From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #350 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Thursday, October 31 2002 Volume 11 : Number 350 Today's Subjects: ----------------- LA Show / Jury Doodie ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: michael moore or less ["Maximilian Lang" ] Re: Jury Duty ["Michael E. Kupietz, wearing a pointy hat" ] Re: she don't care about time ["Michael E. Kupietz, wearing a pointy hat"] re: di$ney [Jeff Dwarf ] Re: the hahrah, the hahrah [Jeff Dwarf ] really [Jill Brand ] annoying acronyms [Jill Brand ] Re: Jury Duty ["Stewart C. Russell" ] Re: annoying acronyms [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: annoying acronyms ["Stewart C. Russell" ] Re: Jury Duty [Ken Weingold ] Redundant tautologies, and a Rew-related question [grutness@surf4nix.com ] Soft Boys on KEXP [Jason Miller ] Re: Quail: Exercise Caution! [Michael R Godwin ] Re: really [mary ] Happy Halloween (0%RH) [mary ] Re: Soft Boys on KEXP [dances with virgos ] Re:Chicago Review ["Sam Adams"] Re: Duty [gSs ] REAP [Ken Weingold ] Re: LA Show / Jury Doodie [gSs ] Re: annoying acronyms ["Jason R. Thornton" ] Re: Redundant tautologies, and a Rew-related question [Jeffrey with 2 Fs ] Re: annoying travel questions [gSs ] Re: Jury Duty [Jeff Dwarf ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:02:15 -0800 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: LA Show / Jury Doodie Jason >>Who all is going to the House of Blues show, by the way? Me. Wish I could make some of the other local shows, but I doubt it as my wife is way pregnant and having a harder and harder time keeping up with the kid we already have... one night a week is about the most I can feel good about staying out late. I'll be wearing... hell, I dunno. Something. So if you see a nude guy there, that's not me. __________ gSs: >>dems and reps are the only ones I have ever heard regulary >>complain about civic duty, specifically jury duty. it is a requirement for >>which you should be grateful. You've actually ascertained the party affiliation of everyone you've ever heard complaining about jury duty? I would bet at least some of the complainers, if not most, are unregistered, or nonvoters. Lots of those around. Civic duty is just that: duty. We all complain about our work, don't we? And jury duty is worse than work because it often brings us a little closer to sides of life which are (hopefully) seedier and seamier than our own, which ain't a comforting place to be. Might make you feel good about the judicial system or law enforcement... human nature not so much. Can't blame anyone for bitchin' about that. - -Rex ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:07:42 -0500 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: Re: michael moore or less >From: The Great Quail >On this, to be honest, I have to agree with him. Having grown up around >guns, and possessing a love to shoot myself. Is this Dan Quayle? Max Okay, my wife came up with that one but she doesn't post, so... _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:17:14 -0800 From: "Michael E. Kupietz, wearing a pointy hat" Subject: Re: Jury Duty At 2:31 PM -0800 10/30/02, Tom Clark spake thus: >As far as jury duty, I have to admit that my experience was rather >positive. >The selection process was fun to watch (hint: to get excused, either act >really stupid or really intelligent. Or start an argument with one of the >attorneys), and in a way I'm a little bummed I didn't get selected. I >guess >when it comes right down to it, what annoyed me the most about having to >report was that I had to be there at eight fucking fifteen in the morning. >I don't even get up until 8:30 most days, fer crissakes. What? You mean there's an 8:30 in *the morning*, too? (tom: sorry about that previous, newly resubscribed and not back in the habit of using "Reply All" instead of "Reply".) Mike ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 18:17:30 -0800 From: drew Subject: boy redundancy boy >From: Ken Weingold > >Hmmm. Can I jump in with another annoyance of mine? Not sure what >you call it (besides stupid), but when people say things like "PIN >Number", "ATM Machine", "VIN Number", "GPS System", etc. It's "redundancy," but it makes perfect sense because acronyms are stupid. The people who invent them think that the meaningful component is the acronym, when in fact it's the word people tack on. Out of context, PIN, VIN, and to a lesser extent ATM and GPS are cryptic. In context, grandiose identifiers like "Personal Identification" and "Automatic Teller" are unnecessary. You use your number to get money from the machine, end of story. >From: Eb > >Speaking of