply that either the Indian is an animal akin to other sports names - >Jaguars, Bengals, Tigers, Falcons or a mythical group that no longer exists >like the Celtics or the Knickerbockers. Native Americans are real people, >not mascots or animals. To your argument of a sort of "animalization" of Native Americans (when we stack teams like the Braves & Indians against the Jaguars and the Colts) I would futher ask if there's a colorization of all animal-based teams in light of the Cleveland Browns? > > The term "redskin" is as offensive to Native Americans as "nigger" is to > > blacks. As with all if this: conjecture. >Should we have teams called the San Francisco Slant-Eyes, the El > > Paso Wetbacks, and the Los Angeles Chinks, too? Maybe Boston could field > > a team called the Mickeys, New Jersey could field a team called the Wops > > and Detroit could have a team called the Ragheads. I vote for the Connecticut WASPS, personally. >what a surprise that must be to some to know that racism was still >prevalant so far north. While Atlanta is an integrated city, go a bit out of the city limits and enlightenment deteriorates pretty damned quickly. There is, however, still a fair amount of racial bias in Connecticut. >i don't think the team name was created to offend anyone, but that fact >that it does offend a few and not the majority should also be considered. Pandering. There's an adage you may have heard: "You can't please all the people all the time." The level of sensitivity that some would demand is just getting foolishly out of hand. The idea could be put to debate in DC, let it be bandied around for years, and come up with the most distilled down name you can think of (the Washington Vanilla, for example) and some action group somewhere will fight you on it because it's offensive to them. It's frankly not worth the trouble. Or the money. At all. Should Green Bay rename their team because the "Packers" offend vegetarians? What about the Syracuse Orangemen? They'd best change *that* name. We wouldn't want to offend any Irish Republican. > > I think the "Tomahawk Chop" > > is offensive to the nth degree. A staple of the Atlanta Braves! (Who I'll be seeing tonight vs. the Phillies.) - -ferris. ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V12 #342 ********************************