Di$ney, I cringed at how aggressively Michael "Behind >These Smiling Steely Eyes, I Know Where the Bodies are Buried" Eisner >overlapped Disney promotion into his big World Series venture. Ah, Disney and the World Series: two institutions I would not miss if they disappeared tomorrow. Well, I might miss Disney a little bit. >Not only did he show up for the post-game interviews with a jacket >self-consciously unbuttoned to reveal a Mickey Mouse T-shirt, but he >engineered it so that yesterday's local "victory parade" ran legs >through both Disneyland Park and the new (struggling) California >Adventure area. Yuck. >(Maybe I'll watch Spirited Away on cable someday, when my film tastes >are in more of a oh-wow-dude-look-at-the-colors mood.) You might not be satisfied. I mean, it's gorgeous visually but the appeal is really in the characters and the fantasy world and the transformations...classic fairy-tale stuff of the sort that Disney used to do decently. It's very easy for adults to enjoy but genre-wise it's very much in the vein of children's movies. Which maybe you don't watch, I couldn't say... >Hey, I don't think I mentioned this yet...did folks hear that the >TRIO channel has bought reruns of the early, early David Letterman >shows from NBC? This is the most exciting television news I've heard >in *years*. ...and likewise the excitement value of something like this completely eludes me. >From: "Rex.Broome" > >What maketh a "good" cartoon movie? Not being tempted to call it a "cartoon movie"? >Pokemon, now... that is, >or at least recently was, both mainstream fare and oddball Japanese >animation, craptastic though it was... and it succeeded thanks to, yup, >not-un-Disney-like marketing. I will definitely agree that Pokemon the cartoon is direly vapid. Like Sanrio and San-X, it's mainly about cute collectible characters (i.e. marketing), and I must admit I'd rather have Bulbasaur dangling from my keychain than, I dunno, that ugly mofo Goofy. >As far as I'm >concerned, most of the recent Disney animated films have been artistically >viable and occasionally great ("Lilo & Stitch"... and "Pocahontas" comes to >mind, with its uncharacteristically moody bits) I was really thrilled with Lilo and Stitch when it came out. But I gotta say that Spirited Away makes it look pretty shabby. Maybe I already did say that. As for Popeahontas, well, I didn't bother, and if its most significant quality was "uncharacteristically moody bits" I'm not in a big rush. It's sad that Disney is praised for being daring just because it does something with a trace of true melancholy (is it moodier than, say, _Bambi_?). >and consistently a better >bet than the animated features from competing American studios. Because they're all making crappy knockoffs of Disney films. >I tried to get >people to come with me to see "Princess Mononoke" and they all said it >sounded depressing or boring. Well, it was both, to me anyway. :) >From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) > >IWBAAL is about wanting to become something else I've always interpreted it as a sort of change anxiety, a desire for escape from the messy and traumatic business of human transformation and significance of form. An anglepoise lamp is pretty stable and no one passes laws against it or denies it the vote or anything. >From: Tom Clark >Solo >Robyn is is definitely entertaining, but he may as well be on TV for the >degree of connection I feel. With the band it's like a house party, where >we're all having the same good time. Hope that makes sense. Yes, it does -- good call. >From: gSs > >'i've got this jury duty bullshit today', does not appear to me like you >think it's a good thing. and i was aksing you the question. Sometimes good things, like broccoli and cough medicine, are unpleasant. Unpleasant things, like your tendency to preach and mine to carp, are not always good. - - Drew ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:45:01 -0800 From: "Michael E. Kupietz, wearing a pointy hat" Subject: Re: she don't care about time I think with RH it all relates, in one way or another, to the concept of "mouldering". At 11:16 AM +1300 10/31/02, James Dignan spake thus: >>Me then James: >>>>does a general theme seem to be emerging here? What is >> >ressurection, return for? Do we have to wait for the next disc to find >>out >>> >or can someone else pry it out of the present songs? >> >>>to quote an earlier posted setlist: >> >> >I Wanna Be An Anglepoise Lamp >> >If You Know Time (new song -- wow!) >> >Underwater Moonlight >> >>>QED? >> >>Errrhhh. Yeah sure. I got it, of course. But for those poor punier >>intellects on list, would you care to, erhh, explicate? Especially since >>the set list includes a song most of us havent heard and UM has a whole >>new >>innerspace. ;-) > >erm yeah. I didn't read your question properly. But it does look like even >the new songs have a distinct time theme (I'm just guessing this from the >title - lyrics, anyone?). > >IWBAAL is about wanting to become something else, and UM is about statues >'reborn' in human form. There's always been an idea of personalities >merging, changing into sdomething else, in Robyn's songs ("Sometimes I wish >IWAPG; I'm only you; When I was dead; The shapes between us...), and of the >ways of the past being replaced by the ways of the future (My favourite >buildings; Winchester; 1974; maybe even Mexican God and The wreck of the >Arthur Lee). > >As time has gone on these themes have subtly drifted together, I feel, and >the whole idea of time lost/time returning has grown a little stronger in >his songs. > >Oh, and thirded (someone already seconded it) about the great wojmeister! > > James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= > .-=-.-=-.-=-.- > .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. > -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance > =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time > -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:34:59 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: re: di$ney Eb wrote: > Speaking of Di$ney, I cringed at how aggressively Michael "Behind > These Smiling Steely Eyes, I Know Where the Bodies are Buried" Eisner > > overlapped Disney promotion into his big World Series venture. > > Not only did he show up for the post-game interviews with a jacket > self-consciously unbuttoned to reveal a Mickey Mouse T-shirt, but he > engineered it so that yesterday's local "victory parade" ran legs > through both Disneyland Park and the new (struggling) California > Adventure area. Thus, he managed to squeeze out a heap of extra > admission fees from folks who watched the proceedings in those > locations. Furthermore, a baseball-uniformed Mickey Mouse was sitting > next to Jackie Autry (Gene's widow) in the parade, waving to the > fans.... Bleh. Wow, imagine if he hadn't been desparately trying to sell the team for the past couple years (and probably still is). > Hey, I don't think I mentioned this yet...did folks hear that the > TRIO channel has bought reruns of the early, early David Letterman > shows from NBC? This is the most exciting television news I've heard > in *years*. Except that nobody actually _has_ TRIO. I don't think we even have it on the dish package at work. ===== "If we don't allow journalists, politicians, and every two-bit Joe Schmo with a cause to grandstand by using 9-11 as a lame rhetorical device, then the terrorists have already won." -- "Shredder" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt . HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:37:24 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: the hahrah, the hahrah Namesake with 2 Fs Namesake wrote: > Quoting drew : > > Sometimes a change is just a change, damn it. > > And sometimes it's a cigar. Either way, it's definitely jumped the shark. ===== "If we don't allow journalists, politicians, and every two-bit Joe Schmo with a cause to grandstand by using 9-11 as a lame rhetorical device, then the terrorists have already won." -- "Shredder" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt . HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:08:52 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Brand Subject: really OurMax wrote of Yo La Tengo's stint at Maxwell's: Duh, Bad Jew Max, bad Jew! It's the 2nd Annual YLT Hannukah Series @ Maxwell's I think they spell it wrong. Max Since I'm such a gullible moron, I don't know whether this is really true. Is that really the reason they are playing 8 nights? How cute. I guess if your name is Ira Kaplan, you might do things that way. Will people be bringing them latkes or something? Will there be a menorah? Will people get to bring their own menorahs? So many questions. Jill ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:19:08 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Brand Subject: annoying acronyms Ken wrote: Hmmm. Can I jump in with another annoyance of mine? Not sure what you call it (besides stupid), but when people say things like "PIN Number", "ATM Machine", "VIN Number", "GPS System", etc. It's bad enough that people say the TOEFL test (which means they are saying Test of English as a Foreign Language test), but what's worse is that there are "how to" textbooks entitled things like Guide to the TOEFL Test, and The Best Damned Book on the TOEFL Test. And then, of course, half my students pronounce the thing 'toyful', which is pronounced the same way as the word 'devil' (Teufel) in German. All this bantering shows how much Diet Pepsi I drank today. Jill ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:42:14 -0500 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Jury Duty Tom Clark wrote: > > As far as jury duty, I have to admit that my experience was rather positive. I enjoyed the crap out of my jury duty; two+ weeks of doing bugger-all, free food, seeing more drugs than Keef would do in, say, an afternoon, and getting freaked out at the scary bad folk who do deals in the posh neighbourhood near where I grew up. > hint: to get excused, either act really stupid or really intelligent. ah, in Scotland, they can't object to jury selection, unless you know, or know of, one of the defendants. Plus they have a 15-seat jury; it's never hung. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:42:17 -0600 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: annoying acronyms Quoting Jill Brand : > It's bad enough that people say the TOEFL test (which means they are > saying Test of English as a Foreign Language test), but what's worse is > that there are "how to" textbooks entitled things like Guide to the TOEFL > Test, and The Best Damned Book on the TOEFL Test. And then, of course, > half my students pronounce the thing 'toyful', which is pronounced the > same way as the word 'devil' (Teufel) in German. And "toeful" is better? I think this is a fine example of the point Drew (I think it was Drew) made about acronyms often being rather pointlessly dysfunctional. Outside of its context, there's no way that anyone would know that a "TOEFL" is a test of anything - so of course, people say "TOEFL test" to clarify. Perhaps they should have called it the OEFL test and pronounced it vaguely in the French manner: "awful test" (as said by Peter Sellers as Inspector Clouseau). ..Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html :: I feel that all movies should have things that happen in them :: --TV's Frank ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:45:49 -0500 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: annoying acronyms Jill Brand wrote: > > It's bad enough that people say the TOEFL test I always thought the T was 'teaching'; Catherine teaches ESOL, and has for years. I really hate serial numbers which have letters in them ... Hey, I made the Board of Directors of WindShare tonight: ! - -- $,="\n";foreach(split('',"\3\3\3c>\0>c\177cc\0~c~``\0cc\177cc")) {$a++;$_=unpack('B8',$_);tr,01,\40#,;$b[$a%6].=$_};print @b,"\n" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:07:07 -0500 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: Jury Duty On Wed, Oct 30, 2002, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > ah, in Scotland, they can't object to jury selection, unless you know, or > know of, one of the defendants. Plus they have a 15-seat jury; it's never > hung. Not even WELL-hung? How boring. - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:28:27 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Redundant tautologies, and a Rew-related question >Hmmm. Can I jump in with another annoyance of mine? Not sure what >you call it (besides stupid), but when people say things like "PIN >Number", "ATM Machine", "VIN Number", "GPS System", etc. we can go one better than that with the "ISBN book number". Blech. Tautology fits the bill for naming, but I'm sure there is a name for this - something like 'deuterism'. Stewart? My pet hate is that, somewhere over the last five years, "-ing" has become an endangered species. It's most noticeable in sport, where we have swim teams going to international meets. Then again, I'm one of those pedants who throws cushions at the TV when someone calls tsunami 'tidal waves'. Ain't nothing tidal about them! A question: a TV ad currently on air here in NZ uses a reggae version of "Walking on Sunshine"... anyone know who released this? Or is it likely to be a version specially recorded for the ad? James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:14:12 +0000 (GMT) From: Jason Miller Subject: Soft Boys on KEXP The boys are supposed to be on KEXP at noon PST today. Can anyone capture the high quality stream? I'll be sleeping (graveyard shift). They archive their shows but at super-low quality (32 Kbps). http://www.kexp.org/index.htm Jason M. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:56:36 +0000 (GMT) From: Michael R Godwin Subject: Re: Quail: Exercise Caution! > Michael G. > >>Smashey and Nicey's 'poptastic' > On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, Rex.Broome wrote: > Dare I ask? Series of sketches by Harry Enfield and Paul Whitehouse as superannuated radio disc-jockeys. They did a full-length TV special in 1994 entitled 'Smashey and Nicey, the End of an Era' http://www.imdb.com/Title?0108931 which featured such notable icons as Tony Blackburn (now back at the top of the tree), Angus Deayton (chucked off the tree this week), Alan 'Fluff' Freeman, Bob 'fucking fucking' Geldof, John Thomson (from the Fast Show) and John Peel as John Past-Bedtime. A review http://www.imdb.com/Title?0108931#comment describes the film as both "poptastic" and "poptabulous". - - Mike Godwin PS My vote for the description of "PIN number" goes, as always, to "pleonasm", defined as "using more words than necessary". ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 07:39:21 -0500 From: mary Subject: Re: really At 11:08 PM 10/30/2002 -0500, Jill Brand wrote: >Since I'm such a gullible moron, I don't know whether this is really true. >Is that really the reason they are playing 8 nights? How cute. I guess >if your name is Ira Kaplan, you might do things that way. Will people be >bringing them latkes or something? Will there be a menorah? Will people >get to bring their own menorahs? So many questions. According to the promotional email from Matador: YO LA TENGO will be playing their Second Annual Hannukah Series at Maxwell's in Hoboken, NJ, on the 8 nights of Hannukah from November 29 through December 6. These will be benefit concerts for charities to be announced! Every night will feature different charities, opening acts, comics, and special guests, all to be announced shortly. Stay tuned to the Matador and Yo La Tengo websites for announcements: http://www.matadorrecords.com http://www.yolatengo.com Tickets are available now Other Music in NYC, Tunes in Hoboken, at Ticketmaster elsewhere, and if you're from overseas, but planning on Hanukkahing in these parts, we recommend contacting Maxwell's at: http://www.maxwellsnj.com In addition there will be a 3-song Christmas CDEP included in the ticket price (that's right, Christmas!) Hope to see you there! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 07:46:34 -0500 From: mary Subject: Happy Halloween (0%RH) I hope everyone has a fright-tacular, scare-rific, and spook-tastic time tonight! It's the most wonderful time of year. mary ps. Yes, Woj is the all-around best! Thanks for spray painting my costume for me : ) pps. TC - I love your sense of humour even though a lot of folks don't get it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0500 From: dances with virgos Subject: Re: Soft Boys on KEXP when we last left our heroes, Jason Miller exclaimed: >The boys are supposed to be on KEXP at noon PST today. Can anyone capture >the high quality stream? i was planning on doing that -- either the 96k mp3 or realaudio streams. the latter seems to be of a higher quality (264kbps realaudio 8 is the max bitrate), but mp3 is a little more flexible. i'll try to grab both and see what happens. woj ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:45:21 -0800 From: "Sam Adams" Subject: Re:Chicago Review Maybe "Seven-winged bat?" While he was introducing the song at Maxwell's, Robyn mentioned that had been the original title, and sang it once in the final verse before switching over to "anglepoise lamp" for the harmonies. Sam > Did anyone else notice that during Anglepoise Lamp they were singing "Seven Band Width" instead of "Anglepoise Lamp", or am I just insane? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:52:22 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: Duty On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, Tom Clark wrote: > Jury system and jury duty are two different things. it's your duty to participate in the jury system. don't split hairs. > The bullshit part of jury *duty* is having to call a phone number every six > hours for five straight days to see if you have to rush down to the > courthouse and sit in a room for hours on end on the off chance that you'll > be called up to the courtroom. There's gotta be a better way, and I'm sure > you've got a few ideas on that as well. what the hell kinda system is that? here you get a letter in the mail with a specific date and time at which you are required by law to appear at the courthouse. you can call or send in an excuse in some cases. if i remember correctly the grand juries are pulled the same way. most people's lack of enthusiasm for civic duty or anything else even near helpful beyond their immediate domain is an issue that rightly upsets me, along with a few other things like gin, black licorice and a particular cat. > Does that include sacrificing one's sense of humor? In the words of the > renowned Sgt. Hulka, "Lighten up, Francis." but you can touch my stuff. gSs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 10:02:56 -0500 From: Ken Weingold Subject: REAP FUCK - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 09:19:13 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: LA Show / Jury Doodie On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, Rex.Broome wrote: > You've actually ascertained the party affiliation of everyone you've ever > heard complaining about jury duty? partisans usually identify themselves inadvertantly. > Civic duty is just that: duty. We all complain about our work, > don't we? not everyone complains, but i do. > And jury duty is worse than work because it often brings us a > little closer to sides of life which are (hopefully) seedier and seamier > than our own, which ain't a comforting place to be. Might make you feel > good about the judicial system or law enforcement... human nature not so > much. Can't blame anyone for bitchin' about that. human nature overall at the "natural" level is a good thing in my opinion, i think. we live so far above and beyond the natural level now and got here so quickly that i don't think the natural instincts have yet adjusted to the "unnatural world". figuratively speaking as i don't think anything can be accurately labeled unnatural or artificial, except possibly satellites and data. gSs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 08:16:36 -0800 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: annoying acronyms At 11:45 PM 10/30/2002 -0500, Stewart C. Russell wrote: >>It's bad enough that people say the TOEFL test > >I always thought the T was 'teaching'; Catherine teaches ESOL, and has for >years. You're probably thinking of TESL, TEFL or TESOL certification, given to trained English instructors, in which the T stands for "Teaching" - Teaching English as a Second/Foreign Language, or Teaching English to Speakers of Other Languages. TOEFL is the Test of English as a Foreign Language, which non-English speakers take to prove their proficiency, after perhaps taking a course or two from a TESL/TEFL/TESOL certified instructor. JRT ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 10:33:03 -0600 From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: Redundant tautologies, and a Rew-related question Quoting James Dignan : > My pet hate is that, somewhere over the last five years, "-ing" has become > an endangered species. It's most noticeable in sport, where we have swim > teams going to international meets. You mean "in sporting events," right? I dunno - I've always heard "swim teams" (at least among fans or members) rather than "swimming teams"--and I suppose that it's an "international meet" rather than "international meeting" because "meeting" means something very different. I'm try to think of other disappear "-ings," but I'm hav trouble think of them. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html :: PLEASE! You are sending cheese information to me. I don't want it. :: I have no goats or cows or any other milk producing animal! :: --"raus" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 10:39:29 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: annoying travel questions here's a question for you europeans or world travelers. what are the advantages and disadvantages of visiting Europe in January, generally, besides the snow? few tourists, lower prices, big hats, it might be worth it. i guess i'm more interested in seeing the base culture or what's left of it and the architecture from the eastern bloc countries as well as the uk, so warm temperatures is not a factor. And there is always Russia. has anyone been lately or ever? gSs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 10:20:15 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: Jury Duty Ken Weingold wrote: > On Wed, Oct 30, 2002, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > > ah, in Scotland, they can't object to jury selection, unless you > know, or > > know of, one of the defendants. Plus they have a 15-seat jury; it's > never > > hung. > > Not even WELL-hung? How boring. Well, it _IS_ Scotland. So, of course not. Of course, given that most US juries (at least in criminal cases) have to be unanimous, a 15 member jury would actually make a hung jury more likely, not less. ===== "If we don't allow journalists, politicians, and every two-bit Joe Schmo with a cause to grandstand by using 9-11 as a lame rhetorical device, then the terrorists have already won." -- "Shredder" "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." -- Theodore Roosevelt . HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #350 ********************************